Ron Paul: Saving The American Health Care System Part 1

[anisocoro]

In my view there are some things,perhaps very difficult to understand, that create difficulties in US healthcare system

a)the absence of a powerful general practitioner who can stop the unuseful expenditures by knowing the patient since many years b)the diffuse practise of "defensive medicine" that forces doctors to prescribe dozens of examinations clinically not rilevant. They are not useful, but very expensive

c)the high level of debt of Doctors, who loose the indipendence

[cpriorful]

bush did the same thing they are all the same. Ron Paul seems like the only one

who stands up for his beliefs and not the party

[wakeupsweden2]

Ron paul is the guy, still can´t belive how Obama maneged too fool america.

[ricanlegend203]

Our American healthcare system is weak.

[DInara1999]

IN BRITAIN: A children's doctor cut out 90 per cent of a baby's bladder after she mistook the organ for a hernia during a bungled hospital operation, a medical tribunal heard today.

Consultant paediatric surgeon Dr Pierina Kapur, 43, failed to recognise the hernia when she carried out the operation on the seven-week-old baby girl, it was alleged.

[hunter128933]

@DInara1999 what accident like that don't happen in the us? your kidding ain't you? i rather me or my family die from an accident rather then being turned away or flat out denied any help at all

[illuminaz1]

to all american and others who want to see a very good documentary about american healthcare with michael more.

[whiff1962]

Thinking of the bureaucratic overlay needed to run a national healthcare system, for a diverse population of some 300 million Americans, well, the mind boggles. A disentangling of govt. meddling in the healthcare and insurance system, with a concomitant reassertion of a self-regulating, and competitive free-market, will foster greater choice for the consumer, as well as lower costs of healthcare and insurance. Americans spend more on healthcare because it is effectively a govt. cartel.

[austcan519]

american government carnt even look after their own people for free the cunts.thank god im not an american.

[MyDormantSoul]

@austcan519 we as industrialized democracies are all sitting in the same boat. greece and ireland are already bankrupt, while Britain, US, Canada, and Spain are facing that likely hood as well.

[hadenufnow]

Kill the 3000 pg Illlegal HC TAX & JAIL Trojan Horse Mandate Bill nobody wants..

Kill the bill..

Vote em out..

nobody wants it..

[Jessecraft1954]

I have lost so much of the respect I once had for the American Government. Borrow money for college and it`s like paying back loan sharks. The sell and resell your loans for higher interest rates. Lose your job and you have no healthcare. We pay for criminals to have free everything including cable tv and then we have to pay for women who have six children by six different men. When does it stop. When does the tax payer get something back from the taxes the pay in? fed up.

[geewhiz76]

@Jessecraft1954 - then perhaps yoru country should review the misspent funds. look how much america spends on military and weapons. wouldnt it be better spent on healthcare for all of its citizens?

[DInara1999]

@geewhiz76 I think that would be enough for people with disabilites, but everybody else should work.....The thing is that too many people want a high quality healthcare for free.....Universalhealthcare would mean that all Americans would have a horrible healthcare without a choice.

[geewhiz76]

@DInara1999 no, it doesn't mean that at all. the american public has been brainwashed.

[hunter128933]

@DInara1999 thats a straight out lie and if american company keep thier business in the states then there might be enough work to go around. as soon as a company gets big it sack the american worker and send it to one of the third world countries.maybe youse should start blaming big business instead of the people, most unemploted people relly do want to improve thier lives.here in OZ we have plenty of jobs but it's still hard for even professionals to get work

[scott04la]

If the free market were given a chance to thrive, it would trump any socialized healthcare. It's unlikely that it will get a chance as everything gets lost in the bureaucracy of our broken government.

[amanuscarr]

Exactly! Nature must be allowed to run its course. No more intervening in the natural economic process that the free market allows to exist and thrive.

[hunter128933]

@amanuscarr money before humans. "the LOVE of money is the root of all evil" so the free market must thive while the unfortunates dies 

[eugene680]

" Money is what makes the world go round ". Only a rich snob would believe that because they can afford anything. I don't believe it either, money is evil. It controls everyone's decisions making nowadays. If money never existed but we've found a better way for the world go round, it would be a much happier place. It would probably be the same as Heaven.

[hunter128933]

first thing this Ron dude says is the health care can't be sustained is a lie Australia gov pumps money into private & public health and we are out of recession we are the only country in the world to report economic growth we value life over money. health should be a right for all not a privilege just for the few

[DInara1999]

@hunter128933 Australia....well, they has people who are working. Now think how many people you have in the USA who are staying at home on welfare and getting medicare.... Single mothers who have 2-5 kids and get foodstamps....Too many people who want to get stuff for free....Illegals who give birth to their children in hospitals with all comforts for free....why they are not sent back home right from the hospitals? US has many people who want to get everything for free

[hunter128933]

@DInara1999 we to have the umemployed, age care, single mothers pension, illegal immigrants & junkies\alco's who don't want to work & just want a free handout (and they get it) but we stayed out of recession & our dollar is tip to overtake the greenback (US dollar) by xmas & we'll be back in the black in 2 years..youse are being lie to when they say it not affordable

[DInara1999]

@hunter128933 WHY? You want doctors work almost for free? Would you agree for free? Doctor provide a service and it should be paid well. It shouldn't be cheap because you want it to be that way. Nobody tells you to work for others....

[hunter128933]

@DInara1999 doctors who bulk bill are reimbursed by the government doctors here are very well paid & are very wealthy. youse are being lie to when they say it not affordable

[rottentomatoes100]

You are right, Pinnertop.

For example, how many of us know that although the term "health care" is commonly used both as noun as well as adjective, the preferred usage is: health care (a two-word non-hyphenated term) for noun, and healthcare or health-care (in one-word form or hyphenated form) for adjective.

Examples:

1. Everyone needs health care (noun, a compound noun).

2. Our healthcare (adjective) system (noun) is inefficient.

Similarly: home page and homepage.

[Pinnertop]

Why is it that so many Americans seem incapable of having any sort of discussion about anything very much without resorting to abusive language and generally bad grammar and spelling? I can only think that this is as a result of a poor education. Most civilised countries think that Health Care is a fundamental human right.

[marcsmancrusader]

that's because americans are a bunch of arrogant and ignorant assholes who still doesn't want any type of reform, considering the fact they're in a recession already.

arrogant indeed

[Pinnertop]

Goodness I am glad I live in Europe. Our NHS is the best thing that we have. My parents were looked after wonderfully and I am proud to live in a country that cares for all its people. Americans why on earth are you not demanding something similar?

[freedombiteback]

NHS in the UK is un-fit for Purpose !.Zip / Post code Lottery at best, and a means of Culling the old and sick (burden on Society !! )......Do a quick search on the New World Order (NWO) and see how deep this rabbit hole goes....

[m8cct]

Because a lot of Americans feel that providing health care for all citizens, no matter how admirable, is not a proper role for government. There is another, very different and much more sustainable way of improving the U.S health system, through very different means, such as the policies presented here.

[DInara1999]

@Pinnertop because it's pathetic..... we are adults who take care of themselves

[exp10rer]

in a socialized system, those people abusive about their health gets a care they want without paying any money...those who don't abuse have to line on cue with the same people who are abusive because that's how the system works. so if you are sick although not abusive of your health, but needs urgent attention because it's a matter of life and death may end up dead just because one has to wait in the waiting list which is the reality in free healthcare system.

[hunter128933]

what about poor people that don't abuse thier body?

[DInara1999]

@hunter128933 can't they work?

[TheRockville]

doctor who gives a damn soon enough but I still wouldn't trade our system. One time I went to the hospital with food poisoning, first time. Was in emergency with about 30 other aching people. 6hrs later finally got in and find out all it took was a gravol pill to clear it up. It sucked but in the U.S. knowing that I would have to pay... I think a lot of people down there might have tried ride it out and risk it but then you'd be dead right. I'd say our system vs yours is 60/40 pro vs con.

[TheRockville]

I can tell you in all honesty here in Toronto Canada it can be rough. The doctor swipes that health card and a lot of times can care less what's wrong with you cuz they've been paid. I went to 9 doctors and two doctors due to a pain in the knee never to find out what was actually wrong with it. I had to do research myself and it's either bursitis or tendonitis. I've considered going to the states to pay and find out once and for all, but I don't have that kind of money. I hope I'll find a

[8motion]

Trust..me..many other areas..walk in, get help walk out, no bills... it is really a reality , I hope for the U.S next generation gets a chance to experience a better quality of life.

[8motion]

Does anyone have any personal experience with Health Care systems outside the U.S? Even with the best system..there is no Pill to solve your problems.. got to change the way you live, Eat healthy, have a balance life..work, family.. you never see a unhealthy obese person living very long..so..look outside the U.S and get a perspective that's honest. Even if you had all the insurance ( you think) they insurance companies will deny you coverage,,

[jackolini]

Squire You are one dumb fuck I don't know why I am responding to your utterly retarded post. No it's not a right, you have to PAY for health care, just like FOOD, SHELTER, and CLOTHING. At least for now in this country you do, until it goes communist, you have to still pay for shit in a capitalist country.

Now go beat off to your Fidel Castro pictures.

[SquireDonCristobal]

jackolini....Make up your mind 'it isnt a right' - is it all charity then ? Look you already made yourself look foolish enough - your not likely to let anything like the truth get in the way of that crayon infested logic. For those who dont have any crayons there - just have a browse and find the websites for NHS UK and read Wikepedia too - everyone except jackolini will find it at least interesting or hopefully enlightening.

[jackolini]

Health care isn't a right dipshit. And nobody, not even illegal aliens in this country get turned away from health care.

Now go beat off to your Fidel Castro pictures.

[windwatcher89]

i think medicine should be practiced by those who really have a passion for it. but i dont think theres enough doctors willing to lower prices for patients. most doctors want the profit more than to help people. unfortunately thats what the whole disease of the human race is, just greed. its nobodys fault in particular. but obamas plan isnt going to help. its gonna create more debt and more inflation. medicare is just a ponzi scheme. ron paul has a much better plan imo.

[SquireDonCristobal]

I see you also forgot to mention how the US hospitals are now 'DUMPING' their expired Insurance patients on the local charity hospitals by TAXI ? When you ever manage to get the crayon from your brain I think you'll begin to understand that 'some' people care about others and not just their own selves - something so many of you countryman have done naturally for a LONG time - just not YOU !

[jackolini]

LOL squaire you are a complete idiot. Yeah people don't get treated in the United States, the uninsured are dying in the streets every day. That is news to me.

Michael Moore's sicko showed Cuba's health care system for the ELITE, NOT THE AVERAGE CUBAN OFF THE STREET. I suppose you think that if you are an average cuban citizen, driving a car from the 1950s, isn't going to have to be placed on a waiting list for a major illness, THEN YOU ARE FUCKING DELUSIONAL.

[SquireDonCristobal]

When you get beyond the age of playing video games you might - just MIGHT start to find some intelligent thinking inside your 'crayon infested' brain. The point that was made is that NOBODY - even in Cuba is TURNED AWAY BECAUSE THEY DONT HAVE INSURANCE. I have no doubt at all that many people DO die in the streets in the US but far more die at home because they DONT HAVE HEALTH CARE !

I do note you completely IGNORED all the other relevant points in the film-FRANCE,UK etc etc - why's that ???

[SquireDonCristobal]

Just in case it still escapes your comprehension - if a smaller proportion of people get treated then the survivors become a higher proportion. And I may add that Britains health service is no longer anywhere near the best in Europe either and yet still far better than the gamble US citizens have to take with their insurance which is fine until you get ILL !

[jackolini]

Yeah Europe's health care is so great. That's why Britian has an 18% higher morality rate of surviving a major illness than in the United States. You are more likely to survive 12 out the 15 major cancers in the United States then anywhere else in the world.

Get your facts straight before you post dipshit.

[SquireDonCristobal]

NO you get your facts straight DIPSHIT ! Remember your US figures ONLY apply to those who get treated - NOT those who cant afford it - they are not considered -EVERYONE gets treated in Europe - FACT. As for Cuba - DESPITE the US embargo which has lasted almost 50 YEARS it can STILL treat people for FREE ! When the day comes you need healthcare and your insurance is either declined or runs out (you know - when your get older than 26) I bet you scream about how UNFAIR it is then !

[jackolini]

You have to be high as fuck right now if you think Cuba has a better health care system than the United States.

If Cuba, it's government, and health care system are so great, then why the fuck do people every day risk their lives floating over here on janky rafts?

And health care isn't only for the wealthy, it's for the people who WORK for a living, contribute something to society. Of the 46 million uninsured, 12 million are illegal aliens who don't belong here in the first place.

[SquireDonCristobal]

So I guess the other 34 million can go fuck themselves then as far as you care ? I wonder what your day will be like when you lose your job and health insurance ? Or maybe your IN the health Insurance business - well that would explain all the crap you spout !

[SquireDonCristobal]

Please remember the quality of the health care 'available' to most Americans will be limited to their Insurance. When that runs out - you DIE ! Throughout europe you will find the highest quality health care available in the world - but it just may not include cable TV(although most do) and 24 hour room service at $5K a day. Please dont take offence but its stunning how little Americans know of the world outside their borders-its almost like the old USSR !!!

[SquireDonCristobal]

ermmm-I'm really not quite sure what your disagreeing with?So socialised health is cheaper than private then so its not fair to compare it?Then you says it doesnt regard the 'quality' of that care even though the highest quality of such care is only available to very few Americans who can afford?Who is telling you this rubbish about poor quality health care outside the US-yes Insurance companies etc?I suggest you watch "SICKO" BY Michael Moore for the TRUTH! You'll find even CUBA have better!

[jackolini]

The 37th ranking is complete bullshit. You should see the criteria used for that ranking. 25% of it's ranking is financial fairness which basically favors socialized medical care. Since we are still a somewhat free marker country, guess where we rank in that area?

The ranking is biased because it is basically about the overall fairness of health care, not the quality.

[SquireDonCristobal]

It may also be of interest for you to know that where a pioneering treament IS available in the US or ANYWHERE. Many countries with 'SOCIAL HEALTH PROGRAMS' send their patients FREE OF CHARGE' to those as well ! No country in the world can offer EVERY treatment YET !

[rwilb2]

Well, David Walker failed. Americans voted for a socialist who wants to spend trillions on national health care (including for 20 million illegal immigrants) just as soon as he finishes bailing out bankers and failed automobile manufacturers.

[tencz57]

he'll bail out anyone or anything but the citizen .

in Ron Paul i trust . Jails would have been full if he'ld elected . White collar crooks in doing hard time . Watch the soap bubba

[MakeLoveWarNot]

Spread the word -The Second American Revolution has begun

[MakeLoveWarNot]

Spread the word -The Second American Revolution has begun

Google Jeff Fisher Ron Paul WOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Salagrae]

it's funny but i've actually seen a graph with this gap in the increase of relatives before. i made a graph showing the increase in the cost of food production versus the increase in food cost. i found that over 75% of the increase in overall food cost from as far back as i could find data for was in the marketing, packaging and processing, not production. inflation in both insurance and food have been due to marketing these needs not the cost of the need itself.

[Salagrae]

cuba is number one but france is not far behind. cuba may be number one because of their huge contribution to free healthcare to third world countries. its sad that a country so small contributes not only more to underserved countries, but to their own people as well. we spend 4 trillion fighting iraq while our people are pauperized by healthcare costs. it is no longer the fear of age's poor health that the elderly dread...it is the health care

[eurohim]

"and how much do we have?" "zip"

I wish it were that promising. More like in the negative trillions.

[PeelTower]

As a Brit whith full healthcare and dental care (free at the point of use) I think Americans should be ashamed of their callous indifference to their people.

The richest country on earth? I don't think so. You are a nation full of divisions. Enamoured of obscene wealth at the expense of the majority. You guys should go online ( to an internet cafe if you don't have a home computer) and check if medical insurance companies fund your candidates. If they do, don't vote for them. You have the power

[foxfairness]

the problem is our government and our society in general is so volatile that wont due

[floridasandy]

i don't think british subjects should be lecturing us on how we do anything. your bond rating is about to drop again and your own debt level is worse than ours.

america has done more than any other country in the world in providing medicine and medical technology to the rest of the world!

[SquireDonCristobal]

No-the US has NOT done more than the rest of the world - thats false and a total lie. What the US offers is the most EXPENSIVE health care not the best. Inevitably there are some areas of health research that a country as big as the US has advanced further in than others but only SOME NOT ALL.Since British subjects have created a health care system which treats all without regard to status and regardless of their illness how can that be bad except for Insurance executives? Stop deluding yourself

[floridasandy]

why do people come to america for health treatment that they cannot get in their own country?

[SquireDonCristobal]

There are some medical proceedures which are sometimes only availabel to the RICH. Guess why that is ? BECAUSE they cost a small fortune much like heart transplants once did. Why do you think people travelled to South Africa once for those ? Pioneering treatments in ANY country attract the wealthy FIRST and those people travel to MANY OTHER COUNTRIES not just the USA. Why do have this illusion that people are 'pouring' into the US for treatment ? Who is telling you this rubbish ?

[SquireDonCristobal]

So why do US citizens travel to CANADA for treatment they CANNOT AFFORD in the USA?

[SquireDonCristobal]

I suspect more sick Americans are interested in the fact that the US is now 37th in the world league of health care than a Briton is about the value of their bond? Worrying about 'Trillions' of $'s being spent on the health care of US citizens is nonsense - its ALREADY being spent but going into the pockets of Insurance executives instead of paying for health treatment. It would merely be a redirection of those resources. DOH !!!

[murdertil10]

look on wiki it says cuba i googled it and that was the answer

[mossbergmaniac1947]

*facepalm* the minute you use wiki as a source is the minute you lose all credibility.

[432player]

There is nothing wrong with the american healthcare system as the most advaced in the world.

Practicaly the repression has altered the danger of government controlled health care attempts, what seems to be better for the naive.

In other words, we cant afford to get into ruining ourself even further than it happens by the complex world financial circumstances .

As philantrop imperialism, we can stay firm on the best that was possible.

[murdertil10]

except your average life expectancy is 3 or 4 years below me and im british most advanced in the world bah! your ranked right next to ukraine 47th in the world believe it or not the cubans have the worlds best healthcare

[fivefingerdp]

Im pretty sure France was ranked number one.

[foxfairness]

the only reason everyone else lives longer is because of our lifestyles, not our healthcare

[mossbergmaniac1947]

Thats because of all the fattys here.

[Godson2O]

The American Goverment's existence is travesty to all human life. Someone save us.

[murdertil10]

Its also funny how all the siko vids are gone

[murdertil10]

It's pretty obvious why the american government dont want universal healthcare, im British it cost's our government £100billion a year to run the NHS thats for about 60 million people america has like 300 million people just do the maths. your rich but your government couldnt keep it up for ever they'd rather spend it on weapons and war

[LGJamster]

The American economy is also proportionally bigger than the UK's, so in my opinion that argument should not be used by American politicians or anyone.

The NHS is far from perfect but if I had a choice between having a heart attack in the UK and the USA the UK will win every time.

Life saving Healthcare should not be run for profit ever, plastic surgery YES, heart bypass surgery NO

[murdertil10]

im not saying your government couldnt afford it just saying they can spend billions developing new ways to kill people but cant spend a penny on creating ways to save lives.

[dantae666]

good to see there is al least one sensible person in america angry ram guys i live in the uk i dont spend thousands on health care i take the 2 3 grand i dont spend on health care when i get sick and have 5 star holidays in the caribbean,egypt my perscription charges also ony cost me 14 dollars for at least one months supplie of drugs for all drugs do the maths people

[dantae666]

maybey if you kicked out the insurnce companies and have a system paid for by taxes you would all be happier

[owchywawa]

We don't want the government to control our money.

[AngryRam1]

yea becoz they dont alreay control it... stupid.

[murdertil10]

Your the most government controlled country on this earth you have to pledge your alliegence to the flag ive never done that in my life im patriotic but not brainwashed

[owchywawa]

I am not submitted to my country. I am submitted to the ideal of freedom.

[foxfairness]

political correctness rules america and you are correct here

[AngryRam1]

Wish i could give u 4 thumbs up.

[annboylyn]

LIVE AND LET LIVE. RON PAUL 2008

[DaveDoggOwns]

Maybe if we didn't subsidize Big Agri (who genetical modify their crops)

Maybe if we didn't put fluoride in our water

Maybe if didn't drink diet soda (which has aspartame and phenalahyde)

Maybe if we didn't eat as much MSG

we would have a better healthcare system.

[longtallsallie08]

I should be able to at least get a mammogram and a physical without paying 1000 dollars okay? doesnt have anything to with me what i'm eating if I cant even get INITIAL services without coming out of pocket with a ridiculous amount of money. god forbid I actually get sick

[BeanGene]

DaveDoggOwns: Is not blaming you personally for your diet. He is trying to expand your knowledge about Genectically Modified Foods. The hazards of fluoride in tap water and aspartame in tons of sugar free foods. This is for you to discover. Just as it is up to you to research how government helps jack prices and limit options. Universal Healthcare is monopolization not humanitarian or cheap healthcare.

[ZeroDisease]

Thanks for spreading the truth! If you're going to share any link on the web, you should share this one!

[ZeroDisease]

-- GO RON PAUL!!!!

Dr. Stephen E. West's father also ran for Lt Governor with the same party as Bo Gritz in 1992.

They planned to revamp the FDA and revamp our monitary system back in compliance with the Constitution and what our founding fathers died for! Why Kennedy was assasinated - he was going to do the same thing with our monitary system! GO RON PAUL!!!!!! He sticks his neck out for all of us - let's give him the attention, respect, and support he deserves!!!!!!

[ZeroDisease]

Health care costs have doubled & trippled every ten years since 1950!

Ron Paul is aware of this!

#1 cause of Bankrupcy and 75% have full medical insurance!

Dr. Stephen E. West's father, Dr. C. Samuel West, was heavily pursocuted for teaching the truth and after he was nominated for some nobel prizes in 2003, then a "mysterious accident" in a federal court room on the last day of a 20 year law suit with the IRS, killed him.

Government did nothing to help out the family.

[VermoXL]

Basically Ron Paul has no plan for healthcare. All he says is PAY! PAY! PAY! He is a doctor, he wants your cash, and I understand his motives.

We have this option already.

Dennis Kucinich has a better plan: to get rid of insurance companies and make it not for profit, free for everyone.

Dennis Kucinich for President 2008

[hapspir]

That sounds tempting. However, "free" healthcare is a sly trick. Who is going to pay for the doctors and support staff, to build and maintain the hospitals, and to make the medicine? You, the taxpayer will pay. The bill will be quite high, because central planning is quite inefficient and expensive. Free healthcare is a flagrant misconception.

[disintegratingeden]

You, the taxpayer, also pays for police. And a fire department. And schools. And a public library. And the best part about that, is that all of the taxes that you pay for those fundamentals don't even come close to how much taxes you pay for your president to wage war.

[hapspir]

Yes, the war is a huge waste of lives and money, but it pales in comparison to the cost of Medicare. The U.S. could get better results if our healthcare system were run by clown school dropouts.

[disintegratingeden]

Really? What do you say to Canada? Or France? Or any of the other socialized health care systems? Privatizing health care even MORE, like Ron Paul suggests, does absolutely nothing for those who can't afford health care. More options for new drugs, for instance, doesn't work when the drug company has a patent on that drug for the next 20 years and can charge whatever-the-fuck-price they want.

[hapspir]

One of the main reasons that drug prices are so high is because the development costs are so high. The FDA mandates excessive clinical trials for life-saving drugs, meaning that dying people have no choice but to wait. If there were no patents, the drugs wouldn't get made at all, because the developers couldn't recover the costs.

[disintegratingeden]

And the cause for drugs in Great Britain costing 10 bucks? No matter the drug or the amount?

A 2000 percent markup on drugs isn't necessarily to recover the costs. Especially when the doctor convinces someone that they take it, or die. And sadly, people are naive enough to believe a lot of that.

[hapspir]

And do you think that all cars should cost the same?

In the U.S. the average development time for a new drug is 14 years. That is a loooong time. That is super-expensive. Not many can afford to do that.

Now, many drug companies are making a lot of money. But the tighter you make the laws, the fewer companies there will be, and the more powerful they become. Competition is eliminated.

[disintegratingeden]

I don't understand how cars have to do with it.

And drug companies are competitive? Since when? Look at Prilosec. Before its patent was removed, it was a prescription which cost, through an HMO, 200 dollars a month premium. Patent ends? 4 DOLLARS A MONTH.Same EXACT drug. Why were they able to charge 200 a month? Because they could. And you HAVE to pay for it, because your doctor says it's the only drug that help you. Why is it the only drug? Because there is NO competition for it.

[hapspir]

Right, drug companies are not nearly as competitive as they would be in a free market, because their competition has been pushed out of the market by aggressive regulation.

Cars are a consumer product, just like medicine. It would be folly to set all prices the same in any industry.

[hapspir]

To Canada and France I say: Why do you feel that it is necessary to force people to pay for their medicine? People love medicine. It keeps them from getting sick. And that demand is eagerly met by drug makers who work to satisfy health needs. Stop interfering. Your people can take care of themselves. Use your guns for protection, not for threatening each other into submission.

[disintegratingeden]

Okay. And what do you say to the millions of Americans who can't afford it? And don't fall under any form of Medicaid/Medicare to get it?

And, judging from America's history, and how we react to tragedies, isn't that something that has always been uniquely American? Helping your fellow man? I would gladly pay an increase in taxes to help you if you were sick. Why would you not help me?

[hapspir]

To those who can't afford it, I say: help is on the way; Ron Paul will do everything he can to restore sanity to healthcare (among other things) by restoring the Constitution. Government can't run healthcare, they can barely deliver mail.

[hapspir]

Yes, Americans are very generous people. That is why we used to have charity hospitals. You must understand that forcing charity at gunpoint completely destroys the spirit of it.

You are not my brother, you are my neighbor. Don't expect me to treat you like my brother. I advocate charity, but not slavery.

[disintegratingeden]

I'm sorry that you have such little regard for your fellow countrymen. What ever happened to "ask not what your country can do for you?"

Anyways, I don't see one instance where Ron Paul's healthcare system will help out the lower class. And, considering we have 36 million people under the poverty line, and the gap is getting bigger, I think that's somewhat of an important issue.

[murdertil10]

you really are an idiot, ive never had to worry about paying for medicine or a life or death operation, poor people dont pay at all, thats one of the main reasons the NHS was created so poor prople never had to worry about healthcare i work i pay taxes they are nowhere near as much as u seem to think they are, medicine and cars are nothing to do with eachother you cant put a price an a life,

unless your an American iof course

also the waiting time for a non urgent operation is 6 wks not 1yr+

[hapspir]

Human beings are irreplaceable. You are correct to say that you can't put a price on a life. But you can put a price on life-saving medicine. Only a collectivist would say that the person who saves lives doesn't deserve a monetary reward. Food also saves lives but you must pay the grocer if you want to eat. Calling me an idiot won't change that.

[LGJamster]

No but comparing life saving medical intervention to groceries certainly qualifies you as one.

[hapspir]

"No but comparing life saving medical intervention to groceries certainly qualifies you as one."

Could you be a good sport and tell us a little more about your objection. I know that medicine and food are different. The discipline of medicine requires much more training and much less quantity than food services. But take away either one of them and we would be in deep trouble.

[murdertil10]

its not really the medicine im on about, things like heart operations, life or death operations that if you havnt got insurance, well that doesnt matter cos alot of the insurance companies are corrupt and make excuses not to give u that cover. yeah u pay for food but theres nothing stopping u going out and hunting or picking berries or even growing ur own food. i think you are either over patriotic or you are working for the american government.

[foxfairness]

I personally do not think that in the u.s. single payer would work. The government here is too corrupt and we are to blind too see it. They would probably use beauracracy to say why some things should be done for people.

[angrydragon]

Competition drives costs down, just like with electronics. Government involvment is the reason costs are so high because they limit competition and always have the need to charge the maximum. This is why you have big drug corporations lobby congress to pass laws that favor them. This keeps out competition and drives up costs. Canada has a long waiting list, maybe years.

[disintegratingeden]

Drug corps lobby Congress to give more power to the HMOs and health insurance companies. I understand the idea that all competition works, but not always for the best.

Canada has a long waiting list? YEARS? Where did you get that information? It is known that non-emergency procedures may have to wait up to 15 weeks (like elective or replacement surgeries), but emergency procedures are taken care of in a similar time to the American system. They just don't have to check your wallet first.

[hapspir]

There seems to be some minor confusion. Competition does not involve force. When corps buy power from Congress to gain an advantage over competitors, they aren't competing for customers--they are forcibly taking choices away from customers (through the guns of government). Freedom of choice is the foundation of free market competition.

[disintegratingeden]

That's not what I said at all. The free market works great for everything and everything should be involved in the market. I get it. For those of us who are wealthy, woohoo! We just saved a bundle on... living.

[hapspir]

I think I see the missing piece of the puzzle.

Compared to the richest kings and queens of Medieval Europe, every working person in America is wealthy. We have AC, heat, cars, buses, plumbing, fresh food, e-mail, cell phones, antibiotics, DVDs, etc.

Let me tell you a wonderful secret: wealth is limitless--but only if we are free. That's why we must get our freedom back.

[disintegratingeden]

Wow. We live better than people did 1000 years ago. Our life expectancy is also double that. We don't fear the plague anymore, and I don't shit in a bucket and throw it out my window. Is that supposed to change my mind now? So when somebody falls ill at 40, it's alright if they can't afford the medical care?

No, they lived better than kings! From a fucking thousand years ago...

[hapspir]

I'm trying to inspire a positive attitude. To solve our predicament, we must move forward, not back. I am suggesting that healthcare was miserable in the era when rulers were in charge of everything. The New World enabled people to escape from that. The reason our healthcare is worsening is because we are slipping back to the philosophy of "the king knows best."

[disintegratingeden]

If you think I'm arguing for a monarchy or a communist state, then you're way off. We are not going to agree on this at all. I do understand what you're trying to say, but I disagree that it will leave us any better off.

[hapspir]

I know you don't want totalitarianism. But every slice of power we give to the government and every freedom we give up takes us a step closer to it. They already screwed up our education. I don't want them to screw up our healthcare any more than it already is. Where do you draw the line?

[alibadshaa]

AMERICA

FUCK YEAH!!!

[LGJamster]

No it would not drive down costs for healthcare because 90% of the time you can not choose whether you need it or not. I can decide not to buy a TV at a certain price point but I have fuck all choice if I'm run over by a car and unconscious and need live saving surgery.

[Richandler]

"We can't afford the promises we already made!"