She has a point - he KNOWS that what he is saying is not true. He is purposefully lying to people. What else, do you think, is he lying about??
Find out Truth - Search for "NowPublic "The List" on Health Care (Insurance) Reform Bill" and read my research on the list of page numbers. 3 out of 49 were true - which ones?
People fearful of the Public Option need to learn wtf they're talking about. Its not a single payer system. It opens choices up and breaks monopolyies in areas. Lady on the left is right.
Businesses are already dropping peoples coverage!!! Republicans say that this bill will make it so you will have to pay for my healthcare. BUT YOU ALREADY DO!!! 33% of the deficit as I write this is made up of medicare. WE NEED TO MAXIMIZE OUR DOLLAR!
I like how people would rather have private insurance companies which rape them for their money to make the most PROFIT. They are basically the "death panels" that the Republicans claim "Obamacare" to include. Private companies cut people off if they get too sick and expensive and choose for people what procedures they are allowed to get - aren't those major talking points AGAINST this healthcare bill? Misinformation much?
OMFG, is a Republican finally admitting that most individuals currently have no choice when it comes to health care insurance? Are they finally admitting that it's your employer, not you that gets to decide what doctors you will get to see based on their choice of insurance? Is he acknowledging that insurance companies get between you and your doctor right now?
We need to get away from an employer based system. The public option moves in that direction.
The bill begins, "To provide affordable, quality health care for all Americans and reduce the growth in health care spending, and for other purposes."
Line 1 states "Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representa-"
I have had a copy of H.R. 3200 on my computer since July and have read through most of it. Everytime some conservative spews bullshit about the bill, I check it, find out the conservative is full of shit and move on.
of course it doesnt actually start with such a short nad generic summary of tossing free health in all Americans swag bag, I was saying what do you think the other thousand pages say?
Specifically page 59: The federal government will have direct, real-time access to all individual bank accounts for electronic funds transfer...... or page 427: Government mandates program that orders end-of-life treatment; government dictates how your life ends.... and the countless other fucked up provisions....
LIAR - Search for "NowPublic "The List" on Health Care (Insurance) Reform Bill" and read the research I've done on that stupid list of page numbers quoted above. Or, use a link to the text and read it yourself!
So, really we need to label these people with a different term. The ppl in control are a mix of nazi, fascist, and communist, under the guise of socalism. Technically you could call them an Orwellian Government. Since they're trying to reach a 1984-ish type of World. Called the New World Order by people of course.
Blah, blah, blah, everyone labels their enemies as the worst kind of things possible.
Go fuck yourself.
How can a mixed race man want to be the leader of a Eugenics movement?
I would say their a mix of many different opinions representing many different regions inside a diverse country, all of which were elected by people like me who voted for them. That's democracy, and sometimes when you lose it tastes like shit, so suck it up asshole.
Maybe next time you want to reply you'll have the guts to click the reply button so I know you did. How can a mixed man be the leader of a eugenics movement? Are you fucking retarded? What does color have to do with killing? Get your stupid ass back to school and do some god damn learning next time you're there. This is not democracy, this is a republic. Democracy is the worst god damn government imaginable, but you wouldnt know that because youre a fucking retard. You spinless Cocksucker, bye.
Yes, we're a Republic, but when I said "that's Democracy" I was clearly referring to the election of leaders by a popular vote. What's that called? I'm just so fucking stupid. Please help me.
And race has commonly been a facet of eugenics theories and people who support them. "Purity" arguments often include race, and are commonly central to eugenics philosophies, as they were most famously with the Nazis.
And youre still a spineless cocksucker, never has our republic been referred ot as a democracy by our founding fathers. IF they ever mentiioned democracy it was as a democracy by law, which is a republic. And eugenics is not a purity ploy, under nazis it was, under Holdren its a simple reduction of population to 500 million. That type of plan does not care for skin color, or religious beliefs.
I guess your Crazy Pants makes sense, because you can't even accurately deconstruct what I wrote:
The popular election of a leader is Democracy. I said, "Yes, we're a Republic, but when I said 'that's Democracy' I was clearly referring to the election of leaders by a popular vote."
I think you have your own purity issues.
Isn't it frustrating to shout angrily into the crowded warehouse that is the internet, and still, after all your efforts, be just another Crazy Pants?
I see what you did there, and I like it. However, stop using the word democracy to describe our country, its misleading by definition. Call it a democratic repbulic, yes, that sounds much better. And I'm not sure what a crazy pants is, but uh, well, what the fuck is a crazy pants? Its in caps so it must be a noun. But I don't make up words to insult ppl, I use old fashion ones, like spineless cocksucker, I've used it before, and I'll use it again.
For the record, what Obama and Bush have done is actually closer to fascism. Mussolini described fascism as corporatism. Obama has said he wants a single payer system, on record. And you cannot compete with a government business. They can go billions of dollars in debt and just fuel their shitty businesses with tax dollars. Speaking of taxes, I have yet to hear how they actually plan on paying for this. They keep saying it will be a deficit neutral plan...how?
yeah you are right but you have to be careful with the f word. somehow the great american propaganda machine equates it to nazism so you sound crazy if you use the word correctly.
The Nazi party was into eugenics above all else. They believed certain races and religions were inferior, and thus needed to be rid of. So, people should stray from the word Nazi and go towards eugenics, because there are actually a great deal of people in Obama's cabinet that have announced publicly their eugenicist views. John Holdren being the biggest, wrote a book called Eco Science which details how to reduce the world population to 500 million. He is also the head of science and technology
Sorry -- you just entered into a field of somewhat expertise of mine. Holdren has written books on population theories -- that doesn't mean he heartily endorses them. Because China had the 1 child program as population control it should be discussed -- but Holdren doesn't endorse it. Read the book -- its interesting -- but not Holdren's personal views. Holdren is not pro- eugenics by any stretch of the imagination.
The book details how to go about reducing the population expert. And Holdren goes on record several times endorsing eugenics. Yet, since this is your area of expertise, you must know this by now. So, I think by all stretches of imagination, one could perceive Holdren as a Eugenicist. And I might add, that Eco Science is a huge ass book, if you read the whole thing and came out with "population theories", I think you wasted your time. Just being honest.
Sorry, you are the one who is wrong. On several occasions, OBama said he prefers single payer, government run healthcare. he said it as a state senator, a US senator, and as a candidate. He knows that a government funded, public option will lead to single payer.
you need to check your facts....why did he raise cigarette prices? to pay for healthcare for children. and also, we wont have a single payer system...if you dont want the option, dont take it. and the stimulus has created jobs in my home town..did it save everyones job? no. did it soften the blow? yes. and if you dont think its important for everyone to be able to have healthcare, thats your business.
Also, the healthcare bill has a clause that states companies CANNOT sue the gov't for price fixing... That's basically violating any antitrust law in existence... This is bull - the govt can't run any agency cost effectively and we're trusting them with a multibilliondollar market?
This woman doesn't know what she is talking about... The 8% payroll tax she is referring to is for companies opting NOT to take the gov't option - it's a huge penalty for not sending their employees that route. Imagine if payroll constituted 50% of your operating cost and your company is lucky enough to operate at a 5% net profit in this economy you're now down to a 1% net profit (while still paying for your existing insurance....).
this is not about health care. its about insurance money.and whether privet will do it better then government. if you like the public school works.then be fore it but it will drive out privet.except fore the rich.and congress thy will still have there golden option.our health care needs repair.but if your car gets a flat tire you don't get a new car.unless your a member of congress.
Oh by the way that business we own is health care related. You make it unprofitable for me to stay in business, I'll take my money retire, head to Honolulu and you can treat your own damned self with your high school diploma. Make it unprofitable for me to be a doctor and you just see what it does to the health care system in this country.
If young 20 somethings would put down their IPODS , Wii's, and quit binge drinking over the weekends they could take that money and buy health insurance. I run a business and I can tell you we will drop our insurance coverage like a rock and ask our employees to take the public option. Once monopolized by the governement you have no choice! anyway you slice it this is a power grab that is anti-capitalist. Sure you like Obama he let's you be lazy and keep your IPODS.
Adorable network news propaganda . . . anyone doing research into the elite business structure even at a cursory glance will see HUGE public subsidies (tax payer $) going to PRIVATE corporations aka unaccountable private tyrannies on a regular basis. Not even talking about the bailout here, just another day at the office of the suckers of satan's cock.
Period.
Average employee pays in US pays %60 in taxes through all the different taxes. Public Health AND free education is a no-brainer.
You know, it'd be awesome if those of us, the younger adults in the US, the twenty somethings? I can't get insurance, I got laid off. The public option would help my wife get the operation to make it so she's not in pain all the fucking time. But no, thanks to the republican party, she is going to continue to suffer. And even if there is the public option, a good 4/5ths of the work force only need minimum insurance for when something comes up. The sickly pay more as it is, nothing would change.
The chance to sign a bigger contract and to sign endorsement deals drives them just as much as the admiration and bragging rights. Take away that potential for profit and all you are left with is self loathing government automatons going through the motions like in England. They don't care how many patients they treat in the scheme, they make the same amount regardless, that's a dangerous situation and self limiting. JV
you know what i say, set up some uni healthcare but don't compel me to pay for it. whoever wants it, they pay into it, don't take any more money from me to pay for something i don't use. if i think the gov plan is better i will go with them but don't fine me if i choose not too.
taking a profit motive out of any business endeavor, yes HC is a business, is detrimental to it's effectiveness. In the World Cup, they play to win, they profit from their hard work, skill, sacrifice, and talent....
Well, jv, the problem with voluntary plans is that they are overwhelmingly populated by people who anticipate illness - which is always the most expensive group to fund, and blows premiums up. That's why there is a compulsory component to most public plans.
As to the other - nothing is taking the profit motive out of American businesses faster than the health insurance companies.
CommonSenseJoe supposedly knows more about economics than even economists. No, most research does not come from the private sector, it comes from publicly funded research, and even the nature of the research is different. Industry modifies drugs to re-patent them, public funding makes the fundamental breakthroughs from DNA, antibiotics, to sequencing and iRNA. It is all public funding. CommonSenseJoe is really CommonDelusionJoe: he thinks he knows it all. All he knows is Fox News.
The democratic party has a majority of seats in both houses,,ask yourself why?
Because a majority of the electorate voted for them based on progressive ideas including healthcare ,including a public option,this was a cornerstone of the obama campaign and was no secret,,,democrats had and have a popular mandate
It is how they represent the majority who sent them to washington
How can these guys sleep at night? They are selling out the entire country just to make a few more bucks for themselves. And these are the people who question others' patriotism? They obviously hate this country - The U.S. Gov. is just an opportunity for them to make more money. Shame, shame, shame.
umm, the only reason many people can afford health insurance is that their employer can give it to them at reduced rates... kick the average joe into the "exchange" and health care will cost him more and if the public option costs less, they'll be force to take it...especially if the government mandates it. I like my private insurance and I can't afford it without my employer's support.
Obviously I've read more of the bill than you have. Who's feeding you your talking or screaming points? You are not smart enough to have come up with your own opinion.
Ahaha, now you've read the bill?! Wow you've either done more than your stupid corrupt goons in congress, or have the audacity to not only lie to yourself but everyone else.
Nice try buddy. Come back when you've read a simple PARAGRAPH. And sorry there aint any pictures with captions for ya.
What they need to do is force the healthcare industry to be open and honest about their billing practices ( $15 for an asprin), reform litigation laws, and invest in health saving reasearch and prevention methods that include health education.
Why? You seem to side with the President who is lying through his teeth. My insurance company has never lied to me about what they would or would not cover. I am free to change companies if I want or pay less if I want less coverage.
you don't like a choice? what do you think the word "option" means? It's just like Medicare. Senior citizens have a choice to buy into Medicare or not. Why shouldn't the rest of us not have that same choice? Isn't this country about equality and should not promote age discrimination?
this medical plan the dems are pushing gives more power to the the criminal gov't .i believe in health care reform just not 1 that grants more power to the gov't over its ppl.why do u think the bill is as thick as 4 bibles??? checkurself
Those who retire and don't have enough retirement savings or a pension won't have a choice but to opt into Medicare. My parents are over 55 and they use the medical ins. plan from my dad's former employer which was a union. People can opt in or not into Medicare. People don't plan ahead will no be able to afford health care ins. if there was no Medicare. Lucky for them there is Medicare. Otherwise they would be screwed.
Respectfully, I believe your parents are in Medicare. Most insurance plans require that you enroll when you are eligible, but they pay everything the Medicare does not. This is what will happen with a publicly funded, government option. Insurance companies will abandon everyone the government plan, but sell supplemental plans to it.
They have a choice to participate, not a choice to "buy in." You're in regardless, you have no choice. Whether you decide to participate is another story.
I have no choice but to pay taxes for public schools when I don't even have kids; I rather have an educated society then a stupid one. Same goes for health care. I rather have a healthy society then a sick one. I don't see how people are so unwilling to help their fellow citizens. In the end it makes for a better society. We all pay taxes for fire dept., police, clean water, street lamps, public schools,Cal Trans to fix roads and bridges regardless if we use those services or not.
It is not a question of helping our fellow citizens. It is a question of the government taking over all of our healthcare in order to help 5% of the population.
I love the argument they use against public health care. That public health care will be cheaper and better then private health care because the gov is backing it so people will leave private health care and then the public health care will take over. Iam not really seeing a problem with having the cheaper and better system take over.
I would be a cheaper system, but not a better quality system. Have you ever heard the saying, "you get what you pay for". The only way that the government can keep costs down is price controls, salary caps, and rationing of care. I see a problem with that.
And yet all across the world other governments are proving you wrong. Because they have both cheaper and higher quality systems. Now don't get me wrong, if you got tons of cash then look no further then the US to get the best quality of health care. But for the system as a whole for the nation that is not the case.
The same is true in those countries as well. There are private clinics with the best doctors and no waiting times for those who money.
Where will all the break through treatments and drugs come from? Every medical and drug company makes the majority of their profit in the US. If we impose price control like every other socialized country does, where will the money for research come from? What company will invest a billion dollars on new drug with no hope of decent return?
Were we not talking about health insurance not drug companies? But either way i don't think its right for Americans to pay more for the same drugs then other countries, i thought Republicans were not in favor of more taxes, but it seems that the high price of drugs is like a tax on America and the rest of the world benefits from it. Wouldn't it be more fair if the prices were even so the prices in America falls a bit and the prices in other wealthy nations goes up a bit.
Are we talking healthcare reform of just health insurance reform? This is the whole problem with this mythical bill. Health insurance costs more because health care costs more. Healthcare costs more because the government fails to pay for the care providers give to Medicare and Medicaid patients. It only pays 10-15 cents on the dollar. The President is planning on cutting this further to pay for his plan, whatever it is.
I am tired of all the BS. We Need a Public Option Plan period. If they Repubs do not want to work with us then we need to go around them.
Anyone who would like more info about the public option plan should visit my profile. In the comment section you will find a link to the ez to read version of the bill sent out by congress and so much more.
I don't make the rules. I just live by them. Why not call your representative and suggest that. I would be all for it personally because I know the majority want this. Even the Pro-lifers have gotten on board now as they feel this is the best way to provide health care to moms and babies that is affordable.
I doubt many prolifers would be taken with that "fantasy". The party in power now has support the murdering of over 30 million unborn children. I doubt they will do better by mothers and babies.
The problem is that Democrats and the President are not being honest about what they REALLY want. If the public option is funded with tax payer dollars and does not have to deal with the same market forces as other insurance companies, it will eventually eliminate all private insurance. This is not debatable. It is a fact.
The Democrats desperately want and need single payer, government run healthcare to cover up the crash of Medicare and Medicaid. They are going broke soon.
The public option is not funded with tax dollars, only revenue on premiums.
The tax-dollar myth is a Republican lie.
The public option IS dealing with the same market forces; in fact, it is introducing competition into an oligarchic monopoly.
The only way the public option eliminates private insurance is if consumers choose it because it provides better care. What is wrong with providing better care? Isn't that what this is all about? Getting better care to Americans.
It cannot be a myth because so far the bill is a myth. Which bill are we talking about now? Version 1, 2, or 3? Is this the one with or without the public option in it?
I am all for having a public option as described by the President himself. A self-sustaining public option would be good for the market. The problem is that I don't think it will be able to survive without tax dollars or it will be too expensive for anyone to afford.
The public option has nothing to do with care however.
You went broke under Bush. Perhaps you might have spoken up under honest George's two terms. Its a little late now, except to try and shift the blame.
Actually money talks. He's right. But most employers will offer both, which means private insurance companies would HAVE to lower their rates. I do think many smaller businesses-which do not ordinarily carry insurance benes anyway, and Wal-Mart, which is the largest employers in the nation, would go with the public option since Wal-Mart supports it .
Just leave things alone-employers will be dropping their health plans anyway since it will be too expensive to keep. So you all get NO plan. That's the Republican way! Hey they got their free health insurance - NOT their problem!
Sigh, I wish people traveled more.... If people could just get outside the US for once, they'd see that all these horrible consequences of Health care reform are ridiculous. But lobbyists' propaganda works. Germany has a system with both public/private insurance. It works really well.. People/doctors like it. Ditto my friends in Japan, Taiwan, France, Canada, etc. Germans have had universal health care since 1887! Maybe it's time the US joined the 19th century.
Pence exists in an alternate universe; apparently he is unaware (or more likely just doesn't give a damn) that people are presently losing their private health coverage in droves, public option or not. Thus the dire need for reforms, first & foremost being a stringent regulation of the abusive private insurance companies which make billions in profits killing off people by denying them the services they have already paid for.
Wow. Pence makes a good point, and the lady is completely dishonest in her response. That's tough to admit as a blue-blooded Democrat. Workers that are dropped from their employer provided insurance plans will still lose their coverage. Having choices of other plans after that doesn't change the fact that they'll have to pay for it themselves.
You simply missed the point. Pence claimed that if employers stopped providing insurance through private corporations then employees would have to go to public option. The lady was simply pointing out how fallacious that statement is.
Dude you really need to work on your critical thinking. It's something they teach in science but unfortunately the majority of the U.S. population is scientifically illiterate. Stop reading people magazine and pick up a peer reviewed scientific journal.
That's only half his point, and it's valid. I'm for a public option, but the bill needs to be rewritten to close these loop holes. They need to raise that 8% payroll penalty or something to reinforce companies providing care for their workers.
p.s. Your class is showing. Ad hominem attacks weaken your argument. I guess that's something you can't learn from all those peer reviewed scientific journals you read though.
No it's not valid moron. If an employer decided not to provide insurance for their employees they would still be able to choose private insurance instead of public option. So what he said was patently false.
p.s. You don't know what ad hom is. It's a common mistake made by cretins like you. Personal attack in and of itself does not constitute an ad hominem attack. It's only ad hom when you use it as a substitute for a substantive argument.
"Sorry, couldn't read that through YouTube's new asshole filter."
That my friend is the epitome of ad hominem. You can call me names all you want, but if you don't have a counter-argument then you're simply name calling.
He could have mispoke regarding pushing them into the public option. Substitute, "public option" with "exchange" and his point is valid; that piont being they would lose their plan w/ their employer. She agreed, she just disagreed it would automatically push them into a public option. Why argue that it won't cause people to lose their plans if she agrees?
And just think. The poor heads of insurance companies will no longer be able to make tens of millions of dollars off businesses that cannot afford their costs. Dude you are living in an alternate universe. If companies do not have to worry about health insurance costs they may be able to hire more employees. Therefore adding more consumers and even creating more jobs. But lets feel sorry for the insurance companies instead of REAL people.
So are you saying that it is Ok that businesses pay to much for their health insurance plans? You sound like a insurance bought republican to me. The businesses can keep their insurance if they choose. That is why its called public OPTION!!!!
You do not understand how the market works. Business will do what makes econimic sense. If the public "option" is cheaper and offers better benefits, the smart decision is to drop health insurance benefits completely.
Isn't Mike Pence sort of correct on this point? If employers do decide to drop coverage for their employees and instead pay the payroll tax, as Debbie Wasserman Schultz says, then being put in the exchange may not lead to one getting insurance, as one would have to pay for it on his or her own dime and may not find that to be a viable option.
pence looked like a lying idiot. Does the GOP think we a stupid. if you say it a hundred time it does not make it true. it just make us more angry at you
Imagine the benefit if just one thing changed...allowing people to buy insurance from any state in the union. That would increase competition dramatically.
You mean like car ins companies, you can buy car insurance from any company on any state but they still charge you whatever they feel like based on the state you live in? I can't really imagine that one benefit because there wouldn't really be such a benefit. Ins companies will never lower prices unless forced by real competition from an outsider who will offer lower premiums with expanded coverage and that would be a public option. Let John Lennon image and let's face reality here.
Hmm...where was the so called republican health care reform proposal the last 8 years? Now they act like they're concerned and want to reform it...right.
its simple really what does the government do that is trully successful? let alone self sustaining, they cant even pay out the money for 'cash for clunkers' and you guys want them paying for your medical needs?
What does the private sector do that's so great? Cause recessions, and deny people because of pre-existing conditions? You are a heartless bastard. I'd rather the government then the private insurance companies who fuck everyone over. And don't give me the bs about "they are lazy it's their choice". I don't give a fuck what they have done in their lives I STILL think they deserve health insurance. I wouldn't ever deny anybody that right. Asshole.
let me just say a quick statement here, my family has to mail tylenol to cuba because it doesnt exist in that country, thats what happens when government takes over everything. i will agree with you on one thing the insurance companies are screwing both patients and doctors but if you think the government (who currently screws doctors even more) is any better then you sir are a fool
Okay let's just be fucking idiots! America looks so god damn dumb and evil because of this. This is sick, just so fucking sick and I'm sooo tired of these heartless bastards!
None of this endless jabbering makes one iota of difference. The corporations *own* both the Dems and the Repubs and will ultimately be the deciders of this "great debate".
And I already know what their decision will be. The corporations will continue to make even more obscene profits until we, the common folk, decide to say enough or the US is brought to it`s knees, whichever comes first.
lol so if we give everybody insurance then people are going to lose their insurance? lmao. how idiotic can you be?
Debbie Wasserman Schultz is great.
insurance companies will only go out of business if they can meet the shift in the demand curve. I thought conservatives understood that competition is good for making sure people get higher quality goods at more competitive and affordable prices.
Its called economics. Believe it or not it isn't a political ideology.
On behalf of at least one Canadian(me) please accept my apologies for boots.
Our system has its drawbacks, but the one fundamental benefit is that I know my healthcare will never be denied. That means I can be honest with my doctor and not worry if I have coverage.
I can build a life without the fear that it will be taken away due to a boardroom decision when I'm most vulnerable.
You get healthcare for now 20 years from now I'm not so sure.
Already the government can't keep up, we will end up with no option. Also why aren't Canadians rewarded for being healthy? Everybody's covered in Canada, drunks, drug addicts, obese...no one is denied service.
To be honest, my only beef with our system is that it's provincially administered. Instead of being federally funded, I think it should be a federal program.
Every citizen should be protected by universal healthcare regardless of where they live and what their circumstances are.
Anything less is a form of anarchy where the strong victimize the weak.
I like to think we're evolving out of that mindset.
Its both the Federal Government transfers funds to the provinces based on population, the provincial government charges fees to make up the short fall.
What happens when the government can't cover it, they cut back services and raise the fees.
You think people that smoke and are drug addicts should be covered. Like wishful thinking the system can take care of idiots. We'll be evolving all right back to the dark ages.
Look at the Olympics , its over budget by billions.
The long term gain is a healthy, productive citizenry.
Isn't that the ultimate goal?
Flu shots aren't working towards that goal, either is fast food or a majority of prescription drugs.
I use the Olympics as how incompetent government is, if they can't run the simple things efficiently , the more complex things like healthcare you're just fooling yourself that government will preserve the service. It will end in a blink of an eye leaving the taxpayer as a victim.
I shed no tears for the insurance industry, if they played fair and treated consumers right they wouldnt be in this position. Screw them, it's about the patients not their bottom line.
so when the public option is available companies will drop their employees. what is stopping them from doing that now. that would say alot about the company that drops their employees not about the public option.
What do Repubs have again American business? Why do they want them to fail? I can't understand it because they act like they are the party of business.
So when my employer drops my HMO and not provide healthcare I could go to the public plan to buy my own plan on the free market. Right now my employer pays about half of the cost for the plan, let's say they pay $200/month and I pay $200/month. So now when I am on the free market, how do I get the remaining $200 that my employer would of paid?
i hope the public option has an income limit, which may help private insurance companies.
AlmostAlwaysFabulous 2 years ago
She has a point - he KNOWS that what he is saying is not true. He is purposefully lying to people. What else, do you think, is he lying about??
Find out Truth - Search for "NowPublic "The List" on Health Care (Insurance) Reform Bill" and read my research on the list of page numbers. 3 out of 49 were true - which ones?
TheGraywalker 2 years ago
People fearful of the Public Option need to learn wtf they're talking about. Its not a single payer system. It opens choices up and breaks monopolyies in areas. Lady on the left is right.
koren1124 2 years ago 5
i agree.
AlmostAlwaysFabulous 2 years ago
Pence is a liar.
Iceberg6606 2 years ago 6
HR 3438 Contains only 7 pages New Health Bill Paid by 1% Tobin Tax on Wall Street Speculators
louis12346 2 years ago
Businesses are already dropping peoples coverage!!! Republicans say that this bill will make it so you will have to pay for my healthcare. BUT YOU ALREADY DO!!! 33% of the deficit as I write this is made up of medicare. WE NEED TO MAXIMIZE OUR DOLLAR!
supersamschwartz 2 years ago
I like how people would rather have private insurance companies which rape them for their money to make the most PROFIT. They are basically the "death panels" that the Republicans claim "Obamacare" to include. Private companies cut people off if they get too sick and expensive and choose for people what procedures they are allowed to get - aren't those major talking points AGAINST this healthcare bill? Misinformation much?
Engeltag 2 years ago
OMFG, is a Republican finally admitting that most individuals currently have no choice when it comes to health care insurance? Are they finally admitting that it's your employer, not you that gets to decide what doctors you will get to see based on their choice of insurance? Is he acknowledging that insurance companies get between you and your doctor right now?
We need to get away from an employer based system. The public option moves in that direction.
shalcall 2 years ago 2
Soooooo... part of line 1 on page 1 of HR3200 says free healthcare for everyone, mind telling me what you think the other 1100 pages say?
If only more people knew then I would bet my life the support for the would be below 5%
Have you read the entire bill?
thejmeister88 2 years ago
The bill begins, "To provide affordable, quality health care for all Americans and reduce the growth in health care spending, and for other purposes."
Line 1 states "Be it enacted by the Senate and House of Representa-"
I have had a copy of H.R. 3200 on my computer since July and have read through most of it. Everytime some conservative spews bullshit about the bill, I check it, find out the conservative is full of shit and move on.
shalcall 2 years ago
of course it doesnt actually start with such a short nad generic summary of tossing free health in all Americans swag bag, I was saying what do you think the other thousand pages say?
Specifically page 59: The federal government will have direct, real-time access to all individual bank accounts for electronic funds transfer...... or page 427: Government mandates program that orders end-of-life treatment; government dictates how your life ends.... and the countless other fucked up provisions....
thejmeister88 2 years ago
I don't have to imagine what H.R. 3200 says, I know what it says.
Page 59: "enable electronic funds transfers, in order to allow automated reconciliation with the related health care payment and remittance advice"
- The plan will allow me to pay with an electronic funds transfer? They'll pay my doctors the same way? OMFG, TYRANNY!
Page 427: . . makes accessible such orders to physicians that may sign orders for life sustaining treatment.
- my doctor can sign my wishes like DNR and it's legal.
shalcall 2 years ago
You are a moron to believe that list. Only 3 out of those 49 pages have any truth to them!
Google "NowPublic "The List" on Health Care (Insurance) Reform Bill" and read the TRUTH.
TheGraywalker 2 years ago
You are a moron to believe that list of lies without researching it. I did. Search for "NowPublic The List on Health Care (Insurance) Reform Bill"
Read the Truth for yourself.
TheGraywalker 2 years ago
LIAR - Search for "NowPublic "The List" on Health Care (Insurance) Reform Bill" and read the research I've done on that stupid list of page numbers quoted above. Or, use a link to the text and read it yourself!
TheGraywalker 2 years ago
So, really we need to label these people with a different term. The ppl in control are a mix of nazi, fascist, and communist, under the guise of socalism. Technically you could call them an Orwellian Government. Since they're trying to reach a 1984-ish type of World. Called the New World Order by people of course.
Retic92 2 years ago
You are crazy pants sir.
Crazy Pants.
Blah, blah, blah, everyone labels their enemies as the worst kind of things possible.
Go fuck yourself.
How can a mixed race man want to be the leader of a Eugenics movement?
I would say their a mix of many different opinions representing many different regions inside a diverse country, all of which were elected by people like me who voted for them. That's democracy, and sometimes when you lose it tastes like shit, so suck it up asshole.
Deweydecible 2 years ago
Maybe next time you want to reply you'll have the guts to click the reply button so I know you did. How can a mixed man be the leader of a eugenics movement? Are you fucking retarded? What does color have to do with killing? Get your stupid ass back to school and do some god damn learning next time you're there. This is not democracy, this is a republic. Democracy is the worst god damn government imaginable, but you wouldnt know that because youre a fucking retard. You spinless Cocksucker, bye.
Retic92 2 years ago
Great, you're just so brilliant. I'm so sorry.
Yes, we're a Republic, but when I said "that's Democracy" I was clearly referring to the election of leaders by a popular vote. What's that called? I'm just so fucking stupid. Please help me.
And race has commonly been a facet of eugenics theories and people who support them. "Purity" arguments often include race, and are commonly central to eugenics philosophies, as they were most famously with the Nazis.
You're still crazy pants.
Deweydecible 2 years ago
And youre still a spineless cocksucker, never has our republic been referred ot as a democracy by our founding fathers. IF they ever mentiioned democracy it was as a democracy by law, which is a republic. And eugenics is not a purity ploy, under nazis it was, under Holdren its a simple reduction of population to 500 million. That type of plan does not care for skin color, or religious beliefs.
Retic92 2 years ago
I guess your Crazy Pants makes sense, because you can't even accurately deconstruct what I wrote:
The popular election of a leader is Democracy. I said, "Yes, we're a Republic, but when I said 'that's Democracy' I was clearly referring to the election of leaders by a popular vote."
I think you have your own purity issues.
Isn't it frustrating to shout angrily into the crowded warehouse that is the internet, and still, after all your efforts, be just another Crazy Pants?
Deweydecible 2 years ago
I see what you did there, and I like it. However, stop using the word democracy to describe our country, its misleading by definition. Call it a democratic repbulic, yes, that sounds much better. And I'm not sure what a crazy pants is, but uh, well, what the fuck is a crazy pants? Its in caps so it must be a noun. But I don't make up words to insult ppl, I use old fashion ones, like spineless cocksucker, I've used it before, and I'll use it again.
Retic92 2 years ago
For the record, what Obama and Bush have done is actually closer to fascism. Mussolini described fascism as corporatism. Obama has said he wants a single payer system, on record. And you cannot compete with a government business. They can go billions of dollars in debt and just fuel their shitty businesses with tax dollars. Speaking of taxes, I have yet to hear how they actually plan on paying for this. They keep saying it will be a deficit neutral plan...how?
Retic92 2 years ago
yeah you are right but you have to be careful with the f word. somehow the great american propaganda machine equates it to nazism so you sound crazy if you use the word correctly.
gisforgary 2 years ago
The Nazi party was into eugenics above all else. They believed certain races and religions were inferior, and thus needed to be rid of. So, people should stray from the word Nazi and go towards eugenics, because there are actually a great deal of people in Obama's cabinet that have announced publicly their eugenicist views. John Holdren being the biggest, wrote a book called Eco Science which details how to reduce the world population to 500 million. He is also the head of science and technology
Retic92 2 years ago
Sorry -- you just entered into a field of somewhat expertise of mine. Holdren has written books on population theories -- that doesn't mean he heartily endorses them. Because China had the 1 child program as population control it should be discussed -- but Holdren doesn't endorse it. Read the book -- its interesting -- but not Holdren's personal views. Holdren is not pro- eugenics by any stretch of the imagination.
gisforgary 2 years ago
The book details how to go about reducing the population expert. And Holdren goes on record several times endorsing eugenics. Yet, since this is your area of expertise, you must know this by now. So, I think by all stretches of imagination, one could perceive Holdren as a Eugenicist. And I might add, that Eco Science is a huge ass book, if you read the whole thing and came out with "population theories", I think you wasted your time. Just being honest.
Retic92 2 years ago
You're so wrong.
Obama never wanted a single payer system, which is what Hillary ran on in the primary. That was a major difference between them.
Guess what though, Obama and all the leaders in our country can be defeated in elections.
Deweydecible 2 years ago
Sorry, you are the one who is wrong. On several occasions, OBama said he prefers single payer, government run healthcare. he said it as a state senator, a US senator, and as a candidate. He knows that a government funded, public option will lead to single payer.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
We already have single payer idiot it's called Medicare.
cataliades 2 years ago
liberals have very selective memories...obama is many things and has many ideas we just don't know what they are.
we do know they are expensive
PatricksTime 2 years ago
Wow your post has convinced me!
Wait you didn't type anything substantial except for DURR DAMN DIM LIBS!!!
numnunums 2 years ago
so your telling me you don't have a selective memory...
remember when obama said
he would give us 5 days to read the bills...did they read them?
on day one he wouldn't hire lobbyist...day 2 he has 3!!!
if we don't pass stimulus unemployment will exceed 8%...will soon be at 10%.
he said he wouldn't raise taxes of any kind on anyone making under 250k...imposed the largest federal cigarette tax increase in history
he was for a single payer system now nobody knows what he wants
should i continue?
PatricksTime 2 years ago
You mean that two page hand out that the republicans passed out?
It was great! Sorta like one of those:
Step 1: Do Stuff Step 2: Profit!
Utterly mindless. I'm with you on the corporate bullshit that Obama is pulling though. He's just greedy and limp wristed.
numnunums 2 years ago
you need to check your facts....why did he raise cigarette prices? to pay for healthcare for children. and also, we wont have a single payer system...if you dont want the option, dont take it. and the stimulus has created jobs in my home town..did it save everyones job? no. did it soften the blow? yes. and if you dont think its important for everyone to be able to have healthcare, thats your business.
AlmostAlwaysFabulous 2 years ago
Also, the healthcare bill has a clause that states companies CANNOT sue the gov't for price fixing... That's basically violating any antitrust law in existence... This is bull - the govt can't run any agency cost effectively and we're trusting them with a multibilliondollar market?
jjoliver22 2 years ago
This woman doesn't know what she is talking about... The 8% payroll tax she is referring to is for companies opting NOT to take the gov't option - it's a huge penalty for not sending their employees that route. Imagine if payroll constituted 50% of your operating cost and your company is lucky enough to operate at a 5% net profit in this economy you're now down to a 1% net profit (while still paying for your existing insurance....).
jjoliver22 2 years ago
this is not about health care. its about insurance money.and whether privet will do it better then government. if you like the public school works.then be fore it but it will drive out privet.except fore the rich.and congress thy will still have there golden option.our health care needs repair.but if your car gets a flat tire you don't get a new car.unless your a member of congress.
SunSin1000 2 years ago
Goldman sachs.. sounds like a marxist jew to me
FRApp44300 2 years ago
Comment removed
xretracsemajx 2 years ago
why are the youth in America Marxist little pricks?
xretracsemajx 2 years ago
Oh by the way that business we own is health care related. You make it unprofitable for me to stay in business, I'll take my money retire, head to Honolulu and you can treat your own damned self with your high school diploma. Make it unprofitable for me to be a doctor and you just see what it does to the health care system in this country.
xretracsemajx 2 years ago
I say the same thing all the time. Except I am a farmer.
skangmox 2 years ago
If young 20 somethings would put down their IPODS , Wii's, and quit binge drinking over the weekends they could take that money and buy health insurance. I run a business and I can tell you we will drop our insurance coverage like a rock and ask our employees to take the public option. Once monopolized by the governement you have no choice! anyway you slice it this is a power grab that is anti-capitalist. Sure you like Obama he let's you be lazy and keep your IPODS.
xretracsemajx 2 years ago 2
Adorable network news propaganda . . . anyone doing research into the elite business structure even at a cursory glance will see HUGE public subsidies (tax payer $) going to PRIVATE corporations aka unaccountable private tyrannies on a regular basis. Not even talking about the bailout here, just another day at the office of the suckers of satan's cock.
Period.
Average employee pays in US pays %60 in taxes through all the different taxes. Public Health AND free education is a no-brainer.
NassimHarameinVedas 2 years ago
You know, it'd be awesome if those of us, the younger adults in the US, the twenty somethings? I can't get insurance, I got laid off. The public option would help my wife get the operation to make it so she's not in pain all the fucking time. But no, thanks to the republican party, she is going to continue to suffer. And even if there is the public option, a good 4/5ths of the work force only need minimum insurance for when something comes up. The sickly pay more as it is, nothing would change.
GriffenMorivan 2 years ago
The GOP platform: Socialism for the rich at Goldman Sachs and capitalism for the poor at Kaiser Permanente.
Francebrasil 2 years ago
public or private, you can't even answer that simply anymore about sectors....the govt crooks got their hands in everything
chriscunanan 2 years ago
well said!
aarongrooves 2 years ago
The chance to sign a bigger contract and to sign endorsement deals drives them just as much as the admiration and bragging rights. Take away that potential for profit and all you are left with is self loathing government automatons going through the motions like in England. They don't care how many patients they treat in the scheme, they make the same amount regardless, that's a dangerous situation and self limiting. JV
jvforever72 2 years ago
you know what i say, set up some uni healthcare but don't compel me to pay for it. whoever wants it, they pay into it, don't take any more money from me to pay for something i don't use. if i think the gov plan is better i will go with them but don't fine me if i choose not too.
taking a profit motive out of any business endeavor, yes HC is a business, is detrimental to it's effectiveness. In the World Cup, they play to win, they profit from their hard work, skill, sacrifice, and talent....
jvforever72 2 years ago
Well, jv, the problem with voluntary plans is that they are overwhelmingly populated by people who anticipate illness - which is always the most expensive group to fund, and blows premiums up. That's why there is a compulsory component to most public plans.
As to the other - nothing is taking the profit motive out of American businesses faster than the health insurance companies.
47f0 2 years ago
CommonSenseJoe supposedly knows more about economics than even economists. No, most research does not come from the private sector, it comes from publicly funded research, and even the nature of the research is different. Industry modifies drugs to re-patent them, public funding makes the fundamental breakthroughs from DNA, antibiotics, to sequencing and iRNA. It is all public funding. CommonSenseJoe is really CommonDelusionJoe: he thinks he knows it all. All he knows is Fox News.
davidmcaba 2 years ago
Tell me then, what was the last drug marketed by the "public funded" research?
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
lol that was easy
exweez 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
The democratic party has a majority of seats in both houses,,ask yourself why?
Because a majority of the electorate voted for them based on progressive ideas including healthcare ,including a public option,this was a cornerstone of the obama campaign and was no secret,,,democrats had and have a popular mandate
It is how they represent the majority who sent them to washington
SAYESTOHEALTHCARE1 2 years ago
How can these guys sleep at night? They are selling out the entire country just to make a few more bucks for themselves. And these are the people who question others' patriotism? They obviously hate this country - The U.S. Gov. is just an opportunity for them to make more money. Shame, shame, shame.
diffidatio 2 years ago
umm, the only reason many people can afford health insurance is that their employer can give it to them at reduced rates... kick the average joe into the "exchange" and health care will cost him more and if the public option costs less, they'll be force to take it...especially if the government mandates it. I like my private insurance and I can't afford it without my employer's support.
CampHazzard 2 years ago
You appear to have a lot of ideas. All completely whacked, but ideas nonetheless.
redcloak676 2 years ago
The GOP are a bunch of liars!
Iceberg6606 2 years ago
Just more neocon lies. Apparently it's just the way they do things.
redcloak676 2 years ago
Read Page 16 of HR3200. The Federal Government bans private healthcare. Only option is government run.
zzx2847 2 years ago
Is there not one neocon that tells the truth? What's in it for you big guy?
redcloak676 2 years ago
Go fucking read it you dipshit. You do know how to READ don't you? Or does Obama do all the reading for you numbnuts?
zzx2847 2 years ago
Obviously I've read more of the bill than you have. Who's feeding you your talking or screaming points? You are not smart enough to have come up with your own opinion.
redcloak676 2 years ago
Ahaha, now you've read the bill?! Wow you've either done more than your stupid corrupt goons in congress, or have the audacity to not only lie to yourself but everyone else.
Nice try buddy. Come back when you've read a simple PARAGRAPH. And sorry there aint any pictures with captions for ya.
zzx2847 2 years ago
if you have read the bill and are able to rebut on the facts,why the insults and namecalling.i think you are full of shit
exweez 2 years ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Viva la France!!!
Pleblian 2 years ago
Actually, Rep. Schakowsky and President Obama agree with Rep. Pence here:
p-bY92mcOdk
So... was the point of this video to discredit Pence?
MooseOfReason 2 years ago
@ least he's up front and honest about being in the party that is owned by the corporations.
foley15136 2 years ago
I am a business owner ... And Mike is right on!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
One hundred % right!
Don't listen to that Soulless bottom feeder with the curly hair.
Peace
llandshark 2 years ago
What they need to do is force the healthcare industry to be open and honest about their billing practices ( $15 for an asprin), reform litigation laws, and invest in health saving reasearch and prevention methods that include health education.
jenisoutofhermind 2 years ago
Republicans ♥ Insurance Companies
RobertSeattle 2 years ago
I cannot believe that anybody in their right mind sides with Insurance Companies, it's unbelievable!!!
ver506 2 years ago
Why? You seem to side with the President who is lying through his teeth. My insurance company has never lied to me about what they would or would not cover. I am free to change companies if I want or pay less if I want less coverage.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
your little plan is shit lady please revise it
savior02 2 years ago
you don't like a choice? what do you think the word "option" means? It's just like Medicare. Senior citizens have a choice to buy into Medicare or not. Why shouldn't the rest of us not have that same choice? Isn't this country about equality and should not promote age discrimination?
checkurself 2 years ago
this medical plan the dems are pushing gives more power to the the criminal gov't .i believe in health care reform just not 1 that grants more power to the gov't over its ppl.why do u think the bill is as thick as 4 bibles??? checkurself
savior02 2 years ago
Actually, I don't think they have a choice about Medicare.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
Those who retire and don't have enough retirement savings or a pension won't have a choice but to opt into Medicare. My parents are over 55 and they use the medical ins. plan from my dad's former employer which was a union. People can opt in or not into Medicare. People don't plan ahead will no be able to afford health care ins. if there was no Medicare. Lucky for them there is Medicare. Otherwise they would be screwed.
checkurself 2 years ago
Respectfully, I believe your parents are in Medicare. Most insurance plans require that you enroll when you are eligible, but they pay everything the Medicare does not. This is what will happen with a publicly funded, government option. Insurance companies will abandon everyone the government plan, but sell supplemental plans to it.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
They have a choice to participate, not a choice to "buy in." You're in regardless, you have no choice. Whether you decide to participate is another story.
njcarlos1 2 years ago
I have no choice but to pay taxes for public schools when I don't even have kids; I rather have an educated society then a stupid one. Same goes for health care. I rather have a healthy society then a sick one. I don't see how people are so unwilling to help their fellow citizens. In the end it makes for a better society. We all pay taxes for fire dept., police, clean water, street lamps, public schools,Cal Trans to fix roads and bridges regardless if we use those services or not.
checkurself 2 years ago 4
It is not a question of helping our fellow citizens. It is a question of the government taking over all of our healthcare in order to help 5% of the population.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
I love the argument they use against public health care. That public health care will be cheaper and better then private health care because the gov is backing it so people will leave private health care and then the public health care will take over. Iam not really seeing a problem with having the cheaper and better system take over.
drunkdecoy 2 years ago
I would be a cheaper system, but not a better quality system. Have you ever heard the saying, "you get what you pay for". The only way that the government can keep costs down is price controls, salary caps, and rationing of care. I see a problem with that.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
And yet all across the world other governments are proving you wrong. Because they have both cheaper and higher quality systems. Now don't get me wrong, if you got tons of cash then look no further then the US to get the best quality of health care. But for the system as a whole for the nation that is not the case.
drunkdecoy 2 years ago
The same is true in those countries as well. There are private clinics with the best doctors and no waiting times for those who money.
Where will all the break through treatments and drugs come from? Every medical and drug company makes the majority of their profit in the US. If we impose price control like every other socialized country does, where will the money for research come from? What company will invest a billion dollars on new drug with no hope of decent return?
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
Were we not talking about health insurance not drug companies? But either way i don't think its right for Americans to pay more for the same drugs then other countries, i thought Republicans were not in favor of more taxes, but it seems that the high price of drugs is like a tax on America and the rest of the world benefits from it. Wouldn't it be more fair if the prices were even so the prices in America falls a bit and the prices in other wealthy nations goes up a bit.
drunkdecoy 2 years ago
Are we talking healthcare reform of just health insurance reform? This is the whole problem with this mythical bill. Health insurance costs more because health care costs more. Healthcare costs more because the government fails to pay for the care providers give to Medicare and Medicaid patients. It only pays 10-15 cents on the dollar. The President is planning on cutting this further to pay for his plan, whatever it is.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
I call bullshit
LeGioNoFZioN 2 years ago
I am tired of all the BS. We Need a Public Option Plan period. If they Repubs do not want to work with us then we need to go around them.
Anyone who would like more info about the public option plan should visit my profile. In the comment section you will find a link to the ez to read version of the bill sent out by congress and so much more.
Smartassawhip 2 years ago
Why not a national referendum on socialized medicine? Let the people decided if they want single payer, government run healthcare!
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
I don't make the rules. I just live by them. Why not call your representative and suggest that. I would be all for it personally because I know the majority want this. Even the Pro-lifers have gotten on board now as they feel this is the best way to provide health care to moms and babies that is affordable.
Smartassawhip 2 years ago
I doubt many prolifers would be taken with that "fantasy". The party in power now has support the murdering of over 30 million unborn children. I doubt they will do better by mothers and babies.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
The problem is that Democrats and the President are not being honest about what they REALLY want. If the public option is funded with tax payer dollars and does not have to deal with the same market forces as other insurance companies, it will eventually eliminate all private insurance. This is not debatable. It is a fact.
The Democrats desperately want and need single payer, government run healthcare to cover up the crash of Medicare and Medicaid. They are going broke soon.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
The public option is not funded with tax dollars, only revenue on premiums.
The tax-dollar myth is a Republican lie.
The public option IS dealing with the same market forces; in fact, it is introducing competition into an oligarchic monopoly.
The only way the public option eliminates private insurance is if consumers choose it because it provides better care. What is wrong with providing better care? Isn't that what this is all about? Getting better care to Americans.
davidmcaba 2 years ago
It cannot be a myth because so far the bill is a myth. Which bill are we talking about now? Version 1, 2, or 3? Is this the one with or without the public option in it?
I am all for having a public option as described by the President himself. A self-sustaining public option would be good for the market. The problem is that I don't think it will be able to survive without tax dollars or it will be too expensive for anyone to afford.
The public option has nothing to do with care however.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
You went broke under Bush. Perhaps you might have spoken up under honest George's two terms. Its a little late now, except to try and shift the blame.
charlie44444 2 years ago
We went "broke" under Bush? Do you see how much money your President is spending? How much he plans to spend? No one is shifting blame here.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
Actually money talks. He's right. But most employers will offer both, which means private insurance companies would HAVE to lower their rates. I do think many smaller businesses-which do not ordinarily carry insurance benes anyway, and Wal-Mart, which is the largest employers in the nation, would go with the public option since Wal-Mart supports it .
WinterHaven 2 years ago
Just leave things alone-employers will be dropping their health plans anyway since it will be too expensive to keep. So you all get NO plan. That's the Republican way! Hey they got their free health insurance - NOT their problem!
WinterHaven 2 years ago
awh, lying bastard
ilike2burnthing 2 years ago
awh, lying bastard
ilike2burnthing 2 years ago
awh, lying bastard
ilike2burnthing 2 years ago
Jesus H. Christ, look at that graph. 0:27
They should make this Congresstool shut up and just show those stats for a while like a test pattern.
SubmarinerAndroid 2 years ago
Pence is a consummate liar.
keithproctor 2 years ago
Sigh, I wish people traveled more.... If people could just get outside the US for once, they'd see that all these horrible consequences of Health care reform are ridiculous. But lobbyists' propaganda works. Germany has a system with both public/private insurance. It works really well.. People/doctors like it. Ditto my friends in Japan, Taiwan, France, Canada, etc. Germans have had universal health care since 1887! Maybe it's time the US joined the 19th century.
stealth63 2 years ago 2
fewer profits for private health care - what wrong with that?
It's immoral; to make profit over the pain and suffering iof others
marniespeaks 2 years ago
Pence is a crook!!!
sarsanch 2 years ago
Pence exists in an alternate universe; apparently he is unaware (or more likely just doesn't give a damn) that people are presently losing their private health coverage in droves, public option or not. Thus the dire need for reforms, first & foremost being a stringent regulation of the abusive private insurance companies which make billions in profits killing off people by denying them the services they have already paid for.
dafttool 2 years ago 4
Wow. Pence makes a good point, and the lady is completely dishonest in her response. That's tough to admit as a blue-blooded Democrat. Workers that are dropped from their employer provided insurance plans will still lose their coverage. Having choices of other plans after that doesn't change the fact that they'll have to pay for it themselves.
mikebee02 2 years ago
You simply missed the point. Pence claimed that if employers stopped providing insurance through private corporations then employees would have to go to public option. The lady was simply pointing out how fallacious that statement is.
Dude you really need to work on your critical thinking. It's something they teach in science but unfortunately the majority of the U.S. population is scientifically illiterate. Stop reading people magazine and pick up a peer reviewed scientific journal.
pokermaster54 2 years ago 3
That's only half his point, and it's valid. I'm for a public option, but the bill needs to be rewritten to close these loop holes. They need to raise that 8% payroll penalty or something to reinforce companies providing care for their workers.
p.s. Your class is showing. Ad hominem attacks weaken your argument. I guess that's something you can't learn from all those peer reviewed scientific journals you read though.
mikebee02 2 years ago
"That's only half his point, and it's valid."
No it's not valid moron. If an employer decided not to provide insurance for their employees they would still be able to choose private insurance instead of public option. So what he said was patently false.
p.s. You don't know what ad hom is. It's a common mistake made by cretins like you. Personal attack in and of itself does not constitute an ad hominem attack. It's only ad hom when you use it as a substitute for a substantive argument.
pokermaster54 2 years ago
Sorry, couldn't read that through YouTube's new asshole filter.
mikebee02 2 years ago
"Sorry, couldn't read that through YouTube's new asshole filter."
That my friend is the epitome of ad hominem. You can call me names all you want, but if you don't have a counter-argument then you're simply name calling.
pokermaster54 2 years ago
He could have mispoke regarding pushing them into the public option. Substitute, "public option" with "exchange" and his point is valid; that piont being they would lose their plan w/ their employer. She agreed, she just disagreed it would automatically push them into a public option. Why argue that it won't cause people to lose their plans if she agrees?
njcarlos1 2 years ago
"Why argue that it won't cause people to lose their plans if she agrees?"
Why create a strawman? You're putting words in my mouth.
pokermaster54 2 years ago
And just think. The poor heads of insurance companies will no longer be able to make tens of millions of dollars off businesses that cannot afford their costs. Dude you are living in an alternate universe. If companies do not have to worry about health insurance costs they may be able to hire more employees. Therefore adding more consumers and even creating more jobs. But lets feel sorry for the insurance companies instead of REAL people.
RodgersRevolution 2 years ago
now that's a valid point too
WinterHaven 2 years ago
I love people who think that can tell companies what they will or will not do.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
So are you saying that it is Ok that businesses pay to much for their health insurance plans? You sound like a insurance bought republican to me. The businesses can keep their insurance if they choose. That is why its called public OPTION!!!!
RodgersRevolution 2 years ago
You do not understand how the market works. Business will do what makes econimic sense. If the public "option" is cheaper and offers better benefits, the smart decision is to drop health insurance benefits completely.
CommonSenseJoe 2 years ago
Ironically, the graphics are showing how healthcare cost is sky rocketing under the current system.
oldtownkid 2 years ago
you mean like the way the internet made people lose compuserve and america online? people would choose what's best.
iamafractal 2 years ago
Isn't Mike Pence sort of correct on this point? If employers do decide to drop coverage for their employees and instead pay the payroll tax, as Debbie Wasserman Schultz says, then being put in the exchange may not lead to one getting insurance, as one would have to pay for it on his or her own dime and may not find that to be a viable option.
zeppelin462 2 years ago
Wheres the day in 100 seconds? :'(
MelanieLouM 2 years ago
lies, lies, lies.
lamouchemorte 2 years ago
I cant believe Pence would make a douche of himself on TV with his loony opinion. Thats so wrong, its awesome.
mephesh 2 years ago
pence looked like a lying idiot. Does the GOP think we a stupid. if you say it a hundred time it does not make it true. it just make us more angry at you
doink1422 2 years ago
What a bunch of crap! Repukes spinning lies because they are owned.
JamJells 2 years ago
Imagine the benefit if just one thing changed...allowing people to buy insurance from any state in the union. That would increase competition dramatically.
eurohim 2 years ago
You mean like car ins companies, you can buy car insurance from any company on any state but they still charge you whatever they feel like based on the state you live in? I can't really imagine that one benefit because there wouldn't really be such a benefit. Ins companies will never lower prices unless forced by real competition from an outsider who will offer lower premiums with expanded coverage and that would be a public option. Let John Lennon image and let's face reality here.
oldtownkid 2 years ago
re: eurohim
Let's say they did remove the state barrier.
Now if every separate health insurance company stayed separate, you'd have quite a bit of undercutting going on.
HOWEVER what's to stop even more conglomeration within the market?
The tragic flaw in your logic is the assumption that the "natural" most dominant state of ALL business models is low economies of scale.
When what you'd really end up having is even larger more entrenched oligopolies.
Libertarians fail to notice that flaw.
greyflcn 2 years ago
Hmm...where was the so called republican health care reform proposal the last 8 years? Now they act like they're concerned and want to reform it...right.
Powderfinger07 2 years ago
I love this Lady, she should run for President in 2016.
gallomex13 2 years ago
I agree with you, she seems to be tough, smart and disciplined. I think she's gonna play an important role in the future of the Democratic party.
oldtownkid 2 years ago
This lady sums it up nicely:
Health insurance needs to be patient driven, first and foremost, not profit driven.
The downfall of America is that greed has been turned into a virtue and anything that doesn't make someone filthy rich is apparently not worth doing.
That is a epitome of mental illness.
SabuPtolemy 2 years ago
its simple really what does the government do that is trully successful? let alone self sustaining, they cant even pay out the money for 'cash for clunkers' and you guys want them paying for your medical needs?
Sharpshooterjoe 2 years ago
What does the private sector do that's so great? Cause recessions, and deny people because of pre-existing conditions? You are a heartless bastard. I'd rather the government then the private insurance companies who fuck everyone over. And don't give me the bs about "they are lazy it's their choice". I don't give a fuck what they have done in their lives I STILL think they deserve health insurance. I wouldn't ever deny anybody that right. Asshole.
themarycity 2 years ago
let me just say a quick statement here, my family has to mail tylenol to cuba because it doesnt exist in that country, thats what happens when government takes over everything. i will agree with you on one thing the insurance companies are screwing both patients and doctors but if you think the government (who currently screws doctors even more) is any better then you sir are a fool
Sharpshooterjoe 2 years ago
Ah man you're still a fucking dumbass!! Wow what a surprise! :D
themarycity 2 years ago
the givernment run healthcare in america will be just another private insurance, this time th insurance company is the government.
sharinganclan213 2 years ago
Okay let's just be fucking idiots! America looks so god damn dumb and evil because of this. This is sick, just so fucking sick and I'm sooo tired of these heartless bastards!
cataliades 2 years ago
None of this endless jabbering makes one iota of difference. The corporations *own* both the Dems and the Repubs and will ultimately be the deciders of this "great debate".
And I already know what their decision will be. The corporations will continue to make even more obscene profits until we, the common folk, decide to say enough or the US is brought to it`s knees, whichever comes first.
Painkill3r4 2 years ago
He knows it's not true,he just does'nt care.
bonzaidave2 2 years ago
lol so if we give everybody insurance then people are going to lose their insurance? lmao. how idiotic can you be?
Debbie Wasserman Schultz is great.
insurance companies will only go out of business if they can meet the shift in the demand curve. I thought conservatives understood that competition is good for making sure people get higher quality goods at more competitive and affordable prices.
Its called economics. Believe it or not it isn't a political ideology.
daderone 2 years ago
wow. this actually was a good back'n forth.
jasonsadventure 2 years ago
It's a government takeover in my country and I wouldn't have it any other way. :p I don't trust those health care profiteers at all.
Chestmuscles 2 years ago
Yeah it's like 'no shit', but apparently America is so fucking dumb. I can't take it anymore.
cataliades 2 years ago
Oh my! An intelligent, well-spoken proponent of the public option brings the smack-down. First I've ever seen of it! Land's sakes!
therealcharismatron 2 years ago
On behalf of at least one Canadian(me) please accept my apologies for boots.
Our system has its drawbacks, but the one fundamental benefit is that I know my healthcare will never be denied. That means I can be honest with my doctor and not worry if I have coverage.
I can build a life without the fear that it will be taken away due to a boardroom decision when I'm most vulnerable.
In Canada, if you're sick you get healthcare.
End of story.
wmg111 2 years ago 2
You get healthcare for now 20 years from now I'm not so sure.
Already the government can't keep up, we will end up with no option. Also why aren't Canadians rewarded for being healthy? Everybody's covered in Canada, drunks, drug addicts, obese...no one is denied service.
boots920 2 years ago
Healthcare is something that civilized societies provide for their citizens.
Addiction is a healthcare issue.
Human frailty is a healthcare issue.
Healthy Canadians are rewarded for being healthy, they aren't sick.
One would have thought being sick was punishment enough, but you'd like to throw in a little retribution as well.
Do unto others as you would have them do unto you.
wmg111 2 years ago
Addiction in the states is treated like a crime, that's a fact.
You think the Canadian taxpayers are getting a good value out of "free flu shots". How much harm are they doing ?
Nothing wrong with providing healthcare but there's plenty wrong with government run healthcare.
Google BC and Alberta heathcare , to balance the books they're cutting back on services.
boots920 2 years ago
To be honest, my only beef with our system is that it's provincially administered. Instead of being federally funded, I think it should be a federal program.
Every citizen should be protected by universal healthcare regardless of where they live and what their circumstances are.
Anything less is a form of anarchy where the strong victimize the weak.
I like to think we're evolving out of that mindset.
wmg111 2 years ago
Its both the Federal Government transfers funds to the provinces based on population, the provincial government charges fees to make up the short fall.
What happens when the government can't cover it, they cut back services and raise the fees.
You think people that smoke and are drug addicts should be covered. Like wishful thinking the system can take care of idiots. We'll be evolving all right back to the dark ages.
Look at the Olympics , its over budget by billions.
boots920 2 years ago
Don't get me started on the olympics. I'm a bit ambivalent about the whole concept.
And it has nothing to do with the ability of a government to administer healthcare.
Universal healthcare is an investment. As with any investment you have short term liabilities.
The long term gain is a healthy, productive citizenry.
Isn't that the ultimate goal?
wmg111 2 years ago
The long term gain is a healthy, productive citizenry.
Isn't that the ultimate goal?
Flu shots aren't working towards that goal, either is fast food or a majority of prescription drugs.
I use the Olympics as how incompetent government is, if they can't run the simple things efficiently , the more complex things like healthcare you're just fooling yourself that government will preserve the service. It will end in a blink of an eye leaving the taxpayer as a victim.
boots920 2 years ago
I shed no tears for the insurance industry, if they played fair and treated consumers right they wouldnt be in this position. Screw them, it's about the patients not their bottom line.
clnmike 2 years ago 2
so when the public option is available companies will drop their employees. what is stopping them from doing that now. that would say alot about the company that drops their employees not about the public option.
1samothrace77 2 years ago
What do Repubs have again American business? Why do they want them to fail? I can't understand it because they act like they are the party of business.
burntonion05 2 years ago
its not a gov takeover!!!
lhooq21 2 years ago
So when my employer drops my HMO and not provide healthcare I could go to the public plan to buy my own plan on the free market. Right now my employer pays about half of the cost for the plan, let's say they pay $200/month and I pay $200/month. So now when I am on the free market, how do I get the remaining $200 that my employer would of paid?
cagedtigersteve 2 years ago
The exchange would include a pool of private insurance plans and a public option, all with better coverage than what we have today (bec