Joseph Pine: What do consumers really want?

[zanitywest]

Quite an interesting talk; bit of a shame this guy's an enormous twat.

[NationalElitism2]

watch?v=ipdR_90Bt4s - The Essence of American Power

[BrutusAlbion]

A business is never true to itself, it is inherently cheap, it will cutt its own ideals to make an extra quick buck. It will do this for as long as the consumer can put up with it. Cause that is the most profitable, a little pain but massive gain ;-). And consumers sometimes they are just left no other choice.

[roboboxB]

Alternative title: "How to play minecraft"

[edwinstar100]

Starbucks is a good example; in fact, they have done advertising for their instant coffee...which is feaux coffee and not consistant with Starbucks policy of offering something "real" and of historically, not advertising. Their instant coffee tastes like Nescafe, in my opinion.

[ABIMarketingPR]

In BtoB, value comes not so much from experience as from extending value up and down the supply chain. In a way, you're marketing not so mcu value, but extending value. For example, making something more efficiently doesn't mean cheaper -- it means being able to communicate a green message all the way down to the consumer.

[ImOnTheTube]

So the term "deeper harmony" I refer to perpetual balance. That is something that is caused by the resonance of the deep "things" in you. When you understand the nature of these "things" you will make your decisions based on them. You will be more authentic because your decisions will not be based on shallowness.

Sorry for the long posts.

[ImOnTheTube]

OK, I understand your confusion...

I think happiness can be compared to an ocean. It can be shallow or deep. Shallow happiness is caused by material possession and sensual experience. Deep happiness is caused by balance and the achievement of passion.

Material possession is good; lobster is good, but too much lobster turns to tiresome. The idea is not to go off balance.

Consumerism causes people to go off balance because its philosophy says that there is never too much lobster.

[ImOnTheTube]

Deep happiness is long term because it resonates deeply with you. It makes all the little gears that make up you to start fitting each other and turning. That will cause you to move forward gradually and be in balance. I call this progression deep love for subjects or for people. Passion.

You need lobster to fulfill your food passion. But if you understand that the nature of your well being is caused by balance, you will move out of consumerism. You will not look for more.

[ImOnTheTube]

This is why all people buy to be happy. But only consumerists are trapped in this more, more, more notion. They are enslaved because they do not realize that more, more, more will not make them happy.

If you discover your deep nature, if you discover what you need to put into your fridge you will not need to buy loads of random products that you think will make you happy. You will buy lobster. But remember not too much lobster.

[euripideesshreds]

@ImOnTheTube Hi I reply because these are such excellent comments. I love the ocean metaphor and I use it as well for the truth, which is also applicable. I had a look at your channel and invite you to check out mine. Aloha...

[HigherPlanes]

Consumers just want sex, food and entertainment. Everything else is just an extension of that.

[dialectics]

Amen.

[ImOnTheTube]

Essentially absolutely everything that one buys, buys it to be happy. I agree with this lecture because you buy a Lexus in order to recreate that exhilarating acceleration experience you see in the commercial. Everything is great until you find out the law requires you to drive 40 mph. The only problem I have is with the levels of happiness. Todays consumerism enslaves the people with temporary happiness. It blinds the people from deeper harmony. So its really not all that authentic.

[bettySwollox]

ImOnTheTube, I would argue that all happiness is temporary, if you look at it from the "exhilarating....experience" perspective. For example, the pleasure and happiness derived from eating lobster, is in my view not temporary at all. The consumption process of eating the lobster, is of course temporary, but the pleasure and happiness derived from merely thinking about eating it could, arguably, last a life time. ( cont...)

[bettySwollox]

Would you then argue that the genuine happiness I receive from the mere thought of eating lobster is not authentic or genuine in any sense at all?

In addition, I think your point about "Essentially absolutely everything that one buys, buys it to be happy" is a little bit weak, and I very much doubt if that is the case. I mean can you name one thing that you buy to make yourself unhappy? Probably not! Take a look at the items in the average shopping basket. Not really items of happiness at all.

[ImOnTheTube]

I did not say that all happiness is temporary, I said that there are levels of happiness and that today's consumerism is primarily focused on one end of the spectrum.

I understand your lobster point because some people have a passion for food. Passion is a very much deeper kind of happiness. However most people do not guide themselves by passion. They guide themselves by the temporary awe created by the mass media. And this is the problem in today's society; there is no balance.

[ImOnTheTube]

If we look at the grocery basket phenomenon we may see that we will buy only to survive.

But here is the thing: You have a choice of survival. You have a choice of starving.

You won't want to starve to death because you know that is not the path you would like to take. I also won't even mention the type of food you may buy that will make you even more happy [lobster]....

The universe is made up of the dual nature of long and short. There is too much shortness in the world today.

[bettySwollox]

I'm not sure you've made you point any clearer, as now you seem to be contradicting yourself. I don't wanna bust your balls (or breasts) about it, I just wanna clear up any confusion. You said that "Essentially absolutely everything that one buys, buys it to be happy" which when coupled with "Todays consumerism enslaves the people with temporary happiness" sounds like you are leading up to a contradiction, especially when you deliver a line such as "I did not say that all happiness is temporary"

[bettySwollox]

So, is happiness - no matter how temporary - a good thing or a bad thing? Is the fact that producers of goods and services, who "know" and listen to what the market wants, needs and demands, and confirming this with their dollar votes, a good thing or a bad thing in your mind?

If we look at happiness, on the brain level, as simply an interaction of chemical, electric and hormonal activity, then how can even just a brief moment of happiness brought on by the purchase of ....(cont.)

[bettySwollox]

......a "thing" be any less genuine or authentic than something you referred to as "deeper harmony"?

In the film Fight Club, one scene has Edward Norton looking at his refrigerator, that has just flown 200ft to its demise, the scence ends with a line that goes something like this "a fridge full of condements, but no food!". Is this what you mean about consumerism? That much of our lives, these days, lacks any real substance? If, so then I think I get your point, otherwise please explain further

[LudicrousTachyon]

Next up, customizing experience, here come implants to help you experience the world in new ways!

$0.02 to $5 just blows me away.

[tubedeejay]

creepiest guy i ever saw on a ted talks! because he's defending disney as real as anything dutch? really everything dutch may be fictional as disney, at least it involves real people (unlike this guy)

what he's really saying:

commodity economy: we only charged you to eat

goods: we only charged you for food and things we made which cost more

services: finds ways to charge more for food and goods

experiences economy: everything you do is commercial!

we can afford more but we work more than ever.

[jazzyfizzle86]

You should read the book because I don't think you understand the concept of the Progression of Economic Value.

[pykenike]

Werecow is right imo. I would like to add that the very act of being the first to "make land" on such a scale is authentic. Yeah sure it's man-made, but because holland was pioneer on that makes it, authentic.

Futhermore, there is a cultural difference between americans and europeans. That's why Disneyland Paris had so much trouble in the start, They copied the American disneyPark.(Thus not authentic). For us (or at least for me) disney is somewhat to much/over the top.

[Paulginz]

A summary of this talk:

1) If you have money left over after basic needs, you'll use it to have fun.

2) People have a subjective and easily manipulable measure of quality of experience which we call authenticity.

3) (implicit) people are stupid enough to buy overpriced "authenticity" (think big brands) as long as you can convince enough people that competitors are cheap knockoffs.

4) PROFIT!!!

[code933k]

Sorry for the thumb down, my finger slide to the wrong side... Your shortening of the conference made me want to see you there instead of Mr. Consumerism (aka. Ferengi).

[SirBanon]

no worries, i cancel'd your negative with a positive and it was super effective xD

[adzug]

ty, christ i knew from the begin that starbux was crappolla and to develop a whole long winded theory about real fake and fake real ... bottom line, i dont waste my money on the ambiance of a starbux, i buy a coffee for cheap at local deli

[eArtrash]

blow me

[megamarsvin]

I'll tell you what this consumer wants: Not be seen as freaking cattle for the self-proclaimed marketing gurus of the world.

[mfmezz11]

Amen - Bill Hicks fan?

[megamarsvin]

Absolutely ^^

[Tekahera]

... And perhaps you prefer to brew your own coffee. In general terms that simply means you prefer to take over past the commodity or the goods stage, but I can bet you'd much rather have your coffee out on your balcony in the warm sun, or whatever floats your boat. Point being that you generate your own "authentic"(w/e) experience. And with a little willingness, you can find tons of examples where you'd rather other people provide the good experience for you: massages, dance halls, etc.

[Tekahera]

It is not just a coffee shop, that is the point that you're missing. Just a coffee shop is at the gas station or at the grocery store, where they're simply offering the service of brewing me a coffee. However, we're increasingly expecting more than just good or bad service, they're expecting a certain "something". Yes that is common sense for most, but the merit of this talk, at least for me, was to pinpoint what that certain something is.

[code933k]

What an use of random buzzwords masked as a reasoning.., Interesting... for uncultured business people.

[Paulginz]

Let's not be too harsh.

He just stretched a simple one-line concept (People notice artificiality and generally don't like it.) into a 14 minute talk by filling it up with empty rethoric.

[code933k]

Agreed :}

[Punniabi]

This is a really smart man. He doesn't use trickery in his speech he says stuff how it is and he doesn't give a fuck. That's one thing I hate about this world everyones a fucking sneak, they are always so nice and speak so good but on the inside they are thinking of something completely different.

[eArtrash]

great talk! kinda told us what we already knew but in a new light. what will the new level of economic value be?... hmm i recon a major disaster (like an asteroid) will inevitably hit us (at some time in the future)and wipe out a huge region of our map. then when we are staring in the aftermath of disaster and Comodities will out-vaulue goods... then the pattern will continue.....

[roidroid]

I read/watch Sci-Fi to be inspired, and as a reality check: it has to be believable, possible... Boiled down it's basically just "education". It has to educate me. I have to come outof it smarter, come outof it with better ideas than i went in with.

I don't want to be deluded, or sorted as a person into a market demographic and served a purposefully limited (carefully rationed) product - i do not want planned obselescence, to be manipulated, harvested, controlled.

[roidroid]

@3:50

To say that a bad experience is still an experience is rediculous semantics. We're talking about an experience as a sort of service - it's something to sell, it's a market. THERE IS NO MARKET FOR BAD EXPERIENCES.

When i have an inauthentic experience, i don't like it. i feel used, manipulated, commoditized. I will not pay for that. Don't fuck around the point with semantics. A bad experience is not an experience anyone wants to buy, it is a nonexistant market.

[clannon]

Actually, there is a market for bad experiences. They use them to de-sensitize people with phobias.

[TheThomaswastaken]

This was a good one.

[Westonci]

i want to experience porno.

[csikjarudi]

I could characterize this talk with three words: bullshit, bullshit, bullshit.

[dubaiedge]

thank you.

[gusphraba]

How did this get so many stars. Yadda Yadda Yadda.

[corridorofpower]

Satisfying my desire for authenticity will make me happy. ... Does that really mean anything?

[akafazov]

I don't get this guy. He sounds very unauthentic/artificial. It's simply so boring that it's hard to listen to.

[Skulls2300]

that's probably because you are not trying to start or run your own business, so you are not interested because you can't find any use to what he is saying and so find it hard to relate in any way.

[GetMeThere1]

You're right, akafazov. But this is the "boring" that every day empties people's pockets through neverending consumerism.

People (like this guy) actually spend their lives (and all their creativity) on crap like this.

[swingbabu2006]

blah blah blah....

[Skulls2300]

ANSWER: what is homer thinking when an intellectual talk is given?

[swingbabu2006]

u think this is intellectual? dude on what level?

This is common knowledge, buttered in fancy language.

[Skulls2300]

on the level requiring the use of the mind creatively on the subject of commerce, hence the use of the word "intellectual"... dude!

If this is such common knowledge how come it's not more commonly used? take wallmart for example, I heard they're a pretty "successful" corporation, if this was common knowledge wouldn't walmart be in on it? yeah... but they're not!

[swingbabu2006]

Authenticity thats all I hear in this talk, rest is blah blah.

Probably he is right about what he is talking about, but where is the evidence that authentic experience is what consumer wants?. Do you think just the name "Starbucks" is enough. He should be talking to bunch of school kids.

[Skulls2300]

it's called a "talk" for a reason not a debate or seminar, TED=people sharing their IDEAS! you hear ideas you don't know enough about, understand or like and hear "blah blah blah" insinuating useless, unimportant, and waste of time. but guess what he is talking at TED because a lot of people don't just hear "blah blah blah" This is the ignorance of Homer Simpson. Maybe if the guy had more than 18 min. to speak he could give you more examples, other than starbucks... hmmm just maybe.

[swingbabu2006]

so tell me what exactly you hear? blah blah and more blah?

[Skulls2300]

why would I waste my time telling someone that leaves comments like BLAH BLAH BLAH what I got out of this?? I rather have a conversation with someone that has more to say than blah blah blah. I get it, you think this talk sucks, thanks for letting us know. see ya.

[swingbabu2006]

I rather make my own coffee than go for some thing he describes as FAKE REAL... or what is the other name?AUTHENTIC!

This talk is pretty much a FILLER, if you know what I mean

See ya..

[Punniabi]

ur an idiot have you ever been to a starbucks resturant? you feel like a millionaire when you're in there

[swingbabu2006]

it is just a coffee shop you, less than idiot.

[cavakun]

This talk is very much related to baudrillard's theories.

[baronmorris]

another example comes to mind:

in "Breakfast at Tiffany's" it is said of the main character that "she's a phony... but she's a REAL phony..."

Peace

[mikimel]

I would change only one thing in Mr. Pines presentation and that is the word "render" to "design".

[petfoodonly]

What does 'being true to itself' even mean? Why is he so obsessed with heritage?

I think of a company like Hyundai, did make mining equipment and boats. Then made smaller trucks. Then cheap cars. Now they're successfully making high quality sports car. It's not being 'true to itself' in the sense he's talking about - but that's fine? Who cares about 'authenticity'?

I think he's talking though his arse.

[rhaikh]

Would you rather drive a Hyundai or a Maserati?

[petfoodonly]

If it was my money, I'd take the Hyundai.

It's the product that matters, not the heritage of the intellectual product that happens to be stamped on packaging.

[GeeWeezzz]

Great! That was such a mindfuck!

[cromicus]

I don't think he's an economist

[drchaffee]

Sounds like a fad to me, championing a characteristic that has always been around and trying to shine a different light on it.

[yp06407012]

Brilliant talk...!!

[yadeyrinii]

This guy is dead on right. I think he is getting down to the nitty gritty, he's not using the word postmodernity, but he is speaking the continental philosophical discourse known as postmodernity.

[muzzleray]

companies would use the word "Integrity" in their mission statements in their foyers, now I'm starting to see the word "Authenticity". Authenticity at least is a bit more honest as you can have an "authentic thief".

[Krumbz2003]

This was an excellent video. He makes some VERY valid points.

Kind of makes you look at how businesses market their products to unassuming consumers.

[DrewEl2]

interesting

[dubaiedge]

this is a white view. a lot of people in the world have cared for a long time who makes the goods.

[georgio316]

You mean the world view of the developed world. Countries like Japan and even China (slowly as they rise economically) are caring less who makes the goods. He's talking about how different stages of economic development produces different levels of consumerism. Race has nothing to do with it.

[dubaiedge]

You're entitled to your opinion.

[JmkLcAeJsm]

Bloody non-economists, stay out of my subject!

[JmkLcAeJsm]

In all seriousness, my criticism is that mr Josephine uses a construct, the distinction between goods, commodities and services, that is only an arbitrary statistical descriptor, and tries to use it as a predictive model.

This is not a good way of doing things.

[spikesmth]

I agree that it's arbitrary, but it's also usefully descriptive of intangible relationships. But my conclusion on the vid is that the masters of fakery (corporations) will just do a better job hiding how fake they are. But small businesses would have an inherent advantage in authenticity perhaps.

[JmkLcAeJsm]

Fake, real, authentic. Just descritors for consumers criteria. Ultimately, whoever best satisfies those, large or small, wins.

That's a good thing.

[JmkLcAeJsm]

Ha, Josephine. Lol.

[ratholin]

boo cross promoting the clock of the long now. Did this guy just say starbucks creates an authentic experience? This video could have been about 4 minutes long cut out the poorly thought up examples and been far more impacting.

[earfetish]

jargon

[conoba]

Fake and artifical are two different things.

The netherlands are the fascinating result of generations of people working hard. Disneyland is just fake and it's parts were build in months by contractors.

How does he dare to compare the two just because both are artifical?

The dutch made an entire country out of the bottom of the sea! How awsome is that?

It is an experience to visit there and it is genuine. How does this marketing monkey dare to belittle generations of work in such a manner?

[MisterWeed]

Yeah you a right conoba, that was a stupid comparison. Amsterdam for example is already authentic or "Real Real" like he called it.

It is an experience..

[esaman]

He argues, that Neatherlands is trying too look like it is not artificial. Which can be sed to mean it is fake.

I wouldn't know how true it is though.

[werecow2003]

Well, I'm Dutch, and I do like it here, but he has a point on the whole fabricated thing; we have almost no original natural landscape left here. When I go out to 'experience nature', that usually means the Dutch countryside, which consists mainly of farmland. And the few bits of natural forest, dunes, etc that we do have left are swarming with tourists and are strictly maintained. Still, it's more authentic than Disneyland, I'd argue, since that place was designed specifically for the fantasy.

[wolffenhaus]

this is correct. Experience is given to those who appreciate.

[intrepgun]

the problem is that 'economic experiences' are being pushed down people's throats by various institutions and then people sell themselves to wage slavery in order to meet this false ideal. they're selling themselves for what amounts to nothing.

[Thedreamshaperabc]

cool first view :D

for all of you who wondered, it doesnt count you. I am seeing 0 views.