Whenever there's a nice video like this there's always at least one fool who has to bombard it with stupid narrow-minded comments. What's wrong with listening to a piece of music and appreciating it for what it is?
I think this is really awesome. I think more female bass singers and more male sopranos should not be afraid to sing, or be ashamed of their voices. I hate the stereotype of voices for each gender.
@Nerdynessocity I'm the opposite. I'm a lower voiced woman and I personally would love to sing high like you. Count your blessings at having a soprano voice. :)
Interesting as a historical exercise, but there seems little point in having one-sex choirs, since there are plenty of men around to sing the lower parts, and women the higher. If I had any such prejudice, it would be for all male choirs, which tend to produce a "purer" sound, but with fabulous women singers in choirs like the Tallis Scholars, even this is achieved. Also interesting that the pretty singer in this video is the contralto, whilst the others look like men!
@londoneg The whole point of the early music movement is to take "historical exercises" and put them into performance practice. Men have been having their way with male-voiced choirs for centuries so why should they be threatened by all-female choirs, especially when this is how Vivaldi composed, heard and intended his music to be performed? And why does their looks have anything to do with it? Do you call countertenors effeminate?! That's quite sexist. One of our basses is a pro fashion model!
My point was that there is no particular need, beyond historical curiosity, for this venture. I was advocating mixed choirs. Contemporary beauty of sound is more important than historical replication.
It strikes me that, with remarks like "men not needed"; "challenging the cultural stereotype"; "men have been having their way"; "why should they [men] be threatened", the group itself might be seen as having a rather sexist attitude. Of course, they may do as they please.
@londoneg It's really very simple - we analyse historical evidence from primary sources (the Venetian archives) and realise it in our performances, as the "Women's Vocal Range" page of our website explains. We do not claim that women sound like men, nor is this of interest to us. It is true, of course, that Vivaldi's bass vocal parts are always doubled by instruments - there were lots of cellists among his musicians.
@londoneg How are any of those remarks sexist? There IS a cultural stereotype of women not having deep voices. Men HAVE been having their way in choirs because choirmasters are still predominantly male. Men AREN'T needed in all choirs, just as women aren't needed in all choirs. And why SHOULD men be threatened by some all-female choirs to balance the all-male ones? It adds diversity of expression. I love mixed choirs, female choirs, male choirs, men, women, and my tenor voice.
@londoneg , if I take your meaning correctly, 1) a female tenor should not be allowed to sing because there are lots of male tenors so no one needs them especially because men sing better than women, and 2) pretty women have higher voices.
So now I know. As a female tenor I should not be allowed to sing, and even if I don't, I'm probably not pretty.
@chamisa77 You do not take my meaning correctly. And yes, I do hate your kind of deliberate feminist misinterpretation. If we're reviving women tenors on historical grounds, why not revive the castrati? That should serve both historical "authenticity", and get rid of a few annoying testicles!
@londoneg, The only one being political here is you. Now I must be a feminist as well? (Apparently a horrible thing).
Comparing my natural, God-given voice to the voice of a male who has been castrated is just about as offensive as one can get--though your implication that I would like to "get rid of a few annoying testicles" manages to be even more offensive.
@chamisa77 None of this is about you - and what does God have to do with it? If we were going for total historical replication, women would not sing in most choral music written before about 1800, and castrati would be essential for many operas. If you post on here, you must expect some adverse comments. As far as I.m concerned, women can do whatever they want, but I don't have to like it.
@londoneg We don't revive the castrati because of the huge damage done to a man's health by castrating him. We do revive female tenors because there have always been women like me with naturally low voices but who love to sing, and should be given an opportunity to do so.
I seriously don't understand how it offends you so much that a few women got together and sang a song.
@londoneg Has it not occurred to you that some women are natural basses and to delegate all low parts to men means that you shut these women out of choir singing altogether or force them into a range unsuitable for them?
@barefootcapegirl Let me try again to make my position clear. (1) It is interesting to hear how Vivaldi's music MAY have sounded (2) Most Baroque choral music would have been sung by men and boys (3) My PERSONAL preference would be a skilled mixed-voice choir (4) Women may sing whatever they like (5) If anything I have said is judged by some to be sexist, then so be it.
@londoneg If women can sing whatever they like, then why the objection to using women's voices to sing low parts on the grounds that there are "plenty of men around to sing the lower parts"? Why are you such a fan of shutting out lower-voiced women from choral singing? And again I ask, are you against countertenors?
I love listening to this. I have an infinity for the lower female voices. My wife is naturally a contralto, but she pushed herself to be able to sing the mezzo soprano range because it is easier to follow the melody.
I much prefer her lower range as it is richer, and has that velvety texture. Oh how I love those rich tones. You ladies are remarkable. Bravo!!
I love listening to this. I have an infinity for the lower female voices. My wife is naturally a contralto, but she pushed herself to be able to sing the mezzo soprano range because it is easier to follow the melody.
I much prefer her lower range as it is richer, and has that velvety texture. Oh how I love those rich tones.
I love listening to this. I have an infinity for the lower female voices. My wife is naturally a contralto, but she pushed herself to be able to sing the mezzo soprano range because it is easier to follow the melody.
I much prefer her lower range as it is richer, and has that velvety texture. Oh how I love those rich tones.
@XenaAmazon Even in normal speech your voice surely has a wider range than this. D4-F4 is only a minor 3rd, and is approximately where 4-8yr old children place their speaking voices. Check these pitches with the Wikipaedia article "Scientific pitch notation"
@VivaldisWomen (I'm terrible at this. Please forgive me, lol).
I was labeled a ''contralto'' in my high school choir, but I really don't know what my range is now. I was once told that my lowest range was between a D4-C4 middle c, and my highest range was an F4 flat.
@XenaAmazon - please look at our SPAV website. Go to the Female Vocal range page (which might interest you). At the bottom is a link to our survey, which you can complete and email back to us. Then we'll have a better idea.
beautiful! I'm a female tenor (not sure about the MIDI notations, but my range goes from the A an octave and a bit below middle C, to the A a sixth above middle C). It's great to find examples of women singing in their natural voices like this - for years I thought I couldn't sing because I couldn't sing as high as my mother (a mezzo-soprano, now mostly singing alto) - I thought it was odd that I could sing in tune when standing next to men...
@Allaphaidole We find that many women with low voices have that range naturally, but of course with proper training can expand it in both directions, just as a baritone can be trained to use his countertenor voice. However, there are plenty of female singers out there who can naturally and easily negotiate their tenor, baritone, bass and even basso profundo ranges. As with all singers, the training of a good voice coach is what's needed.
@PureZOOKS it is a theorbo (lute with a long neck for bass strings, used mainly for accompaniment). The other instruments are harpsichord, cello and organ (out of view). In Vivaldi's day there were several theorbists at the Pietà
@CharlieBladeRemus - she was still young at the time! She is basically a folk/early music singer, and we chose her to match the "chest" sonority of the tenor and bass...
@VivaldisWomen Ok, maybe I shouldn't have used the word 'mature' since she is still young, lol. What I meant to say was that I believe Victoria could have made her voice a little darker in timbre. Personally I felt like her voice was sticking too far out over Penny and Margaret. They have darker voices and Victoria's just sounded a tad too bright. But that's just my opinion...
Or do folk/early music singers typically sing wth a brighter vocal timbre than others? Just wondering...
@majav15mg Thanks for your comment. You'll notice we did not say men aren't needed, wanted or capable, only that they're not required to sing tenor and bass lines.
Is Margaret really a bass? I thought *she* was the woman tenor. And thought Penny was the contralto. Also thought Victoria was at least a dramatic mezzo-soprano. But that's just me, lol.
@XenaAmazon - the tenor and bass parts of Vivaldi's Pietà music tend to lie higher than those of his "male" repertoire, with few notes below C3. In this trio for basso, tenor and contralto the lowest bass note is A2, though Margaret can reach E2 comfortably. Vivaldi used the terms soprano, contralto, tenor and bass to describe the musical part (as defined by the clef used to notate it) rather than the vocal character of the singer in the modern way.
Hello, I am a Baritone, in chorus, and I am learning how to go above my baritone range and head to the tenor range. I don't know about my vocal range, but my range is pretty high sometimes, but not soprano high. Oh and by the way, can males be contraltos? And what is my range?
@Wigglehead2050 Well, the firstthing you should acknowledge are the lowest and the highest notes that you can hit, maybe helping yourself with a keyboard or an other intrument. Classically a the range of a baritone is A1-G3 with some exceptions. I remind you that I'm talking about choir singers; obviously singing solos and entering in the operatic world requires a higher technique and a analysis of the tessitura, which depends on the colour, the light and other characteristics of your voice.
@deejayL89 Which pitch notation system are you using? C4 is middle C, and anyone can hit that, so I'm kinda confused.... I'm a bass, and according to scientific pitch notation, my range is C#2-E4. Am I missing something important, because I don't know many people who can hit A1???
@CharlieBladeRemus Well, it might be a little bit confusing, because I meant C3 as middle C! I ccome from Italy, and most of european country have Do3 as the parameter of central C, and we do... I've being doing some reasearch and I found that in some cases C3is the middle one, in others it's C4. In the US, C4 is middle C, and, as I think you are American, it was just a misunderstanding... Sorry! So to compare the pitches I wrote, just add one "octave to every note" :)
@CharlieBladeRemus AHahah, that was funny! By the way, I love this music, even if I'm "socially" not supposed to do so as I'm 22, but I don't care! And that's why it's a pleasure to talk about this with somebody else who's interested in it! Are you a musician or you're just an enthusiast?
@CharlieBladeRemus Well, it might be a little bit confusing, because I meant C3 as middle C! I come from Italy, and most of european countries have Do3 as the parameter of central C, and we do... I've being doing some reasearch and I found that in some cases C3 is the middle one, in others it's C4. In the US, C4 is middle C, and, as I think you are American, it was just a misunderstanding... Sorry! So to compare the pitches I wrote, just add one "octave" to every note :)
@Wigglehead2050 The tenor's typical range is between C2-A3 but can go higher, obviously it depends on the type of your voice and lots of training. Talking about male contraltos, i may say that they don't just exist, but that there a very impotant in the occidentale classical music. I won't get into detail, but contralto is typical of a woman's low voice, for man we use te term Alto (italian for high) which was indeed a male voice. I's quite rare to find a male voice like that,
@Wigglehead2050 as the astonishing voice of the bass lady, and the exquisite one of the tenor lady. Now lots of singers that fill the alto parts ar women, the contralti, indeed, or male singers that sing with falsetto, or the "head voice" (which is not true, it isn't a proper way to define this voice). These male singers are called countertenors. their range is G3-E5, but, as usual, it depends from singer to singer. Countertenor and alto ranges are similar, if not exactly the same
@charlieslilyflower Are you using MIDI terminology (G3 = G below middle C; C5 = C above middle C)? If so, your voice would fit Vivaldi's contralto (choral) parts.
I can hardly believe that such a wonderful bass voice could come from a woman!...I am a female tenor with a major symphony choir. Even though my speaking voice is quite soft and not at all deep, when I sing, something comes from deep within that changes my voice to tenor. I often get negative comments from people (mainly women) in other choirs, who don't think it "right" for a woman to be in the tenor section. As long as your voice blends with your section, why should it matter? Great video!
Wow, wow, wow... @MultiJackrob, all I can say is... wow. I'm watching "Vivaldi's Women" because I'm doing RV 589 tomorrow in Pittsburgh, PA, USA. Although the programme notes have been done for ages (I wrote them), I'm utterly fascinated with La Pietà now and desperate to learn more. I'm also the PR Director for the Pittsburgh Baroque Ensemble (check out our videos!), and the thing about which we are the most serious is "historically-informed performance"... Would love to know your thoughts!
@lojundolo Ché cosa ridicola ed ignara da dire! Appena come gli uomini, le donne hanno una gamma vocale molto espansiva e sappiamo per un fatto che le donne hanno cantato Tenore e Basso durante tutta la storia. Mantenga prego il vostri pregiudizio e bigottismo a lei stesso.
@lojundolo What a ridiculous and ignorant thing to say. Just like men, women have a very expansive vocal range, and we know for a fact that women have sung tenor and bass throughout all of history. Please keep your prejudice and bigotry to yourself.
@lojundolo I'm a musicologist and I know perfectly that women sang in male register. I was just observing that two of these singers have a total or partial male look, not just in singing, it seems to me that they feel themselves like men. Excuse my bad English.
@lojundolo I'm afraid we still find your comments offensive. You do not know these women or how they feel - and I assure you they are 100% women no matter what you think they look like.
@Treemeadow Perhaps that is true, and thanks for pointing it out. However, women who look 'manish' by societal standards are still women. Furthermore, women do not need to be transgendered to sing Bass or Tenor. Who cares what the singers look like, anyways?
@VivaldisWomen you got that right. Those 3 have an amazing harmony together. Ive known men who sing alto and women who can sing Tenor. gender has nothing to do with it, it just so happens that you dont often see a female bass singer or a tenor, but I you do I find it truly amazing :D
@VivaldisWomen Thank-you for your precisation. I know a lot of women that wear as if they were a man, and go to barbershop for their hair, and sing or speak in male register. If they feel natural to look like a man, I think that they find it better than looking like women, usually they take men's part in life and in job, and in singing, too. But if you think that notifying this is offensive, probably you think that a male is a bad thing, but why trying to look like a so bad gender?
Thank you so much! I'm a female tenor but really feel more comfortable as a baritone or even bass. My comfort range is F2-F4. Why do I have to feel so darned freakish about it? God made me with long ligaments and tendons, so why wouldn't that translate to long vocal chords as well? And why is so much emphasis placed on high notes and freakish vocal acrobatics? There is so much talent to be mined in the lower ranges, but it never seems to be highlighted. Thanks for your wonderful work!
my dream is to be a singer my belt range C3 to an F4 and then my head voice goes to an E5. anyways i was always discouraged from being a professional singer but this gives me new hope
Thanks for the supportive comment. I am the lady bass featured in the clip, and I'm also a pretty good tenor in mixed chamber choirs. It's just not true that women can't naturally sing very low; my lowest ever note is the C 2 octaves below middle C, and there are no hairs on my chest. Some men naturally sing soprano, and nobody thinks that odd.
@MultiJackrob you've given me so much hope! i am a female tenor and it's tough in a world that only thinks high voices are beautiful. your voice is amazing! don't ever stop singing!
@MultiJackrob, All I can say is... BRAVA to you and BRAVI TUTTI to all of you. I'm the PR Director for the Pittsburgh Baroque Ensemble, and the thing we're most interested in is "historically-informed performance" so I'm fascinated by "Vivaldi's Women" and would love to know more from YOU! Do check out our videos (on my page). Thanks so much for your work -- wish you were in our bass section for tomorrow's performance of RV 589!!!
@MultiJackrob i hear you, everyone at my school thinks i'm a freak because I can sing E two octaves below middle C on a good day and I'm a thirteen year old girl.... But some people are just born with the amazing gift of TENORNESS!
This is amazing! My vocal range goes high (C3-C6), but have always been embarrassed that I sing most comfortably and naturally in the tenor-ish range (D3-E4). It's awesome to hear other women who naturally sing this low! Keep on rockin!
@afuachu This is why we are doing the work that we do! I am sure that many more women could sing in the same range as you, but they are discouraged from doing so.
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the reason why women shouldnt sing low notes is becuz they have NO power in their voices. they are too ligth and were meant for speed and high notes. power and beauty should be left to the heavier voice types AKA men. however, women obviously have an advantage ont higher notes. ture but NOWADAYS not in the ancient times where EVERYTHING was narrow minded have seen BASSES hit g5's in MIXED voice. honestly notes int he fifth octave arent hard for men to hit. its the d6-... area tht is hard.
@VivaldisWomen Rubbish: have you never heard a really beefy operatic contralto or the amazing Bulgarian women's choir? Just as there are natural male sopranos so it is equally natural that some women have really low and powerful voices. I should know; I am the lady bass featured on the clip, and I can go lower yet in full power. So open your ears and your mind to a new sensation.
thanks for letting us know - perhaps you could post a video to demonstrate this. Our research suggests that 1% of women can sing in the (male) bass register.
@VivaldisWomen that's not even much of an accomplishment. Many singers have been able to reach that note--i.e. Amy Lee, Mariah Carey, Utada Hikaru (on the Japanese front), etc. I could name many more, but I think you get the point. They are all sopranos. Usually, the low E is the lower extreme of a contralto's vocal range. I don't understand what's so amazing about anyone reaching this note.
I have actually heard Maragret sing the D below that E. That is the D off the bottom of the bass stave, the one some male basses cannot hit. Do you still think that's nothing special, SekaiNoMu ?
@petrafanafinny I realized that right after I sent the message how low that note was. I read 'e' and assumed it was an octave higher, which is the typical bottom of a contralto's range. Not thinking at all. I apologize.
@petrafanafinny But I would not call you a baritone if you "only" can make a Ab 2 (with enough force I presume) I still think that makes you a tenor?! In my amateur choir we have three female tenors, they usually skip the notes or sing one octave up if lower than C3. Anyway I really enjoy this, would be nice to hear more of this esemble in this setting.
Are you implying I'm really a Bass, or an Alto? I am happiest singing in the Baritenor range. I sing Tenor in one choir right now, and the male tenors bitch and whine if they have to sing a C3, which I can comfortably go a few notes lower. So that alone make me lower than your average male tenor... I get paid to sing Tenor, Bari and Bass right now, so there!
@petrafanafinny Well, I am not sure..I sing tenor too, and usually that is c3-g4, but could happen as low as g2, although that is normally bass notes.
from the journal "Pallade Veneta", Venice, July 1687, about Maria Anna Ziani, from the ospedale dei Mendicanti: although a woman, she is endowed naturally with a male voice, but one that is so tender and full, and of such a sweet tone, that she sings baritone with enough grace to transport and captivate the minds of her listeners. [Talbot "Venetian Music in the Age of Vivaldi", p131]
... Talbot also refers to an entry in the diary of a Venetian nobleman, dated 3 September 1758. This refers to the death of a woman in her eighties, also from the Mendicanti, named Anna Cremona and described as a distinguished bass singer.
Wow, this is fantastic. I think I prefer the sound of the woman singing in a more modal voice.
I'm a sucker for that sort of mix/head voice singing.
AtariMaxiToriyama 2 weeks ago
Whenever there's a nice video like this there's always at least one fool who has to bombard it with stupid narrow-minded comments. What's wrong with listening to a piece of music and appreciating it for what it is?
samwige9on9the9left 3 weeks ago
I think this is really awesome. I think more female bass singers and more male sopranos should not be afraid to sing, or be ashamed of their voices. I hate the stereotype of voices for each gender.
EdwardNygma1 1 month ago
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EmilyGreene1984 1 month ago
Thank you heaps girls, you make me feel more secure in my female tenor voice. :)
barefootcapegirl 2 months ago
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EmilyGreene1984 2 months ago
@Nerdynessocity I'm the opposite. I'm a lower voiced woman and I personally would love to sing high like you. Count your blessings at having a soprano voice. :)
EmilyGreene1984 2 months ago
I'm also a female bass (my lowest note is F#2), and I think this is just awesome... it was kinda fun to sing along with Margaret. :-)
godelnahaleth 2 months ago
LOVE THIS!!! I love the girl with the curly hair. Her voice is to die for!
mikewill9511 3 months ago
Beautiful voices! Go ahead Ms. Margaret :)
And I believe my vocal range is F5-G4. I may be a woman tenor myself.
VelvetViolet4 3 months ago
COngratulations to Margaret, truly a very good bass, saluti dalla Colombia
PhillipGerwald 4 months ago
Interesting as a historical exercise, but there seems little point in having one-sex choirs, since there are plenty of men around to sing the lower parts, and women the higher. If I had any such prejudice, it would be for all male choirs, which tend to produce a "purer" sound, but with fabulous women singers in choirs like the Tallis Scholars, even this is achieved. Also interesting that the pretty singer in this video is the contralto, whilst the others look like men!
londoneg 5 months ago
@londoneg The whole point of the early music movement is to take "historical exercises" and put them into performance practice. Men have been having their way with male-voiced choirs for centuries so why should they be threatened by all-female choirs, especially when this is how Vivaldi composed, heard and intended his music to be performed? And why does their looks have anything to do with it? Do you call countertenors effeminate?! That's quite sexist. One of our basses is a pro fashion model!
VivaldisWomen 5 months ago
@VivaldisWomen
My point was that there is no particular need, beyond historical curiosity, for this venture. I was advocating mixed choirs. Contemporary beauty of sound is more important than historical replication.
It strikes me that, with remarks like "men not needed"; "challenging the cultural stereotype"; "men have been having their way"; "why should they [men] be threatened", the group itself might be seen as having a rather sexist attitude. Of course, they may do as they please.
londoneg 5 months ago
@londoneg It's really very simple - we analyse historical evidence from primary sources (the Venetian archives) and realise it in our performances, as the "Women's Vocal Range" page of our website explains. We do not claim that women sound like men, nor is this of interest to us. It is true, of course, that Vivaldi's bass vocal parts are always doubled by instruments - there were lots of cellists among his musicians.
VivaldisWomen 4 months ago
@londoneg How are any of those remarks sexist? There IS a cultural stereotype of women not having deep voices. Men HAVE been having their way in choirs because choirmasters are still predominantly male. Men AREN'T needed in all choirs, just as women aren't needed in all choirs. And why SHOULD men be threatened by some all-female choirs to balance the all-male ones? It adds diversity of expression. I love mixed choirs, female choirs, male choirs, men, women, and my tenor voice.
barefootcapegirl 2 months ago
@londoneg , if I take your meaning correctly, 1) a female tenor should not be allowed to sing because there are lots of male tenors so no one needs them especially because men sing better than women, and 2) pretty women have higher voices.
So now I know. As a female tenor I should not be allowed to sing, and even if I don't, I'm probably not pretty.
Hate much?
chamisa77 4 months ago
@chamisa77 You do not take my meaning correctly. And yes, I do hate your kind of deliberate feminist misinterpretation. If we're reviving women tenors on historical grounds, why not revive the castrati? That should serve both historical "authenticity", and get rid of a few annoying testicles!
londoneg 4 months ago
@londoneg, The only one being political here is you. Now I must be a feminist as well? (Apparently a horrible thing).
Comparing my natural, God-given voice to the voice of a male who has been castrated is just about as offensive as one can get--though your implication that I would like to "get rid of a few annoying testicles" manages to be even more offensive.
Yes, you do hate.
chamisa77 4 months ago
@chamisa77 None of this is about you - and what does God have to do with it? If we were going for total historical replication, women would not sing in most choral music written before about 1800, and castrati would be essential for many operas. If you post on here, you must expect some adverse comments. As far as I.m concerned, women can do whatever they want, but I don't have to like it.
londoneg 4 months ago
@londoneg We don't revive the castrati because of the huge damage done to a man's health by castrating him. We do revive female tenors because there have always been women like me with naturally low voices but who love to sing, and should be given an opportunity to do so.
I seriously don't understand how it offends you so much that a few women got together and sang a song.
barefootcapegirl 2 months ago
@londoneg Has it not occurred to you that some women are natural basses and to delegate all low parts to men means that you shut these women out of choir singing altogether or force them into a range unsuitable for them?
Are you against countertenors also?
barefootcapegirl 2 months ago
@barefootcapegirl Let me try again to make my position clear. (1) It is interesting to hear how Vivaldi's music MAY have sounded (2) Most Baroque choral music would have been sung by men and boys (3) My PERSONAL preference would be a skilled mixed-voice choir (4) Women may sing whatever they like (5) If anything I have said is judged by some to be sexist, then so be it.
londoneg 2 months ago
@londoneg If women can sing whatever they like, then why the objection to using women's voices to sing low parts on the grounds that there are "plenty of men around to sing the lower parts"? Why are you such a fan of shutting out lower-voiced women from choral singing? And again I ask, are you against countertenors?
barefootcapegirl 2 months ago
@rainharmony1 I'm not sure about her vocal techinque. It doesn't sound all that natural or clear.
EmilyGreene1984 5 months ago
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I love listening to this. I have an infinity for the lower female voices. My wife is naturally a contralto, but she pushed herself to be able to sing the mezzo soprano range because it is easier to follow the melody.
I much prefer her lower range as it is richer, and has that velvety texture. Oh how I love those rich tones. You ladies are remarkable. Bravo!!
scoozyme 5 months ago
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I love listening to this. I have an infinity for the lower female voices. My wife is naturally a contralto, but she pushed herself to be able to sing the mezzo soprano range because it is easier to follow the melody.
I much prefer her lower range as it is richer, and has that velvety texture. Oh how I love those rich tones.
You ladies are remarkable. Bravo!!
scoozyme 5 months ago
I love listening to this. I have an infinity for the lower female voices. My wife is naturally a contralto, but she pushed herself to be able to sing the mezzo soprano range because it is easier to follow the melody.
I much prefer her lower range as it is richer, and has that velvety texture. Oh how I love those rich tones.
You ladies are remarkable. Brava!!
scoozyme 5 months ago
I checked my range(A2-D5) A2 is very unstable. I can only reach it not sing. ((((
toni7777ful 6 months ago
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The so-called women tenors or basses don't sound the same as male basses or male tenors, but nevertheless - this is interesting.
EmilyGreene1984 6 months ago
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EmilyGreene1984 6 months ago
I'm a D4-F4, what does that make me?
XenaAmazon 6 months ago
@XenaAmazon Even in normal speech your voice surely has a wider range than this. D4-F4 is only a minor 3rd, and is approximately where 4-8yr old children place their speaking voices. Check these pitches with the Wikipaedia article "Scientific pitch notation"
VivaldisWomen 6 months ago
@VivaldisWomen (I'm terrible at this. Please forgive me, lol).
I was labeled a ''contralto'' in my high school choir, but I really don't know what my range is now. I was once told that my lowest range was between a D4-C4 middle c, and my highest range was an F4 flat.
XenaAmazon 6 months ago
@XenaAmazon - please look at our SPAV website. Go to the Female Vocal range page (which might interest you). At the bottom is a link to our survey, which you can complete and email back to us. Then we'll have a better idea.
VivaldisWomen 6 months ago
@VivaldisWomen I just sent the survey to you :)
XenaAmazon 6 months ago
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XenaAmazon 6 months ago
beautiful! I'm a female tenor (not sure about the MIDI notations, but my range goes from the A an octave and a bit below middle C, to the A a sixth above middle C). It's great to find examples of women singing in their natural voices like this - for years I thought I couldn't sing because I couldn't sing as high as my mother (a mezzo-soprano, now mostly singing alto) - I thought it was odd that I could sing in tune when standing next to men...
pamcurrie99 6 months ago
@pamcurrie99 - perhaps you would like to take our Female Vocal Range survey (link via SPAV website)
VivaldisWomen 6 months ago
Can you naturally train the female voice to reach tenor or do you have to go to a doctor?
Allaphaidole 7 months ago
@Allaphaidole We find that many women with low voices have that range naturally, but of course with proper training can expand it in both directions, just as a baritone can be trained to use his countertenor voice. However, there are plenty of female singers out there who can naturally and easily negotiate their tenor, baritone, bass and even basso profundo ranges. As with all singers, the training of a good voice coach is what's needed.
VivaldisWomen 6 months ago
@VivaldisWomen But truthfully, female "basses" or "basso profundos" do not sound the same as a male bass or basso profondo.
EmilyGreene1984 4 months ago
This is absolutely beautiful. I love the deeper female voice - so rich. True, with such strong and powerful lower voices, men not required. Brava!
scoozyme 7 months ago
What is that instrument behind them?
PureZOOKS 8 months ago
@PureZOOKS it is a theorbo (lute with a long neck for bass strings, used mainly for accompaniment). The other instruments are harpsichord, cello and organ (out of view). In Vivaldi's day there were several theorbists at the Pietà
VivaldisWomen 8 months ago
@VivaldisWomen thank you.
Another question. You describe the low range singer here as a "basso". What does that mean exactly, is she a baritone?
PureZOOKS 8 months ago
I believe the contralto featured here could have made her sound a tad bit more mature, but beautiful all the same!
CharlieBladeRemus 9 months ago
@CharlieBladeRemus - she was still young at the time! She is basically a folk/early music singer, and we chose her to match the "chest" sonority of the tenor and bass...
VivaldisWomen 9 months ago
@VivaldisWomen Oh ok, her voice is beautiful all the same though! :)
CharlieBladeRemus 9 months ago
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CharlieBladeRemus 7 months ago
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@VivaldisWomen Ok, maybe I shouldn't have used the word 'mature' since she is still young, lol. What I meant to say was that I believe Victoria could have made her voice a little darker in timbre. Personally I felt like her voice was sticking too far out over Penny and Margaret. They have darker voices and Victoria's just sounded a tad too bright. But that's just my opinion...
Or do folk/early music singers typically sing wth a brighter vocal timbre than others? Just wondering...
CharlieBladeRemus 7 months ago
I find the title of this video to be rather sexist ;D
majav15mg 9 months ago 2
@majav15mg Thanks for your comment. You'll notice we did not say men aren't needed, wanted or capable, only that they're not required to sing tenor and bass lines.
VivaldisWomen 9 months ago
Is Margaret really a bass? I thought *she* was the woman tenor. And thought Penny was the contralto. Also thought Victoria was at least a dramatic mezzo-soprano. But that's just me, lol.
XenaAmazon 9 months ago 2
@XenaAmazon - the tenor and bass parts of Vivaldi's Pietà music tend to lie higher than those of his "male" repertoire, with few notes below C3. In this trio for basso, tenor and contralto the lowest bass note is A2, though Margaret can reach E2 comfortably. Vivaldi used the terms soprano, contralto, tenor and bass to describe the musical part (as defined by the clef used to notate it) rather than the vocal character of the singer in the modern way.
VivaldisWomen 9 months ago
@VivaldisWomen Ohh wow. You ladies are very unique :)
XenaAmazon 8 months ago
this is awsome! i always felt weird that i sang lower than any of the basses in my chior but someone told me that i could sing a female tenor
369842able 10 months ago
Its a shame the alto here has a rather dominating voice, sounds a bit like she's shouting over the other two.
olialto7 10 months ago
@bob1sded We quite agree, and we don't have any...
VivaldisWomen 10 months ago
hemaphradites don't count
bob1sded 10 months ago
Hello, I am a Baritone, in chorus, and I am learning how to go above my baritone range and head to the tenor range. I don't know about my vocal range, but my range is pretty high sometimes, but not soprano high. Oh and by the way, can males be contraltos? And what is my range?
Wigglehead2050 11 months ago
@Wigglehead2050 Well, the firstthing you should acknowledge are the lowest and the highest notes that you can hit, maybe helping yourself with a keyboard or an other intrument. Classically a the range of a baritone is A1-G3 with some exceptions. I remind you that I'm talking about choir singers; obviously singing solos and entering in the operatic world requires a higher technique and a analysis of the tessitura, which depends on the colour, the light and other characteristics of your voice.
deejayL89 9 months ago
@deejayL89 Which pitch notation system are you using? C4 is middle C, and anyone can hit that, so I'm kinda confused.... I'm a bass, and according to scientific pitch notation, my range is C#2-E4. Am I missing something important, because I don't know many people who can hit A1???
CharlieBladeRemus 9 months ago
@CharlieBladeRemus Well, it might be a little bit confusing, because I meant C3 as middle C! I ccome from Italy, and most of european country have Do3 as the parameter of central C, and we do... I've being doing some reasearch and I found that in some cases C3is the middle one, in others it's C4. In the US, C4 is middle C, and, as I think you are American, it was just a misunderstanding... Sorry! So to compare the pitches I wrote, just add one "octave to every note" :)
deejayL89 8 months ago
@deejayL89 That explains a heck of a lot, LOL I thought I was going crazy for a minute there. Thanks for taking the time to explain! :)
CharlieBladeRemus 8 months ago
@CharlieBladeRemus AHahah, that was funny! By the way, I love this music, even if I'm "socially" not supposed to do so as I'm 22, but I don't care! And that's why it's a pleasure to talk about this with somebody else who's interested in it! Are you a musician or you're just an enthusiast?
deejayL89 8 months ago
@deejayL89 I'm a musician in and out :)
CharlieBladeRemus 8 months ago
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@CharlieBladeRemus Well, it might be a little bit confusing, because I meant C3 as middle C! I come from Italy, and most of european countries have Do3 as the parameter of central C, and we do... I've being doing some reasearch and I found that in some cases C3 is the middle one, in others it's C4. In the US, C4 is middle C, and, as I think you are American, it was just a misunderstanding... Sorry! So to compare the pitches I wrote, just add one "octave" to every note :)
deejayL89 8 months ago
@Wigglehead2050 The tenor's typical range is between C2-A3 but can go higher, obviously it depends on the type of your voice and lots of training. Talking about male contraltos, i may say that they don't just exist, but that there a very impotant in the occidentale classical music. I won't get into detail, but contralto is typical of a woman's low voice, for man we use te term Alto (italian for high) which was indeed a male voice. I's quite rare to find a male voice like that,
deejayL89 9 months ago
@Wigglehead2050 as the astonishing voice of the bass lady, and the exquisite one of the tenor lady. Now lots of singers that fill the alto parts ar women, the contralti, indeed, or male singers that sing with falsetto, or the "head voice" (which is not true, it isn't a proper way to define this voice). These male singers are called countertenors. their range is G3-E5, but, as usual, it depends from singer to singer. Countertenor and alto ranges are similar, if not exactly the same
deejayL89 9 months ago
I'm stunned and amazed! This is fantastic!!!!! Great job ladies!
gavinfarkas 11 months ago
@charlieslilyflower Are you using MIDI terminology (G3 = G below middle C; C5 = C above middle C)? If so, your voice would fit Vivaldi's contralto (choral) parts.
VivaldisWomen 11 months ago
Everytime I watch this video I feel moved to tears by the exquisiteness of the music and the three awesome singers.
cbojorquez 1 year ago
I can hardly believe that such a wonderful bass voice could come from a woman!...I am a female tenor with a major symphony choir. Even though my speaking voice is quite soft and not at all deep, when I sing, something comes from deep within that changes my voice to tenor. I often get negative comments from people (mainly women) in other choirs, who don't think it "right" for a woman to be in the tenor section. As long as your voice blends with your section, why should it matter? Great video!
Flowerpotty 1 year ago
@Nerdynessocity - take a look at our Female Vocal Range page (spav.org), and do the survey at the bottom...
VivaldisWomen 1 year ago
Wow, wow, wow... @MultiJackrob, all I can say is... wow. I'm watching "Vivaldi's Women" because I'm doing RV 589 tomorrow in Pittsburgh, PA, USA. Although the programme notes have been done for ages (I wrote them), I'm utterly fascinated with La Pietà now and desperate to learn more. I'm also the PR Director for the Pittsburgh Baroque Ensemble (check out our videos!), and the thing about which we are the most serious is "historically-informed performance"... Would love to know your thoughts!
PalmerJennie 1 year ago
It's not beautiful, but that lady bass has an effective C3, I'm quite impressed, she has more balls than many a tenor in my choir.
saintsaens21 1 year ago
can we call them WOMEN?
lojundolo 1 year ago
@lojundolo Ché cosa ridicola ed ignara da dire! Appena come gli uomini, le donne hanno una gamma vocale molto espansiva e sappiamo per un fatto che le donne hanno cantato Tenore e Basso durante tutta la storia. Mantenga prego il vostri pregiudizio e bigottismo a lei stesso.
VivaldisWomen 1 year ago
@lojundolo What a ridiculous and ignorant thing to say. Just like men, women have a very expansive vocal range, and we know for a fact that women have sung tenor and bass throughout all of history. Please keep your prejudice and bigotry to yourself.
VivaldisWomen 1 year ago
@lojundolo I'm a musicologist and I know perfectly that women sang in male register. I was just observing that two of these singers have a total or partial male look, not just in singing, it seems to me that they feel themselves like men. Excuse my bad English.
lojundolo 1 year ago
@lojundolo I'm afraid we still find your comments offensive. You do not know these women or how they feel - and I assure you they are 100% women no matter what you think they look like.
VivaldisWomen 1 year ago
@VivaldisWomen
Perhaps he thought they were transgendered. Its not an uncommon thing these days. No need to jump to the defense.
Treemeadow 1 year ago
@Treemeadow Perhaps that is true, and thanks for pointing it out. However, women who look 'manish' by societal standards are still women. Furthermore, women do not need to be transgendered to sing Bass or Tenor. Who cares what the singers look like, anyways?
VivaldisWomen 1 year ago
@VivaldisWomen you got that right. Those 3 have an amazing harmony together. Ive known men who sing alto and women who can sing Tenor. gender has nothing to do with it, it just so happens that you dont often see a female bass singer or a tenor, but I you do I find it truly amazing :D
cowtippingrocks 1 year ago
@VivaldisWomen Thank-you for your precisation. I know a lot of women that wear as if they were a man, and go to barbershop for their hair, and sing or speak in male register. If they feel natural to look like a man, I think that they find it better than looking like women, usually they take men's part in life and in job, and in singing, too. But if you think that notifying this is offensive, probably you think that a male is a bad thing, but why trying to look like a so bad gender?
lojundolo 1 year ago
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Thank you so much! I'm a female tenor but really feel more comfortable as a baritone or even bass. My comfort range is F2-F4. Why do I have to feel so darned freakish about it? God made me with long ligaments and tendons, so why wouldn't that translate to long vocal chords as well? And why is so much emphasis placed on high notes and freakish vocal acrobatics? There is so much talent to be mined in the lower ranges, but it never seems to be highlighted. Thanks for your wonderful work!
RepublicTX 1 year ago
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RepublicTX 1 year ago
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RepublicTX 1 year ago
Thanks VivaldisWomen.I Love You
martmaz123 1 year ago
my dream is to be a singer my belt range C3 to an F4 and then my head voice goes to an E5. anyways i was always discouraged from being a professional singer but this gives me new hope
treblemaker24 1 year ago
The bass is amazing! Not like a raspy voice, but actually great sound. I knew of female tenors, but not basses. She is an awesome find.
joscha79 1 year ago
@joscha79
Thanks for the supportive comment. I am the lady bass featured in the clip, and I'm also a pretty good tenor in mixed chamber choirs. It's just not true that women can't naturally sing very low; my lowest ever note is the C 2 octaves below middle C, and there are no hairs on my chest. Some men naturally sing soprano, and nobody thinks that odd.
MultiJackrob 1 year ago 11
@MultiJackrob you've given me so much hope! i am a female tenor and it's tough in a world that only thinks high voices are beautiful. your voice is amazing! don't ever stop singing!
treblemaker24 1 year ago
@MultiJackrob you 3 sound amazing!
cowtippingrocks 1 year ago
@MultiJackrob, All I can say is... BRAVA to you and BRAVI TUTTI to all of you. I'm the PR Director for the Pittsburgh Baroque Ensemble, and the thing we're most interested in is "historically-informed performance" so I'm fascinated by "Vivaldi's Women" and would love to know more from YOU! Do check out our videos (on my page). Thanks so much for your work -- wish you were in our bass section for tomorrow's performance of RV 589!!!
PalmerJennie 1 year ago
@MultiJackrob i hear you, everyone at my school thinks i'm a freak because I can sing E two octaves below middle C on a good day and I'm a thirteen year old girl.... But some people are just born with the amazing gift of TENORNESS!
idajork 9 months ago
@MultiJackrob Well done! Amazing!!!
laurelfan1 8 months ago
still there's the voice of women,.
mordoquiojunelle 1 year ago
cool!
sherbetstraw 1 year ago
Bravissimae! Never mind the haters. You are wonderful, and I'm thrilled that you're doing what you're doing!
abracadaverous 1 year ago
Now I can say "I've seen everything", men singing in the high soprano register and women singing in the low bass one! :D
18thCenturyMusic 1 year ago
This is amazing! My vocal range goes high (C3-C6), but have always been embarrassed that I sing most comfortably and naturally in the tenor-ish range (D3-E4). It's awesome to hear other women who naturally sing this low! Keep on rockin!
afuachu 1 year ago 6
@afuachu This is why we are doing the work that we do! I am sure that many more women could sing in the same range as you, but they are discouraged from doing so.
VivaldisWomen 1 year ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
the reason why women shouldnt sing low notes is becuz they have NO power in their voices. they are too ligth and were meant for speed and high notes. power and beauty should be left to the heavier voice types AKA men. however, women obviously have an advantage ont higher notes. ture but NOWADAYS not in the ancient times where EVERYTHING was narrow minded have seen BASSES hit g5's in MIXED voice. honestly notes int he fifth octave arent hard for men to hit. its the d6-... area tht is hard.
thegodofpop1 1 year ago
@thegodofpop1 Please see the page called Vocal Range on our website for more information.
VivaldisWomen 1 year ago
@VivaldisWomen Rubbish: have you never heard a really beefy operatic contralto or the amazing Bulgarian women's choir? Just as there are natural male sopranos so it is equally natural that some women have really low and powerful voices. I should know; I am the lady bass featured on the clip, and I can go lower yet in full power. So open your ears and your mind to a new sensation.
MultiJackrob 1 year ago
see reply to your comment on "In exitu Israel"
VivaldisWomen 1 year ago
Nice to see some other female singing tenor. It is the most natural for me to sing. Not alto, tenor.
0Krusnik0 1 year ago
I like the voice of Penny
mmmaaarrrcccooo 1 year ago
bella voz la de penny, es un timbre mas parecido al de una contralto legítima
Darioalquimia 1 year ago
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lovehristenko 1 year ago
thanks for letting us know - perhaps you could post a video to demonstrate this. Our research suggests that 1% of women can sing in the (male) bass register.
oxfordyouthchoirs 1 year ago
Oh this was really great! How low can Margaret sing?! Not very low for a male bass (not even a tenor) but she does make the A with ease.
karpov89 2 years ago
she has sung a clear low E for us...
VivaldisWomen 2 years ago
Oh..well I am not sure I can sing a clear low E myself..hope you will post more great videos like this!
karpov89 2 years ago
@VivaldisWomen that's not even much of an accomplishment. Many singers have been able to reach that note--i.e. Amy Lee, Mariah Carey, Utada Hikaru (on the Japanese front), etc. I could name many more, but I think you get the point. They are all sopranos. Usually, the low E is the lower extreme of a contralto's vocal range. I don't understand what's so amazing about anyone reaching this note.
SekaiNoMu 2 years ago
We don't claim to be amazing - just to perform Vivaldi with an all-women ensemble. But the note in question is the E below the bass stave (82 Hz)
VivaldisWomen 2 years ago
@VivaldisWomen Wow, this is amazing! All of you have such amazing and unique voices!
JazzBassist777 1 year ago
I have actually heard Maragret sing the D below that E. That is the D off the bottom of the bass stave, the one some male basses cannot hit. Do you still think that's nothing special, SekaiNoMu ?
petrafanafinny 2 years ago
@petrafanafinny I realized that right after I sent the message how low that note was. I read 'e' and assumed it was an octave higher, which is the typical bottom of a contralto's range. Not thinking at all. I apologize.
SekaiNoMu 2 years ago
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petrafanafinny 2 years ago
No problems - thanks, I appreciate it : ) I am a mere baritone and can hit the Ab at the bottom of the Bass stave.
petrafanafinny 2 years ago
@petrafanafinny But I would not call you a baritone if you "only" can make a Ab 2 (with enough force I presume) I still think that makes you a tenor?! In my amateur choir we have three female tenors, they usually skip the notes or sing one octave up if lower than C3. Anyway I really enjoy this, would be nice to hear more of this esemble in this setting.
karpov89 1 year ago
@karpov89
Are you implying I'm really a Bass, or an Alto? I am happiest singing in the Baritenor range. I sing Tenor in one choir right now, and the male tenors bitch and whine if they have to sing a C3, which I can comfortably go a few notes lower. So that alone make me lower than your average male tenor... I get paid to sing Tenor, Bari and Bass right now, so there!
petrafanafinny 1 year ago
@petrafanafinny Well, I am not sure..I sing tenor too, and usually that is c3-g4, but could happen as low as g2, although that is normally bass notes.
karpov89 1 year ago
a beautiful music and a pleasure to listen . . .
classicalcompo 2 years ago
beautiful. The contralto sounds a little pushed, but the other two sound wonderful. :) thank you for posting.
dragonfly51990 2 years ago
She has such beauty yet, please excuse me for saying this. Masculine voice.
OnyxNexion 2 years ago
from the journal "Pallade Veneta", Venice, July 1687, about Maria Anna Ziani, from the ospedale dei Mendicanti: although a woman, she is endowed naturally with a male voice, but one that is so tender and full, and of such a sweet tone, that she sings baritone with enough grace to transport and captivate the minds of her listeners. [Talbot "Venetian Music in the Age of Vivaldi", p131]
VivaldisWomen 2 years ago
... Talbot also refers to an entry in the diary of a Venetian nobleman, dated 3 September 1758. This refers to the death of a woman in her eighties, also from the Mendicanti, named Anna Cremona and described as a distinguished bass singer.
oxfordyouthchoirs 2 years ago
Very nice! It's certaintly refreshing to hear such unique female voices. Beautiful song, by the way. :)
whiskeyii 2 years ago
awesome!
duhhh86 2 years ago