Rethink Afghanistan War Debate #1: Tom Hayden vs. Michael O'Hanlon

[SuperStart2011]

America jade the right decision to invade afghanistan I had enough of those teror network. I have enough suffer.most of you ppl dint know what was going on there do you? I dint think so I didn't have the right to go school or become what I was going to. I didn't have any right at all. All I was thinking was when are they gona kill me and my ppl. Shame on these bustards who claim they are Muslim. They don't have any sense of humanity. I wish them all to die.

[Harbringe]

When US forces leave Iraq your going to see that country disintegrate very quickly into factional fighting of people settling scores.Shia ,Sunnis are just playing a waiting game and once the US leaves there is gonna be a big massacre of anyone who cooperated with the Americans and everyone there knows it.

[TheUnknownGrower]

were can i buy illegal ducks?

[mookixox]

WTF? This guy had ZERO mention of the rise and protection and harvesting of the Opium (poppy) crops by us/nato forces? Zero mention of the civilian casualties? Zero mention of the private contractors (mercenaries) who are paid more then army troops (funded by us tax dollars)?

[tomludwig1]

our country will be destroyed by Obamas idea of staying in afghanistan for 4 more years and beyond as if we were in North Korea.Lets forget for a moment are so called good intention of being there besides exploitation and look elsewhere where we have not gone such as cambodia,burma, parts of Africa. If we cannot exploit another countrys resources we dont become involve. we can support our economic growth here we think through weapon manufacturing. wrong,wrong ,wrong... ludwigtom53@yahoo.com

[ukscumru2]

BABY KILLER BABY KILLERS BABY KILLERS

[johnmcan]

Pakistan support Taliban And Al Quida..Who supply weapon to Taliban -Pakistan...Who give finacial support to Taliban- Pakistan..How the terorism survive because of Pakistan...Pakistan is hub of terorism in this world..if pakistan stop supporting terorist there will not be terorism in this world at all..Pakistan do all these things through ISI..Head offices of all major terorist organisation are openly operating in Pakistan..No restricton for terrorist..Pakistan provide everything which they need

[donkeyjote0104]

American policy made a lot of mistakes in the past and very few successful. Ideology cold war ended and war continues for economy and some greed people be much richer. At last, Afghanistan will be another Vietnam, another lesson to U.S. to they understand what is a real peace to the world. The answer is, only for some greed people, many people will be sacrificed and U.S.A. will lose again, in this world where information are much clear than fire.

[wannaruwae]

michael is deadly wrong since afghan people don't want the u.s. troops in afghanistan. when the u.s. troops came to afghan, the situation became out of frying pan into the fire. the u.s. troops are just messing up and creating chaos and killing innocent civilians by the careless bombings. the u.s. troops are the real terroists.

[USAneedsaChange]

@wannaruwae Did the Afghans want bin Laden and the Taliban? because those were the guys they had before. bin Laden had his camps there to educate terrorists. The world can't accept any nation to have known terror groups have camps openly in their countries... The bombings of USA don't target civilians, that's the difference between them and terrorists. It's still unfortunate that any civilian suffer. but if Afghanistan or other muslim nations don't do anything, USA have to.

[apelsinas69]

war is good,,,give war a chance

[dinamo4889]

happy birthday youtube! you can be watched in Afghanistan.

[lawharrison]

there is no honor in being a killer, only a hallow feeling of remorse.

[theratfarmer]

yeah, a smoke screen. whats next?

[MrFuckthisworld]

fucking white scum DIE

[crash76]

Another fake movies to cover Bush's conspiracies and to keep your focus on fake things against real murders they don on thousends of Americans 9/11. Bush is biggest lier ever!

[saadabdulaziz]

assholes get out of our lands. you already sucking all the resources now you have become vampires.

[jaymorpheus01]

I got one... why not press afghans in America that own a bunch of liquor stores and businesses... to help out their OWN PEOPLE!

[aybak07]

if you leave afghanistan, where r u going to fight with extremists from Turkey, chechnia, uzbekistan, pakistan, all gulf states and british muslims ? because they will come after you and your interests everywhere in the world.

[smujismuj]

myth

google Noam Chomsky

[dilbertgeg]

CIA invented Al-Qaeda in 1979, long before Soviets invaded, hoping a few terror attacks in one of their flank states and across border would prompt invasion ... which happened. Brzezinski told French reporter how he sponsored the Mujahideen, and that it was brilliant plan. Orrin Hatch agreed.

Today news anchors and guests claim not that terrorist attack on America would be BAD, that it would be the ONLY thing to "SAVE America".

[dilbertgeg]

Top Neocons and Trilateralists were writing in 2000 and before that USA needed to be attacked, that it would be "lucky" and "providential". We needed a "catastrophic and catalyzing event".

When are these people, with prior connections to Al-Qaeda ops, going to be tortured to reveal what THEY know.  When are they even going to be exposed on national TV?

Never. These people are leaders in the revolving door between National Security positions and related punditry and public relations.

[AlNouveau]

Well said, and sadly true. Thank you.

[tainoaz]

Afghanistan?! Some Data: 79-89 15k + dead and many more maimed and wounded. Billions of Rubles over 10 years bled the Soviet Economy.

Over One Million 'rats' Oops! I mean HUMAN BEINGS killed by; helicopter gunships, carpet bombing, bulldozing, land mines etc.

Geneva Convention? ROFL they killed anything that moved and let GOD sort them out!

RESULT? They got their ASSES handed to them anyway! They had to duck tail and run!

Anyone think we can WIN the War on Terror there? LMAO! Wake Up!

[krzysztofer85]

Vast deserted hills of Afghanistan were place where biggest, most powerful empires were humiliated. Alexander the Great has problem there. Colonial forces of British Empire were decimated there. Soviet Union suffered economical stagnation because of Afghan "intervention" and failed anyway. Probably Americans will get 2nd Vietnam too. It will "only" take another 1 million of Afghan lives in the process...

[amareto35]

@tainoaz why, you didn't know this when 10 years ago, or you thought you were tougher than the Russians, and OOPS, Alexander the great and the British...

[ElCanalDeCarlitos]

We will have a peaceful world only if the United States STOP acting as a "heroe" to other countries. Deep down we all know why United States are invading those rich oil countries..

Is not their business there!!!!

[JBeck862]

Afghanistan doesn't have any oil reserves.

[moreblahblahblah]

where do you think the pipe line goes through? 1st contract signed in 2002. go look it up.

[andimoi]

@JBeck862 Yeah but Iran has and Afghanistan borders Iran. Iran is also sponsoring the terrorist group hezbollah in lebonan and is a threat to Israel.

[DontEatEggs666]

@andimoi Israel is a threat itself. Isreal has developed hundreds of nuclear arms, and has invaded lebanon. Iran hasn't been agressive in hundreds of years.

[JG573]

@DontEatEggs666 What are you talking about? You want to know why Israel is so hostile towards muslim countries? Because Iran and many other countries have threaten to bomb the living shit of them and kill all of them multiple times. That isn't hostile aggressive? And on top of that Iran is developing nuclear weapons. Now that is really aggressive. No Israel didn't start it. Since they became a country they have been attacked. Cut the bullshit about them not being aggressive.

[psbjr]

@JG573 so threatening to bomb is worse than ACTUALLY BOMBING, which is what WE are doing NOW. Israel has nuclear weapons too, and guess what they defy the NPT, but oh wait they are ABOVE the law, they don't count, despite their history of aggression. How many countries has Iran invaded in the last 20 years, vs the US and Israel? Take a look at the history, start actually counting bodies, and you will realize how deluded you are

[JG573]

@psbjr We are bombing terrorists in Afghanistan because we are at war you dumbass. What are we suppose to do not drop bombs when we are at war haha. Plus we are talking about iran and israel not us. Haha aggression? Israel wouldn't have to be aggressive if it wasn't for iran and every other arab country wanting to kill them. Iran is surrounding by arab countries and they don't have american's driving airplanes into them so who are they going to invade?

[psbjr]

@JG573 Israel is currently in violation of international law. Removing settlements back to 1967 borders is one option to do instead of dropping white phosphorous on hospitals and "economically strangling" the Palestinians, abducting people without trial, etc etc.. Before waging war, it is the duty of every state to first exercise all peaceful means. Waging wars of aggression, on the contrary, as we have done in Iraq and as Israel continues to do, is a war crime, and leads to mass suffering.

[JG573]

@psbjr It is completely different circumstances. We got attacked so we went into the terrorist controlled Afghanistan to stop these terrorist. Iran on the other hand hasn't been attack and don't have the ability to invade a country so who are they going to invade. Instead since they know they can't invade israel or the US they sit back threaten to kill us all and they would do it if they could. So really shut the fuck up. Iran has killed more in the iraq and iran war then our wars.

[JG573]

@psbjr Israel and the US have a bigger body count because we have been attacked and threaten by arab countries and we defend ourselves. Israel since they have became a country was attacked they had no choice to defend themselves or die. Would you lay down and die or would you fight for your life like israel. Iran sits in there country like pussies and threatens to kill us all and acts aggressive and you dare to say that we shouldn't defend ourselves. SMart up dumbass and learn the facts.

[psbjr]

@JG573 and if you think we were attacked out of the blue, take a closer look at the U.S history around the world (carefully ignored on CNN and the like). It's not like they just randomly decided to attack us. We have been supporting the bad guys for a long time to maintain hegemony, and virtually created the situation in afghanistan ourselves by pumping arms and money in there. The best thing we can do for our safety is to start respecting the sovereignty of the peoples of all nations.

[USAneedsaChange]

@ElCanalDeCarlitos bin Laden had his terrorist camps there and now they're in Pakistan... so, I think USA have a business there. Actually I think that the "Arab League" or w/e coalition they have in the muslims world should be doing this, but they just sit there and seem to accept all the terrorism in Islam's name.

[tgriffy]

A useful debate, but I also have to agree more with Tom Hayden. What is lacking here is a clear goal of what we should be doing in/for Afghanistan. Lacking that, I have no idea whether a military solution is even helpful.

[Boomen17]

They both bring up very useful points, but I would still have to agree more with Tom Hayden.

[darkENhandsome]

What a fantastic video. This was an intelligent thoughtful and measured debate that was focused on solutions not egos or dogma. Thank you for elevating the quality of discussions on these issues.

[johnknight999]

All you truthers are "whacko!". The TALIBAN is BAD. The Taliban tried to burn and destroy the poppy fields. What are you anti-capitalist, anti American, anti-freedom? We care about the people of Afghanistan. We must protect freedom for all people and not allow the bad Taliban to destroy poppys. It's not good for the economy you idiots! Bwhaaaaaaaaaahahaha

[glebbukov]

Yes lets protect the people of Afghanistan by invading it then fighting civilians. Listen you fucking idiot, theres a number of things we could have other done, like strengthen its military and moniter it. not put Americans and British lives in danger, this is not our business;their country.

[johnknight999]

The CIA needs to keep importing heroin into the USA for your children AND to prop uo our dead economy. Hell, this war in Afghanistan can go on forever as long as people remain ignorant of the fact.

[Tcheuchter1]

America does not want to stop the poppy growing opium farmers in Afghanistan, if they wanted they could do it easily. remember how Napalm was used against civilians in Vietnam?, yet they dont seem to want to use it to destroy the poppy fields in Afghanistan. Simple answer is theres money in it for both sides. It all makes perfect sense, expressed in dollars and cents, pounds, shillings and pence. (Pink Floyd)

[frogscott68]

wow...you call this video a debate?

funny stuff...I think this is like the mild war monger debating the rabid war monger.

I thought the two would kiss each other. Please stop spreading debate that war is justified.

Now back to your corporate controlled regular programming...don't wake up and don't seek third party opinion.

Which flavor of shit do you prefer? Chocolate or Vanilla. Dems or Repubs.

[johnknight999]

wow...you call this video a debate?

Right on! When are people going to stop being so pathetically ignorant and embarasingly stupid?

[shaokem]

i agree war sucks its a horrible thing and many can not come around understanding why war comes about.... with that said its hard to disagree that problems of that country are affecting many other countries, and when this happens something must be done. also a debate doesn't have to be an argument. a debate should bring forth thought.

[moreblahblahblah]

Afghanistan is not a threat to any other country. check out the history of the country tru' the late 80's and who funded who, where they then developed into. key point, the Taliban had nothing to do with 911 either. they were happy to see it because the Americans left them out to dry (Mujahideen formally) after the end of '89. they were promised support but got none. The FBI don't list Osama as linked to 911, no proof. that video a marine found in a mud house (hello??) is fake. check Saudi & ISS

[hypnofan35]

Let's face it dudes! Afghanistan is all about the opium poppies and plantation economics. It is the biggest franchise in the world folks and the military is partnered with the US Gov to get the job done.. Like any large money maker it is extremely hard to give up. We are talking about all the heroin in the world or 90+%. You have free access and free range; the only thing left is beating down the competition. Same thing happened with Sadam. The oil went to SA and EAU for "freefining".

[jround93]

More soldiers should be sent to Afghanistan to fight the Taliban but also to increase the training of the Afghan army so they can fight the war without NATO help

Winning hearts and minds is just as important as destroying the Taliban millitarily

We shouldn't abandon the Afghan people to the Taliban

[flang]

and so when we leave Afghanistan another group we trained can become a leading terrorist organization in the world

[AnyeongF91]

....lol how many afghan citizens are part of the taliban?"

[hammergaidin]

This should be a good series. Upload in HD please :D

[snorkleporkle]

War has never been an answer to anything. Unfortunately USA has always supported other countries. There is enough violence going on everywhere.

Peace is what all God's creations need.

[pataphysician66]

It's nice to see a civil debate for once.

[ndyt]

Neither speaker stated the real shocker: Afghanistan is bigger and has more people then Iraq. Also, the people don't have electricity outside of cities, so most people are living in the stone age and follow a very fundamentalist from of Islam which is only a hair more relaxed then what the Taliban follow. And to make it even worse: the rugged terrain is perfect for guerrilla tactics and makes our modern equipment useless. Oh, and they have always hated outsiders of any kind.

[tuberpie68]

& if you don't believe ndyt, ask the Russians!

[ndyt]

tuberpie68, good point! The Russians had almost a MILLION troops there and still got their ass handed to them. Are we going to send two million? Were do we get them? Now you might want to look into Ron Emanuel's plan to have a mandatory draft!

[cc6809]

True. They had the numbers, the technology, spent quite a few years in the region... and where did that put them?. By all means that debacle helped out to bring the old Kremlin regime down.

[Foringin]

And the britons

[kevin2155boe]

I CANT even keep up with stuff any more. are we in iraq or afganistan or some where else?

[ndyt]

kevin2155boe, Both, we were in afganistan first, then we invaded iraq.

[kevin2155boe]

thanks

[tuberpie68]

I strongly suspect that your news sources are the reason that you're not keeping up. You can find some good ones right here on YT. Besides, bravenewfilms, there's: VOTERSTHINKdotORG; TheSexyPatriot; GregPalastOffice; ObamaTheBlackJFK; AlterFocus; TheYoungTurks; & AljezeeraEnglish, to mention a few.

[kevin2155boe]

apreciate it

[WKaliber1]

Poland > All else

[JuniperSun]

I don't understand why things can't be solved with nonviolent methods.

[ndyt]

JuniperSun, play the computer game Civilization. See if you can win without firing a shot.

[smujismuj]

JuniperSun

"I don't understand why things can't be solved with nonviolent methods."

Because the weapons industry is the most lucrative business on Earth.

Wars are for profit.

They have nothing to do with "fighting terrorism".

If we really wanted to fight terrorism, we'd shut down the Pentagon, the CIA, the WTO, the World Bank, The IMF etc.

The u.s. has been the world's leading terrorist nation since the end of WWII.

[TheJamMan69]

PWND