There is nothing wrong with teaching from the Bible in Church or anywhere. The Bible is true, and this is America. And nobody goes to an Assemblies of God church to advance their careers. They go there to hear from God. This fact alone shows that Sarah Palin is genuine. If you want to be shocked, look at the preaching of Jeremiah Wright--Obama's pastor for 20 years!
A conservative TV station considers her an Idiot, This moron could decide weather or not this nation goes to war or not and could have the keeps to the nuclear arsernal. How dumb cam people people, Even conservative commentators have to accept she is an idiot. Most to the point that she should be replaced for the sake of the nation
Let's see just what he was praying for over Sarah:
To make a way for her in government
For men and women to help her
For righteousness in our nation
For the hearts of fathers to be for their children and children to the fathers
For the spiritual enemy's and witchcraft to be defeated
WOW!! That is SOOOO much worse than the HATE spewed out in Obama's church...NOT!! And Palin heard this VISITING pastor ONCE, Obama listened to his RACIST pastor 20 YEARS!!!
paulp1021: I agree that Rev. Wright should be entitled to express his opinions. One thing that should be mentioned is that, unlike Wright, who was drafted, McCain VOLUNTEERED to go bomb a nation that had never attacked us and posed no threat to us. His participation in Operation Rolling Thunder added to the 60,000+ civilian deaths in that operation, and he knew that his last mission, bombing a power station in central Hanoi, would kill civilians. He was a WILLING killer of innocent people.
I never attacked Rev. Wright. He was so oppressed as being an African American. However the other African American minister was also oppressed. Witchcraft is his heritage. Just like Obama said, the mid-westerners "cling to their religion and guns". It's ok.
Freak out! It was a witch hunt going after Obama's pastor, and it's a witch hunt going after her witch hunter.
DEBATE POLICY LAMEBRAINS! Or would that mean you'd have to recognize that Obama and McCain differ only on details, not on overall policy. It's also why the both suck. And people who blindly follow either one are DDS.
The suspension of the Republican campaign is the most obvious ploy ever. Sarah Palin will also postpone her debate with Joe Biden, how fortunate......You have to give them credit for their transparency on that one!
Palin's preacher said something about "witch craft" and was just teaching part of his heritage so don't complain about the Reverend speaking of witchcraft.
"Palin's preacher said something about 'witch craft' and was just teaching part of his heritage so don't complain about the Reverend speaking of witchcraft." Uh-huh. And were you aware that this "heritage" of accusing women in Africa of witchcraft is responsible for the murders of hundreds of innocent women every year, and thousands more who are harmed or run out of town? THAT is just the sort of evil that this "reverend" (who deserves no such title) has been up to -- persecuting innocent women.
The Reverend was speaking of witchcraft because that is his heritage in Africa. As an African American, he has been so repressed and he "clings to his religion and witchcraft" like Obama said mid-westerners "cling to their religion and guns".
Cindi3847: Witchcraft isn't "his heritage in Africa", unless you think that ignorance and superstition are the heritage of every African. It may be news to you, but supernatural witches don't actually exist. "As an African-American he has been so repressed"? WTF are you talking about?! First, he's not African-American, he's a Kenyan citizen; he visited the US. Second, what "repression" has he faced here? Let's see some evidence. Finally, Obama was right: Americans DO cling to religion and guns.
Sorry but your trying to have it both ways. The preacher believes that witchcraft exists, just like Obama believes mid-westerners "cling to their religion and guns". I grew up in the mid-west and none of my neighbors had guns. Where is your proof? You don't have proof.
It appears from looking at your videos, you choose to live in a scientific world..nothing wrong with that.
I live in a world where everyone has beliefs and I respect them, even if I don't agree.
Cindi -- first, I'm NOT trying to have it both ways. Muthee is a witch hunter despite all evidence to the contrary. Obama's quip wasn't a "belief", it was an opinion. And BTW, he wasn't speaking specifically about Midwesterners, the two states he cited were Ohio and Pennsylvania; the latter is not in the Midwest. And as for your world where everyone's beliefs are respected -- how does that jibe with a candidate who shows little respect for contrary views and wants to legislate their own beliefs?
Obama's comment was for the "great unwashed" (other than the people in Philidelphia and Chicago, everywhere else west of the Hudson River, until you reach the west coast).
Our fore fathers believed in witches (Salem Ma.) and why would we expect this Preacher to believe anything else. He's from Kenya. Remember the hijackers believed in 72 virgins.
People that live in the west truly believe in freedom and independence. I know because that is where I live now. Principles are different.
So first, Obama's comment was directed at "mid-westerners" (except that he cited Pennsylvania), and now it was directed at "the great unwashed" (except that he never used that term). Whatever. We could play semantic games all day. Yeah, some of our ancestors believed in witches, 3 centuries ago; I'd like to think that most people have moved beyond that. It's dismaying the way that Americans are being left in the dust by secular nations who are also safer, healthier and more generous than we are.
I'm surprised you're not familiar with the term, "the great unwashed" used by many in New England to describe people in the mid-west who are "culturally inferior". It has several other definitions applying to other groups. Obama is technically part of the Great Unwashed, but since he went to Harvard, he gets a pass.
In Florida, a few years ago, murders took place by self-proclaimed witches and warlocks. Witches and warlocks are real in the mind of the beholder or the accuser.
Cindi: Of course I'm familiar with the term "the great unwashed". My point remains that Obama never used that term, or the term "mid-westerners". These are all just projections by those who want to claim that Obama is "elitist"; an absurd claim for a guy who was raised in a middle-class home by a single mother, worked his ass off to get into Columbia and Harvard, and so on. The elitist is McCain, a child of privilege who married an heiress, has 7 houses and 13 cars, and serves the super-rich.
bricology: You said "Of course I'm fimilar with the term". Not likely unless you just looked it up. I read your comment and it certainly didn't elude to an understanding of the word.
I never stated Obama made that statement about "the great unwashed " or the "mid-west". He made the statement using the term "middle America", (I checked it out). I think it means the same thing.
McCain was born to a military family. He serves the people of Arizona, not many elitist there.
"McCain was born to a military family." McCain is the son of one 4-star Navy admiral, the grandson of another 4-star admiral and the nephew of an Army general, and he grew up in privilege in Virginia, attending a prestigious private school. He didn't move to Arizona until he was 45. There are plenty of elitists in Arizona, such as McCain's good friends and early political sponsors Charles Keating and Fife Symington, both of whom are mega-millionaires (and both of whom were convicted of fraud).
"Americans DO cling to religion and guns." And this creates what problem? So long as they don't enforce their religious beliefs on others, I fail to see anything wrong with religion or guns.
"So long as they don't enforce their religious beliefs on others, I fail to see anything wrong with religion or guns." First, there has NEVER been a dominant religion that didn't try to assert influence upon the State. The history of the US is precisely one of Christianity forcing its way into politics. Second, by far the most common reason people are religious is because their parents forced it upon them. I would say that telling a child that their "sins" will send them to hell, is child abuse.
"Yeah, We must say to our children that if they make a sin, they will get away with it." Oh, absolutely. Because "getting away with" "sins" like making a graven image of Yahweh or "breaking the Sabbath" would be disastrous to let children get away with, right? You ARE aware that the Bible says that children who commit certain sins should be stoned to death, aren't you? Name one "sin" that it's imperative that children be taught to not commit that isn't already addressed in the secular realm.
1. Not drinking alcohol is YOUR superstition, not mine, nor is it contrary to most OTHER religions (even Jesus turned water into wine and drank it himself). And drunkenness is already addressed in the secular realm.
2. Putting ones parents in a retirement house is prohibited nowhere in the Bible, nor does it even remotely constitute a "sin".
3. Sleeping with the same sex is a sin peculiar to Islam (and to some degree, Christianity); not to other religions and not to the secular world.
Why don't you use the books of hindu? When I defend religion, i don't speak on behalf of Christianity or Buddhism. Christianity is worst than secularism, and the bible is mixed with crap.
Drunkness adressed in secularism? How? To give him a drive back home? LOL The religion is Islam , others are crap.
"The religion is Islam , others are crap." Oh, riiight -- Islam. That would be the religion founded by a pedophile who raided caravans, killed people, had Jewish men, women and children beheaded even after they surrendered, etc. "The Bible is mixed with crap"? No disagreement there; in fact I'd say it's mostly crap. But Islam takes that to a whole new level of crap-dom with a superstition that's violent, misogynistic, tribal, willfully ignorant and thoughtlessly destructive. What a tool you are!
"Not to lie"? Everything I said is factual. How old was Aisha when Muhammad first had sex with her? I'll answer that for you: she was 9 YEARS OLD. So a man who has sex with a 9 year-old isn't a pedophile in your book? That says a lot about you. It's a fact that Muhammad raided caravans. It's a fact that he Jews of Banu Qurayza surrendered but Muhammad had them beheaded anyway, and their women and children enslaved. Muhammad did all this and worse. You "use your brain"? That's clearly untrue.
LOL...That's the thing you don't understand liberty...always trying to tell me what I can or can't do.
I'm Episcopalian, and in my churches I have NEVER ONCE heard a single statement about politics. Morals bro, morals. Some churches distort them...some "liberals" don't respect liberty. What do you want?
"Liberals don't respect liberty"? What kind of utter bullshit is that?! In the first place, our Founding Fathers were hardcore liberals! Who could be more liberal than Jefferson, Franklin, Paine? Conservatives are just as likely to try to tell people what they can or can't do (abortion, freedom FROM religion, etc.) And the leaders at the Episcopal church I attend (3,000 members) OFTEN bring up politics; usually liberal politics. Morals, I have no interest in; I much prefer secular ethics.
Perhaps I should have said modern liberals don't respect liberty. And that's a fact. Neither do modern conservatives. Fact is both parties are disgustingly progressive(in that they have no problem using force to push their ideals on the American people.
Let's not label Jefferson and Paine, as they would be considered libertarian, which falls pretty far to the political right.
You attend a massive church...all the giant churches seem to try and sway peoples politics...try a nice small one.
Well, I don't buy that "modern liberals don't respect liberty". For example, whose liberty takes precedence: an individual who wants to smoke in a public room, or the majority who want to be free from smoke in public? I'd say that being free FROM something negative trumps the being free TO DO something potentially negative to others, such as smoking in public. I would also disagree that (small "L") libertarianism is far to the political right; laissez-faire ideology is actually pretty moderate.
I do. Obama, Clinton, Biden. Three people who hate freedom as much as Bush, Cheney, and O'Reilly.
How is the second version of the patriot act IN ANY WAY pro freedom? How is gun control pro freedom? How is centralized control of education pro freedom? How is stealing from me to pay for somebody else pro freedom?
Your analogy is a weak and irrelevant one...especially considering the important issues where they ALL repeatedly vote against liberty.
I can quote quite a few conservatives who before any vote or decision always asked themselves, 'am I maximizing liberty?'
Eisenhower, Taft, Goldwater, Reagan(at least usually, and let's ignore his foreign policy...he was very weak there)...the list can go on.
Modern democrats(and most republicans) act as though the Union created the states, and not the other way around. They act as though our rights come from government and are not natural. They prefer Hobbes over Paine.
I would never claim that the Patriot Act is "pro-freedom".
"Obama, Clinton, Biden. Three people who hate freedom as much as Bush, Cheney, and O'Reilly."
You might as well say that EVERY elected official "hates liberty", but they only hate the forms of liberty that differ from their preferred form. In the same respect, some people see taxes and other govt. functions as "anti-freedom", but it's just as logical to say that it's "pro-freedom" to fund the public benefits that their taxes provide.
"How is centralized control of education pro freedom? How is stealing from me to pay for somebody else pro freedom?"
The parents of the majority of children can neither afford privately-funded schools nor can they homeschool them. What education should they get? It seems that the better educated the public, the more successful, so the public funding some form of public education is beneficial to the whole, even though -- as someone without children -- I'm not happy about my taxes going to that.
Nothing wrong with public education, sorry if my post mislead you. There is something wrong with the federal government getting involved. Never mind the ineficiency of federal beaurocracy, it makes children that much easier to indoctrinate into the system and susceptible to certain agendas. And it removes any community values.
OMG! Someone said Rev. Wright is a nut? I don't think so. Rev. Wright just tells the truth as he sees it and his parishioners agree. I know that Obama, being a member of the church for 20 years, took criticism. But why wouldn't Obama, a man of color that has been discriminated against all his life, not share those feeling. We need to give Obama a break on this one.
LOL He is a nut. It's not a reason to vote against Obama, there are enough real reasons to do that.
But his historical analogies regarding white people are not only racist, they're quite off base. If Obama does share those feelings, then he's a liar because he said he does not. BOOHOO...your preacher is as fucked up as Palin's. With that said, a few of the things he said were correct, if for the wrong reasons.
I see. So, Obama's relationship with his pastor is irrelevant, but we should pay CLOSE attention to Palin and her pastor. Keep digging, you libtards.
Deke101 2 years ago
Th prayer should have included: give her some brain in the name of jesus.
allbu849 2 years ago
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There is nothing wrong with teaching from the Bible in Church or anywhere. The Bible is true, and this is America. And nobody goes to an Assemblies of God church to advance their careers. They go there to hear from God. This fact alone shows that Sarah Palin is genuine. If you want to be shocked, look at the preaching of Jeremiah Wright--Obama's pastor for 20 years!
biblethink 3 years ago
... and this is why I am voting for Obama...
even though I am/was a Republican.
crazypdj 3 years ago
I could give her some special LIPSTICK.
crazypdj 3 years ago
A conservative TV station considers her an Idiot, This moron could decide weather or not this nation goes to war or not and could have the keeps to the nuclear arsernal. How dumb cam people people, Even conservative commentators have to accept she is an idiot. Most to the point that she should be replaced for the sake of the nation
franks2732 3 years ago 2
Please people.
I beg, please study our American history to find out what we broke away from in establishing this country.
Please read our Constitution.
We didn't come this far to go back to the Dark Ages.
fonna 3 years ago
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Whos fault is the economic crisis?? Watch these 2 videos for the PROOF... if you have the guts and can handle the TRUTH...
Actual video footage from the floor of the senate
watch?v=_MGT_cSi7Rs
TONS of proof from MANY sources
watch?v=H5tZc8oH--o
jbob30 3 years ago
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Let's see just what he was praying for over Sarah:
To make a way for her in government
For men and women to help her
For righteousness in our nation
For the hearts of fathers to be for their children and children to the fathers
For the spiritual enemy's and witchcraft to be defeated
WOW!! That is SOOOO much worse than the HATE spewed out in Obama's church...NOT!! And Palin heard this VISITING pastor ONCE, Obama listened to his RACIST pastor 20 YEARS!!!
Your hypocrisy is amazing...
jbob30 3 years ago
psychos.
KoffeeNut 3 years ago
If you took KO's brain and magnified it one thousand times and stuck it in an ant's head, it would look like a BB rollong around in a box car.
GZVSI 3 years ago
Keith you're such a dork ..remember Jeremiah Wright?
skydogz1 3 years ago
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This dangerous woman CANNOT be allowed to have her finger anywhere NEAR "the button." Not if we value our very existence.
ChuckyJesus666 3 years ago
paulp1021: I agree that Rev. Wright should be entitled to express his opinions. One thing that should be mentioned is that, unlike Wright, who was drafted, McCain VOLUNTEERED to go bomb a nation that had never attacked us and posed no threat to us. His participation in Operation Rolling Thunder added to the 60,000+ civilian deaths in that operation, and he knew that his last mission, bombing a power station in central Hanoi, would kill civilians. He was a WILLING killer of innocent people.
bricology 3 years ago
*****
1stAmendmentVoter 3 years ago
I never attacked Rev. Wright. He was so oppressed as being an African American. However the other African American minister was also oppressed. Witchcraft is his heritage. Just like Obama said, the mid-westerners "cling to their religion and guns". It's ok.
Cindi3847 3 years ago
Freak out! It was a witch hunt going after Obama's pastor, and it's a witch hunt going after her witch hunter.
DEBATE POLICY LAMEBRAINS! Or would that mean you'd have to recognize that Obama and McCain differ only on details, not on overall policy. It's also why the both suck. And people who blindly follow either one are DDS.
bighitter42 3 years ago
The suspension of the Republican campaign is the most obvious ploy ever. Sarah Palin will also postpone her debate with Joe Biden, how fortunate......You have to give them credit for their transparency on that one!
yetigoose 3 years ago
If Barack Obama's preacher related to "witchcraft" -- it would be 24/7 non-stop on cable news...they hypocracy is amazing! OBAMA 08
rextrek 3 years ago 5
Palin's preacher said something about "witch craft" and was just teaching part of his heritage so don't complain about the Reverend speaking of witchcraft.
Cindi3847 3 years ago
"Palin's preacher said something about 'witch craft' and was just teaching part of his heritage so don't complain about the Reverend speaking of witchcraft." Uh-huh. And were you aware that this "heritage" of accusing women in Africa of witchcraft is responsible for the murders of hundreds of innocent women every year, and thousands more who are harmed or run out of town? THAT is just the sort of evil that this "reverend" (who deserves no such title) has been up to -- persecuting innocent women.
bricology 3 years ago
bricology
The Reverend was speaking of witchcraft because that is his heritage in Africa. As an African American, he has been so repressed and he "clings to his religion and witchcraft" like Obama said mid-westerners "cling to their religion and guns".
You can't have it both ways. It is the same.
Cindi3847 3 years ago
Cindi3847: Witchcraft isn't "his heritage in Africa", unless you think that ignorance and superstition are the heritage of every African. It may be news to you, but supernatural witches don't actually exist. "As an African-American he has been so repressed"? WTF are you talking about?! First, he's not African-American, he's a Kenyan citizen; he visited the US. Second, what "repression" has he faced here? Let's see some evidence. Finally, Obama was right: Americans DO cling to religion and guns.
bricology 3 years ago
bricology
Sorry but your trying to have it both ways. The preacher believes that witchcraft exists, just like Obama believes mid-westerners "cling to their religion and guns". I grew up in the mid-west and none of my neighbors had guns. Where is your proof? You don't have proof.
It appears from looking at your videos, you choose to live in a scientific world..nothing wrong with that.
I live in a world where everyone has beliefs and I respect them, even if I don't agree.
Cindi3847 3 years ago
Cindi -- first, I'm NOT trying to have it both ways. Muthee is a witch hunter despite all evidence to the contrary. Obama's quip wasn't a "belief", it was an opinion. And BTW, he wasn't speaking specifically about Midwesterners, the two states he cited were Ohio and Pennsylvania; the latter is not in the Midwest. And as for your world where everyone's beliefs are respected -- how does that jibe with a candidate who shows little respect for contrary views and wants to legislate their own beliefs?
bricology 3 years ago
bricology
Obama's comment was for the "great unwashed" (other than the people in Philidelphia and Chicago, everywhere else west of the Hudson River, until you reach the west coast).
Our fore fathers believed in witches (Salem Ma.) and why would we expect this Preacher to believe anything else. He's from Kenya. Remember the hijackers believed in 72 virgins.
People that live in the west truly believe in freedom and independence. I know because that is where I live now. Principles are different.
Cindi3847 3 years ago
So first, Obama's comment was directed at "mid-westerners" (except that he cited Pennsylvania), and now it was directed at "the great unwashed" (except that he never used that term). Whatever. We could play semantic games all day. Yeah, some of our ancestors believed in witches, 3 centuries ago; I'd like to think that most people have moved beyond that. It's dismaying the way that Americans are being left in the dust by secular nations who are also safer, healthier and more generous than we are.
bricology 3 years ago
bricology:
I'm surprised you're not familiar with the term, "the great unwashed" used by many in New England to describe people in the mid-west who are "culturally inferior". It has several other definitions applying to other groups. Obama is technically part of the Great Unwashed, but since he went to Harvard, he gets a pass.
In Florida, a few years ago, murders took place by self-proclaimed witches and warlocks. Witches and warlocks are real in the mind of the beholder or the accuser.
Cindi3847 3 years ago
Cindi: Of course I'm familiar with the term "the great unwashed". My point remains that Obama never used that term, or the term "mid-westerners". These are all just projections by those who want to claim that Obama is "elitist"; an absurd claim for a guy who was raised in a middle-class home by a single mother, worked his ass off to get into Columbia and Harvard, and so on. The elitist is McCain, a child of privilege who married an heiress, has 7 houses and 13 cars, and serves the super-rich.
bricology 3 years ago
bricology: You said "Of course I'm fimilar with the term". Not likely unless you just looked it up. I read your comment and it certainly didn't elude to an understanding of the word.
I never stated Obama made that statement about "the great unwashed " or the "mid-west". He made the statement using the term "middle America", (I checked it out). I think it means the same thing.
McCain was born to a military family. He serves the people of Arizona, not many elitist there.
Cindi3847 3 years ago
"McCain was born to a military family." McCain is the son of one 4-star Navy admiral, the grandson of another 4-star admiral and the nephew of an Army general, and he grew up in privilege in Virginia, attending a prestigious private school. He didn't move to Arizona until he was 45. There are plenty of elitists in Arizona, such as McCain's good friends and early political sponsors Charles Keating and Fife Symington, both of whom are mega-millionaires (and both of whom were convicted of fraud).
bricology 3 years ago
"Americans DO cling to religion and guns." And this creates what problem? So long as they don't enforce their religious beliefs on others, I fail to see anything wrong with religion or guns.
bighitter42 3 years ago
"So long as they don't enforce their religious beliefs on others, I fail to see anything wrong with religion or guns." First, there has NEVER been a dominant religion that didn't try to assert influence upon the State. The history of the US is precisely one of Christianity forcing its way into politics. Second, by far the most common reason people are religious is because their parents forced it upon them. I would say that telling a child that their "sins" will send them to hell, is child abuse.
bricology 3 years ago
"I would say that telling a child that their "sins" will send them to hell, is child abuse."
Yeah, We must say to our children that if they make a sin, they will get away with it.
1MoreMuslim 3 years ago
"Yeah, We must say to our children that if they make a sin, they will get away with it." Oh, absolutely. Because "getting away with" "sins" like making a graven image of Yahweh or "breaking the Sabbath" would be disastrous to let children get away with, right? You ARE aware that the Bible says that children who commit certain sins should be stoned to death, aren't you? Name one "sin" that it's imperative that children be taught to not commit that isn't already addressed in the secular realm.
bricology 3 years ago
"Name one "sin" that it's imperative that children be taught to not commit that isn't already addressed in the secular realm."
1/ Not to drink alcohol.
2/ Not to put your parents in a retire house
3/ Not to go sleep with same sex.
on the top of my head..
1MoreMuslim 3 years ago
1. Not drinking alcohol is YOUR superstition, not mine, nor is it contrary to most OTHER religions (even Jesus turned water into wine and drank it himself). And drunkenness is already addressed in the secular realm.
2. Putting ones parents in a retirement house is prohibited nowhere in the Bible, nor does it even remotely constitute a "sin".
3. Sleeping with the same sex is a sin peculiar to Islam (and to some degree, Christianity); not to other religions and not to the secular world.
Next?
bricology 3 years ago
LOL
Why don't you use the books of hindu? When I defend religion, i don't speak on behalf of Christianity or Buddhism. Christianity is worst than secularism, and the bible is mixed with crap.
Drunkness adressed in secularism? How? To give him a drive back home? LOL The religion is Islam , others are crap.
1MoreMuslim 3 years ago
"The religion is Islam , others are crap." Oh, riiight -- Islam. That would be the religion founded by a pedophile who raided caravans, killed people, had Jewish men, women and children beheaded even after they surrendered, etc. "The Bible is mixed with crap"? No disagreement there; in fact I'd say it's mostly crap. But Islam takes that to a whole new level of crap-dom with a superstition that's violent, misogynistic, tribal, willfully ignorant and thoughtlessly destructive. What a tool you are!
bricology 3 years ago
My religion also teach us to use our brain.. and NOT TO LIE!
1MoreMuslim 3 years ago
"Not to lie"? Everything I said is factual. How old was Aisha when Muhammad first had sex with her? I'll answer that for you: she was 9 YEARS OLD. So a man who has sex with a 9 year-old isn't a pedophile in your book? That says a lot about you. It's a fact that Muhammad raided caravans. It's a fact that he Jews of Banu Qurayza surrendered but Muhammad had them beheaded anyway, and their women and children enslaved. Muhammad did all this and worse. You "use your brain"? That's clearly untrue.
bricology 3 years ago
And the Christians have been angelic over their history. It's time to eliminate all religions.
MidnightChimes 3 years ago 2
You can do both of those w/o the biased "help" of religion. ;)
meloearth 3 years ago
I was asked a question, i answered! When bricology got owned, he changed the subject.
1MoreMuslim 3 years ago
LOL...That's the thing you don't understand liberty...always trying to tell me what I can or can't do.
I'm Episcopalian, and in my churches I have NEVER ONCE heard a single statement about politics. Morals bro, morals. Some churches distort them...some "liberals" don't respect liberty. What do you want?
bighitter42 3 years ago
"Liberals don't respect liberty"? What kind of utter bullshit is that?! In the first place, our Founding Fathers were hardcore liberals! Who could be more liberal than Jefferson, Franklin, Paine? Conservatives are just as likely to try to tell people what they can or can't do (abortion, freedom FROM religion, etc.) And the leaders at the Episcopal church I attend (3,000 members) OFTEN bring up politics; usually liberal politics. Morals, I have no interest in; I much prefer secular ethics.
bricology 3 years ago
Perhaps I should have said modern liberals don't respect liberty. And that's a fact. Neither do modern conservatives. Fact is both parties are disgustingly progressive(in that they have no problem using force to push their ideals on the American people.
Let's not label Jefferson and Paine, as they would be considered libertarian, which falls pretty far to the political right.
You attend a massive church...all the giant churches seem to try and sway peoples politics...try a nice small one.
bighitter42 3 years ago
Well, I don't buy that "modern liberals don't respect liberty". For example, whose liberty takes precedence: an individual who wants to smoke in a public room, or the majority who want to be free from smoke in public? I'd say that being free FROM something negative trumps the being free TO DO something potentially negative to others, such as smoking in public. I would also disagree that (small "L") libertarianism is far to the political right; laissez-faire ideology is actually pretty moderate.
bricology 3 years ago
I do. Obama, Clinton, Biden. Three people who hate freedom as much as Bush, Cheney, and O'Reilly.
How is the second version of the patriot act IN ANY WAY pro freedom? How is gun control pro freedom? How is centralized control of education pro freedom? How is stealing from me to pay for somebody else pro freedom?
Your analogy is a weak and irrelevant one...especially considering the important issues where they ALL repeatedly vote against liberty.
bighitter42 3 years ago
I can quote quite a few conservatives who before any vote or decision always asked themselves, 'am I maximizing liberty?'
Eisenhower, Taft, Goldwater, Reagan(at least usually, and let's ignore his foreign policy...he was very weak there)...the list can go on.
Modern democrats(and most republicans) act as though the Union created the states, and not the other way around. They act as though our rights come from government and are not natural. They prefer Hobbes over Paine.
bighitter42 3 years ago
I would never claim that the Patriot Act is "pro-freedom".
"Obama, Clinton, Biden. Three people who hate freedom as much as Bush, Cheney, and O'Reilly."
You might as well say that EVERY elected official "hates liberty", but they only hate the forms of liberty that differ from their preferred form. In the same respect, some people see taxes and other govt. functions as "anti-freedom", but it's just as logical to say that it's "pro-freedom" to fund the public benefits that their taxes provide.
bricology 3 years ago
"How is centralized control of education pro freedom? How is stealing from me to pay for somebody else pro freedom?"
The parents of the majority of children can neither afford privately-funded schools nor can they homeschool them. What education should they get? It seems that the better educated the public, the more successful, so the public funding some form of public education is beneficial to the whole, even though -- as someone without children -- I'm not happy about my taxes going to that.
bricology 3 years ago
Nothing wrong with public education, sorry if my post mislead you. There is something wrong with the federal government getting involved. Never mind the ineficiency of federal beaurocracy, it makes children that much easier to indoctrinate into the system and susceptible to certain agendas. And it removes any community values.
bighitter42 3 years ago
paulp1021
OMG! Someone said Rev. Wright is a nut? I don't think so. Rev. Wright just tells the truth as he sees it and his parishioners agree. I know that Obama, being a member of the church for 20 years, took criticism. But why wouldn't Obama, a man of color that has been discriminated against all his life, not share those feeling. We need to give Obama a break on this one.
phineastbuster 3 years ago 2
LOL He is a nut. It's not a reason to vote against Obama, there are enough real reasons to do that.
But his historical analogies regarding white people are not only racist, they're quite off base. If Obama does share those feelings, then he's a liar because he said he does not. BOOHOO...your preacher is as fucked up as Palin's. With that said, a few of the things he said were correct, if for the wrong reasons.
bighitter42 3 years ago
bighitter42
Thanks for seeing the satire in my posting.
phineastbuster 3 years ago
I missed it, but I'm happy to hear it.
bighitter42 3 years ago