UMvC3 - Tricks & Tech 9 - Firebrand - Death Loop

[zanpakutoman]

wow. I was actually thinking of a team with super skrull and morrigan and was looking for a point character. Guess I found him

[bkzapick]

Wow thats pretty cool...wesker is in for it now...sick and trying of his x factor bullshit

[Sabin41]

That's disgusting.

[Stealth995]

just a few ideas for escaping, i dont really have time to test it out, but how about dante's hammer? and can anyone double jump in time to get out?

[jhvidst2]

@Stealth995 Hammer isn't invul till like frame 14, and double jumps will not get you out. Remember your getting hit by the tenderizer on the first possible frame.

[greggf426]

I'm waiting for an answer to what guamcards asked. I can't maintain the timing to charge h and catch them and am wondering if that's why you dash and whiff h?

[jhvidst2]

@greggf426 Sorry for the delay, The wifed H is for timing, the dash is for positioning. You call the assist before the dash though. So the dash is necessary, the whiffed H is not.

[Dragonslayer9]

@jhvidst2 Have you tried this vs people that can double jump, fly or teleport?

[jhvidst2]

@Dragonslayer9 You get hit by tenderizer on the first frame, so anything that isn't frame 1 invul won't work.

[guamcards]

Whiff h then charge missile? Is dashing necessary? I mean your calling the assist during the dash right?

[guamcards]

@jhvidst2 timing is really tough. To confirm, do u do SnapBack, dash+tenderizer

[StrayVice]

Please make something on effective x23 combos since she can't faint loop more than once now and the jump loop almost makes follow up impossible nice work by the subbed

[MrDnj80]

Im assuming when you are snapped in i think you are only allowed one air command i.e block or attack so force them to block the lock down assist and catch them as they fall out of their block .

[scandiumtrioxide]

Gold Hsien-Ko would also be able to get out of it.

[Orsinite]

@scandiumtrioxide Who the fuck is Hsien-Ko?

[kilo15]

@Orsinite what? you never played mvc3? shes a jiangshi from the old darkstalkers game morrigan and felicias in.

[Orsinite]

@kilo15 i know this, im just saying who plays her lol. shes so rare

[kilo15]

@Orsinite oh wow LOL i use her first day is still is one of my mains in this game.I do like her as a character,and she deserves some love atleast.

[SolidSnakeRules]

and there's no chance of trading with the tenderizer? what if you have a double jump or air dash? can you make the tenderizer miss or at least partially miss and screw up the combo? what about air dragon punches ala chun li, x-23, morrigan etc?

[shkamarustorm]

What would advance Guarding the assist do?

[Kamukix]

@shkamarustorm nothing, the reason why he's using the lockdown assist is because you can't advance guard an assist (they won't move back at all), which gives him time for the full charge of his move.

Kei

[shkamarustorm]

@Kamukix Ok that's what I was wondering  Thanks

[kazumauno]

Fire brand is beast

[TheCJRhodes]

This music isn't Tech 9



[BDDterror]

No ironman on umvc3 the mvc3 vid you made helped me alot need to make new one with the changes

[devilsadvocate1080]

I haven't tried it, but there might be another way to get out of this. If Spider-Man is the character to get snapped-in, use Maximum Spider before blacking Tenderizer. MaxSpider doesn't have invincibility, though, so you might get hit. If you do, you could DHC into a GROUND hyper that has invincibility. And of course, the Firebrand player could just snap Spider-man in last, but still. Thoughts?

[Kamukix]

@devilsadvocate1080 In that situation you can't DHC into anything because you were just snapped in, which leaves you unable to DHC or call assists for at least 4 seconds.

Kei

[freckleburger]

Mist as the BGM. Godlike. Almost as godlike as this loop

[C3lticlord]

Very informative video, the only reason I want to buy UMVC3 is for Firebrand >.< he looks so sick!

[ESintu3]

If they decide to patch the game again I bet this will be gone.

[Skeezklax]

So, I don't play Firebrand, but I was just wondering, why is his 623C an unblockable in this situation? Maybe I'm just not understanding the term...

[jhvidst2]

@Skeezklax If FIrebrand fully charges his 623C is becomes ublockable. It's just a property of the move.

[GalaxYSmokaH4Trilli0]

I don't understand why I cant block? This don't look like no unblockable to me!!

[jhvidst2]

@GalaxYSmokaH4Trilli0 Firebrand's 623C is unblockable when fully charged.

[SomethingRules]

disgusting

[Suetakefan]

Oh god yes that SMT music...lovin' it!!

[seenextpage]

Can't you cross over counter out of the unblockable?

[MegaDoogles]

@seenextpage Because of the snapback, you can't do anything involving your assist characters for a few seconds, including crossover counter.

[jhvidst2]

@MegaDoogles Even if you could, you can't use a dead angle in the air anyways.

[salindy13]

Wait, you can't just simply hold back to avoid being hit by the swoop?

[Tayl1rYT]

@salindy13 Nope, the swoop is unblockable when charged up.

[SirFickDace]

they could do advanced guard...

[HybridDarkSephiroth]

@SirFickDace Doesnt work on assists, it only pushes back character you are playing and there you aren't attacking but your assist is.

[GalaxYSmokaH4Trilli0]

@SirFickDace Exactly and who doesn't advance guard nowadays? I know Frank West can put you in a infinite block stun but if you advance guard you can get out for free? I don't see why you cant just simply block or advance guard the tenderizer I don't think this would work on me.

[jhvidst2]

@GalaxYSmokaH4Trilli0 You can't pushblock an assist... Come on people, I'm tired of responding to this one.

[SmokeyAmp]

Surely any double jump character can just x-factor guard stun at the end of assist and jump out?

[supernovajm]

As a non-firebrand player, I want to dislike this video... but as a fighting game enthusiast, It's the most brilliant thing I've ever seen

[nawhz]

ive created a team in heroes and heralds for this exactly. It works in that mode much easier because the megaman card makes it so that it takes less time to charge the unblockable and another card I have gives you meter for doing a successful snap in so this can be done infinitely in Heros and Heralds.

[jhvidst2]

@nawhz Lol... your mean... :)

[C3lticlord]

@nawhz you have won the game

[nawhz]

@C3lticlord After playing H&H for some time I've learned that hitting with the unblockable only works if opponent is on the ground because there are nerfs applied to this game mode such as down aeial exchanges not causing a hard knock down, and firebrands unblockable doesnt cause the opponent to spiral until hitting the ground. They pop out of the set up during these, and even recover much more quickly after getting hit with berserker slash. Total bullshit imo.

[Z3r0Sk83r]

four thousandth favorite, because not even YouTube can hold Firebrand.

[RecFilmz]

Umvc3 - Tricks & Tech 10 - Frank West - Smile

[acidglow]

Can't you air teleport as you're tagged in? wesker, dante...

[jhvidst2]

@acidglow Nope. Teleports actually have alot of startup. You'll just get hit... and die.

[demitrinarrow]

Props for the Persona music.

[IndigoR]

The best option to beat this tactic is to not play such a retarded and hackneyed game.

No one should be surprised with the broken shit that comes out every other day in this game anymore. The core design of the MVC3 engine is to accommodate bullshit like this until it is patched ad infinitum and subsequently made into another banal version.

Capcom: Rinse, Lather, Repeat... and most importantly- PROFIT!

[jelaninoel]

I can't believe this is news to everyone. From the moment I heard he had an unblockable attack, the first thing that came to mind was cold star and tenderizer assist. I honestly thought this was common knowledge.

[Idlevice]

I assume no air dashes, Spencer's grapple, RR's skates, teleports etc. work? Does in need to be an invincible super rather than just an invincible move? Can't think of any air ones, though...

[Beshir111]

The Persona 4 music alone was enough to make me subscribe.

[SamDrugbringer]

@Beshir111 Thanks, it was driving me crazy trying to remember where this music was from.

[omgcandy16Kimicari0]

KAW KAW KAW TIER SHIT RIGHT HERE

[dooku9876]

Have you tested if Joe can escape this? Air six cannon has frame 1 invul according to the guide.

[Sloth7d]

More ToD cheapness. This is Budokai 3 all over again.

[daveythesurfer]

This is an exploit right? In mw3 u get banned for using exploits

[lucisnow]

@daveythesurfer No exploits. everything in the combo is as intended, and as designed. While this setup is kind of bullshit in a way (and kind of awesome in another) there is no breaking of mechanics going on here. When Chris G pulls this off at the next major the internet is going to explode, and it's all perfectly legal.

[C3lticlord]

@lucisnow yeah, I hope ChrisG sticks with his Firebrand team and doesn't replace him with Wesker.

[TheArmOS]

wouldnt even the loop where they get hit eventually be meter positive bc characters would start dying and each time a char died you would get a free unblockable?

Also if they had a char who could get out you could just avoid that character when doing the snaps and kill the other two.

[airamanddex]

subbed

[hedgehog547]

holy crap my day one team for umvc3 was firebrand frank and skrull that perfectly fits for the loop, thank you for the idea time to grind in the lab for a while :)

[TheArmOS]

favoriting this video for the godlike persona music

[Rikortez]

Why the fuck did they give firebrand that unallocable move.

[Shockeled]

Damn. I'm really glad I subbed to you...

[stryflyer]

God I remember the first week a dude ran a firebrand, dorm, morrigan team that looped snapbacks...shit blew my mind.

[Kyubi888Naruto]

Been a long time since I thought Marvel 3 tech was as dumb as Marvel 2 stuff...and I use Firebrand lol.

[Kyubi888Naruto]

@Kyubi888Naruto

wait couldn't Morrigan use Shadow blade upone entry?

[jhvidst2]

@Kyubi888Naruto Not invulnerable. Won't work.

[BDDterror]

Can u make a dorm vid

[jhvidst2]

@BDDterror I'd have to learn Dorm first... So it could be a while...

[zomgimonfire5000]

Shoutouts to Persona music.

[OdiIon616]

C.Viper EX Burning Kick?

[jhvidst2]

@OdiIon616 No invulnerable, just fast. It won't work.

[skisonic]

I've been working on this but having trouble with the positioning. Cool stuff, you used the exact word I use for when they take the hit, "finicky" lol. I've been waiting for a visual aid.

I like your vids, keep it up imo. Succinct, Informative, Well-done.

[jhvidst2]

@skisonic You'll notice in the vid i always wiff a 5C before I do the unblockable. That's how I'm keeping my timing consistent, accurate, and stable.

[Boodendorf]

Oh I know! Using any character that can air super, maybe DHC really quickly into a ground super that wouldn't neceserally be invincible?

[OdiIon616]

@Boodendorf Can't DHC as soon as you're tagged in.

[jhvidst2]

@Boodendorf Still need an invulnerable air hyper, at which point why not just let it rock.

You can't DHC until after startup, so you'd just get hit if your air hyper didn't have invul.

[dhtjlghks]

@Boodendorf you cant dhc right after youve been snapped out - assists are on cooldown

[trysephiroth007]

@Boodendorf You can't do anything involving your other characters when a character gets snapped in or comes in after a character is killed for a few game seconds. No DHC, crossover counter, nothing like that.

[magneticmagnum]

No, seriously, why did you have to post this video?

[Kamukix]

@magneticmagnum This is not the first time this setup has been shown, it's already been used with thousands of people watching at a tourney. However this video IS out there to try to find a way around it, so it's great that it's been posted.

Kei

[killerkord]

I won't have access to my lab for a day or two but can't someone with a heavy S or d.H make it out by advancing guard the tenderizer really quick and hitting the floor before you can swoop in? Vergil comes to mind, successfully advancing the first hit of tenderizer and then his down H which should have better reach than firebrand's swoop?

Just off the top of my head

[jhvidst2]

@killerkord Pushblocking assists doesn't do anything.

[raginghell14]

@killerkord pushblocking assist dont work

[Geekandcool]

The Mist, Persona 4.

Gotta love it <3

[DeviantProtagonist]

God, the music makes this tech even more ominous.

[MRVLTheMartyr]

Amaterasu?

[BlazeTaktix]

nothing happens to the point char. (firebrand) if you push block the assist. you people should know that!

[arelaz01]

Someone on Medina4life stream does this and I saw it like last week, it's so lame..

Great choice of music btw I love P4

[AeonsOfFrost]

Karsticles had a variant of this loop, using Firebrand/Dormammu/Morrigan.

[RoundOrangeBox]

@AeonsOfFrost That was my first thought, so then doesnt that make this old? lol

[jhvidst2]

@RoundOrangeBox I didn't invent it, but I didn't see any video covering the technique yet so I figured it was good territory for my little series. This shit is seriously not fair.

Also, it is escapable with alot of characters with Dormammu, but the flip side is Dorm>Skrull.

[RoundOrangeBox]

@jhvidst2 Still ain't much more fair even with Dorm, lol

[jhvidst2]

@RoundOrangeBox I agree. This is the first thing I've seen in a long time that I think should be patched. Marvel has alot of overpowered BS, but this really violates the sanctity of the game. But who knows, give it a few majors, we'll see what happens. I know some top players subscribe, so they will at least be seeing this. And I've heard there are a few players abusing this already too.

[kunal5]

push block tenderizer?

[goldw1993]

@kunal5 You can't pushblock assists.

[shiken]

@kunal5 you can't pushblock assists

[pukey]

I'm not at console atm so excuse me if I'm totally wrong or if this sounds stupid... But what happens if you advance guard the tenderizer? or can't assists be ag'd?

[jhvidst2]

@pukey You can, but it won't help. In fact, it makes it less likely that the Firebrand player will screw up as you best hope is that he miss-times it thus that you touch the ground and can XFC>Reversal.

[yrsmilekillsme]

ah i saw this in the forums when ultimate dropped but i really had no idea what it looked like

this is pretty intense lol

[BlahBitchBitch]

Someone was using this on me online the other day.

I cried, there was no way out.

[cg219]

So the move just defies all blocking?? I havent run into many firebrands. And the ones I did arent too good, so I've never seen it before.

[NeoThePaladinOfLight]

lol, "You could do this, but you'll probably still die. You could do this, but not even I could do it. Oh, but you could definitely do this, if you happen to be using 1 of the only 3 characters that can." I love it.

[thejuggernaut81]

Soooo glad I subscribe to this guy. The text in 3:02 alone should tell you just how dangerous this tech really is.

[Boodendorf]

Hmmmm, perhaps a long ranged air normal (maybe Task's air H?) or maybe a super coming out fast enough like Super Nova? Or maybe Spencer's atk+S to touch skrull?

[jcw034]

I was waiting to see this video after all the debate going on about this in the Balanced/Tier threads now that i see this this is quite the nuisance lol

[EviltoasterofFP]

Could double jumpers get out? It looked like Sentinel was high enough to just jump out.

Either way, this is pretty good. Hopefully now people will stop complaining about Firebrand doing 'no damage.'

[jhvidst2]

@EviltoasterofFP Nope. Tenderizer catches them on the first frame, the only option is a reversal.

[Imozart0341I]

@EviltoasterofFP Firebrand went from doing no damage to killing entire teams. hahaha

[sibladeko]

@EviltoasterofFP So your answer instead would be...

"Firebrand doesn't do damage."

"Oh that's easy, give up playing whatever existing team you had and sacrifice one of your assists to gain meter and you can do damage against non-Sentinel non-Phoenix teams if your assists never die."

Right.

[Kyubi888Naruto]

@EviltoasterofFP

I think this is a good option if you think your opponent is messing up the timing slightly. If you char has a double jump, the timing for this has to be really good. I wonder if there are any assists that last long enough for the timing to not be so strict. (Off my head I was thinking eye of mogamoto, or whatever it's called, but I'm not sure it hits high enough).

[ParalysisProductions]

Oh god.

We are all COMPLETELY SCREWED.

Seriously, do capcom even test these games, first wesker, now this.

[EviltoasterofFP]

@ParalysisProductions I'm sure Capcom was well aware this was possible with Firebrand.

[Matr1xninJa]

Was just about to sleep :D