LOL if the borg are 1 mind then that means all darth vader/emperor have to do is use force currupt on the borg or a jedi mind trick on the borg and make the Borg there imperial bitch..
LOL you used star wars ideas on a star trek ship. Borg don't have a hole you can just fire into and have it explode. lol, star wars is so weak and closed minded. Typical low quality video by a low quality movie.
okay before all the star trek fags get all alpha quadrant on me i must ONE thing.................do not be so proud of your bubble shields the power of your Galaxy Class Starships are insignificant to the power of the FORCE
this was funny. Even if you grant that this one cube was destroyed the real danger is now that they(the Borg) are aware of their existance (galactic empire) they will be coming and would've already have adapted to the empires tech...It will soon be part of the collective. Resistance IS futile..........
its nice to see the idiot trolls farion and onlysuckstobeme are still out here wanking off to straw wars. for a REAL COMPARISON OF TECH between the two franchises got to starfleet jedl.com and read. enjoy..........................
@onlypeaceindeath And as for transporters not working, transporters can beam through shields if they are low enough. It is 20% power for the Star Trek universe, so if you shields don't match that power level, even at full shields transporters would work. However the main defence of the Empire is their armor not shield and transporters work fine through armor, no matter how thick. They have used transporters to beam people to the center of planets before, so I doubt the armor will stop them.
@onlypeaceindeath Then why is it that Han Solo say his ship the Millenium Falcon is the fastest ship at a top speed of .5 over lightspeed. Warp 1 is lightspeed in Star Trek, so he goes Warp 1.5, not nearly the speed of any starfleet ship.
@idazmi7 "with what?" did you heard force power called force disabledroid that means it deativates droids witch means the borg are fucked since they rely on nanoprobes and there technology crap
The Federation could easily destroy the entire empire. They don't even need to use weapons. The Federation's cruising speed is warp 4, warp 1 is as fast as the Empire can go, so any Star Wars ship can easily outmaneuver any destroyer. But the winning technology Star Trek has is transporters. Even Darth Vader can't survive in the core of a planet, or out in the middle of space. With a click of a button the entire crew would no longer be on the destroyer/deathstar.
@leonardjohn76 The Empire is a society 100,000 years more advanced than the Federation or the Borg. A single Star Destroyer carries more firepower than the entire Federation, and it's shields are 1,000,000 times more powerful than the Enterprises. It's not even a fight, it's a slaughter.
@theemrpoint123 Engineers have studied the movies and the TV shows, done the math, and those are the results. Sorry to burst your bubble boy, but the Empire is as far advanced over the Federation as we are over Stone Age man. (Pre-Clovis Point stone age man)
@leonardjohn76 Wrong. In Return of the Jedi the Rebel fleet covered hundreds of lightyears in roughly six minutes (i checked the time myself, and the hundreds of lightyears comes from the novelization), which puts the speed roughly between 0.5-2 lightyears per second. And transporters are useless. They can't be used in relatively weak EM fields, can't pass through shields and dense materials. As an offensive weapon it simply sucks.
The Borg would win... they assimilate at an alarming rate... they know everything... they could tear holes in subspace and let Species 8472 raise hell on the Empire... they can assimilate the Death Star and use it to destroy all... They can travel back in time and destroy everything in their path... Resistance Is Futile.
Star Destroyers have 60 turbo-"lasers", which are NOT rapid-fire. (SW:ANH) They carry 72 sublight fighters, and 5000 troops. Star Destroyers are not ray-shielded, only Star Dreadnaughts. They are made of Durasteel, which is only 1/3 neutronium, (SW:ACS) not enough to deflect phasers. They can bombard localized planetary targets, but prefer invasion.
The smallest Star Trek ships are therfore equivalent to Star Dreadnaughts.
the borg would win hands down the borg would teleport several hundred drones into the death star infect the entire mainframe wiht nanaoprobe thus assimilating the technology then assimilating the troopers and any other resistance and then darth vader and sidious themselves resistance is futile we are borg
Seeing that a single star destroyer can make the whole surface of an Earth-like world into lava--in under an hour, too--it is safe to write that the Galactic Empire will squash the Borg like ants. Sad, but true.
Now then, peoples. The Borg Cubes are powerful- in the Star Trek universe. However, the Borg themselves in a gun battle could easily win, as they could adapt to any gun blast from the Empire. (Also Star Trek is better in terms of TV shows)
Considering how star trek specifically mentions how weak and out dated lasers are, i don't think the Borg would even need to modulate their shields. xD Not to mention, Storm Troopers are apparently really easy to take down in the first place.
Death star blows up anything it is fired at... PERIOD. I love both Star Trek and Star Wars, and will happily admit that in ship to ship engagements, Trek has the superior technology. The Borg couldn't adapt to a simple solar flare enveloping their ship, or combined fire from a fleet (Han mentioned the ENTIRE Imperial fleet couldn't muster the firepower to blow up a planet ) what makes you think they could stand any chance of withstanding the awesome power of the Death Star???
@tobiasbrahms Enterprise has survived multiple direct hits at full power from TWO different energy-based planet crushing weapons: Nomad and the Planet Killer.
@TeknomanScimitar You're kidding right? It's far too powerful for any technology that the Borg have. It has the power of a few exploding stars, so a cube can't adapt to that kind of power.
The Borg can adapt to the frequency of the electro magnetic radiation from energy weapons,all the Borg have to do is beam over on to the Death Star and take over their technology,but the Borg don't have powers of the force like Darth Vader does,another problem with the light sabers ,the Borg can adapt to the to the frequency of the electro magnetic radiation from energy weapons and the light sabers,conclusion,the Borg would win if the the Jedi and Sith teamed up against the Borg,they would lose.
@Drakon6956 Uh no, sorry. But there are so many things wrong with what you just said. A) Blasters have no set frequency (they are not phase coherent, they can only adapt to phase coherent energy weapons) B) Borg cannot beam through shields which again, are not phase coherent C) Borg cannot assimilate Neutronium, never have, D) Borg cannot adapt to sheer power, and since Lightsabers can cut through neutronium like a knife through butter well... The list goes on and on
Lets see the queer Dv took fifty years to create a star destroyer about the size of a Borg cube.The borg can adapt and assimulate technology while on the move in a day and probably have a Borg cube in six months all done with about half of dosen drones "Regeneration" enterprice.Yeah I'm not convince the Empire can take on billions of drones and the Queen which is actually what controls the Borg .
@VIEW8472 The Venator class Star Destroyers entered service during the clone wars, and were designed and built during it as well. That's roughly a year between drawing board and mass production. Not 50, The Imperator class ships were designed during the Clone Wars and entered Service shortly after. By the time the Death Star 1 was completed they had well over 25,000 Star Destroyers, that's an average of 3 built per day.
@VIEW8472 The Death Star 2 was 900km in diameter, and took only six months to get to 60% completion. With no visible strain on the Empire's economy (it was made in secret) and with all the raw materials shipped by a single private contractor.
"Regeneration" only had the drones try to take over a primitive 22nd century ship, which they failed at. At no point was there even the slightest piece of evidence that they could have turned it into a cube.
@VIEW8472 The Empire doesn't have to take on the drones, just obliterate the fleets. Besides, that's what the Quadrillions of Troops are for, all armed with weapons the Borg could never adapt to.
The Empire outnumbers the Borg a million to one at least in the Troop/Drone ratio, and outguns them many thousands to one in the ship to ship department.
@Perion OH so now the Emprie have Quadrillions of Troops which are humans which the borg can easily assimulate which use technology and not biological technology which can also be assimulated.I still say the THE FEDERATION is more then a match for the Empire. Whast the point of sending the Borg which in this case is over kill against the empire.
@VIEW8472 The Empire always had Quadrillions, and the Borg would only be able to assimilate them if they actually were able to get to them, which between the Blasters which they could never match frequency with, to the ACP/Concussion weapons/ hell even slugthrowers that the empire use, would never happen.
You still ignore the established limits of Borg adaptation and assimilation, treating it like a comic book super power. Refusing to listen to reason.
@Perion Numbers mean nothing if you can't defeat your enemy.Unless its biological technology that the borg nano have trouble to assimulate they will and have adapted to biological technology.Unless the empire have the Apex of all bio=technology-ships in there side the Borg will adapt and assimulate period.I mean ships that have dence cells reject and destroy the borg nano probes.All i hear from your argument is that the borg will not adapt to the empires tech because u say,but no reason to supp
@VIEW8472 All I hear from your argument is that borg can adapt to any tech that is non-bio because you say so. Even though we've seen them incapable of adapting to/assimilating Neutronium, Ion Storms, Data's positronic brain/the Enterprise E's main computer, Guns, Knives, and in supplementary material energy weapons that have no set frequency.
They need to be hit by weapons or attack something to adapt to it's weapons/shields, and then only if the weapon/shields operate on a set frequency.
@Perion The Empire can beat Trek because you say so. I have never seen battledroids exploding into pieces from hand blasters save once: In AtoTC, a Destroyer Droid explodes from a blaster rifle that only "broke" smaller droids in an earlier scene. Also, Han's blaster, and all other hand blasters doesn't do NEAR that much damage as in the hangar scene- ever again. Kind of like THIS scene:
@Idazmi7 Also battle Droid reactions to blaster fire says more about A) The settings in use (possibly lower settings to conserve ammo since there are allot of the buggers, and using a higher setting against a Droideka cause, well, it's a fracking Droideka.) and/or B) the materials the Battle Droids are made out of.
@Perion I never heard of a blaster being set lower than "kill stormtrooper-level foes". I've heard stun, and kill: exactly what most people say the only phaser settings are. Also, as per my comment, starfleet uniforms seem to be capable of temporarily repelling enough power to blow someones head. Stormtrooper armor does not do that with blaster fire, no matter what unsaid "setting" the blaster is on.
@Idazmi7 Uh, no, there's zero evidence that Starfleet uniforms provide any sort of protection whatsoever, let alone against firepower like that. Phasers and Disruptors operate via chain reaction anyhow. It's clear that the bizarre and unique reaction was due to the Bluegill parasite's affect on LC Remmick.
Since when do "most" people say that there are only two phaser settings when in TNG more are mentioned constantly, with 16 being the highest.
@Perion Why did his head explode then? Analyse your arguement. Uniform? no Explodie. Head? Explodie. Parasite? Would have also protected his obviously fragile head.
@Idazmi7 Blasters have a wide range of settings, low enough ones can be used to light a cigar or burn the skin off their bones as a means of torture. The films themselves show several settings during firefights, as not all impacts, even to the same surface, cause as large explosions as others. They also seem to be able to switch settings very quickly, by the flip of a switch like a fire selection system on modern assault rifles and SMGs. Rather than the cumbersome button mashing of Phasers.
@Perion Just cause you say so. Again, I've never heard of it, even in most of the novels. Darksaber's statements on "off-axis firing" make more sense than what you just said, as it is SEEN. (The "off-axis firing" was just the editors making up for the actor's poor aim. You are just making up for Star Wars not seemingly posessing Star Trek level tech.) Beyond A New Hope I have never seen switch-flipping on blasters. Switching blasters to stun IS cumbersome: the dead stormtrooper can testify.
@Idazmi7You mean the guy who was shot barely a second after saying it? that's hardly evidence of it being cumbersome since none of them were observed fiddling with the blaster to set it to stun, which more than suggests a simple and easy mechanism that doesn't require you to take the weapon off target and press stuff like we always see with a phaser when they change settings. The closest real life analogy to switching settings is a fire selection switch, which is a simple thumb switch.
@Idazmi7 That's because people in trek actually wait for them to finish fiddling, where as he was killed no sooner than he had finished giving the order and Leia had the sense to shoot him right away.
@Idazmi7 As a result, a switch flip is the most logical mechanism, such a mechanism is even described early on in "Shadows of the Empire".
Beyond a New hope we never see them use stun, and we never actually see the flipping to stun on screen, and again we see several settings during firefights from the variety of impact scales (usually 2 or 3 different scales of blasts, each consistent with one another and different from the other scales) on the same surface material.
@Idazmi7 There are also times where they say "Set Blasters on Full!" in the EU. The common depiction is that Blasters have 4 standard settings, with additional settings such as the super low ones I described before being available with a bit more work, but the standard settings include Stun, Low power, Med power, and Full. The kind that hit leia in the arm was clearly low, (little to no different from the hit to Crusher's arm in "datalore") while other, explosion causing ones are med and high.
@Idazmi7 So now that I proved you wrong you immediately try to cry "warsie conspiracy" really? Set phasers on full may have came before, but that doesn't mean it came first much less that Wars "copied" it as some means to "defend". Honestly that's just paranoid delusion. The writers just feel that Blasters would have power settings because practically all energy weapons in sci-fi pre and post trek have them too. In all honesty there is zero reason to assume they shouldn't have them anyhow.
@Perion But they don't. EU means Expanded Universe. I would absolutely LOVE to get another response from the films (eg, the canon): but the films are wimpy on the sci-fi scale of visible damage with the Death Star and lightsabers as the only exception. Let's see a few scientific "explanations" for Star Wars:
Turbolasers are plasma blasts that explodes with 22 kiloton force
Lighsabers are "arc waves"
/watch?v=mj1j-Fl0ixo This is why the fans even try to give it scientific grounding.
@Idazmi7 Uh, no. again we see point defense guns releasing multimegaton level energy on screen in Empire Strikes Back when they vapourize asteroids. as well as Seismic Charges do 12 gigatons worth of damage.
Don't give me that EU isn't canon nonsense, It's C Canon and S Canon but it doesn't even come close to any sort of direct contradictions with G Canon.
@Perion The beat-up, constantly breaking down freighter Millenium Falcon has better shields than a Star Destroyer? Gosh! o_O
I guess Echo Base was miles underground then, to only have a few ice cave collapses. Not to mention that those asteroids were only Falcon size! i didn't know it took nukes to blow rocks only 35 feet long!
@Perion Dude everything that they borg can't adapt to is in Star trek Not the Empire.Where is your argument? because none of that tech is in the Empire because they never explain how shit works in Star wars its all based on Magic.
@VIEW8472 Actually, they do explain quite a few mechanisms in Star Wars, Starship hulls are made out of Neutronium for one. A common droid's nanoprocessor is capable of at least 3 orders of magnitude greater performance than Data is, and while Data is unique droids use the same technology as ship computers. The Empire employ a wide arsenal of weapons, each opperating on different principles, many are KEW or fire physical projectiles such as Gauss/Rail guns and even slugthrowers.
@Perion Neutronium in completely neutral to Newtonian Physics. A Star Destroyer "made" out of Neutronium would not be impacted by ANY weapon, blaster or not.
@Perion U may be able to get one or two shots in but after that the borg scan and adapt technology to there own the only technology they have trouble with scaning is bio-tech and thats where the nano probes and drones get beam onto the ships and inject nano probes to assimulate.Yes borg ships can adapt to tech- just by scanning it watch the first encounter between the Enterprice and the borg.
@VIEW8472 Again the nano probes have limits that have been established that you are ignoring (such as the fact that they only work on assimilating devices that aren't too advanced) you simply repeat the same thing even after I proved you wrong like a broken, debunked record.
We've seen them incapable of assimilating or adapting to natural, non biological phenomenon, as well as still being vulnerable (though with increased resilience) to the things they can adapt to.
@Idazmi7 Pretty much Everything in that comment you just made is wrong. Your obvious bias and wilful misunderstanding of pretty much everything related to star wars, as well as refusal to learn or accept facts and instead ignorantly disregarding them as fabrications or whatever you find convenient. As a result of this behaviour I see no reason to humour you any further, you've made your decision and are clearly here only to troll, not for any mature discussion.
@Perion The "quadrillions" plus Death Star II were STILL beat by a 40 ship fleet, a noobish admiral, a half-trained Jedi, and teddy-bear people. What? Ewoks aren't teddy bear people? Perhaps Lucas *should* have gone with the "Wookie homeworld" idea!
@Idazmi7 Pretty much everything in that comment you just made is wrong. Your obvious bias and wilful misunderstanding of pretty much everything related to star wars, as well as refusal to learn or accept facts and instead ignorantly disregarding them as fabrications or whatever you find convenient. As a result of this behaviour I see no reason to humour you any further, you've made your decision and are clearly here only to troll, not for any mature discussion.
The borg can adapt any kind of technology to there own and use it against them not even lightsabers would save u.The Borg ships are almost the same size as the star destroyer and they have thousands not to mention tactical ships design just for war.They are so powerful they tried to conquer another species because they are that powerful.One borg ship is known bring down fleets.YEAH RIGHT!!Star fleet has a better chance then the QUEER EMPIRE.
@VIEW8472 The SW fanboys refuse to accept that the Borg may be able to adapt to their firepower. It just blows their minds that anyone can contend with DV and the Empire.
@stiehler1117 Sorry, but we see no reason to assume the Borg can adapt to their firepower when we look at all the other things they cannot adapt to, while every reason to say they could not. You simply jump to conclusions about people's motives that suit your ends.
@stiehler111 They don't get the consept of the borg adapt to any technology except biological and even then they just take longer to adapt while they are understanding it.Storm troopers are strong but when the borg carry personal shields that adapt to weapons that makes them pretty useless.
@Perion Unless its biological technology the borg will adapt and the empire isnt species 8472. I haven't seen a single species in the empire that uses living ships as weapons.I watch both shows not just one and i'm basing it on what I know from both shows not just one sided.
@VIEW8472 Sorry but Biological technology isn't the only thing they cannot adapt to. And you clearly haven't heard of the, Sekotans the Yuuzhan Vong, the Lurrians etc.
Also they cannot adapt to
Ion Storms (Voyager: Dark Frontier)
Kinetic Impacts (Star Trek: First Contact)
Overwhelming Firepower (Star Trek: First Contact again)
Phase coherent energy weapons that they haven't matched frequency with (every time they show up)
@Perion no they dont, there is not ONE cannoncal reference to any of these technologies you are referencing at all. just more made up bullshit by farion.
@VIEW8472 Technology that the borg cannot assimilate
Neutronium (Voyager: Think Tank)
Positronic Brains (Once again, Star Trek: First Contact)
The Empire use Quantum Computers, and their droids have much higher computational performance levels than Data (comparing the Synthetech AA One Nanoprocessor described in "Medstar II: Jedi Healer" to Data's stated capabilities in "TNG: Measure of a man")
@Perio The key to the Borgs ability to adapt to technology is its nano probes and nano probes can be reprogram to adapt to biological being species and weaposn.Scorpian voyager.
@VIEW8472 And the Borg couldn't reprogram them to adapt to The Undine (Species 8472) without help from Voyager, not only that, but again you ignore the list of their limitations along with which episode that limitation was shown. IE the Limitations of what their nanoprobes can or cannot assimilate.
Also Adaptation to threats has nothing to do with the Nanoprobes.
Again Borg Adaptation and Assimilation are not super powers, nor do they magically have no limits.
Hell, the Rebels were able to defeat the Empire while outgunned and out numbered. I would have to say the Federation could at least match the firepower of the Rebel forces.
@stiehler1117 Of course the Empire's power has limits, but it's firmly beyond the limits of the Borg, Federation, Dominion, etc.
Again the Rebels won because Palpatine bet the farm on Luke, then bought the farm thanks to Vader
As for the Federation/Rebellion comparison? Not even close, a single Nebulon B frigate, or even Corvette, would be able to wipe out all of Starfleet if it wished, let alone an Assault Frigate, and never mind a Mon Calamari Cruiser.
@stiehler1117 I don't recall debating with you about Q recently, but there is zero evidence to suggest that Q would get involved. And plenty of evidence that Q wouldn't care to bother.
@Perion you made it personal troll when we were debating. still would love to meet up with you at the san diego comic con. a 27 year old canadian is not match for any american ever.....................LOL
@stiehler1117 Because as Q put it, they had potential, but they never saved humanity from any of the threats that were about to wipe them out, not even in the timelines where they DID.
Also it's important to note that the Empire are run by humans as well, so as far as the Q would be concerned this would bear little difference to a federation civil war as far as taking sides go.
@Idazmi7 Because he's wrong, The Empire uses Hypermatter not Nuclear Fusion, and btw, Deep Space Nine uses Nuclear Fusion and has more powerful shields and Phasers than any Matter/Antimatter equipped Federation vessel.
@Idazmi7 It does however have a Wookieepedia page, and is part of the Star Wars canon whether you like it or not. Also SDN is vastly superior to St-v-sw.net.
@Perion The last statement about SDN was bold stupid. I'm willing to accept correction, but I will not accept a straightforward immature "SW pwns ST" fansite. Hypermatter = okay. SDN = Lies and Unsupported Illogical Reasoning.
@Idazmi7 So you'd prefer a site that's dishonest while pretending to be an unbiased objective comparison? Sorry but Darkstar's antics have been exposed by a great many people, including but not limited to, The people of Something Awful.com (where they had him for one of their Awful Links of the day articles in 2003) employees of Lucasfilm, and Employees of Paramount/CBS who he argued with on the rules of what is canon and what isn't. With the very people who made said rules in the first place.
@Idazmi7 Honestly if you can't see how obvious it is, between the random filibustering and double talk, then I don't see why I should bother filling this comments page with all the examples. Believe it or not I have better things to do.
@Perion Then don't. You're the one who replied to my "double talk". Show it to me. I see no "filibustering" on that site. All I saw on the one you provided was "reasons why Star Wars ships win" with NO EXAMPLES and a forum that will instantly flame any Trek-fan, whether or not he/she has said anything. Someone should expose THAT one. Meanwhile, send me an obvious lie on that site.
@Idazmi7 More nonsensical parts you mean, I've read through it already, long ago. The thing about Darkstar is that he has a way of trying to use a veneer of civility and buzzwords to try and make his arguments sound plausible, but they don't hold an ounce of water.
One of my favourites is how he goes at length talking about the sunrise/sunset thing for his Tatooine to Geonosis "calcs". While completely forgetting that both Mace and Yoda arrived not long after, Yoda making a stop over at Kamino.
@Perion But again I have no interest in discussing this SDN vs Darkstar's site, his antics and arguments have been torn to shreds so many times it's sad.
If you bought into his nonsense, well that's all she wrote really.
@Idazmi7 provide visual reference? wow, so basically you're under the impression that I'm just making this up or whatnot eh? Honestly I don't see any reason to bother.
What the Ewok trees are is irrelevant, as usual Darkstar goes to great lengths to calculate stuff that has no bearing on what he is trying to prove (again the Tatooine to Geonosis example) an AT-ST is little more than a Jeep with legs, or at best, a Humvee with legs, both of those are notoriously easy to destroy.
@Perion You ARE making it up. I searched the archives for you on each link. You're afraid other YouTubers will use them, so you state me as a liar. Give me one verified statement on SDN.
@Idazmi7 Sorry, but your accusations mean nothing. Again, I don't feel like digging through old forum posts to find them, it took long enough doing that years ago, let alone now. I see no reason to just to placate your doubts. I know I'm right, and at this point, that's enough for me.
The moment you claimed SDN was crap and Darkstar's site was good was the moment I stopped caring about your opinions.
@Perion And again, through "random filibustering" and "double talk" *YOU* fervently hope that no one uses one of the links I've posted. You're sad, man. I still searched the archives for you, and linked to the exact pages they were on, saving you the trouble of looking yourself.
st-v-sw.net/STSWblaster.html
Blasters suck, and you cannot prove me wrong. You will most likely post an un-creative reason why you have "better things to do", while ignoring the fact that you bothered to reply. ^_^
@Idazmi7 Doesn't take long to bother with a short reply, I considered it a courtesy, but clearly you are hell bent on misinterpreting whatever you please to suit your own ends.
If people go to the links you post they will either A) see how full of it Darkstar is, or B) buy into his paranoid delusions and utter nonsense. Either way I don't care. If you keep up this behaviour, then I won't see any reason to dignify it with a response.
@Idazmi7 You also share Darkstar's bizarre tendency to think he is winning a debate when in fact he is failing horribly.
I noticed that all you are doing is mindlessly linking to pages that have been debunked nearly a decade ago, and are completely unaware that obviously, darkstar's argument with people such as mike sussman are not on his page. I saw the debate once before, on an Official Star Trek forum, but like I said I can't be arsed to look up a forum thread from over 5 years ago.
@Perion uhh from what the rest of the sci fi community is saying you are losing. there are many more sites that are pro trek then pro wars now. i told you two years ago that the movement was going to come about face and it has. people are waking up and standing up to that idiot wong and all of his silly goons.
@TheSundown2010 You are acting as though this is some kind of war, or conspiracy or other such nonsense. Rather than differing viewpoints based on the evidence at hand, some accept the evidence others do not (such as those who discount the EU in spite of it's place in the canon.) You threaten me with physical violence, dig through comments, insult the side you don't agree with, regardless of relevance and yet you say I am the one with no life.
@Perion And it almost IS a conspiracy. You trolls cannot accept Star Wars being inferior in any way, including nonsensical "firepower estimates". Just because there are a lot of fans that agree with you, 5551 people is still not even near the whole Star Wars- or Star Trek -fanbase, nor is it an important number in any realistic sense. Either way: Star Wars demonstrates absolutely none of the firepower, mobility, or intelligence you typically speak of.
Also you clearly still don't understand, the argument Darkstar made was on the trek forums against people such as Mike Sussman (about an episode he wrote by the way) not on Darkstar's own site. However since that was years ago I don't feel like scouring through forums to find it.
@Perion Destroyed by what? You just proved that the renegade Han Solo has better tech than the Empire, just to fight me. Either that, or Leia is much tougher than any "ferrocite". (Never heard that term in the movies...)
@Idazmi7 Blasters have settings just like practically any other sci-fi Energy weapon, using one type of setting over another for all sorts of various reasons. However, we've seen a hand phaser on the "legendary" setting 16 in the TNG episode "Chain of Command Part 1" where it takes 3 solid seconds to disintegrate a dozen or so cubic inches of Granite.
bbs,stardestroyer,net/viewtopic,php?f=40&t=97649&sid=aa0e5e6522e9e36f5e50d1251ef47c0e&start=100 Shows quite a few examples of Blaster firepower.
@Idazmi7 Also because I'm being honest, as well as the fact that I don't feel like digging through archives to find the debate in question. As I said, I have better things to do.
@Perion yeah torn apart by people who have no real evidence on the subject matter. wong and everyone there twist every fact on its end so bad that most people just laugh at the credibility of that site. hey perion why dont you go to starfleet jedi and debate with those guys. LOL
@TheSundown2010 Because I've compared the two, and I disagree with your assertion, also the fact that you claim that "most people" would be a considerable exaggeration. "most people" don't care about the debate at all, and if you really want to compare numbers in terms of how many people are on either site, well, a quick look at the member lists makes things rather clear.
@Perion So you are a popular asshole. Doesn't change fact: the fact is SDN is not a "credible" resource to anything. They use non-canon data from non-canon sources as well as make stuff up on the fly. The defunct "Turbolaser Comentaries" is a perfect example: It does not take that much to melt a 30 meter asteroid made of "rusted iron". How Iron would "rust" in space is another matter.
The parent asteroid in that scene was definitely hollow rock, thus neccesitation a re-calculation anyway.
@Perion At least Starfleet Jedi cites resources to Star Trek episodes, instead of unilaterally stating Star Trek to be inferior without giving any reasons as to why.
StarDestroyer[dot]net doesn't even give ANY tactical details to any single Star Wars vessel! I'd expect to at least learn about Star Destroyers on a site called Star Destroyer. Seems *odd* that I can only find "Turbolaser" fanwankery, and a very biased forum.
@Idazmi7 According to the Imperial Wiki, a Star Destroyer is smaller than a Star Cruiser, and bigger than a Star Frigate.
My question: What, then, are the Venator and Executor Star Destroyers??? The Executor is bigger than the typical (Imperator class) Star Destroyer. The Venator is smaller. That means that the info in the Imperial Wiki is nothing but made-up crap. Nice to know, Mike Wong says it goes all the way up to the imaginary Star Dreadnaught, which is never seen or implied anywhere.
@Idazmi7 Simply put, no other information exists on that site at all. And since there is no real explanation of Star Trek technology, how in the name of heck is it possible to accept it's over-generalized statements?
Example: Starfleet Ground Combat technology. We hear of little compared to Star Wars. Why?
/watch?v=QN2ZrTpvIss
Because Alpha Quadrant races can level CONTINENTS in scarce seconds with just a few ships. They state: 30 percent of CRUST destroyed. Not 30 percent of the water.
@Idazmi7 In addition, the starfighters that show up later are from a higher tech faction: they can easily destroy Galaxy Class Starships, which are extremely powerful:
/watch?v=d734afLFPds
The only Galaxy Class ships that were EVER destroyed, out of the 40+ that were made, were killed by Dominion ships, or lame plot devices like "invulnerable shields"
/watch?v=H_XbWq49vUM
Star Destroyers are routienely killed by much less. Rebel ships are weaker than SD's:
@Idazmi7 And if you claim "super shielding" to explain the laughably innefective heavy guns in that scene this is just for you.
/watch?v=lchA-lwqrPw&feature=related
No shields at all. The fact is, Star Wars' Original Trilogy just didn't have the special effects material to show flying debris on every shot, and the only shield mentioned on the SSD is the "Bridge Deflector shield" ergo, only the command deck is protected.
@Idazmi7 Here are even MORE shield examples from Star Trek:
/watch?v=-CEgqKh8t8k&feature=related - Skin tight shields, like the fake ones on Star Destroyers
/watch?v=FZWI2cxKXLg&feature=related - "Bubble" shields, like most people expect from Star Trek.
watch?v=MJZbCNexctc
/watch?v=qjRFYOcT1WU&feature=related - The Soverign Class switches shields from one to the other, it may have both, but that seems sketchy. Either way: it has shields.
@TheSundown2010 the star wars guns look real tough.......... LOL they arnt even megaton level events. where are those 200 gt shots. there arnt any thoughout the entire 6 movies. except for the death star shooting at the rebel fleet. not once have i seen an event that puts out 200 gigaton shots. not from one ssd.......EVER.
@TheSundown2010 so perion and all other warsies. come and show me any visual reference that is cannon. that show me the legendary 200 gt shot. give me one. and the esb asteriod scene was debunked a long time ago. explain to me why if your ships are so tough, then why general grevious ship broke up in a simple atmosheric reentry. or why a simple asteriod smashed the avengers bridge off in the empire strikes back.
@Idazmi7 yet in star trek we see events that hit the 500 megaton to 20 gigaton range easily. yes the tech manual does state 64 megaton photon torpedo yeild. but it is trumped by the effects that are visually shown by the movies and tv. why? because these are the rules of cannon. written cannon is ALWAYS trumped by visual effect.
The Empire would crush the Borg. Darktroopers FTW
eightball6219 1 week ago
LOL if the borg are 1 mind then that means all darth vader/emperor have to do is use force currupt on the borg or a jedi mind trick on the borg and make the Borg there imperial bitch..
187bobafett 1 week ago
@187bobafett Idiot..
MyHelloman123 6 hours ago
This is bullshit The Borg would wipe out The Empire
jokershawn1 1 week ago
LOL you used star wars ideas on a star trek ship. Borg don't have a hole you can just fire into and have it explode. lol, star wars is so weak and closed minded. Typical low quality video by a low quality movie.
kylertornow 3 weeks ago
2:59 Death Star On The Borg Cube Xd
justinpatrick550 4 weeks ago
okay before all the star trek fags get all alpha quadrant on me i must ONE thing.................do not be so proud of your bubble shields the power of your Galaxy Class Starships are insignificant to the power of the FORCE
papatub154 1 month ago
this was funny. Even if you grant that this one cube was destroyed the real danger is now that they(the Borg) are aware of their existance (galactic empire) they will be coming and would've already have adapted to the empires tech...It will soon be part of the collective. Resistance IS futile..........
ryckless1 1 month ago
its nice to see the idiot trolls farion and onlysuckstobeme are still out here wanking off to straw wars. for a REAL COMPARISON OF TECH between the two franchises got to starfleet jedl.com and read. enjoy..........................
TheSundown2010 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath And as for transporters not working, transporters can beam through shields if they are low enough. It is 20% power for the Star Trek universe, so if you shields don't match that power level, even at full shields transporters would work. However the main defence of the Empire is their armor not shield and transporters work fine through armor, no matter how thick. They have used transporters to beam people to the center of planets before, so I doubt the armor will stop them.
leonardjohn76 1 month ago
@onlypeaceindeath Then why is it that Han Solo say his ship the Millenium Falcon is the fastest ship at a top speed of .5 over lightspeed. Warp 1 is lightspeed in Star Trek, so he goes Warp 1.5, not nearly the speed of any starfleet ship.
leonardjohn76 1 month ago
@idazmi7 "with what?" did you heard force power called force disabledroid that means it deativates droids witch means the borg are fucked since they rely on nanoprobes and there technology crap
187bobafett 1 month ago
@187bobafett Droids are less than borg
Idazmi7 1 month ago
The Federation could easily destroy the entire empire. They don't even need to use weapons. The Federation's cruising speed is warp 4, warp 1 is as fast as the Empire can go, so any Star Wars ship can easily outmaneuver any destroyer. But the winning technology Star Trek has is transporters. Even Darth Vader can't survive in the core of a planet, or out in the middle of space. With a click of a button the entire crew would no longer be on the destroyer/deathstar.
leonardjohn76 1 month ago
@leonardjohn76 Not to mention transporter bombs.
Picard: "Beam a photon torpedo onto their bridge, Mr. O'brien"
Vader: "You do not know the power of the DARK side..!"
(torpedo arrives)
Vader: "No..."
(torpedo timer reaches zero)
Vader: "NOOOOOOO!!!"
(boom)
Idazmi7 1 month ago
@leonardjohn76 The Empire is a society 100,000 years more advanced than the Federation or the Borg. A single Star Destroyer carries more firepower than the entire Federation, and it's shields are 1,000,000 times more powerful than the Enterprises. It's not even a fight, it's a slaughter.
mrthebillman 1 month ago
@mrthebillman Says what?
Idazmi7 1 month ago
@mrthebillman Now fuck that shit nerd
theemrpoint123 1 month ago
@theemrpoint123 Ouch! What a reply, how will I recover?
mrthebillman 1 month ago
@mrthebillman But really fuck that shit man nothing with lasers can't be 1,000,000 times more powerful than antimatter weapons or something...
theemrpoint123 1 month ago
@theemrpoint123 Engineers have studied the movies and the TV shows, done the math, and those are the results. Sorry to burst your bubble boy, but the Empire is as far advanced over the Federation as we are over Stone Age man. (Pre-Clovis Point stone age man)
mrthebillman 1 month ago
@mrthebillman Let's forget about the techs and enjoy the video, Eh?
theemrpoint123 1 month ago
@leonardjohn76 Wrong. In Return of the Jedi the Rebel fleet covered hundreds of lightyears in roughly six minutes (i checked the time myself, and the hundreds of lightyears comes from the novelization), which puts the speed roughly between 0.5-2 lightyears per second. And transporters are useless. They can't be used in relatively weak EM fields, can't pass through shields and dense materials. As an offensive weapon it simply sucks.
onlypeaceindeath 1 month ago
daleks own them all all you will be exterminated
190shepard 2 months ago 9
the empire would squash the borg and the federation all vader would have to do is use the force tho disable the shields and shut down all the drones
cvonbarron 2 months ago
@cvonbarron With what?
Idazmi7 2 months ago
The Borg would win... they assimilate at an alarming rate... they know everything... they could tear holes in subspace and let Species 8472 raise hell on the Empire... they can assimilate the Death Star and use it to destroy all... They can travel back in time and destroy everything in their path... Resistance Is Futile.
TheLastPieceOfBacon 2 months ago
Star Destroyers have 60 turbo-"lasers", which are NOT rapid-fire. (SW:ANH) They carry 72 sublight fighters, and 5000 troops. Star Destroyers are not ray-shielded, only Star Dreadnaughts. They are made of Durasteel, which is only 1/3 neutronium, (SW:ACS) not enough to deflect phasers. They can bombard localized planetary targets, but prefer invasion.
The smallest Star Trek ships are therfore equivalent to Star Dreadnaughts.
Idazmi7 2 months ago
Now the Dominion vs The Empire would be even more interesting.
subzerowarrior1 3 months ago
the borg would win hands down the borg would teleport several hundred drones into the death star infect the entire mainframe wiht nanaoprobe thus assimilating the technology then assimilating the troopers and any other resistance and then darth vader and sidious themselves resistance is futile we are borg
staticmunk7777 3 months ago
Of all the fan based 'match-up's' between various sci fi universes, this was one of the best.
Well done.
1tryingtoimprove 3 months ago
Seeing that a single star destroyer can make the whole surface of an Earth-like world into lava--in under an hour, too--it is safe to write that the Galactic Empire will squash the Borg like ants. Sad, but true.
DieserBenuterIstCool 4 months ago
Now then, peoples. The Borg Cubes are powerful- in the Star Trek universe. However, the Borg themselves in a gun battle could easily win, as they could adapt to any gun blast from the Empire. (Also Star Trek is better in terms of TV shows)
beedrillfreak 4 months ago
@beedrillfreak I agree.
Idazmi7 4 months ago
@beedrillfreak
Considering how star trek specifically mentions how weak and out dated lasers are, i don't think the Borg would even need to modulate their shields. xD Not to mention, Storm Troopers are apparently really easy to take down in the first place.
Vicious713 2 months ago
Death star blows up anything it is fired at... PERIOD. I love both Star Trek and Star Wars, and will happily admit that in ship to ship engagements, Trek has the superior technology. The Borg couldn't adapt to a simple solar flare enveloping their ship, or combined fire from a fleet (Han mentioned the ENTIRE Imperial fleet couldn't muster the firepower to blow up a planet ) what makes you think they could stand any chance of withstanding the awesome power of the Death Star???
tobiasbrahms 4 months ago
@tobiasbrahms Enterprise has survived multiple direct hits at full power from TWO different energy-based planet crushing weapons: Nomad and the Planet Killer.
Idazmi7 4 months ago
The Empire would lose...Vader would survive.
Guywholovesbakon 4 months ago
Star Wars wins. Death Star blows up the Borg Cube.
MrImastinker 5 months ago 12
@MrImastinker Borg ada[tation would eventually render that superlazer useless
TeknomanScimitar 5 months ago
@TeknomanScimitar You're kidding right? It's far too powerful for any technology that the Borg have. It has the power of a few exploding stars, so a cube can't adapt to that kind of power.
MrImastinker 5 months ago
@MrImastinker You do realize that the existing shielding in the startrek universe is more than capable of handling a strike of that magnitude...
hugmesillypeople 5 months ago
Lol Well this was a friendly debate.
Drakon6956 5 months ago
@Drakon6956 He's sore that he lost, lol. Everything I said made sense. I mean, wtf is G canon, S canon, or C canon? I'm confused! ;-P
Idazmi7 5 months ago
@Drakon6956
See? /watch?v=vyTxZW_2774
Idazmi7 5 months ago
The Borg can adapt to the frequency of the electro magnetic radiation from energy weapons,all the Borg have to do is beam over on to the Death Star and take over their technology,but the Borg don't have powers of the force like Darth Vader does,another problem with the light sabers ,the Borg can adapt to the to the frequency of the electro magnetic radiation from energy weapons and the light sabers,conclusion,the Borg would win if the the Jedi and Sith teamed up against the Borg,they would lose.
Drakon6956 5 months ago
@Drakon6956 Uh no, sorry. But there are so many things wrong with what you just said. A) Blasters have no set frequency (they are not phase coherent, they can only adapt to phase coherent energy weapons) B) Borg cannot beam through shields which again, are not phase coherent C) Borg cannot assimilate Neutronium, never have, D) Borg cannot adapt to sheer power, and since Lightsabers can cut through neutronium like a knife through butter well... The list goes on and on
Perion 5 months ago
@Perion Mostly due to that "warsie conspiracy" inventing ways to beat Trek in the combat area.
Idazmi7 5 months ago
Hmm? assimilate vader? I dont think so....borg would still smash the empire though.
inphasesith 5 months ago
@inphasesith Indeed.
Idazmi7 5 months ago
Lets see the queer Dv took fifty years to create a star destroyer about the size of a Borg cube.The borg can adapt and assimulate technology while on the move in a day and probably have a Borg cube in six months all done with about half of dosen drones "Regeneration" enterprice.Yeah I'm not convince the Empire can take on billions of drones and the Queen which is actually what controls the Borg .
VIEW8472 6 months ago
@VIEW8472 The Venator class Star Destroyers entered service during the clone wars, and were designed and built during it as well. That's roughly a year between drawing board and mass production. Not 50, The Imperator class ships were designed during the Clone Wars and entered Service shortly after. By the time the Death Star 1 was completed they had well over 25,000 Star Destroyers, that's an average of 3 built per day.
Perion 6 months ago
@VIEW8472 The Death Star 2 was 900km in diameter, and took only six months to get to 60% completion. With no visible strain on the Empire's economy (it was made in secret) and with all the raw materials shipped by a single private contractor.
"Regeneration" only had the drones try to take over a primitive 22nd century ship, which they failed at. At no point was there even the slightest piece of evidence that they could have turned it into a cube.
Perion 6 months ago
@VIEW8472 The Empire doesn't have to take on the drones, just obliterate the fleets. Besides, that's what the Quadrillions of Troops are for, all armed with weapons the Borg could never adapt to.
The Empire outnumbers the Borg a million to one at least in the Troop/Drone ratio, and outguns them many thousands to one in the ship to ship department.
and who or what is this "Dv"
Perion 6 months ago
@Perion OH so now the Emprie have Quadrillions of Troops which are humans which the borg can easily assimulate which use technology and not biological technology which can also be assimulated.I still say the THE FEDERATION is more then a match for the Empire. Whast the point of sending the Borg which in this case is over kill against the empire.
VIEW8472 6 months ago
@VIEW8472 The Empire always had Quadrillions, and the Borg would only be able to assimilate them if they actually were able to get to them, which between the Blasters which they could never match frequency with, to the ACP/Concussion weapons/ hell even slugthrowers that the empire use, would never happen.
You still ignore the established limits of Borg adaptation and assimilation, treating it like a comic book super power. Refusing to listen to reason.
Perion 6 months ago
@Perion Numbers mean nothing if you can't defeat your enemy.Unless its biological technology that the borg nano have trouble to assimulate they will and have adapted to biological technology.Unless the empire have the Apex of all bio=technology-ships in there side the Borg will adapt and assimulate period.I mean ships that have dence cells reject and destroy the borg nano probes.All i hear from your argument is that the borg will not adapt to the empires tech because u say,but no reason to supp
VIEW8472 5 months ago
@VIEW8472 All I hear from your argument is that borg can adapt to any tech that is non-bio because you say so. Even though we've seen them incapable of adapting to/assimilating Neutronium, Ion Storms, Data's positronic brain/the Enterprise E's main computer, Guns, Knives, and in supplementary material energy weapons that have no set frequency.
They need to be hit by weapons or attack something to adapt to it's weapons/shields, and then only if the weapon/shields operate on a set frequency.
Perion 5 months ago
@Perion The Empire can beat Trek because you say so. I have never seen battledroids exploding into pieces from hand blasters save once: In AtoTC, a Destroyer Droid explodes from a blaster rifle that only "broke" smaller droids in an earlier scene. Also, Han's blaster, and all other hand blasters doesn't do NEAR that much damage as in the hangar scene- ever again. Kind of like THIS scene:
/watch?v=REoN1sEYVZo
Idazmi7 5 months ago
@Idazmi7 Also battle Droid reactions to blaster fire says more about A) The settings in use (possibly lower settings to conserve ammo since there are allot of the buggers, and using a higher setting against a Droideka cause, well, it's a fracking Droideka.) and/or B) the materials the Battle Droids are made out of.
Perion 5 months ago
@Perion I never heard of a blaster being set lower than "kill stormtrooper-level foes". I've heard stun, and kill: exactly what most people say the only phaser settings are. Also, as per my comment, starfleet uniforms seem to be capable of temporarily repelling enough power to blow someones head. Stormtrooper armor does not do that with blaster fire, no matter what unsaid "setting" the blaster is on.
Idazmi7 5 months ago
@Idazmi7 Uh, no, there's zero evidence that Starfleet uniforms provide any sort of protection whatsoever, let alone against firepower like that. Phasers and Disruptors operate via chain reaction anyhow. It's clear that the bizarre and unique reaction was due to the Bluegill parasite's affect on LC Remmick.
Since when do "most" people say that there are only two phaser settings when in TNG more are mentioned constantly, with 16 being the highest.
Perion 5 months ago
@Perion Why did his head explode then? Analyse your arguement. Uniform? no Explodie. Head? Explodie. Parasite? Would have also protected his obviously fragile head.
Idazmi7 5 months ago
@Perion Then the Bluegill would have protected his head, idiot.
Idazmi7 5 months ago
@Idazmi7 Blasters have a wide range of settings, low enough ones can be used to light a cigar or burn the skin off their bones as a means of torture. The films themselves show several settings during firefights, as not all impacts, even to the same surface, cause as large explosions as others. They also seem to be able to switch settings very quickly, by the flip of a switch like a fire selection system on modern assault rifles and SMGs. Rather than the cumbersome button mashing of Phasers.
Perion 5 months ago
@Perion Just cause you say so. Again, I've never heard of it, even in most of the novels. Darksaber's statements on "off-axis firing" make more sense than what you just said, as it is SEEN. (The "off-axis firing" was just the editors making up for the actor's poor aim. You are just making up for Star Wars not seemingly posessing Star Trek level tech.) Beyond A New Hope I have never seen switch-flipping on blasters. Switching blasters to stun IS cumbersome: the dead stormtrooper can testify.
Idazmi7 5 months ago
@Idazmi7You mean the guy who was shot barely a second after saying it? that's hardly evidence of it being cumbersome since none of them were observed fiddling with the blaster to set it to stun, which more than suggests a simple and easy mechanism that doesn't require you to take the weapon off target and press stuff like we always see with a phaser when they change settings. The closest real life analogy to switching settings is a fire selection switch, which is a simple thumb switch.
Perion 5 months ago
@Perion LOL! He looked down, fiddled, and THEN got shot! Never happened in Trek!
Idazmi7 5 months ago
Comment removed
Perion 5 months ago
@Idazmi7 That's because people in trek actually wait for them to finish fiddling, where as he was killed no sooner than he had finished giving the order and Leia had the sense to shoot him right away.
Perion 5 months ago
@Perion And then get shot right away. Also, no one waited in Star Trek: TOS's "Operation: Aniahalate!" and they still got stunned.
Idazmi7 5 months ago
@Idazmi7 As a result, a switch flip is the most logical mechanism, such a mechanism is even described early on in "Shadows of the Empire".
Beyond a New hope we never see them use stun, and we never actually see the flipping to stun on screen, and again we see several settings during firefights from the variety of impact scales (usually 2 or 3 different scales of blasts, each consistent with one another and different from the other scales) on the same surface material.
Perion 5 months ago
@Idazmi7 There are also times where they say "Set Blasters on Full!" in the EU. The common depiction is that Blasters have 4 standard settings, with additional settings such as the super low ones I described before being available with a bit more work, but the standard settings include Stun, Low power, Med power, and Full. The kind that hit leia in the arm was clearly low, (little to no different from the hit to Crusher's arm in "datalore") while other, explosion causing ones are med and high.
Perion 5 months ago
@Perion "Set Phasers on Full!" came first. I guess there ARE more "must defend Star Wars" types than just you!
Idazmi7 5 months ago
@Idazmi7 So now that I proved you wrong you immediately try to cry "warsie conspiracy" really? Set phasers on full may have came before, but that doesn't mean it came first much less that Wars "copied" it as some means to "defend". Honestly that's just paranoid delusion. The writers just feel that Blasters would have power settings because practically all energy weapons in sci-fi pre and post trek have them too. In all honesty there is zero reason to assume they shouldn't have them anyhow.
Perion 5 months ago
@Perion But they don't. EU means Expanded Universe. I would absolutely LOVE to get another response from the films (eg, the canon): but the films are wimpy on the sci-fi scale of visible damage with the Death Star and lightsabers as the only exception. Let's see a few scientific "explanations" for Star Wars:
Turbolasers are plasma blasts that explodes with 22 kiloton force
Lighsabers are "arc waves"
/watch?v=mj1j-Fl0ixo This is why the fans even try to give it scientific grounding.
Idazmi7 5 months ago
@Idazmi7 Uh, no. again we see point defense guns releasing multimegaton level energy on screen in Empire Strikes Back when they vapourize asteroids. as well as Seismic Charges do 12 gigatons worth of damage.
Don't give me that EU isn't canon nonsense, It's C Canon and S Canon but it doesn't even come close to any sort of direct contradictions with G Canon.
Perion 5 months ago
@Perion The beat-up, constantly breaking down freighter Millenium Falcon has better shields than a Star Destroyer? Gosh! o_O
I guess Echo Base was miles underground then, to only have a few ice cave collapses. Not to mention that those asteroids were only Falcon size! i didn't know it took nukes to blow rocks only 35 feet long!
Idazmi7 5 months ago
@Perion Dude everything that they borg can't adapt to is in Star trek Not the Empire.Where is your argument? because none of that tech is in the Empire because they never explain how shit works in Star wars its all based on Magic.
VIEW8472 5 months ago
@VIEW8472 Actually, they do explain quite a few mechanisms in Star Wars, Starship hulls are made out of Neutronium for one. A common droid's nanoprocessor is capable of at least 3 orders of magnitude greater performance than Data is, and while Data is unique droids use the same technology as ship computers. The Empire employ a wide arsenal of weapons, each opperating on different principles, many are KEW or fire physical projectiles such as Gauss/Rail guns and even slugthrowers.
Perion 5 months ago
@Perion Neutronium in completely neutral to Newtonian Physics. A Star Destroyer "made" out of Neutronium would not be impacted by ANY weapon, blaster or not.
Idazmi7 5 months ago
@Perion U may be able to get one or two shots in but after that the borg scan and adapt technology to there own the only technology they have trouble with scaning is bio-tech and thats where the nano probes and drones get beam onto the ships and inject nano probes to assimulate.Yes borg ships can adapt to tech- just by scanning it watch the first encounter between the Enterprice and the borg.
VIEW8472 5 months ago
@VIEW8472 Again the nano probes have limits that have been established that you are ignoring (such as the fact that they only work on assimilating devices that aren't too advanced) you simply repeat the same thing even after I proved you wrong like a broken, debunked record.
We've seen them incapable of assimilating or adapting to natural, non biological phenomenon, as well as still being vulnerable (though with increased resilience) to the things they can adapt to.
Perion 5 months ago
@Perion Quadrillions that were easily beat by a 40 ship fleet, a noobish admiral, a half-trained Jedi, and teddy-bear people.
Idazmi7 5 months ago
@Idazmi7 Pretty much Everything in that comment you just made is wrong. Your obvious bias and wilful misunderstanding of pretty much everything related to star wars, as well as refusal to learn or accept facts and instead ignorantly disregarding them as fabrications or whatever you find convenient. As a result of this behaviour I see no reason to humour you any further, you've made your decision and are clearly here only to troll, not for any mature discussion.
Perion 5 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@Perion The "quadrillions" plus Death Star II were STILL beat by a 40 ship fleet, a noobish admiral, a half-trained Jedi, and teddy-bear people. What? Ewoks aren't teddy bear people? Perhaps Lucas *should* have gone with the "Wookie homeworld" idea!
/watch?v=vyTxZW_2774
Idazmi7 5 months ago
@Perion Mature? The "Hypermatter" thing you posted was mature?
Idazmi7 5 months ago
@Perion Actually, that's you.
Idazmi7 5 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@Idazmi7 Pretty much everything in that comment you just made is wrong. Your obvious bias and wilful misunderstanding of pretty much everything related to star wars, as well as refusal to learn or accept facts and instead ignorantly disregarding them as fabrications or whatever you find convenient. As a result of this behaviour I see no reason to humour you any further, you've made your decision and are clearly here only to troll, not for any mature discussion.
Perion 5 months ago
The borg can adapt any kind of technology to there own and use it against them not even lightsabers would save u.The Borg ships are almost the same size as the star destroyer and they have thousands not to mention tactical ships design just for war.They are so powerful they tried to conquer another species because they are that powerful.One borg ship is known bring down fleets.YEAH RIGHT!!Star fleet has a better chance then the QUEER EMPIRE.
VIEW8472 6 months ago
@VIEW8472 The SW fanboys refuse to accept that the Borg may be able to adapt to their firepower. It just blows their minds that anyone can contend with DV and the Empire.
stiehler1117 6 months ago
@stiehler1117 Sorry, but we see no reason to assume the Borg can adapt to their firepower when we look at all the other things they cannot adapt to, while every reason to say they could not. You simply jump to conclusions about people's motives that suit your ends.
Perion 6 months ago
@stiehler111 They don't get the consept of the borg adapt to any technology except biological and even then they just take longer to adapt while they are understanding it.Storm troopers are strong but when the borg carry personal shields that adapt to weapons that makes them pretty useless.
VIEW8472 6 months ago
@VIEW8472 Borg adaptation is not a super power, they have established limitations.
Perion 6 months ago
@Perion Unless its biological technology the borg will adapt and the empire isnt species 8472. I haven't seen a single species in the empire that uses living ships as weapons.I watch both shows not just one and i'm basing it on what I know from both shows not just one sided.
VIEW8472 6 months ago
@VIEW8472 Sorry but Biological technology isn't the only thing they cannot adapt to. And you clearly haven't heard of the, Sekotans the Yuuzhan Vong, the Lurrians etc.
Also they cannot adapt to
Ion Storms (Voyager: Dark Frontier)
Kinetic Impacts (Star Trek: First Contact)
Overwhelming Firepower (Star Trek: First Contact again)
Phase coherent energy weapons that they haven't matched frequency with (every time they show up)
The Empire has all of these in spades.
Perion 6 months ago
@Perion no they dont, there is not ONE cannoncal reference to any of these technologies you are referencing at all. just more made up bullshit by farion.
TheSundown2010 1 month ago
@VIEW8472 Technology that the borg cannot assimilate
Neutronium (Voyager: Think Tank)
Positronic Brains (Once again, Star Trek: First Contact)
The Empire use Quantum Computers, and their droids have much higher computational performance levels than Data (comparing the Synthetech AA One Nanoprocessor described in "Medstar II: Jedi Healer" to Data's stated capabilities in "TNG: Measure of a man")
Perion 6 months ago
@Perio The key to the Borgs ability to adapt to technology is its nano probes and nano probes can be reprogram to adapt to biological being species and weaposn.Scorpian voyager.
VIEW8472 6 months ago
@VIEW8472 And the Borg couldn't reprogram them to adapt to The Undine (Species 8472) without help from Voyager, not only that, but again you ignore the list of their limitations along with which episode that limitation was shown. IE the Limitations of what their nanoprobes can or cannot assimilate.
Also Adaptation to threats has nothing to do with the Nanoprobes.
Again Borg Adaptation and Assimilation are not super powers, nor do they magically have no limits.
Perion 6 months ago
@Perion Nor does the power of the Empire.
Hell, the Rebels were able to defeat the Empire while outgunned and out numbered. I would have to say the Federation could at least match the firepower of the Rebel forces.
stiehler1117 6 months ago
@stiehler1117 Of course the Empire's power has limits, but it's firmly beyond the limits of the Borg, Federation, Dominion, etc.
Again the Rebels won because Palpatine bet the farm on Luke, then bought the farm thanks to Vader
As for the Federation/Rebellion comparison? Not even close, a single Nebulon B frigate, or even Corvette, would be able to wipe out all of Starfleet if it wished, let alone an Assault Frigate, and never mind a Mon Calamari Cruiser.
Perion 6 months ago
@Perion How so?
Idazmi7 5 months ago
The 'Storm Troopers' with all their super weapons and 'kinetic' armor were handily defeated by the Ewoks, who use clubs. Yeah...case closed.
stiehler1117 6 months ago
I was arguing with Perion and he refused to even include the Q in the argument.
stiehler1117 6 months ago
@stiehler1117 I don't recall debating with you about Q recently, but there is zero evidence to suggest that Q would get involved. And plenty of evidence that Q wouldn't care to bother.
Perion 6 months ago
@Perion
I'm sure you don't remember because you choose not to.
stiehler1117 6 months ago
@stiehler1117 You would be mistaken, I don't make these things personal.
Perion 6 months ago
@Perion you made it personal troll when we were debating. still would love to meet up with you at the san diego comic con. a 27 year old canadian is not match for any american ever.....................LOL
TheSundown2010 1 month ago
@Perion Then why did the Q choose to get involved with a 'puny' species, such as the humans?
stiehler1117 6 months ago
@stiehler1117 Because as Q put it, they had potential, but they never saved humanity from any of the threats that were about to wipe them out, not even in the timelines where they DID.
Also it's important to note that the Empire are run by humans as well, so as far as the Q would be concerned this would bear little difference to a federation civil war as far as taking sides go.
Perion 6 months ago
Tell me that Spaceballs scene was random!
Supersmashodsts8 6 months ago
Star Destroyer = fusion reactor (mini sun). Roundabouts a couple of million terawatts
Federation vessel = matter/antimatter warp core. Roundabouts a couple of billion terawatts
Borg Cube = Unknown power core, more powerful than Federation definitely. Can also continue functioning when 75% of the ship is destroyed.
If a Star Destroyer can't handle a single Federation vessel, what makes people think a fleet of them could handle a Borg Cube?
RedneckRapture 6 months ago
@RedneckRapture They will never listen, dude.
Idazmi7 6 months ago
@Idazmi7 Because he's wrong, The Empire uses Hypermatter not Nuclear Fusion, and btw, Deep Space Nine uses Nuclear Fusion and has more powerful shields and Phasers than any Matter/Antimatter equipped Federation vessel.
Perion 6 months ago
@Perion /st-v-sw.net/STSWhi2.html
I tried defend you from @KellG with this site. WTF is hypermatter, dingbat? Four words:
Nonexistant in Star Wars.
Idazmi7 6 months ago
@Idazmi7 /stardestroyer,net/Empire/Tech/Power/Power2,html
oh, and just cause I can /watch?v=J7EMeG59XK0
Perion 6 months ago
@Perion That clip was pure fictional bull, and Star Destroyer. Net does not show it's work-- at all.
Wikipedia on antimatter:
Wikipedia on hypermatter:
THE HYPERMATTER PAGE DOES NOT EXIST YOU MORON!
Idazmi7 6 months ago
@Idazmi7 It does however have a Wookieepedia page, and is part of the Star Wars canon whether you like it or not. Also SDN is vastly superior to St-v-sw.net.
The clip was more for lols than anything else.
Perion 6 months ago
@Perion The last statement about SDN was bold stupid. I'm willing to accept correction, but I will not accept a straightforward immature "SW pwns ST" fansite. Hypermatter = okay. SDN = Lies and Unsupported Illogical Reasoning.
Idazmi7 6 months ago
@Idazmi7 So you'd prefer a site that's dishonest while pretending to be an unbiased objective comparison? Sorry but Darkstar's antics have been exposed by a great many people, including but not limited to, The people of Something Awful.com (where they had him for one of their Awful Links of the day articles in 2003) employees of Lucasfilm, and Employees of Paramount/CBS who he argued with on the rules of what is canon and what isn't. With the very people who made said rules in the first place.
Perion 6 months ago
@Perion Show me the dishonesty on-site.
Idazmi7 6 months ago
@Idazmi7 Whaddaya know... no response.
Idazmi7 6 months ago
@Idazmi7 Honestly if you can't see how obvious it is, between the random filibustering and double talk, then I don't see why I should bother filling this comments page with all the examples. Believe it or not I have better things to do.
Perion 6 months ago
@Perion Then don't. You're the one who replied to my "double talk". Show it to me. I see no "filibustering" on that site. All I saw on the one you provided was "reasons why Star Wars ships win" with NO EXAMPLES and a forum that will instantly flame any Trek-fan, whether or not he/she has said anything. Someone should expose THAT one. Meanwhile, send me an obvious lie on that site.
st-v-sw.net/STSWdodgethis.html
By the way, anyone can LOOK at my evidence.
Idazmi7 6 months ago
@Idazmi7 I could also link you to more technical parts of the site.
Idazmi7 6 months ago
@Idazmi7 More nonsensical parts you mean, I've read through it already, long ago. The thing about Darkstar is that he has a way of trying to use a veneer of civility and buzzwords to try and make his arguments sound plausible, but they don't hold an ounce of water.
One of my favourites is how he goes at length talking about the sunrise/sunset thing for his Tatooine to Geonosis "calcs". While completely forgetting that both Mace and Yoda arrived not long after, Yoda making a stop over at Kamino.
Perion 6 months ago
@Perion But again I have no interest in discussing this SDN vs Darkstar's site, his antics and arguments have been torn to shreds so many times it's sad.
If you bought into his nonsense, well that's all she wrote really.
Perion 6 months ago
@Perion Actually, you're just hoping everyone believes you. His "antics and arguements" provide visual reference. What ARE ewok trees made of, then?
Idazmi7 6 months ago
@Idazmi7 provide visual reference? wow, so basically you're under the impression that I'm just making this up or whatnot eh? Honestly I don't see any reason to bother.
What the Ewok trees are is irrelevant, as usual Darkstar goes to great lengths to calculate stuff that has no bearing on what he is trying to prove (again the Tatooine to Geonosis example) an AT-ST is little more than a Jeep with legs, or at best, a Humvee with legs, both of those are notoriously easy to destroy.
Perion 6 months ago
@Perion You ARE making it up. I searched the archives for you on each link. You're afraid other YouTubers will use them, so you state me as a liar. Give me one verified statement on SDN.
Idazmi7 5 months ago
@Idazmi7 Sorry, but your accusations mean nothing. Again, I don't feel like digging through old forum posts to find them, it took long enough doing that years ago, let alone now. I see no reason to just to placate your doubts. I know I'm right, and at this point, that's enough for me.
The moment you claimed SDN was crap and Darkstar's site was good was the moment I stopped caring about your opinions.
Perion 5 months ago
@Perion And again, through "random filibustering" and "double talk" *YOU* fervently hope that no one uses one of the links I've posted. You're sad, man. I still searched the archives for you, and linked to the exact pages they were on, saving you the trouble of looking yourself.
st-v-sw.net/STSWblaster.html
Blasters suck, and you cannot prove me wrong. You will most likely post an un-creative reason why you have "better things to do", while ignoring the fact that you bothered to reply. ^_^
Idazmi7 5 months ago
@Idazmi7 Doesn't take long to bother with a short reply, I considered it a courtesy, but clearly you are hell bent on misinterpreting whatever you please to suit your own ends.
If people go to the links you post they will either A) see how full of it Darkstar is, or B) buy into his paranoid delusions and utter nonsense. Either way I don't care. If you keep up this behaviour, then I won't see any reason to dignify it with a response.
Perion 5 months ago
@Idazmi7 You also share Darkstar's bizarre tendency to think he is winning a debate when in fact he is failing horribly.
I noticed that all you are doing is mindlessly linking to pages that have been debunked nearly a decade ago, and are completely unaware that obviously, darkstar's argument with people such as mike sussman are not on his page. I saw the debate once before, on an Official Star Trek forum, but like I said I can't be arsed to look up a forum thread from over 5 years ago.
Perion 5 months ago
@Perion uhh from what the rest of the sci fi community is saying you are losing. there are many more sites that are pro trek then pro wars now. i told you two years ago that the movement was going to come about face and it has. people are waking up and standing up to that idiot wong and all of his silly goons.
TheSundown2010 1 month ago
@TheSundown2010 You are acting as though this is some kind of war, or conspiracy or other such nonsense. Rather than differing viewpoints based on the evidence at hand, some accept the evidence others do not (such as those who discount the EU in spite of it's place in the canon.) You threaten me with physical violence, dig through comments, insult the side you don't agree with, regardless of relevance and yet you say I am the one with no life.
Perion 1 month ago
@Perion And it almost IS a conspiracy. You trolls cannot accept Star Wars being inferior in any way, including nonsensical "firepower estimates". Just because there are a lot of fans that agree with you, 5551 people is still not even near the whole Star Wars- or Star Trek -fanbase, nor is it an important number in any realistic sense. Either way: Star Wars demonstrates absolutely none of the firepower, mobility, or intelligence you typically speak of.
Idazmi7 1 month ago
@Idazmi7 I noticed you also share Darkstar's bizarre tendency to claim victory even after having your arguments destroyed thoroughly.
stardestroyer,net/Empire/HateMail/RSA/MoO/Blasters.html
Also you clearly still don't understand, the argument Darkstar made was on the trek forums against people such as Mike Sussman (about an episode he wrote by the way) not on Darkstar's own site. However since that was years ago I don't feel like scouring through forums to find it.
Perion 5 months ago
@Perion Destroyed by what? You just proved that the renegade Han Solo has better tech than the Empire, just to fight me. Either that, or Leia is much tougher than any "ferrocite". (Never heard that term in the movies...)
Idazmi7 5 months ago
@Idazmi7 Blasters have settings just like practically any other sci-fi Energy weapon, using one type of setting over another for all sorts of various reasons. However, we've seen a hand phaser on the "legendary" setting 16 in the TNG episode "Chain of Command Part 1" where it takes 3 solid seconds to disintegrate a dozen or so cubic inches of Granite.
bbs,stardestroyer,net/viewtopic,php?f=40&t=97649&sid=aa0e5e6522e9e36f5e50d1251ef47c0e&start=100 Shows quite a few examples of Blaster firepower.
Perion 5 months ago
@Perion So... Stormtroopers use LOWER settings on Princess Leia than on Rebel Red Shirts?
Idazmi7 5 months ago
@Idazmi7 Also because I'm being honest, as well as the fact that I don't feel like digging through archives to find the debate in question. As I said, I have better things to do.
Perion 6 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@Perion I gave you the debate, moron. You didn't even look at the post.
/st-v-sw.net/STSWATST.html - Trek vs AT-ST.
I'm logging off, I expect an intelligent reply tomorrow.
Idazmi7 6 months ago
@Perion yeah torn apart by people who have no real evidence on the subject matter. wong and everyone there twist every fact on its end so bad that most people just laugh at the credibility of that site. hey perion why dont you go to starfleet jedi and debate with those guys. LOL
TheSundown2010 1 month ago
@TheSundown2010 Because I've compared the two, and I disagree with your assertion, also the fact that you claim that "most people" would be a considerable exaggeration. "most people" don't care about the debate at all, and if you really want to compare numbers in terms of how many people are on either site, well, a quick look at the member lists makes things rather clear.
Perion 1 month ago
@Perion uhh no they dont there are no member lists. sorry your losing the debate worldwide on the inet . just accept it.
TheSundown2010 1 month ago
@TheSundown2010 and another thing nobody cares about you or what you say. sdnet makes fun of your ass regularily there anyway.
TheSundown2010 1 month ago
@TheSundown2010 # of SDN forum members 5551 # of SFJ Forum Members 258. Very simple and easy method of checking this.
Perion 1 month ago
@Perion So you are a popular asshole. Doesn't change fact: the fact is SDN is not a "credible" resource to anything. They use non-canon data from non-canon sources as well as make stuff up on the fly. The defunct "Turbolaser Comentaries" is a perfect example: It does not take that much to melt a 30 meter asteroid made of "rusted iron". How Iron would "rust" in space is another matter.
The parent asteroid in that scene was definitely hollow rock, thus neccesitation a re-calculation anyway.
Idazmi7 1 month ago
@Perion At least Starfleet Jedi cites resources to Star Trek episodes, instead of unilaterally stating Star Trek to be inferior without giving any reasons as to why.
StarDestroyer[dot]net doesn't even give ANY tactical details to any single Star Wars vessel! I'd expect to at least learn about Star Destroyers on a site called Star Destroyer. Seems *odd* that I can only find "Turbolaser" fanwankery, and a very biased forum.
And yes, I *did* look it up in the Imperial Wiki:
Idazmi7 1 month ago
@Idazmi7 According to the Imperial Wiki, a Star Destroyer is smaller than a Star Cruiser, and bigger than a Star Frigate.
My question: What, then, are the Venator and Executor Star Destroyers??? The Executor is bigger than the typical (Imperator class) Star Destroyer. The Venator is smaller. That means that the info in the Imperial Wiki is nothing but made-up crap. Nice to know, Mike Wong says it goes all the way up to the imaginary Star Dreadnaught, which is never seen or implied anywhere.
Idazmi7 1 month ago
@Idazmi7 Simply put, no other information exists on that site at all. And since there is no real explanation of Star Trek technology, how in the name of heck is it possible to accept it's over-generalized statements?
Example: Starfleet Ground Combat technology. We hear of little compared to Star Wars. Why?
/watch?v=QN2ZrTpvIss
Because Alpha Quadrant races can level CONTINENTS in scarce seconds with just a few ships. They state: 30 percent of CRUST destroyed. Not 30 percent of the water.
Idazmi7 1 month ago
@Idazmi7 In addition, the starfighters that show up later are from a higher tech faction: they can easily destroy Galaxy Class Starships, which are extremely powerful:
/watch?v=d734afLFPds
The only Galaxy Class ships that were EVER destroyed, out of the 40+ that were made, were killed by Dominion ships, or lame plot devices like "invulnerable shields"
/watch?v=H_XbWq49vUM
Star Destroyers are routienely killed by much less. Rebel ships are weaker than SD's:
/watch?v=0iOeFPE8574
Idazmi7 1 month ago
@Idazmi7 And if you claim "super shielding" to explain the laughably innefective heavy guns in that scene this is just for you.
/watch?v=lchA-lwqrPw&feature=related
No shields at all. The fact is, Star Wars' Original Trilogy just didn't have the special effects material to show flying debris on every shot, and the only shield mentioned on the SSD is the "Bridge Deflector shield" ergo, only the command deck is protected.
Compare to Star Trek:
/watch?v=did164yEFx4&feature=related
Idazmi7 1 month ago
@Idazmi7 Here are even MORE shield examples from Star Trek:
/watch?v=-CEgqKh8t8k&feature=related - Skin tight shields, like the fake ones on Star Destroyers
/watch?v=FZWI2cxKXLg&feature=related - "Bubble" shields, like most people expect from Star Trek.
watch?v=MJZbCNexctc
/watch?v=qjRFYOcT1WU&feature=related - The Soverign Class switches shields from one to the other, it may have both, but that seems sketchy. Either way: it has shields.
Idazmi7 1 month ago
@Idazmi7 And lastly, try your Star Wars firepower estimates on THIS one:
/watch?v=B5sfQtMbvxw&feature=related - Enterprise, as of 2009
/watch?v=lchA-lwqrPw&feature=related - General Grievous' command Ship.
In a fight, Enterprise would obvously kill both of the slowpoke, age-of-sail style Star Wars cruisers in no more than 40 seconds.
Idazmi7 1 month ago
@Idazmi7 Read bottom up.
Idazmi7 1 month ago
@Idazmi7 and in the cannon war VISUAL EFFECTS TRUMP ALL OTHER SOURCES OF CANNON. meaning no ics books here ...............or ever.
TheSundown2010 1 month ago
@TheSundown2010 the star wars guns look real tough.......... LOL they arnt even megaton level events. where are those 200 gt shots. there arnt any thoughout the entire 6 movies. except for the death star shooting at the rebel fleet. not once have i seen an event that puts out 200 gigaton shots. not from one ssd.......EVER.
TheSundown2010 1 month ago
@TheSundown2010 so perion and all other warsies. come and show me any visual reference that is cannon. that show me the legendary 200 gt shot. give me one. and the esb asteriod scene was debunked a long time ago. explain to me why if your ships are so tough, then why general grevious ship broke up in a simple atmosheric reentry. or why a simple asteriod smashed the avengers bridge off in the empire strikes back.
TheSundown2010 1 month ago
@Idazmi7 yet in star trek we see events that hit the 500 megaton to 20 gigaton range easily. yes the tech manual does state 64 megaton photon torpedo yeild. but it is trumped by the effects that are visually shown by the movies and tv. why? because these are the rules of cannon. written cannon is ALWAYS trumped by visual effect.
TheSundown2010 1 month ago
@Perion Whell then!
/st-v-sw.net/STSWground.html
Idazmi7 6 months ago