My first point to refute this video is this: Look up the youtube video by "mikebatie" called "Mormons - Are all of Brigham Young's words scripture?". Second, go to fairmormon . org and look up the "adam god theory" and "Moon and sun are inhabited". A prophet can have opinion, and unless what he says he claims is revelation, is approved unanimously by the quorum of the 12 apostles, and has a sustaining vote of the members of the church, it is not official doctrine of the church but only opinion.
A prophet can be incorrect in his opinions, only Christ was perfect. The idea a prophet can't speculate and form his own opinion(wrong or right) is merely an excuse anti-mormons formulate to prove them false prophets.
The men in the moon... This is taken way out of context. BY was making a point that people will away mock the words of the prophet no matter what they say. Like if men lived on the moon. They will mock him because the do not understand the Word of God. Thanks for showing BY was correct... read more then what you youth pastor has showed you and taught you about it.
@Sk8er408 its not mocking or taking out of context when BY who claimed to be prophet says that people are on the moon. Many of Smith's and Youngs claims could not be verified at that time becasue back then no one could disprove him. Now with space travel and appollo missions we know that there are no people living on the moon. BY was wrong. Just as JS was wrong with his false prophecies.
David Whitmer wrote:Joseph Smith would put the seer stone into a hat, and put his face in the hat, drawing it closely around his face to exclude the light; and in the darkness the spiritual light would shine. A piece of something resembling parchment would appear, and on that appeared the writing. One character at a time would appear, and under it was the interpretation in English. WHY HAVE GOLDEN PLATES WHEN YOU HAVE A HAT ?
Ladies and Gentlemen, we have here the classi cult mind control drone. In the case of LDS this "iamtherealthing" we have wha we call in counter cult ministry a "Jack Mormon". Jack Mormons will defend LDS teachings while drinking coffe & booze. The may smoke too. Notice that he or she, that instead of adressing the topic of B. Young's Adam G-d doctrine he attacks historic Christianity.This is "normal" in cults, please read Steve Hassans book "Combating Cult Mind Control".
Ok the Trinity good subject....second only to the deity of Christ in attacks by cultist who either misunderstand what Christians believe about it or down right lie. The doctrine in in the OT and NT and can be shown,just because the word "Trinity" is not there is a strawman arguement..is the word "Theocratic Organization" in the Bible JW's? is the word Ward,Stake,in the Bible LDS? you have to let the Bible speak for itself AND what is reveals. Father,Son & Holy Spirit are creators etc...lots more
I am not understanding what you are trying to get at. Slow down and THINK out what you are trying to say before putting it down in print. Between your bad grammar and poor sentence structure and typos I am trying to determine what the heck you are trying to get at. Are you upset because I do what most academics do - that is CITE sources like "The Encyclopedia Americana" and "The New Encyclopedia Britannica"? What do you expect? I have a DEGREE in Theology - silly little man.,
@imtherealthing Oh realy a degree in Theology no less. The Encylopedia Britiannica wow then it must be true. I do have a feeling that you may may misquoted the source or are just looking for ANY support,any port in the storm you know just like you JW bedfellows. Degree? well my friend has a a REAL degree from Fuller Theological Seminary where they teach Greek,Hebrew,Church History and his Phd from Princeton where he studied under Bruce Meztger and my bu chuckles at cultist like u
Silly bad grammar and yet you can't give a solid argument but the again I don't need to be much of a scholar to answer the likes of you. So stay on the subject will you? Why are you so hung up that there is no Biblcal pasage that says the Father, Son and Holy Spirit are the ONE G-d? why do you need such a passage?.What would that prove? You claim to have a "degree in theology" and you can't exeget biblical passages? What textbooks did you use for your Hermeneutics class? Greek Grammar books? ?
Here is a scholarly proof of your corrupted, man-made Trinity. The Encyclopedia Americana: "Christianity derived from Judaism and Judaism was strictly Unitarian [believing that God is one person]. The road which led from Jerusalem to Nicaea was scarcely a straight one. Fourth century Trinitarianism did not reflect accurately early Christian teaching regarding the nature of God; it was, on the contrary, a deviation from this teaching." -- (1956), Vol. XXVII, p. 294L.
The New Encyclopedia Britannica: "Neither the word Trinity, nor the explicit doctrine as such, appears in the New Testament, nor did Jesus and his followers intend to contradict the Shema in the Old Testament: (Deut. 6:4). . . The doctrine developed gradually over several centuries and through many controversies . . . By the end of the 4th century . . . the doctrine of the Trinity took substantially the form it has maintained ever since." -- Micropædia, Vol. X, p. 126. (1976)
@imtherealthing ..and the Anti-Nicene fathers, the Apostolic fathers,the Trinity, even in it's most fundamental form is there and that is fact.,nice try. But you should have know this in your Church History classes right? But Since you quote the ecyclopedia what do they define as Polytheism? is it inline with Bruce R. McConkie where he said in Mormon Dcotrine that LDS are not polytheist because they only worship one god? The Trinity doctrine is solid and despite attacks by cultist.
You don't make sense. You obviously lack an education and cannot even put together a sentence without typos and bad grammar let alone put forth a decent argument. Seriously give up already - your intelligence is showing...or should I say your LACK of intelligence. Are you trying to tell me that I should know the doctrine of the trinity better having taken univeristy classes on it? Is that what you are trying to communicate? I wrote a univeristy paper on it.
RE :USING EXTRA-SCRIPTURAL SOURCES IN LDS THEOLOGY
LDS theology is only based on the following:
The Bible
The Book of Mormon
The D&C
The PofGP
And General Conferance talks that eventually get sustained as revelation to be binding on the saints (i.e. The Proclamation to the World)
These are called the STANDARD WORKS - and if it doesn't come from any of these..then it is just speculation and "theory" - not doctrine nor binding on the saints.
@imtherealthing What does that have to do with how old you are? I'd like you to read some referneces from your standard works. D&C 88 (The TRUE nature of God, and Time doesn't exist!- which means that you are all at once here and there, then & now... inseperable from God because you are both still with Him, and have already returned!) D&C111 (JS prophesied that he would be the sovereign ruler of Salem Mass., Never happened! After some guy told him where he could steal some gold
@imtherealthing and silver out of a basement in a house, he wrote this "revelation" about God giving him an abundance of Gold and silver there!!! Never happened. The "guy" got there and with the place having been built up some since he'd been there, couldn't recall where the house was!!! FALSE GOLD DIGGING PROPHECY!!! STILL in your STANDARD WORKS! This IS the explanation for this section in an older Gospel Doctrine Lesson manual. Newer ones give less info.Moses 5:29-31,
@imtherealthing Cain's oath with Satan, where he swore by his throat... If you went through the Temple prior to 1990... Where have you heard an oath like that?
You seriously have some REAL mental issues...go seek help. Nothing you just said is true or accurate or represents LDS theology or what consititutes "revelation" binding on the saints - seriously - go seek help for your mental problems.
YOUR QUOTE:"@imtherealthing You, are being dishonest not recognizing that things in there ONCE WERE part of the Temple endowment!!! You can't just "disown" 26 volumes of the teachings of the early prophets, because it makes you uncomfortable now, or fail to realize that BY disowning them you discredit the church you are defending & bring it to the ground!"
MY REPLY: No..a "journal" was meant to be BY's own private thoughts..it later got turned into what it is today..silly
@imtherealthing I don't make sense? lol and yet you cannnot counter my statments by logic,truth,history least of all Biblical and yet I I can not only respond to you but destroy your strawman arguements.
Suggested reading Bible first all truth filters through it. So let's see The Tanners who have been a thorn in the LDS church since the 60's. D. Michael Quinn's book "Early Mormonsism and The Magic World View" gives you the occult ties of the LDS. Of course Dr. walter Martin.... Oh yes their will be cahracter assasination by these LDS kids online here but they can be dismissed easly with facts about the LDS church so they don't matter anyway. Cheers.
Ity is clear that Brigham Young was false prophet as was Joseph Smith and yet they conveyed the succesion of prophets of the church all the way to Thomas Monson so in the BIBLICAL standard Joe through Monson are false prophets and have no authority to preach the word of G-d.
I like how you don't respond to my comments directly to make it look like you made good points and I didn't respond - coward. Again you have FAILED to make any sort of good objection - but rather just spout off your own opinions with nothing to back it as though anyone should take your "opinion" seriously. i.e. YOUR QUOTE: "Ity is clear that Brigham Young was false prophet as was Joseph Smith" typos included ;)
Really? that's just your own words with NO FACTS.
Why haven't you responded to my objections on your false nicene 3-headed god? Hmmm..I guess it is easier for your kind to "cut and paste" worn out anti-mormon objections because you are incapable of honest intellectual debate. Must be hard to be stupid - the cure is an education - not "google".
LOL..."DR" Walter Martin?...lol..I guess you haven't heard that the old "dr"'s credentials are FAKE...lol...and still can not be substantiated. Even the CRI distanced itself from him for that reason...lol..oh my..my side hurts. All of the "dr"'s so-called objections have been debunked ...waaaayy back in the 80's..shows me the level of intelligence you possess...lol..oh my...I just love how your kind try so hard to sound smart and fail.
No matter how much you disagree with LDS theology we have the right to claim that those sources are legit whether you like it or not. You have no authority to claim any right to tell us what our theology is. So when you quote stuff from the Journal of Discourses - you are wrong - because that is not part of LDS theology. To do so and know that is to be dishonest - but that is what you excel at isn't it? For you are a lover of darkness rather than light like your father satan.
@imtherealthing You, are being dishonest not recognizing that things in there ONCE WERE part of the Temple endowment!!! You can't just "disown" 26 volumes of the teachings of the early prophets, because it makes you uncomfortable now, or fail to realize that BY disowning them you discredit the church you are defending & bring it to the ground!
You do NOT understand LDS theology..that is very obvious. The Journal of Discourses by B.Y. or any other prophet is NOT revelation binding on the saints. And NO "your interpretation" of the Godhead is WRONG from the D&C - that is NOT LDS theology - PERIOD. So I do not know what break off you belong to of the TRUE church if it is indeed a break off sect of the LDS faith that accounts for your twisted "interpretation" of scripture given by TRUE prophets - not your false ones.
@imtherealthing D&C 88:6- "He that ascended up on high, as also he descended below all things, in that he comprehended all things, that he might be in all and through all things, the light of truth. 7- "Which truth shineth. This is the light of Christ. As also HE IS IN THE SUN, and the light of the sun, and the power thereof by which it was made. 8- As also HE IS IN THE MOON, and is the light of the moon, and the power thereof by which it was made;.......
Listen mental midget...that scripture is using metaphor. God's light - his power - is everywhere. AS interpreted by PROPHETS not a mental case like you - puts this in correct context.
met·a·phor /ˈmɛtəˌfɔr, -fər/ Show Spelled[met-uh-fawr, -fer] Show IPA
noun
1. a figure of speech in which a term or phrase is applied to something to which it is not literally applicable in order to suggest a resemblance, as in “A mighty fortress is our God.”
@imtherealthing The Tanners who exposed your church time and time again so much so that your church "security",Bill Hickman types tried in vain to discredit them only to show how much of a sick and racist cult you are. You go around knocking on doors claiming to be the "Restored Church" proclaiming it all with lessons etc and then you run into a Bible believeing Christian and you "have to go?" lol that is Luke 16 hitting your missionaries.And that is that what you guys are about?..cowards.
@imtherealthing Right...tell us the name of the mental patient who gave you a degree. I humored you and you took the bait. You are so predictable. Like the Jack Mormon you are, not addressing the video but attacking a believer that knows his Bible and Chuch History and the cults. You fail to answer the questions, you make idiotic and untrue statments i.e the Council of Nicea established the Trinity Problem, the Council had NOTHING to do with the Trinity and yet you droned on.Typical cultist.
@imtherealthing BOM and Blacks...so you comfortable with this? 2 Nephi 5:21,30:6.... Jacob 3:5,8-9...Alma 3:6.3Nephi 2:14-16, 19:25-30.....and my fav..Mormon 5:15. So if you "like " black folk, why are you LDS?
LOL..the more you comment here the more you give credence to my saying you are a "moron". Thanks for supporting my comments. I have yet to see your replies to my objections - instead you just regurgitate OLD anti-mormon objections and hide behind your "googled" anti-mormon sources. Do you really believe that people can't see you for the moron you are? Seriously..go get an education. It hurts me to see so many typos and bad grammar. I'm embarrassed for you.....seriously
@imtherealthing Right....and you have yet to tell me the name of the mental patient who gave you a degree.
What school would hand out such a degree? the degree that teaches you inaccurate information that can be easily proven wrong by looking at the record? What school kid? This is the example of LDS higher leanring? Well my temple garment with Masonic talisman sybols on it, are wither a liar(imagine a brianwahsed cultist ready for the Kool Aid) or a fool for paying for such a "degree".
@imtherealthing There is a cure for a "direct question" too...it's called a "direct answer" now go back and drink the Kool Aid Comrade Monson has for you my dear Jack Mormon child...so where did you get "degree" from again? .......thought so. You talk about me being ignorant etc... and yet you can't answer simple nad direct questions and I know more about your religion than you do. Insidious is'nt it?
@imtherealthing You had several opportunities to refute what I wrote and you have shown to be a petulant brat wallowing in a sea of retarded adolescence. You are also a liar and deceiver. When and only when you decide to grow up, then address the questions kid. You can say you know more about religion but you have yet to show it. The fact you claimed the Council of Nicea established the Trinity shows you know nothing of Church History. You got your "facts" by some idiot FAIRLDS.ORG,FARMS types.
@imtherealthing Ok I know who you are, I tangled with your fanatical Jack Mormon self about two years ago..your "The Rommulator" .or some silly thing & you are with those other two LDS nut jobs. "The Backyard Archeologist"( this guy needs some psycological intervention a.s.a.p.) and "The Mormonanswerman"(A liar and coward) wow what company you keep...so you never answered my question fro 2 years ago sport....where in Jewish writns is the phrase "Land of Jerusalem"? This Jew would like to know.
First...do you even know what a "Jack Mormon" is?...apparently not because you use the word incorrectly (due to your lack of education no doubt). Second, what is "writins"? Do you mean "writings"? Third, you need anger managment. Fourth, just answer the questions posed to you and stop running from them and say that "I" need to answer your pathetic and illogical questions that have been debunked 30 years ago that you copy and paste from anti-mormon sites. Silly boy.
@imtherealthing You are a Jack Mormon, you drink coffe,smoke ."Writins" spelling error you on the other hand cannot bring not ne logical argument and at least I did not write a backward E and claimed to be part of the Book of Abraham...Ok Rommulator Rambutt or whatever your name is...None of your idiotic "apologist" debunked nothing you liar, fanatical Kool Aid drinking drone.Silly boy? ask your mom. So my temple garment friend, what about the questions I posed to you? answer them coward.
@imtherealthing Hmm still no answers to direct questions...your mommy know your online? Typical cultist ,ranting testimony,irrational,can't keep text in context,does as he is told by his cult leader. Sad kid, one day you gotta answer why you did not investigate the lies you have been told by your church.Pathetic. You are also a liar and a fraud, you have no formal education of any kind just some droned in "testimony party" at your local ward. Take cake Rommulator,Purcalator, your called.
@imtherealthing You follow these con men and yet I am the mental patient.... a huh right.So how are the Quakers doing on the moon Rommy?...And what school did your degree in again? BYU? figures. You keep harping on my education and yet what I ever I know it's head and shoulders above what you know including the real history of your "church". So it's obvious that even a lay Christian knows his Bible better than a Phd for BYU or what other kookie schools teaches you kids... pathetic..how sad
@imtherealthing So many Mormons are in apostasy to Mormonism. The FLDS seem the be the only ones carrying the flag of "The New and Everlasting Restoration". The Mormon "restoration" includes Polygamy (Whimped out) Polytheism (Still strong) Blood atonement (Getting weakly) complete obedience to a rigid theocratic despotism (Pretty strong) and Adam=God Doctrine (Whimped out and running in denial). If Mormonism is the restoration shouldn't good MoJoes adhere to all of it?
@imtherealthing And yet the LDS religion was founded by someone with only a 3rd grade education... Quit being so prideful and boasting over your "much learning"... BOTH of you! You're acting like children...Discuss the issue quiot swapping silly insults!
How's your racism and swearing "christian"? Yes..we see your "character" quite clearly. Remember I sent you copies of comments you made on other posts of your foul language and your racists comments. Your kind has nothing to offer the TRUE CHRISTIANS and followers of Christ - we see your dark works easily...only the simpleminded and weak of character fall for your lies.
@imtherealthing Racist? lol not even close...so you one of those LDS trolls trying character assassination like the Scientologist do with Operation Freak Out? RAcist lets see YOUR Churh has quite a history of You still preach it in the BOM, why? you got some nerve kid.Dark works? you who go into a Temple and swear Masonic blood oaths? You whose Temples have no crosses but lots of pentagrams,Ba"al sunstones,all seeing eye,the beehive? htose are occultic...hypocrite.
Well since I cannot get an answer from an LDS coward who trolls this site my questions will be directed to more reasonable LDS folks so I wil be posting.I want an honest exchange and not some Kool Aid Drinking mental patient.Can any LDS just answer some simple questions?
Well First lets start with the Bible both Testaments. ONE G-d not many gods and whether you worship them or not is not the issue nor the definition of a polytheist se any LEGIT dictionary not some delusions of Bruce R. McConkie. Deut 4:35,6:4,32:39 2Samuel 7:22,Pslams 86:10,Isaiah chpts 43-46 and many more NT Mark 12:32. 1 Cor 8:4,6. Gal 4:8 etc.. So the LDS can believe in many gos and be polytheist all they want but there is NO Biblical support for it....none. If there is please show me.
Fact Brigham BY believed in Adam god JOD vol1 pp50--51 Adam "is the only god whom we have to do" this was NOT his only quote yeas after he continued never printed nor took back his statements so please with the "he was misquoted" JOD vol13 p.95 All his sermons are as good as scripture,..Adam God again.."How much unbelief exists in the mins od the Latter Day Saints Deseret News Weekly June 18th 1873 ..19 years after the first time he taught it....19 years!!!! so he was that sloppy?
@imtherealthing Never changed??? LDS Doctrine in BY's Day (and included in the endowment) was that Adam, was God, and the physical father of Jesus with Mary, and that Eloheim was Adam's Father... Jesus' Grand daddy... Today LDS view JC as an "Older brother". Which is NOT how other Christians view him.
THREE seperate GODS worthy of worship, yet we pray to the FATHER GOD in the NAME of JESUS CHRIST and receive confirmation by the Holy Ghost.
TITLES like : Eternal Father or LORD can be applied to both the FATHER GOD and JESUS, Elohim also ...these are "TITLES" in MOST cases we LDS know that Lord is Jehovah/Jesus as Elohim is the Father
@imtherealthing Which is WHY they don't consider LDS Christians... You do not both believe in the SAME Christ! You are talking apples and oranges...And JS claimed to have formerly been the HG, as it being Spirit, is a temporary calling, since ALL must come to earth to get a body...
It was practiced by Abraham, Issac and Jacob AND OTHER PROPHETS for example..and we see that they are in Heaven with God:
Luke 13: 28
There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see ABRAHAM, AND ISAAC, AND JACOB, and "ALL the PROPHETS", IN THE KINGDOM OF GOD, and you yourselves thrust out.
The deity of Jesus Christ was decided upon by a vote . A few hundred church leaders gathered at Nicea in 325 AD. to vote on the matter. (the vote was loaded, because most of the opposing bishops were either KILLED or EXHILED or excluded!) Representation for the TRUTH about the Godhead was allowed by only a small fraction of those TRUE Christians...we lost the TRUTH then to the pagan trinity of man.
2 Tim. 4: 3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
RE :USING EXTRA-SCRIPTURAL SOURCES IN LDS THEOLOGY
LDS theology is only based on the following:
The Bible
The Book of Mormon
The D&C
The PofGP
And General Conferance talks that eventually get sustained as revelation to be binding on the saints (i.e. The Proclamation to the World)
These are called the STANDARD WORKS - and if it doesn't come from any of these..then it is just speculation and "theory" - not doctrine nor binding on the saints.
MY REPLY: Unless it is in the cannon of scripture as per below - it is just speculation. Gee I wonder what it would have been like if the prophets and apostles of the OT and NT had the internet or media like today to mis-represent thier words and how they would have faired. Many of the people of the time didn't even know how to read or write and therefore newspapers were not available to TWIST thier words.
Also, in Christ's day the saints were persecuted and Christ was thought of as being a "magician"etc....apostles were called drunkards, etc..same arguments..because the same spirit that possessed the enemies of Christ then is in people like you today.
Acts 28: 22
But we desire to hear of thee what thou thinkest: for as concerning this SECT [cult], we know that every where it is spoken against.
In LDS theology we say that The Father, Son and Holy Ghost are ONE in PURPOSE not BEING...this GODHEAD is what we LDS say constitutes "ONE GOD" - a unity of GODS who are ALL FULLY GOD working as ONE unit in a GODHEAD.
“Ye STIFFNECKED and uncircumcised IN HEART and EARS, YE DO ALWAYS RESIST the HOLY GHOST: as your fathers did, SO DO YE.
Which of the PROPHETS have not your fathers PERSECUTED and they have slain them which shewed before of the coming of the Just One; of whom ye have been now the betrayers and murderers:
Who have RECIEVED the law BY THE DISPOSITION OF ANGELS, and have NOT KEPT IT”.
I noticed your silence on my finding all those comments you made elsewhere where you use foul language and the racism that you expressed...funny how one always knows just the kind of people you so-called "christians" are who attack the LORD's church. Like your father lucifer...you love darkness more than light and will always persecute the Lord's TRUTH.
@imtherealthing Oh stop that ok grow up already. have a life and if you only knew waht i have been up to, needles to say there is one LDS who's head is spiinin after I shared some of your churches history.I The Lords church? well let's see if the LDS church is shall we? Anybody can claim that just like the JW's,Moonies etc...it don't mean squat. Racist? like your church has been and still is? please.so you wanna get back on the subject or you gonna eveda, any port in the storm?
Are you serious?..you can barely spell your words correctly and put together a cohesive sentence and you want "me" to answer your cut and paste objections? Nice try pal...try answering my questions I put to you or are you afraid of the answers? AGAIN, your "form" of "christinaity" does not appeal to me. Your example of foul language and racism as I found in your comments elsewhere shows me your form of relgion has nothing to offer me...nor does your 3-headed nicene god.
@imtherealthing Cut and paste questions? No they are direct questions my cultish friend and you cannot answer them which speaks for it self. You are a bigoted fantical religionst. The fact is that the Warren Jeffs of the world are the real LDS and you are a watered down revisionist. You cannot defend your faith so you choose to live in the "club" mentality as most LDS deluted phonies do.We are done here.You are Stan Fileds,the Browns & Elder Michael Griffith all rolled into one. Faceless fanatic
Now stop EVADING my questions and "man-up" or shut up as the expression goes. Otherwise you're just "another" ignorant pathetic hateful anti-mormon who like the rest of your kind lack an education and has nothing better to do with his time.
YOUR QUOTE: "@Gideon6640man you wrote about other stuff and eveaded this direct question...due noted.
Gideon6640man 16 hours ago"
MY REPLY: LOL...you said it perfectly...to yourself excpet with all the bad grammar and spelling...lol
Did you mean "duly" instead "due" and did you mean "evaded" rather than "eveaded"...get yourself an education...and clean up your language I have seen you use on other posts & deal with your OWN RACISM as I copied and printed evidence to you.
@imtherealthing Ok let;s start with the Bible..Nowhere do we find the G-d of Abraham ,Itzak,Yacob as an exalted man, nor exsitence in other true gods only so called "gods". Nor it teaches that the Aaronic Priesthood can be held by any male EXCEPT from the tribe of Levi so strict even Yeshua can't hold.The Melchisedek Priesthhod only has ONE priest and that is Yeshua, period. Meschia will come form the tribe of Judah and be born in Behtlehem. No baptism for the dead.Is your church Biblical?
The New Encyclopedia Britannica: "Neither the word Trinity, nor the explicit doctrine as such, appears in the New Testament, nor did Jesus and his followers intend to contradict the Shema in the Old Testament: (Deut. 6:4). . . The doctrine developed gradually over several centuries and through many controversies . . . By the end of the 4th century . . . the doctrine of the Trinity took substantially the form it has maintained ever since." -- Micropædia, Vol. X, p. 126. (1976)
@imtherealthing Where is this coming from? I haven't been speaking about any "Trinity" But read D&C88 "God is IN and THROUGH and OF ALL things!!!" We are ALL ONE;)
The deity of Jesus Christ was decided upon by a vote . A few hundred church leaders gathered at Nicea in 325 AD. to vote on the matter. (the vote was loaded, because most of the opposing bishops were either KILLED or EXHILED or excluded!) Representation for the TRUTH about the Godhead was allowed by only a small fraction of those TRUE Christians...we lost the TRUTH then to the pagan trinity of man.
@imtherealthing Um that is a blatant lie. The Council of Nicea in 325AD had to do with the realtion of the Father and Son i.e equal in nature,eternal. Also in the dicussion on Cannon Law and Easter but the Christological question was the main issue. Arius held like JW's(cult) that the son was inferior to the Father and Athanasius held the they are equal in nature. Homousius vs. Homoiusius and the Athanatian arguement won out,rightfully too. You do not know what you are talking about my friend
A "blantant lie"? Oh really? I have a BA in Relgious Studies my focus within that degree being early christianity 1st-3rd century. Tell me again what is a lie here? Are you telling me that what I said is not verifiable in history? Tell me again and let's demonstrate here to everyone just how ignorant you really are...so I ask you agin..is this a lie?
@imtherealthing Because any school that teaches that the Nicea Council dealt with the Trinity is a school of idiots. BA in BS is what you got. If you want to talk about degrees a good friend of mine teachesEarly Church History Unitiversity and was a conrtibutor to the Word Commentaries and he would laugh even more at your clowinish rants Yes you LIE the Council of Nicea was NOT about the Trinity. Who's textbooks you use? LDS "Religious" studies in their theology is joke as any LEGIT scholar.
Ignoramus...RE: "Trinity" and the council of Nicea
Are you are telling me that the trinity was not part of what the council of Nicea was about ...is this correct? It's obvious you like to play "armchair academics" (i.e. google) ...lo..oh my thanks for the laugh..I come across simpletons like you all the time...lol
Here is a scholarly proof of your corrupted, man-made Trinity. The Encyclopedia Americana: "Christianity derived from Judaism and Judaism was strictly Unitarian [believing that God is one person]. The road which led from Jerusalem to Nicaea was scarcely a straight one. Fourth century Trinitarianism did not reflect accurately early Christian teaching regarding the nature of God; it was, on the contrary, a deviation from this teaching." -- (1956), Vol. XXVII, p. 294L.
The New Encyclopedia Britannica: "Neither the word Trinity, nor the explicit doctrine as such, appears in the New Testament, nor did Jesus and his followers intend to contradict the Shema in the Old Testament: (Deut. 6:4). . . The doctrine developed gradually over several centuries and through many controversies . . . By the end of the 4th century . . . the doctrine of the Trinity took substantially the form it has maintained ever since." -- Micropædia, Vol. X, p. 126. (1976)
Now Einstein tell me..if the "The New Encyclopedia Britannica" can say that - "By the end of the 4th century . . . the doctrine of the Trinity took substantially the form it has maintained ever since." then they MUST be idiots too right? Since what took place in the 4th century? And, what "controverisies" (councils) are they speaking of Sherlock? got your "quotes"...now provide "yours"...big mouth :)
Why are you afraid to answer questions about your 3-headed god..tell me..why does one not find the words "essence" or "substance" in the bible when you speak of the GODHEAD being ONE GOD...those words are NOT found in the bible in ANY of the original languages..it is EXTRA-BIBLICAL..that means outside of the bible.
We learn that ONLY the Father knows of end of the world not the angels or even JESUS knows this according to the bible...so if they share the same MIND - which "is" trinatarian theology..then how can this be?
Ever think that your Hellenized god could be just that..a god made up by wicked men to destroy people's faith in the TRUE GOD..as we learn..it is LIFE ETERNAL to know who GOD "&" Jesus Christ is..God is not supposed to be a mystery like you trinitarians teach..
@imtherealthing I dont have a Hellenized Lord they were polytheist like the LDS. My ancestors received the Torah and since then we have proclaimed ONE and ONLY ONE G-d. Shema Y'srael Adonai ELohenu Adonia Echod(Deut 6:4. Isaiah 43:10 & 11, 44:6 & 8,45: 5,6,18,22,46:9,48:11,12...) notice a pattern here? so tell me how you justify using the Bible that there are many gods? the Greeks,Romans,Babylonians etc polytheist.As a Messianic Jew have been taught only one G-d and then became a man Yeshua.
The Jews were first polytheistic then they shifted to henotheism then later into monotheism in the context of thier Babylonian captivity. In this CONTEXT it was the practice of the time in Babylon to have a community altar to put all the IDOLS which were "FORMED" (of wood/silver/gold) on this altar..Jehovah's idol also was put on this altar. Jehovah said that this should not be the case to put "BEFORE" HIM these FALSE gods.
The Shema which is what Deut 6:4 is refering to would not recognize your trinity..as a matter of fact that is why the Jews and Muslims refer to the trinity as "polytheism"..no matter how you SPIN it..the trinity still says they are "three seperate GODS" but are connected by this non-biblical "essence" or "substance" thus making them really ONE GOD...sorry..but the Shema does not RECOGNIZE your 3-headed god.
TITLES like : Eternal Father or LORD can be applied to both the FATHER GOD and JESUS, Elohim also ...these are "TITLES" in MOST cases we LDS know that Lord is Jehovah/Jesus as Elohim is the Father
@imtherealthing The "Eloheim" in Hebrew meant Gods. It was NOT the name of ONE God. It was a plurality of Gods. The Church of Christ sees this as being Father and Mother Gods. Which could be a logical conclusion. But what if it was more than 2? According to LDS teachings Eloheim was originally the "GrandFather" since Adam was Our God, and the Father of Jesus (with Mary) in the flesh. The original doctrine taught by BY and included in the endowment, was Eloheim-Adam-Jesus
Why is it that false christianity needs analogies like an egg, a triangle, or water in its three phases to EXPLAIN thier 3-headed god?..can you point to just ONE place in the Bible where ANY of the prophets or apostles use these very analogies or ANY analogies for that matter to explain the GODHEAD?..well?
“And this is ‘LIFE ETERNAL’, that THEY might KNOW THEE the ONLY TRUE GOD, “and” Jesus Christ, whom THOU HAST SENT.”
Notice the “and”…who sent Jesus?...did Jesus send himself? Silly Trinitarians. The Godhead is NOT a “mystery” like you Trinitarians teach..but it is LIFE ETERNAL to know them both as they are distinct separate beings here in this verse.
@imtherealthing Listen kid, when you can behave like an adult I will be more than glad to answer ANY questions you may have, we in the Chrsitian Apologetics are not afraid to confront the issues head on and now resort to insults like you have exibited. I don't know who you are realy but you are behaving like Stan Fields, The Browns and Michael D. Quinn with your clandestine attacks. If you can agree with me on those terms.ie to be civil then you are on if not good day to you.
@imtherealthing ro are you like "Elder Michael Griffith" the anonymous LDS apologist that rants and insults people to get his point across? Are you able to have a cohesive discussion?
@SuperNoobTroll No, he is not. The B of M is a book about ancient Jews who fled Israel and sailed to America 600 years before Christ. It is a history of their governments and wars. Towards the end JC comes to the America's after his resurrection, and recites most of the New Testament. There is no mention of Joseph Smith or Brigham Young in the book.
Of course that is a video, and therefore you wouldn't accept it. I don't declare it with certainty either. I'm just pointing out that the door is open for speculation. The video footage of the "moon landing" doesn't prove anything either... (By your own standards) and in many circles is consider to be quite controversial!
Remote viewers are used to locate missing persons, weapons of mass destruction and much much more.... I do not think that the possibility of former civilizations possibly having been on the moon or Mars mean that JS or BY were prophets. That they made up something that later turns out to have some validity does not make them seers.... (There's no evidence that those civilizations dressed like Quakers...) I have even seen Nasa video footage that shows spaceships coming and going from the Sun!
I had not attempted to prove the validity of the B of M to you. Although the book is impressive. I find it difficult to belief that one man made it up on his own. Wherever he got it from, I think it must have been somewhat inspired. That he found this book and was in possession of it, does not necessarily make him a prophet, and it certainly doesn't make him infalible. But what "coins" are you referring to? I don't know of any "coins" that are mentioned in conjunction with the B of M.
Since you won't accept any video evidence, in order to give you the real goods, I would have to TAKE YOU THERE... I can't accomplish that physically. However I encourage you to look into Technical Remote Viewing. It is a way to view things that are at a distance without physically relocating yourself. Remote viewers do a lot of work for/ with the government, and some of the targets that they have done and data that they received are publically available. Remote viewers are used to locate
The Adam God Doctrine is something that can be refuted as it is NOT taught any longer. The LDS position on who exactly Jesus was has entirely changed... Those are valid points. However, when referring to the moon, you actually lend credibility to BY. There has been MUCH evidence of a former civilization found on the moon, as well as much built there by our government presently!
@MaryMarchNewell "Prove it with facts please, not trait comparison techniques that mormons like to use to try to prove almost anything, but in reality prove nothing. I want solid facts of a moon civilization from you, not hokus pokus youtube videos on conspiracy of aliens videos. Give me the real goods please. Please show me one shred of evidence that the B of M is true by archeology. Please get one coin, just one that was mentioned of the many in the BofM.
@Gideon6640man Yes, very much sooo... I an convinced of evidence of people having previously lived on the moon and on Mars, and possibly a few still being there. The sun is merely speculation, however just because the environment there would destroy US in our present state, doesn't mean that there aren't some species/ beings for whom that environment is suitable. Watch the extra footage of the "premonition" movie starring Sandra Bullock. They interview a professional remote viewer. The governme
@Gideon6640man The government formerly trained and now hires Remote Viewers to find missing persons, locate weapons of mass destruction, as well as investigate anomolies on Mars and the Moon, I have read their findings on several of those anomolies as well as crop circles... Have you seen "Men who stare at Goats"? Truth is stranger than fiction my friend... stranger than fiction... However JS likely was certain that no one would ever be able to prove him right OR wrong...
@MaryMarchNewell That is circular reasoning at best and with that "logic" you can "prove" anything. Fact is Joe and Brighame were false prophets(all you need is one to qualify just like a murderer or rapist etc..)so you see there are no "hey well will give him that one" nooooo not when you are talking Biblical prophets, only cult prophets get that just like the Watchtower, Heavens Gate etc.....you would flunk a logic or theology with your nutty reasoning.
@Gideon6640man I'm not arguing with you about them being false prophets, and there are multiple examples... I'm just opening up your mind to what may possibly be on the moon, Mars and other planets... What circular reasoning? I agree that they made up what they said, assuming that no one would ever find out one way or the other...Every once in a while, when you make enough predictions, you hit a few:)
@MaryMarchNewell That is fine for a someone to hit and miss except for someone claiming to be a prophet in the Biblical tradition, that yardstick is 100% or you were stoned to death back then.As far as other worlds and such yeah it's possible in fact I propose like Allen Hynek and Jaques Valle believed they are multidimensional things and if you read Michio Kaku in his books he talks about it dimensions. All this has nothing to do with B. Young who was a con man like J. Smith with tall tales.
@Gideon6640man I absolutely agree! Also, I am very inclined to agree with the multiple dimensions...There's an interesting vid here called : Time travel with proof , its not too long, check it out! JS taught that a prophet is only a prophet WHEN he is prophecying, at all other times he is a normal man!!!
@imtherealthing Again false witness. I haven't lied more than 4 times my entire life, and those as a child! I'm NOT anti-Mormon, I AM Mormon as are most of those I've known my entire life! I certainly don't hate my friends and family... I LOVE TRUTH, and I follow the trail of truth wherever it leads. Those that assume they have all truth grow complacent in their ignorance and BLIND in their minds, they won't look for truth, and so will never find it...
Here is a scholarly proof of your corrupted, man-made Trinity. The Encyclopedia Americana: "Christianity derived from Judaism and Judaism was strictly Unitarian [believing that God is one person]. The road which led from Jerusalem to Nicaea was scarcely a straight one. Fourth century Trinitarianism did not reflect accurately early Christian teaching regarding the nature of God; it was, on the contrary, a deviation from this teaching." -- (1956), Vol. XXVII, p. 294L.
@imtherealthing I don't believe in the Trinity... I don't know why you direct this at me... However D&C 88 states that "God is IN and OF and THROUGH ALL things...." We are ALL ONE... try arguing with your own scriptures on that;)
“Ye STIFFNECKED and uncircumcised IN HEART and EARS, YE DO ALWAYS RESIST the HOLY GHOST: as your fathers did, SO DO YE.
Which of the PROPHETS have not your fathers PERSECUTED and they have slain them which shewed before of the coming of the Just One; of whom ye have been now the betrayers and murderers:
Who have RECIEVED the law BY THE DISPOSITION OF ANGELS, and have NOT KEPT IT”.
@imtherealthing Now you are breaking the commandments by BEARING FALSE WITNESS AGAINST YOUR NEIGHBOR... You tread on very dangerous ground when you take it upon yourself to judge me, who you know not at all!!! I'd hate to be measured by your yardstick on judgment day, as you will be... You have yet to know and feel the HOLY GHOST! The little trickle you occassionally get in testimony meeting is NOTHING compared to the HEALING DIVINE LOVE that is waiting for you...
RE :USING EXTRA-SCRIPTURAL SOURCES IN LDS THEOLOGY
LDS theology is only based on the following:
The Bible
The Book of Mormon
The D&C
The PofGP
And General Conferance talks that eventually get sustained as revelation to be binding on the saints (i.e. The Proclamation to the World)
These are called the STANDARD WORKS - and if it doesn't come from any of these..then it is just speculation and "theory" - not doctrine nor binding on the saints.
For God so loved the world, that he GAVE "his" ONLY "BEGOTTEN SON", that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting ilife.
How much more clearer can one get? Was he begotten or not?..was Jesus a liar? This scripture is known by almost everyone..surprised you: "[had] gone through [your] bible and [couldn't] can't find one"
The Jews were first polytheistic then they shifted to henotheism then later into monotheism in the context of thier Babylonian captivity. In this CONTEXT it was the practice of the time in Babylon to have a community altar to put all the IDOLS which were "FORMED" (of wood/silver/gold) on this altar..Jehovah's idol also was put on this altar. Jehovah said that this should not be the case to put "BEFORE" HIM these FALSE gods.
My first point to refute this video is this: Look up the youtube video by "mikebatie" called "Mormons - Are all of Brigham Young's words scripture?". Second, go to fairmormon . org and look up the "adam god theory" and "Moon and sun are inhabited". A prophet can have opinion, and unless what he says he claims is revelation, is approved unanimously by the quorum of the 12 apostles, and has a sustaining vote of the members of the church, it is not official doctrine of the church but only opinion.
FighterOfWhatsRight 2 weeks ago
A prophet can be incorrect in his opinions, only Christ was perfect. The idea a prophet can't speculate and form his own opinion(wrong or right) is merely an excuse anti-mormons formulate to prove them false prophets.
FighterOfWhatsRight 2 weeks ago
The men in the moon... This is taken way out of context. BY was making a point that people will away mock the words of the prophet no matter what they say. Like if men lived on the moon. They will mock him because the do not understand the Word of God. Thanks for showing BY was correct... read more then what you youth pastor has showed you and taught you about it.
Sk8er408 1 month ago
@Sk8er408 its not mocking or taking out of context when BY who claimed to be prophet says that people are on the moon. Many of Smith's and Youngs claims could not be verified at that time becasue back then no one could disprove him. Now with space travel and appollo missions we know that there are no people living on the moon. BY was wrong. Just as JS was wrong with his false prophecies.
moronigoldenplates 3 weeks ago
@moronigoldenplates
There are lots of unverified prophecies in the bible that are claimed to have been fulfilled...
Besides that... Get to know the context instead of believing the commentary your youth pastor has given you. It's plain deceptive.
Sk8er408 3 weeks ago
David Whitmer wrote:Joseph Smith would put the seer stone into a hat, and put his face in the hat, drawing it closely around his face to exclude the light; and in the darkness the spiritual light would shine. A piece of something resembling parchment would appear, and on that appeared the writing. One character at a time would appear, and under it was the interpretation in English. WHY HAVE GOLDEN PLATES WHEN YOU HAVE A HAT ?
999LDS 1 month ago
Apostle Bednar : Women Who Wear More Than One Ear Ring Per Ear Should Not Be Dated ;
999LDS 1 month ago
Ladies and Gentlemen, we have here the classi cult mind control drone. In the case of LDS this "iamtherealthing" we have wha we call in counter cult ministry a "Jack Mormon". Jack Mormons will defend LDS teachings while drinking coffe & booze. The may smoke too. Notice that he or she, that instead of adressing the topic of B. Young's Adam G-d doctrine he attacks historic Christianity.This is "normal" in cults, please read Steve Hassans book "Combating Cult Mind Control".
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
Ok the Trinity good subject....second only to the deity of Christ in attacks by cultist who either misunderstand what Christians believe about it or down right lie. The doctrine in in the OT and NT and can be shown,just because the word "Trinity" is not there is a strawman arguement..is the word "Theocratic Organization" in the Bible JW's? is the word Ward,Stake,in the Bible LDS? you have to let the Bible speak for itself AND what is reveals. Father,Son & Holy Spirit are creators etc...lots more
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
I am not understanding what you are trying to get at. Slow down and THINK out what you are trying to say before putting it down in print. Between your bad grammar and poor sentence structure and typos I am trying to determine what the heck you are trying to get at. Are you upset because I do what most academics do - that is CITE sources like "The Encyclopedia Americana" and "The New Encyclopedia Britannica"? What do you expect? I have a DEGREE in Theology - silly little man.,
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@imtherealthing Oh realy a degree in Theology no less. The Encylopedia Britiannica wow then it must be true. I do have a feeling that you may may misquoted the source or are just looking for ANY support,any port in the storm you know just like you JW bedfellows. Degree? well my friend has a a REAL degree from Fuller Theological Seminary where they teach Greek,Hebrew,Church History and his Phd from Princeton where he studied under Bruce Meztger and my bu chuckles at cultist like u
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
Silly bad grammar and yet you can't give a solid argument but the again I don't need to be much of a scholar to answer the likes of you. So stay on the subject will you? Why are you so hung up that there is no Biblcal pasage that says the Father, Son and Holy Spirit are the ONE G-d? why do you need such a passage?.What would that prove? You claim to have a "degree in theology" and you can't exeget biblical passages? What textbooks did you use for your Hermeneutics class? Greek Grammar books? ?
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
LDS theology is only based on the following:
The Bible reliable but misquoted by LDS
The Book of Mormon a product of 19th century relicious fervor proven a fraud.
The D&C more nonsense
The PofGP--- the biggest joke called "The Book Of Abraham" in reality an Ancient Egyptian Book fo Breathings
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
TRINITY
Here is a scholarly proof of your corrupted, man-made Trinity. The Encyclopedia Americana: "Christianity derived from Judaism and Judaism was strictly Unitarian [believing that God is one person]. The road which led from Jerusalem to Nicaea was scarcely a straight one. Fourth century Trinitarianism did not reflect accurately early Christian teaching regarding the nature of God; it was, on the contrary, a deviation from this teaching." -- (1956), Vol. XXVII, p. 294L.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@imtherealthing You are not even close. So where did you study Church History? I mean the Christian Church that is...
Gideon6640man 1 month ago
@Gideon6640man
The New Encyclopedia Britannica: "Neither the word Trinity, nor the explicit doctrine as such, appears in the New Testament, nor did Jesus and his followers intend to contradict the Shema in the Old Testament: (Deut. 6:4). . . The doctrine developed gradually over several centuries and through many controversies . . . By the end of the 4th century . . . the doctrine of the Trinity took substantially the form it has maintained ever since." -- Micropædia, Vol. X, p. 126. (1976)
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@imtherealthing ..and the Anti-Nicene fathers, the Apostolic fathers,the Trinity, even in it's most fundamental form is there and that is fact.,nice try. But you should have know this in your Church History classes right? But Since you quote the ecyclopedia what do they define as Polytheism? is it inline with Bruce R. McConkie where he said in Mormon Dcotrine that LDS are not polytheist because they only worship one god? The Trinity doctrine is solid and despite attacks by cultist.
the
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
You don't make sense. You obviously lack an education and cannot even put together a sentence without typos and bad grammar let alone put forth a decent argument. Seriously give up already - your intelligence is showing...or should I say your LACK of intelligence. Are you trying to tell me that I should know the doctrine of the trinity better having taken univeristy classes on it? Is that what you are trying to communicate? I wrote a univeristy paper on it.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@imtherealthing Sure you did.....
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
@imtherealthing How old are you? Are you over 8 yet? I don't think you're even old enough to be a baptized Mormon.
MaryMarchNewell 1 month ago
@MaryMarchNewell
RE :USING EXTRA-SCRIPTURAL SOURCES IN LDS THEOLOGY
LDS theology is only based on the following:
The Bible
The Book of Mormon
The D&C
The PofGP
And General Conferance talks that eventually get sustained as revelation to be binding on the saints (i.e. The Proclamation to the World)
These are called the STANDARD WORKS - and if it doesn't come from any of these..then it is just speculation and "theory" - not doctrine nor binding on the saints.
imtherealthing 1 month ago
@imtherealthing What does that have to do with how old you are? I'd like you to read some referneces from your standard works. D&C 88 (The TRUE nature of God, and Time doesn't exist!- which means that you are all at once here and there, then & now... inseperable from God because you are both still with Him, and have already returned!) D&C111 (JS prophesied that he would be the sovereign ruler of Salem Mass., Never happened! After some guy told him where he could steal some gold
MaryMarchNewell 1 month ago
@imtherealthing and silver out of a basement in a house, he wrote this "revelation" about God giving him an abundance of Gold and silver there!!! Never happened. The "guy" got there and with the place having been built up some since he'd been there, couldn't recall where the house was!!! FALSE GOLD DIGGING PROPHECY!!! STILL in your STANDARD WORKS! This IS the explanation for this section in an older Gospel Doctrine Lesson manual. Newer ones give less info.Moses 5:29-31,
MaryMarchNewell 1 month ago
@imtherealthing Cain's oath with Satan, where he swore by his throat... If you went through the Temple prior to 1990... Where have you heard an oath like that?
MaryMarchNewell 1 month ago
@MaryMarchNewell
You seriously have some REAL mental issues...go seek help. Nothing you just said is true or accurate or represents LDS theology or what consititutes "revelation" binding on the saints - seriously - go seek help for your mental problems.
imtherealthing 1 month ago
@MaryMarchNewell LOL .
999LDS 1 month ago
@999LDS :)
MaryMarchNewell 1 month ago
@MaryMarchNewell
YOUR QUOTE:"@imtherealthing You, are being dishonest not recognizing that things in there ONCE WERE part of the Temple endowment!!! You can't just "disown" 26 volumes of the teachings of the early prophets, because it makes you uncomfortable now, or fail to realize that BY disowning them you discredit the church you are defending & bring it to the ground!"
MY REPLY: No..a "journal" was meant to be BY's own private thoughts..it later got turned into what it is today..silly
imtherealthing 1 month ago
@imtherealthing I don't make sense? lol and yet you cannnot counter my statments by logic,truth,history least of all Biblical and yet I I can not only respond to you but destroy your strawman arguements.
Gideon6640man 1 month ago
@Gideon6640man
Ah yes...I remember you...the big mouth who can't back up his 3-headed nicene god.
imtherealthing 1 month ago
Suggested reading Bible first all truth filters through it. So let's see The Tanners who have been a thorn in the LDS church since the 60's. D. Michael Quinn's book "Early Mormonsism and The Magic World View" gives you the occult ties of the LDS. Of course Dr. walter Martin.... Oh yes their will be cahracter assasination by these LDS kids online here but they can be dismissed easly with facts about the LDS church so they don't matter anyway. Cheers.
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
Ity is clear that Brigham Young was false prophet as was Joseph Smith and yet they conveyed the succesion of prophets of the church all the way to Thomas Monson so in the BIBLICAL standard Joe through Monson are false prophets and have no authority to preach the word of G-d.
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
I like how you don't respond to my comments directly to make it look like you made good points and I didn't respond - coward. Again you have FAILED to make any sort of good objection - but rather just spout off your own opinions with nothing to back it as though anyone should take your "opinion" seriously. i.e. YOUR QUOTE: "Ity is clear that Brigham Young was false prophet as was Joseph Smith" typos included ;)
Really? that's just your own words with NO FACTS.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@imtherealthing D&C 111 When was that "prophecy" fulfilled?
MaryMarchNewell 1 month ago
@Gideon6640man
Why haven't you responded to my objections on your false nicene 3-headed god? Hmmm..I guess it is easier for your kind to "cut and paste" worn out anti-mormon objections because you are incapable of honest intellectual debate. Must be hard to be stupid - the cure is an education - not "google".
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
LOL..."DR" Walter Martin?...lol..I guess you haven't heard that the old "dr"'s credentials are FAKE...lol...and still can not be substantiated. Even the CRI distanced itself from him for that reason...lol..oh my..my side hurts. All of the "dr"'s so-called objections have been debunked ...waaaayy back in the 80's..shows me the level of intelligence you possess...lol..oh my...I just love how your kind try so hard to sound smart and fail.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
No matter how much you disagree with LDS theology we have the right to claim that those sources are legit whether you like it or not. You have no authority to claim any right to tell us what our theology is. So when you quote stuff from the Journal of Discourses - you are wrong - because that is not part of LDS theology. To do so and know that is to be dishonest - but that is what you excel at isn't it? For you are a lover of darkness rather than light like your father satan.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@imtherealthing You, are being dishonest not recognizing that things in there ONCE WERE part of the Temple endowment!!! You can't just "disown" 26 volumes of the teachings of the early prophets, because it makes you uncomfortable now, or fail to realize that BY disowning them you discredit the church you are defending & bring it to the ground!
MaryMarchNewell 1 month ago
@MaryMarchNewell
You do NOT understand LDS theology..that is very obvious. The Journal of Discourses by B.Y. or any other prophet is NOT revelation binding on the saints. And NO "your interpretation" of the Godhead is WRONG from the D&C - that is NOT LDS theology - PERIOD. So I do not know what break off you belong to of the TRUE church if it is indeed a break off sect of the LDS faith that accounts for your twisted "interpretation" of scripture given by TRUE prophets - not your false ones.
imtherealthing 1 month ago
@imtherealthing D&C 88:6- "He that ascended up on high, as also he descended below all things, in that he comprehended all things, that he might be in all and through all things, the light of truth. 7- "Which truth shineth. This is the light of Christ. As also HE IS IN THE SUN, and the light of the sun, and the power thereof by which it was made. 8- As also HE IS IN THE MOON, and is the light of the moon, and the power thereof by which it was made;.......
MaryMarchNewell 1 month ago
@MaryMarchNewell
Listen mental midget...that scripture is using metaphor. God's light - his power - is everywhere. AS interpreted by PROPHETS not a mental case like you - puts this in correct context.
imtherealthing 1 month ago
@MaryMarchNewell
met·a·phor /ˈmɛtəˌfɔr, -fər/ Show Spelled[met-uh-fawr, -fer] Show IPA
noun
1. a figure of speech in which a term or phrase is applied to something to which it is not literally applicable in order to suggest a resemblance, as in “A mighty fortress is our God.”
imtherealthing 1 month ago
@Gideon6640man
Tanners and Quinn..lol..oh my..get with the times...ROFL!!!..you are just too funny.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
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Gideon6640man 4 months ago
@imtherealthing The Tanners who exposed your church time and time again so much so that your church "security",Bill Hickman types tried in vain to discredit them only to show how much of a sick and racist cult you are. You go around knocking on doors claiming to be the "Restored Church" proclaiming it all with lessons etc and then you run into a Bible believeing Christian and you "have to go?" lol that is Luke 16 hitting your missionaries.And that is that what you guys are about?..cowards.
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
Then get your "phd" friend on here to talk to me...because you are an absolute moron....seriously.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
Comment removed
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
@imtherealthing Right...tell us the name of the mental patient who gave you a degree. I humored you and you took the bait. You are so predictable. Like the Jack Mormon you are, not addressing the video but attacking a believer that knows his Bible and Chuch History and the cults. You fail to answer the questions, you make idiotic and untrue statments i.e the Council of Nicea established the Trinity Problem, the Council had NOTHING to do with the Trinity and yet you droned on.Typical cultist.
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
@imtherealthing BOM and Blacks...so you comfortable with this? 2 Nephi 5:21,30:6.... Jacob 3:5,8-9...Alma 3:6.3Nephi 2:14-16, 19:25-30.....and my fav..Mormon 5:15. So if you "like " black folk, why are you LDS?
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@Gideon6640man
LOL..the more you comment here the more you give credence to my saying you are a "moron". Thanks for supporting my comments. I have yet to see your replies to my objections - instead you just regurgitate OLD anti-mormon objections and hide behind your "googled" anti-mormon sources. Do you really believe that people can't see you for the moron you are? Seriously..go get an education. It hurts me to see so many typos and bad grammar. I'm embarrassed for you.....seriously
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@imtherealthing Right....and you have yet to tell me the name of the mental patient who gave you a degree.
What school would hand out such a degree? the degree that teaches you inaccurate information that can be easily proven wrong by looking at the record? What school kid? This is the example of LDS higher leanring? Well my temple garment with Masonic talisman sybols on it, are wither a liar(imagine a brianwahsed cultist ready for the Kool Aid) or a fool for paying for such a "degree".
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
Comment removed
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
There is a cure for ignorance - it's called an "education"...go get one.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@imtherealthing There is a cure for a "direct question" too...it's called a "direct answer" now go back and drink the Kool Aid Comrade Monson has for you my dear Jack Mormon child...so where did you get "degree" from again? .......thought so. You talk about me being ignorant etc... and yet you can't answer simple nad direct questions and I know more about your religion than you do. Insidious is'nt it?
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
YOUR QUOTE: " I know more about your religion than you do"
MY REPLY: ROFL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Heck you don't know more than what a grade 7 education has taught you...oh my side hurts stop...lol
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@imtherealthing You had several opportunities to refute what I wrote and you have shown to be a petulant brat wallowing in a sea of retarded adolescence. You are also a liar and deceiver. When and only when you decide to grow up, then address the questions kid. You can say you know more about religion but you have yet to show it. The fact you claimed the Council of Nicea established the Trinity shows you know nothing of Church History. You got your "facts" by some idiot FAIRLDS.ORG,FARMS types.
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
@imtherealthing Ok I know who you are, I tangled with your fanatical Jack Mormon self about two years ago..your "The Rommulator" .or some silly thing & you are with those other two LDS nut jobs. "The Backyard Archeologist"( this guy needs some psycological intervention a.s.a.p.) and "The Mormonanswerman"(A liar and coward) wow what company you keep...so you never answered my question fro 2 years ago sport....where in Jewish writns is the phrase "Land of Jerusalem"? This Jew would like to know.
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
First...do you even know what a "Jack Mormon" is?...apparently not because you use the word incorrectly (due to your lack of education no doubt). Second, what is "writins"? Do you mean "writings"? Third, you need anger managment. Fourth, just answer the questions posed to you and stop running from them and say that "I" need to answer your pathetic and illogical questions that have been debunked 30 years ago that you copy and paste from anti-mormon sites. Silly boy.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@imtherealthing You are a Jack Mormon, you drink coffe,smoke ."Writins" spelling error you on the other hand cannot bring not ne logical argument and at least I did not write a backward E and claimed to be part of the Book of Abraham...Ok Rommulator Rambutt or whatever your name is...None of your idiotic "apologist" debunked nothing you liar, fanatical Kool Aid drinking drone.Silly boy? ask your mom. So my temple garment friend, what about the questions I posed to you? answer them coward.
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
You have to be the most uneducated moron on Youtube...it figures that you are not cognitive of this fact.
imtherealthing 3 months ago
@imtherealthing Hmm still no answers to direct questions...your mommy know your online? Typical cultist ,ranting testimony,irrational,can't keep text in context,does as he is told by his cult leader. Sad kid, one day you gotta answer why you did not investigate the lies you have been told by your church.Pathetic. You are also a liar and a fraud, you have no formal education of any kind just some droned in "testimony party" at your local ward. Take cake Rommulator,Purcalator, your called.
Gideon6640man 3 months ago
@Gideon6640man
Just keep commenting...it's obvious to anyone that you have mental probelms and are uneducated. :)
imtherealthing 3 months ago
@imtherealthing You follow these con men and yet I am the mental patient.... a huh right.So how are the Quakers doing on the moon Rommy?...And what school did your degree in again? BYU? figures. You keep harping on my education and yet what I ever I know it's head and shoulders above what you know including the real history of your "church". So it's obvious that even a lay Christian knows his Bible better than a Phd for BYU or what other kookie schools teaches you kids... pathetic..how sad
Gideon6640man 3 months ago
@imtherealthing So many Mormons are in apostasy to Mormonism. The FLDS seem the be the only ones carrying the flag of "The New and Everlasting Restoration". The Mormon "restoration" includes Polygamy (Whimped out) Polytheism (Still strong) Blood atonement (Getting weakly) complete obedience to a rigid theocratic despotism (Pretty strong) and Adam=God Doctrine (Whimped out and running in denial). If Mormonism is the restoration shouldn't good MoJoes adhere to all of it?
IExposeMormonism 3 months ago
@imtherealthing You are deluded as to what is obvious in these strains...
MaryMarchNewell 1 month ago
@MaryMarchNewell
John 17: 11, 21-22
...And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that THEY MAY BE ONE, even as we are ONE”
They are ONE in purpose, NOT ONE IN BEING
imtherealthing 1 month ago
@imtherealthing And yet the LDS religion was founded by someone with only a 3rd grade education... Quit being so prideful and boasting over your "much learning"... BOTH of you! You're acting like children...Discuss the issue quiot swapping silly insults!
MaryMarchNewell 1 month ago
@imtherealthing Dont' need a Phd to counter some cultic clown like you.
Gideon6640man 1 month ago
@Gideon6640man
How's your racism and swearing "christian"? Yes..we see your "character" quite clearly. Remember I sent you copies of comments you made on other posts of your foul language and your racists comments. Your kind has nothing to offer the TRUE CHRISTIANS and followers of Christ - we see your dark works easily...only the simpleminded and weak of character fall for your lies.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@imtherealthing Racist? lol not even close...so you one of those LDS trolls trying character assassination like the Scientologist do with Operation Freak Out? RAcist lets see YOUR Churh has quite a history of You still preach it in the BOM, why? you got some nerve kid.Dark works? you who go into a Temple and swear Masonic blood oaths? You whose Temples have no crosses but lots of pentagrams,Ba"al sunstones,all seeing eye,the beehive? htose are occultic...hypocrite.
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Well since I cannot get an answer from an LDS coward who trolls this site my questions will be directed to more reasonable LDS folks so I wil be posting.I want an honest exchange and not some Kool Aid Drinking mental patient.Can any LDS just answer some simple questions?
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
Well First lets start with the Bible both Testaments. ONE G-d not many gods and whether you worship them or not is not the issue nor the definition of a polytheist se any LEGIT dictionary not some delusions of Bruce R. McConkie. Deut 4:35,6:4,32:39 2Samuel 7:22,Pslams 86:10,Isaiah chpts 43-46 and many more NT Mark 12:32. 1 Cor 8:4,6. Gal 4:8 etc.. So the LDS can believe in many gos and be polytheist all they want but there is NO Biblical support for it....none. If there is please show me.
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
Comment removed
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
Fact Brigham BY believed in Adam god JOD vol1 pp50--51 Adam "is the only god whom we have to do" this was NOT his only quote yeas after he continued never printed nor took back his statements so please with the "he was misquoted" JOD vol13 p.95 All his sermons are as good as scripture,..Adam God again.."How much unbelief exists in the mins od the Latter Day Saints Deseret News Weekly June 18th 1873 ..19 years after the first time he taught it....19 years!!!! so he was that sloppy?
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
LDS THEOLOGY(that has NEVER changed):
The Father = Fully GOD
The Son (Jehovah/Jesus) = Fully GOD
The Holy Spirit = Fully GOD
THREE seperate GODS worthy of worship, yet we pray to the FATHER GOD in the NAME of JESUS CHRIST and receive confirmation by the Holy Ghost.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@imtherealthing Never changed??? LDS Doctrine in BY's Day (and included in the endowment) was that Adam, was God, and the physical father of Jesus with Mary, and that Eloheim was Adam's Father... Jesus' Grand daddy... Today LDS view JC as an "Older brother". Which is NOT how other Christians view him.
MaryMarchNewell 1 month ago
@MaryMarchNewell
LDS THEOLOGY(that has NEVER changed):
The Father = Fully GOD
The Son (Jehovah/Jesus) = Fully GOD
The Holy Spirit = Fully GOD
THREE seperate GODS worthy of worship, yet we pray to the FATHER GOD in the NAME of JESUS CHRIST and receive confirmation by the Holy Ghost.
TITLES like : Eternal Father or LORD can be applied to both the FATHER GOD and JESUS, Elohim also ...these are "TITLES" in MOST cases we LDS know that Lord is Jehovah/Jesus as Elohim is the Father
imtherealthing 1 month ago
@imtherealthing Which is WHY they don't consider LDS Christians... You do not both believe in the SAME Christ! You are talking apples and oranges...And JS claimed to have formerly been the HG, as it being Spirit, is a temporary calling, since ALL must come to earth to get a body...
MaryMarchNewell 1 month ago
@MaryMarchNewell
In the Old Testament the word “elohim” is found translated 2674 times as God or gods.
imtherealthing 1 month ago
@MaryMarchNewell
RE: plural marriage (polygamy)
It was practiced by Abraham, Issac and Jacob AND OTHER PROPHETS for example..and we see that they are in Heaven with God:
Luke 13: 28
There shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth, when ye shall see ABRAHAM, AND ISAAC, AND JACOB, and "ALL the PROPHETS", IN THE KINGDOM OF GOD, and you yourselves thrust out.
imtherealthing 1 month ago
@Gideon6640man
On the devil-inspired doctrine of the “Trinity”
The deity of Jesus Christ was decided upon by a vote . A few hundred church leaders gathered at Nicea in 325 AD. to vote on the matter. (the vote was loaded, because most of the opposing bishops were either KILLED or EXHILED or excluded!) Representation for the TRUTH about the Godhead was allowed by only a small fraction of those TRUE Christians...we lost the TRUTH then to the pagan trinity of man.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@Gideon6640man
2 Tim. 4: 3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine; but after their own lusts shall they heap to themselves teachers, having itching ears;
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
RE :USING EXTRA-SCRIPTURAL SOURCES IN LDS THEOLOGY
LDS theology is only based on the following:
The Bible
The Book of Mormon
The D&C
The PofGP
And General Conferance talks that eventually get sustained as revelation to be binding on the saints (i.e. The Proclamation to the World)
These are called the STANDARD WORKS - and if it doesn't come from any of these..then it is just speculation and "theory" - not doctrine nor binding on the saints.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@imtherealthing So if any LDS says otherwise????
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
YOUR QUOTE:"So if any LDS says otherwise??"
MY REPLY: Unless it is in the cannon of scripture as per below - it is just speculation. Gee I wonder what it would have been like if the prophets and apostles of the OT and NT had the internet or media like today to mis-represent thier words and how they would have faired. Many of the people of the time didn't even know how to read or write and therefore newspapers were not available to TWIST thier words.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
Also, in Christ's day the saints were persecuted and Christ was thought of as being a "magician"etc....apostles were called drunkards, etc..same arguments..because the same spirit that possessed the enemies of Christ then is in people like you today.
Acts 28: 22
But we desire to hear of thee what thou thinkest: for as concerning this SECT [cult], we know that every where it is spoken against.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
Acts 7:54
“When they heard these things, they were cut to the heart, and they gnashed on him with their teeth.”
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@imtherealthing She quoted all these same verses at me as well.. not very original... I haven't gnashed my teeth lately....lol:)
MaryMarchNewell 1 month ago
@MaryMarchNewell
In LDS theology we say that The Father, Son and Holy Ghost are ONE in PURPOSE not BEING...this GODHEAD is what we LDS say constitutes "ONE GOD" - a unity of GODS who are ALL FULLY GOD working as ONE unit in a GODHEAD.
imtherealthing 1 month ago
@Gideon6640man
Acts 7:51-53
“Ye STIFFNECKED and uncircumcised IN HEART and EARS, YE DO ALWAYS RESIST the HOLY GHOST: as your fathers did, SO DO YE.
Which of the PROPHETS have not your fathers PERSECUTED and they have slain them which shewed before of the coming of the Just One; of whom ye have been now the betrayers and murderers:
Who have RECIEVED the law BY THE DISPOSITION OF ANGELS, and have NOT KEPT IT”.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
2 Timothy 3:12-13 (King James Version)
12 Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall suffer persecution.
13 But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
I noticed your silence on my finding all those comments you made elsewhere where you use foul language and the racism that you expressed...funny how one always knows just the kind of people you so-called "christians" are who attack the LORD's church. Like your father lucifer...you love darkness more than light and will always persecute the Lord's TRUTH.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@imtherealthing Oh stop that ok grow up already. have a life and if you only knew waht i have been up to, needles to say there is one LDS who's head is spiinin after I shared some of your churches history.I The Lords church? well let's see if the LDS church is shall we? Anybody can claim that just like the JW's,Moonies etc...it don't mean squat. Racist? like your church has been and still is? please.so you wanna get back on the subject or you gonna eveda, any port in the storm?
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man you wrote about other stuff and eveaded this direct question...due noted.
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
Are you serious?..you can barely spell your words correctly and put together a cohesive sentence and you want "me" to answer your cut and paste objections? Nice try pal...try answering my questions I put to you or are you afraid of the answers? AGAIN, your "form" of "christinaity" does not appeal to me. Your example of foul language and racism as I found in your comments elsewhere shows me your form of relgion has nothing to offer me...nor does your 3-headed nicene god.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@imtherealthing Cut and paste questions? No they are direct questions my cultish friend and you cannot answer them which speaks for it self. You are a bigoted fantical religionst. The fact is that the Warren Jeffs of the world are the real LDS and you are a watered down revisionist. You cannot defend your faith so you choose to live in the "club" mentality as most LDS deluted phonies do.We are done here.You are Stan Fileds,the Browns & Elder Michael Griffith all rolled into one. Faceless fanatic
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
Yes..run away and not answer my objections. Run to the nearest university...heck first finish highschool.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
Now stop EVADING my questions and "man-up" or shut up as the expression goes. Otherwise you're just "another" ignorant pathetic hateful anti-mormon who like the rest of your kind lack an education and has nothing better to do with his time.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@Gideon6640man
YOUR QUOTE: "@Gideon6640man you wrote about other stuff and eveaded this direct question...due noted.
Gideon6640man 16 hours ago"
MY REPLY: LOL...you said it perfectly...to yourself excpet with all the bad grammar and spelling...lol
Did you mean "duly" instead "due" and did you mean "evaded" rather than "eveaded"...get yourself an education...and clean up your language I have seen you use on other posts & deal with your OWN RACISM as I copied and printed evidence to you.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@imtherealthing Ok let;s start with the Bible..Nowhere do we find the G-d of Abraham ,Itzak,Yacob as an exalted man, nor exsitence in other true gods only so called "gods". Nor it teaches that the Aaronic Priesthood can be held by any male EXCEPT from the tribe of Levi so strict even Yeshua can't hold.The Melchisedek Priesthhod only has ONE priest and that is Yeshua, period. Meschia will come form the tribe of Judah and be born in Behtlehem. No baptism for the dead.Is your church Biblical?
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man Correct... Melchezidek was "without beginning of days or end of years... without Father, without Mother..." he was NOT a natural man!
MaryMarchNewell 1 month ago
Comment removed
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
Jesus is our savior. DO you know anything else besides trying to find plausible loopholes to protect your flock?
Frisby412 4 months ago
Listen peeps, one day you will know the truth of his statements...
ConvinceTheWorld 6 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
BoM has "NEVER" been changed?
1 nephi 20:1 "out of the waters of baptism"
MISSING 1830
MISSING Printers MSS
MISSING Original MSS
ADDED 1840 Edition
DELETED 1849 edition (2nd european)
Who tampered with and mutilated the text of the STD WRKS?
bdplist 7 months ago
@bdplist Love how someone keeps flagging all your comments as spam...lol, they can't respond to them, so they try to hide them...
MaryMarchNewell 4 months ago
@MaryMarchNewell
The New Encyclopedia Britannica: "Neither the word Trinity, nor the explicit doctrine as such, appears in the New Testament, nor did Jesus and his followers intend to contradict the Shema in the Old Testament: (Deut. 6:4). . . The doctrine developed gradually over several centuries and through many controversies . . . By the end of the 4th century . . . the doctrine of the Trinity took substantially the form it has maintained ever since." -- Micropædia, Vol. X, p. 126. (1976)
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@imtherealthing Where is this coming from? I haven't been speaking about any "Trinity" But read D&C88 "God is IN and THROUGH and OF ALL things!!!" We are ALL ONE;)
MaryMarchNewell 1 month ago
@MaryMarchNewell
On the devil-inspired doctrine of the “Trinity”
The deity of Jesus Christ was decided upon by a vote . A few hundred church leaders gathered at Nicea in 325 AD. to vote on the matter. (the vote was loaded, because most of the opposing bishops were either KILLED or EXHILED or excluded!) Representation for the TRUTH about the Godhead was allowed by only a small fraction of those TRUE Christians...we lost the TRUTH then to the pagan trinity of man.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@imtherealthing Um that is a blatant lie. The Council of Nicea in 325AD had to do with the realtion of the Father and Son i.e equal in nature,eternal. Also in the dicussion on Cannon Law and Easter but the Christological question was the main issue. Arius held like JW's(cult) that the son was inferior to the Father and Athanasius held the they are equal in nature. Homousius vs. Homoiusius and the Athanatian arguement won out,rightfully too. You do not know what you are talking about my friend
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
A "blantant lie"? Oh really? I have a BA in Relgious Studies my focus within that degree being early christianity 1st-3rd century. Tell me again what is a lie here? Are you telling me that what I said is not verifiable in history? Tell me again and let's demonstrate here to everyone just how ignorant you really are...so I ask you agin..is this a lie?
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@imtherealthing Because any school that teaches that the Nicea Council dealt with the Trinity is a school of idiots. BA in BS is what you got. If you want to talk about degrees a good friend of mine teachesEarly Church History Unitiversity and was a conrtibutor to the Word Commentaries and he would laugh even more at your clowinish rants Yes you LIE the Council of Nicea was NOT about the Trinity. Who's textbooks you use? LDS "Religious" studies in their theology is joke as any LEGIT scholar.
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
Ignoramus...RE: "Trinity" and the council of Nicea
Are you are telling me that the trinity was not part of what the council of Nicea was about ...is this correct? It's obvious you like to play "armchair academics" (i.e. google) ...lo..oh my thanks for the laugh..I come across simpletons like you all the time...lol
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
TRINITY
Here is a scholarly proof of your corrupted, man-made Trinity. The Encyclopedia Americana: "Christianity derived from Judaism and Judaism was strictly Unitarian [believing that God is one person]. The road which led from Jerusalem to Nicaea was scarcely a straight one. Fourth century Trinitarianism did not reflect accurately early Christian teaching regarding the nature of God; it was, on the contrary, a deviation from this teaching." -- (1956), Vol. XXVII, p. 294L.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
The New Encyclopedia Britannica: "Neither the word Trinity, nor the explicit doctrine as such, appears in the New Testament, nor did Jesus and his followers intend to contradict the Shema in the Old Testament: (Deut. 6:4). . . The doctrine developed gradually over several centuries and through many controversies . . . By the end of the 4th century . . . the doctrine of the Trinity took substantially the form it has maintained ever since." -- Micropædia, Vol. X, p. 126. (1976)
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
RE: The New Encyclopedia Britannica:
Now Einstein tell me..if the "The New Encyclopedia Britannica" can say that - "By the end of the 4th century . . . the doctrine of the Trinity took substantially the form it has maintained ever since." then they MUST be idiots too right? Since what took place in the 4th century? And, what "controverisies" (councils) are they speaking of Sherlock? got your "quotes"...now provide "yours"...big mouth :)
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
Why are you afraid to answer questions about your 3-headed god..tell me..why does one not find the words "essence" or "substance" in the bible when you speak of the GODHEAD being ONE GOD...those words are NOT found in the bible in ANY of the original languages..it is EXTRA-BIBLICAL..that means outside of the bible.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
Tell me,
We learn that ONLY the Father knows of end of the world not the angels or even JESUS knows this according to the bible...so if they share the same MIND - which "is" trinatarian theology..then how can this be?
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
Ever think that your Hellenized god could be just that..a god made up by wicked men to destroy people's faith in the TRUE GOD..as we learn..it is LIFE ETERNAL to know who GOD "&" Jesus Christ is..God is not supposed to be a mystery like you trinitarians teach..
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@imtherealthing I dont have a Hellenized Lord they were polytheist like the LDS. My ancestors received the Torah and since then we have proclaimed ONE and ONLY ONE G-d. Shema Y'srael Adonai ELohenu Adonia Echod(Deut 6:4. Isaiah 43:10 & 11, 44:6 & 8,45: 5,6,18,22,46:9,48:11,12...) notice a pattern here? so tell me how you justify using the Bible that there are many gods? the Greeks,Romans,Babylonians etc polytheist.As a Messianic Jew have been taught only one G-d and then became a man Yeshua.
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
RE: Isa. 43:10
The Jews were first polytheistic then they shifted to henotheism then later into monotheism in the context of thier Babylonian captivity. In this CONTEXT it was the practice of the time in Babylon to have a community altar to put all the IDOLS which were "FORMED" (of wood/silver/gold) on this altar..Jehovah's idol also was put on this altar. Jehovah said that this should not be the case to put "BEFORE" HIM these FALSE gods.
That is the context. FALSE gods
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
The CONTEXT of the SHEMA (Deut 6:4) is that they were not to follow after "FALSE" gods.
Read Joshua 22:22
God is the God of gods...
Now is God the God of TRUE gods or FALSE gods?
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
The Shema which is what Deut 6:4 is refering to would not recognize your trinity..as a matter of fact that is why the Jews and Muslims refer to the trinity as "polytheism"..no matter how you SPIN it..the trinity still says they are "three seperate GODS" but are connected by this non-biblical "essence" or "substance" thus making them really ONE GOD...sorry..but the Shema does not RECOGNIZE your 3-headed god.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
TITLES like : Eternal Father or LORD can be applied to both the FATHER GOD and JESUS, Elohim also ...these are "TITLES" in MOST cases we LDS know that Lord is Jehovah/Jesus as Elohim is the Father
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@imtherealthing The "Eloheim" in Hebrew meant Gods. It was NOT the name of ONE God. It was a plurality of Gods. The Church of Christ sees this as being Father and Mother Gods. Which could be a logical conclusion. But what if it was more than 2? According to LDS teachings Eloheim was originally the "GrandFather" since Adam was Our God, and the Father of Jesus (with Mary) in the flesh. The original doctrine taught by BY and included in the endowment, was Eloheim-Adam-Jesus
MaryMarchNewell 1 month ago
@Gideon6640man
Why is it that false christianity needs analogies like an egg, a triangle, or water in its three phases to EXPLAIN thier 3-headed god?..can you point to just ONE place in the Bible where ANY of the prophets or apostles use these very analogies or ANY analogies for that matter to explain the GODHEAD?..well?
Guess your "god" is not found in the bible
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man
John 17:3
“And this is ‘LIFE ETERNAL’, that THEY might KNOW THEE the ONLY TRUE GOD, “and” Jesus Christ, whom THOU HAST SENT.”
Notice the “and”…who sent Jesus?...did Jesus send himself? Silly Trinitarians. The Godhead is NOT a “mystery” like you Trinitarians teach..but it is LIFE ETERNAL to know them both as they are distinct separate beings here in this verse.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@imtherealthing Listen kid, when you can behave like an adult I will be more than glad to answer ANY questions you may have, we in the Chrsitian Apologetics are not afraid to confront the issues head on and now resort to insults like you have exibited. I don't know who you are realy but you are behaving like Stan Fields, The Browns and Michael D. Quinn with your clandestine attacks. If you can agree with me on those terms.ie to be civil then you are on if not good day to you.
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
@imtherealthing ro are you like "Elder Michael Griffith" the anonymous LDS apologist that rants and insults people to get his point across? Are you able to have a cohesive discussion?
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
@MaryMarchNewell That is what Mormons do!
Liars
Deceivers
Seducers
bdplist 1 month ago
@bdplist Yes, but they are not the ONLY ones... There are many...
MaryMarchNewell 1 month ago
I know Brigham Young is a Prophet of God.
Maceron48 8 months ago
@Maceron48 Which God?
MaryMarchNewell 1 month ago
Brigham Young was opposed to priesthood for blacks, a policy which continued until 1978, he was a classic american racist.
beradification 9 months ago
is brigham young mentioned in the book of moron?
SuperNoobTroll 10 months ago
@SuperNoobTroll No, he is not. The B of M is a book about ancient Jews who fled Israel and sailed to America 600 years before Christ. It is a history of their governments and wars. Towards the end JC comes to the America's after his resurrection, and recites most of the New Testament. There is no mention of Joseph Smith or Brigham Young in the book.
MaryMarchNewell 4 months ago
Of course that is a video, and therefore you wouldn't accept it. I don't declare it with certainty either. I'm just pointing out that the door is open for speculation. The video footage of the "moon landing" doesn't prove anything either... (By your own standards) and in many circles is consider to be quite controversial!
MaryMarchNewell 11 months ago
Remote viewers are used to locate missing persons, weapons of mass destruction and much much more.... I do not think that the possibility of former civilizations possibly having been on the moon or Mars mean that JS or BY were prophets. That they made up something that later turns out to have some validity does not make them seers.... (There's no evidence that those civilizations dressed like Quakers...) I have even seen Nasa video footage that shows spaceships coming and going from the Sun!
MaryMarchNewell 11 months ago
I had not attempted to prove the validity of the B of M to you. Although the book is impressive. I find it difficult to belief that one man made it up on his own. Wherever he got it from, I think it must have been somewhat inspired. That he found this book and was in possession of it, does not necessarily make him a prophet, and it certainly doesn't make him infalible. But what "coins" are you referring to? I don't know of any "coins" that are mentioned in conjunction with the B of M.
MaryMarchNewell 11 months ago
Since you won't accept any video evidence, in order to give you the real goods, I would have to TAKE YOU THERE... I can't accomplish that physically. However I encourage you to look into Technical Remote Viewing. It is a way to view things that are at a distance without physically relocating yourself. Remote viewers do a lot of work for/ with the government, and some of the targets that they have done and data that they received are publically available. Remote viewers are used to locate
MaryMarchNewell 11 months ago
The Adam God Doctrine is something that can be refuted as it is NOT taught any longer. The LDS position on who exactly Jesus was has entirely changed... Those are valid points. However, when referring to the moon, you actually lend credibility to BY. There has been MUCH evidence of a former civilization found on the moon, as well as much built there by our government presently!
MaryMarchNewell 11 months ago
@MaryMarchNewell "Prove it with facts please, not trait comparison techniques that mormons like to use to try to prove almost anything, but in reality prove nothing. I want solid facts of a moon civilization from you, not hokus pokus youtube videos on conspiracy of aliens videos. Give me the real goods please. Please show me one shred of evidence that the B of M is true by archeology. Please get one coin, just one that was mentioned of the many in the BofM.
moronigoldenplates 11 months ago
@MaryMarchNewell LOL are you serious??????
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man Yes, very much sooo... I an convinced of evidence of people having previously lived on the moon and on Mars, and possibly a few still being there. The sun is merely speculation, however just because the environment there would destroy US in our present state, doesn't mean that there aren't some species/ beings for whom that environment is suitable. Watch the extra footage of the "premonition" movie starring Sandra Bullock. They interview a professional remote viewer. The governme
MaryMarchNewell 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man The government formerly trained and now hires Remote Viewers to find missing persons, locate weapons of mass destruction, as well as investigate anomolies on Mars and the Moon, I have read their findings on several of those anomolies as well as crop circles... Have you seen "Men who stare at Goats"? Truth is stranger than fiction my friend... stranger than fiction... However JS likely was certain that no one would ever be able to prove him right OR wrong...
MaryMarchNewell 4 months ago
@MaryMarchNewell That is circular reasoning at best and with that "logic" you can "prove" anything. Fact is Joe and Brighame were false prophets(all you need is one to qualify just like a murderer or rapist etc..)so you see there are no "hey well will give him that one" nooooo not when you are talking Biblical prophets, only cult prophets get that just like the Watchtower, Heavens Gate etc.....you would flunk a logic or theology with your nutty reasoning.
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man I'm not arguing with you about them being false prophets, and there are multiple examples... I'm just opening up your mind to what may possibly be on the moon, Mars and other planets... What circular reasoning? I agree that they made up what they said, assuming that no one would ever find out one way or the other...Every once in a while, when you make enough predictions, you hit a few:)
MaryMarchNewell 4 months ago
@MaryMarchNewell That is fine for a someone to hit and miss except for someone claiming to be a prophet in the Biblical tradition, that yardstick is 100% or you were stoned to death back then.As far as other worlds and such yeah it's possible in fact I propose like Allen Hynek and Jaques Valle believed they are multidimensional things and if you read Michio Kaku in his books he talks about it dimensions. All this has nothing to do with B. Young who was a con man like J. Smith with tall tales.
Gideon6640man 4 months ago
@Gideon6640man I absolutely agree! Also, I am very inclined to agree with the multiple dimensions...There's an interesting vid here called : Time travel with proof , its not too long, check it out! JS taught that a prophet is only a prophet WHEN he is prophecying, at all other times he is a normal man!!!
MaryMarchNewell 4 months ago
@MaryMarchNewell
2 Nephi 9: 34
“Wo unto the liar, for he shall be thrust down to hell.”
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@imtherealthing Again false witness. I haven't lied more than 4 times my entire life, and those as a child! I'm NOT anti-Mormon, I AM Mormon as are most of those I've known my entire life! I certainly don't hate my friends and family... I LOVE TRUTH, and I follow the trail of truth wherever it leads. Those that assume they have all truth grow complacent in their ignorance and BLIND in their minds, they won't look for truth, and so will never find it...
MaryMarchNewell 4 months ago
@MaryMarchNewell
TRINITY
Here is a scholarly proof of your corrupted, man-made Trinity. The Encyclopedia Americana: "Christianity derived from Judaism and Judaism was strictly Unitarian [believing that God is one person]. The road which led from Jerusalem to Nicaea was scarcely a straight one. Fourth century Trinitarianism did not reflect accurately early Christian teaching regarding the nature of God; it was, on the contrary, a deviation from this teaching." -- (1956), Vol. XXVII, p. 294L.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@imtherealthing I don't believe in the Trinity... I don't know why you direct this at me... However D&C 88 states that "God is IN and OF and THROUGH ALL things...." We are ALL ONE... try arguing with your own scriptures on that;)
MaryMarchNewell 1 month ago
@MaryMarchNewell
Acts 7:51-53
“Ye STIFFNECKED and uncircumcised IN HEART and EARS, YE DO ALWAYS RESIST the HOLY GHOST: as your fathers did, SO DO YE.
Which of the PROPHETS have not your fathers PERSECUTED and they have slain them which shewed before of the coming of the Just One; of whom ye have been now the betrayers and murderers:
Who have RECIEVED the law BY THE DISPOSITION OF ANGELS, and have NOT KEPT IT”.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@imtherealthing Now you are breaking the commandments by BEARING FALSE WITNESS AGAINST YOUR NEIGHBOR... You tread on very dangerous ground when you take it upon yourself to judge me, who you know not at all!!! I'd hate to be measured by your yardstick on judgment day, as you will be... You have yet to know and feel the HOLY GHOST! The little trickle you occassionally get in testimony meeting is NOTHING compared to the HEALING DIVINE LOVE that is waiting for you...
MaryMarchNewell 4 months ago
@MaryMarchNewell
RE :USING EXTRA-SCRIPTURAL SOURCES IN LDS THEOLOGY
LDS theology is only based on the following:
The Bible
The Book of Mormon
The D&C
The PofGP
And General Conferance talks that eventually get sustained as revelation to be binding on the saints (i.e. The Proclamation to the World)
These are called the STANDARD WORKS - and if it doesn't come from any of these..then it is just speculation and "theory" - not doctrine nor binding on the saints.
imtherealthing 4 months ago
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@MaryMarchNewell
John 3:16
For God so loved the world, that he GAVE "his" ONLY "BEGOTTEN SON", that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting ilife.
How much more clearer can one get? Was he begotten or not?..was Jesus a liar? This scripture is known by almost everyone..surprised you: "[had] gone through [your] bible and [couldn't] can't find one"
imtherealthing 4 months ago
@MaryMarchNewell
RE: Isa. 43:10
The Jews were first polytheistic then they shifted to henotheism then later into monotheism in the context of thier Babylonian captivity. In this CONTEXT it was the practice of the time in Babylon to have a community altar to put all the IDOLS which were "FORMED" (of wood/silver/gold) on this altar..Jehovah's idol also was put on this altar. Jehovah said that this should not be the case to put "BEFORE" HIM these FALSE gods.
That is the context. FALSE gods
imtherealthing 4 months ago