Thanks for posting this! Would this also work against (very) tight hooks? Your opponent's hooked a bit wider than yours at 1.56. I'm still struggeling to find a wing chun hook defense so if you got any more of these tips and vids please upload ;)
@Scythehalotrial It depends. I've had alot of questions about smaller arc hooks with this video so I'm probably goign to make another follow up vid. Basically, the thing is if he throws a tighter clean hook you won';t have the time to fully extend teh biu sao. So in this case you have to modify the intent to block the bicep by pushing forward instead of using the forearm. I'll explain further in my followup video, subscribe and be on the look out :)
Man, that poor guys arms have to be red and swollen. I have tried this block before many many times in boxing. Every time I used it, what happened was his punch would either go around my arm and hit me, or simply plow my arm out of the way. Maybe I'm not turning my body right, or something. I dunno. Cool video tho!
@altermann1ify it's easy to mess this up. the key is your stance. you need to have your wieght on the back leg and have your feet spaced correctly. You also need to push the blocking arm out forwards in addition to just throwing it up. If the guy is coming around your block then you need to shift more and probably turn it into a biu sao, OR alternatively instead of blocking cup his bicep and jam the punch at it's core.
@sonoflurch depends on how hard you get hit. They are great for 10<70% sparring. However, the main benefit is they save your nose and face from smashing force. But, as any boxer will tell you alot of the true damage of a punch comes from the impact on your head. The impact is spread equally over the entire head so multiple hard blows can still easily knock you out. Of course in a drill like this we try to avoid gettin hit as much as possible.
@sonoflurch I bought mine at karatesupply I believe they run about 60 to 125 dollars including tax and shipping. I paid about 63 bucks for mine. Century is the brand I like so centurymartialarts is my recommendation.
There are two simple ways of intercepting a hook punch: Biu Sau and Tan Sau. If you're at punching distance from your opponent and he does a hook punch, Biu Sau at his inner elbows and biceps. Make sure to tuck in your elbow and keep the hand connected to your center so you have your whole body behind it. Once you're in near elbowing distance and he does a hook punch, then now you would Tan Sau like you did with Biu Sau. The reason for using different hands at different distances has to do with
the strength of your arm. A long Tan Sau will not take much impact compared to a Biu Sau. Tan Sau isn't meant for taking heavy impact, but for guiding the opponent's arm. The Biu Sau structure is similar to the way we do elbow-in-push-ups; it is very strong.
Another very important concept is that you have to step in. Don't just stand in place and take the impact. If you're going to just stand in place to counter and your opponent lets out a chain of strikes, then you'll be chasing hands and it can go on forever until you slip. If you want to chase their center, then you must step in and keep a forward intent.
The Biu Sau you're doing is not so good because your elbows are flying out. If I give you a hook punch, that Biu Sau will not be able to take the impact; it will collapse. You HAVE TO tuck in your elbow, shift your position to face their bicep and step in. Even if their fist touches you, it will not do damage. Also, if you're going to block, you're going to hit all in one motion.
Also, remember Siu Nim Tau? In Siu Nim Tau, you practice omitting some of the basic WC hands from the center. None of the basic hands in Wing Chun (Tan, Biu, Fok, Jum, Pak, Huen, Lap, Jam) are done to the side of the body. They are always aligned with the center of the body, not to the side of the body. If you to deal with a strike from the side, shift your footwork and turn your body, not your arm. You learn to shift footwork in Chum Kiu. All that must be put together.
I totally agree with everything you wrote. I was asking myself the same thing actually, whether it's smart to put the Biu Sau all the way out there, or keep it in center and rotate towards the attack and step in. You answered all my questions. However, I would also like to point out that the version they are doing here isn't useless and might come in handy when dealing with a fast but not so strong opponent. Of course, one must not forget to step in after the block and own
@TheSenseofTouch own the centerline with chain punches or something else. Also, thank you guys for making this vid, you are clearly dedicated to what you do and do it with leisure and enthusiasm. Keep up the good work.
Dude I like the fact that you're trying to inject aliveness in WC and stuff, but that's not a good idea for a hook defense. Never stick your arm out like that. Go to a boxing gym for a week or two , take your own advice about how you need to know wrestling to stop a take-down. Sticking your arms out like that will get you KO'd. All you need is 1 faint hook.
that's why there si a simultaneous punch, if you try to fake you get hit anyways and the biu sao can conform to block teh incomming strikes. the reason boxing doesnt send their arm out is becasue to get back to guard they have to return to thier head. In wing chun my blocking hands are out in the middle ready to meet the force. I appreciate the comments and advice but I've used this in both muay thai and boxing sparring matches.
i like your stuff guys i think bui sau is good for the hook aswell .. also im glad you enjoy your training so much you seem very happy with your training .. good luck and keep enjoying your training .
btw where can i buy a helmet like the one your wearing? all the head gear that i come across online is that foam shit that TKD people wear or those black plastic cage things that don't protect shit.
LOL nice vid guys. very entertaining. Biu Sao works. however Tan Sao can work as well if you needed it to. The way your demonstrating it however it will never work. But if you were to turn the waste and then Tan Da (with your elbow directly inline with your shoulder and the angle of your Tan Sao greater than 90 degrees) it would definately work. I personally however like Bui Sao more, or even Fak Sao is nice. In anycase great job on the vid.
hey, no i really mean Fak maybe spelt faak sao. not fuk/fook sao. it's the part of SLT/SNT after you do the double elbows, you hands chop laterally outward on both sides. It's funny cause i can't find anything online that shows fak sao. lol go figure. Some people refer to fak sao as mon sao which is incorrect.
I beleive we calll that movment double jum sao. And that is in my opinion a linear movement and I would doubt that particulat movements effectivensss. However, I encourage you to gear up and try it out for yourself, the purpose of this video series is to stop all this theory only training. Whether you get hit or not can be tested in objective reality so have someone hook at you a few times then use your move lol. Then post a video im interested in seeing it.
no no you are mistaken. the jum is a downward moving hand. What i am referring to as fak sao is the before Jum Sao in the SLT/SNT form. The part i'm referring to is in the "second section" of the form after doing the Gum Sao's you then bring both arms in front of you for double lan sao and then out for double fak sao and then back in again for double lan sao, double jum sao, double jut sao..ect..then the rest of the form.
problem with double tan is that you have two hands (double tan) against one of his (hook punch). In wing chun you never try to have two hand on one. Actually wing chun prefers one against two. This way you have an arm available to strike with. But yes it "would work", but not the best thing to use especially against a skilled boxer.
Well, what's best is all relative; the fight dictates that. While it maybe the principle in wing chun to never have two hands on one you're overlooking the fact that one, it's a hook that's coming so you're as close as you can get--essentially a clinch Given that, it doesn't matter at that point really if it's 2 on 1; you've breached his inner guard. Your hands are right there to attack his center line, manipulate the head, etc AND more importantly to stick and end the fight.
I disagree, when you for example do a double tan on a hook (whatever the circumstance) not only are you have two hand on one of your attackers, but you are also not simultaneously attacking and defending. there is no clinch if i've just blocked your attack and simultaneously hit you in the face. Also your assuming that your enemy is going to be so slow that he's going to give you time to double then attack (occuring in two separate moments)...
...where if you block and attack at the same time you have beaten your opponent to it. In reality the worst that could have is that you also get punched if he counters your counter (which if you spar with real boxers you see happen alot) I can see how a clinch would happen in your double tan scenerio, only because your busy doing a double tan and not attacking. However i will end this by saying to each his own. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and say that you can make it work. ;)
Well it's a trade off for the simultaneous hit and defend. My view is you're doing that to breach the inner guard. Even if he counters you should be sensitive [sticking closely] enough or even basically aware that something else is gonna come. If it's another hook/punch to the head/jab to the ribs the arm on the inside is right there to defend or strike first. Also, in my scenario, your footwork should be already into his center. It's the optimal control.
You actually CAN make the Tan Work (not the best uppergate block for sure but..) if step in and jam between the shoulder and elbow--taking all that awesome opponent energy-and using it for the counter. If you pull it off his arm will wrap around yours.
By the time he counters he "could" be in midair--all up to you.
Just use a Lap Sao afterwards and a lil imagination!
Thanks for posting this! Would this also work against (very) tight hooks? Your opponent's hooked a bit wider than yours at 1.56. I'm still struggeling to find a wing chun hook defense so if you got any more of these tips and vids please upload ;)
Scythehalotrial 4 days ago
@Scythehalotrial It depends. I've had alot of questions about smaller arc hooks with this video so I'm probably goign to make another follow up vid. Basically, the thing is if he throws a tighter clean hook you won';t have the time to fully extend teh biu sao. So in this case you have to modify the intent to block the bicep by pushing forward instead of using the forearm. I'll explain further in my followup video, subscribe and be on the look out :)
gageX2z 4 days ago
@ 2:50 - My sentiments exactly dude...
DrSpooglemon 2 months ago
Man, that poor guys arms have to be red and swollen. I have tried this block before many many times in boxing. Every time I used it, what happened was his punch would either go around my arm and hit me, or simply plow my arm out of the way. Maybe I'm not turning my body right, or something. I dunno. Cool video tho!
altermann1ify 8 months ago
@altermann1ify it's easy to mess this up. the key is your stance. you need to have your wieght on the back leg and have your feet spaced correctly. You also need to push the blocking arm out forwards in addition to just throwing it up. If the guy is coming around your block then you need to shift more and probably turn it into a biu sao, OR alternatively instead of blocking cup his bicep and jam the punch at it's core.
gageX2z 8 months ago
how much are the head gear? and how effective are they? cheers, ive used this defense with my brother and it works, keep it up.
sonoflurch 1 year ago
@sonoflurch depends on how hard you get hit. They are great for 10<70% sparring. However, the main benefit is they save your nose and face from smashing force. But, as any boxer will tell you alot of the true damage of a punch comes from the impact on your head. The impact is spread equally over the entire head so multiple hard blows can still easily knock you out. Of course in a drill like this we try to avoid gettin hit as much as possible.
gageX2z 1 year ago
@gageX2z so they are pretty good protection then. how much are they though?
sonoflurch 1 year ago
@sonoflurch I bought mine at karatesupply I believe they run about 60 to 125 dollars including tax and shipping. I paid about 63 bucks for mine. Century is the brand I like so centurymartialarts is my recommendation.
gageX2z 1 year ago
There are two simple ways of intercepting a hook punch: Biu Sau and Tan Sau. If you're at punching distance from your opponent and he does a hook punch, Biu Sau at his inner elbows and biceps. Make sure to tuck in your elbow and keep the hand connected to your center so you have your whole body behind it. Once you're in near elbowing distance and he does a hook punch, then now you would Tan Sau like you did with Biu Sau. The reason for using different hands at different distances has to do with
TheSenseofTouch 2 years ago
the strength of your arm. A long Tan Sau will not take much impact compared to a Biu Sau. Tan Sau isn't meant for taking heavy impact, but for guiding the opponent's arm. The Biu Sau structure is similar to the way we do elbow-in-push-ups; it is very strong.
TheSenseofTouch 2 years ago
Another very important concept is that you have to step in. Don't just stand in place and take the impact. If you're going to just stand in place to counter and your opponent lets out a chain of strikes, then you'll be chasing hands and it can go on forever until you slip. If you want to chase their center, then you must step in and keep a forward intent.
TheSenseofTouch 2 years ago
The Biu Sau you're doing is not so good because your elbows are flying out. If I give you a hook punch, that Biu Sau will not be able to take the impact; it will collapse. You HAVE TO tuck in your elbow, shift your position to face their bicep and step in. Even if their fist touches you, it will not do damage. Also, if you're going to block, you're going to hit all in one motion.
TheSenseofTouch 2 years ago
Also, remember Siu Nim Tau? In Siu Nim Tau, you practice omitting some of the basic WC hands from the center. None of the basic hands in Wing Chun (Tan, Biu, Fok, Jum, Pak, Huen, Lap, Jam) are done to the side of the body. They are always aligned with the center of the body, not to the side of the body. If you to deal with a strike from the side, shift your footwork and turn your body, not your arm. You learn to shift footwork in Chum Kiu. All that must be put together.
TheSenseofTouch 2 years ago
@TheSenseofTouch
I totally agree with everything you wrote. I was asking myself the same thing actually, whether it's smart to put the Biu Sau all the way out there, or keep it in center and rotate towards the attack and step in. You answered all my questions. However, I would also like to point out that the version they are doing here isn't useless and might come in handy when dealing with a fast but not so strong opponent. Of course, one must not forget to step in after the block and own
DavorBa 8 months ago
@TheSenseofTouch own the centerline with chain punches or something else. Also, thank you guys for making this vid, you are clearly dedicated to what you do and do it with leisure and enthusiasm. Keep up the good work.
DavorBa 8 months ago
Yo, how well is your vision with those headgear on? Brand?
TheSenseofTouch 2 years ago
Very nice video, but please be more serious next time.
fghful 2 years ago
Dude I like the fact that you're trying to inject aliveness in WC and stuff, but that's not a good idea for a hook defense. Never stick your arm out like that. Go to a boxing gym for a week or two , take your own advice about how you need to know wrestling to stop a take-down. Sticking your arms out like that will get you KO'd. All you need is 1 faint hook.
JustaEropeanGuy 2 years ago
that's why there si a simultaneous punch, if you try to fake you get hit anyways and the biu sao can conform to block teh incomming strikes. the reason boxing doesnt send their arm out is becasue to get back to guard they have to return to thier head. In wing chun my blocking hands are out in the middle ready to meet the force. I appreciate the comments and advice but I've used this in both muay thai and boxing sparring matches.
gageX2z 2 years ago
i like your stuff guys i think bui sau is good for the hook aswell .. also im glad you enjoy your training so much you seem very happy with your training .. good luck and keep enjoying your training .
adamwingchun 2 years ago
BOXING FTW
shadowcar88 2 years ago
lol I liek boxing and MMA too. I just dont liek the rep of "doesn't work period" that kung fu gets.
gageX2z 2 years ago
Thats true
its just so many people who teach chinese kung fu arnt really teaching it right
I like that you guys are actually sparring
shadowcar88 2 years ago
btw where can i buy a helmet like the one your wearing? all the head gear that i come across online is that foam shit that TKD people wear or those black plastic cage things that don't protect shit.
mywingchunsucks 2 years ago
LOL nice vid guys. very entertaining. Biu Sao works. however Tan Sao can work as well if you needed it to. The way your demonstrating it however it will never work. But if you were to turn the waste and then Tan Da (with your elbow directly inline with your shoulder and the angle of your Tan Sao greater than 90 degrees) it would definately work. I personally however like Bui Sao more, or even Fak Sao is nice. In anycase great job on the vid.
mywingchunsucks 2 years ago
Fak (Fuk/Fook) Sao? Gonna try that--funny--I was just practicing my Fook Sao. Hmmm--maybe a nice grab-behind-the head-combo afterwards ^.^
RyzER617 2 years ago
hey, no i really mean Fak maybe spelt faak sao. not fuk/fook sao. it's the part of SLT/SNT after you do the double elbows, you hands chop laterally outward on both sides. It's funny cause i can't find anything online that shows fak sao. lol go figure. Some people refer to fak sao as mon sao which is incorrect.
mywingchunsucks 2 years ago
I beleive we calll that movment double jum sao. And that is in my opinion a linear movement and I would doubt that particulat movements effectivensss. However, I encourage you to gear up and try it out for yourself, the purpose of this video series is to stop all this theory only training. Whether you get hit or not can be tested in objective reality so have someone hook at you a few times then use your move lol. Then post a video im interested in seeing it.
gageX2z 2 years ago
no no you are mistaken. the jum is a downward moving hand. What i am referring to as fak sao is the before Jum Sao in the SLT/SNT form. The part i'm referring to is in the "second section" of the form after doing the Gum Sao's you then bring both arms in front of you for double lan sao and then out for double fak sao and then back in again for double lan sao, double jum sao, double jut sao..ect..then the rest of the form.
mywingchunsucks 2 years ago
You know what else would work, is a double tan with a forward step.
bmariano 2 years ago
problem with double tan is that you have two hands (double tan) against one of his (hook punch). In wing chun you never try to have two hand on one. Actually wing chun prefers one against two. This way you have an arm available to strike with. But yes it "would work", but not the best thing to use especially against a skilled boxer.
mywingchunsucks 2 years ago
Well, what's best is all relative; the fight dictates that. While it maybe the principle in wing chun to never have two hands on one you're overlooking the fact that one, it's a hook that's coming so you're as close as you can get--essentially a clinch Given that, it doesn't matter at that point really if it's 2 on 1; you've breached his inner guard. Your hands are right there to attack his center line, manipulate the head, etc AND more importantly to stick and end the fight.
bmariano 2 years ago
I disagree, when you for example do a double tan on a hook (whatever the circumstance) not only are you have two hand on one of your attackers, but you are also not simultaneously attacking and defending. there is no clinch if i've just blocked your attack and simultaneously hit you in the face. Also your assuming that your enemy is going to be so slow that he's going to give you time to double then attack (occuring in two separate moments)...
mywingchunsucks 2 years ago
...where if you block and attack at the same time you have beaten your opponent to it. In reality the worst that could have is that you also get punched if he counters your counter (which if you spar with real boxers you see happen alot) I can see how a clinch would happen in your double tan scenerio, only because your busy doing a double tan and not attacking. However i will end this by saying to each his own. I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and say that you can make it work. ;)
mywingchunsucks 2 years ago
Well it's a trade off for the simultaneous hit and defend. My view is you're doing that to breach the inner guard. Even if he counters you should be sensitive [sticking closely] enough or even basically aware that something else is gonna come. If it's another hook/punch to the head/jab to the ribs the arm on the inside is right there to defend or strike first. Also, in my scenario, your footwork should be already into his center. It's the optimal control.
bmariano 2 years ago
agreed.
mywingchunsucks 2 years ago
You actually CAN make the Tan Work (not the best uppergate block for sure but..) if step in and jam between the shoulder and elbow--taking all that awesome opponent energy-and using it for the counter. If you pull it off his arm will wrap around yours.
By the time he counters he "could" be in midair--all up to you.
Just use a Lap Sao afterwards and a lil imagination!
Thats why I love Wing Chun so much.
4 *'s
RyzER617 2 years ago