Apparitions, Visions, Locutions, and Cardinal Arinze

[rpgabc123]

Can anyone say "Medjugorje?" ;)

[theluellen]

I would enjoy having this Cardinal speak here in Washington, DC

[temp911Luke]

Cardinal Arinze is awesome. Thanks God he is with us.

[Skyethur]

I believe in apparition that the catholic church confirmed..

[Estaban333]

The Pope said, at a general audience on 2nd Dec 2010 "I greet all Croatian pilgrims here, and especially those from the parish of St. James in Medjugorje. Your pilgrimage to Rome is part of the way of preparation for the coming of the Lord. Therefore, in hope, be evangelisers of God's love in your nation. May God bless you. Hvaljen Isus i Marija (Blessed be Jesus and Mary)". Doesn't sound as though he is about to condemn the apparitions to my ears.

[shysterlicious]

Again I say: OUR future Pope!

[blitzel3]

This guy is awesome!

[ebolingUtube]

TekkonShiro - WOW! What an opinion you have about the Catholic church. I can see why there are over 35,001 Protestant religions in the world. You go with the absolutely false and stupid claims you make about the Vatican.

Now we have Protestant Pope TekkonShiro #35,002. Hopefully your interpretations of what every documentation you follow is somewhat Christian.

Good luck with that.

[ebolingUtube]

@johnthreesixteen316 @ebolingUtube All of the marian apparitions are demonic. It's obvious to anyone who is sound biblically.

Now that comment sounds just like a Protestant. When one cannot prove anything and only has an opinion, the next thing they do is say that "you don't understand the bible".

What he is really saying is that if you don't agree with him, then you are not sound biblically. This goes back to what I said earlier; everyone has an opinion and they all think they are right.

[latinoforever1991]

2 more popes...to the end according to the Bible..

[swwaddell]

The "Protestants click here" button leads to an in-your-face video about Sacred Tradition and apostolic succession. I found it gratuitous and a little insulting, so don't bother with it, and just stick with the good Cardinal here.

[TheChurchMilitant]

@swwaddell I agree with you :D

[Hilarion1771]

Apparitions = Project Bluebeam, the ships are coming.

[johnthreesixteen316]

Christ said this..."I am the Way, the Truth and the Life. Nobody comes to the Father except by me."

The apparition says this...."Only I can help you. My immaculate heart will be your refuge and the Way that will lead you to God." It's quite clear that someone is lying here. Christ doesn't lie to us. The apparition is the liar. The apparition is a satanic deception. "And no marvel, for Satan himself is transformed into an angel of light."

[rytsign69]

could you please tell me which of the marian apparition did you get these words?

[johnthreesixteen316]

@rytsign69 The demon pretending to be Mary at Fatima.

[rytsign69]

That is for me to decide if they are Demonic or not. Please tell me which Apparition did you get these words?

[ebolingUtube]

@johnthreesixteen316 - Re:The apparition is a satanic deception.

You claim that the apparition is a demon in disguise. What has Mary said that is a lie? And what has she said that does not point to her son Jesus? Do you have an authority given to you to make such determinations or is it your opinion that the apparition was demonic?

[johnthreesixteen316]

@ebolingUtube Mary hasn't said anything. The apparitions are not Mary.

[ebolingUtube]

@johnthreesixteen316 - You only answered one of my questions and it was not a very good answer. You are claiming that Mary did not say anything because it was not Mary at Fatima. Then answer my last question as well.

Do you have an authority given to you to make such determinations or is it your opinion that the apparition was demonic and not Mary?

[johnthreesixteen316]

@ebolingUtube These apparitions contradict scripture.  Here is an example......

The apparition calls itself the "mediator of all graces." Christ is our only Mediator.

The apparition claims to suffer for our sins. Christ suffered on the cross ONCE for the sins of mankind.

Etc. etc. Many lies being spoken by this demon or demons pretending to be Mary.

[ebolingUtube]

@johnthreesixteen316 - These apparitions contradict scripture.

Where did you find your information that the apparition claims itself "the mediator of all graces" and that it "suffers for our sins"?

I found a reference that claims Mary said "I have come to tell the world that God exists. He is the fullness of life, and to enjoy this fullness and peace, you must return to God".

That does not sound like what you said and it does not sound Satanic to me.

[ebolingUtube]

@johnthreesixteen316 - These apparitions contradict scripture. Here is an example......

Again, you did not answer my question. The only reason I ask the question is that you sound like you are absolutely sure of the truth but it sounds like your opinion to me.

There are plenty of people in the world that have an opinion and they all have one thing in common. They all believe they know the truth and that everyone else is wrong. Everyone can't be right.

What apparitions are not demonic?

[WilliamTapley]

All these marian apparitions are DEMONIC! God is ALLOWING you to be TESTED with these!

Many are deceived...

[johnthreesixteen316]

@WilliamTapley I agree 100 percent!

[ebolingUtube]

@WilliamTapley - Re: All these marian apparitions are DEMONIC! God is ALLOWING you to be TESTED with these!

I will ask you a similar question as johnthreesixteen316.

Are you saying that all apparitions are from Satan or just Marian ones? God sent angels in visions according to the bible; does this mean that only angels can be sent by God? How do we know when an apparition is from God or Satan?

[WilliamTapley]

@ebolingUtube Catholics worship Mary. God commanded us not to do this. Satan uses the Mary figure to deceive as many as possible.

If a man came to this earth and looked like the Jesus in all those pictures, would you believe it was really Jesus? The shroud of turin depicts the closest resemblance we have to Jesus... but not many have that picture on their walls...

[ebolingUtube]

@WilliamTapley - Re:Catholics worship Mary.

That is completely false and proves you have no idea what Catholics believe. That would be like me saying that all Protestants worship the bible as their God and not Jesus.

The Catechism of the Catholic church clearly states that Catholics worship God alone. Veneration of Saints is not the same as worship.

As far as pictures go, I don't think anyone who has turned away from Jesus would ever recognize him when he returns.

[WilliamTapley]

@ebolingUtube It's not completely false. Maybe you should actually see what Catholics truly worship and how they behave to get a real understanding of how bad the deception really is. If these marian apparitions are real, then how come they say that you only need to go to church for 6 months and you get into heaven? That is a joke!!!! Satan is laughing at you right now, and I would be too if I didn't love or care about you. Hopefully you can open your eyes to the truth.

[ebolingUtube]

@WilliamTapley - Re:It's not completely false.

Now that is a better comment but still wrong. What some Catholics do and what the Church teaches are not always the same.

If you look back at my statements, I never said the apparitions are real. I simply asked how you know they are not real without a shadow of a doubt.

I am not aware of the apparitions saying "you only need to go to church for 6 months and you get into heaven". That is against Catholic church teachings. Provide your source!

[WilliamTapley]

@ebolingUtube Search for "Our Lady of Fatima" and her 'promises' I think there's 15 of them. Totally bogus.

[ebolingUtube]

@WilliamTapley - R:Search for "Our Lady of Fatima"

Perhaps this is one of the sites you are referring?

w w w .fatima. org/essentials/requests/promis­es. asp

At the same time, most everything said points to her son with a few exceptions. I can see why you have a problem with those promises.

Now what is the Catholic church's stance on the subject? The Cardinal makes it very clear that public apparitions have been concluded with Jesus.

[ebolingUtube]

@WilliamTapley - Re:Search for "Our Lady of Fatima" All other apparitions are private in nature, including Marian apparitions like Fatima and are not required to be believed.

Make sure when you accuse the Catholic church, you are making correct accusations. You need to know what the Catechism of the Catholic church teaches, not what you see on some web sites.

Nancy Pelosi thinks she is a Catholic and many people believe her lies when she proclaims something that the Catholic church teaches.

[WilliamTapley]

@ebolingUtube All I need to know is that they are demonic apparitions. There is way too much corruption in Babylon, I mean Vatican City... Her destruction is near.

[ebolingUtube]

@WilliamTapley - Re:There is way too much corruption in Babylon

Ok, if you say so Pope WilliamTapley. Preach your gospel of what your truth is to everyone. I only hope that people are not dumb enough to listen to your lies about the corruption in Bablylon or Vatican as you put it.

For those listening to Pope WilliamTapley, you might want to check some sources other self proclaimed Popes who claim only they can interpret this book correctly.

w w w .catholictelevision. org/podcast/s1e5. mp3

[WilliamTapley]

@ebolingUtube Can I get my own pope mobile? Or really cool bling to match my awesome fish helmet and pimp attire?

Jokes... But seriously. When revelation speaks of the first beast, it is obviously pointing to the Vatican. Why do you think they call it Mystery Babylon?

[ebolingUtube]

@ebolingUtube

By the way, I like the WHITE PILL also.

WHITE PILL = the bible is true and we are caught in the middle of a war btw God vs Satan

[ebolingUtube]

@WilliamTapley Re:Can I get my own pope mobile?

Hopefully you are not referring  to Dave Hunt, in his 1994 book, A Woman Rides the Beast. He is a self proclaimed Pope as well.

[ebolingUtube]

@WilliamTapley

William, I know you listened to the audio that I already posted. You would not do me the disservice of making a claim, disputed by me, and not listen to it?

You have provided your understanding of what the bible says but even many Protestants do not agree with you. So are you saying they are wrong as well?

w w w .catholictelevision. org/podcast/s1e5. mp3

[WilliamTapley]

@ebolingUtube Yep. Practically all protestants are wrong as well. Anyone who observes the Sunday sabbath instead of the True Sabbath is wrong... and that is just one key point! Don't get me started on the pagan 'holy' days.

[ebolingUtube]

@WilliamTapley -Re:Yep.

As I said before, the Definition of Pope:

1 The male head of some non-Christian religions: the Taoist pope.

2 A person considered to have unquestioned authority: the pope of surrealism.

Observing the Sabbath on Sunday is wrong? Ok Pope William! You go with that amigo.

[122651Lil]

@WilliamTapley The Sunday Sabath is based on the resurrection of Jesus on Easter Sunday.If you say Sabbthis wrong for Sunday, state you reason, which you did not do.

[WilliamTapley]

@122651Lil Sabbath means rest. God didn't raise Jesus on the Sabbath. He raised him on Sunday. So you're trying to say that Sunday is now the day of rest? I think I just proved beyond a shadow of a doubt, but my guess is that you will still follow along with the crowd.

[temp911Luke]

@WilliamTapley This IS NOT TRUTH ! And you bettter be carefull what you say. It would be better for you if you didnt spread those lies. Repent while its still time.

[TekkonShiro]

Question to "lady" gospa of Medjugorje:

"Did you appear at Necedah, Wisconsin?"

[TekkonShiro]

Answer by Gospa: Yes.

???

The fact is:

Catholic Church [Vatican] has condemned Necedah long time ago.

Even, the seer died out of the grace of the Church and did not even receive a Church burial. Necedah has been taken over by the priests and bishops of the heretical sect, who split from the Catholic Church.

[TekkonShiro]

There are written statement by the Franciscan priest of Medjugorje, Father Slavko Barbaric, and signed by his translator, John T. Shindler. It contains many questions to be presented to the Gospa through the visionaries.

[TekkonShiro]

These are some of the questions and the answers by the Gospa (Virgin?):

Question 2. When does a baby receive a living soul?

Answer by Gospa: "Four and one half months."

Question 4. What about UFOs? Are they true?

Answer by Gospa Yes.

[TekkonShiro]

Question 7. Where Adolf Hitler, Marshal Tito, and Pope Paul VI replaced by evil doubles during their lifetimes?

Answer by Gospa: Yes. They were good men replaced by evil red doubles.

[TekkonShiro]

The answer to Question 2 would legalize almost all abortions; Question 4 and 7 need no comment;.

[TekkonShiro]

On May 25, 1984, the so-called "Virgin" commanded that her 2000th anniversary be celebrated on August 5th. Bishop Zanic forbid the request. The "Virgin" then demanded that the feast of her birthday be celebrated on the 5th of August instead of the 8th of September. What about the Feast of the Immaculate Conception? Will that have to be changed also?

[TekkonShiro]

God will not contradict Himself. Nor will a true seer contradict another true seer. Since Catherine Emmerich, Therese Neumann, Mary Agreda, and the Church have said that Mary was born on September 8th, what are we to make of this woman of Medjugorje?

[TekkonShiro]

In fact, Mirna of Damascus received four different apparitions on the eve of September 8th. One in that same year, 1984. On the following eve of September 8th, 1985, Christ said, "I am the creator. I created Her to give Me life..."

[TekkonShiro]

see the fake vision ecstasy :

youtube . com / watch?v=3l9faPilhSo

[TekkonShiro]

False Doctrine of Medjugorje:

from April 1983

"Our Lady" said:

1. . . . give me the grace to love all men as you loved Jesus Christ . . .

2. . . . give me the grace to be merciful towards you . . .

3 . . . if, by chance, I should lose your grace, I ask you to restore it to me.

[TekkonShiro]

The numerous absurd messages, lies, falsehoods and DISOBEDIENCE associated from the beginning with the events and "apparitions" of Medjugorje.

[TekkonShiro]

Bishop Zanic said:

"IT IS NOT THE VIRGIN MARY APPEARING AT MEDJUGORJE."

Archbishop, Cardinal Kuharic said:

"IT IS NOT THE VIRGIN MARY APPEARING AT MEDJUGORJE."

Lucia of Fatima said, Do not go there ---

"IT IS NOT THE VIRGIN MARY APPEARING AT MEDJUGORJE."

[TheotokosCarmeli]

TekkonShiro: I'll leave judgement up to the pope. The Church remains silent in judgement.

[TekkonShiro]

The greatest pilgrimage on Earth is [actually] at:

The Holy Communion Eucharist.

The Holy Eucharist is Jesus Christ; God Himself.

No need 'apparition' to prove or believe that.

John 20:29

Jesus said to him: "You believe because you can see me. Blessed are those who have not seen and yet believe."

[kolbe1019]

Crux Sacra sit mihi lux, nunc draco siy mihi dux. CSPB T

[pbaylis1]

The cardinal quoted scripture: "Those who listen to you, listen to me, and those who don't listen to you, don't listen to me". He doesn't realise that irony. God speaks to us through apparitions. Fear and apprehension of apparitions is not a good look for a Catholic leader. We should all be listening VERY CAREFULLY when God speaks through an apparition and begin to do the things that are asked.

[pbaylis1]

The entire country of Mexico was converted because people were enthusiastic about an apparition. I'm not sure throwing a wet blanket on people is the correct way.

[donhenri01]

Card. Arinze was a great man excerpt when he excomunised Mgr Marcel Lefebvre, a truly saint man.

[pbaylis1]

Ah, now that explains a lot. I didn't know that.

[sokre86]

I will link Fatima with Medjugorje because it is my right. Will I burn in hell? Vatican is examing Medjugorje and when the visions will finish they will recognized it. Jesus said you will know good fruit from the three and the bad one. Medjugorje has a lot of converts and that is good fruit of the three

[iotaunam1]

VIDEO PROOF THAT "SEERS ARE NOT IN ECSTASY!!!!

PASTE INTO YOUTUBE:

Medjugorje senza maschera. 14 gennaio 1985 (video 2)

[pbaylis1]

Iotunam, you are from the evil one, not anyone to do with Medjugorje. Unfortunately for you, three scientific teams have studied the visionaries over a period of YEARS (not just one apparition) and found them NOT to be faking ecstasy. If Vicka blinked and moved her head, then God allowed it, simple as that!

[iotaunam1]

I am not "from the evil one" as you suggest, but I am a firm believer in Truth.

The "Children" - all in their teens (bar one) - admitted that they were smoking stolen cigarettes when "Gospa" appeared!

They said they could touch her and she just "giggled" (this is also on tape and available in the transcripts - now in the hands of the Vatican).

See the Tape interviews from after the first "apparitions" or read the transcripts before you make idiotic comments!!!

[JoelDeniro]

Those children stole cigarettes??

so because of this you think they cant have a revelation from god?

I know we must be careful in not to believe just any claims.

However kids are kids and they are now adults and you are not making a case of why they cant have any revelation

[iotaunam1]

All the evidence points to Medjugorje being Fraudulent. Have you read the Bishops letters explaining why?

As I said before, the "seers" were hardly innocent Children - they were all (bar one) in their teens.

They were somking stolen cigaretts when "the Gospa" appeared - Contrast this with the Authentic Marian apparitions!

Also, if you hear the tapes or see the transcripts, you will see nothing but lies and contradiction. Our lady NEVER makes doctrinal mistakes in her messages!

[JoelDeniro]

You already know that it takes time to approve or reject such event.

Just like Fatima and a few others

Pray

Fast

Confession

Communion

I dont see contradictions here

I dont know of any false prophecies

You can message me..

[iotaunam1]

Firstly, "it takes time" and "we have to wait till they finish" are NOT valid arguments. Sr Lucia continued to see Our Lady & Our Lord after the apparitions were approved!

Secondly, Pray, fast etc - are obvioulsy not the contradictions I speak of. See the tape interviews from the first week, or transcripts etc!

Also, I recommend you read "Understanding Medjugorje", which provides some evidence in a condensed form. All should seek the truth, biases withstanding.

[apeygirl]

@iotaunam1 it's not Fatima part 2. It's Garabandal part 2. The similarities are there. (being appeared to while stealing, among other things). The devil has, to give him his due, brushed up on his PR since then. He's succeeding wildly in creating a schism with Medjugorje.

[iotaunam1]

@apeygirl

Everyone knows why JPII never condemned it directly. It has been leaked from so many sources in the Vatican over the years. JPII thought he could use the Medjugorje phenomenon (though he knew it was false) to try and break communism in that country. He used it for geopolitical reasons, and it back fired. It grew so large that to condemn it now would cause the liberals to Schism. He should have spoke out. This dilema faces Pope Benedict, but aparantly he is due to condemn it soon.

[apeygirl]

@iotaunam1 Well, he cracked down on the Legion of Christ and laicized one of the Medjugorje seers' spiritual directors. I have faith in Pope Benedict.

[iotaunam1]

@apeygirl

Lets just hope he does the right thing sooner rather than later. There are too many gullible people out there who wont believe it is false until the Pope says it.

[Estaban333]

@iotaunam1 You clearly have high level sources! When is "soon"?

[iotaunam1]

Also, in real apparitions, such as Lourdes, La Salette, and Fatima etc - the apparitions never lasted more than 6 months - sometimes one day! Contrast this with Medjugorje.

In real apparitions, Our Lady only gives short, serious messages directly relating to the salvation of the world - whereas in Medjugorje, we see thousands and thousands of meaningless conversations with "the Gospa". Jakov also asked the Gospa about the football results - contrast this with Fatima etc.

[pbaylis1]

I'm so glad the Vatican doesn't have people like you making decisions. Since when do we ever give God a time limit? Where is it written that an apparition must follow a certain timeline. By the way, the answer to the question of longevity is that the prayers and fasting of those who do what Our Lady asked is providing additional graces and holding back God's justice. Mary herself said it would be impossible to convert everyone, but God is giving us a fair chance. AND YOU'RE NOT HELPING!

[iotaunam1]

The "seers" have also made many many false prophesies, which were never fulfilled on the dates they gave! Also miralces they claim as proof, such as the hands turning round on the watch, is not in keeping with real miracles. (This watch was later taken to a watchsmith who confirmed that the hands had simply been plucked, so that with even a slight tilt, they would spin). Contrast these with the Fatima Secrets, and Miracle of the Sun, witnessed by over 70,000 people!!

[pbaylis1]

Well, you're just a liar and worse. If you were a firm believer in the Truth, you would read what three scientific teams found when they studied the visionaries during their visions. Bright lights shined in their eyes and their pupils did not dilate. Burned on their arms, but they did not flinch. Loud noises with no reaction. Read them, then come back and comment. Sensible people, including the Vatican, look at ALL the evidence. Hateful people just lie and bear false witness.

[pbaylis1]

iotaunam1 - a hateful and lost soul!

Cigarettes: The kids weren't saints when Mary first appeared 25 years ago. Peter and the apostles weren't already saints when Christ called them.

And you forgot to mention that they have all quit smoking now! You are a liar and a bearer of false witness. And you don't seem to care. Buzz off and good luck to you.

[iotaunam1]

Well, you may call me hateful, but I have no intention of returning insult. I believe that you are sincere in your will to follow Christ and His Church, but are, like so many others, caught up in this deception.

Also, the fact that the "seers" have "quit smoking" is not relevant to my point: that they had stolen cigaretts and were smoking them when "the Gospa" appeared. This is in complete contradiction to the the events surrounding real apparitions.

[pbaylis1]

You have already insulted and condemned half of Medjugorje. You're condemnation of innocent people is against the 8th commandment and the reason why you are getting back what you have given out. What the heck happened to the basic Christian tenet "Judge not lest you be judged".

[pbaylis1]

Do they steal cigarettes now? Was Peter a sinner when Christ first appeared to him? What happened then? Was he forgiven? Did he carry on sinning?

Please answer these questions. Then you will know the correct way to view the visionaries. You will see how Christ views the visionaries, you will see how the Vatican views the visionaries and you will yourself become a true Catholic and more Christ-like. If you don't want to, then you've no business calling yourself a Christian.

[iotaunam1]

Regarding evidence, have you seen the video that I provided a link for? It shows conclusively that Vicka was not in ectasy, as she claimed, and lied about "the Gospa" nearly dropping the Child Jesus.

Whatsmore, it you you who bear false witness against me, since I do not lie about what I have said!

[pbaylis1]

First, as I keep asking, and you never answer, is: Where is the evidence that Vicka was not in ecstasy? If you're saying the evidence is that she moved her head away from Jean Louis' finger, again, I ask you.....why would God not allow her body to defend itself? Let's clear that one up first. Then we'll address other things. You're not keeping up with the pertinent questions so I'll repeat them one at a time. You just attack me when I give you the answer you asked for. Respond to this one first.

[iotaunam1]

Medjugorje is a false apparition! Their followers need to read the Catechism, Bible and Catholic Dogma (Such as Denzinger) etc!

[sokre86]

that is your opinion. when the vision finish we will see what will Vatican say about medjugorje

[iotaunam1]

Medjugorje is a false apparition because it goes against catholic teaching! Truth cannot contradict Truth. The 'seers' are obvious liars, particularly Ivan and Vickka. I know this from personal experience.

Do not ask me to list the contadictions again, as I have listed them so many times already. See my other posts, or read more books/online articles about this deception.

[sokre86]

look I said that is your opinion. What about millions of people who founded there faith in Medjugorje? In the time Lurd and Fatima where first mentioned as place where Mary appeared people where skeptical like you. Vatican is waiting for visions to finish so then they will exam it. Vatican did the same thing with Fatima and Lurd. Even if Medjugorje is not place of visions and appearances it is not a sin to go there and pray

[iotaunam1]

Medjugorje is a false apparition because it goes against catholic teaching! - This is not my opinion, it is a matter of basic logic. Truth cannot contradict Truth. Anyway I know these seers are liars from personal experience! Most in the Vatican Know these are all lies. Faith found at a false apparition is not True faith, it is full of doctrinal lies which the ignorant embrace to thier own destruction.

[sokre86]

i will quote Pope John Paul II : "Medjugorje is the fulfillment and continuation of Fatima"

[iotaunam1]

So what! This proves nothing. The Vatican denies that JPII said anything like this! Even if he did, it would only show that he believed that a false apparition was True!

Do not try and link false apparitions with those of Fatima. In doing so, you are dicrediting Fatima!!!!

[pbaylis1]

Where is the evidence that the Vatican denied this? This is a rhetorical question because I already know that there is no evidence.

[apeygirl]

@sokre86 That quote was proven to be false by Ratzinger in a letter to either Zanic or Peric. Any statements attributed to the pope and himself concerning Medjugorje are untrue... something like that.

[apeygirl]

@iotaunam1 Yes. According the the Gospa, first trimester abortions are alright because the baby has not yet received its soul and the condemned book "Poem of the Man-God" is true.

[iotaunam1]

@apeygirl

True. One of the many hundreds of lies and contradictions coming from those false "seers". Do these blind sheep not even start to question the authenticity when they see the seers having multiple homes (with swimming pools) and ordering BMW'S brand new with "outside the series" wheels. It is a sick joke at the expense of Real Apparitions like Fatima.

[Estaban333]

@apeygirl Can you quote the relevant messages?

[andrzejnher4eva]

i'm sorry but you are wrong. :)

watch the video again.

and btw, if medjugorje is based on liars... the the whole Church is a liar. either that or you are a very much mistaken ( or in the worst of circumstances, you're a liar yourself..hopefully you arent) i am convinced that medjugorje is genuine! Mama Mary came there! I believe because i have seen a miracle :) ask me about it..i can tell you

[iotaunam1]

Why would I watch this video again, when I have understood it perfectly?

"if medjugorje is based on liars... the the whole Church is a liar" - Do you honestly believe that this is a logical statement? The Church is infallible! Whatsmore, there is strong opposition in the Church (including the Ordinary of the Diocese) to Medjugorje. It is False!

Did you not watch the video I linked to, exposing the "seers"? "Miracles" prove nothing - as God warned, the Devil can work all signs and wonders!

[andrzejnher4eva]

i'm not ging to base what i believe on a mere video. furthermore, the Catholic Church has never once condemned the apparations at Medjuhorje as you have so unrighteously done. I will pray for you that you will be forgiven in spreading such erroroneos theories. God bless. PS. The Devil has clouded your mind with doubt I hope and pray that it will pass..

[iotaunam1]

This "mere video" exposes the lies for all to see!! This cannont be from God, as he is all truth.

The Ordinary of the area has the power ( by Canon law) to make a definitive pronouncement on the matter. He has - look up his numerous letters etc!

Whatsmore, I do not need to be "forgiven" for exposing the truth about this false apparition, in fact I would consider it a sin to know about it, and not warn other well meaning people!

[pbaylis1]

Pull your head in iotaunam. How dare you spread lies and cause conflict. Medjugorje has NEVER been spoken negatively of by any official pronouncement by the Vatican. I challenge you to show us even ONE document. I can show you several that say the opposite of what you're saying.

[iotaunam1]

I do not spread lies!

I never ever said that Medjugorje was spoken of negatively by any official Vatican Pronouncement - that does not mean it is not false!!!! It is an evil movement, which has nothing to do with our Lady!!!

There is plenty of Formal letters from the Bishop of Mostar (the Ordinary who represnts the Church by Canon law) which refute this false apparition clearly!!!!

[pbaylis1]

Let me address your brain explosion:

1) The Bishop of Mostar is HARDLY the person to rely on for evidence. He has been reprimanded on several occasions by investigators and by the Vatican itself. MOST IMPORTANTLY, The Vatican's Bishop Tarcisio Bertone from the Congregation for the Doctrine of Faith sent a letter to the faithful telling them NOT TO CONSIDER THE OPINIONS OF THE LOCAL BISHOP AS OFFICIAL VATICAN OPINION.

Yes, you ARE spreading lies.

[iotaunam1]

According to Canon law, the local Ordinary HAS the jurisdiction to decide whether an apparition is authentic or false (Canon 753) just as at Fatima and Lourdes etc. This is Church Law. Due to dissobedience, he delegated the matter to a larger council of Bishops, as the local Franciscan clergy (long since dissobedient to the Magesterium) led the faithfull in ignoring his decision. His decision still stands.

How much do you know about Bertone? Perhaps he is HARDLY the person to rely on!

[pbaylis1]

You're embarrassing yourself. You just don't know the history and the facts. Rick Salbato of Unity Publishing himself admitted to me in an email that he could not refute the letter from Bertone. It is by far the strongest argument for the Vatican's rejection of the rabid opposition of the local bishop. I suggest you go away now and learn. I'm not responding to you personally any more. But for the rest of the world reading this thread, I'm going to suffer your ignorance and answer your silliness

[iotaunam1]

See also:

- Letter banning pilgrimages (from Archbishop Alberto Bovone - Undersecretary for Congregation for the Doctrine of Faith) to Ittlian Bishops Conference.

-Letters of Bishop Zanic

- Letter of Cardinal Pio Laghi

Most devistating of all is the interviews with the "seers". Read the transcripts and tell me if you still think it its true. The seers were somking stolen cigaretts and schoolmates maintain they were selling drugs. They admitted the smoking on tape.

FRAUD!!!

[pbaylis1]

Allow me repair your next brain eruptions:

Bovone's statement is the same as the official Zadar Declaration of 1991, i.e. that UNTIL THE VATICAN HAS HAD TIME TO CONCLUDE ITS INVESTIGATIONS, anyone can pilgrimage to Medjugorje, but it is not YET appropriate to organise official pilgrimages that give the impression that the Vatican's work has concluded positively. Archbishop Bertone clarified this in case of confusion: Anyone can travel and receive pastoral support at Medjugorje.

[pbaylis1]

Again you mention Bishop Zanic's letters. These can all be ignored according to the official letter from the Vatican's Cardinal Tarcisio Bertone. Neither Zanic nor his successor Peric were very popular in the Vatican. Both were endorsed by the communist regime in Yugoslavia. Zanic was a firm believer in Medjugorje, but appeared to suddenly changed his tune when the Communist Secret Police demanded that he stop the apparitions.

[iotaunam1]

It is you who spread lies!!!!! Bishop Zanic Was NEVER insupport of these false apparitions. If you read his first official statement, he said that they "seem" to have seen something, however " the most difficult question remains: Did the children have subjective supernatural experiences?" - He clarified that he was open to the possibility that "somthing" was seen, but leaning more towards diabolical!!!! He was clearly NEVER for the false apparition, as he always maintained!

[pbaylis1]

I dare say that even E Michael Jones, Richard Salbato and the nastiest of detractors would be cringing at your ignorance.

There is very little doubt that Zanic favoured the apparitions and Zovko opposed them at first.

Both Zovko and Zanic were ordered by the Communist Secret Service, under threat of jail, to cease the apparitions. By the time Zovko had changed his mind and chose 3 years in jail. But, Zanic soon began to oppose the apparitions. He spent no time in jail.

[pbaylis1]

The big mistake you keep making is relying on the hate letter that Zanic sent out after Ratzinger disagreed with his impossible stance that "it is PROVEN not to be supernatural" Who the heck can agree with that!? Not Ratzinger! He took away from Zanic the power to decide on the authenticity of the apparitions. Zanic was very sternly warned by Bishop Franic, and then officially by the Vatican, to stop spreading his opinions immediately, but he apparently did not heed these warnings.

[apeygirl]

@pbaylis1 I disagree with Zanic there. It supernatural, but not the good kind.

[Estaban333]

@apeygirl Bishop Zanic was initially supportive but withdrew support when the Communist authorities called him to a meeting in Sarajevo. He told the then parish priest that he was not prepared to go to prison and would obey the civil authorities and that is what he did.

[iotaunam1]

@Estaban333

No, if you read what the Bishop wrote you will see his reasons why he changed his mind after hearing the facts of what actually happened and interviewing the "seers". Also the "authorities" could have stoped this sharade long ago, but the amount of money it brought in made even the reddest of them bite their toungues. As to your question: I cannot say, thats up to the Pope. The longer he delays however, the bigger the problem will be-Should have been done when the fraud statrted.

[Estaban333]

@iotaunam1 No. If you read what Fr. Jozo says, the Bishop changed his mind because he was frightened of going to prison as Fr. Jozo later did for 2 years and lost his hearing as a result. The Communist authorities were intent on stopping the claims and warned the Bishop, it was much later that the government saw some advantage in letting the pilgrims in to spend their money.

[iotaunam1]

@Estaban333

You are brainwashed. You need to read more on the case - stop listening to what Jozo says the Bishop thought and read what the Bishop actually said. Also, you quote Jozo as if he was reliable: you obviously are unaware of his suspension and being accused multiple times of sexual assult. Also, even you admit that the red government had interest in letting the fraud continue. I have researched this for years- its false. PM if you need more evidence.

[Estaban333]

@iotaunam1 Have you ever been there? It took the communists several years to see any advantage in this situation, they threatened the (then) youngsters with psychiatric confinement, they imprisoned Fr Jozo, they threatened Bishop Zanic with imprisonment. They thought that it was a Catholic/Croat political conspiracy. Fr Jozo has not been found guilty of any sexual impropriety, accusations are just that. Go there, then give us your opinions.

[iotaunam1]

@Estaban333

I will reply to your PM - but I will say here what should be clear to anyone: you don't have to visit every false apparition site to kow that it is false. I will respond to the rest by PM.

[Estaban333]

@iotaunam1 I acknowledge that you do not have to visit every claimed apparition site to establish its authenticity personally. I share your opinion of some without going myself. However Medjugorje is unique in that an estimated 30 million people have been there (so, not directly comparable with other sites). I am one of the 30 million and have been there 3 times. I do know more than you do about this. If Cardinal Schonborn felt the need to go (in 2010) before making judgement, maybe you should.

[iotaunam1]

Of course the Pope cannot prevent people from going! If people go there and want their confessions herd, or hear Mass etc, the Church makes provisions, as it would do anywhere else!! This does not lend support IN ANY WAY to these fasle apparitions. Do you know what Cardinal Ratzinger said about Medjugorje when he was head of the CDF?

Do you know that Rene Laurentin has lied (which he admits) when he knows it is false?

Again, find out about Bertone before you cite him as anyway credible!

[pbaylis1]

Liar, liar..You better repent quick

[pbaylis1]

iotaunam: "Again, find out about Bertone before you cite him as anyway credible! "

Lol, you seem completely bound by ignorance and hate. It is YOU who needs to get the facts. You're just being plain silly.

Bertone was secretary for the Congregation for the Doctrine of Faith and reported to Ratzinger. He would have needed Ratzinger's approval to send that letter!

[pbaylis1]

Here's another unofficial recorded, verified Bertone comment, which you're going to hate.

"For the moment, one should consider Medjugorje as a Sanctuary, a Marian shrine, in the same way as Czestochowa." He added: "The Congregation of the Doctrine of the Faith has asked the Episcopal Conference of Bosnia Hercegovina to take over the dossier of Medjugorje and start again from the beginning. A team of experts will take part in the work."

Source: Medjugorje Report 15 May, 1999

[pbaylis1]

So, it should be AS CLEAR AS DAY to anyone who doesn't have hate in their hearts that the Vatican doesn't like the way the local bishops have been handling things and wants to protect Medjugorje from their influence until it has had time to objectively investigate. YOU ARE NOT HELPING.

You are working AGAINST the objectivity that the Vatican is trying to promote. You are effectively ANTI-VATICAN. How do you feel about that?

[apeygirl]

@pbaylis1 I'm going to have to disagree with you. If Bishop Peric was not to be trusted, then he would be censured or suspended or laicized. That has not happened. Yet two of the priests that advised the seers early on have been laicized and yet another that still works with them is administering sacraments invalidly while under suspension. Yet Peric and his predecessor have never had any scandal attached to them.

[thirdexodus2008]

Sir there was NEVER A PUBLIC REVELATION.God never spoke to the public.The revelations in the Bible were all PRIVATE REVELATIONS.The bible told us the word God came to Isaiah,to Nahum,Nhemaiah,even Apostle John. It was God SPEAKING TO THE INDIVIDUAL NOT PUBLIC.Catholic church DOES NOT BELIEVE THE BIBLE!

[ESEME11]

Public revelation doesn't mean speaking to the public. if that's the case then we shouldn't know about the convos Jesus had with Mary Magdala, Nicodemus and the apostles. Public Revelation is that which is in the Bible, and must be believed.

[thirdexodus2008]

Every word of God must be believed.Gods true children and sons that have open channel of communication with the pillar of fire constant receive from the Lord.That is THUS SAITH THE LORD.The bible serves as reference point to butress these.Gods word the bible remains and is a book of private revelations. D Word of God came 2 Amos, Moses,Samuel,to me & as many as have channel of communication open the the holy spirit.Revelations from God are word based. Eg Jesus to apostles on the way to Emmaus.

[kadet001]

Amen! I look forward to when the Curia does not see skin colour or language as the barriers or definitions for recognition of a legitimate candidate to the papacy. Viva Cardinal Arinze and his commitment to the faith!!!!

[Nillessir]

Flaco favor el de la Virgen, eh señores?

Ella saca tierra del agujero y Uds de espaldas la vuelven a meter dentro.

Didáctico , oh yes .

[richardquartimain]

Very good speech!

[mulg1]

The bishops are appointed to govern by the Holy Spirit, and it is the Holy Spirit that guides their judgements, as well as Church Tradition. Therefore they discern according to the spirit, not judging according to the flesh.

[pbaylis1]

Well, not necessarily. If the Bishop rejects the guidance of the Holy Spirit and acts on his own, according to his free will, then we can't say that he was led by the Holy Spirit. After all, all the Old Testament Kings were anointed of God, but look how most of them turned out. You have to keep yourself pure and holy and listen to and obey the direction of the Holy Spirit. It's a struggle sometimes.

[maria31x]

Kolbe1019: Could you tell me exactly when and where this video was taken? It is excellent!

[helgothjb]

Catholic Family Land. It is in Ohio. An amazing place!

[Rev11Reyes]

How does the catholic church distingush between private revelations vs. the two witnesses of revelations ch 11?

[laurensdelange]

You see. He said that we who judge according the flesh, don't know when He comes and when he goes. Shall we then judge about whether Mary comes or goes?

Learn to listen to the Holy Spirit instead? The Holy Spirit may tell you personally whom to listen to.

[kolbe1019]

That is religious relativism. The Holy Spirit tells me not to listen to you. How do I know I am right? Because the Church Christ founded to be protected by the Holy Spirit in teachings of faith and morals agrees with me.

I believe the heresy you are promoting is that of the Montanists. It is not new.

[CJKTARA]

Hi ya do you have a transcript for the Cardinals speech? Kind regards, Chris

[crafter111]

All Medjugorje fanatics take note of what this good Bishop is saying, one of the reported messages of the Virgin to the seers was that the local Bishop was wrong in denouncing the apparitions and that he would be punished if he did not repent! do you really believe that our Lady would dare to speak like this against an Apostle of the church?

[vitrohon]

The Vatican must also have decided that the bishop was wrong because they took away his prerogative of ruling on the authenticity of the apparitions!

[mercychaplet]

The local bishops authority was NOT "removed" - all that is happening is that the Vatican is investigating the behavior of the Franciscans who are rebelling against the local bishop. They will NOT rule on an apparition that is still ongoing. In the meantime - the bishop has the authority in his diocese - unless he is removed as a bishop. Period. And both the current bishop AND his predicessor have stated that these apparitions are not valid.

[apeygirl]

@mercychaplet Exactly. I wish people would understand that. What bishop wouldn't want Our Lady to truly appear in his diocese? It's not like he's being petty. He's trying to protect people from receiving invalid sacraments from priests whose faculties have been suspended. It's such a mess over there. Poor Bishop Peric.

[drexelboy2000]

I went to Medjugorje this year as a believer but as soon as I got there and after I had left, it became painfully obvious that this is a false apparition from the devil. In addition to blatant disobedience to the bishops, the seers and their promotors are living in luxury compared to the intense poverty of other Bosnia-Herzegovinia residents around them. There are many "signs" in Medjugorje such as the smell of roses and a vibrating sun but those are deceptions. Don't go there.

[smile4kenny]

I see him as the next pope..

Thanks for posting

[gothlegion]

i wouldnt mind seeing him as the next pope, i like many of his views on things but i would see him being a very active pope

[McNewC]

So... If people say they saw or felt something in spirit, the church needs to "prove" their experence? Because saying they are lying if the church doesn't believe them, that's crap. Sorry, I can't agree with this man's narrow mind and his shallow heart.

[kolbe1019]

...(sigh) Listen.... Don't Just hear the words... Listen to the first 2 minutes. You must believe Public Revelations i.e. the Word of God. We are not bound to believe your "PRIVATE" revelation and if it contradicts the Word of God then you should not believe it. Talk about a narrow mind and shallow heart... you didn't even listen. You condemned him without even listening. God help you and God bless Cardinal Arinze for preaching the truth in season and out.

[Robvg197]

he will be the next pope, be assured

[cambiata]

I hope so. I really wanted him to be the pope this last time, but I suppose it was not God's will yet. Still, he's not a young man, I hope he lives long enough for it!

[camasta23m]

Let us hope so!

[benaggreyfynn]

Excellent! This is wisdom and truth that must be listened to.

I totally agree, that after 2000 years, we already have a solid foundation of faith, built on Scripture, tradition, public revelations and/or apparitions and as such although some private apparitions are from heaven, we do not need them to base our Faith on. They are like cream on the cake to help us strengthen our Faith, and that is all.

Thank you my friend for this posting. It is a great video.

Welldone and God bless †

[missgreeneyes56]

I think he's wonderful. Our next pope? I'd like to think do.

[FamaNihilEstCelerius]

Cardinal Arinze is wonderful to listen to and one of my favorite people. Thank you for posting this. God bless you!

[1Hope4All]

Excellent video. I've loved Cardinal Arinze for a long time now. He's a wise man. Thanks for posting.

[MarysMyMom]

I love Cardinal Arinze! keep um coming. God Bless.

[StormMarc]

Excellent!  Thanks for sharing.

[thealphacrow]

Lol.

"You want pilgrimage? JERUSALEM! Of course."

I love you Cardinal Arinze.

[FIDESetRATIOihtys]

Great video!

Thank you for posting.

God bless you and keep you forever.