Look at CHINA before 2000, under CCP control, sweat shop nation, making NIKE shoes for americans. NOW look at HONG KONG, under British control,richest city in CHINA, supports 33% of ALL of chinas economy.THERES NO COMPARISON. CCP is the worst thing to happen to china. IF china got rid of the CCP, they couldve been prosperous like 60 YEARS ago.
If the Dalai Lama had power and the ruler of an independent Tibet, he would use imprisonment, torture, murder and massacre to wipe out these minorities, like what the
Christians did to the pagans when Christianity, a cult founded on lies and violence dominated Europe.
@tenzing1009,Tibetan name used won't shows that u r Tibetan,u might b Chinese or Ghost follower(no one cares but)lets c hu dies sooner?plz let one of ur friend must know,u have this wish,wat u had been rite here so that,ur friend can see hu die first.lets do it..(Challange from one uneducated vd follower of Great His Holiness The Dalai Lama)LONG LONG LIFE N LIVE OUR GREAT DALAI LAMA)BhOD GYALO!!!
i dont care about the religion thing but the fact is that dalai lama has lied n he has divided the tibetan ppl .no more long live dalia lama i hope dies soon n this problem goes away with him
@tenzing1009 shame on u for using such words,his holiness again insisted that iz upto individual if one wishes pr not to practice shugden, he juz mentioned there r negativ sides of it, nas bein da spritual leader of tib budhism he has all da right to let ppl know wat is right n wat is wrong!! ur words speak for ur god, a budhist never wishes for neone to die not even their enemy..may his holiness lives long
@xpressloX,u r definitely n make sure to go to Hell before ur breath stops,becoz it would b really difficult after u die.not only Dalai Lama knows,I can feel pity on u even from now,I m normal social animal n uneducated. u poor man..take care n pray little bit,beg ur pardon near Dalai Lama's picture so that,u could have better life in next born.I can't say that u could come again in human but may b Almightys forgive u if u b innocent n idiot now..Gud Luck.....
I wonder how much these monks protesting against Dalai Lama know about Buddhism. Buddha has taught to believe after proper analysis, not out of blind faith. So sad to see these monks wearing robes of monk and protesting for something that they don't know well.
i don't understand why people dont get the facts right. especially westerners who preach Tibetan Buddhism. Its a pity that they dont research on sensitive issues like this and easily support the Shugden group without cause or base. the slogan reads, 'DALAI LAMA STOP LYING'- when did he lie? pin point the fact if it is true. when did Dalai Lama forced people not to follow this cult practise? it was a recommendation. i feel pity on the demonstrators! go,do some research before u come to the street
A great thinker of ancient India said.."We all are partially blind..on an average we either obliviously or intentionally ignore half of the things happening in front of us" I've known a shugden family for at least 20 years and believe me when I say I've known the shugdens better than most of the tibetan commenters in this page... and I also enjoy the position of not being threatened by a hardliner tibetan...:)
The Tsem Tulku Organization runs wwwdorjeshugdencom, they are also the ones dropping DS pamphlets all over Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia. People who leave the organization or otherwise find out their secret are subject to abuse and death threats. Kechara House is a dangerous cult that has betrayed His Holiness the Dalai Lama, the Tibetan Community, and most of all, Gaden Shartse Monastery. Please circulate this information far and wide.
The Tsem Tulku Organization runs wwwdorjeshugdencom, they are also the ones dropping DS pamphlets all over Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia. People who leave the organization or otherwise find out their secret are subject to abuse and death threats. Kechara House is a dangerous cult that has betrayed His Holiness the Dalai Lama, the Tibetan Community, and most of all, Gaden Shartse Monastery. Please circulate this information far and wide.
Dalai lama has clearly made it public that whether to worship shugen or not its up to the individual. then why these western follows who even don't have proper understanding and knowledge of Buddhism are creating so much chaos in Tibetan buddhist community. why don't they do their own business, sticking to their own religion. if you feel something sacred in worshipping buddhism, then follow lord buddhas teaching. that's how simple it is! is that what shugden dictated them to do so? i wonder?
1. Dorje Shugden is the ghost of a dead Lama that did evil before he got banned, then forced to work as an oracle and buddhism defender.
2. Some rich royal buddhists with yellow hats made up a secret society cult on this demon, to defend Tibet from the chinese and to establish their cult as the only one in buddhism.
3. The Dalai Lama had enough of this and so Dorje Shugden was forbidden
4. Buddha don't give a shit about any demons or Dorje Shugdens. Focus.
IF ONLY THESE PEOPLE LISTENED TO THE REASON WHY HIS HOLINESS TELLS WHY NOT TO PRACTICE. HIS HOLINESS USED TO PRACTICE SHUGDEN TOO BUT AFTER ANALYSING HE CONCLUDED THAT DORJEE SHUGDEN ONLY CAUSES SHORT TERM HAPPINESS AND REALLY DANGEROUS TOO. ITS ONLY FOR YOU PEOPLE'S SAFETY...REST ITS YOUR DECISION.
this fucking shugden society get funds from PRC ( people republic from china) and always be a barrier for tibetan freedom! His holiiness the Dalai lama stated that you can choose any religion so why you guys are shouting ur ass out?
Foreigners are always their to give spark to throw on gas, they thiink changing religion is cool and i hav one thing to tell them, live a life! anyhow u will die sooner or later!
As much as I dislike the demonstrations, I have to say that the ban on this practice and the way in which it is being implemented, is equally distasteful to me. The truth is that there is very little objective evidence to support the ban on this practice.
I decided along with the rest of the people that lft the NKT, ITS A CASH COW for power hungry ASSHOLES, who care more about Money, status, and wait for it (HI my names such and such, ive been practising dharma for x amount of years and im a HYT practitioner) status status status. Please help close down the NKT, do not feed it with anymore of your hard earnt money.
i decided to take action and saw a psyciatrist, i have been told i have no <Mental health Issues. what would the NKT like to say about that? My teachers reason for becomming ordained was that as her daughter was a SLUT (as the teacher called her) and had many one night stands and had become pregnant, her grand daughter eeded to see an ordained robe to give it the best help in life. what tha child needed to help it in life is to see its grandmother wiped off the face of the earth
also, everyone who opens their eyes past their own periphery and decides to leave the NKT because of CULT like behaviour is branded insane.
Apparently we all share the similar diagnosis, we have serious mental health issues.
my teacher, when we tried to expose her, (aftr i left my centre) went to the POLICE and told them i was harassing the centre, told the police tha I HAD BEEN FOCIBLY REMOVED beaus of (wait for it) Mental health issues.
WHY has the nkt been under scrutiny for years? why do monks and nuns claim Incapacity benefits (because they cannot work) but can offer 30-40 hours of hard work in the centres? i have witnessed teachers who change out of robes to go to the doctors and claim they have ailments for benefit purposes, then come back to thcentre, change into robes, Clean, cook, Teach, leaflet drop and who just who are not ill at all
I decided to leave when money became more important that giving t techings of buddha shakyamuni, when CLEANING becam more important tat equanimity, compassion and the liberation from suffering of others.
you know i once asked a close friend of mine who was ordained, i asked what is the WSS, he said it was a seperate group (nothing to do with NKT-IKBU) i replied that the only members of WSS were NKT-IKBU, his reply was dont be F***ing stupid, NKT does not get involved in POLITICS
I left because i and several people within our group began to realise tat out teacher was stealing money from the centre, lying to community members and bitching about them to others not realising that the people they were bitching about were friends. Teachers stealing others property and explaining that they were donated to the charity. I heard my teacher, who used to sit on the throne to teach, when she was off of the throne she would use the N word when referring to black individuals
If when people come to visit the NKT, if they knew that the NKT was against the dalai lama i think a lot of people give it a wide berth. No one really wants to be a member of a group thagoes against the grain. TBH it is my believe that the only motivation for the protests, were to raise recognition for the NKT and to help bring money into the "BUSINESS"!!!
I decided to leave th KT after i realised it was a CULT, what spurred me on to leave?
If when people come to visit the NKT, if they knew that the NKT was against the dalai lama i think a lot of people give it a wide berth. No one really wants to be a member of a group thagoes against the grain. TBH it is my believe that the only motivation for the protests, were to raise recognition for the NKT and to help bring money into the "BUSINESS"!!!
I decided to leave th KT after i realised it was a CULT, what spurred me on to leave?
If when people come to visit the NKT, if they knew that the NKT was against the dalai lama i think a lot of people give it a wide berth. No one really wants to be a member of a group thagoes against the grain. TBH it is my believe that the only motivation for the protests, were to raise recognition for the NKT and to help bring money into the "BUSINESS"!!!
I decided to leave th KT after i realised it was a CULT, what spurred me on to leave?
Apparently, this was not anger, but Wrathfulness (something that the NKT always uses to excuse their behaviour)
I was envolved in the NKT for over 8 yeas and TBH im glad that afer his time i finally listened to friends and family and saw the NKT as the CULT they really are.
Nobody within he heirarchy of NKT wishes the Dalai Lama to ban shugden practice because this is their main source of revenue.
I do not believe for a second that the NKT-IKBU/WSS is funded by the Chinese at all. I was personally at 3 of these demonstrations in the UK.
I was horrified during the international spring Festival 2008 that my Guru, Geshe Kelsang Gyatso decided to bring politics into his harma teachings and began to guide people towards the importance of Supporting TIBETAN people by joining the WSS and tha we must Peacefully protest.
How can men blindly follow what an religious figure says, that's why the Christians and the Mulisms fought back in the days. Have we learned anything from it?
@yuning83 you do realize that alot of this has to do with china trying to remove the dalai lama's power in buddhism, did you also know that the kid chosen to recognize the next dalai lama has been prisoned by the the chinese, likely already dead considerinf no one has heard or seen from him in years, and chose their own. This gives them the power to completely manipulate and destroy the future of buddhism, knowing the dalai lama we should know he wouldnt do such a thing without justifiable reasn
@xdac89 You do realize that Dalai lama is just a leader of 1 of 5 lama buddhism, which is just a sect off main buddhism. I could care less what he says.
i really dont think the behavior of western shugden groups are looking out for the best interest of tibetans, but instead for themselves. Although you are so deep in your knowledge of your diety i think SOME of you are not in tuned with the histrory behind it, hhdl stance and most importantly the Tibetan communities way of thinking and behavior.
I also dont think this is of just western shugden but also some western Buddhists who do support hhdl. it oftens seems its ALL ME! ME! ME!
to see the Tibetan community split. I have a fair few amount of Tibetan friends who practice shugden, and i feel very close to them and their famies as do they do, and they enjoy to be apart of the general tibetan community.
They are free to worship which they do, and they also still worship hhdl, they want to be apart of the general community, but sometimes i feel western shugen practitioners can be causing a greater split and disturb the relationship between our fellow tibetans.
as a tibetan and knowning tibetans who practice shugden, i think it is awful especially how sumdong rinpoche speaks about Tibetan shugden worshipers> this is why i am happy he will be stepping down. There many closed minded tibetans living in refugee camps in India/nepal, who really dont have a clue about anything, forget about shugen, im talking about general tibetan poltical/cultural issues. They do follow blindly at ceratin times. however there also many tibetans like myself, who do not want
as a tibetan and knowning tibetans who practice shugden, i think it is awful especially how sumdong rinpoche speaks about Tibetan shugden worshipers> this is why i am happy he will be stepping down. There many closed minded tibetans living in refugee camps in India/nepal, who really dont hae a clue about anything, forget about shugen, im talking about general tibetan poltical/cultural issues. They do follow blindly at ceratin times. however there also many tibetans like myself, who do not want
Be careful, you guys are going in the other direction. Realize that Dalai Lama is in line with the universe. If you want to ascend in 2012, keep your heart open. It's that easy.
WOOOOH........cut dis CRAP yahhh.......u all chinese....party..having chinese. bucks... how much u all paid by faking dis.....DALAI LAMA....is d only who lead us not sugden....so better wake up an let peace in b/w tibetans...
We have all kind of human living in this world. Each and everyone have their own believe and faith. Let the believer do what ever he/she think is correct ( At that moment of time when his/her thought is fixed, you can't change it ) . Out of compassion and concern for their well being we can only give them our thought and rational.
No need to protest against anybody, keep the religion to yourself.
@WTMC59 I agree with you. Everyone has their own religion and beliefs and they should do whatever they think is correct. However, the reason for the protests is the ban that is still going on in tibetan communities, where the Shugden practicers are basically alienated from the tibetan society and refused any help. People continue to practice but face hard times. I personally believe that in buddhism, there is no place for such ban and hence, the reason for protest.
Look at CHINA before 2000, under CCP control, Poor, Pathetic, crappy, nothing but a SWEAT shop nation, making NIKE shoes for americans. NOW look at HONG KONG, under BRITSH CONTROL, Richest city in CHINA, supports 33% of ALL of chinas economy.THERES NO COMPARISON. CCP is the worst thing to happen to china. IF china got rid of the CCP, they couldve been prosperous like 60 YEARS ago. AND if it was completely up to the CCP, CHINA would STILL BE POOR TODAY. U.S. companies made CHINA rich, not CCP.
Well, to be honest, I think eventually people are able to filter out truth from false propaganda. After I saw these Shugden demonstrations against His Holiness, curious, I did my own study into the matter. The lies being propagated by Dalai Lama's adversary - Kelsang Gyatso are crystal clear and just observe the body language of these Shugden protesters and you will notice how unhappy and frustrated they are. I have written an article about this on my website too.
"For me, this remains an open wound, and as long as the CCP keeps stonewalling, the much beloved phrase “Reform and Opening Up” will ring at least partially hollow. Those who keep demanding more contrition from the Japanese for their crimes against humanity should demand the same from their own rulers." Ma Ying Jeou
Actually, I would like to give up my membership in the CCP; I really would. I am tired of being paid to post made-up drivel against good people for money. I realize that my actions actually hurt China's image, not help it; therefore, I hereby renounce the party, my employer, and the propagandistic supermachine they are obsessed with.
@fIoatinghippos you are a good man my friend. i respect ur decision. we shud alwys know that the truth will stay as it is despite all the lies and propagandas . keep moving forward to become a good humanbeing.
@fIoatinghippos Really....so what are you waiting for...?.Good luck for your sucking dalai lama coq...Oh yeah don't expect me to believe all the stupid things you said....keep on lying.
Funny, the Dalai Lama claims to promote peace, harmony, and religious tolerance, but look at his actions:
He promotes a ban on a mainstream Gelugpa practice, Dorje Shugde, which he himself, his brother, all his Gurus practiced and which was the main protector of the Gelugpa tradition for the last 350 years.
He does nothing to stop the open persecution going on in Dharmasala and throughout the world against Dorje Shugden practitioner who have done nothing but follow their Gurus instructions.
most of them protesting are westerners because they dont have to live inside this tight knit community where the shugden worshippers in india are being discriminated and intimidated. atleast they can speak up for the muted, the minority.
"In an order dated April 5, 2010, Justice S. Muralidhar dismissed the writ petition and application on the grounds that the allegations of violence and harassment were vague averments and that the raised issues do not partake of any public law character and therefore are not justiciable in proceedings under Article 226 of the Constitution.
Citing the absence of any specific instances of any such attacks on Dorjee Shugden practitioners, ..."
why must practitioners be anti dalai lama - pro shugen or anti shugden - pro dalai lama?! to start with, dalai lama and dorje shugden both are higher beings, attained beings, from the scriptures,..they are enlightened!
"The city of Lhasa was bombarded by tanks and artillery. The children were crying and crying. The corpses of people, dogs, horses, everyone was lying dead. They were put in a pile and then burned with kerosene. "
Dorje Shugden is an Enlightened Protector, that's why we can take refuge in him. He is not a spirit for many reasons - the main one being if he is a spirit and so malevolent, why doesn't the Dalai Lama bind him and subdue him or destroy him. The Dalai Lama has asked for many fire pujas to be done to destroy Dorje Shugden but this has never been successfully done, showing that Dorje Shugden must be enlightened.
People have used him to cast spells, to inflict harm on their enemies. He is considered "a powerful magical being who can help propitiators acquire worldly goods and other powers and benefits." A powerful gyalpo is not a fully enlightened being.
Just go to the youtube video on how Dorje Shugden was the one who told Dalai Lama to flee from Tibet and even drew a map out for the escape route and his sword for protection.
It's called Dorje Shugden saved the Dalai Lama's Life
/watch?v=mV4VAQgt4Bs&feature=related
And I don't think a poor old monk at his age need to lie for any reasons.
This is history. Noone can prove that he´s telling the truth, noone can prove that he´s lying
The Shugden groups and China are allies. There is a clear link between the triple murderers and the Shugden society in Delhi. This group has been conspireing with China since 1999. These are facts, not stories...
Just go to the youtube video on how Dorje Shugden was the one who told Dalai Lama to flee from Tibet and even drew a map out for the escape route and his sword for protection.
It's called Dorje Shugden saved the Dalai Lama's Life
/watch?v=mV4VAQgt4Bs&feature=related
And I don't think a poor old monk at his age need to lie for any reasons.
I do not think that the teachings on compassion and kindness by HH the Dalai Lama was exercised when monks were attacked by pro Dalai Lama supporters in Mundgod Sep 9, 2009.
I do not see the practice of religious freedom or humanity shown to these monks.
It is just shocking that a nation known to be Buddhist could act in such terror to their own brothers. Unbelievable. To read more on an eye witness report go to dorje shugden (dot) com on interesting read section on the right panel
If there was truly freedom of practicing what you like without any discrimination. Then what is all the witch hunt list of people's name being posted up on the Tibetan refugee settlements and posters on No Shugden followers can be allowed to walk in certain shops to buy daily supplies?
That is just out right religious discrimination that India has a heavy law against. The Dalai Lama has been warned by the Indian High court to watch it.
If there was truly freedom of practicing what you like without any discrimination. Then what is all the witch hunt list of people's name being posted up on the Tibetan refugee settlements and posters on No Shugden followers can be allowed to walk in certain shops to buy daily supplies?
That is just out right religious discrimination that India has a heavy law against. The Dalai Lama has been warned by the Indian High court to watch it.
Perhaps the biggest wrong predictions was the famous statement hat Tibet would be free by the year 2000. How devastating for all Tibetans, of whom probably most believed that the news came directly from His Holiness clairvoyant mind.
So why still ask Nechung's advice when it comes to making huge political decisions that affects so many people?
Nechung has many times predicted wrongly to the Tibetan Govt and people. And Nechng is a spirit not a Buddha. So how come Nechung is OK to perpetuate but it will reason for Banning Dorje Shugden because it is a "spirit"???
This pure shows how twisted and bias this contradictory view is.
@dragonthunder2010 I've read that Nechung's time as a protector is ending soon...his karma will exhaust as a spirit and he will gain the state of enlightenment.
@TheDharmaKnight Exactly what I heard too. So we can confirm then Dorje Shugden is a Dharma protector.
Besides it was Nechung who requested DS in his previous life as Dulzin Drakpa Gyeltsen to become a Dharma protector to protect the teachings of Je Tsongkhapa and that he will remind Dulzin in future (Tulku Drakpa Gyeltsen) of his promise.
Dulzin was the one responsible for building Gaden Monastery. His incarnation history can be read on dorje shugden (dot) com
@TheDharmaKnight Exactly what I heard too. So we can confirm then Dorje Shugden is a Dharma protector.
Besides it was Nechung who requested DS in his previous life as Dulzin Drakpa Gyeltsen to become a Dharma protector to protect the teachings of Je Tsongkhapa and that he will remind Dulzin in future (Tulku Drakpa Gyeltsen) of his promise.
Dulzin was the one responsible for building Gaden Monastery. His incarnation history can be read on dorje shugden (dot) com
Noone takes refuge in Nechung. But the Shugdens take refuge in DS.
He is a protector for the magical suppression of the other schools. Not a Dharma Protector. Gelug school has three Dharma Protectors. Tibetans know this, western followers don´t. They only know what their teachers tell them.
Can't the Tibetans that in this way they are actually bringing the Dalai lama's name down and tarnishing it? Because how can you be a Dalai Lama supporter - who preaches non-violence be violent to anyone.
You should not even be violent to even an ant or even a ghost as it says in the Lamrim.
So it goes to question are Tibetans even Buddhist?
Tibetan Buddhism has pre-Buddhist elements, we know that.
Propitiating spirits as a means to achieve fame and fortune in this life is not Buddhism. Taking refuge in worldly deities is not Buddhism.
Who is violent? The Shugden activists are violent. Anti-Shugdens can become violent too. They are afraid of political traitors and Chinese infiltration.
I guess the party-controlled Buddhism in China is "real Buddhism" according to you.
On the contrary, to Western audiences the Dalai Lama repeatedly says that he issued this ban In order to save this pure and profound Tibetan Buddhism from degenerating into spirit worship. And This ban is applied in order to promote peace and harmony between the four Tibetan Buddhist traditions.
The justification given to the Tibetan public, which destroyed the entire harmony of the Tibetan community, is: Worshipping this evil deity is a danger for my life and for the freedom of Tibet. If you Tibetans want me to be dammed and dont care at all about the cause of Tibet, then go ahead with the worship of this deity.
Shugden people are trying to destabilize the exile community. They commit violent crimes.
That self proclaimed lama in Delhi and his Shugden followers try to belittle the Dalai Lama in the eyes of international community.( It will not work.)
That is why I don´t listen to the Shugden groups.
By the way, floatinghippos, are you still blocking me?
If the dharma protectors function is to protect the Buddhadharma, why would he want to bring any harm to HH DL? Why would he be a threat to HH DLs life? Why would he want to shorten HH DLs life? Why? Why? Why?
dalai lama's age is beyond the average Tibetan life expectancy (may DL live long). Where is the truth in the accusation that DS is shortening DL's life???
What is fanatical about wanting to go to hospital or enter a simple shop? They are turned away due to their religious beliefs... this is truly disgraceful for those who claim to be Buddhist and who claim to follow the path of love, tolerance, peace, and compassion.
I fully agree - people are being denied their basic rights. I must say that i was very moved to learn of the late HH Penor Rinpoche - a Nyingma high lama - who immediately opened his monastery to those ostracised because of their belief. It's not that he is a Shugdenpa but that he is a human being who empathises with those who are suffering. May HH Penor Rinpoche return again to show his great example.
you speak passionately about and associate DS practitioners to the Chinese' government with the motivation to get money and belittling Dalai Lama. I do think there are DS practitioners who are doing this...but NOT ALL. I hope you can consider this point...
Note that China pays their web surfers .50 usd (fifty cents club) for inserting lies onto the Web. The biggest effort at spreading lies in the history of the world. U can spot them via their foul language and slurs on HH Dalai Lama. Beware of these scum.
your not practising buddhism if you say compassion for this person but not that person. in this case shugden pracitioners. this is simple. why practise buddhism any further if its like this?
politics is politics, buddhism is buddhism, compassion is compassion.
It's funny you use the word "IF" to refer to the ban... when in fact the DL has publicly acknowledged it, as well as his prime minister, Samdhong.
There is a great news story done by Al Jazeera which shows a Dorje Shugden practitioner being turned away from shops, hospitals, etc... merely for his religious beliefs. The Dalai Lama is allowing this.This is real hard evidence you can see with your own eyes.
By the way, the Dalai Lama would be welcome in any DS monastary despite his bad behavior.
Of course, even if the ban existed--which anyone who's attended HHDL's teachings knows it does not--what would it matter?
Shugden Lamas teach that HHDL is a liar and a hypocrite--then they say "don't attend HHDL's teachings," then they make up a story about how "Shugden practitioners are banned from HHDL's teachings."
Sounds like a story made up to keep unwitting western NKT converts "in the fold."
I think the best way to practice is to understand the politics and just take refuge in our Lama and the practice he gives. We were taught as Buddhist is to forgive our enemies and practice compassion. But how we reconcile that with the Dorje Shugden issue and the ban that the Dalai Lama instituted upon its practitioners? Shouldn't the Shugden practitioners be dealt with compassion too?
DS is completely represented by WSS. No one talked about DS in the west until WSS did.
NKT is WSS, from conception through today.
This new attempt to portray NKT as suddenly Dalai Lama-friendly comes too late, unfortunately.
If NKT has had a change of policy and heart, it will have to spend as many years (or more) counteracting its original propaganda as it did generating it.
I think that point sums it up, HHDL said the final decision is up to you whether to follow his advice or not. All the ban, the violence, the TGIE implementation of the ban is not because of HHDL but people who think they are Buddhas representatives on earth.
Back in the 1970 and 1980 teachers like Ajahn Sumedho and Thich Nhat Hanh gave teachings and retreats in Manjushri ,
Manjushri Centre was glad to take there money because they needed it at the time. Gash-la put a stop to this because he did not want the pure dharma of JeTsonghapa to be mix with other Buddhist teachings,
But by 2010 it is ok to mix the pure dharma of Je Tsonkhapa with business?
Buddhism is like that, until you find your niche, where you click, if you want a path to enlightenment they are there but you need to follow it through to the end. Switching schools is like traveling down one road and getting 1km from your destination then changing your mind going back to the beginning and choosing a different road to get to you to the same destination.
Just because you stick to one school of Buddhism doesn't mean you're sectarian. A person can choose to follow one school of buddhism and even promote it but also simultaneously have respect for other schools. Sectarianism is when you protect & promote your own school AT THE EXPENSE OF other schools, but this is not necessarily the case.
@ImNotCCP to say that Gelugpas are sectarian, would be like saying that all Buddhists are anti-jewish, anti-christian, anti-muslim, which is not true.
just because you prefer to follow the teachings of one school does not mean you are trying to go against or suppress another school of buddhism! It means you wish to just follow one way because it has suited your own disposition and learning.
until you find the right school for you which fits you perfectly you are free to make a choice. The sectarianism you schismatic people talk about has been there since the very beginning. Yes it promotes pure lineage but so too does all faiths. Each has created great masters of their mind, in all faiths not just buddhism so why only now do you talk of sectarinism when its been there all along. choose your path and walk it.... whats yours
Get the facts straight, all buddhism is sectarian, this is nothing new, there is theravadan, mahayana, vajrayana, zen,etc etc... The facts are all religions are practicing what they believe in that gets results. If your going to be a heart surgeon why would you say you need to learn flower arranging. Buddhas teachings fit all types of people and each school caters to that type of mind. Your just trying to stir a reaction from people and there is no basis.
It should be made clear that Shugen worship itself violates religious freedom, because Shugden does not allow followers to practice other schools than the "pure Gelug school". Those who practice other schools "mix the pure doctrine" and will be killed for that "crime" by the deity Dorje Shugden, or they will at least be punished by a terrible sickness and finally die a horrible death.
the RedNieceBorg (harrynephew, vinayaholder, lineageholder, purplseaster et all) seems to have a different puppetmaster behind the posts this week. Must be a sensitive date coming up.
look at /user/portaljohn..on his anti-Dalai Lama/pro-KG video, the second commenter is Dale157, who "just happens" to stop by a year ago as soon as the video was posted.
When is the WSS going to open up their videos to comments? Or are they afraid of the opinions of the larger Buddhist community?
In one of the videos on WSS's site, a young NKT Buddhist says 'There is no practice without him (shugden).
Clearly the NKT has recruited the least experienced of their students for these protests, who have no knowledge of Buddhist history and the fact that Shugden came well after the time of Tzongkhapa.
WSS please open your vids to comment for honest dialogue.
THE CHINESE GOVERNMENT KIDNAPPED HIM AND HIS FAMILY 1995
The Panchen-substitute has promised to uphold the leadership of the Communist Party of China. He is not a Tibetan Buddhist, he´s with the Buddhist Association of China.
The Dalai Lama´s mission is to preserve the whole Tibetan Buddhist tradition.
Hardline security policies are taking China to the brink of revolutionary turmoil.
In contrast with the powerful, assertive and united China that is being projected to the outside world, Yu Jianrong said his prediction of looming internal disaster reflected on-the-ground surveys and also the views of Chinese government ministers.
Deepening social fractures were caused by the Party's obsession with preserving its monopoly on power through "state violence" and "ideology", rather than justice.
Hardline security policies are taking China to the brink of revolutionary turmoil.
In contrast with the powerful, assertive and united China that is being projected to the outside world, Yu Jianrong said his prediction of looming internal disaster reflected on-the-ground surveys and also the views of Chinese government ministers.
Deepening social fractures were caused by the Party's obsession with preserving its monopoly on power through "state violence" and "ideology", rather than justice.
This great King may seem to appear wrathful and fearsome but he is actually a guardian angel. He uses his wrathful means to clear obstacles and to destroy demons that come in our way. The more you look at him and understand him, he actually looks quite handsome!
Hopefully one day this controversy will be lifted and the ban will fade away and Shugden will appear beautiful as ever. This should have been the way long time ago. Its alright now for those who is in favor of Shugden to practice quietly.
One day this controversy will die down and all will be forgotten about how harmful this Protector will be. However, our actions and attitude towards him will result in future repercussions. Sowing seeds of discontent towards anybody has repercussions especially is the object is a high being or emanation of a high being.
I totally agrees with Red Niece that the DS issues is not just a Tibetan affair. Millions all over the world are still practicing this amazing great and beautiful deity called Dorje Shugden. DS has obviously helped and protect millions till today. This deity is no evil spirit.
Fuck Dalai Liar, he made bone trinkets out of serfs (human, mind you) body parts. Fucking hypocrites Tibetans are
spdsboiboi86 2 weeks ago
LONG LIVE HIS HOLINESS THE DALAI LAMA.
lolly4458 2 months ago
you guys need to wash your brain and heart to realise it´s wrong what you are doing..
TheCountrygirl59 2 months ago
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Look at CHINA before 2000, under CCP control, sweat shop nation, making NIKE shoes for americans. NOW look at HONG KONG, under British control,richest city in CHINA, supports 33% of ALL of chinas economy.THERES NO COMPARISON. CCP is the worst thing to happen to china. IF china got rid of the CCP, they couldve been prosperous like 60 YEARS ago.
fIoatinghippos 3 months ago
But the Dalai Lama did have rule over Tibet, and he didn't wipe out any minorities.
In fact, the CCP has wiped out minorities since invading.
fIoatinghippos 3 months ago
If the Dalai Lama had power and the ruler of an independent Tibet, he would use imprisonment, torture, murder and massacre to wipe out these minorities, like what the
Christians did to the pagans when Christianity, a cult founded on lies and violence dominated Europe.
TheSpeaknoevil 3 months ago
@tenzing1009,Tibetan name used won't shows that u r Tibetan,u might b Chinese or Ghost follower(no one cares but)lets c hu dies sooner?plz let one of ur friend must know,u have this wish,wat u had been rite here so that,ur friend can see hu die first.lets do it..(Challange from one uneducated vd follower of Great His Holiness The Dalai Lama)LONG LONG LIFE N LIVE OUR GREAT DALAI LAMA)BhOD GYALO!!!
Tseyangzable1 3 months ago
i dont care about the religion thing but the fact is that dalai lama has lied n he has divided the tibetan ppl .no more long live dalia lama i hope dies soon n this problem goes away with him
tenzing1009 3 months ago
@tenzing1009 shame on u for using such words,his holiness again insisted that iz upto individual if one wishes pr not to practice shugden, he juz mentioned there r negativ sides of it, nas bein da spritual leader of tib budhism he has all da right to let ppl know wat is right n wat is wrong!! ur words speak for ur god, a budhist never wishes for neone to die not even their enemy..may his holiness lives long
peljortibet 1 month ago
@xpressloX,u r definitely n make sure to go to Hell before ur breath stops,becoz it would b really difficult after u die.not only Dalai Lama knows,I can feel pity on u even from now,I m normal social animal n uneducated. u poor man..take care n pray little bit,beg ur pardon near Dalai Lama's picture so that,u could have better life in next born.I can't say that u could come again in human but may b Almightys forgive u if u b innocent n idiot now..Gud Luck.....
Tseyangzable1 3 months ago
Thanks dalailama 尊者达赖喇嘛 我们都爱您~~
dakpa1224 4 months ago
dalai lama is lying wake up tibetans stop this blind faith!
tenzing1009 4 months ago
I wonder how much these monks protesting against Dalai Lama know about Buddhism. Buddha has taught to believe after proper analysis, not out of blind faith. So sad to see these monks wearing robes of monk and protesting for something that they don't know well.
MrPeace1959 5 months ago
They're all kids in grown up bodies... pathetic apes.
HalfFullYeah 5 months ago
how the fucking shugden group dare to protest to his holiness the dalai lama.by dalai lama hard work they have able to live a good life in america.
tserun911 7 months ago
LONG LIVE HH THE 14 DAlAI LAMA
pemala777 7 months ago
All foreigner protesters are paid either by china or by shugden group. They don't even know abut shungden..
tenrique20 7 months ago
Dalai lama must go to the hell after his dead !
XpresloX 8 months ago
@XpresloX you will surely burn in hell..
that is for sure
tenzing144 6 months ago
@tenzing144 Dalai lama will go rejoint Hitler and Staline in hell soon :)
XpresloX 6 months ago
i don't understand why people dont get the facts right. especially westerners who preach Tibetan Buddhism. Its a pity that they dont research on sensitive issues like this and easily support the Shugden group without cause or base. the slogan reads, 'DALAI LAMA STOP LYING'- when did he lie? pin point the fact if it is true. when did Dalai Lama forced people not to follow this cult practise? it was a recommendation. i feel pity on the demonstrators! go,do some research before u come to the street
rnzndrj17 9 months ago
A great thinker of ancient India said.."We all are partially blind..on an average we either obliviously or intentionally ignore half of the things happening in front of us" I've known a shugden family for at least 20 years and believe me when I say I've known the shugdens better than most of the tibetan commenters in this page... and I also enjoy the position of not being threatened by a hardliner tibetan...:)
riyazahmed1111 10 months ago
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The Tsem Tulku Organization runs wwwdorjeshugdencom, they are also the ones dropping DS pamphlets all over Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia. People who leave the organization or otherwise find out their secret are subject to abuse and death threats. Kechara House is a dangerous cult that has betrayed His Holiness the Dalai Lama, the Tibetan Community, and most of all, Gaden Shartse Monastery. Please circulate this information far and wide.
ivivism 11 months ago
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The Tsem Tulku Organization runs wwwdorjeshugdencom, they are also the ones dropping DS pamphlets all over Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia. People who leave the organization or otherwise find out their secret are subject to abuse and death threats. Kechara House is a dangerous cult that has betrayed His Holiness the Dalai Lama, the Tibetan Community, and most of all, Gaden Shartse Monastery. Please circulate this information far and wide.
ivivism 11 months ago
you westerns don't understand a thing and just do crazy shit...
leave his holiness alone...
free tibet~!!
123confusion 11 months ago
Dalai lama has clearly made it public that whether to worship shugen or not its up to the individual. then why these western follows who even don't have proper understanding and knowledge of Buddhism are creating so much chaos in Tibetan buddhist community. why don't they do their own business, sticking to their own religion. if you feel something sacred in worshipping buddhism, then follow lord buddhas teaching. that's how simple it is! is that what shugden dictated them to do so? i wonder?
tendorjee1 11 months ago 5
For those who are new to this:
1. Dorje Shugden is the ghost of a dead Lama that did evil before he got banned, then forced to work as an oracle and buddhism defender.
2. Some rich royal buddhists with yellow hats made up a secret society cult on this demon, to defend Tibet from the chinese and to establish their cult as the only one in buddhism.
3. The Dalai Lama had enough of this and so Dorje Shugden was forbidden
4. Buddha don't give a shit about any demons or Dorje Shugdens. Focus.
xtraa 11 months ago 2
Shit, this video just shows the opinion of one side.
shunfulin 11 months ago
IF ONLY THESE PEOPLE LISTENED TO THE REASON WHY HIS HOLINESS TELLS WHY NOT TO PRACTICE. HIS HOLINESS USED TO PRACTICE SHUGDEN TOO BUT AFTER ANALYSING HE CONCLUDED THAT DORJEE SHUGDEN ONLY CAUSES SHORT TERM HAPPINESS AND REALLY DANGEROUS TOO. ITS ONLY FOR YOU PEOPLE'S SAFETY...REST ITS YOUR DECISION.
bhod2ari 11 months ago
this fucking shugden society get funds from PRC ( people republic from china) and always be a barrier for tibetan freedom! His holiiness the Dalai lama stated that you can choose any religion so why you guys are shouting ur ass out?
Foreigners are always their to give spark to throw on gas, they thiink changing religion is cool and i hav one thing to tell them, live a life! anyhow u will die sooner or later!
tenzdak 1 year ago
As much as I dislike the demonstrations, I have to say that the ban on this practice and the way in which it is being implemented, is equally distasteful to me. The truth is that there is very little objective evidence to support the ban on this practice.
michaelduane11 1 year ago
As my posts were long they are in reverse order, please start from the Bottom post by Buddhistpaul
buddhistpaul 1 year ago
I decided along with the rest of the people that lft the NKT, ITS A CASH COW for power hungry ASSHOLES, who care more about Money, status, and wait for it (HI my names such and such, ive been practising dharma for x amount of years and im a HYT practitioner) status status status. Please help close down the NKT, do not feed it with anymore of your hard earnt money.
buddhistpaul 1 year ago
i decided to take action and saw a psyciatrist, i have been told i have no <Mental health Issues. what would the NKT like to say about that? My teachers reason for becomming ordained was that as her daughter was a SLUT (as the teacher called her) and had many one night stands and had become pregnant, her grand daughter eeded to see an ordained robe to give it the best help in life. what tha child needed to help it in life is to see its grandmother wiped off the face of the earth
buddhistpaul 1 year ago
also, everyone who opens their eyes past their own periphery and decides to leave the NKT because of CULT like behaviour is branded insane.
Apparently we all share the similar diagnosis, we have serious mental health issues.
my teacher, when we tried to expose her, (aftr i left my centre) went to the POLICE and told them i was harassing the centre, told the police tha I HAD BEEN FOCIBLY REMOVED beaus of (wait for it) Mental health issues.
buddhistpaul 1 year ago
WHY has the nkt been under scrutiny for years? why do monks and nuns claim Incapacity benefits (because they cannot work) but can offer 30-40 hours of hard work in the centres? i have witnessed teachers who change out of robes to go to the doctors and claim they have ailments for benefit purposes, then come back to thcentre, change into robes, Clean, cook, Teach, leaflet drop and who just who are not ill at all
buddhistpaul 1 year ago
I decided to leave when money became more important that giving t techings of buddha shakyamuni, when CLEANING becam more important tat equanimity, compassion and the liberation from suffering of others.
you know i once asked a close friend of mine who was ordained, i asked what is the WSS, he said it was a seperate group (nothing to do with NKT-IKBU) i replied that the only members of WSS were NKT-IKBU, his reply was dont be F***ing stupid, NKT does not get involved in POLITICS
buddhistpaul 1 year ago
I left because i and several people within our group began to realise tat out teacher was stealing money from the centre, lying to community members and bitching about them to others not realising that the people they were bitching about were friends. Teachers stealing others property and explaining that they were donated to the charity. I heard my teacher, who used to sit on the throne to teach, when she was off of the throne she would use the N word when referring to black individuals
buddhistpaul 1 year ago
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If when people come to visit the NKT, if they knew that the NKT was against the dalai lama i think a lot of people give it a wide berth. No one really wants to be a member of a group thagoes against the grain. TBH it is my believe that the only motivation for the protests, were to raise recognition for the NKT and to help bring money into the "BUSINESS"!!!
I decided to leave th KT after i realised it was a CULT, what spurred me on to leave?
buddhistpaul 1 year ago
If when people come to visit the NKT, if they knew that the NKT was against the dalai lama i think a lot of people give it a wide berth. No one really wants to be a member of a group thagoes against the grain. TBH it is my believe that the only motivation for the protests, were to raise recognition for the NKT and to help bring money into the "BUSINESS"!!!
I decided to leave th KT after i realised it was a CULT, what spurred me on to leave?
buddhistpaul 1 year ago
If when people come to visit the NKT, if they knew that the NKT was against the dalai lama i think a lot of people give it a wide berth. No one really wants to be a member of a group thagoes against the grain. TBH it is my believe that the only motivation for the protests, were to raise recognition for the NKT and to help bring money into the "BUSINESS"!!!
I decided to leave th KT after i realised it was a CULT, what spurred me on to leave?
buddhistpaul 1 year ago
Apparently, this was not anger, but Wrathfulness (something that the NKT always uses to excuse their behaviour)
I was envolved in the NKT for over 8 yeas and TBH im glad that afer his time i finally listened to friends and family and saw the NKT as the CULT they really are.
Nobody within he heirarchy of NKT wishes the Dalai Lama to ban shugden practice because this is their main source of revenue.
buddhistpaul 1 year ago
I do not believe for a second that the NKT-IKBU/WSS is funded by the Chinese at all. I was personally at 3 of these demonstrations in the UK.
I was horrified during the international spring Festival 2008 that my Guru, Geshe Kelsang Gyatso decided to bring politics into his harma teachings and began to guide people towards the importance of Supporting TIBETAN people by joining the WSS and tha we must Peacefully protest.
buddhistpaul 1 year ago
Shugden groups and NKT/IKBU are breakaway groups from the Gelug school of Tibetan Buddhism. Western people are ignorant and easily manipulated
Varavaken 1 year ago
Tibet will be free.
Just as surely as the sun rises & the darkness sets, light will shine again on a Tibet free of occupation.
To the east of the Great Line is China, and long may she live in peace
To the west of the Great Line is Tibet, and long may she live in peace
Long may the light of freedom shine on these friends, and neighbors, and people.
By the power of this practice may all beings be liberated from suffering
By the power of this practice may all beings attain perfect enlightenment
SauIan 1 year ago
How can men blindly follow what an religious figure says, that's why the Christians and the Mulisms fought back in the days. Have we learned anything from it?
yuning83 1 year ago
@yuning83 you do realize that alot of this has to do with china trying to remove the dalai lama's power in buddhism, did you also know that the kid chosen to recognize the next dalai lama has been prisoned by the the chinese, likely already dead considerinf no one has heard or seen from him in years, and chose their own. This gives them the power to completely manipulate and destroy the future of buddhism, knowing the dalai lama we should know he wouldnt do such a thing without justifiable reasn
xdac89 1 year ago
@xdac89 You do realize that Dalai lama is just a leader of 1 of 5 lama buddhism, which is just a sect off main buddhism. I could care less what he says.
yuning83 1 year ago
@yuning83
The Dalai Lama is the religious leader of Tibetan Buddhism. Tibetan Buddhism has five schools (if you include the Bon tradition).
Varavaken 1 year ago
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FreedomlsYourCover 1 year ago
Idiot anti-Japanese rioters mistake Hanfu for kimono; force girl to strip so they can burn her clothes: bit . ly/d3dOrs
FreedomlsYourCover 1 year ago
It's so convenient to blame everything on China.
aguswidjaja 1 year ago
i really dont think the behavior of western shugden groups are looking out for the best interest of tibetans, but instead for themselves. Although you are so deep in your knowledge of your diety i think SOME of you are not in tuned with the histrory behind it, hhdl stance and most importantly the Tibetan communities way of thinking and behavior.
I also dont think this is of just western shugden but also some western Buddhists who do support hhdl. it oftens seems its ALL ME! ME! ME!
getfree999 1 year ago
to see the Tibetan community split. I have a fair few amount of Tibetan friends who practice shugden, and i feel very close to them and their famies as do they do, and they enjoy to be apart of the general tibetan community.
They are free to worship which they do, and they also still worship hhdl, they want to be apart of the general community, but sometimes i feel western shugen practitioners can be causing a greater split and disturb the relationship between our fellow tibetans.
getfree999 1 year ago
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as a tibetan and knowning tibetans who practice shugden, i think it is awful especially how sumdong rinpoche speaks about Tibetan shugden worshipers> this is why i am happy he will be stepping down. There many closed minded tibetans living in refugee camps in India/nepal, who really dont have a clue about anything, forget about shugen, im talking about general tibetan poltical/cultural issues. They do follow blindly at ceratin times. however there also many tibetans like myself, who do not want
getfree999 1 year ago
as a tibetan and knowning tibetans who practice shugden, i think it is awful especially how sumdong rinpoche speaks about Tibetan shugden worshipers> this is why i am happy he will be stepping down. There many closed minded tibetans living in refugee camps in India/nepal, who really dont hae a clue about anything, forget about shugen, im talking about general tibetan poltical/cultural issues. They do follow blindly at ceratin times. however there also many tibetans like myself, who do not want
getfree999 1 year ago
you can tell how brainless and opinionless the tibetan community is. they worship their god-fuher and always say what he wants them to say. sad.
thewiffenpoof 1 year ago
I bet the protests is a grass-roots program from a Chinese backed organization.
hyunseob900 1 year ago
Be careful, you guys are going in the other direction. Realize that Dalai Lama is in line with the universe. If you want to ascend in 2012, keep your heart open. It's that easy.
hyunseob900 1 year ago
WOOOOH........cut dis CRAP yahhh.......u all chinese....party..having chinese. bucks... how much u all paid by faking dis.....DALAI LAMA....is d only who lead us not sugden....so better wake up an let peace in b/w tibetans...
regan990 1 year ago
Wonder why they didn`t interview the people protesting?
mattpricedrums 1 year ago
@dhargyal007.. coz they get money!
fucking assholes!
Long live the 14th Dalai Lama!
pelzZypelzZ 1 year ago
FUCK YOU ALL!!
LONG LIVE HH THE 14TH DALAI LAMAI!
FREE TIBET!
pelzZypelzZ 1 year ago
hey fake monk and nuns bitch shut up.......
jctcdk 1 year ago
We have all kind of human living in this world. Each and everyone have their own believe and faith. Let the believer do what ever he/she think is correct ( At that moment of time when his/her thought is fixed, you can't change it ) . Out of compassion and concern for their well being we can only give them our thought and rational.
No need to protest against anybody, keep the religion to yourself.
WTMC59 1 year ago
@WTMC59 I agree with you. Everyone has their own religion and beliefs and they should do whatever they think is correct. However, the reason for the protests is the ban that is still going on in tibetan communities, where the Shugden practicers are basically alienated from the tibetan society and refused any help. People continue to practice but face hard times. I personally believe that in buddhism, there is no place for such ban and hence, the reason for protest.
Iamstillsingle1 1 year ago
@Iamstillsingle1
Learn more about this issue.´It´s complicated.
Don`t spread lies
Varavaken 1 year ago
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Look at CHINA before 2000, under CCP control, Poor, Pathetic, crappy, nothing but a SWEAT shop nation, making NIKE shoes for americans. NOW look at HONG KONG, under BRITSH CONTROL, Richest city in CHINA, supports 33% of ALL of chinas economy.THERES NO COMPARISON. CCP is the worst thing to happen to china. IF china got rid of the CCP, they couldve been prosperous like 60 YEARS ago. AND if it was completely up to the CCP, CHINA would STILL BE POOR TODAY. U.S. companies made CHINA rich, not CCP.
daIailamaTibet 1 year ago
Well, to be honest, I think eventually people are able to filter out truth from false propaganda. After I saw these Shugden demonstrations against His Holiness, curious, I did my own study into the matter. The lies being propagated by Dalai Lama's adversary - Kelsang Gyatso are crystal clear and just observe the body language of these Shugden protesters and you will notice how unhappy and frustrated they are. I have written an article about this on my website too.
BodhiOshin 1 year ago
Tiananmen redux:
"For me, this remains an open wound, and as long as the CCP keeps stonewalling, the much beloved phrase “Reform and Opening Up” will ring at least partially hollow. Those who keep demanding more contrition from the Japanese for their crimes against humanity should demand the same from their own rulers." Ma Ying Jeou
SauIan 1 year ago
Actually, I would like to give up my membership in the CCP; I really would. I am tired of being paid to post made-up drivel against good people for money. I realize that my actions actually hurt China's image, not help it; therefore, I hereby renounce the party, my employer, and the propagandistic supermachine they are obsessed with.
fIoatinghippos 1 year ago 20
@fIoatinghippos
well, they say that imitation is the highest form of flattery....
floatinghippos 1 year ago
@fIoatinghippos Can we really believe that you're a member of the Party?
ManjuSu 1 year ago
@fIoatinghippos you are a good man my friend. i respect ur decision. we shud alwys know that the truth will stay as it is despite all the lies and propagandas . keep moving forward to become a good humanbeing.
rnzndrj17 9 months ago
@fIoatinghippos Really....so what are you waiting for...?.Good luck for your sucking dalai lama coq...Oh yeah don't expect me to believe all the stupid things you said....keep on lying.
petergho 4 months ago
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我们没有资格去掌握别人的生命
生命是自己的
人要互相关爱要统一也是要用爱的方法
这样屠杀只会让西藏人更想独立
FreedomlsYourCover 1 year ago
Funny, the Dalai Lama claims to promote peace, harmony, and religious tolerance, but look at his actions:
He promotes a ban on a mainstream Gelugpa practice, Dorje Shugde, which he himself, his brother, all his Gurus practiced and which was the main protector of the Gelugpa tradition for the last 350 years.
He does nothing to stop the open persecution going on in Dharmasala and throughout the world against Dorje Shugden practitioner who have done nothing but follow their Gurus instructions.
floatinghippos 1 year ago
Yes everything is due to the Chinese govt. So the next US president is also going to be Chinese??
Scapegoats are handy but offer no solution at all.
pat2698 1 year ago
most of them protesting are westerners because they dont have to live inside this tight knit community where the shugden worshippers in india are being discriminated and intimidated. atleast they can speak up for the muted, the minority.
ikhamo 1 year ago
why almost 99% of the protesters were foreigners? why they are striving for such baseless cause? we tibetan people do't get it hardly.
dhargyal007 1 year ago 45
Delhi High Court:
"In an order dated April 5, 2010, Justice S. Muralidhar dismissed the writ petition and application on the grounds that the allegations of violence and harassment were vague averments and that the raised issues do not partake of any public law character and therefore are not justiciable in proceedings under Article 226 of the Constitution.
Citing the absence of any specific instances of any such attacks on Dorjee Shugden practitioners, ..."
ABCDIR 1 year ago 11
why must practitioners be anti dalai lama - pro shugen or anti shugden - pro dalai lama?! to start with, dalai lama and dorje shugden both are higher beings, attained beings, from the scriptures,..they are enlightened!
TheDharmaKnight 1 year ago
"The city of Lhasa was bombarded by tanks and artillery. The children were crying and crying. The corpses of people, dogs, horses, everyone was lying dead. They were put in a pile and then burned with kerosene. "
Bhusang, survivor of the Rape of Lhasa
SauIan 1 year ago
Dorje Shugden is an Enlightened Protector, that's why we can take refuge in him. He is not a spirit for many reasons - the main one being if he is a spirit and so malevolent, why doesn't the Dalai Lama bind him and subdue him or destroy him. The Dalai Lama has asked for many fire pujas to be done to destroy Dorje Shugden but this has never been successfully done, showing that Dorje Shugden must be enlightened.
wisdombeing 1 year ago
@wisdombeing
People have used him to cast spells, to inflict harm on their enemies. He is considered "a powerful magical being who can help propitiators acquire worldly goods and other powers and benefits." A powerful gyalpo is not a fully enlightened being.
Varavaken 1 year ago
Just go to the youtube video on how Dorje Shugden was the one who told Dalai Lama to flee from Tibet and even drew a map out for the escape route and his sword for protection.
It's called Dorje Shugden saved the Dalai Lama's Life
/watch?v=mV4VAQgt4Bs&feature=related
And I don't think a poor old monk at his age need to lie for any reasons.
dragonthunder2010 1 year ago
@dragonthunder2010
This is history. Noone can prove that he´s telling the truth, noone can prove that he´s lying
The Shugden groups and China are allies. There is a clear link between the triple murderers and the Shugden society in Delhi. This group has been conspireing with China since 1999. These are facts, not stories...
Varavaken 1 year ago
Just go to the youtube video on how Dorje Shugden was the one who told Dalai Lama to flee from Tibet and even drew a map out for the escape route and his sword for protection.
It's called Dorje Shugden saved the Dalai Lama's Life
/watch?v=mV4VAQgt4Bs&feature=related
And I don't think a poor old monk at his age need to lie for any reasons.
dragonthunder2010 1 year ago
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I do not think that the teachings on compassion and kindness by HH the Dalai Lama was exercised when monks were attacked by pro Dalai Lama supporters in Mundgod Sep 9, 2009.
I do not see the practice of religious freedom or humanity shown to these monks.
It is just shocking that a nation known to be Buddhist could act in such terror to their own brothers. Unbelievable. To read more on an eye witness report go to dorje shugden (dot) com on interesting read section on the right panel
dragonthunder2010 1 year ago
Pls do not forget the kindness of these REAL Democratic country, wherever you are living.
dragonthunder2010 1 year ago
If there was truly freedom of practicing what you like without any discrimination. Then what is all the witch hunt list of people's name being posted up on the Tibetan refugee settlements and posters on No Shugden followers can be allowed to walk in certain shops to buy daily supplies?
That is just out right religious discrimination that India has a heavy law against. The Dalai Lama has been warned by the Indian High court to watch it.
dragonthunder2010 1 year ago
@dragonthunder2010
Indian police keeps a close eye on "Kundeling" and his followers.
They´ve been conspireing with China since 1999. This group has connection with the triple murderers.
Varavaken 1 year ago
If there was truly freedom of practicing what you like without any discrimination. Then what is all the witch hunt list of people's name being posted up on the Tibetan refugee settlements and posters on No Shugden followers can be allowed to walk in certain shops to buy daily supplies?
That is just out right religious discrimination that India has a heavy law against. The Dalai Lama has been warned by the Indian High court to watch it.
dragonthunder2010 1 year ago
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Perhaps the biggest wrong predictions was the famous statement hat Tibet would be free by the year 2000. How devastating for all Tibetans, of whom probably most believed that the news came directly from His Holiness clairvoyant mind.
So why still ask Nechung's advice when it comes to making huge political decisions that affects so many people?
dragonthunder2010 1 year ago
Nechung has many times predicted wrongly to the Tibetan Govt and people. And Nechng is a spirit not a Buddha. So how come Nechung is OK to perpetuate but it will reason for Banning Dorje Shugden because it is a "spirit"???
This pure shows how twisted and bias this contradictory view is.
dragonthunder2010 1 year ago
@dragonthunder2010 I've read that Nechung's time as a protector is ending soon...his karma will exhaust as a spirit and he will gain the state of enlightenment.
TheDharmaKnight 1 year ago
@TheDharmaKnight Exactly what I heard too. So we can confirm then Dorje Shugden is a Dharma protector.
Besides it was Nechung who requested DS in his previous life as Dulzin Drakpa Gyeltsen to become a Dharma protector to protect the teachings of Je Tsongkhapa and that he will remind Dulzin in future (Tulku Drakpa Gyeltsen) of his promise.
Dulzin was the one responsible for building Gaden Monastery. His incarnation history can be read on dorje shugden (dot) com
dragonthunder2010 1 year ago
@TheDharmaKnight Exactly what I heard too. So we can confirm then Dorje Shugden is a Dharma protector.
Besides it was Nechung who requested DS in his previous life as Dulzin Drakpa Gyeltsen to become a Dharma protector to protect the teachings of Je Tsongkhapa and that he will remind Dulzin in future (Tulku Drakpa Gyeltsen) of his promise.
Dulzin was the one responsible for building Gaden Monastery. His incarnation history can be read on dorje shugden (dot) com
dragonthunder2010 1 year ago
@TheDharmaKnight
Shugden embodies the sectarian belief that other Tibetan lineages should be destroyed.
Tibetans know about this. Western followers don´t want to know.
Varavaken 1 year ago
@dragonthunder2010
Noone takes refuge in Nechung. But the Shugdens take refuge in DS.
He is a protector for the magical suppression of the other schools. Not a Dharma Protector. Gelug school has three Dharma Protectors. Tibetans know this, western followers don´t. They only know what their teachers tell them.
Varavaken 1 year ago
Can't the Tibetans that in this way they are actually bringing the Dalai lama's name down and tarnishing it? Because how can you be a Dalai Lama supporter - who preaches non-violence be violent to anyone.
You should not even be violent to even an ant or even a ghost as it says in the Lamrim.
So it goes to question are Tibetans even Buddhist?
dragonthunder2010 1 year ago
@dragonthunder2010
Tibetan Buddhism has pre-Buddhist elements, we know that.
Propitiating spirits as a means to achieve fame and fortune in this life is not Buddhism. Taking refuge in worldly deities is not Buddhism.
Who is violent? The Shugden activists are violent. Anti-Shugdens can become violent too. They are afraid of political traitors and Chinese infiltration.
I guess the party-controlled Buddhism in China is "real Buddhism" according to you.
Varavaken 1 year ago
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dragonthunder2010 1 year ago
Wisdombeing, Rednice, KachMarpo, yadda yadda yadda, all the same person.
Makes you wonder - what is one person doing only 24/7, posing as different people, just to DISS the Dalai Lama.
Hmm, the only other people doing that are Chinese mainlanders working for the Propaganda Department.
vinayahoIder 1 year ago
Shugden/WSS/NKT is just a business. It benefits several top "leaders" (translation: business partners) and acts as the lapdog for the CCP.
Sadly, it tricks regular people into thinking they are being benefitted, only to discover the foundation is built on a spiritual pyramid plan.
Beware This Cult. There is a world of true Dharma available, which does NOT require the cult-like subservience so inherent in NKT.
NKTsurvivors 1 year ago
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On the contrary, to Western audiences the Dalai Lama repeatedly says that he issued this ban In order to save this pure and profound Tibetan Buddhism from degenerating into spirit worship. And This ban is applied in order to promote peace and harmony between the four Tibetan Buddhist traditions.
What is the reality behind these statements?
TheDharmaKnight 1 year ago
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The justification given to the Tibetan public, which destroyed the entire harmony of the Tibetan community, is: Worshipping this evil deity is a danger for my life and for the freedom of Tibet. If you Tibetans want me to be dammed and dont care at all about the cause of Tibet, then go ahead with the worship of this deity.
TheDharmaKnight 1 year ago
floatinghippos
Shugden groups are spreading lies.
Shugden groups have financial support from China.
Shugden people are trying to destabilize the exile community. They commit violent crimes.
That self proclaimed lama in Delhi and his Shugden followers try to belittle the Dalai Lama in the eyes of international community.( It will not work.)
That is why I don´t listen to the Shugden groups.
By the way, floatinghippos, are you still blocking me?
Varavaken 1 year ago
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TheDharmaKnight 1 year ago
If you truly understood why they are being so aggressive and animalistic towards the Dalai Lama then you would be the same as them.
ibiza1290 1 year ago
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TheDharmaKnight 2 years ago
If the dharma protectors function is to protect the Buddhadharma, why would he want to bring any harm to HH DL? Why would he be a threat to HH DLs life? Why would he want to shorten HH DLs life? Why? Why? Why?
zamzam24388 2 years ago
zamzam
Why do you people repeat the same questions over and over?
You don´t want to understand. And you don´t have to.
Varavaken 2 years ago
dalai lama's age is beyond the average Tibetan life expectancy (may DL live long). Where is the truth in the accusation that DS is shortening DL's life???
TheDharmaKnight 1 year ago
floatinghippos
Stop promoting that tashidelek17-video.
WSS-propaganda. Nothing more.
Shugden-fanatics in Delhi, crazy western followers and most of all CHINA make this "ban" a big issue.
Tibetans have no problem with it. They have complete faith in the Dalai Lama.
Varavaken 2 years ago
What is fanatical about wanting to go to hospital or enter a simple shop? They are turned away due to their religious beliefs... this is truly disgraceful for those who claim to be Buddhist and who claim to follow the path of love, tolerance, peace, and compassion.
floatinghippos 1 year ago
I fully agree - people are being denied their basic rights. I must say that i was very moved to learn of the late HH Penor Rinpoche - a Nyingma high lama - who immediately opened his monastery to those ostracised because of their belief. It's not that he is a Shugdenpa but that he is a human being who empathises with those who are suffering. May HH Penor Rinpoche return again to show his great example.
wisdombeing 1 year ago
varavaken
you speak passionately about and associate DS practitioners to the Chinese' government with the motivation to get money and belittling Dalai Lama. I do think there are DS practitioners who are doing this...but NOT ALL. I hope you can consider this point...
peace
TheDharmaKnight 1 year ago
TheDharmaKnight
I read your hidden comments.
Both these statements are sincere. Just different perspectives.
Not all Shugden practitioners are his enemies, but the Shugden leaders in Delhi are, and also NKT/WSS.
Varavaken 1 year ago
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Note that China pays their web surfers .50 usd (fifty cents club) for inserting lies onto the Web. The biggest effort at spreading lies in the history of the world. U can spot them via their foul language and slurs on HH Dalai Lama. Beware of these scum.
XlVDALAILAMA 2 years ago
your not practising buddhism if you say compassion for this person but not that person. in this case shugden pracitioners. this is simple. why practise buddhism any further if its like this?
politics is politics, buddhism is buddhism, compassion is compassion.
ImNotCCP 2 years ago
It's funny you use the word "IF" to refer to the ban... when in fact the DL has publicly acknowledged it, as well as his prime minister, Samdhong.
There is a great news story done by Al Jazeera which shows a Dorje Shugden practitioner being turned away from shops, hospitals, etc... merely for his religious beliefs. The Dalai Lama is allowing this.This is real hard evidence you can see with your own eyes.
By the way, the Dalai Lama would be welcome in any DS monastary despite his bad behavior.
floatinghippos 2 years ago
slut in nuns robe is a very talkative spokesperson for NKK
MsKushh 2 years ago
Of course, even if the ban existed--which anyone who's attended HHDL's teachings knows it does not--what would it matter?
Shugden Lamas teach that HHDL is a liar and a hypocrite--then they say "don't attend HHDL's teachings," then they make up a story about how "Shugden practitioners are banned from HHDL's teachings."
Sounds like a story made up to keep unwitting western NKT converts "in the fold."
cIoserelative 2 years ago
I think the best way to practice is to understand the politics and just take refuge in our Lama and the practice he gives. We were taught as Buddhist is to forgive our enemies and practice compassion. But how we reconcile that with the Dorje Shugden issue and the ban that the Dalai Lama instituted upon its practitioners? Shouldn't the Shugden practitioners be dealt with compassion too?
closerelative 2 years ago
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DS is completely represented by WSS. No one talked about DS in the west until WSS did.
NKT is WSS, from conception through today.
This new attempt to portray NKT as suddenly Dalai Lama-friendly comes too late, unfortunately.
If NKT has had a change of policy and heart, it will have to spend as many years (or more) counteracting its original propaganda as it did generating it.
Ieedhi 2 years ago
I think that point sums it up, HHDL said the final decision is up to you whether to follow his advice or not. All the ban, the violence, the TGIE implementation of the ban is not because of HHDL but people who think they are Buddhas representatives on earth.
ImNotCCP 2 years ago
STOP KILLING IN TIBET.
SauIan 2 years ago
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So Manjushri has a Business Venue?
Back in the 1970 and 1980 teachers like Ajahn Sumedho and Thich Nhat Hanh gave teachings and retreats in Manjushri ,
Manjushri Centre was glad to take there money because they needed it at the time. Gash-la put a stop to this because he did not want the pure dharma of JeTsonghapa to be mix with other Buddhist teachings,
But by 2010 it is ok to mix the pure dharma of Je Tsonkhapa with business?
Laugh, I could cry.
lmNotCCP 2 years ago
THE MONASTERIES IN TIBET ARE VERY EMPTY THESE DAYS...
But your group claim that there is "religious freedom" in China/Tibet, that Tibetan Buddhism is "flourishing more than ever" (hisphonynesss )
YOU ARE SPREADING LIES!
Varavaken 2 years ago
Buddhism is like that, until you find your niche, where you click, if you want a path to enlightenment they are there but you need to follow it through to the end. Switching schools is like traveling down one road and getting 1km from your destination then changing your mind going back to the beginning and choosing a different road to get to you to the same destination.
ImNotCCP 2 years ago
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Varavaken 2 years ago
DS monks in Tibet are doing fine while TIBETAN BUDDHIST MONKS ARE BEING IMPRISONED!
Varavaken 2 years ago
@ImNotCCP thank you for your good points.
Just because you stick to one school of Buddhism doesn't mean you're sectarian. A person can choose to follow one school of buddhism and even promote it but also simultaneously have respect for other schools. Sectarianism is when you protect & promote your own school AT THE EXPENSE OF other schools, but this is not necessarily the case.
TheRedNiece 2 years ago
@ImNotCCP to say that Gelugpas are sectarian, would be like saying that all Buddhists are anti-jewish, anti-christian, anti-muslim, which is not true.
just because you prefer to follow the teachings of one school does not mean you are trying to go against or suppress another school of buddhism! It means you wish to just follow one way because it has suited your own disposition and learning.
TheRedNiece 2 years ago
ImNotCCP
What are you talking about?
Switching schools?
Varavaken 2 years ago
until you find the right school for you which fits you perfectly you are free to make a choice. The sectarianism you schismatic people talk about has been there since the very beginning. Yes it promotes pure lineage but so too does all faiths. Each has created great masters of their mind, in all faiths not just buddhism so why only now do you talk of sectarinism when its been there all along. choose your path and walk it.... whats yours
ImNotCCP 2 years ago
Get the facts straight, all buddhism is sectarian, this is nothing new, there is theravadan, mahayana, vajrayana, zen,etc etc... The facts are all religions are practicing what they believe in that gets results. If your going to be a heart surgeon why would you say you need to learn flower arranging. Buddhas teachings fit all types of people and each school caters to that type of mind. Your just trying to stir a reaction from people and there is no basis.
ImNotCCP 2 years ago
It should be made clear that Shugen worship itself violates religious freedom, because Shugden does not allow followers to practice other schools than the "pure Gelug school". Those who practice other schools "mix the pure doctrine" and will be killed for that "crime" by the deity Dorje Shugden, or they will at least be punished by a terrible sickness and finally die a horrible death.
cIoserelative 2 years ago
shapeshifters...
Varavaken 2 years ago
my my my
the RedNieceBorg (harrynephew, vinayaholder, lineageholder, purplseaster et all) seems to have a different puppetmaster behind the posts this week. Must be a sensitive date coming up.
vinayahoIder 2 years ago
Dear Varavaken,
The previous Panchen Lama worshipped Dorje Shugden and formally INVITED Dorje Shugden into the holy Tashi Lhunpo.
Why are u so fixated that the Panchen Lama can only have ONE incarnation? Why can't the Buddha's blessings be more?
harrynephew 2 years ago
I regard my suffering at the moment being due to having been part
of the NKT because of my own obstinacy in thinking that an
'unorthodox' and persecuted organisation, with a lovely English monk
in Mexico, couldn't possibly be problematic. Naive, is the word,
like greatescape, how could we think that a religion that 'collects'
real estate is o.k.
NKTsurvivors 2 years ago
look at /user/portaljohn..on his anti-Dalai Lama/pro-KG video, the second commenter is Dale157, who "just happens" to stop by a year ago as soon as the video was posted.
vinayahoIder 2 years ago
Hey.
I'm Dale157's sockpuppet.
My goal is to trash Tibetan lives while supporting my own government [of course I wouldn't even do that unless paid.]
I pretend to be a Briton woman.
0ptionM45 2 years ago
The NKT is a cult who takes Dharma teachings, twist them around to fit their own agenda, and leave peoples lives in ruins.
Ieedhi 2 years ago
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When is the WSS going to open up their videos to comments? Or are they afraid of the opinions of the larger Buddhist community?
In one of the videos on WSS's site, a young NKT Buddhist says 'There is no practice without him (shugden).
Clearly the NKT has recruited the least experienced of their students for these protests, who have no knowledge of Buddhist history and the fact that Shugden came well after the time of Tzongkhapa.
WSS please open your vids to comment for honest dialogue.
fIoatinghippos 2 years ago
only Gyaincain, the true Pan Chan La Ma
is the answer
Maohamet 2 years ago
The nkt will be only remembered for one thing and thats hating the dalai lama
fIoatinghippos 2 years ago
The real Panchen Lama dissappeared.
THE CHINESE GOVERNMENT KIDNAPPED HIM AND HIS FAMILY 1995
The Panchen-substitute has promised to uphold the leadership of the Communist Party of China. He is not a Tibetan Buddhist, he´s with the Buddhist Association of China.
The Dalai Lama´s mission is to preserve the whole Tibetan Buddhist tradition.
Panchen has another mission....
Varavaken 2 years ago
I thought this was a wind up - maybe someone using the same name but upon investigation i found this
hotelkadampa . com / holland / hotel/world-peace-cafe
That logo is unmistakable and there is suprise suprise a world peace cafe with that trademarked tag line - an oasis of peace.
Not one single mention of Buddhism anywhere.
As Mr KG once said - 'worldly business - what meaning'
but as he now likes to say -'just business you suckers....'.
kokoIiam59 2 years ago
all sockpuppets of floatinghippos
she didn't know what she was getting into lol
kokoIiam59 2 years ago
kokoliam
closerelative
redniece
dharma-whatever
all same dude with tendonitis.
kokoIiam59 2 years ago
of course Kokoliam agree with RedNiece
as they are the same two hands
don't worry, the new security office will revoke paychecks soon. unfortunately the country is coming crashing to a halt.
kokoIiam59 2 years ago
the only way forward is Pan Chan La Ma
Everyone in China knows that.
There is only one Tibetan to trust, that is Gyancain.
kokoIiam59 2 years ago
these people are all clones of the same dude lol
kokoIiam59 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Hardline security policies are taking China to the brink of revolutionary turmoil.
In contrast with the powerful, assertive and united China that is being projected to the outside world, Yu Jianrong said his prediction of looming internal disaster reflected on-the-ground surveys and also the views of Chinese government ministers.
Deepening social fractures were caused by the Party's obsession with preserving its monopoly on power through "state violence" and "ideology", rather than justice.
cIoserelative 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Hardline security policies are taking China to the brink of revolutionary turmoil.
In contrast with the powerful, assertive and united China that is being projected to the outside world, Yu Jianrong said his prediction of looming internal disaster reflected on-the-ground surveys and also the views of Chinese government ministers.
Deepening social fractures were caused by the Party's obsession with preserving its monopoly on power through "state violence" and "ideology", rather than justice.
FreedomlsYourCover 2 years ago
This great King may seem to appear wrathful and fearsome but he is actually a guardian angel. He uses his wrathful means to clear obstacles and to destroy demons that come in our way. The more you look at him and understand him, he actually looks quite handsome!
kokoliam59 2 years ago
kokoliam59
PEHAR, take a good look at Pehar.
Pehar will clear some obstacles.
Pehar is undisputed.
Varavaken 2 years ago
Hopefully one day this controversy will be lifted and the ban will fade away and Shugden will appear beautiful as ever. This should have been the way long time ago. Its alright now for those who is in favor of Shugden to practice quietly.
kokoliam59 2 years ago
One day this controversy will die down and all will be forgotten about how harmful this Protector will be. However, our actions and attitude towards him will result in future repercussions. Sowing seeds of discontent towards anybody has repercussions especially is the object is a high being or emanation of a high being.
closerelative 2 years ago
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Varavaken 2 years ago
I totally agrees with Red Niece that the DS issues is not just a Tibetan affair. Millions all over the world are still practicing this amazing great and beautiful deity called Dorje Shugden. DS has obviously helped and protect millions till today. This deity is no evil spirit.
kokoliam59 2 years ago