it says who is the liar if not he that denies that jesus/yashoua not is/is not the christos he is the anti christ that deny the father and the son word for word what i found
Jesus/Lucifer/occult = 74 = 11 represents the celestial twins from the FAMILY TREE which were forbbiden fruit/offspring. Lucifer as evil & Jesus as good aka good news. Eve said it LOOKED GOOD! We were NOT to partake of ANY of the FRUIT. Twins11+11=22=FIG! Israel is the FIG TREE as they hid their nakedness behind FIG LEAVES from the FIG TREE ie RELIGION as Christianity stems from Judaism as the serpent was in the midst/middle of the garden/earth which was planted eastward ie MIDDLE EAST! AWAKENED
Do you believe in GOD but don't beleive Jesus is the Messiah? (The Anointed One, The Savior)? Who are you waiting for?
When JESUS was arrested....they asked who are you looking for...-He responded" I Am" 'he.'" He answered I AM.(Translators added 'he' for easier reading.).
@lookingup82, Jesus never existed. I have a 14 part series titled "Proof of Jesus?" which looks at every secular text that the Church claims as proof of his existence. I am to believe that the Son of God, walked the Earth, doing miracles daily, but, no one, except his followers, noticed him or thought it was worth writing about?
@Mathetes76, Yes, Indeed it is embarrassing for you and othr Christians that try to explain this away. A "double negative", would require two negative terms used together in the same phrase, and that is NOT the case in this verse. Where do you see two negative terms in the phrase "Jesus is not the Christ"?
@Mathetes76, The Phrase in Greek is "ιησους ουκ εστιν ο χριστος", Jesus is not the Christ. There is only one negative word in the phrase. Now while you are correct that the construct "ου μη" (ou me) IS a double negative in Greek, the fact remains that "ου μη" was not used in this verse. Is it through ignorance or deception that you claim it is there? Anyone with common sense would have checked the text first.
@Mathetes76, Here is the entire verse in Greek- 1John 2:22 "τις εστιν ο ψευστης ει μη ο αρνουμενος οτι ιησους ουκ εστιν ο χριστος ουτος εστιν ο αντιχριστος ο αρνουμενος τον πατερα και τον υιον" As anyone can see, the construct "ου μη" is NOT found in this verse.
@Mathetes76, Also to argue that "ου μη" is found within the word "αρνουμενος", is as foolish as arguing that the presence of "no" within the word "knowledge" means that knowledge is evil.
@ForBibletruth Comparaing two langauages is difficult. In English Double negatives mean it's "positive-or the opposite..."I am not not a woman. [I AM a woman]. (Not the negative statement). IN MANY other languages, a double negative means emphasis.
@lookingup82, You are 100 % correct. I have a paragraph in the video description explaining that, but as you can see in the comments here, that hasn't stopped people from claiming there is a double negatived used in this verse, when that is not the case. In Greek as in English, both negative terms must be used back to back, and the negatives must all refer to the same word or expression, within the same clause of the sentence. There is no double negative in this verse.
@lookingup82, If we were to find your above example in Greek, both "nots" refer to the verb "am", and both "nots" would be combined for emphasis, and we would translated the sentence as " I am not a woman" or to convey the original idea of the Greek, we could say, "I am in no way a woman". However, back to the verse in 1 John 2:22. The first negative, is part of the constuct "ει μη" (if not), and this is not in the same clause of the sentence, and it is certainly not referring to Jesus.
@lookingup82, It is really foolish for Christians to be claiming that there is a double negative in this verse, because that would only add more emphasis on the clause stating that Jesus is NOT the Messiah.
@miss3v3lyn, Jesus was a fictional character in the Gospels, which are allegories-not history books. He represents the Spirit of God that resides in each one of us. God judges us by our actions-the word clearly states, "The soul that sinneth, it shall die..." Eze 18:20. We are responsible for our own actions, faith without works is dead. The idea that, if we just believe that someone else suffered for us, we can now live as we please and still be saved is not taught in the Bible.
Matthew 28:8 And they departed quickly from the sepulchre with fear and great joy; and did run to bring his disciples word.
Mark 16:8 And they went out quickly, and fled from the sepulchre; for they trembled and were amazed: neither said they any thing to any man; for they were afraid.
You can't have it both ways, either the woman did or did not tell the disciples-which verse is correct?
You assert that Christian leaders have purposefully hidden the truth. This is a vast conspiracy theory that falls under its own weight. It is extremely implausible that a lie of such magnitude could be propagated and passed down for two millennia without someone noticing before now.
All this demonstrates is the unrefined nature of the NT in its original forms (pre- modern era). It is well known that the early Christian leaders competed between themselves for the audience/converts. They forged many texts, and created fraudualent evidences. Gibbons, using the ancient historic writings showed this in the 18th century.
They never imaged even the simplist forensic methods of investigation. And not one of the "holy" leaders today dare to alter one jot of the original.
ForBibleTruth: just for confirmation, is it your belief that the authors of the Gospels intentionally used allegory? Or are you claiming that what they recounted as reality is to be taken as allegory?
Yes, I do believe that the writers intentionally used allegory, and did include contradictions in the text, to remind the reader of that fact. Christianity was a mystery religion, with both an inner message, for those with ears to hear, and outer message for the masses. See Matthew 13:34-35
It's an interesting assertion, for certain. But I'm having a tough time being as confident as you that people from that era were as proficient with allegory and metaphor as you give them credit for. Ancient people had a hard time taking things for anything but face value. To believe that a few had mastered the art of allegory in literature seems a stretch to me. Also, in that example, Jesus is referring to an obvious parable, (comparing heaven to a perfect mixture of yeast and flour)
You give little credit to Ancient cultures. Myth and fable, allegory and metaphor, were all very common modes of communication, used for centuries before the common era, and they are still in use today. This does not mean that every line has a hidden meaning. Did you not read Matthew 13:34-35? Jesus was not referring to a particular parable-he was not speaking at all. Those two verses are a comment by the Gospel's author. Why did Jesus speak in parables? See Mark 4:11-12 and Luke 8:10.
The practice still goes on today in (for instance) Sufi texts which carry deliberate apparent contradictions to deflect the gullible wishful thinker and draw the lovers of truth into meaningful reflection and also in the case of Sufi teachers who are apparently in opposition but - as Rumi said - "superficial conflicts may be resolved after deeper examination".
@DefendingChristJesus Why are people getting so defensive over their beliefs of a Greek Bible, KJV, English, or whatever... the original Bible is Hebrew...everything else is suspect. Its best to read MUCH into it...RESEARCH HEAVILY!!!! SHALOM
@diezelish I'll answer that question. Chrisitianity is still making an image of their maker, of their father and this requires defense : an identity problem. True God-ian (instead of christian) worship God who has no image, pure spirit. Knowledge is the only thing that cannot deceive you, perception can.
The word "ουκ" appears 1453 times in the New Testament, and in no instance can it mean "indespensable". Strongs dictionary states "ου Also ουκ used before a vowel and ουχ before an aspirate- A primary word; the absolutely negative adverb; no or not". Perhaps you would have us now change every verse in the New Testament that contains this word? Try it and see. Every time you see the word "no, not, nor, cannot, nothing or never" change it to "indispensable". This is what you believe?
"the word ουκ means indispensable ,the word δεν is 'not'.......you are wrong"
I think he got this idea from the translation service on google, which does indeed translate both of these words as he has said. Altavista Babelfish on the other hand won't translate either of the two words. Online translaters are very poor at what they do, from my experience.
Yes, well Koine Greek is a dead language, so I doubt any of the online translators were programed to deal with it.
Unless I am greatly mistaken, "δεν " is not even a word that is used in the New Testament, if it is a word at all. The closest word I could find is "δένδρον-dendron" meaning a tree or bush, like the Rhododendron.
John 4:21-24 21Jesus saith unto her, Woman, believe me, the hour cometh, when ye shall neither in this mountain, nor yet at Jerusalem, worship the Father. 22 Ye worship ye know not what: we know what we worship: for salvation is of the Jews. 23But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him. 24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.
Bible and religions belongs in the sphere of Fantasy and illusions. There's no boogie man so live your life well!
And in greek "Δεν υπάρχει θεός , όλα αυτά είναι δημιουργήματα της νοσηρής φαντασίας των εβραίων "
Greetings from Greece!
PS1) You can find more recent books written in greek to read! for example poetry , science books etc , so you can leave the new testament , it's a bit old do you think?
Is there anyone else historically or otherwise who has ever pointed this mistranslation out? I'd like to learn more about this so any writings regarding these mistranslations you could point to on the net would be much appreciated. Thank you.
I know of no text that will list them. I have found this through my own study of the text. I am not pointing it out as an issue of doctrine, but to point out that there are many contraditions in the Bible texts. I believe they are there to wake us up to the fact, that these things were not to be taken as historical fact.
I guess a Gnostic Christian would be a close discription, however I do not use the Gnostic texts. I do not belong to a group, so I see little use for a title.
If you are using the KJV, Yahuwah or Yahwah, is translated as LORD or as GOD. Any verse in the Bible could be called a lie, if it is misunderstood. As I said above, I do not believe the Gospels were intended to be understood as history books. Although they do contain many historic characters, that does not mean that the entire story line is lterally true. The modern story of "Forrest Gump" would be a good example of this. The Gospels are allegories.
Jesus is God in the flesh . The Father, the Son, The Holy Spirit- The Deity of GOD.
He is beyond our comprehension. To try to "figure" Him out and have the Word "figured out" in our understanding is going to make God less than what He is.
Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits and doctrines of devils;
1Ti 4:7 But refuse profane and old wives' fables, and exercise thyself rather unto godliness.1Ti 4:10 For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe. Isa 43:11 I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour.
The purpose of the video was to show that the NT does contain contradictions. Jesus was not the Messiah. The Jewish Messiah was to be a man that would free the Hebrews from their oppressors and lead them to world domination. Jesus did not do this. If you study the geneology given in the Gospels you will find that he came from a cursed line and could never sit on the throne of David. However Jesus never existed. See the videos-"Geneology of Jesus","When was Jesus Born?" and "Proof of Jesus?"14pts
Jesus never existed-He is a literary character, representing God's word or voice in the New Testament scriptures. Isa 43:11 I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour.
in indirect speech (indicated by "oti"). The entire sentence reads, "Tis estin o pseusths ei mh o arnoumenos oti isous ouk estin o xristos;" Literally, "Who is the liar except the one saying that Jesus is not the Christ?"
You have purposely mistranslated "o arnoumenos" as "the one saying". " o arnoumenos"(Strongs # G720)means to contradict, to deny, to reject. It does NOT mean "to say". The complete sentence says -Who is the liar except(if not,or but) the one contradicting (denying or rejecting) that Jesus IS NOT the Christ. All this was already in the video info box since day one. Your own comments have proven you to be the one in error. I never claimed the idiom "μη ουκ" was in the verse- You did.
(look to my comment at the top first (I forgot to reply) What the entire thing is asking is "Who is the liar but he that denies that Jesus is the Christ?". The extra word "ουκ" is left untranslated because English does not use an extra word to indicate that a "yes" answer is needed.
In short, this is a rhetorical question that is supposed to get a "yes" answer ("Who but a liar says Jesus is not Christ?") .
You have mistranslated it again- It says "Who is The liar if not the one who denies that Jesus is not the Christ". That would be you. The one who repeatedly and purposely mistranslated the text, with the intent to decieve
ell him to read the whole sentence before he goes making claims about mistranslations. It does indeed contain the words "mh" and "ouk," but he is wrong that "mh ouk" is the construction being used. The construction being used is "ei mh," meaning "except," and the second half the sentence is
LOL. "ell him to read the whole sentence..." It is you that claimed that ""mh ouk" is the construction being used" NOT ME. The quote is telling you that you are wrong.LOL
As you are a bible believer like me how do you explain John 3:16 and the four gospels or are they mistranslations? Also a Christian site I went on contained the original Greek σους ουκ εστιν ο χριστος so how come none of the letters were removed if they don't want you seeing it?
I view the Gospels as allegories-not history books. God sent his offspring-the spirit of Christ into the world. He is the light that lights every man coming into the world. He was not a historical character. Please see my videos " The True Christ-1John 4:1-6", Did Jesus ever exist?" as well as the 14 part series "Proof of Jesus?".
it's a common idiom in Greek, especially in clauses containing both "me" and "ouk" (as in this verse).
For example, Romans 10:18 says (literally) "Not have they not heard?" It is translated "Have they not heard?" (in Greek: me ouk ekousan?)
And besides, do you actually imagine that Greek-speaking Christians read this passage aloud every year in the liturgy for nearly 2000 years without noticing a problem?
μη ουκ used together is translated as an interrogitive and negative "is it not that?". This is not the case in 1John 2:22. It does NOT say ιησους μη ουκ εστιν ο χριστος meaning Is not Jesus the Christ? It DOES say "ιησους ουκ εστιν ο χριστος" meaning Jesus IS NOT the Christ. So while μη ουκ is a common idiom it is NOT used in this verse. On this your argument fails.
what do you think about The Holy Fire that is believed by the Orthodox Christians to be a miracle that occurs every year at the Church of the Holy Sepulchre in Jerusalem?is that a fraud?have any links that could debunk it?
Fraud is possible, but might be a natural phenomena. I doubt very much that the annual ceremony would ever be suspended, so that a team of experts could investigate. The "fire" is a blue tinted light that is hot enough to light a candle. It is said to behave slightly differently each year. It sounds to me like a lens might be used. Ever use a magnifying glass to start a fire? This can also be done with an ice cube. Simply use the warmth of your body to shape the ice into a lens.
The Church has not been above using fraud in the past. It has been said that they have sold enough splinters from "the True Cross" to build a fleet of ships. Tony Bushby's "The Crucifixion of Truth" relates a story, on page 146, of a crucifix which opened it's eyes and lips, lifted it's head at Kent, England. It was examined and found to be a spring loaded mechanical device.
I only suggested one possible method. There photos I have seen look like sun light coming in from a high window. There service starts at 11:00 AM to my knowledge. A trick candle is another possiblity. If you wish to believe it is a "miricle", that is your right of course. Rev 13:13 "And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men" This verse was talking about the Beast. See also Matthew 24:24.
I can find nothing in the Bible that supports the Christian teaching of one suffering in the flames of Hell for eternity. In the Old Testament Hell simply means a pit, a hole in the ground; in other words a grave. The New Testament uses the word "gehenna" which was a garbage pit. The only reason the fire keeps burning is because more items are added. We all sin. We should do our best not to. All that God has asked of us is that we love him and each other, to do good and hate evil.
You are correct about hell. I can't go into it because it would take to much space. The word Gehenna was not used to describe the Lake of Fire in Rev. It is a completely different thing. It is all good and everyone is saved. Gosh i wish I had more room to explain. Satan is not what we think he is either. Everything works for Good.
Did you look at the video info box? I included the English KJV text, the Greek TR text, the Latin Vulgate text. As you can see from the comments above, other viewers verified what I stated in a Greek text and the Blue Letter Bible also. I discovered this error through my own study of the scriptures. You can verify this yourself as others have done. I urged you to do so in the video. What other reference do you need? Do you not trust your own eyes?
With this Greek word for 'not' being in the sentence, is it possible that it is simply placed much like for insatnce German, where words such as 'not' or 'the' are placed in differently as regards the object(Jesus in this case) than they are in English? Know what I mean?
It is placed before the word that it is negating. In this case the word "(εστιν) is". In English of course we would say "is not" rather than "not is".
Found one that may be correct: Who is the lair, if not the one denying, that Jesus not is the Anointed one? This is the antichrist, the one denying the Father and the son. (1Jn 2:22 Diaglott-NT)-"The Emphatic Diaglott New Testament by the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society (1942." Wow didn't expect that text to have it right..lOL
Still with "ouk" in the statement, you have the liar deny a negative statement. The word order is the same in John 1:20 where John the Baptist says "I am not the Christ." Yet the translators dropped the negative in 1John 2:22. It says "not is" rather than "is not"-Is the Diaglott an interlinear Bible?
It's ridiculous I know but I'm only 17 and the Qur'an plays with the mind, warning the disbelievers who mock they really will know the hour they thought wasn't true!
I need someone like you who if read the Qur'an to reassure me why, maybe with historical knowledge like you have on Christianity, that the Qur'an is not true :)
Well, humans are highly skilled at making people doubt, manipulation, and mocking those who don't share the same views. Listen, if mere mortals said that God told them to sday it was from God, then all bets are off. How do we know that humans didn't write down "This book is not to be doubted" in the Qur'an? See, it's scary isn't it?
Anyone can write down "I am God and this is what I want." This is the reason why I beleive humans do HAVE an excuse for not believing, because regardless of what any book says, we really don't know for sure who wrote it. I believe that even though it might be the Word of God, God can't blame us for not believing.
What put believeing in christianity away was that 1)there was the same story over and over years and ands years before him. 2) it;s not the only religion so someone is wong 3) Religon is physhological-if the same minipulation/physhological assault of the mind can be used like in rediculous cults, what makes main stream religion any better? We are to live by the 10 commandmants yet man has made thousands of laws after to keep order. That's when I knew there was no God based religion.
Its called the fear-factor from the people in control to the people to be controlled. Books in religion and similar things are just their interpretations of telling you what to do. Thats why all religion is basically figuratively the same.
I did some reading in it many years ago. It is a jumbled mess of nonsense to me. It claims Jesus was a prophet, yet it knows nothing of his teachings. It allows a man to beat his wife and to kill people for leaving the faith. It teaches to kill people of other faiths for simply being in your country. It constainly tells you to ask the people of the book -then it tells you they are pigs and monkeys. These are not the words of any God that I wish to know.
it says who is the liar if not he that denies that jesus/yashoua not is/is not the christos he is the anti christ that deny the father and the son word for word what i found
tegaffer 1 month ago
Jesus/Lucifer/occult = 74 = 11 represents the celestial twins from the FAMILY TREE which were forbbiden fruit/offspring. Lucifer as evil & Jesus as good aka good news. Eve said it LOOKED GOOD! We were NOT to partake of ANY of the FRUIT. Twins11+11=22=FIG! Israel is the FIG TREE as they hid their nakedness behind FIG LEAVES from the FIG TREE ie RELIGION as Christianity stems from Judaism as the serpent was in the midst/middle of the garden/earth which was planted eastward ie MIDDLE EAST! AWAKENED
SPLENOROUS 6 months ago
Just would like to ask where is the text you got this from can you please post a link to the Greek text you found this in
jsmid 8 months ago
@jsmid, Have you been able to find a Greek text that does NOT say this?
ForBibletruth 8 months ago
Amen! brother PREACH!!
tria68 11 months ago
Do you believe in GOD but don't beleive Jesus is the Messiah? (The Anointed One, The Savior)? Who are you waiting for?
When JESUS was arrested....they asked who are you looking for...-He responded" I Am" 'he.'" He answered I AM.(Translators added 'he' for easier reading.).
lookingup82 1 year ago
@lookingup82, Jesus never existed. I have a 14 part series titled "Proof of Jesus?" which looks at every secular text that the Church claims as proof of his existence. I am to believe that the Son of God, walked the Earth, doing miracles daily, but, no one, except his followers, noticed him or thought it was worth writing about?
ForBibletruth 1 year ago
Comment removed
Mathetes76 1 year ago
@Mathetes76, Yes, Indeed it is embarrassing for you and othr Christians that try to explain this away. A "double negative", would require two negative terms used together in the same phrase, and that is NOT the case in this verse. Where do you see two negative terms in the phrase "Jesus is not the Christ"?
ForBibletruth 1 year ago
Comment removed
Mathetes76 1 year ago
@Mathetes76, The Phrase in Greek is "ιησους ουκ εστιν ο χριστος", Jesus is not the Christ. There is only one negative word in the phrase. Now while you are correct that the construct "ου μη" (ou me) IS a double negative in Greek, the fact remains that "ου μη" was not used in this verse. Is it through ignorance or deception that you claim it is there? Anyone with common sense would have checked the text first.
ForBibletruth 1 year ago
@Mathetes76, Here is the entire verse in Greek- 1John 2:22 "τις εστιν ο ψευστης ει μη ο αρνουμενος οτι ιησους ουκ εστιν ο χριστος ουτος εστιν ο αντιχριστος ο αρνουμενος τον πατερα και τον υιον" As anyone can see, the construct "ου μη" is NOT found in this verse.
ForBibletruth 1 year ago
@Mathetes76, Also to argue that "ου μη" is found within the word "αρνουμενος", is as foolish as arguing that the presence of "no" within the word "knowledge" means that knowledge is evil.
ForBibletruth 1 year ago
@ForBibletruth Comparaing two langauages is difficult. In English Double negatives mean it's "positive-or the opposite..."I am not not a woman. [I AM a woman]. (Not the negative statement). IN MANY other languages, a double negative means emphasis.
lookingup82 1 year ago
@lookingup82, You are 100 % correct. I have a paragraph in the video description explaining that, but as you can see in the comments here, that hasn't stopped people from claiming there is a double negatived used in this verse, when that is not the case. In Greek as in English, both negative terms must be used back to back, and the negatives must all refer to the same word or expression, within the same clause of the sentence. There is no double negative in this verse.
ForBibletruth 1 year ago
@lookingup82, If we were to find your above example in Greek, both "nots" refer to the verb "am", and both "nots" would be combined for emphasis, and we would translated the sentence as " I am not a woman" or to convey the original idea of the Greek, we could say, "I am in no way a woman". However, back to the verse in 1 John 2:22. The first negative, is part of the constuct "ει μη" (if not), and this is not in the same clause of the sentence, and it is certainly not referring to Jesus.
ForBibletruth 1 year ago
@lookingup82, It is really foolish for Christians to be claiming that there is a double negative in this verse, because that would only add more emphasis on the clause stating that Jesus is NOT the Messiah.
ForBibletruth 1 year ago
Regardless of the greek version:
The german translation of 1Joh 2,22 means exactly the same as in the english King James Version.
Luther Bible
Wer ist ein Lügner, wenn nicht, der da leugnet, daß Jesus der Christus sei? Das ist der Widerchrist, der den Vater und den Sohn leugnet.
schiller2222 1 year ago
@schiller2222, Yes, and once again the translators chose to ignore what the original text said.
ForBibletruth 1 year ago
@ForBibletruth Who then is this Jesus?
miss3v3lyn 1 year ago
@miss3v3lyn, Jesus was a fictional character in the Gospels, which are allegories-not history books. He represents the Spirit of God that resides in each one of us. God judges us by our actions-the word clearly states, "The soul that sinneth, it shall die..." Eze 18:20. We are responsible for our own actions, faith without works is dead. The idea that, if we just believe that someone else suffered for us, we can now live as we please and still be saved is not taught in the Bible.
ForBibletruth 1 year ago
And I don't need no other source of information to prove to me that the Holy Bible is 100% accurate
christistheway8233 2 years ago
Matthew 28:8 And they departed quickly from the sepulchre with fear and great joy; and did run to bring his disciples word.
Mark 16:8 And they went out quickly, and fled from the sepulchre; for they trembled and were amazed: neither said they any thing to any man; for they were afraid.
You can't have it both ways, either the woman did or did not tell the disciples-which verse is correct?
ForBibletruth 2 years ago
You assert that Christian leaders have purposefully hidden the truth. This is a vast conspiracy theory that falls under its own weight. It is extremely implausible that a lie of such magnitude could be propagated and passed down for two millennia without someone noticing before now.
gmbrannan 2 years ago
LOL, For 2000 years many have also stated that Jesus never existed, yet most have disregarded that as a foolish claim too.
ForBibletruth 2 years ago
All this demonstrates is the unrefined nature of the NT in its original forms (pre- modern era). It is well known that the early Christian leaders competed between themselves for the audience/converts. They forged many texts, and created fraudualent evidences. Gibbons, using the ancient historic writings showed this in the 18th century.
They never imaged even the simplist forensic methods of investigation. And not one of the "holy" leaders today dare to alter one jot of the original.
deaddoc 2 years ago
ForBibleTruth: just for confirmation, is it your belief that the authors of the Gospels intentionally used allegory? Or are you claiming that what they recounted as reality is to be taken as allegory?
photekxl 2 years ago
Yes, I do believe that the writers intentionally used allegory, and did include contradictions in the text, to remind the reader of that fact. Christianity was a mystery religion, with both an inner message, for those with ears to hear, and outer message for the masses. See Matthew 13:34-35
ForBibletruth 2 years ago
It's an interesting assertion, for certain. But I'm having a tough time being as confident as you that people from that era were as proficient with allegory and metaphor as you give them credit for. Ancient people had a hard time taking things for anything but face value. To believe that a few had mastered the art of allegory in literature seems a stretch to me. Also, in that example, Jesus is referring to an obvious parable, (comparing heaven to a perfect mixture of yeast and flour)
photekxl 2 years ago
You give little credit to Ancient cultures. Myth and fable, allegory and metaphor, were all very common modes of communication, used for centuries before the common era, and they are still in use today. This does not mean that every line has a hidden meaning. Did you not read Matthew 13:34-35? Jesus was not referring to a particular parable-he was not speaking at all. Those two verses are a comment by the Gospel's author. Why did Jesus speak in parables? See Mark 4:11-12 and Luke 8:10.
ForBibletruth 2 years ago
The practice still goes on today in (for instance) Sufi texts which carry deliberate apparent contradictions to deflect the gullible wishful thinker and draw the lovers of truth into meaningful reflection and also in the case of Sufi teachers who are apparently in opposition but - as Rumi said - "superficial conflicts may be resolved after deeper examination".
ZoeEGrace 2 years ago
It appears to be more of a perfect strategy.
lipoicacid 2 years ago
you are 100% correct.
lipoicacid 2 years ago
I think you reading to much into it..
How do you explain1 John 4v2.... I have a Greek Bible...
DefendingChristJesus 2 years ago
See: The True Christ-1 John 4:1-6
watch?v=MwYUC_J2Kt0
ForBibletruth 2 years ago
@DefendingChristJesus Why are people getting so defensive over their beliefs of a Greek Bible, KJV, English, or whatever... the original Bible is Hebrew...everything else is suspect. Its best to read MUCH into it...RESEARCH HEAVILY!!!! SHALOM
diezelish 2 years ago
@diezelish I'll answer that question. Chrisitianity is still making an image of their maker, of their father and this requires defense : an identity problem. True God-ian (instead of christian) worship God who has no image, pure spirit. Knowledge is the only thing that cannot deceive you, perception can.
patrolg 1 year ago
@diezelish Why isn't the hebrew bible suspect also?
xebec1958 1 year ago
According to Philo they contain deliberate allegories.The gnostics wrote all of the gospels but some are more gnostic than others.
lipoicacid 2 years ago
wat the hell?
kush11999 2 years ago
Great work!
nebulajr 2 years ago
the word ουκ means indispensable ,the word δεν is "not".......you are wrong
TheGodIessGod 3 years ago
The word "ουκ" appears 1453 times in the New Testament, and in no instance can it mean "indespensable". Strongs dictionary states "ου Also ουκ used before a vowel and ουχ before an aspirate- A primary word; the absolutely negative adverb; no or not". Perhaps you would have us now change every verse in the New Testament that contains this word? Try it and see. Every time you see the word "no, not, nor, cannot, nothing or never" change it to "indispensable". This is what you believe?
ForBibletruth 3 years ago
"the word ουκ means indispensable ,the word δεν is 'not'.......you are wrong"
I think he got this idea from the translation service on google, which does indeed translate both of these words as he has said. Altavista Babelfish on the other hand won't translate either of the two words. Online translaters are very poor at what they do, from my experience.
Lykaestria 2 years ago
Yes, well Koine Greek is a dead language, so I doubt any of the online translators were programed to deal with it.
Unless I am greatly mistaken, "δεν " is not even a word that is used in the New Testament, if it is a word at all. The closest word I could find is "δένδρον-dendron" meaning a tree or bush, like the Rhododendron.
ForBibletruth 2 years ago
So if I live still in Jesus but live a good life morally you believe I can reach Heaven?
FccB24 3 years ago
You cannot live in Jesus. Christ lives in us. See the videos on Theophilos.
ForBibletruth 3 years ago
I'm not seeing the Theophilos videos. Can you provide further info on them?
shunyotube 3 years ago
Theophilus-Sorry, I made a typo. watch?v=SuiR3FYvKTM watch?v=bM70j-JMq5U watch?v=-X8xQrxRqgc
Just copy each line and paste it in the seach window.
ForBibletruth 3 years ago
grejtube 3 years ago
What is truth?
Its like saying What is Perfect?
Stop taking things in the bible so literally.
Its psychological, like all religion, even governments , thus society is controlled to their standards.
drummer4life900 3 years ago 2
Bible and religions belongs in the sphere of Fantasy and illusions. There's no boogie man so live your life well!
And in greek "Δεν υπάρχει θεός , όλα αυτά είναι δημιουργήματα της νοσηρής φαντασίας των εβραίων "
Greetings from Greece!
PS1) You can find more recent books written in greek to read! for example poetry , science books etc , so you can leave the new testament , it's a bit old do you think?
satyrostv 3 years ago
No, I understand you. I have been watching your other videos and think you have done a good job in actually checking into these things.
emiage 3 years ago
Is there anyone else historically or otherwise who has ever pointed this mistranslation out? I'd like to learn more about this so any writings regarding these mistranslations you could point to on the net would be much appreciated. Thank you.
emiage 3 years ago
I know of no text that will list them. I have found this through my own study of the text. I am not pointing it out as an issue of doctrine, but to point out that there are many contraditions in the Bible texts. I believe they are there to wake us up to the fact, that these things were not to be taken as historical fact.
ForBibletruth 3 years ago
are u a jew or an atheist?
Celsus22 3 years ago
I guess a Gnostic Christian would be a close discription, however I do not use the Gnostic texts. I do not belong to a group, so I see little use for a title.
ForBibletruth 3 years ago
Very well...Where in the Old Testament is Yahuwah mentioned. Does that make the new testament a lie?
diezelish 2 years ago
If you are using the KJV, Yahuwah or Yahwah, is translated as LORD or as GOD. Any verse in the Bible could be called a lie, if it is misunderstood. As I said above, I do not believe the Gospels were intended to be understood as history books. Although they do contain many historic characters, that does not mean that the entire story line is lterally true. The modern story of "Forrest Gump" would be a good example of this. The Gospels are allegories.
ForBibletruth 2 years ago
Interesting video. Where on the internet can we find the full Greek translation of this text?
emiage 3 years ago
try googling
ForBibletruth 3 years ago
Jesus is God in the flesh . The Father, the Son, The Holy Spirit- The Deity of GOD.
He is beyond our comprehension. To try to "figure" Him out and have the Word "figured out" in our understanding is going to make God less than what He is.
nodoubt257 3 years ago
Given limited space here, I will ask you to watch these two videos. watch?v=MwYUC_J2Kt0 watch?v=MYNUuT_N5NE
ForBibletruth 3 years ago
I Timothy 4:1-4
Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits and doctrines of devils;
nodoubt257 3 years ago
1Ti 4:7 But refuse profane and old wives' fables, and exercise thyself rather unto godliness.1Ti 4:10 For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe. Isa 43:11 I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour.
ForBibletruth 3 years ago
And we see this each and everyday, but the bible speaks on these things.
jatamode 2 years ago
Most have itching ears to hear only what they want to hear.
ForBibletruth 2 years ago
@ForBibletruth...In the old testament, do you believe that the Messiah existed? If so, is it "Joshua" or Yahushua? What do you think or know?
diezelish 2 years ago
God is a spirit, not a historical person.
Isaiah 43:11 " I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour. "
ForBibletruth 2 years ago
Horus is the Krist.
martynblackburn1977 3 years ago
Do you even know what messiah means?? this doesnt prove jesus is not messiah
ShootAAppleOffMyHead 3 years ago
The purpose of the video was to show that the NT does contain contradictions. Jesus was not the Messiah. The Jewish Messiah was to be a man that would free the Hebrews from their oppressors and lead them to world domination. Jesus did not do this. If you study the geneology given in the Gospels you will find that he came from a cursed line and could never sit on the throne of David. However Jesus never existed. See the videos-"Geneology of Jesus","When was Jesus Born?" and "Proof of Jesus?"14pts
ForBibletruth 3 years ago
if Jesus isn't the Christ, who or what is?
eircom2222 3 years ago 2
Jesus never existed-He is a literary character, representing God's word or voice in the New Testament scriptures. Isa 43:11 I, even I, am the LORD; and beside me there is no saviour.
ForBibletruth 3 years ago
Horus.
martynblackburn1977 3 years ago
Don't look above, just take my comments as they are I got confused lol
tom8907 3 years ago
in indirect speech (indicated by "oti"). The entire sentence reads, "Tis estin o pseusths ei mh o arnoumenos oti isous ouk estin o xristos;" Literally, "Who is the liar except the one saying that Jesus is not the Christ?"
Sources:
Nestle-Aland NTG.
tom8907 3 years ago
You have purposely mistranslated "o arnoumenos" as "the one saying". " o arnoumenos"(Strongs # G720)means to contradict, to deny, to reject. It does NOT mean "to say". The complete sentence says -Who is the liar except(if not,or but) the one contradicting (denying or rejecting) that Jesus IS NOT the Christ. All this was already in the video info box since day one. Your own comments have proven you to be the one in error. I never claimed the idiom "μη ουκ" was in the verse- You did.
ForBibletruth 3 years ago
(look to my comment at the top first (I forgot to reply) What the entire thing is asking is "Who is the liar but he that denies that Jesus is the Christ?". The extra word "ουκ" is left untranslated because English does not use an extra word to indicate that a "yes" answer is needed.
In short, this is a rhetorical question that is supposed to get a "yes" answer ("Who but a liar says Jesus is not Christ?") .
tom8907 3 years ago
You have mistranslated it again- It says "Who is The liar if not the one who denies that Jesus is not the Christ". That would be you. The one who repeatedly and purposely mistranslated the text, with the intent to decieve
ForBibletruth 3 years ago
A comment for you:
ell him to read the whole sentence before he goes making claims about mistranslations. It does indeed contain the words "mh" and "ouk," but he is wrong that "mh ouk" is the construction being used. The construction being used is "ei mh," meaning "except," and the second half the sentence is
tom8907 3 years ago
LOL. "ell him to read the whole sentence..." It is you that claimed that ""mh ouk" is the construction being used" NOT ME. The quote is telling you that you are wrong.LOL
ForBibletruth 3 years ago
As you are a bible believer like me how do you explain John 3:16 and the four gospels or are they mistranslations? Also a Christian site I went on contained the original Greek σους ουκ εστιν ο χριστος so how come none of the letters were removed if they don't want you seeing it?
tom8907 3 years ago
I view the Gospels as allegories-not history books. God sent his offspring-the spirit of Christ into the world. He is the light that lights every man coming into the world. He was not a historical character. Please see my videos " The True Christ-1John 4:1-6", Did Jesus ever exist?" as well as the 14 part series "Proof of Jesus?".
ForBibletruth 3 years ago
You have many problems with your argument, first:
it's a common idiom in Greek, especially in clauses containing both "me" and "ouk" (as in this verse).
For example, Romans 10:18 says (literally) "Not have they not heard?" It is translated "Have they not heard?" (in Greek: me ouk ekousan?)
And besides, do you actually imagine that Greek-speaking Christians read this passage aloud every year in the liturgy for nearly 2000 years without noticing a problem?
tom8907 3 years ago
μη ουκ used together is translated as an interrogitive and negative "is it not that?". This is not the case in 1John 2:22. It does NOT say ιησους μη ουκ εστιν ο χριστος meaning Is not Jesus the Christ? It DOES say "ιησους ουκ εστιν ο χριστος" meaning Jesus IS NOT the Christ. So while μη ουκ is a common idiom it is NOT used in this verse. On this your argument fails.
ForBibletruth 3 years ago
You should write a book. You have to tell the christian world what you know, and spread the gospel of truth
CombustableHuxtable 3 years ago
thank you
BlueDesertScorpion 3 years ago
what do you think about The Holy Fire that is believed by the Orthodox Christians to be a miracle that occurs every year at the Church of the Holy Sepulchre in Jerusalem?is that a fraud?have any links that could debunk it?
BlueDesertScorpion 3 years ago
Fraud is possible, but might be a natural phenomena. I doubt very much that the annual ceremony would ever be suspended, so that a team of experts could investigate. The "fire" is a blue tinted light that is hot enough to light a candle. It is said to behave slightly differently each year. It sounds to me like a lens might be used. Ever use a magnifying glass to start a fire? This can also be done with an ice cube. Simply use the warmth of your body to shape the ice into a lens.
ForBibletruth 3 years ago
The Church has not been above using fraud in the past. It has been said that they have sold enough splinters from "the True Cross" to build a fleet of ships. Tony Bushby's "The Crucifixion of Truth" relates a story, on page 146, of a crucifix which opened it's eyes and lips, lifted it's head at Kent, England. It was examined and found to be a spring loaded mechanical device.
ForBibletruth 3 years ago
yes it is very strange that the priest goes alone in the tomb,so you're saying the "miracle" can't happen on cloudy days or at night?
BlueDesertScorpion 3 years ago
I only suggested one possible method. There photos I have seen look like sun light coming in from a high window. There service starts at 11:00 AM to my knowledge. A trick candle is another possiblity. If you wish to believe it is a "miricle", that is your right of course. Rev 13:13 "And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men" This verse was talking about the Beast. See also Matthew 24:24.
ForBibletruth 3 years ago
thanks you for your reply,i just want to ask you if you believe in hell,you think atheists like me will go there? :))))))
BlueDesertScorpion 3 years ago
I can find nothing in the Bible that supports the Christian teaching of one suffering in the flames of Hell for eternity. In the Old Testament Hell simply means a pit, a hole in the ground; in other words a grave. The New Testament uses the word "gehenna" which was a garbage pit. The only reason the fire keeps burning is because more items are added. We all sin. We should do our best not to. All that God has asked of us is that we love him and each other, to do good and hate evil.
ForBibletruth 3 years ago
You are correct about hell. I can't go into it because it would take to much space. The word Gehenna was not used to describe the Lake of Fire in Rev. It is a completely different thing. It is all good and everyone is saved. Gosh i wish I had more room to explain. Satan is not what we think he is either. Everything works for Good.
B0thergirl 3 years ago
Have you read Joseph Atwill's book CAESAR'S MESSIAH?
ChubbyCheckerChannel 3 years ago
Yes I have. It is just one of many theories. Julius Caesar is also a figure which Jesus may have been based on.
ForBibletruth 3 years ago
and he shows absolutlly no literaly reference for his claims.
commdude0621 3 years ago
Did you look at the video info box? I included the English KJV text, the Greek TR text, the Latin Vulgate text. As you can see from the comments above, other viewers verified what I stated in a Greek text and the Blue Letter Bible also. I discovered this error through my own study of the scriptures. You can verify this yourself as others have done. I urged you to do so in the video. What other reference do you need? Do you not trust your own eyes?
ForBibletruth 3 years ago
Jesus was just one of the delusional run of the mill types who believed that he was the son of god which in itself is a delusion.
There seems to be at least one of these delusional persons running around in every city today.
maurieer 3 years ago
Wow, it is untranslated at BlueLetterBible . org, too!
minorityop 3 years ago
i found an interesting passage that says that Jesus was a real man,please read Romans 1:3
durere1 3 years ago
Yes, it also says that he is the morning star (the planet Venus) in Rev 22:16.
ForBibletruth 3 years ago
"Yes, it also says that he is the morning star (the planet Venus) in Rev 22:16."
It is purely symbolic What does the morning star do? It is the sign of renewal.
B0thergirl 3 years ago
With this Greek word for 'not' being in the sentence, is it possible that it is simply placed much like for insatnce German, where words such as 'not' or 'the' are placed in differently as regards the object(Jesus in this case) than they are in English? Know what I mean?
ravenshire43 3 years ago
It is placed before the word that it is negating. In this case the word "(εστιν) is". In English of course we would say "is not" rather than "not is".
ForBibletruth 3 years ago
OK I get you on the 'is not' issue.
ravenshire43 3 years ago
Pretty complelling case, I'll be sure to look more into this.
HumbleYankee 3 years ago
Found one that may be correct: Who is the lair, if not the one denying, that Jesus not is the Anointed one? This is the antichrist, the one denying the Father and the son. (1Jn 2:22 Diaglott-NT)-"The Emphatic Diaglott New Testament by the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society (1942." Wow didn't expect that text to have it right..lOL
wayman29 3 years ago
Still with "ouk" in the statement, you have the liar deny a negative statement. The word order is the same in John 1:20 where John the Baptist says "I am not the Christ." Yet the translators dropped the negative in 1John 2:22. It says "not is" rather than "is not"-Is the Diaglott an interlinear Bible?
ForBibletruth 3 years ago
Great thoughts here. Nice work.
wayman29 3 years ago
Been watching your videos they're great.
Have you read the Qur'an?
It's ridiculous I know but I'm only 17 and the Qur'an plays with the mind, warning the disbelievers who mock they really will know the hour they thought wasn't true!
I need someone like you who if read the Qur'an to reassure me why, maybe with historical knowledge like you have on Christianity, that the Qur'an is not true :)
CombustableHuxtable 3 years ago
Well, humans are highly skilled at making people doubt, manipulation, and mocking those who don't share the same views. Listen, if mere mortals said that God told them to sday it was from God, then all bets are off. How do we know that humans didn't write down "This book is not to be doubted" in the Qur'an? See, it's scary isn't it?
HumbleYankee 3 years ago
Anyone can write down "I am God and this is what I want." This is the reason why I beleive humans do HAVE an excuse for not believing, because regardless of what any book says, we really don't know for sure who wrote it. I believe that even though it might be the Word of God, God can't blame us for not believing.
HumbleYankee 3 years ago
What put believeing in christianity away was that 1)there was the same story over and over years and ands years before him. 2) it;s not the only religion so someone is wong 3) Religon is physhological-if the same minipulation/physhological assault of the mind can be used like in rediculous cults, what makes main stream religion any better? We are to live by the 10 commandmants yet man has made thousands of laws after to keep order. That's when I knew there was no God based religion.
JimTL1000R 3 years ago 2
Its called the fear-factor from the people in control to the people to be controlled. Books in religion and similar things are just their interpretations of telling you what to do. Thats why all religion is basically figuratively the same.
drummer4life900 3 years ago
Nice explanation. You should be quoted.
Reynolds773 3 years ago
I did some reading in it many years ago. It is a jumbled mess of nonsense to me. It claims Jesus was a prophet, yet it knows nothing of his teachings. It allows a man to beat his wife and to kill people for leaving the faith. It teaches to kill people of other faiths for simply being in your country. It constainly tells you to ask the people of the book -then it tells you they are pigs and monkeys. These are not the words of any God that I wish to know.
ForBibletruth 3 years ago
the Bible is an amazing book,the christians are liars
DarwinIsHere 3 years ago
as always a pleasure listening to you
DarwinIsHere 3 years ago
Yay! Geezuz got owned.
Atheist001 3 years ago
Very interesting & thought-provoking video. Thanks.
tenneral 3 years ago