@tellicherry1802 . Allendale is a village in the county of Northumberland. Lyrics written by Charles Jeffreys and the music by Sidney Nelson in the 1840s. Northumberland used to be part of Scotland many centuries ago but now part of England . I would imagine if you asked a local they would tell you they are Northumbrian and quite right too :-)
@erchieplum There are Allendale/Allandales in Scotland too. The lyrics were written by an Englishman but he also wrote things like Mary of Argyl. It is really unclear as to which Allandale is being sung about
@gaconnochie I think we can give this one to England or settle for Northumbrian.I get a bit annoyed about Scottish tunes being constantly labelled as Irish (normally on their way back from the US and examples have included "Caledonia! !and Bonnie Lass o Fyvie- crivvens ! ) So I think it reasonable to be generous with R of A. There is quite a lot of related discussion on Mudcat website
@erchieplum You're right it most certainly is an English song but it isn't Northumbrian as it was written by a Londoner. The oft assertion is that it is about the plave in Northumberland but there is no proof of that and there are places in Scotland too. And the songwriter wrote other 'pseudo-Scottish' songs like Mary of Argyll. AFAIK he never put in print what place it refers too. I agree with the Irish thing. Any Irish artist or partly Irish sings a song then it because an Irish song
I believe the true orogin of this song is in fact neither Scots or Irish, but stems from the Alendale in the English Co of Northumberland, also not a trad song but written by Charles Jeffrys and Sidney Nolan in the 1840's Mary Black's version is I think the best but Sean cannon's excellent too
Sean Cannon has to be the most under-rated singer i ever heard. its so hard to get his material. The Last of the Great Whales is another incredible song he sings
Hey guys...just cool it...whether this song originates in Scotland or Ireland is not as important as just sitting, listening and enjoying the lovely Dubliners singing what is truly such a beautiful song..lets all be friends and enjoy one of the only things we have thta brings us all together........MUSIC!
And all this is again besides the point as A) You are Irish (nothing wrong with that I am part Irish) and probably not from the area so arguing with someone who lives there saying you know more about the dialect is canny stupid. B) We know when and by whom this song was written. C) We know where Allendale is. D) Even if as you claim "highland" is uncommon the fact remains that there is no evidence in the song that it is referring to the Highlands (which like it or not is correctly capitalized).
Saying I cannot comment on a dialect because I am not from the place is ridiculous considering you have commented at length on the dialect in Scotland & the 1800s when you are from neither.Isn't thatthat hypocritical?I continue to maintain that the song was Annandale where you are not from anywhere near & you need to bear in mind the amount of folk songs that are rehashed then wrongly attributed entirely to the most recent composer e.g.Dawning of the Day,Sally Gardens,Loch Lomond,Minstrel Boy.
I commented on the dialect of the Borders (where I am from), not Scotland in general. I said a word was used in Northumberland and the Scottish Borders not that it is not used in Scotland...read my post. I realise that many folksongs have been rehashed and that includes English ones being reused in "Gaelic" nations ('All Around My Hat' for one thing). You may want it to be about Annandale but where is the evidence. We know the name and composition of the original version and who wrote it.
And by the way South West Scotland is not in the Highlands so the "Highland cot" would be out of place. It is usually "When Mary left her highland cot and wandered forth with me" (though it is sometimes now "highland home", "cot" being thought archaic by some). Note that it isn't "Highland cot" but "highland cot" and thus does not refer to *The Highlands* but the highlands. That is land that is high, a fell, a hill, a mound et cetera.
I know where The Highlands are in relation in Ayrshire,Dumfries & Galloway thanks & I am sure many folk are aware of the linguistic similarities between Lowland Scots & some English but lour has far greater usage in Lowland Scots than other areas historically.We are both aware though that the term'highland'(without a capital h)is not a term habitually used to refer to higher land by English folk.When was the last time that you heard anyone English refer to a hill,mound or mountain as highland?
It is commonly used when referring to "highland areas" (hence "the Highlands" deriving from this term). Any lesson in geography usually mentions "highland areas", "highland zones" et al. I must admit in the Borders "fells" is the most common term. I have heard "highland" being used many times however and it was commonly used in the 1800s.
Being from the Borders I can tell you that in Northumbrian "lour" is used as much as in Scotland. Maybe not by Geordies, but bey West and North Northumbrians.
How can you compare technical descriptive language used in a Geography lesson to that used in the vernacular?I would also point out that the 2 composers that you mention also wrote the tune 'Mary of Argyll' which is in close proximity to where I am talking about?I've been there many times so that does that mean I can talk about it & you cannot?...nope. Where did you read that highland was commonly used in the 1800s?i would like to read that too(no joking).
Will you lovely Irish and Scottish people stop trying to claim this as your own. Allendale is in Northumberland, and this is a folk song from that region.
I'm so glad that a few of us still know that it was a traditional English folk song, actually Northumberland has quite a few nice folk songs. (The Fair Flower Of Northumberland being one example)
Yes indeed it's Northumbrian. I actually live not far from Allendale, so I do quite like this song. It's also not a traditional song...it's quite modern being from the 1840s.
I like 'The Fair Flower of Northumberland' as well. It must be stated that it may originate on the Scottish side of the Border (hence the Knight being from that side) but that doesn't matter as it is still Northumbrian in the sense that both the English and Scots sides are culturally from the same source (Norþymbre).
Ah, I just thought 'Fair Flower' was from the Northumberland side of the border because of some of the lyrics; like "you're not the first that young scots did beguile" which would suggest treachery at those times.
Anyway, it doesn't bother me really, I have, English, Irish and Scottish blood in me, but I am from the south, so don't know all about the northumbrian/scottish history and that, though. But it's nice to learn.
It must be said, it may still be from the English side as we cannot be sure which side Border folksongs are from as they are in the same dialect, have many of the same references and use the same styles and themes. In fact many of the songs stated to be Scottish Border ballads...etc... do seem to be English rather than Scottish but it seems it is more "romantic" to call them all Scottish.
I am English (Northumbrian and West Saxon), Scottish and Irish amongst other things as well by the way.
Thanks, I love learning about songs from England, Scotland & Ireland, but sometimes it's hard to know. (sorry not to include Wales, but a lot of their stuff is done in their own language, so I wouldn't understand anyway)
Northumberland's probably England's most historically significant county, is it not? because of it's locality to Scotland I suppose.
It's probably more "romantic" to call them Scottish from an 'outsider' point of view, because Scotland's maintained more of its traditions :(
Much as I wish this tune to be Irish it is not and it most definitely is not English either.If you do a wee bit of research you will quickly discover that it is not about Allandale in England,it is about Annandale in the South West of Scotland as this songs proper title & lyrics is The Rose of Annandale.
Also,if you check the origin of the word 'lour'as used in the second verse(I think) you will find that although it is of German(Old English) origin it was commonplace in 'Scottish'English spoken for some time.The song also makes reference to the love interest in the song,Mary,leaving her 'Highland cot.'
If you did a wee bit o' research you'd see it was written in 1836 (Yes I was wrong by saying it was from the 1840s and not the 1830s) by Sidney Nelson and Charles Jeffreys and titled 'The Rose of Allendale' and not 'The Rose of Annandale' .
"Lour" is in Northumbrian English also as it is a dialect closely related to Scots Inglis as they both derive from Northumbrian Old English.
As strange as it can be , this song reminds me of my country in east Africa and of my girl I left in africa running away from war troubles back in the 60's - we lost eachother for 47 years - found her back lately - we were 14 ..now 62 and ....it still hurts .
by the way we lived for 5 years very close to eachother without knowing .....in the same town .... thankls for posting this marvelous song
lol! I was just thinking how much better this one is than The Corries'! The Dubliners' version is more sentimental, so maybe that's why I prefer it :)
Comment removed
gielkoper 2 months ago
Is this Sean singing?
udabonz 4 months ago
Where is allendale ?
tellicherry1802 7 months ago
@tellicherry1802 . Allendale is a village in the county of Northumberland. Lyrics written by Charles Jeffreys and the music by Sidney Nelson in the 1840s. Northumberland used to be part of Scotland many centuries ago but now part of England . I would imagine if you asked a local they would tell you they are Northumbrian and quite right too :-)
erchieplum 6 months ago
@erchieplum There are Allendale/Allandales in Scotland too. The lyrics were written by an Englishman but he also wrote things like Mary of Argyl. It is really unclear as to which Allandale is being sung about
gaconnochie 6 months ago
@gaconnochie I think we can give this one to England or settle for Northumbrian.I get a bit annoyed about Scottish tunes being constantly labelled as Irish (normally on their way back from the US and examples have included "Caledonia! !and Bonnie Lass o Fyvie- crivvens ! ) So I think it reasonable to be generous with R of A. There is quite a lot of related discussion on Mudcat website
regards
erchieplum 6 months ago
@erchieplum You're right it most certainly is an English song but it isn't Northumbrian as it was written by a Londoner. The oft assertion is that it is about the plave in Northumberland but there is no proof of that and there are places in Scotland too. And the songwriter wrote other 'pseudo-Scottish' songs like Mary of Argyll. AFAIK he never put in print what place it refers too. I agree with the Irish thing. Any Irish artist or partly Irish sings a song then it because an Irish song
gaconnochie 6 months ago
Paddy Reilly is good too.
As far as I know , Luke Kelly didn't do a recording.
simmo303 10 months ago
great Sean Cannon - this is fantastic - Sean Cannon is just doing this ( and many other) song perfect
Ravbo1 11 months ago 2
One of the very first loves of my musical life. This rendition is eternal for me.
michelstrogoff99 11 months ago
At his very best he could run Luke a close Second place. He also sings" the Last of the great whales" beautifully.
Oldgit
7oct1936 1 year ago
Wow this is just.. amazing *.* .. so epic
oOSweetpassionOo 1 year ago
Allandale is near to Bonnybridge, Scotland!
stevenbrown19812003 1 year ago
Very good version
DXMorpheus 1 year ago 3
Comment removed
DXMorpheus 1 year ago
This might just be the best rendition I've ever heard of this great song. Thanks for posting.
unclephil440 1 year ago 2
@unclephil440 It is definitely the greatest version of of this lovely song. Have another listen.Sean cannon was magic.
Teddyb1939 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Hurry and check out "JOHN MCCULLAGH "ILL DANCE ON YOUR GRAVE MRS THATCHER"........On youtube or Myspace. plus many more i:e BOBBY SANDS MP!
LARRSON77 1 year ago
Comment removed
JackCropperUK 1 year ago
Hammer Musi
locky0810 1 year ago
See if you can find the version by Michael Littwin.......it will make you cry.
bradesh 1 year ago
old Shee
locky0810 1 year ago
I believe the true orogin of this song is in fact neither Scots or Irish, but stems from the Alendale in the English Co of Northumberland, also not a trad song but written by Charles Jeffrys and Sidney Nolan in the 1840's Mary Black's version is I think the best but Sean cannon's excellent too
crc778Hypnodoc 1 year ago
JUST beautiful!!!!!!!!!!!
lanetemple 2 years ago 3
Beauitful.I must be irish,I love there music,,Such feeling...
72696062 2 years ago 3
I've never heard this before, and I would have sworn that it was Ciaran's vocals.
Either way, Mr. Cannon does a fantastic job with this song.
6\5, Absolute Class!
(P.S.: "Up the Dubs!")
anatefcan13 2 years ago 2
Sean Cannon has to be the most under-rated singer i ever heard. its so hard to get his material. The Last of the Great Whales is another incredible song he sings
timahoeboy 2 years ago
Hey guys...just cool it...whether this song originates in Scotland or Ireland is not as important as just sitting, listening and enjoying the lovely Dubliners singing what is truly such a beautiful song..lets all be friends and enjoy one of the only things we have thta brings us all together........MUSIC!
kiwihans 2 years ago 27
@kiwihans It actually comes from England. Allendale is in Northumberland.
Not that it matters - this is a lovely version.
gaspode18 1 year ago
Comment removed
JackCropperUK 1 year ago
@kiwihans too fecking true!!!!!!!!!!!
margatelad 1 year ago
Lovely song by Séan Cannon.
pasarfan 2 years ago 3
very nice this song!
I love the dubliners!
best oldie band ever!
Irish931 2 years ago 5
And all this is again besides the point as A) You are Irish (nothing wrong with that I am part Irish) and probably not from the area so arguing with someone who lives there saying you know more about the dialect is canny stupid. B) We know when and by whom this song was written. C) We know where Allendale is. D) Even if as you claim "highland" is uncommon the fact remains that there is no evidence in the song that it is referring to the Highlands (which like it or not is correctly capitalized).
HimWotMustBeObeyed 2 years ago
Saying I cannot comment on a dialect because I am not from the place is ridiculous considering you have commented at length on the dialect in Scotland & the 1800s when you are from neither.Isn't thatthat hypocritical?I continue to maintain that the song was Annandale where you are not from anywhere near & you need to bear in mind the amount of folk songs that are rehashed then wrongly attributed entirely to the most recent composer e.g.Dawning of the Day,Sally Gardens,Loch Lomond,Minstrel Boy.
gaelicpiper 2 years ago
I commented on the dialect of the Borders (where I am from), not Scotland in general. I said a word was used in Northumberland and the Scottish Borders not that it is not used in Scotland...read my post. I realise that many folksongs have been rehashed and that includes English ones being reused in "Gaelic" nations ('All Around My Hat' for one thing). You may want it to be about Annandale but where is the evidence. We know the name and composition of the original version and who wrote it.
HimWotMustBeObeyed 2 years ago
And by the way South West Scotland is not in the Highlands so the "Highland cot" would be out of place. It is usually "When Mary left her highland cot and wandered forth with me" (though it is sometimes now "highland home", "cot" being thought archaic by some). Note that it isn't "Highland cot" but "highland cot" and thus does not refer to *The Highlands* but the highlands. That is land that is high, a fell, a hill, a mound et cetera.
HimWotMustBeObeyed 2 years ago
I know where The Highlands are in relation in Ayrshire,Dumfries & Galloway thanks & I am sure many folk are aware of the linguistic similarities between Lowland Scots & some English but lour has far greater usage in Lowland Scots than other areas historically.We are both aware though that the term'highland'(without a capital h)is not a term habitually used to refer to higher land by English folk.When was the last time that you heard anyone English refer to a hill,mound or mountain as highland?
gaelicpiper 2 years ago
It is commonly used when referring to "highland areas" (hence "the Highlands" deriving from this term). Any lesson in geography usually mentions "highland areas", "highland zones" et al. I must admit in the Borders "fells" is the most common term. I have heard "highland" being used many times however and it was commonly used in the 1800s.
Being from the Borders I can tell you that in Northumbrian "lour" is used as much as in Scotland. Maybe not by Geordies, but bey West and North Northumbrians.
HimWotMustBeObeyed 2 years ago
How can you compare technical descriptive language used in a Geography lesson to that used in the vernacular?I would also point out that the 2 composers that you mention also wrote the tune 'Mary of Argyll' which is in close proximity to where I am talking about?I've been there many times so that does that mean I can talk about it & you cannot?...nope. Where did you read that highland was commonly used in the 1800s?i would like to read that too(no joking).
gaelicpiper 2 years ago
seans best song imo
fearghus66 2 years ago 4
learned this song in school wen was a kid
peetellu 3 years ago
like this song *5*
radigozd 3 years ago
This is a nice version, but I think the Corries version is even better. I bet you can find it on youtube if you search. corries - rose of allendale.
Cheers!
WhiteCavendish 3 years ago
good 5*
Inky261 3 years ago
SEAN CANNON.......
wicketchicken 3 years ago
Allendale is just over the Scottish border and is in Northumberland, England
geordylass 3 years ago
or South Africa , ,? or Australia .?
4799711 3 years ago
Northumberland, explain .?? is this in Europe .? thanks
4799711 3 years ago
Will you lovely Irish and Scottish people stop trying to claim this as your own. Allendale is in Northumberland, and this is a folk song from that region.
1504trevor 3 years ago 4
I'm so glad that a few of us still know that it was a traditional English folk song, actually Northumberland has quite a few nice folk songs. (The Fair Flower Of Northumberland being one example)
autobren 3 years ago
Yes indeed it's Northumbrian. I actually live not far from Allendale, so I do quite like this song. It's also not a traditional song...it's quite modern being from the 1840s.
I like 'The Fair Flower of Northumberland' as well. It must be stated that it may originate on the Scottish side of the Border (hence the Knight being from that side) but that doesn't matter as it is still Northumbrian in the sense that both the English and Scots sides are culturally from the same source (Norþymbre).
HimWotMustBeObeyed 2 years ago
Ah, I just thought 'Fair Flower' was from the Northumberland side of the border because of some of the lyrics; like "you're not the first that young scots did beguile" which would suggest treachery at those times.
Anyway, it doesn't bother me really, I have, English, Irish and Scottish blood in me, but I am from the south, so don't know all about the northumbrian/scottish history and that, though. But it's nice to learn.
autobren 2 years ago
It must be said, it may still be from the English side as we cannot be sure which side Border folksongs are from as they are in the same dialect, have many of the same references and use the same styles and themes. In fact many of the songs stated to be Scottish Border ballads...etc... do seem to be English rather than Scottish but it seems it is more "romantic" to call them all Scottish.
I am English (Northumbrian and West Saxon), Scottish and Irish amongst other things as well by the way.
HimWotMustBeObeyed 2 years ago
Thanks, I love learning about songs from England, Scotland & Ireland, but sometimes it's hard to know. (sorry not to include Wales, but a lot of their stuff is done in their own language, so I wouldn't understand anyway)
Northumberland's probably England's most historically significant county, is it not? because of it's locality to Scotland I suppose.
It's probably more "romantic" to call them Scottish from an 'outsider' point of view, because Scotland's maintained more of its traditions :(
autobren 2 years ago
Much as I wish this tune to be Irish it is not and it most definitely is not English either.If you do a wee bit of research you will quickly discover that it is not about Allandale in England,it is about Annandale in the South West of Scotland as this songs proper title & lyrics is The Rose of Annandale.
gaelicpiper 2 years ago
Also,if you check the origin of the word 'lour'as used in the second verse(I think) you will find that although it is of German(Old English) origin it was commonplace in 'Scottish'English spoken for some time.The song also makes reference to the love interest in the song,Mary,leaving her 'Highland cot.'
gaelicpiper 2 years ago
If you did a wee bit o' research you'd see it was written in 1836 (Yes I was wrong by saying it was from the 1840s and not the 1830s) by Sidney Nelson and Charles Jeffreys and titled 'The Rose of Allendale' and not 'The Rose of Annandale' .
"Lour" is in Northumbrian English also as it is a dialect closely related to Scots Inglis as they both derive from Northumbrian Old English.
HimWotMustBeObeyed 2 years ago
This is a very lovely song, and touches the soul I think.
So Beautiful !
Norfolk UK
(female 59)
josparkes 2 years ago 6
Lovely song and very well sung.
Jo Sparkes
Norfolk
7/12/2008
josparkes 3 years ago 4
Yes it is the Dubliners!
glyn001 3 years ago
this isnt the dubliners you idiot
MarkDangerSmith 3 years ago
yes, it is
duckiesv 3 years ago 2
As strange as it can be , this song reminds me of my country in east Africa and of my girl I left in africa running away from war troubles back in the 60's - we lost eachother for 47 years - found her back lately - we were 14 ..now 62 and ....it still hurts .
by the way we lived for 5 years very close to eachother without knowing .....in the same town .... thankls for posting this marvelous song
4799711 3 years ago 3
Beautiful music sometimes touches a spot and wakens a place that is sleeping.
Glad U are enjoying the song.
Jo Sparkes
Norfolk
7/12/2008
josparkes 3 years ago 6
I love Janet Beazley's version on her CD 5 South. Bit bluegrassy but it really moves along.I heard it just once and have ordered her CD from Amazon.
Moonbeamzz 3 years ago
thank you love this song and love the singers,
shaunasheehan 4 years ago 5
love this song.
LordBashWood 4 years ago 5
Such a wonderful vid.
Irelandmylove 4 years ago 3
A wonderful song,thank you.
CHRISSHART64 4 years ago 7
'Tis a Scottish song but never mind. Check out the Corries version. Much better.
superted147 4 years ago
lol! I was just thinking how much better this one is than The Corries'! The Dubliners' version is more sentimental, so maybe that's why I prefer it :)
TrevsMum 4 years ago 4
I also prefer this one, although the Corries' version is great. This one is more pensive and evocative.
themystiquelady 4 years ago 16
By far the best version of this song is by Mary Black.
anyone out there fancy posting it?
cliffthewanderer 4 years ago
did anyone?
Dira65 4 years ago
Yes they did Machree01 posted it in Oct, I only have it on cassette tape or I might have done it myself, this version is very pleasing though
cliffthewanderer 4 years ago
beautiful song it gives me a nostalgic feeling!
JanineBM 4 years ago 2
Beautiful song and not easy to sing. Covers quite a range. This is a very good version, very well sung.
parakarter 4 years ago 2
Wonderful! Thankyou.
muteswan53 4 years ago
Songs like this must come straight from the soul. Truly wonderful in their simplicity and never to be bettered
spaceword 5 years ago 2