Recovery | New Insights Rehab's False Claims for Genetic Link to Alcoholism

[Hammersley1967]

[3]

This mutation complex disallows chloride osmosis through the cell walls. This leads to a number of symptoms, this most devastating of which is a build up of mucosa in the lungs...

→ which leads to chronic respiratory infection

→ which leads to lung scaring

→ which leads to a decline in lung function

→ which leads to eventual death

Now THAT’S a disease with an extremely complex, yet SCIENTIFICALLY PROVEN, genetic etiology, disease entity, symptomology and prognosis.

(Continued in [4])

[Hammersley1967]

[4]

This is a disease that has a genetic etiology, disease entity, symptomology and defined prognosis.

It has a seamless flow of causality from genetic etiology to symptomology.

After 225 YEARS of disease hypothesis, NO such physiological causal model has ever emerged and ever will.

I challenge any biologist, biomedical researcher or specialist physician (or ANYONE ELSE) to provide hard evidence that supports such a complete causal model of addiction.

Until then, addiction IS NOT a disease.

[SuperWeather123]

Keep up the good work. The main drive in addiction being a disease is for $money, money, money, MONEY

[prschuster]

This genetic link they talk about is probably no different than the kind of genetic links found for any condition. We all have strengths & weaknesses with respect to our biochemistry and some people are more predisposed to medical or behavior problems than others. That doesn't mean we are born with these diseases and it doesn't determine what choices we make in life. I've heard enough talk about serotonin & dopamine etc... It sounds like special pleading to me.

[isegoria1]

I agree, a presupposition (if there is one for addiction) says nothing to the choices one makes.

[prschuster]

I remember how everything I encountered in AA was geared toward warning me about all the things that can lead to relapse. All this did was give too much power to outside influences and it only sabotaged my self confidence. It wasn't until I left AA that I found it easy to just say to myself: "I'm going to beat this addiction and nothing is going to stop me".

[ndrthrdr1]

@prschuster My experience was the same as yours. Powerless? That's a crock.

[nograffix]

As far as I know none of those organizations keep any records so there really isn't anyway of knowing a success rate vs failure; or to know the amount of people who did all of the things the programs requires of you. Lastly is that, as a friend informed me, these organized don't force you to come, charge you any money, or interfere with anything I do in my life. So my question is why you hate them so strongly and what you are gaining by bashing them?

[isegoria1]

"as a friend informed me, these organized don't force you to come, charge you any money, or interfere with anything I do in my life."

So treatment centers are free now? Please do explain which ones. They don't matter until they kill someone you know.

What am I gaining? - Truth, something they know nothing of and don't really care if they kill people with their lies.

[nograffix]

I don't see how they are killing people. But I wasn't talking about recovery centers, i was talking about 12 step programs. I personally don't believe that any recovery centers aren't actually offering any help that cannot be found free of charge through 12 step groups. About the killing thing I've never seen any statistics showing that these 12 step groups are killing people. As you said people have free choice and some choose to kill themselves

[isegoria1]

You don't see it and that is the beauty of indoctrinated thinking. 99% of treatment centers are the failed 12 step program so what is your point? The fact is neither treatment centers or 12 step are doing anything to solve a problem they created with their "powerless" scheme and pseudo science claims.

Read the AA triennial survey, even they know the numbers are below 5% success.

How can they have free will to destroy themselves and be powerless at the same time?

Cognitive dissonance again?

[nograffix]

Ok so i read a little bit of the book the NA group uses just for kicks and about the powerless thing. It says, "we are powerless over our addiction, but nout our recovery, once we have stop using drugs the choice is to use the tools of the program or not." So I think your idea of "powerless" is a little skewed as to what they are teaching... cant say about AA though

[isegoria1]

We were never powerless over our addiction, we caused it and we made decisions that made it all possible. Unless you had super booze that attacked you in the night? In that case there should be a PSA warning people of the mugging booze bottles.

We had to choose to stop, this we were always responsible for it all. Mine is not skewed at at all. I drank because I liked it and I did it on purpose. I also stopped drinking because it was destructive.

An don't give me the not real drunk bull

[nograffix]

Since I don't have a PhD in biochemistry or genetics I really can't say how likely or unlikely the concept actually is. I think the only thing that actually matters in the whole issue is that 12 step programs might help some people, and might not work for others. In my eyes if you are addicted to drugs and you manage to stay clean that you are truly a remarkable individual. So why try and knock their beliefs and ideals?

[isegoria1]

The likely hood of a genetic link to volition is absurd and nothing more. AA own triennial survey states that it basically helps no one, but jockey's in line to claim ownership of the 5% who self remit annually. I guess I would call this dishonest.

There is nothing remarkable by making better decisions in a ones own life. Would you reward a mutilator for not mutilating themselves?

Belief = Being Easily Lead Into Eventual Failure.

When one claims fact there is no room for belief.

[isegoria1]

Beliefs are the lies we tell ourselves to make the world around us palatable.

[nograffix]

ties with the government anyways) have to even look for a genetic link to addiction?

[isegoria1]

I happen to agree.

I do also think searching for a genetic link to alcoholism is like looking for a gene responsible for stupidity or irresponsibility.

[nograffix]

in all honesty how much research is being done involving the genome and alcoholism or addiction... in my opinion no one really cares because the government and so forth will extract much larger quantities from the people keeping bars and every corner, prescriptions flying off the counter, and payoffs from the drug smugglers (if they aren't bringing the drugs in themselves). So what motivation does a science research company (which would most likely be pharmacuitical, who have extremely strong

[MrHollick]

Wow awesome video!!!

[isegoria1]

I figured it was time to call these people out on the carpet once and for all. Thanks for dropping by.

[geroldkid]

No references, no tests? NIRehab, shame on you for insulting science like this. I just checked their website, IT IS yet another 12 step tool.

[isegoria1]

That is what I thought - It will be interesting to see how this plays out......

[geroldkid]

I just made a short video identifying pseudoscience, I'll post it as a response so people can tell what is science and what isn't.