@ahmedazzubaidy Ahmed al Zubaidi's brains are full of shit. Person who gives his mobile phone online thinking that "persian pussies" will call him. Embarrassing asshole :)
"Drozd" costs 30.000$ and was installed only on T-55.
Arena-E (Export version) for BMP-3M costs about 400.000$. It is more expensive and less effective than Israeli Trophy.
On tank it was used only on T-80 as demonstrator. But it can go into serial production for BMP-3M if this version will be sold to any client.
Interesting detail is that despite Arena is not in mass production for tanks, all existing FCS ("Irtish", "Kalina") include electronic circuits for Arena.
@BitnikGr As i know the Trophy is only export version and have no standart operators.And as i know Russians selling only downgraded versions for export or less advanced systeme.I think its big diffrence between Arena not export and Arena E in reaction,range of reaction,relaibility and effectivness are known or common as most effective systeme!?How much this systeme cost?And maybe you heared or guess how much systemes are stored or fitted on T90s.
@Talshet Trophy is installed on every Merkava IV coming out factory since 2008 and there were some Merkava IV with Trophy as an upgrade for field test. Now it is in basic equipment.
There is no such a big difference between Arena-E and Arena. The only big problem of Arena is that it doesn't cover full upper hemisphere, but only +45dgrs.
As I said before, no T-90 is fitted with Arena yet.
They had Shtora system both in 1st and 2nd Chechen campaigns.
They hadn't ERA in 1st campaign and they sent tanks like on parade and they paid it with huge price. They had ERA and used proper tactics in 2nd Chechen campaign resulting about 10 tanks lost including non-combat losses.
They hadn't APS systems in both campaigns.
Nakidka, IR and Radar traps were not used in both campaigns, since Chechens hadn't such systems anyway.
PS: Speaking about politics on topic about technology is not "freedom of speech", it's a flaming and trolling. Find appropriate video to spit your bile as I said.
PPS: Freedom of speech doesn't mean that you may say anything anywhere in any form you like. Your rights are limited to the point where rights of other people start. You may say anything in form you like only in your own bedroom basically.
@prjerry7 Yeah yeah. Colin Powell had access to CIA sources when he was speaking to UN assembly about Iraqis WMD.
My sources are mostly from REAL tankers from different countries and from manufactor companies who sell their products world-wide. Maybe you suggest that GDLS doesn't lie, but UVZ does? Maybe LM doesn't lie, but NII Stali sure does?
Problem with Makarov, Serdyukov, Postnikov is that their lies are so blatant that they are obvious even to 5yo kids. But they are pleasing...
you keep trying to make a point by referencing WMD, i NEVER mentioned the iraq war nor wmd's [which is only part of the iraq resolution], now get back on topic.
As i said, your sources are propaganda which try to sell their product or over inflate cheap products for deterrent purposes, not Marakovs job.
Also, freedom of speech can be exercised outside your bedroom so you are WRONG...again.
Your the troll who jumped into MY conversation with another youtuber, so fuck off.
@prjerry7 1) The point is not what you mentioned or you didn't mention. My point is that even a highly ranked officer or even a president of a country can lie or can be stupid. G. Bush Jr is stupid! C. Powell lied! Who said that careerist General must be an intelligent person?
2) My sources are manuals, photo and video footage and a lot more. Makarov won't be able to back up his own words. But as I said, it is your choice to become a stupid parrot repeating stupid words of stupid man, because they suit your anti-russian agenda.
@prjerry7 3) Freedom of speech can be excersized outside of your bedroom, but not in ANY FORM you like, since it CAN violate rights of other citizens. If someone enters into a bus full of people and start screaming slogans pro-anything or anti-anything thinking that he has "freedom of speech", he will get his head smashed, because he is annoying and taking on nerves of people in that bus. Freedom of choice maybe exercized only in proper ways by proper means...
Speaking about political subjects on video about pure technology is lame, stupid and when author of this video tells you to stop, you have to stop. Otherwise upload your own video about fishes in aquarium and start speaking about evil communist regime in North Korea there ...
You can't back up Makarov's lies with an actual data. Noone can. Neither lies of Postnikov.
That makes you like stupid parrot repeating stupid words of a stupid man. It suits perfectly your anti-Russian agenda. That's fine with me. Just get a fuck out of my videos and spit your bile somewhere else.
I asked your more than 3 times to return on topic and speak only about tank protection systems and involved technologies. Enough if enough.
@prjerry7 You'd believe? With same success you'd believe that Iraq has WMD, right? It was already said to you, that intelligence of people is not depended on their rank. Either their sincerity.
I base my knowledge pure on technological level. While you are trying to present someone brainwashing and trolling in order to discriminate your opponent with a lame way. You quote ria novosti when it suits you. But then suddenly ria novosti becomes propaganda when it doesn't suit your lame ass.
This video is about technologies of tank protection systems. STOP bullshitting about irrelevant subjects... especially ones, which you can't comprehend.
@BitnikGr i know exactly what is going on in the russian arms industry and its history, and i also believe 1,000 times more what Marakov has to say about the Russian weaponry then some youtube troll.
@prjerry7 "they were trying to get the government to put more money into foreign defense industry." - STUPID!
"Those generals don't have personal gains from this" - EVEN MORE STUPID!
You simply don't have a clue idea about the subject and particularly about current situation of Russian MoD vs Russian MIC. Whatever you quote has simply twisted interpretation to suit your anti-Russian mind-set.
@BitnikGr Did he delete his account or something? =) I couldn't find his post that he replied to me with.
Anyway, as I was going to say, the reason behind the generals saying such things is simple, saying such things makes for debates within the M.O.D. and with such debates tank development will be on the forethought of Vladimir Popovkin's mind, since there are alot of people trying to take a bite of the military budget.
@prjerry7 They were merely trying to push the government into pumping more money to the defense industry, funny how you wouldn't normally quote rian unless it was a article that suits your opinion.
Something people here arguing which tank is the best. or not.. forget.. is that tanks will only be used by an invading country..once they have the control of the air.. you cannot send your tanks if you have hundreds of moderns jets and helicopters controlling the air. tanks are only usefull for fights againts third world countries.or minor scale wars. in a major war.Top nations have nuclear missiles and they can wipe entire armies on land ,entire tanks divisions of tanks with those weapons.
@prjerry7 you didn't see that US and Russian says negative things about their army to their politicians things like that to get more funding.. they alarm.. saying how bad shape their army airforce or navy is.. to get more funding for their projects.. Don't take his opinions seriously.. better find quotes of real experts or real test on the subject not public relations people trying to get more money from its parlament.. :)
@prjerry7 a t62 is a upgraded version of a t54/55, a t72 is a upgraded version of t62, a t80 is a upgraded version of t72 a t90 is a upgraded version of the t80, this is called tank evolution, so in theory a t90 is a upgraded t54.although the iraqis could have fougt a good fight against the americans they lacked the skill, morale and leadership to give the usa a good blow and their was a few m1 abrams tanks that where knocke dout then
@meee2014 its all upgrades. m1a2 is also an upgrade ofo lder American tanks.
Iraq lost due to many things but especially technological superiority of US weaponry, which, thanks to Reagan, were NEW, while Iraqs weapons were poor outdated soviet weaponry
@meee2014 Your lineup in evolution of Soviet tanks is quite wrong. But that's not important.
The rest of your comment is correct.
Lack of competent leadership, modern tactics, skills, modern technology = crashing defeat. And no bravery of private soldiers and low rank officers can replenish that.
@BitnikGr Iraq had probably gone on a similar crushing defeat even if their Army where equipped with M1A2, M2 and AH-64, I think.
Whole Discussion on how good American equipment was in Iraq is quite dumb when the war was a toy war, a slaughter that compares a grown man beating a small child, in that situation no one say that the adult man was good at fighting ...
Test bomb Moscow, send in the Marines in Vladivostok, roll the Army over the Russian plain, after that we can se whats good or bad.
Postnikov was commander of Russian ground forces. Makarov is now a General of HeadQuarter and there is another man... Serdyukov. Yes, they have highest positions. And yes, they say total bullshits. Examples of which I gave you above. Whatever they say is intended for "internal consumption", meaning that they ask pressure on Russian MIC in order to develop better weapon systems and most important to present transparent prices for their production.
@prjerry7 You are so lame, that you mistaking even historical facts! Iraq-Iran war... Iraq had Soviet planes, it was Iran, which had US made planes (F-4, F-5 and even F-14, and helicopters). Iran's air-force was the largest in the region before the war, and during 8years none of the countries didn't get air superiority. There wasn't domination in air by any side!
Iraqi Mi-24 (helicopter in case you don't know) even managed to shot down an Iranian F-4 (fighter... in case you don't know).
Sout-Vietnamese + US + Korean losses 1: 4 North Vietnamese combat losses
Man power in 1968 4:1 respectively.
Or maybe you are taking into account civilian losses too?
Don't you think that speaking about "mere" 50.000 husbands, fathers, sons, brothers killed is insulting to their memory? Wasn't it the American 300mln citizen society, which get tired of losses and demanded stop of the war? And you speak about "mere" perished your own fellow citizens?! Shame on you... Really!
@prjerry7 What you do cannot be named a "work" at all. I gave you same source and suddenly it is not good enough for you, because it says something different from what you want to present. And that is a propaganda!
Vietnam war? Yes, you killed more... Which was a final result?
Citation: "North Vietnam and Viet Cong victory Withdrawal of American forces from Indochina Dissolution of South Vietnam Communist governments take power in Vietnam, Cambodia and Laos"
Finally, in order to have a better perceptions on things you have no clue idea about, I strongly advise you to speak with someone from the "opposite" side in order to have a "second opinion" and find out that truth is somewhere in the middle. In this case "opposite side" are experts who can explain you that what those "Top General" said is plain BS.
@prjerry7 ... Market. Or maybe you wanna imply that Abrams doesn't incorporate foreign technologies in it? If you do, then do your homework and research deeper.
@prjerry7 ... would still believe that these tanks are the same, just because they have same name.
In second video you provided, its a reporter's stupid assumption that Russia will spend so much ammount for purchase of US weapons. Medvedev hadn't ever said that. He said that MIC must provide transparent prices and competitive products, otherwise MoD MAYBE will be allowed to buy TECHNOLOGIES abroad and not complex weapon systems in large numbers, which is a perfectly normal practice in Global...
@prjerry7 Do us a favor and don't comment on subjects you have no clue about ok?
The so called "Top Generals" say so stupid things that even a 6yo kid laughs at them. There is an internal confrontation of Russian MIC and MoD and it creates a bad publicity, but that in no way doesn't represent real picture.
First video you provided is the perfect example of propaganda. Since differences of Iraqi T-72 and Soviet T-72 were thoroughly discusses all over internet and only a blind brainless retard...
@CelestialVulpes I meant that today we have 3-4 men crews. 4th generation MBT will be 2-3men. FCS was a project of 4th generation MBT and it had 3men crew. T-95 has 3 men crew, but there are designs for 2 men crews as well.
Unmanned turret will make interior space smaller. Crew sits in armored capsule, which is isolated from combat and engine compartments. Different layout is the main characteristic of feature generation of MBT.
@BitnikGr Engine compartment is more or less isolated in Renault FT. Combat compartment, if it is just where the gun breech is, also isolated with the newer auto-loader.
While electronics systems can share work load of tanks crews, tanks ain't combat aircrafts, their engagement zone is 360 degree horizontal, the ground is full of terrain and objects you need to have your driver focus on driving, gunner for targets and commander to cover their blind spots.
@CelestialVulpes This can be done placing whole crew in tank's body and leaving turret unmanned.
Unmanned turret can host bigger gun or can become smaller in size. Crew sits in armored isolated capsule. 360degree visibility can be achieved with help of electronics and technology like "looking through steel". Something like on F-35.
T-95 has unmanned turret and 2-3 men crew sitting in tank's body.
I am not sure about Armata... It is yet unknown if it will have manned or unmanned turret.
@BitnikGr Problem with design like this is that it have no fail-safe/back up manual system at all; so the tank would cease to function as soon as the optics get taken off.
And really, if you go for maximum automation, you should either have no or just one crew.
@CelestialVulpes Why do you think that? All modern tanks have reserve sights in case if their main sights are off. And yes, sensors and optics are vulnerable on all modern tanks. And yes, blind tank cease to function.
@BitnikGr isolated crew compartment = less physical vision block around the tank. Turret is the only place which you can put physical vision block 360 degree all round.
@CelestialVulpes What for do you need physical vision blocks, when sights with combined 3-channel vision can be installed on tank? In case of power disrupt or main sights going off, a tank may have reserve electronic vision with its own power (it is implemented already today with reserve gunner's sight). Furthermore, physical vision blocks are prone to enemy laser attacks, which can blind human's eye. Meanwhile laser can only burn electronic equipment when electronic sights are implemented.
China already deploys such combat lasers on their Type-99 and Type-99A2. There are already more than 600 of them. Despite that such lasers are excluded from a list of conventional weapons.
From the other side, having 2 independent electronic systems for 360dgr visibility is a too damn expensive solution. That's the main reason why T-95 didn't go into production. Too technologically complex and too expensive. Intermediate solution in form of "Armata" was chosen.
@TATARSTAN59500 Yes. T-95 is only a prototype of 4th generation MBT. And T-90MS is also only a prototype right now. UVZ won't build it if there will be no orders on it.
@TATARSTAN59500 Yes, armor is upgraded. Relikt is a new generation of ERA... yes. But not the whole tank.
Yes, T-90MS has new FCS and new thermals... but such optics and systems exist on other 3rd generation tanks too. Satellite Navigation and radio comms also exist on other 2nd and 3rd generation tanks.
And engine is not 1500HP, but 1230 or 1250HP.
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So, it's an evolution of 3rd generation and not 4th generation.
@MrTianak69 Well, tanks you mentioned don't exist in Baltic States, Ukraine, Belarus, Georgia, Ajerbajdzhan, Kazakhstan, China and Mongolia (Russian T-90)
Neither they are in Pakistan, Bangladesh, Pakistan and China. (Indian T-90S)
Neither they do exist in Morocco, Tunisia, Libya, Mauritania, Mali, Niger (Algerian T-90SA).
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The most modern MBTs Russian T-90A may meet today are Swedish, Norwegian and Polish Leopards 2A4 and Japanese Type-10.
But don't forget... tanks are mobile force. Any NATO tank based in Europe (everyone you mentioned except Merkava) can easily be transported to Baltic States and be placed at Russian borders within a week.
Talk, Talk, Talk, Talk, Talk and Talk some more. Look at history, M1 merked every soviet tank its been put up ageinst! Say what you want, but you cannot point to one time in history where the T72 and the T90 inflicted even insignificant losses on the M1! Look at how many soviet tanks went up ageinst Israel and lost, its hilariouse that you even talk like this because all you can rattle off are the numbers that dont matter and act as though they do.
@TheTodd1023 1) M1 never faced real soviet equipment on equal terms. Iraqi T-72M were at level of M60A1 at best...
More M1 were lost in Iraq than M60A3 TTS. That's say something. Arabs never have shown to posses demanded skills with any equipment. Either Soviet, either American.
Same outdated T-72M monkey models inflicted a lot of damage to Iranian M60s. This was a battle on equal terms, not Adrams vs T-72M. T-90 would have same success against M-48/60, Challenger 1, Leopard 1.
@BitnikGr People have a tendency to forget that the decisive factor is human, how well trained and motivated tank crews are. Equipment is secondary, a good example is the WW2 Germans against French.
French had more and much better tanks and still lost lamentably. The German crews where highly motivated and trained. Similar thing occurred in 1973 in Arab-Israeli conflict as well Desert Storm...
@BitnikGr Are you forgetting about a few things? If you want to talk about other conflicts, we can. Now let us talk about what happend to the Russian equipment losses in the Russo-Finno war or the losses in the Afghan theater. Both of these situations are great examples of how the Russian doctrine for war is carried out. Equipment is just a pawn in their eyes, do the research read a book called Slaughterhouse and go to a local college library, talk to the history professors.
1) Afghan theater comes out with ABSOLUTELY same results for every invader during centuries. USSR was the only one who had to leave this "project" empty handed.
2) Every army has its victories and defeats. You mentioned the only two you knew, right? What about Alexander Suvorov campaigns? What about defeat of Napoleon? What about the ultimate war for elimination in our recent history? You know whos doctrine won, right?
2) This is not a video about T-90 or any other tank. This is a video about available tank protection systems and principle of their work. Israeli Rafael company have videos about how their APS "Trophy" can protect M113 or Stryker. Those videos are not about Stryker and M113, right?
Instead of talking bullshits, you could describe how American similar systems work on Abrams or Bradley. But no... instead of talking about engineering solutions, you prefer to talk about bullshits...
@BitnikGr A team is what wins on the track feild and a team is what wins a war. You are not looking at the whole picture, the Abrams is a small part of a bigger picture. That picture that I am talking of is the entire US military from the US Air force to the USMC, Army and Navy. We made all of their strengths count for nothing when we knocked out the communication and radar. You NEVER fight fair in war. They come at us with a tank, we drop a 2000 pound JDAM on it!
@TheTodd1023 Yes. The US Army is the strongest Army in the World! I agree.
But I repeat for one more time... This is a pure technological video, about principles of operation of all kind of protection systems of main battle tanks.
If you want to discuss how Abrams MCD is better than Russian Shtora or how Quick-Kill is better than Russian Arena and Israeli Trophy or maybe about effectiveness of Abrams ARAT compared to other ERA then YOU ARE WELCOME. Otherwise, leave your comments for other vids.
@BitnikGr Why would you even want to argue about a peice of technology and brag it up when there are so many other peices of technology that make it null and void in real life?
@TheTodd1023 Why there are dedicated documentaries and presentations for EVERY existing piece of technology? Are you interesting to know "how the stuff works?". Well, many people are... And yes, technology which overcomes current protection systems is also an interesting subject for discussion and their principle of operation does indeed fits in this conversation. Like for example triple-charge-warheads, top-attacks, development of new sabot rounds, laser protection systems (chinese Type-99) etc
@TheTodd1023 3) You are 25yo American... "merked", "egeinst", "hilaruouse"... Learn your own language first if you want be called a patriot and be respected when you talk to international community. If you don't respect and you vandalize your own language, don't expect to be respected from others.
@TheTodd1023 the reason for the iraqi losses against the m1 because the russians gave the arab naitons the export versions of the t55 t72 t62 , those versions are without anti missile and shell protection day and night visions and infared and automated loaders and turrets plus the t 90 has never been used in combat, lool the abrams can be blown up by a 70 mm projectile witch is from a rpg 7 so shut the fuck up you cunt
1. Those tanks were export 'monkey models' or license production but this isn't the main problem.
2. The underlying reason for their poor performance is the inherent weakness of arabs at modern warfare. Give them western gear and provide the IDF with Russian toys - the result will be the same. Generations of military advisors became desperate because of this. Google 'why arabs loose their wars'
@HeildemKrieg Remember that Russians mount kontakt 5 on T90's which make em pretty much immune to 120mm sabot rounds, americans tested kontakt 5 on a T72 by shooting at it with the apfsds rounds abrams use.
@HeildemKrieg ... close to tanks. Infantry follows tanks in IFVs. Like US infantry did in Iraq in 1991 and 2003. So in such scenario there shouldn't be any problem with shrapnel and debris. This problem exists in counter-insurgent environment. And even in such case, APS systems can be switched off by commander of a tank.
@HeildemKrieg Newest Russian reactive armor (like Relikt) is effective against APFSDS rounds as well.
The USA develops Quick Kill system. First tests on the field are programmed for spring of 2011. It is a 30years delay after first Soviet similar system, but there are almost no doubts that Quick Kill will be better than Arena in every aspect. We are talking about 15-20years. Electronics in our days are much more efficient.
According to doctrines of wide scale war infantry wouldn't ever be...
@BitnikGr I believe T-90 is better than any western tanks because this russian philosphy change my point of view about tanks. I like they said here " Minimize the chance of contact of enemy projectile to the tanks armor..
@369NICK963 As far as I know the ERA that use by chally2 and leop 2 are for Anti RPG system only but K5 Era are design to deflect all Anti Tank as possible, It includes HEAT, AP, Missiles etc.. This documentary is old made during late 80's or early 90's so you can suspect that T-90 here are obsolete compare the T-90's today.. I believe russian pilosophy for tanks are better than those in the west because West made their tanks as heavy armor type which could sustain any hit from Anti tank.
@369NICK963 But what russians amaze is their philisophy is to with lots of counter measures against Anti Tanks and they want their system to prevent any Anti tanks not hit the tank as possible which mention as Layer 1, and layer 2 defence but in case the tank reach the armor they ERA to stop the Anti Tank..
Even IF they would spot each other, the round fired by a Leopard 2 are 128 MM wouldnt even scratch a T-90.. they would need 2 bullets anyway because of the Kontak5 ERA armor...(+ all armor = 1350mm of armor) (and im including LAHAT anti- tank missiles with this)
@SuperNegerBamiBal Not 128, but 120mm. Caliber doesn't matter actually. 120 and 125 is almost the same. What matters is gun length and barrel pressure. How can you possibly know real armor equivalent of any tank? This information is undisclosed by any manufacturer and this can be proven only by trial.
Kontakt5 doesn't protect from sabots... Relikt does.
Lahat is NLOS and by thus it is a top attack. No tank in the world has effective enough armor on top to counter such attack.
@therealsleepwalker Была... эффективной вещью. Сегодня Израильские аналоги эффективнее да еще и дешевле. Про Украинский "Нож" не знаю. Американский "Квик Килл" и немецкий аналог завтра тоже будут уже лучше "Арены". 30 лет прошло все же. России нужна новая система активной защиты.
Хотя сегодня всего 3 страны из добрых 40, которые строят танки имеют такие системы. Ну завтра станут 5.
@30DOTCOM "who HAD better tank" - because today foreign analogues are better than presented here Russian defensive systems. It is not surprising. It is an old documentary about 30years old technology.
@BitnikGr ok, i should probably reply by saying something like: "so what tanks are those systems are installed on? because all i see is a few promotional videos and few cartoons (lol) showing us how "great" they are. russian system is on t-90, which tank has your systems on it?". that is what i should'we replied with, but hey, it doesn't matter anymore man. russkies already created rpg that breaks thru that type of defense. (both western made ans russian made, just to be fair)
@val28l MCD is installed on Abrams. Quick-Kill system is planned to be tested in 2011.
Merkava has its own soft-kill system and it has Trophy. All three of these systems are better than Shtora-2 and Arena-E.
Yes, you are right. Double salvo from Khrizantema or Kornet-EM systems will defeat any existing Hard-Kill system. But that doesn't change the fact that Trophy is better than Arena. It is more effective and it is cheaper. ($300.000 vs $400.000)
@BitnikGr "and it is cheaper. ($300.000 vs $400.000)" which would explain the fact why russians only install those on the commander's tank. btw, shtora is the system that hides tanks from missiles, doesn't destroy them (missiles that is). not sure how it got mixed up w/ arena.
@val28l Which would explain why noone in the World would buy more expensive and less effective 30yo system. If I was a client, I would buy naked BMP-3M and install cheaper and more effective Trophy on it, instead of buying it with Arena-E.
Shtora is a defensive soft-kill system and we are talking about them. Not only Hard-Kills. US analogue of Shtora is MCD (missile countermeasure device). I don't recall the name of Israeli similar system...
@BitnikGr oooh, do tell more about mcd pls, i would like to see it in action. for some reason, i have not seen anything like that on the tanks in iraq O.O not sure how i missed it. wth?
@BitnikGr excellent, i found it, thank you. but why so little info? in the video above, i can see how russian system deals with heat guided missiles, laser guided missiles, and t-v (is that the right name) guided missiles. are there any pictures and/or videos on how AN/VLQ-6 system works?
@val28l Maybe because they think that this is a super-duper system, like in "Future Weapons". Meanwhile basic principles are the same. Israeli analogue works about the same way.
The point is in technical specs. What laser beam power can sensors detect? Vertical angle of coverage? Number of smoke grenades? Density and distance of placed smoke? Chemical materials used? Minimum time needed for reaction? Which waves lengths are jammed? All these may vary, but basic principles are the same.
@BitnikGr yes, i am sure that both systems work about the same, was just asking if you know where i can find a video or even few pics of it just to see (video preferred, since it is youtube, lol)
@val28l Presentation of Shtora would be enough. Soft-kill systems' work is invisible to human eye. You can't see laser rangefinder beam. You can't see electronic jamming. Well, only work of smoke grenades discharges is visible :)
The main thing is that soft-kill system works only when its sensors detect laser beam. If there is no laser illumination of target, or sensors are not sensitive enough, soft-kill won't react.
@cammander263 What does a top speed of Abrams or T-90 has to do with "Tank Protection Systems"? This video is about ERA, Soft-kill, hard-kill APS, EMP, optical-electronic jammers and other additional gadgets above of main armor.
If you would describe advantages of Abrams MCD over Russian Shtora, then your comment would be suitable for this video... But talking bs about top speed has no sence here. Go and place it here: /watch?v=SWG6Tp04Nnk
...
but anyhow, I'll tell you couple of words about...
When Abrams came into service it was 63tons and had 1500HP engine and top speed was stated at 70-72km/h... which was proven correct in Greek MBT trials in 1998.
Now M1A2 with ARAT or TUSK upgrades weight 70tons and has the same engine. Can you really beleive that it still can reach stated 72km/h?
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Russian tanks, no matter if they are diesel or gas-turbine powered, give smaller top speed number in manuals considering harsh enviroment and loss of power and overload on...
@BitnikGr yes, because as the weight increases they lower the engine governor a little bit to accommodate for the weight increase,therefore, keeping the same speed even though the weight has been increased.
@hotpocketpoison Probable. And it seems the case with Abrams. But not with Bradley. Increasing Bradley's A2/A3 armor and weight, its top speed have reduced.
@BitnikGr ... of transmission. So, stated numbers of 65-70km/h in manuals in reality is easily 80km/h for T-72/80/90, and this was also proved in the same tender in 1998.
So, T-90 can reach 70km/h on the road in ANY atmospheric conditions. While Abrams can reach 70km/h only if someone drop it from a mountain.
@warnation101 It is not just a smoke, but with special ingridients like aerosol. Even modern laser-guided systems can "see" through such cover. Remember that this is kinda old video.
But yes, there are a lot of examples when cheap counter-measures can fool hell lot an expensive weapons. Especially in anti-air defence.
@GRATZIANI2002 Thanks if u care about my health but i'm not from Moscow. Anyway Gorbachev was and still US cocksucker and it was confermed by all russians. About stupidity and mafia speak for your country u have same problems or bigger...
For all haters... My dear american friends, u can think everything u want but if one day you attack Russia and we will fuck you. I really hope that u becom smarter and u'll not crying and show your respekt for russian people.
knowing that all this is red promo, I have big doubts about., maybe some Indians or Chinese to spend some money to buy it, for research purposes.. .all I can say is that my dog is smarter and better feed than any russian tank crew .period.
@GRATZIANI2002 As I've already aswered to one similar comment with yours, this video is about how Anti-Tank measures works and principles of work of tank defense systems to beat those anti-tank weapons.
This is not about T-90 itself.
Today similar systems in arsenal of other countries are even better than those which are presented here.
Video of "Trophy" APS installed on Stryker is not about Stryker, but about how Trophy works!
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Please, discuss defensive systems of modern MBT. Thank you.
@GRATZIANI2002 Oh my god! They really washed your brain (if u have it). Tipical american bullshit about KGB and comerade Stalin. U really silly boy. Grow up man! How can u be so stupid i don't know, but for info there's no KGB and everybody in Russia can said u that stalin was a asshole just like u. Oh, an another thing if one bitch speak russian that doesn't mean that she's a russian. 99 of 100 whores u can see on streets who speak russian came from another ex soviet republics like Ukraine...
@GRATZIANI2002 and Moldava. I lived in europe, in Italy for precision, and i can say u that almost every person who speak russian there came from Ukraine. Western Ukraine, but i know that u can't understand the difference betwen Ukraine and Russia. Russian Federation is a richest country of all ex soviet republics. So shot u fuck up and riched your colture level u moron! Fucking troll!
@GRATZIANI2002 Good research experiment would be to send you and your dog in space. And while your dog would receive orders from NASA to do several operations and scientific experiments, you would be there only to open cans for your dog and you would be prohibed to touch anything onboard!
Just feed your dog and leave the rest... you are not up to it. :)
Abrams isnt short for abraham... Its named after a guy who drove his tank from like normandy to berlin or something like that.... Dont hate on someone if your not sure of the answer before hand
Seriously what all these comments about USA and Vietnam and Russia?
I came here to look at the defence systems on the T-90 tank. I really don't care at all about American or Russian propaganda.
ANimouz 2 weeks ago
Дураков на этой планете большинство, с чем стоит смериться. Они будут продолжать кидаться говном пока есть такая возможность.
Но если и случаться мировые конфликты то четез сутки (может два-три дня) все мы будем распылены ядерным взрывом...
ikeorus 2 weeks ago
@ahmedazzubaidy Ahmed al Zubaidi's brains are full of shit. Person who gives his mobile phone online thinking that "persian pussies" will call him. Embarrassing asshole :)
BitnikGr 3 weeks ago 2
BitnikGr do you know how many T72s or T90s are equipped with Arena or Drozd.And how much it costs?
Talshet 1 month ago
@Talshet None.
"Drozd" costs 30.000$ and was installed only on T-55.
Arena-E (Export version) for BMP-3M costs about 400.000$. It is more expensive and less effective than Israeli Trophy.
On tank it was used only on T-80 as demonstrator. But it can go into serial production for BMP-3M if this version will be sold to any client.
Interesting detail is that despite Arena is not in mass production for tanks, all existing FCS ("Irtish", "Kalina") include electronic circuits for Arena.
BitnikGr 1 month ago
@BitnikGr As i know the Trophy is only export version and have no standart operators.And as i know Russians selling only downgraded versions for export or less advanced systeme.I think its big diffrence between Arena not export and Arena E in reaction,range of reaction,relaibility and effectivness are known or common as most effective systeme!?How much this systeme cost?And maybe you heared or guess how much systemes are stored or fitted on T90s.
Talshet 1 month ago
@Talshet Trophy is installed on every Merkava IV coming out factory since 2008 and there were some Merkava IV with Trophy as an upgrade for field test. Now it is in basic equipment.
There is no such a big difference between Arena-E and Arena. The only big problem of Arena is that it doesn't cover full upper hemisphere, but only +45dgrs.
As I said before, no T-90 is fitted with Arena yet.
BitnikGr 1 month ago
ths for this vid m8
Oregons 1 month ago
Why did the Russians not have these technologies on their tanks during the Chechen war?
botchedonce 1 month ago
@botchedonce Which ones and at which Chechen war?
They had Shtora system both in 1st and 2nd Chechen campaigns.
They hadn't ERA in 1st campaign and they sent tanks like on parade and they paid it with huge price. They had ERA and used proper tactics in 2nd Chechen campaign resulting about 10 tanks lost including non-combat losses.
They hadn't APS systems in both campaigns.
Nakidka, IR and Radar traps were not used in both campaigns, since Chechens hadn't such systems anyway.
BitnikGr 1 month ago
@BitnikGr Thanks!
botchedonce 1 month ago
@prjerry7 ...
PS: Speaking about politics on topic about technology is not "freedom of speech", it's a flaming and trolling. Find appropriate video to spit your bile as I said.
PPS: Freedom of speech doesn't mean that you may say anything anywhere in any form you like. Your rights are limited to the point where rights of other people start. You may say anything in form you like only in your own bedroom basically.
BitnikGr 1 month ago
@prjerry7 ... morons like you. It's a cherry top for Cold-War Era haters like you.
Comparison of ATGM's range with range of a tank gun is STUPID.
Comparison of TBM with MLRS rounds is STUPID. It's like comparing range of GBU and AAM.
Saying that for price of 1 T-90 you can buy 3 Leopards 2 is STUPID.
You are free man, with "freedom of speech" and you can freely believe STUPID claims and lies, which makes you looking not so smart as well.
That's why I said that you are like a parrot.
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BitnikGr 1 month ago 7
@prjerry7 Yeah yeah. Colin Powell had access to CIA sources when he was speaking to UN assembly about Iraqis WMD.
My sources are mostly from REAL tankers from different countries and from manufactor companies who sell their products world-wide. Maybe you suggest that GDLS doesn't lie, but UVZ does? Maybe LM doesn't lie, but NII Stali sure does?
Problem with Makarov, Serdyukov, Postnikov is that their lies are so blatant that they are obvious even to 5yo kids. But they are pleasing...
BitnikGr 1 month ago
@BitnikGr nonononono
you keep trying to make a point by referencing WMD, i NEVER mentioned the iraq war nor wmd's [which is only part of the iraq resolution], now get back on topic.
As i said, your sources are propaganda which try to sell their product or over inflate cheap products for deterrent purposes, not Marakovs job.
Also, freedom of speech can be exercised outside your bedroom so you are WRONG...again.
Your the troll who jumped into MY conversation with another youtuber, so fuck off.
prjerry7 1 month ago
@prjerry7 1) The point is not what you mentioned or you didn't mention. My point is that even a highly ranked officer or even a president of a country can lie or can be stupid. G. Bush Jr is stupid! C. Powell lied! Who said that careerist General must be an intelligent person?
...
BitnikGr 1 month ago
@prjerry7 ...
2) My sources are manuals, photo and video footage and a lot more. Makarov won't be able to back up his own words. But as I said, it is your choice to become a stupid parrot repeating stupid words of stupid man, because they suit your anti-russian agenda.
...
BitnikGr 1 month ago
@prjerry7 3) Freedom of speech can be excersized outside of your bedroom, but not in ANY FORM you like, since it CAN violate rights of other citizens. If someone enters into a bus full of people and start screaming slogans pro-anything or anti-anything thinking that he has "freedom of speech", he will get his head smashed, because he is annoying and taking on nerves of people in that bus. Freedom of choice maybe exercized only in proper ways by proper means...
BitnikGr 1 month ago
@prjerry7 ...
Speaking about political subjects on video about pure technology is lame, stupid and when author of this video tells you to stop, you have to stop. Otherwise upload your own video about fishes in aquarium and start speaking about evil communist regime in North Korea there ...
BitnikGr 1 month ago
@prjerry7 "Your the troll who jumped into MY conversation with another youtuber, so fuck off."
Dickhead, if you still didn't realized, you JUMPED into MY video about technology with your IRRELEVANT and lame article.
You can tell me "fuck off" when I come to comment to your video.
Right now, read this:
German Defense Minister Attacks Industry!
defensenews . com/story.php?i=8611079&c=EUR&s=TOP
And now Fuck Off!
I tolerated your BS too much. You are blocked.
BitnikGr 1 month ago
@prjerry7 ...
You can't back up Makarov's lies with an actual data. Noone can. Neither lies of Postnikov.
That makes you like stupid parrot repeating stupid words of a stupid man. It suits perfectly your anti-Russian agenda. That's fine with me. Just get a fuck out of my videos and spit your bile somewhere else.
I asked your more than 3 times to return on topic and speak only about tank protection systems and involved technologies. Enough if enough.
BitnikGr 1 month ago
@prjerry7 You'd believe? With same success you'd believe that Iraq has WMD, right? It was already said to you, that intelligence of people is not depended on their rank. Either their sincerity.
I base my knowledge pure on technological level. While you are trying to present someone brainwashing and trolling in order to discriminate your opponent with a lame way. You quote ria novosti when it suits you. But then suddenly ria novosti becomes propaganda when it doesn't suit your lame ass.
BitnikGr 1 month ago
@prjerry7 ...
This video is about technologies of tank protection systems. STOP bullshitting about irrelevant subjects... especially ones, which you can't comprehend.
BitnikGr 2 months ago
@BitnikGr i know exactly what is going on in the russian arms industry and its history, and i also believe 1,000 times more what Marakov has to say about the Russian weaponry then some youtube troll.
prjerry7 1 month ago
@prjerry7 When you are speaking about trolls, first look up in your mirror, moron.
Makarov said that Merkava has range of 6km and T-90 only 2.5.
Makarov said that Smerch has a range of only 70km and M270 has a range of 300km
Makarov said that HIMARS has triple rate of fire than MSTA-S.
If you believe that blatant lies then your IQ is not bigger than your shoe size.
"i know exactly what is going on in the russian arms industry"
Yeah. Right. You was MoD of USSR for 50 years I suppose!
BitnikGr 1 month ago
@prjerry7 "they were trying to get the government to put more money into foreign defense industry." - STUPID!
"Those generals don't have personal gains from this" - EVEN MORE STUPID!
You simply don't have a clue idea about the subject and particularly about current situation of Russian MoD vs Russian MIC. Whatever you quote has simply twisted interpretation to suit your anti-Russian mind-set.
...
BitnikGr 2 months ago
@BitnikGr Did he delete his account or something? =) I couldn't find his post that he replied to me with.
Anyway, as I was going to say, the reason behind the generals saying such things is simple, saying such things makes for debates within the M.O.D. and with such debates tank development will be on the forethought of Vladimir Popovkin's mind, since there are alot of people trying to take a bite of the military budget.
Mikkhailov 1 month ago
@Mikkhailov I removed his irrelevant and obvious bullshitting comments.
BitnikGr 1 month ago
@prjerry7 They were merely trying to push the government into pumping more money to the defense industry, funny how you wouldn't normally quote rian unless it was a article that suits your opinion.
Mikkhailov 2 months ago
Something people here arguing which tank is the best. or not.. forget.. is that tanks will only be used by an invading country..once they have the control of the air.. you cannot send your tanks if you have hundreds of moderns jets and helicopters controlling the air. tanks are only usefull for fights againts third world countries.or minor scale wars. in a major war.Top nations have nuclear missiles and they can wipe entire armies on land ,entire tanks divisions of tanks with those weapons.
Vann7 2 months ago
@Vann7 Guess which forces are the most suited to operate in contaminated environment? :)))
BitnikGr 2 months ago
@prjerry7 you didn't see that US and Russian says negative things about their army to their politicians things like that to get more funding.. they alarm.. saying how bad shape their army airforce or navy is.. to get more funding for their projects.. Don't take his opinions seriously.. better find quotes of real experts or real test on the subject not public relations people trying to get more money from its parlament.. :)
Vann7 2 months ago
@prjerry7 a t62 is a upgraded version of a t54/55, a t72 is a upgraded version of t62, a t80 is a upgraded version of t72 a t90 is a upgraded version of the t80, this is called tank evolution, so in theory a t90 is a upgraded t54.although the iraqis could have fougt a good fight against the americans they lacked the skill, morale and leadership to give the usa a good blow and their was a few m1 abrams tanks that where knocke dout then
meee2014 2 months ago
@meee2014 its all upgrades. m1a2 is also an upgrade ofo lder American tanks.
Iraq lost due to many things but especially technological superiority of US weaponry, which, thanks to Reagan, were NEW, while Iraqs weapons were poor outdated soviet weaponry
prjerry7 2 months ago
@meee2014 Your lineup in evolution of Soviet tanks is quite wrong. But that's not important.
The rest of your comment is correct.
Lack of competent leadership, modern tactics, skills, modern technology = crashing defeat. And no bravery of private soldiers and low rank officers can replenish that.
BitnikGr 2 months ago
@BitnikGr Iraq had probably gone on a similar crushing defeat even if their Army where equipped with M1A2, M2 and AH-64, I think.
Whole Discussion on how good American equipment was in Iraq is quite dumb when the war was a toy war, a slaughter that compares a grown man beating a small child, in that situation no one say that the adult man was good at fighting ...
Test bomb Moscow, send in the Marines in Vladivostok, roll the Army over the Russian plain, after that we can se whats good or bad.
MrCastodian 2 months ago
@meee2014 Actually T-80 is an upgrated version of the T-64,and T-90 is an upgrade of a T-72.
igor7702 2 months ago
@prjerry7 defensenews . com/story.php?i=8611079&c=EUR&s=TOP
German Defense Minister Attacks Industry!
Deja vue!
BitnikGr 2 months ago
The tank looks awesome
elapplzsl 2 months ago
Ok i'm convinced, where can i buy one now?
luculus88 3 months ago 3
@luculus88 UVZ factory.
BitnikGr 3 months ago
That's a whole lot of defenses.
QBisbest 3 months ago
@prjerry7 ...
But I perfectly understand why words of those jerks are like a cherry for haters and propagandists like you are.
Postnikov said that 1 T-90 costs $3.9mln and he said that he can buy 3 Leopards for that money. I am asking you, is that TRUE?
Makarov said that Merkava tank has an armored crew capsule isolated from a combat compartment. IS THIS TRUE?
Makarov also said that Pzh2000 has self-correcting rounds and MSTA-S doesn't. IS THIS TRUE?
Answer these questions!
BitnikGr 3 months ago
@prjerry7 ...
Postnikov was commander of Russian ground forces. Makarov is now a General of HeadQuarter and there is another man... Serdyukov. Yes, they have highest positions. And yes, they say total bullshits. Examples of which I gave you above. Whatever they say is intended for "internal consumption", meaning that they ask pressure on Russian MIC in order to develop better weapon systems and most important to present transparent prices for their production.
...
BitnikGr 3 months ago
@prjerry7 You are so lame, that you mistaking even historical facts! Iraq-Iran war... Iraq had Soviet planes, it was Iran, which had US made planes (F-4, F-5 and even F-14, and helicopters). Iran's air-force was the largest in the region before the war, and during 8years none of the countries didn't get air superiority. There wasn't domination in air by any side!
Iraqi Mi-24 (helicopter in case you don't know) even managed to shot down an Iranian F-4 (fighter... in case you don't know).
...
BitnikGr 3 months ago
@prjerry7 ...
Sout-Vietnamese + US + Korean losses 1: 4 North Vietnamese combat losses
Man power in 1968 4:1 respectively.
Or maybe you are taking into account civilian losses too?
Don't you think that speaking about "mere" 50.000 husbands, fathers, sons, brothers killed is insulting to their memory? Wasn't it the American 300mln citizen society, which get tired of losses and demanded stop of the war? And you speak about "mere" perished your own fellow citizens?! Shame on you... Really!
BitnikGr 3 months ago 8
@prjerry7 What you do cannot be named a "work" at all. I gave you same source and suddenly it is not good enough for you, because it says something different from what you want to present. And that is a propaganda!
Vietnam war? Yes, you killed more... Which was a final result?
Citation: "North Vietnam and Viet Cong victory Withdrawal of American forces from Indochina Dissolution of South Vietnam Communist governments take power in Vietnam, Cambodia and Laos"
BitnikGr 3 months ago
@prjerry7 ...
Finally, in order to have a better perceptions on things you have no clue idea about, I strongly advise you to speak with someone from the "opposite" side in order to have a "second opinion" and find out that truth is somewhere in the middle. In this case "opposite side" are experts who can explain you that what those "Top General" said is plain BS.
A "simple" modernization of T-72 is a BS #1
1 T-90 costs like 3 Leopards is a BS #2
Merkava can fire at 6km and T-90 only at 2.5 - #3
BitnikGr 3 months ago
@prjerry7 ... Market. Or maybe you wanna imply that Abrams doesn't incorporate foreign technologies in it? If you do, then do your homework and research deeper.
...
BitnikGr 3 months ago
@prjerry7 ... would still believe that these tanks are the same, just because they have same name.
In second video you provided, its a reporter's stupid assumption that Russia will spend so much ammount for purchase of US weapons. Medvedev hadn't ever said that. He said that MIC must provide transparent prices and competitive products, otherwise MoD MAYBE will be allowed to buy TECHNOLOGIES abroad and not complex weapon systems in large numbers, which is a perfectly normal practice in Global...
BitnikGr 3 months ago
@prjerry7 Do us a favor and don't comment on subjects you have no clue about ok?
The so called "Top Generals" say so stupid things that even a 6yo kid laughs at them. There is an internal confrontation of Russian MIC and MoD and it creates a bad publicity, but that in no way doesn't represent real picture.
First video you provided is the perfect example of propaganda. Since differences of Iraqi T-72 and Soviet T-72 were thoroughly discusses all over internet and only a blind brainless retard...
BitnikGr 3 months ago
hmmm now its t-90ms 4rd generation tank
TATARSTAN59500 3 months ago
@TATARSTAN59500 No. T-90MS is not a 4th generation by any standards. It is still an evolution of 3rd generation MBT.
T-95 is an example of 4th generation MBT.
BitnikGr 3 months ago
@BitnikGr no men look better its 4rd generation
its name of tagil product
T-90MS TAGIL
MODERN 4RD GENERATION TANK
TATARSTAN59500 3 months ago
@TATARSTAN59500 Look better? :))) At what?
T-90MS has same principles of operations with rest of modern MBTs around the World. It's a 3rd generation.
4th generation will have different layout. Like 2-3men crews and unmanned turret for example.
BitnikGr 3 months ago
@BitnikGr 3 crew is done long ago, and unmanned turret will compromise interior space
CelestialVulpes 3 months ago
@CelestialVulpes I meant that today we have 3-4 men crews. 4th generation MBT will be 2-3men. FCS was a project of 4th generation MBT and it had 3men crew. T-95 has 3 men crew, but there are designs for 2 men crews as well.
Unmanned turret will make interior space smaller. Crew sits in armored capsule, which is isolated from combat and engine compartments. Different layout is the main characteristic of feature generation of MBT.
BitnikGr 3 months ago
@BitnikGr Engine compartment is more or less isolated in Renault FT. Combat compartment, if it is just where the gun breech is, also isolated with the newer auto-loader.
While electronics systems can share work load of tanks crews, tanks ain't combat aircrafts, their engagement zone is 360 degree horizontal, the ground is full of terrain and objects you need to have your driver focus on driving, gunner for targets and commander to cover their blind spots.
CelestialVulpes 3 months ago
@CelestialVulpes This can be done placing whole crew in tank's body and leaving turret unmanned.
Unmanned turret can host bigger gun or can become smaller in size. Crew sits in armored isolated capsule. 360degree visibility can be achieved with help of electronics and technology like "looking through steel". Something like on F-35.
T-95 has unmanned turret and 2-3 men crew sitting in tank's body.
I am not sure about Armata... It is yet unknown if it will have manned or unmanned turret.
BitnikGr 3 months ago
@BitnikGr Problem with design like this is that it have no fail-safe/back up manual system at all; so the tank would cease to function as soon as the optics get taken off.
And really, if you go for maximum automation, you should either have no or just one crew.
CelestialVulpes 3 months ago
@CelestialVulpes Why do you think that? All modern tanks have reserve sights in case if their main sights are off. And yes, sensors and optics are vulnerable on all modern tanks. And yes, blind tank cease to function.
BitnikGr 3 months ago
@BitnikGr isolated crew compartment = less physical vision block around the tank. Turret is the only place which you can put physical vision block 360 degree all round.
CelestialVulpes 3 months ago
@CelestialVulpes What for do you need physical vision blocks, when sights with combined 3-channel vision can be installed on tank? In case of power disrupt or main sights going off, a tank may have reserve electronic vision with its own power (it is implemented already today with reserve gunner's sight). Furthermore, physical vision blocks are prone to enemy laser attacks, which can blind human's eye. Meanwhile laser can only burn electronic equipment when electronic sights are implemented.
...
BitnikGr 3 months ago
@BitnikGr Good point, but that electronic sight should be able to fall back to physical so that tank isn't completely blind.
CelestialVulpes 3 months ago
@CelestialVulpes ...
China already deploys such combat lasers on their Type-99 and Type-99A2. There are already more than 600 of them. Despite that such lasers are excluded from a list of conventional weapons.
From the other side, having 2 independent electronic systems for 360dgr visibility is a too damn expensive solution. That's the main reason why T-95 didn't go into production. Too technologically complex and too expensive. Intermediate solution in form of "Armata" was chosen.
BitnikGr 3 months ago
t-95 is only prototyp test never russian army build this tank
its foe tes new optics and gas turbin for after time
TATARSTAN59500 3 months ago
@TATARSTAN59500 Yes. T-95 is only a prototype of 4th generation MBT. And T-90MS is also only a prototype right now. UVZ won't build it if there will be no orders on it.
BitnikGr 3 months ago
@BitnikGr t-90ms is not simply modified basics t-90 is completly other tank
armor completly superior , last generation optics, rdio satellit comunication, modified interior for totally crew,
turret is completly other no based in t-72 and engine is new too 1500 hp
TATARSTAN59500 3 months ago
@TATARSTAN59500 Yes, armor is upgraded. Relikt is a new generation of ERA... yes. But not the whole tank.
Yes, T-90MS has new FCS and new thermals... but such optics and systems exist on other 3rd generation tanks too. Satellite Navigation and radio comms also exist on other 2nd and 3rd generation tanks.
And engine is not 1500HP, but 1230 or 1250HP.
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So, it's an evolution of 3rd generation and not 4th generation.
BitnikGr 3 months ago
@BitnikGr russia have testing fully turbocharched and devellop 2200 hp
nominal is 1350 and max 1500 hp
TATARSTAN59500 3 months ago
@BitnikGr first talk of 1130hp but is fully shit fifference to basics t-90 1000hp
TATARSTAN59500 3 months ago
@TATARSTAN59500 "russia have testing fully turbocharched and devellop 2200 hp"
Where did you read that? But it is irrelevant anyway... Point is what is installed...
"nominal is 1350 and max 1500 hp"
1130HP.
Again, where did you read about 1500?
BitnikGr 3 months ago
@BitnikGr i see in vadomosti russian tank engeneer talk of extreme test of engine
but no have actually real performance of tagil in internet
many people talk of 1500 1130hp and ~1300hp~
TATARSTAN59500 3 months ago
@BitnikGr no have official characteristic of t-90ms for moment ................
but probably engine power is very much better than classic t-90
so this is no amelioration ................
TATARSTAN59500 3 months ago
@TATARSTAN59500 In other words whatever you said is someone's imagination and is not supported by company.
Meanwhile company have issued official leaflet, which clearly says 1130HP.
imageshack.us/f/225/90388174.jpg
BitnikGr 3 months ago
@BitnikGr its not real but is in test aigain for moment
TATARSTAN59500 3 months ago
what region,borders are we likely to see,fully upgraded t-90 vs a western mbt?
MrTianak69 4 months ago
@MrTianak69 Any western MBT or modern Western mbt?
BitnikGr 4 months ago
@BitnikGr mnnn modern supposed top tier mbt like abrams,chally2,leo2 or lecleque? includes merkava also :)
MrTianak69 3 months ago
@MrTianak69 Well, tanks you mentioned don't exist in Baltic States, Ukraine, Belarus, Georgia, Ajerbajdzhan, Kazakhstan, China and Mongolia (Russian T-90)
Neither they are in Pakistan, Bangladesh, Pakistan and China. (Indian T-90S)
Neither they do exist in Morocco, Tunisia, Libya, Mauritania, Mali, Niger (Algerian T-90SA).
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The most modern MBTs Russian T-90A may meet today are Swedish, Norwegian and Polish Leopards 2A4 and Japanese Type-10.
...
BitnikGr 3 months ago
@MrTianak69 ...
But don't forget... tanks are mobile force. Any NATO tank based in Europe (everyone you mentioned except Merkava) can easily be transported to Baltic States and be placed at Russian borders within a week.
BitnikGr 3 months ago
nice tank..... indonesia will buy this
TheDamdimdum 6 months ago
Talk, Talk, Talk, Talk, Talk and Talk some more. Look at history, M1 merked every soviet tank its been put up ageinst! Say what you want, but you cannot point to one time in history where the T72 and the T90 inflicted even insignificant losses on the M1! Look at how many soviet tanks went up ageinst Israel and lost, its hilariouse that you even talk like this because all you can rattle off are the numbers that dont matter and act as though they do.
TheTodd1023 7 months ago
@TheTodd1023 1) M1 never faced real soviet equipment on equal terms. Iraqi T-72M were at level of M60A1 at best...
More M1 were lost in Iraq than M60A3 TTS. That's say something. Arabs never have shown to posses demanded skills with any equipment. Either Soviet, either American.
Same outdated T-72M monkey models inflicted a lot of damage to Iranian M60s. This was a battle on equal terms, not Adrams vs T-72M. T-90 would have same success against M-48/60, Challenger 1, Leopard 1.
...
BitnikGr 7 months ago
@BitnikGr People have a tendency to forget that the decisive factor is human, how well trained and motivated tank crews are. Equipment is secondary, a good example is the WW2 Germans against French.
French had more and much better tanks and still lost lamentably. The German crews where highly motivated and trained. Similar thing occurred in 1973 in Arab-Israeli conflict as well Desert Storm...
Nice video with a translation.
BOROZ28 7 months ago
@BOROZ28 Bingo! You seid it the absolute best, the biggest weapon in the equation is the crew.
Thanks for the intellegent input
TheTodd1023 7 months ago
@BitnikGr Are you forgetting about a few things? If you want to talk about other conflicts, we can. Now let us talk about what happend to the Russian equipment losses in the Russo-Finno war or the losses in the Afghan theater. Both of these situations are great examples of how the Russian doctrine for war is carried out. Equipment is just a pawn in their eyes, do the research read a book called Slaughterhouse and go to a local college library, talk to the history professors.
TheTodd1023 7 months ago
@TheTodd1023 No. I never have forgotten such thing. However, you are talking about "bigger picture" where it is ABSOLUTELY irrelevant and unnecessary.
This video is not about politics, not about countries, not about historic battles... it is pure technological.
It would be MUCH better and WELCOME by me if you would talk about similar systems of ANY origin.
But no... you continue speaking about irrelevant things in video about principles of action of tank protection systems.
...
BitnikGr 7 months ago
@TheTodd1023 ...
1) Afghan theater comes out with ABSOLUTELY same results for every invader during centuries. USSR was the only one who had to leave this "project" empty handed.
2) Every army has its victories and defeats. You mentioned the only two you knew, right? What about Alexander Suvorov campaigns? What about defeat of Napoleon? What about the ultimate war for elimination in our recent history? You know whos doctrine won, right?
BitnikGr 7 months ago
@TheTodd1023 ...
2) This is not a video about T-90 or any other tank. This is a video about available tank protection systems and principle of their work. Israeli Rafael company have videos about how their APS "Trophy" can protect M113 or Stryker. Those videos are not about Stryker and M113, right?
Instead of talking bullshits, you could describe how American similar systems work on Abrams or Bradley. But no... instead of talking about engineering solutions, you prefer to talk about bullshits...
BitnikGr 7 months ago
@BitnikGr A team is what wins on the track feild and a team is what wins a war. You are not looking at the whole picture, the Abrams is a small part of a bigger picture. That picture that I am talking of is the entire US military from the US Air force to the USMC, Army and Navy. We made all of their strengths count for nothing when we knocked out the communication and radar. You NEVER fight fair in war. They come at us with a tank, we drop a 2000 pound JDAM on it!
TheTodd1023 7 months ago
@TheTodd1023 Yes. The US Army is the strongest Army in the World! I agree.
But I repeat for one more time... This is a pure technological video, about principles of operation of all kind of protection systems of main battle tanks.
If you want to discuss how Abrams MCD is better than Russian Shtora or how Quick-Kill is better than Russian Arena and Israeli Trophy or maybe about effectiveness of Abrams ARAT compared to other ERA then YOU ARE WELCOME. Otherwise, leave your comments for other vids.
BitnikGr 7 months ago
@BitnikGr Why would you even want to argue about a peice of technology and brag it up when there are so many other peices of technology that make it null and void in real life?
TheTodd1023 7 months ago
@TheTodd1023 Why there are dedicated documentaries and presentations for EVERY existing piece of technology? Are you interesting to know "how the stuff works?". Well, many people are... And yes, technology which overcomes current protection systems is also an interesting subject for discussion and their principle of operation does indeed fits in this conversation. Like for example triple-charge-warheads, top-attacks, development of new sabot rounds, laser protection systems (chinese Type-99) etc
BitnikGr 7 months ago
@TheTodd1023 3) You are 25yo American... "merked", "egeinst", "hilaruouse"... Learn your own language first if you want be called a patriot and be respected when you talk to international community. If you don't respect and you vandalize your own language, don't expect to be respected from others.
Greetings.
BitnikGr 7 months ago
@TheTodd1023 the reason for the iraqi losses against the m1 because the russians gave the arab naitons the export versions of the t55 t72 t62 , those versions are without anti missile and shell protection day and night visions and infared and automated loaders and turrets plus the t 90 has never been used in combat, lool the abrams can be blown up by a 70 mm projectile witch is from a rpg 7 so shut the fuck up you cunt
789joshi 7 months ago
@TheTodd1023
1. Those tanks were export 'monkey models' or license production but this isn't the main problem.
2. The underlying reason for their poor performance is the inherent weakness of arabs at modern warfare. Give them western gear and provide the IDF with Russian toys - the result will be the same. Generations of military advisors became desperate because of this. Google 'why arabs loose their wars'
brocalfur 7 months ago
Thanks for sharing this. Very informative and interesting.
Zartan1357 10 months ago
@Zartan1357 you are welcome
BitnikGr 10 months ago
@HeildemKrieg Remember that Russians mount kontakt 5 on T90's which make em pretty much immune to 120mm sabot rounds, americans tested kontakt 5 on a T72 by shooting at it with the apfsds rounds abrams use.
Aaidas2 10 months ago
watching this with the 1911 video thing is funy :D
RedStaryPuu 11 months ago
nice gadgest on russian tanks as always, but they always fail in putting the ammo compartment underneath the turret
Gjldo 11 months ago
@HeildemKrieg ... close to tanks. Infantry follows tanks in IFVs. Like US infantry did in Iraq in 1991 and 2003. So in such scenario there shouldn't be any problem with shrapnel and debris. This problem exists in counter-insurgent environment. And even in such case, APS systems can be switched off by commander of a tank.
BitnikGr 1 year ago
@HeildemKrieg Newest Russian reactive armor (like Relikt) is effective against APFSDS rounds as well.
The USA develops Quick Kill system. First tests on the field are programmed for spring of 2011. It is a 30years delay after first Soviet similar system, but there are almost no doubts that Quick Kill will be better than Arena in every aspect. We are talking about 15-20years. Electronics in our days are much more efficient.
According to doctrines of wide scale war infantry wouldn't ever be...
BitnikGr 1 year ago 2
@BitnikGr the relikt is not in service with russia.
nick74178ify 3 months ago
@nick74178ify It is a fully developed product available for sail to anyone who has cash to buy it.
BitnikGr 3 months ago
@BitnikGr I believe T-90 is better than any western tanks because this russian philosphy change my point of view about tanks. I like they said here " Minimize the chance of contact of enemy projectile to the tanks armor..
f50koenigg 1 year ago
leo2 and chally 2 are better
369NICK963 1 year ago
@369NICK963 How better are Leo2 and Chally2 ERA compared to Kontakt-5 or Relikt ERA?
What are soft-kill systems of Leo2 and Chally2 and what are their properties? How better they are compared to Shtora-2?
What are hard-kill systems of Leo2 and Chally2 and how better they are compared to 25years old Arena?
What other additional protection systems Leo and Chally have, which other tanks don't?
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Happy New Year!
BitnikGr 1 year ago 8
@369NICK963 As far as I know the ERA that use by chally2 and leop 2 are for Anti RPG system only but K5 Era are design to deflect all Anti Tank as possible, It includes HEAT, AP, Missiles etc.. This documentary is old made during late 80's or early 90's so you can suspect that T-90 here are obsolete compare the T-90's today.. I believe russian pilosophy for tanks are better than those in the west because West made their tanks as heavy armor type which could sustain any hit from Anti tank.
f50koenigg 1 year ago
@369NICK963 But what russians amaze is their philisophy is to with lots of counter measures against Anti Tanks and they want their system to prevent any Anti tanks not hit the tank as possible which mention as Layer 1, and layer 2 defence but in case the tank reach the armor they ERA to stop the Anti Tank..
f50koenigg 1 year ago
@369NICK963 A leo cannot get in range of the T-90....... the T-90 will shoot the leo first!
SuperNegerBamiBal 8 months ago
@SuperNegerBamiBal Leopard 2 is certified for use of NLOS ATGM "Lahat" with range of 8km.
Certified - means that Leopard 2 passed all trials successfully, but Bundesweihr haven't introduced "Lahat" in Leopards' arsenal... yet.
BitnikGr 8 months ago
@BitnikGr
Even IF they would spot each other, the round fired by a Leopard 2 are 128 MM wouldnt even scratch a T-90.. they would need 2 bullets anyway because of the Kontak5 ERA armor...(+ all armor = 1350mm of armor) (and im including LAHAT anti- tank missiles with this)
SuperNegerBamiBal 8 months ago
@SuperNegerBamiBal Not 128, but 120mm. Caliber doesn't matter actually. 120 and 125 is almost the same. What matters is gun length and barrel pressure. How can you possibly know real armor equivalent of any tank? This information is undisclosed by any manufacturer and this can be proven only by trial.
Kontakt5 doesn't protect from sabots... Relikt does.
Lahat is NLOS and by thus it is a top attack. No tank in the world has effective enough armor on top to counter such attack.
BitnikGr 8 months ago
мало об "Арене" рассказали, действительно эффективная вещь
therealsleepwalker 1 year ago
@therealsleepwalker Была... эффективной вещью. Сегодня Израильские аналоги эффективнее да еще и дешевле. Про Украинский "Нож" не знаю. Американский "Квик Килл" и немецкий аналог завтра тоже будут уже лучше "Арены". 30 лет прошло все же. России нужна новая система активной защиты.
Хотя сегодня всего 3 страны из добрых 40, которые строят танки имеют такие системы. Ну завтра станут 5.
BitnikGr 1 year ago
Totally blows away any dispute on who has the better tank.
30DOTCOM 1 year ago
@30DOTCOM "who HAD better tank" - because today foreign analogues are better than presented here Russian defensive systems. It is not surprising. It is an old documentary about 30years old technology.
BitnikGr 1 year ago
@BitnikGr what "foreign analogues"?
val28l 1 year ago
@val28l Israeli Iron Fist and Trophy, Trophy Light. They are cheaper and more effective than Arena.
Sorry that I didn't answer to your question 5months ago. I haven't seen your comment. Sorry again.
BitnikGr 7 months ago
@BitnikGr ohithere again. i'm sorry, what were we arguing about?
val28l 7 months ago
@val28l We were not arguing... yet :)
I said that modern foreign analogues are better than Russian defensive systems presented in this video. You asked "what foreign analogues"?
And I counted "Iron Fist, Trophy"... and I should add Israeli and American (MCD) analogues of Shtora.
And maybe Israeli "Black Fox" and "Droid" systems... which are not yet in production, but seem very promising.
BitnikGr 7 months ago
@BitnikGr ok, i should probably reply by saying something like: "so what tanks are those systems are installed on? because all i see is a few promotional videos and few cartoons (lol) showing us how "great" they are. russian system is on t-90, which tank has your systems on it?". that is what i should'we replied with, but hey, it doesn't matter anymore man. russkies already created rpg that breaks thru that type of defense. (both western made ans russian made, just to be fair)
val28l 7 months ago
@val28l MCD is installed on Abrams. Quick-Kill system is planned to be tested in 2011.
Merkava has its own soft-kill system and it has Trophy. All three of these systems are better than Shtora-2 and Arena-E.
Yes, you are right. Double salvo from Khrizantema or Kornet-EM systems will defeat any existing Hard-Kill system. But that doesn't change the fact that Trophy is better than Arena. It is more effective and it is cheaper. ($300.000 vs $400.000)
BitnikGr 7 months ago
@BitnikGr "and it is cheaper. ($300.000 vs $400.000)" which would explain the fact why russians only install those on the commander's tank. btw, shtora is the system that hides tanks from missiles, doesn't destroy them (missiles that is). not sure how it got mixed up w/ arena.
val28l 7 months ago
@val28l Which would explain why noone in the World would buy more expensive and less effective 30yo system. If I was a client, I would buy naked BMP-3M and install cheaper and more effective Trophy on it, instead of buying it with Arena-E.
Shtora is a defensive soft-kill system and we are talking about them. Not only Hard-Kills. US analogue of Shtora is MCD (missile countermeasure device). I don't recall the name of Israeli similar system...
BitnikGr 7 months ago
@BitnikGr oooh, do tell more about mcd pls, i would like to see it in action. for some reason, i have not seen anything like that on the tanks in iraq O.O not sure how i missed it. wth?
val28l 7 months ago
@val28l I don't know about 1991 campaign, but they sure were deployed in 2003 on Abrams and Bradleys.
defense-update . com/features/du-1-04/soft-kill-west . htm
(remove spaces from URL)
BitnikGr 7 months ago
@BitnikGr spaces removed. page not found. just give me the name of the system, i will look it up.
val28l 7 months ago
@val28l MCD - Missile Countermeasure Device. AN/VLQ-6
army-guide . com/eng/product3794.html
BitnikGr 7 months ago
@BitnikGr excellent, i found it, thank you. but why so little info? in the video above, i can see how russian system deals with heat guided missiles, laser guided missiles, and t-v (is that the right name) guided missiles. are there any pictures and/or videos on how AN/VLQ-6 system works?
val28l 7 months ago
@val28l Maybe because they think that this is a super-duper system, like in "Future Weapons". Meanwhile basic principles are the same. Israeli analogue works about the same way.
The point is in technical specs. What laser beam power can sensors detect? Vertical angle of coverage? Number of smoke grenades? Density and distance of placed smoke? Chemical materials used? Minimum time needed for reaction? Which waves lengths are jammed? All these may vary, but basic principles are the same.
BitnikGr 7 months ago
@BitnikGr yes, i am sure that both systems work about the same, was just asking if you know where i can find a video or even few pics of it just to see (video preferred, since it is youtube, lol)
val28l 7 months ago
@val28l Presentation of Shtora would be enough. Soft-kill systems' work is invisible to human eye. You can't see laser rangefinder beam. You can't see electronic jamming. Well, only work of smoke grenades discharges is visible :)
The main thing is that soft-kill system works only when its sensors detect laser beam. If there is no laser illumination of target, or sensors are not sensitive enough, soft-kill won't react.
BitnikGr 7 months ago
@BitnikGr ok, so i can't see them in action....... :(
val28l 7 months ago
01:17 oh, that looked so fucking painful... can't imagine what it was like inside the tank when that happened :P
MatoVuc 1 year ago
to be honest the russian kept it smart and kept i small , but needs a modification put a tbar in it or a stearin wheal in it
cammander263 1 year ago
60km is about the same speed as the abrams can go unless the us comes up with a new tank either way russian tanks are at the bottom of the food chain
cammander263 1 year ago
@cammander263 What does a top speed of Abrams or T-90 has to do with "Tank Protection Systems"? This video is about ERA, Soft-kill, hard-kill APS, EMP, optical-electronic jammers and other additional gadgets above of main armor.
If you would describe advantages of Abrams MCD over Russian Shtora, then your comment would be suitable for this video... But talking bs about top speed has no sence here. Go and place it here: /watch?v=SWG6Tp04Nnk
...
but anyhow, I'll tell you couple of words about...
BitnikGr 1 year ago
@BitnikGr ... top speeds.
When Abrams came into service it was 63tons and had 1500HP engine and top speed was stated at 70-72km/h... which was proven correct in Greek MBT trials in 1998.
Now M1A2 with ARAT or TUSK upgrades weight 70tons and has the same engine. Can you really beleive that it still can reach stated 72km/h?
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Russian tanks, no matter if they are diesel or gas-turbine powered, give smaller top speed number in manuals considering harsh enviroment and loss of power and overload on...
BitnikGr 1 year ago 7
@BitnikGr yes, because as the weight increases they lower the engine governor a little bit to accommodate for the weight increase,therefore, keeping the same speed even though the weight has been increased.
hotpocketpoison 7 months ago
@hotpocketpoison Probable. And it seems the case with Abrams. But not with Bradley. Increasing Bradley's A2/A3 armor and weight, its top speed have reduced.
But you are right about Abrams.
BitnikGr 7 months ago
@BitnikGr the bradley is just a huge mistake in general, i HOPE we replace it with the German Puma IFV, it would be MUCH better.
hotpocketpoison 7 months ago
@BitnikGr ... of transmission. So, stated numbers of 65-70km/h in manuals in reality is easily 80km/h for T-72/80/90, and this was also proved in the same tender in 1998.
So, T-90 can reach 70km/h on the road in ANY atmospheric conditions. While Abrams can reach 70km/h only if someone drop it from a mountain.
BitnikGr 1 year ago
@cammander263
Except that the M1 is so heavy that it falls through bridges and can't be used anywehre but roads and tank country.
Ag3nt0fCha0s 1 year ago
Turbo-Diesel
vaninec 1 year ago
Is it ironic that a very high tech laser guided targeting system can be countered by a low tech smoke cover.
warnation101 1 year ago
@warnation101 It is not just a smoke, but with special ingridients like aerosol. Even modern laser-guided systems can "see" through such cover. Remember that this is kinda old video.
But yes, there are a lot of examples when cheap counter-measures can fool hell lot an expensive weapons. Especially in anti-air defence.
BitnikGr 1 year ago
@GRATZIANI2002 Grow up kid. Maybe one day u understand your mistakes.
LimpBizkitRus 1 year ago
@GRATZIANI2002 Thanks if u care about my health but i'm not from Moscow. Anyway Gorbachev was and still US cocksucker and it was confermed by all russians. About stupidity and mafia speak for your country u have same problems or bigger...
LimpBizkitRus 1 year ago
For all haters... My dear american friends, u can think everything u want but if one day you attack Russia and we will fuck you. I really hope that u becom smarter and u'll not crying and show your respekt for russian people.
LimpBizkitRus 1 year ago
knowing that all this is red promo, I have big doubts about., maybe some Indians or Chinese to spend some money to buy it, for research purposes.. .all I can say is that my dog is smarter and better feed than any russian tank crew .period.
GRATZIANI2002 1 year ago
@GRATZIANI2002 As I've already aswered to one similar comment with yours, this video is about how Anti-Tank measures works and principles of work of tank defense systems to beat those anti-tank weapons.
This is not about T-90 itself.
Today similar systems in arsenal of other countries are even better than those which are presented here.
Video of "Trophy" APS installed on Stryker is not about Stryker, but about how Trophy works!
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Please, discuss defensive systems of modern MBT. Thank you.
BitnikGr 1 year ago
@GRATZIANI2002 Oh my god! They really washed your brain (if u have it). Tipical american bullshit about KGB and comerade Stalin. U really silly boy. Grow up man! How can u be so stupid i don't know, but for info there's no KGB and everybody in Russia can said u that stalin was a asshole just like u. Oh, an another thing if one bitch speak russian that doesn't mean that she's a russian. 99 of 100 whores u can see on streets who speak russian came from another ex soviet republics like Ukraine...
LimpBizkitRus 1 year ago
@GRATZIANI2002 and Moldava. I lived in europe, in Italy for precision, and i can say u that almost every person who speak russian there came from Ukraine. Western Ukraine, but i know that u can't understand the difference betwen Ukraine and Russia. Russian Federation is a richest country of all ex soviet republics. So shot u fuck up and riched your colture level u moron! Fucking troll!
LimpBizkitRus 1 year ago
@GRATZIANI2002 Good research experiment would be to send you and your dog in space. And while your dog would receive orders from NASA to do several operations and scientific experiments, you would be there only to open cans for your dog and you would be prohibed to touch anything onboard!
Just feed your dog and leave the rest... you are not up to it. :)
BitnikGr 1 year ago 4
тайминги сабов хорошо бы подправить
38602 1 year ago
@38602 в смысле?
BitnikGr 1 year ago
Abrams isnt short for abraham... Its named after a guy who drove his tank from like normandy to berlin or something like that.... Dont hate on someone if your not sure of the answer before hand
95warren 1 year ago
@95warren "It is named after General Creighton Abrams, former Army Chief of Staff and Commander of US military forces in Vietnam from 1968 to 1972."
Good comment, I'll probably erase those insulting comments later.
BitnikGr 1 year ago
Damn, back in the 1930s trying the invade the Soviet Union, you would have fucking tanks erupt from the ground to get you!
Breakerchase 1 year ago 3