Ayn Rand better than Mr1001Nights (according to a left-anarchist)

[Worldslargestipod]

Did Ayn Rand really become an Anarchist 1 second before she died?

[SomethingSea1]

@TheQuestioner132 Military intelligence makes sense to me too.

[GiantKukri]

hmmm, what is his policy on people who don't want to live in his "lib"soc community thing? If it's violence, banishment or imprisonment than yeah, he's authoritarian prick. But I think that has very little to do with one set of shitty economic theories or another.

[Cefuroxx]

RaymondDundas, can you weigh in on how badly Israel is in bed with the US?

[CytherLynx]

@Cefuroxx finkelstein and meashimer = good sources

[Cefuroxx]

@CytherLynx

finkelstein and mearsheimer = good

chomsky = bad

[CytherLynx]

@Cefuroxx really? how so? (btw i'm not disagreeing, i haven't read much of chomsky on this.. only a few speeches calling sharon a war lord, etc)

[Cefuroxx]

he calls them war criminals and in fact he generally pulls no punches in describing the barbarity of Israel but when you think he would do what should come naturally. IE, sanctions, boycott, isolation, call for the return of the refugees he starts twisting and flopping like a fish. I saw an interview where he called himself a supporter of israel, another where he lament "the destruction of Israel" and called boycott supporters enemies of the Palestinians bc it would make them suffer more..

[CytherLynx]

@Cefuroxx i have a book on chomsky of a selection of works arriving soon, i'll have to see if thats true

[Cefuroxx]

@CytherLynx

it is, he was a socialist zionist youth leader and to this day self identifies as a zionist

[asdfgasdfasdful]

Anyone interested in the historical details needs to read Bryan Caplan's article on the Spanish "anarchists" entitled 'The Anarcho-Statists of Spain.'

[BlackFlame281]

@asdfgasdfasdful After that they should read, "A Reply to Bryan Caplan's Essay "The Anarcho-Statists of Spain: An Historical, Economic, and Philosophical Analysis" to see why Bryan Caplan cherry picked his information. I could do the same thing by taking a bunch of fucked up quotes about Somalia and string them together to make the place sound totally fucking insane.

[asdfgasdfasdful]

@BlackFlame281

That thing doesn't even try to disagree with the central point of Caplan's essay, and it engages in genetic fallacy and is unsystematic and unacademic. The high point is when it accuses Caplan of neglecting some retarded, quasi-Marxist "class" theory of everything. Professor Caplan links to that reply and doesn't even bother to say anything about it, for good reason. And Somalia is totally fucking insane... it just got a lot less bad going from socialist state to ~no state.

[BlackFlame281]

@asdfgasdfasdful WTF? The article addresses almost every point Caplan makes including the central one. Caplan entire article almost relies on one resource. Imagine trying to get an understanding of the US civil war with one book. The reason Somalia is insane is bc it is anarcho-capitalism. No state. Free markets. Free banking. Capitalism. Wtf else do you want? After 19 years it has over 100% inflation and 66 percent unemployment in the cities. 

[asdfgasdfasdful]

@BlackFlame281

It doesn't disagree w his central point: the CNT-FAI weren't the betrayed 'good guys' portrayed in fawning leftist revisionism. They did bad things too. Caplan doesn't use just one source.. And "addressing" =! giving logically valid refutations of everything. I'm not an "anarcho"-anything. Somalia was more insane with a state than ~without. Factors obviously include 100s of years of state imperialism, fundie Islam, socialism, low average IQ, climate, foreign-imposed govts, etc.

[BlackFlame281]

@asdfgasdfasdful I guess you haven't read much anarchist material. The CNT-FAI did not carry out these acts! It was individual anarchist who after years of oppression at the hands of the state and the church that supported them (including collusion with the fascist) took revenge. Almost every anarchist (including myself) have condemned these acts including Mckay, Bookchin, and just about every book written about the (A) during the civil war.

[QuantumTuba]

My main objection to this comparison is that Rand supported military statism, which I think even by an-cap standards is arguably more authoritarian than any other economic interventionism (Seeing as militarism requires massive economic intervention AND mass slaughter). Mr1001Nights, as far as I know, opposes military statism.

[AlexStrekalGuitar]

@shadowgeyser That's all granted, but I'm not sure you completely got the gist of what I mean with my talk of a youth culture trend. I mean that there is social clickishness in which everything is personalized. A significant part of it is about associating with the right people, giving in to group pressure, highschool style gossip. From the outside, it looks like a little gang of people talking to themselves in a bubble, and too caught up in group dynamics to seriously discuss politics.

[InTheEndIWasRight]

Good laughs to be had hur. Also I didn't know mr1001nights was now partner channel? Exploitation! The working the class!

[comradshaw]

Lol--Universal healthcare is authoritarian? This is silly. I guess the labor movement, too, is authoritarian, since it has deprived capitalists potential profits over the years. If anyone needed to understand the definition of the term "Orwellian," I would have them watch this video. Reforms don't happen in a vacuum; they're the results of long--usually quite radical--struggles. Take the 8 hour workday. Is this "authoritarian" as well:)? It was mostly people who wanted to abolish the...

[comradshaw]

State and capitalism participating in the struggle. The civil rights movement was largely radical, though it led to many reforms in its (still evolving) process. There's not this rigid dichotomy between revolution and reform that you speak of. It's ahistorical to assume that the State gives us anything--these things were demanded.

And is laughingman0x a "left-anarchist"? I think this is a legitimate question. Further, I guess the assumption is here there are right-wing anarchists (no such

[comradshaw]

thing). I question rather laughingman0x is a leftist, since he supports the existence of hierarchical firms, financial markets, and agorism. These are certainly not ad hominem attacks--this is from his vids, which seem to indicate a sea change in his economic philosophy.

Further, none of my comrades from the anarchist milieu (people I personally know) support quid pro quo relations, or for-profit anything. Hence, they all support free healthcare.

[RaymondDundas]

@comradshaw Universal health care requires theft of capital to sustain it. Yeah, it is authoritarian. Mr1001nights is not an anarchist.

[comradshaw]

Capitalism--or any economic market that promotes profits for a few and wages for the masses--requires theft from the proletariat to subsidize the bourgeoisie. Hence, capitalism does exactly what you say universal healthcare does. I don't think any anti-authoritarian is saying that national healthcare programs are the answer; I'm not saying that. But to discuss taxes or universal healthcare without discussing that capitalism does exactly the same thing to wage-earners is disingenuous....

[comradshaw]

But again, national healthcare programs are usually popular with the public; the majority of countries almost always supports them. You cannot honestly buy the notion that social programs enable the State's power--do you? Also, I'm most certainly in favor of getting rid of the State, social programs, etc, so as long as capitalism is done away with.  I wouldn't propose we jettison the fire dept., Medicaid, Medicare, libraries, etc, without also abolishing capitalism.

[RaymondDundas]

@comradshaw Wage labour is not theft. And such "social programmes" necessitate a state to enforce them.

[comradshaw]

@RaymondDundas And I would mention that the "Mr1001nights is not an anarchist" claim is one I'm not interested in.  I wouldn't care if someone claimed I was a Marxist, not an anarchist, etc. The notion that someone is not the political tendency/ philosophy that they claim to adhere to is a bore to me.

[RaymondDundas]

@comradshaw That's fantastic. Oh, by the way, what is the title of this video that you're commenting on?

[comradshaw]

@RaymondDundas I actually found the vid via a search of vids that came out this week with the simple search engine "anarchism." And the title of the video actually concerns Ayn Rand being "better" than mr1001nights, which is according to a "left-anarchist"--not mr1001nights' anarchist credentials. I was responding to your comment.

[RaymondDundas]

@comradshaw Yeah, and that doesn't justify you flouting the subject of the video just because you so happen to have "come across" it.

[LeftPolitiko]

@comradshaw Don't bother arguing with raymond, comrade. You'll lose brain cells.

[RaymondDundas]

@LeftPolitiko How would you know? You never had any to begin with.

[briano8713]

@comradshaw

Not using authoritarian means to abolish hierarchical firms is not the same as "supporting" them- something he explicitly denies. This is especially true given the overwhelming evidence that genuine free market reforms (IP, zoning, liscensure, ect..) would be accompanied by a cocomitant increase in the prevalence of cooperative firms, networked self-employment and microenterprise. The current level of "hierarchy" is artificial, archaic, and inefficient, and would be (CONT..)

[briano8713]

@briano8713

largely competed out of existence by smaller, nimbler firms and informal craft production. This hasn't already occured largely due interventions that hide diseconomies of scale.

Agorism, properly understood, is a crucial form of direct action. If you like, it could be as "lefty" as maintaining a neighborhood garden or bartering honey for eggs- LETS schemes and communes even qualify. IMHO, most "left-anarchist's" opposition to this is aesthetic rather than substantive.

[Guncriminal]

Ayn Rand was against all taxation so by definition she was less authoritarian than someone who does advocate taxation.

[AlexStrekalGuitar]

@Guncriminal Of course, it seems like a very narrow viewpoint to only focus on the question of taxation. I would hope that people realize that there are a multitude of criteria we could use other than that. So by the very least this question is context-sensitive to particular issues. If we want to make a fair and complete comparison, there are some issues in which Ayn Rand is extremely authoritarian while Mr. 1001nights is not.

[AlexStrekalGuitar]

@AlexStrekalGuitar For example: Rand supported the military wing of the state, was rabidly pro-Israel, got caught up in cold war politics, supported IP, justified genocide of native peoples on the grounds of cultural superiority, her politics is theoretically compatible with a global government, and so on.

[Cefuroxx]

@AlexStrekalGuitar

yup, she was a fanatical zionist and a jewish supremacist who changed her name so people wouldnt know.

[InsurgenistCujo]

"Raymond Dundas, you are enemy of communist revolution! You will go to the gulags now..." *stares at you with a shit stain grimace*

[Menace3434]

"Francisco Franco was less authoritarian than the Spanish anarchists during the Spanish Civil War ". You just butchered history.

[RaymondDundas]

@Menace3434 Nope. You're wrong.

[Menace3434]

Google "White Terror" and google "Red Terror" in the Spanish Civil War. Anarchists were not part of either of them, to say that Franco was less authoritarian then the anarchists is to piss on the graves of all anarchists that died in the dungeons of Franco, you should visit the CNT in Spain and say that to their faces. And one thing more you guys are a bunch of toilet philosophers whit no real life experience. I can smell your smug from here. Oh and yes we killed priests and we are proud of it

[RaymondDundas]

@Menace3434 Yeah, I've already read about the Red and White Terrors. But that last sentence sums up basically how authoritarian you are. Not to mention those weren't the only people they killed. You're stupid.

[SecularNumanist]

@RaymondDundas

Sorry but the clergy had been responsible for much oppression in Spain, and the ones who werent we spared. They deserved to die.

[fringeelements]

I piss on the graves of the anarchists who died in the prisons of Franco. Franco did a good thing killing them. Spain was incredibly lucky the nationalists won. As a result, Spain was an economically stagnant shitty third-way economy instead of a communist megadeath nightmare. The communists would have killed more, evidence is found wherever they won.

Life experience! Because extrapolating the .05% of the world you've seen is the best way to construct an unprecedented economic organization!

[Cefuroxx]

@fringeelements

can u make another fap video please?

[nazibreaker]

i piss in your mouth and i hope u fascist fag die 

[fringeelements]

Nope, I totally oppose the state. Just because fascists are less totalitarian than you (in a different flavor) doesn't mean I support them.

[AntifaUSA]

@nazibreaker Antifascism is Capitalism

[nazibreaker]

omg kill ur self idiot

[AntifaUSA]

@nazibreaker OMG Lenin hated Gays and Che was Racist

Oh Noes

[Cujo69]

@nazibreaker LOL

[DoctorMandible]

@fringeelements You are a sociopath. First, wishing anyone dead is downright evil. Second, the Anarchists were betrayed by the Communists. They were not the same group. The Anarchists fought AGAINST the Communists and the fascists.

[fringeelements]

@DoctorMandible Sociopathy means a general lack of empathy. Lacking empathy for you or people in your cause =/= a general lack of empathy.

I don't care who betrayed who. In practice the anarchists and communists are interchangeable.

[FletchforFreedom]

@fringeelements Fringe, m'friend, please differentiate. Syndicalists of all kinds are interchangeable (communists, state socialists, Chomskyites, anarch-syndicalists, etc.) but anarcho-capitalists are still legitimately anarchists and do not suffer the delusions of people like Mr1001Nights (who can never accept his numerous staggering defeats) who want human nature to change by magic.

[FletchforFreedom]

@DoctorMandible Actually, the evidence is overwhelming that the Catalonian experiment was an absolute disaster - a violent period charcterized by capital flight, market collapse, rampant unemployment, a crash in industrial output and internal strife (inlcuding sell-outs to state communists) that made the end inevitable before either the communists or fascists intervened.

[Cefuroxx]

@Menace3434

fuck franco and fuck chomsky, long live the spanis hanarchists, fuck comunists, zionists and fascists

[LibranEsq]

hello from a hard core chemtrail hating channel in the New York City area. We invite you and your viewers to have a look at our videos. we sabatogue chemtrails using vapors right out of the bottle of store bought vinegar. clear the sky of chems !

[Apptendo]

@LibranEsq LOL, chemtrails

[AlexStrekalGuitar]

These videos are stupid, and youtube market anarchy is a silly faddish click mostly constituted by immature young people caught up in shallow forms of rebellion.

[fringeelements]

BS. I've been doing this for 4 years now. It's neither faddish, shallow or a "rebellion" any more than any other political ideology.

[AlexStrekalGuitar]

@fringeelements Except I'm not refering to a political ideology but an online youth culture. In either case, hating on Mr.1001nights is a youtube market anarchist dead horse.

[SecularNumanist]

@fringeelements youre talking to brainpolice btw

[mr1001nights]

How does one measure authority in any system? How does one then measure illegitimate authority? What short and long term steps can ppl take to reduce it? I stand in agreement with the bulk of what An Anarchist FAQ (InfoshopDOTorg) says on these issues, and its take on rothbardian ideology

[Cefuroxx]

@mr1001nights

dude you need to get off chomsky, he is full of shit and a closet jewish supremacist zionist. He is like the pied piper of the left and the sooner we tell him to fuck off the better.

[fringeelements]

The anarchist FAQ makes appeals to pre-marginalist economics and the literally mystical notion of the labor theory of value. It's on the same level as creationism. Not even your fellow statists buy into this intrinsic spiritual value you ascribe to labor anymore. You're like a hindu guru, you even look like one and your cadence is like one (so is chomsky's).

LaughingMan has said many times off the record that you, and chomsky, are more authoritarian than Rand.

[fringeelements]

He hasn't said it publicly because he knows his subscribers, many of which are even dumber than you, would throw a hissy-fit over the idea that their guru is wrong.

Go look up the youtube channel "PillaiCenter". The parallels between you and him pop right out. You are a secular version of him.

[mr1001nights]

The FAQ takes its main theoretical position against marginalism from Steve Keen, the economist who wrote "Debunking Economics". Keen sees the refutation for the LTV in the fact that commodities also add value; that the machine's "devaluation in the service of production is not proportional to its increasing effect on production" (Marx 1857 p.383).

Exchange value necessitates use value (mud/apple pie comparison is therefore a strawman) but use value has a more concrete, less subjective character

[Cefuroxx]

Chomskyan is more of a dipshit cunt than 1001nights, I tried to have an evidence based conversation with him on the role of the pro israel lobby, and because it conflicted with what Noam Chomsky said he told me to go fuck myself and then said it was "implausible" and that for citing CIA and FBI agents who challenged chomsky that I was "not rational", he then went and blocked me lol. Buddhagem is ok tho but Chomskyan is awful, dont have an opinion on 1001nights.

[Chomskyan]

@Cefuroxx thanks cefuroxx, I am glad you are still around. did you organize any new revolutions lately?

[Cefuroxx]

@Chomskyan

Are you still parroting Chomsky's evidence free analysis of the Zionist Lobby that flies in the face of what former Congress people, Senators, Executive Politicians, a President, Military Officers, Academics, Intelligence Agents and Journalists have asserted time and again? One wonders how long the Palestinians will have to remain subjugated before the Corporate class is overthrown in a revolution. Keep it up, I love Chomsky's advice wrt Israel: DON'T DO ANYTHING

[Cefuroxx]

@Cefuroxx

I knew you wouldn't be able to respond in the face of overwhelming evidence that goes against Chomsky's crap thesis. Keep on sucking the Zionist cock.

[Chomskyan]

@Cefuroxx there is a difference between not able to respond and not responding. and hey i've said over and over again that you are free to think what you like and I like to see you organize some actions around it. what's this obsession with me? Yeah, fuck chomsky and do what YOU think is right. Is that a dipshit position that I am taking?

[Cefuroxx]

@Chomskyan

Respond with what? I cite journalists, intel agents, other academics, politicos, etc and you cite chomsky, who offers a thesis based on selectively sourced evidence dating back to the 1960s. You can't stand that he is wrong on this and so you insulted me time and again. Telling me to go fuck myself, calling me irrational and calling the opinions of insiders implausible. You have bought the disinfo spewed forth by Chomsky hook, line and sinker. I can't lead you out of the dark.

[Cefuroxx]

@Chomskyan

Your response? "You're not rational" Red herring

"It seems implausible" It would be if it weren't happening

"Go to the capitalists and tell them their interests are being hurt" Israel American Free Trade Agreement

LOL, I made mince meat of your garbage replies and so you blocked me.

[Chomskyan]

@Cefuroxx hey if you get off on that, good for you. I don't waste time with that shit. Go organize your radical movement.

[Cefuroxx]

Furthermore, you even have this on your channel:

"Please feel free to comment and subscribe, and send me a message with questions and critiques."

But when people have the nerve to critique Chomsky u go nuts like a damn Evangelical Christian at a Richard Dawkins talk. He's wrong. Period. I don't know why u won't man up and re-evaluate your position. We could call u VenomfangX but that would be an insult to him, seeing as he is out for cash and you are out to dick ride zionist liars.

[Chomskyan]

@Cefuroxx yeah, I guess I had no reason to block you, with all that name calling and whatever.

Why do I need to re-evaluate my position? I am not asking you to re-evaluate yours. You stated your position and I said I am not convinced, why keep wasting time? I am asking you to stop wasting your time and go organize a movement around your positions. Somehow that's a dipshit move I guess.... in some alien world.

My answer is the same, do what you think is right, go organize around the issue.

[Cefuroxx]

@Chomskyan

continue not looking at the evidence and organizing around your wild goose chases and spouting word for word chomsky's lying garbage. USE YOUR OWN FUCKING BRAIN YOU DUMBASS FAGGOT

[Chomskyan]

@Cefuroxx hey man thanks, stay classy. Maybe I am just not capable in your eyes? in that case why keep harping on me, why aren't you focusing on the real tasks on organizing a movement based on your beliefs?

So again, I encourage you to pursuit actions which you think is right and will bring about justice for the Palestinians. I am not sure it should involving calling me a "dumbass faggot" or the many other pleasant names.

Good luck

[Cefuroxx]

@Chomskyan

you won't look at the evidence, yo have spent months telling me you don't have time and that its a waste of time when in all reality you could have read those articles in a day. The zionist lobby is real you zionist cock slurping faggot. get off chomskys balls, its disgusting

[Chomskyan]

@Cefuroxx good luck with your organizing efforts. 

[Cefuroxx]

@Chomskyan

CHOMSKYAN: ARM IN ARM WITH AIPAC

[Gettinghitonattheban]

I just don't think he was expecting some kind of Spanish Inquisition.

[Gettinghitonattheban]

LOL.

[SecularNumanist]

Buddhagem: "Quite frankly he comes across more as a Marxist than an anarchist." (addressing Mr1001ReasonsToVoteRalfNader

[Cefuroxx]

@SecularNumanist

:)

[booboonation]

Well she likely knew more about relationships than he does. I wonder what her thoughts would be on the "friend zone" that he speaks of as oppression against men.

[SecularNumanist]

@booboonation

i am entitled to more than your friendship. You OUGHT fuck me

[evilsceptic]

you talk like an anarchist, but you don't walk like one.

[Apptendo]

I'm wondering if you play Minecraft.

[BowmanMusic]

lol at Ryan providing PR

[Sivels]

Is that Ryan/fringeelements?

[BowmanMusic]

ON an interview Rand said she supported voluntary taxation but I think she flip flopped on that.

[Sivels]

Ayn Rand was AGAINST taxation altogether. Non-aggression principle obviously prohibited institutionalized theft. She was for some kind of voluntary taxation/donation to the government.

[Sivels]

@Sivels consistently applied*

[evilsceptic]

@Sivels true

[adjohnson916]

I've been trying to figure out where/how you guys talk to each other. I'm Dustyfoot. I used to go to the Stickam room but it seems all you have left there.

[RaymondDundas]

@adjohnson916 Because Stickam is ghetto. Get your voluptuous arse on Skype.

[adjohnson916]

@RaymondDundas What's your screen name, biatch?

[InsurgenistCujo]

Fuck dat nigga Mr.1001nights. He's authoritarian plain and simple.

[MarmaladeINFP]

It's interesting that the one guy keeps speaking about honesty and the other guy just wants to be intellectually humble. I think intellectual humility is more honest than simply having an opinion on every subject just for shits and giggles. Opinions are like assholes.

Objectivists are more authoritarian than anarcho-syndicalists. Ayn Rand wasn't an anti-statist. She wanted a minimal state, but anarcho-syndicalists see the state as only at best a temporary solution.

[RaymondDundas]

@MarmaladeINFP Failed [post hoc] assumption addressed in the video that honesty is for "shits and giggles" whatever the flying fuck that means. I go over the disposition for honesty as a utilitarian conquest in assuming that there is any utility in making a channel and discussing such ideas. Objectivists are far less authoritarian than left-"anarchists" such as mr1001nights. LaughingMan0x even agrees with me on that. Your comment is full of piss and shit and fail and squid eyeballs.

[Cefuroxx]

@RaymondDundthere is a problem with chomskybots; juliaisafilmbuff, chomskyan and mr1001nights all suck the shit out of his ass and as such are wandering around in circles because they worship the ground he walks on, chomsky when it omes down to it is a jewish supremacist who supports israel, just like ayn rand I mean ROSENBAUM. It's the sad but ugly truth but I have come to terms with it. Rand and CHomsky both pay lip service to human equality and all that but when push to comes to shove...

[SecularNumanist]

@Cefuroxx

I like Julia, im friends with her on facebook. I dont think shes a chomskybot, she went to visit him once I know that though. But apart from that i've never heard her talk about him.

[Cefuroxx]

@SecularNumanist

she is nice enough but I went round and round with her and chomskyan about the israel lobby/sayanim network and they simply refused to look at the evidence. I sent julia an article on the zionist lobby written BY A FUCKING CIA AGENT WHO HAND DELIVERED INTEL BRIEFS TO THE FUCKING PRESIDENT. Her response? "This is conspiracy theorist crap" She may have changed her views since then but I dunno.

[mr1001nights]

Boss-wage labor-based businesses resemble small states. The business authoritarianism of these small units will inevitably lead to an overarching authoritarian structure (a state).

The structure of the small affects bigger structures.

In the 60s the elite feared democracy because it eroded the authority of government & made it more accountable:

"The impulse of democracy makes government less powerful and more active; increasing its functions and decreasing its authority." --Samuel Huntington

[RaymondDundas]

@mr1001nights I cannot limit a response to your insipid rhetoric to under 500 characters. You're obviously not an anarchist, even one of your former allies agrees with this. So why don't you just unblock me so I can actually make a video to you? :)

"Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch."

-James Bovard

See!? I can quote intellectuals too!

[mr1001nights]

@RaymondDundas

i refuted that view of democracy here /watch?v=4y2W6U472IM

[RaymondDundas]

@mr1001nights Why don't you unblock me so I can refute your "refutation"? :)

[Cefuroxx]

@RaymondDundas

yo man do u think chomsky is a redirect agent?

[failedassassin]

Great stuff.

[MindlessGlitch]

Funny video XD