Tribalism & Civilization... Backwards, Advanced?

[BeaSiegal]

Oh and that is one hell of a shirt.

[BeaSiegal]

I would say its subjective. Sounds romantic but if our intelligence is measured by our ability to reason and formulate solutions to obstacles then I'd say our collective intelligence as humans in "developed" societies is declining as we create sparkly cases for smart phones and gaming devices that replace human to human interaction instead of ways to increase the amount of drinking water on the planet.

[Vamavid]

I think intelligent is being able to adapt to what ever situation you find yourself in.

[EricSchwin22]

I'm an Artist...my Co-Workers find me rather odd or weird, hehe...whatever. I think what's important is to be good at something you really love and stick with it, and I think that is Intelligent.

[gabydewilde]

We are fertilizer machines build to spread seeds. Perhaps do a bit of planting. Other real functions we just don't have at this stage. Later on we will be useful to bring life to other planets. (infect)

In case we go extinct nature again will just create something perhaps like a human to do those infestations for her. Or should that be 'something as unlikely as a human'? Anyway, this is clearly a brute force attempt and we are just one stage of it.

[Kronoan]

I love technology, so my vote is that Civilization, overall, is better than a Tribal society. But that's just me. I wouldn't last a day if I was transplanted to a foreign tribe, but that's just the way I am.

[lygophile]

wow, how did i miss this video. yeah, i'm a very 'independant' type of guy, if you know what i mean. individualistic. however, in this artificial society i actually need a lot of advice etc to get by, what with administration and such (i suck at those things)

however, really all i do is such at being DEPENDANT on institutions and what not. dump me in a forrest and i'd probably naturally learn to survive. independancy is just banned in our society, and terms get inverted. NEWSPEAK for ya.

[theultimativehjg]

The indegenous man is, in my point of view, much better educated. In industrialized world, especially in western world, the education and even the worth of a human is only measured on his productivity. But if you look to the really important things in life, an tribe's man is much better educated. For what do you need economical knowledge or a PC, if you stand alone in the bush trying to survive? And also, this man probably has a much better social life, because he spends all time with his family

[formerutuber]

it's impossible to survive without tools.we wouldn't be able to hunt.we don't have the natural weapons predators have, so we made tools.

[TheAremo]

The fallacy in the idea is the assmuption that coming from a tribe may or may not be a factor of intelligence vis a vis "Civilisation" neither terms have been defined. i.e There are lot's of Scottish & Yoruba University Professors both come from their tribes both living in modern society the two are combined.

[Pr4dat0r]

i think intelligence is both, intelligence is questioning one's surrounding and the established order, instead of accepting it and mindlessly following its doctrine

[crispynotfried]

i think it depends on what the persons goal is.

and how they go about working towards it and how they treat people along the way.

[nate556]

You raise some good points in this. I personally find that it's good to develope a balance. I could work behind a desk and kill animals for food.

I think it's important to note that in these modern times of high civilization that these different types do need eachother. So, I work to grow stuff in a field, or i build houses. Then there are other people who keep things like Electricity going, and keep cars working. If you take away one, the whole house falls down.

[nate556]

It's also important to say that should society and civilization collapse for one reason or another, that survival skills will be more important than any ammount of computing knowlege and mechanics. It's good to know how to shoot a deer and snare rabbits.

If you were to give me a choice, i would most definitely pick the tribal way of my ancestors. But i can adapt to live in any environment should i need to. I could survive the cement jungle.

[kaminarigaston]

Hunting and gathering tribes are only supported by their environment in small numbers. If we did just that, we'd be as successful as chimps. I don't know if civilization as we understand it is good for us in terms of happyness and self-fulfillment, but it sure is good for us in terms of survival of the species. At least it was until we invented thermonuclear warfare.

[Claybird121]

I'd rather live in a hunting and gathering tribe. But, considering the fact that all land is owned, all land is taxed (except the small pockets of "reservations") and all areas when hunting and gathering is allowed are already taken by those who aren't nessesarily the most welcoming to the civilized (and really, who could blame them) it makes it hard to live this out. I would prefer to combine the best of both elements and live in a contemporary community that creates and gathers it's own food.

[MadCatElite]

Kudos to anyone who can be dependent on themselves to live, whether in Wall Street or in the Jungle. But that is not how a civilization survives, whether a whole Country or a small tribe, the special ingredient is a community, people working together for a common goal.

Perhaps the question is not of intelligence, but that of cooperation. Can people put aside their arrogance of superiority and work alongside other to obtain a common goal?

[JoeMulk]

excellent points, great video

[KristenMarieJensen]

My grandmother once told me that intelligence is an ability to adapt.

[qualqui]

hmmm...what i like about your vids my buddy,they make you THINK,...hmm...the baker would probably revert to exploitin'his situation in the tribal area, yeah, he might not have electricity or gas but he could build a clay oven that feeds on wood or animal dung, whereas the tribal dude would go beserk with modern way of life and probably withdraw to some park or outskirts of civilization.5 stars proteanview!

[daemonboi2]

I would definitely want to be independent and be able to survive without having to rely on the already-established inventions of other people like cars & printed currency. I think industrialism has had it's chance and is just creating more problems than it can or even attemps to solve. I don't support the abolishment of all modern conveniences but when it's impossable for us to exist comfortably without them, that just seems unhealthy.

[deviantcreep]

People living in industrialized countries should probably learn how to survive in the wild and how to live simply (modern convinence probably ain't gonna last much longer). It probably would be good for the "tribesman" living simply in the wild to learn about modern technology, like how it works and how industrialized people live day to day. So they know whats it is and can develop there own attitude towards "modern living".

[AndrewDewittBaker]

by the way, i think the tribes have it right. seeing as how nature sustains human life, obvious proof is whats happening right now, poisonous air, global warming, etc.. these problems wouldn't exist without the 'advancement' of western civilizations.

[AndrewDewittBaker]

seeing as how i am absolutely in love with animals and nature, i'd pick tribalism, i already hate the lack of nature in modern america. i often dream about moving to some wilderness in the middle of no where and living in a cabin fending and surviving for myself. the practices we do in america literally make me sick to my stomach, and other countries too, surviving for yourself and living an honest life just isn't convenient enough these days.

[MUN7001]

I think you can benefit alot from tribalism. If AMerica didnt stupidly wipe off every tribe out of America, we would probably have a cure for cancer and alot of diseases. We probably would not have to resort to destroying our atmosphere or environment. Alot has and could have been learned from tribalism. Both can benefit from each other.

[MUN7001]

I think there is many forms of intelligence . You have social intelligence, the type of intelligence you need to pass your grades, the type of intelligence you need to play sports. Psychology clearly states the forms of intelligence. But alot of people think that if you are not good in school you are not intelligent. Which is wrong.

[Athaeus]

It's not actually a matter of intelligence, but of knowledge.

Come to think of it, I guess it's actually a vital thing that should even be taught in schools - how to survive outside civilisation.

Personally (being a person with a seemingly endless curiosity) I would prefer to live in a civilisation, but a civilisation that is closer to nature than the modern metropolises. We've lost our biological neccesaities in modern civilisation, such as large-scale human socialising.

[TaskiyahEmaani]

i think the healthier and much more environmentally friendly way of life is living of nature and supporting your self in a nationural way. having said that it is an advantage to have modern skills as well such as knowing how to use computers and other types of machinery.

but the better option is the option is that which benifits us all.

[CHAS1422]

It's not a matter of which is more intelligent, it is a matter of what system can sustain a large population. It would be impossible to sustain all 300,000,000 people in America without a modern infrastructure. Food production is impossible without concentrated agriculture to produce it, a transportation industry to ship it and banking to finance the industries. Tribalism is prone to famine through local drought, pests, parasites, disease and ignorance, but is closer to the natural world.

[buddyfreakinholly]

I think people could be sustained by local markets with produce and meat without a large transportation and banking system, but I'm a bit of an anarchist. Many Americans overindulge especially when it comes to food. We should be more concerned with quality than with quantity. Even with modern technology droughts, floods, pests, parasites, and diseases exist. Would you rather eat an apple that had a little worm in it or one that was sprayed with pesticide?

[CHAS1422]

So you propose that 250,000,000 people who live in concentrated urban areas fan out and live off the land? Very romantic and very unrealistic. We'd live a starvation lifestyle like in the impoverished regions of the world. We'd spend our whole lives foraging for the next meal, and fighting with proximate neighbors for arable land...uhg! Canada would immediately be invaded by land starved tenant farmers...feudalism born again!

[buddyfreakinholly]

No CHAS I didn't imply that at all. I didn't say for everyone to live off of the land and forage for the next meal. You can work as a computer technician, auto mechanic, or whatever you want. I'm saying people should get beef from their local cattle farmer (or the nearest one). Why should New Yorkers eat beef that was raised in Texas when there are plenty of cattle farms in New York?

[sexfanatic]

Tribalism worked will for Native Americans and others, westernized forms of civilazation only caused overpopulation and crime, and infact buffalo, an animal that use to roam in packs all over America was nearly wiped out due to western civilization. Most tribes now how to restrict themselves when hunting, but modern civilizations DON'T (overconsumption).

And ppl can survive without infrastucture, they been doing for hundreds of yrs before, back before obesity and gluntiny.

[CHAS1422]

Don't decieve yourself with romantic notions of savage life. The N. American Triabal population sustained by "living off the land" has been roughly estimated at 5-10 million. In more populated areas tribes were in a constant state of genocidal warefar over hunting grounds. Those that weren't were marginalized. Scalping, human sacrafice & torture were distinct patterns of practice before arrival of europeans. Whole populations were decimated when there were droughts. Is this the life you want?

[sexfanatic]

Some of that u mentioned is part of their society's culture and has nothing to do with tribalism in itself. Let me explain...in "civilized" areas where there is overpopulation u still have high rates of murder and crime,so just becuz tribal societies didn't do good with high populations doesn't mean "civilized" ones are fairing much better. In fact the industrial revolution brought disease & overpopulation to center areas(namely the cities)

Tribalism is much better in my opinion... less havoc

[CHAS1422]

Tribalism evolved out of unitized social competition for resources. If we observe the less civilized and less educated areas where, until recently, tribalism reigned supreme, there are no restraints on birthrates, and there is perpetual warfare with neighboring tribes. Including those tribes that have not contacted civilization. Read up on the recently discovered, and heavily studied Yanomamo tribes of Brazil. Google "Yanomamo Warfare"

[sexfanatic]

Compare China (one of the "civilized" world's GROWING economic powers)to any of the "uncivilized" African Nations...both u would see have HIGH birth rates, but there is an obvisous difference btwn the 2 countries, is there not.

High birthrates are not neccessarily a bad thing, every society has them, even America would have them if it wasn't for Roe v Wade and Pro Choice Laws

And as for Warfare, we AMERICA are in a WAR right now, war is not just an issue limited to tribalism

[CHAS1422]

I don't know where you get your statistics. China's birth rate is one of the lowest in the world (esp due to the "one child" gov policy). Populations can't grow forever. But I never judged the birth rates as bad or good. Clearly replacement population is necessary, but over-population will strain the social recources and structure, often leading to warfare. But, if tribe A overpopulates, then tribe B must respond in kind or become defensive & warlike, or it will be overtaken and become extinct.

[sexfanatic]

i was going off of what the birth rates use to be in China, i have heard of the "One Child Law" MOSTLY BECUZ THEY USE TO HAVE HIGH BIRTHRATES, but i digress

And i do agree with u assessment with tribalism and overpopulation, but i ask of u isn't that the same thing that happens in some "civilized" societies? People in tribes get almost just as bad effects from overpop. as "civilized" societies do

[Malifx]

Today, intellegence is the ability to continue the legacy that has been layed out for you by your ancestors.

[Papachair]

Balance... is possible.

[UTEEngineer]

would u like me to respond to this with a short video?

[chairde]

IQ tests such as the ones designed by Weschler measure the ability to achieve success in your environment, that is Western Civilization in our case. Native people are very intelligent although not by the standards set by 'civilized' people. It is foolish to assume that native people are not intelligent. Custer found this out the hard way. The potential for success in your environment is the real measure of intelligence.

[fion81]

White people would have been tribal once only a few thousand years ago. I think dying of disease, no understanding of the world. Hell, what your doing, communicating on the net have all been good things. Progress has its pains, but comon, stagnation wont work. Eventually we would go extinct that way, i think people have a garden of eden falicy. Given one week in primitive society i think most would run away. However, simplicity is a good thing. Simplicty and modernity can coexist.

[trickertricks]

what people don't understand... which i will have to explain in another vid.... is that living with the level of Respect tribal people had also gives people the highest level of Happiness available to the human experience.

i'm slowly unravelling how all this works with my vids.

thanks for the response.

Peace.

[boxercare]

I think you pose the alternative options in a biased way. Desk jobs can probably be better characterized than merely an effort to "cover up nature and create things that you rely on to live." I think they are the same if you ask me, in that both individuals are contributing their work to sustain their society, which is itself a system that promotes the respective desirable form of survival.

[JeffreyEdward19]

I believe that the ability to create things is probably the best route. I like the luxury of not living in the stone age and having running water and electricity. Also with the medicines available and improvements in healthcare life expectancy is greater. That's just my opinion seems like you will have a better life when you make your environment adapt to you.

[boxercare]

You seem to be putting forth values that are culturally biased. Whereas YOU might prefer to spend 6 years in a hospital and live to 80, other people might be content to live only 30 years if it means never becoming incapacitated in a hospital.

[jplumads]

It depends on how you want to live. If you want to run a Western country, you should probably choose the banker over the tribesman.

[GlobalBuzzSA]

Nowadays intelligence can be determined with a far greater spectrum.

An amazing tennis player can be called a genius and rightly so. The intelligence of their game can be measured.

To take people and place them out of their depth was displayed in Crocodile Dundee.

The ability to adapt and the desire to adapt to change is a strength and whether the person has the intelligence to adapt could be questioned.

Therein you may answer your own question about intelligence

[napalmcoffee]

He makes an interesting analogy. one could argue though our needs to survive evolved/change along with our culture technology.

[SSJSampson]

Both, why not? Not everything is black and white. Im English but i seem to do well in tropical enviroments, i love nature and would enjoy living in a warm lush green place however i believe technology and civilisation is important to help us better understand the world around us. Both have there problems, higher mortality for tribal peoples and corruption and mass destruction in civilisations.

[Antares321]

They play a reverse racism card on the educated white folk, and alienate them. Now the country is in ruins.. Well done ANC. What a GREEDY monkey republic is has become.

They are shortsighted and afraid to stop Afirmative Action, because the white people might rule again... The white population has dwindled to a low of 2%. STOP AA NOW, and rebuild SA with real Equility as you promised ANC!

[steamingweasel0]

Neither nor! the measurement is simple... coming across a new senario can the apply find a solution? Can us take a Bushmen and stick them in Alaska? can you take an Iniut to the Namib? So no mater what your environment is can you come up with a plan in the face of a changing situation? that is the test and measure!

[jdotz27]

A tribesman relies on instincts, which all people have. Don't get me wrong, they are smart in their own right, but more of their skills/trades rely on instincts.

The baker relies on aquired knowledge. What he was taught in schools, not what he knows instinctually.

If it is a question of these two, I think that aquired knowledge needs to be a supplement to our instincts. Suppressing our instincts and using only knowledge learned from books will lead us to failure at some point in our lives.

[jdotz27]

I don't think this is a question of intelligence, seems to be more of a a question on our ways of life. To live with nature and adapt ourselves, or to live by shaping nature to our advantage. I think the best way to live would be a combination of the two. Changing nature is ok, but destroying it and completely remolding the earth is not. As far as who has greater intelligence between the two I would have to say the baker. He still would posses many of the skills needed by the tribsman

[newfielove]

I dont know if you can really say that one is more "intelligent" then the other. I think that where a certain race/tribe/culture end up in life depends on their goals as a people. If we look back at some of the ancient cultures, such as the ancient greeks or egyptians, they had alot of knowledge and technology which has been lost and forgotten, and we far from knowing and understanding what they knew so many years ago. Does that make us less intelligent?

[CorbeauBlanc]

this is a very nice comparison. with the banker and the tribe.

very good.

[pdholden]

I spent years in Africa working with a missionary, and I was able to examine this topic closely. While it is true that I do admire the simplicity of tribal life, I find that many people that live in these conditions are miserable due to both lack of modern medicine and the oppressive superstition which dominates their lives. I would MUCH rather live with technology and modern understanding.

[scottroberts44]

Well we have ALL at one time in the past lived as tribesmen, completely off the land and without tools or technology. But then some of us evolved beyond this simplistic way of life (simple is sometimes better if you ask me).  We have had this knowledge and experience passed down to us through our culture from generation to generation. WE are the SUM of all our ancestors and the progress in which they all contributed to.

[scottroberts44]

It was not accidental, it is the net result of our achievement as a people/culture. You can plop a tribes men into this culture and he can have some degree of success and some can even flourish, but it is NOT a part of his wiring or his very being. And I think we see evidence of this very thing in the world today.

[scottroberts44]

We label it 100 different things and make endless excuses for these "failures", but I think the reality is quite clear to anyone willing to think for themselves and base their opinions on SIMPLE observations. And until this REALITY is realized we will ALL continue to suffer from the lies. Each in our own ways.

[scottroberts44]

As for your question. 1. I do not think it is necessarily ALL about intelligence. But we are in fact wired differently. Time and evolution has seen to it.

2. How would I rather live? I would rather live a SIMPLE life. BUT I would prefer that to be in a progressive society where science and medicine were the main focuses not money and selfishness. Where the main goal is GROUP progress and striving to BETTER the world we live in, as apposed to exploiting it and consequently destroying it.

[scottroberts44]

so if i were to WISH for something it would be a simple life. BUT not one in which I must REGRESS to a place in which my ancestors evolved from LONG ago. I would wish for that same simplicity on SOME levels, but through progress not regression.

Oh yeah.. btw. the banker would have a much greater chance of "success"...cont

[scottroberts44]

Since a tribesmen world is far less complex and we have ALL shown such capabilities to survive in that environment already or we wouldnt be here now. "Been there done that" so to speak. It might take an adjustment, but the demands of life in that environment are far less complex and basic. And "success" would be judged simply by survival.

[scottroberts44]

so if i were to WISH for something it would be a simple life. BUT not one in which I must REGRESS to a place in which my ancestors evolved from LONG ago. I would wish for that same simplicity on SOME levels, but through progress not regression.

Oh yeah.. btw. the banker would have a much greater chance of "success"...cont

*this post was meant to proceed the "since a tribesmen" post, but it got lost somehow.

[sexysyfy]

I like your shirt it's HoT!!!!

I think that is a good idea for T.V. take your Ides to ABC, CBS, FOX, or NBC or even better PBS!!!!!!!!!

If you get a show please email me I love to be at the finals:)

[erkd1]

If you take a begger?? LOL If you replace a functioning member of tribe in our modern world why would you say a begger? That makes no sense at all. Intelligence is the ability to comprehend information, knowledge is what you remember of that information, wisdom is applying both to a situation. A tribesman is equally intelligent but we have far greater understanding (knowledge) of his world then he does of ours, although we would need his wisdom to survive in his enviroment.

[proteanview]

erkd1: Oh, no... a "banker". It does sound like "beggar," though.

[erkd1]

LOL Ohhh, I see, my mistake.

[lysergicaddict]

yin yang

[tomswindell]

He who feels it knows it.

I have often felt that my right as a human was to be born into a harmonious basic lifestyle and that Christianity and capitalism has taken this away from my society leaving us with fools progress instead.

Also I believe that in U.K it's cold and farming would have to be intensive if you were to survive, so this cold weather pushed Europe to develop more comforts and complicate life deemphasizing some of its best aspects.

[cosmanthony21]

i like where your heads at.