Un-Baptized

[Dagny1978]

I went through a de-baptism ceremony myself at an American Atheists convention. People do this to get their name removed from the rolls of their church, and from the statistics that count how many members a particular denomination has. So there's actually good reasons for Atheists to go through the trouble of doing this.

[Dagny1978]

I went through a de-baptism ceremony myself at an American Atheists convention. People do this to get their name removed from the rolls of their church, and from the statistics that count how many members a particular denomination has. So there's actually good reasons for Atheists to go through the trouble of doing this.

[WalkaCrookedLine]

I don't really get the point. It seems to me if you feel the need to be "un-baptised", you are attaching significance to a religous ritual. If you attach significance to a religious ritual, you aren't an atheist, you're just confused.

[dubya3cdotcom]

Juish is not a race.

[dubya3cdotcom]

Pastor Deacon Fred says a Baptism of fire is the fait of the papist.

[pennsays]

Hi Penn fans. Penn Says videos have been discontinued, so you won't be seeing any new content on here. You can check out our Profile on our Channel Page for more info. We'll still be checking in, so hope to keep chatting with you all! Thanks!

[SiriusMined]

@pennsays said "Penn Says videos have been discontinued"

That makes me sad :-(

[ARavenDances]

Penn, love you, been a big fan since like 4th grade. :) I like you more now that I'm older and I know what's up. ;)

[pennsays]

Has anyone on here ever been 'un-baptized'?

[TheRougeStallion]

uhhhh sorta, when I claimed myself to be an atheist I actually jumped into a very dirty lake (since baptisms are usually done is clean pure water to "cleanse you") and said "there now the baptism doesn't count"

[dallasluce]

haahahaaa

[pelalozhstar]

dude this guy is stupid. He stands for good shit, but hes a retard.

[dallasluce]

so.... he is just like you

[beastandthemom]

im athiest now...

i hate how you get baptized as a baby, when you dont have a choice. but im in 7th grade, confirmation is in 8th grade, and im pretty sure confirmation is if you are sure you want to be catholic, or christian. so what should i do when that time comes? i mean should i just approach my parents and say i dont believe in Jesus or God?

please reply, im becoming anxious.....

[pelalozhstar]

dude jesus is sweet. why would you want to become an atheist? Atheists are really REALLY dumb dude.

[deanneugebauer]

Yeah tribalism is pretty crazy, to me rooting for a sports team like the Dodgers just because you grew up in LA is kind of weird, but that's just how I think of it.

[gmanry]

One can choose not to be Hebrew (a Jew who observes the Torah), but not being a Jew is kind of like not being of anglo saxon heritage.

[manfrummt]

Kyle - 'Invisible' is the key word in your statement. God is not invisible. We choose not to see Him.  In fact, He is plainly obvious through the beauty and complexity of His creation, the wisdom of His word, and the miracles from faith..

[manfrummt]

Furthermore, I have found Christianity to be wiser than any other religion or sect. But as we all know, the 'religious' aspect of following Christ (who is said to be the Word of God) can be perverted by our sinful nature. So all of us are subject to sin's temptations, Christian or Atheist, Buddhist or Muslim.. Reading the bible with a person who is wise and mature in the Word is the best way to achieve enlightenment.

[manfrummt]

The farther we stray from our design, the more maligned we become, and so disease and mental imbalance and anxieties and yes, death occur because of sin, or straying from our true design. Following God's design is a beautiful life. Much better than the always seeking and never fulfilling rebellious and hard-headed lifestyle.

[manfrummt]

The dilemma about rules and the bible was explained to me once by a very wise man. 'Rules' in the bible are not made to limit or squash our spirit. The 'rules' are the essence of God, and the essence of our spirit. For instance sexual immorality. We are designed to express our sexuality as intimacy stemming from love. Love itself needs defined and is done so by the wise Paul in 1 Corinthians 13.

[COMALiteJ]

The rules in the Bible? You mean including Deuteronomy Chapter 13 (the WHOLE chapter)? Or Deuteronomy 21:18-21? Among LOTS of others?

[manfrummt]

Rules is an obscure term. Yes there were the 10 commandments, a reaction to a rebellious people who needed law. And many other instances of 'rules', but the essence of those rules boils down to what Jesus said - LOVE God and others. Love is what we are, minus the rebellion. I ask you one question in closing.. If God isn't real, why are there so many religions? Why so much effort into making a God? Don't say governmental control, because it always came from the people.

[aintataterhater]

hey manfrummt... i am a christian and iwould like to say on behalf of all (or at least most) of us that u r only feeding generalizations that give us all a bad name... God loves everyone and gives them free will.... and weather they make right or wrong choices does matter but it is nowhere near our place to antagonize or judge

[manfrummt]

a..t..h.. I don't care if I am feeding into generalization, if I am speaking the truth. God loves us all and doesn't want us, his creation, to perish, but rules are there for a reason. He didn't put the tree there just to trick us into sin. It is symbolic for our desire to try to know more than God. 'Knowledge puffs up and love builds'. Atheism embodies our desire for knowledge over love.. We all share the same sinful desires. God loves no matter what. He forgives - when we ask.

[manfrummt]

Penn,

Why be an atheist? To rebel against God. Cause those darn rules hurt so bad. Funny how most atheists need to be atheists so they can justify some sin they are committing. Sin kills, whether you believe it does or not.

All your doing is practicing your own religion. Religion is the whoe problem.. Good job tough guy.

[kylecblackbear]

Well if your such a "Christian" then you know as well as i do that the bible isnt a book of rules but a guide on how to live life and the ten commandments are what he wants done rules are to be followed and if not then comes punishment but an invisable man gave me a list so i follow it or enternal damnation. sounds like ill follow..not. so thats where the line is drawin so thats were i think people split so going agaisnt god or being for him in isnt what ppl care about its what makes them happy

[COMALiteJ]

Oh, this is rich: Atheists rebel against a God that they, BY DEFINITION, don't even believe in!

Oh, and "most atheists need to be atheists" to justify a sin!? REALLY!?

Do you HONESTLY BELIEVE that someone would CHOOSE to believe that someday s/he's going to die, and then there's no heaven, no hell, no afterlife of any kind: it's just lights out. Game over, man, game over. They'll NEVER see any passed-on loved ones ever again.

They CHOOSE to believe that JUST so they can, what, read PLAYBOY!?

[COMALiteJ]

Furthermore, mamfrummt, you're guilty of HYPOCRISY (the ONE sin that JESUS HIMSELF condemned more often than He did ALL other sins COMBINED!) by levying that charge.

Why? Because it's MAINSTREAM "born-again" CHRISTIANITY that actually DOES offer a "do whatever you want and get away with it" plan!!

Just say a two-dozen-word prayer in which you admit your helplessness to sin and accept Jesus as Personal Savior (and MEAN it), and voila! 100% Guaranteed Eternal Salvation, NO MATTER WHAT YOU DO!

[manfrummt]

COMAL... I like your rebellion against modern Christianity. I am with you on that, but the truth is still found in the bible. It is true, even with its discrepancies. There is no other book so spot on human nature, because GOD is the missing piece of us. You know logic is not as logical as you might think. There is a deeper wisdom within us when we let God speak to us. Some of your points are just abuse of logic to try to make a point - like a lawyer trying to defend a guilty guy...

[COMALiteJ]

There are LOTS of books "spot-on about human nature." Ever read Buddha? Or the Vedas, including the Bhagavad Gita? Or even Homer?

"God is the missing piece of us." Nope. That's your belief, and it's not backed up.

Logic works. It's mathematically proven fact. The very fact that you're reading this on a digital computer whose CPU, FPU, GPU, Northbridge, Southbridge, memory, sound, and other chips are made entirely of billions of LOGIC CIRCUITS is DEMONSTRABLE proof of this.

[manfrummt]

oh and one more thing.. as for the calendar. Was it or was it not about 2000 years ago that Jesus lived and died (and rose again). So what Pagan event is the calendar based on? Why was Jesus so significant, being such a lowly man that fulfilled so many prophecies? How can a group of 12 lowly disciples change the world? I'll tell you - GOD! Your maker. Every knee shall bend, and every toungue confess. I can talk about this forever. And I will die believing it.

[COMALiteJ]

The Julian calendar that we use in MODIFIED form today was invented by scholars under Julius Cæsar (thus the name), and its year started with the alleged founding of Rome by Romulus and Remus.

When the Catholics took over the remains of the Roman Empire thanks to Emperor Constantine, they CHANGED the starting year to a MISCALCULATION of Jesus's birth. "Anno Domini (A.D.)" is Latin (Roman language) for "In the Year of Our Lord."

It's no big miracle. It's PEOPLE who DECIDED to do that.

[COMALiteJ]

Furthermore, the Julian-Gregorian (modifed by Pope Gregory to fix the discrepancy that requires leap centuries) calendar is only the calendar used by the CHRISTIAN world and those parts of the world that have been conquered by Christians (militarily, politically, and/or economically).

The Muslims have their own calendar. So do the Jews (and both even worship the same God you do, albeit differently). So do the Chinese, etc. The Mayans had their own calendar (more accurate than ours), etc.

[COMALiteJ]

"Why was Jesus so significant, being such a lowly man that fulfilled so many prophecies?"

He didn't. Christians, starting with the Gospel writers, twisted prophecies to fit Him.

For instance, "Out of Egypt have I called my son" is NOT a Messianic prophecy nor even a prophecy at all, but rather the LORD reminiscing about how He freed Israel (His "son") from slavery in Egypt under Pharoah.

There are many other similar examples. "He shall be called a Nazarene" isn't even in the Old Testament!

[COMALiteJ]

Most of the REAL Messianic Prophecies (the ones accepted by Jewish scholars as such) were NOT fulfilled by Jesus, not even by twisting them. For instance, He did not gather the Lost Tribes, nor rebuild the Temple, nor institute a period of world peace and prosperity, etc.

That's why Christianity teaches a Second Coming, to give Him another chance. It's a blank check! Any prophecy He didn't fulfill, it's, "Oh, He'll get around to that at His Second Coming." Well, DUH! ANYone could claim that!

[Wolverazio]

Depends. Because you know, for at least a few hundred years before the Christ myth, the same exact story was circulating the Mediteranean.

Personally? I think Christianity was created by the Romans as a means to control the Jews. After all, what HISTORICAL (for emphasis, not for shouting) evidence do we have that the Romans ever fed Christians to lions? As far as I'm aware, it's just Church records (which are not historical fact, sorry).

[pelalozhstar]

dude are you retarded? the jews killed jesus....

[Wolverazio]

Yeah...

You are in no place to be calling anyone retarded.

[COMALiteJ]

The Jews killed Jesus? Funny, that's not what Jesus said.

"NO MAN taketh [My life] from Me, but I lay it down of myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it up again." — John 10:[17-]18 (KJV, from memory)

[pelalozhstar]

your taking the text from context... he chose to give his life for everyone... that was how much he loved the world... its called ultimate sacrifice... the only way he could do this is to be rejected by his own people.

[COMALiteJ]

No, not from context. Out of context would be saying, for instance, that the Bible teaches that there is no God because the KJV says a full dozen times (the NIV says it 15 times!)this four-word phrase: "there is no God." (Psalms 14:1 and 53:1 to name one particularly famous repeated example.)

No, WHY He gave His life has nothing to do with the Jews not killing Him. NOBODY could kill Him. He's GOD! God the Son, in mortal form, but still God! He GAVE UP THE GHOST of His OWN FREE WILL!

[pelalozhstar]

well dude, have fun burning in an eternity of torment. ill laugh as the pestilence crawl under your skin and the flames burn your feet.

[COMALiteJ]

@pelahozhstar, how very Christ-like of you [dripping sarcasm].

[manfrummt]

And yes, I believe that atheists are just rebelling against God. It is demonstrated by their anger. Like the KKK is rebelling against whoever, they are not just proud of being white, like they say. Further, sin is just simply things against God's nature, not dumb things like PLAYBOY. The devil got kicked out of heaven for trying to be better than God. Our nature is to sin against God...

[COMALiteJ]

Most atheists are not angry, at least not at God. Some, like me, are angry at those CHRISTIANS who seek to force their ways on us and others through force of law: be it teaching their creation myth to OUR kids in TAXPAYER-funded PUBLIC schools with OUR tax dollars, to having THEIR slogan made the National Motto (in 1956) and placed continuously on our coins for the first time and on our paper money at all for the first time then, and adding a paen to their God in the Pledge, etc.

[COMALiteJ]

If you're a Christian who does as Christ said: praying in private, letting your light (GOOD WORKS) shine before men as your example, and yes, I don't mind if you tell me about your religion and invite me to join of my own free will, then I have no quarrel with you.

But when you seek to elect politicians who will force Christianity or at least Christian ways and imagery and slogans on the rest of society, THEN I have a problem. And even then, the problem is with YOU and your ilk, NOT with GOD.

[COMALiteJ]

"The devil got kicked out of heaven for trying to be better than God."

Uh, no. You're thinking of Isaiah Chapter 14, which (starting with verse 4) is Isaiah's parable against the King of Babylon, NOT the devil. THAT'S who "Lucifer" is.

Even in the KJV, it says, "and they that see thee shall look narrowly upon thee, saying, is this the MAN who did?" Satan is not a man, is he?

Just so you know what you're up against: I used to be like you, until I read the Bible all the way through.

[COMALiteJ]

I have since read the Bible all the way through several times, from Genesis 1:1 through Revelation 22:21, in several translations. Since I have a near-photographic memory for anything I've ever read, I have the Bible largely memorized in several translations.

It's WAY worse than just "a few discrepancies." It's MAJOR contradictions, not only with itself but with DIRECTLY OBSERVABLE REALITY.

For instance: how many legs do insects have? Six? That's not what Leviticus 11:20-23 says.

[mateocafe]

Jesus christ this is more boring than church! I totally dig penn but hire an editor brother.

[bullhonkeymofo]

DE-BAPTIZE?! hypocrytes! how is that any different from christians de-programing homosexuals?

[SerziQ]

Because most likely the person never made the choice to become a christian and be a part of christian things. However, I don't believe that you can be "de-baptized"... that entire concept strikes me as ridiculous. You can't go back and change the past by destroying the proof or excommunicating. As for homosexuals, I don't believe it is a choice to be homosexual. You either are or you are not, and cannot be "deprogrammed" anymore than you can be "de-baptized".

[bullhonkeymofo]

SerziQ I agree about gays. I was just offering the other side of the fence. de-baptizing is silly and aknowledges that baptizim actually does something to you that you would in turn have to remove. My opinion is EVERYONE THAT HAS EYES READ THIS AND KNOW THAT JESUS CHRIST CAME IN THE FLESH AND DIED SO THAT OUR SINS CAN BE FORGIVEN.

[BananaGeekLord]

I dont see why people make a big deal about baptisms. Im agnostic, my parents had me baptized. I could careless. If there is a god, then it wont matter if I was baptized or not, I still wont get into heaven because of my beliefs. If there is no god, then who cares? They put me in water for 2 seconds. Life moves on.

[Tudles1]

De-baptism sounds ridiculous. Baptism is just an outward sign of an inward change, and if you don't really believe at the time, then that's just a really short bath. If you change your beliefs later, than it doesn't matter at all because for you that baptism holds no meaning. I'm a christian, and when I got baptised it meant something to me. But the mere fact alone that I was dipped in water means nothing.

[manfrummt]

Excellent comment Tudles1. I mean how can you unrepent, right?

[stbays]

I can't imagine any Atheist would have any reason to care if they were baptized. It only means something if you accept God. Otherwise, like Narsil said, it's just water on your head.

[IAteYourTV]

blood in, blood out!

[Nickidewbear]

With some religions, anyway.

[kittyprydekissme]

I suppose un-doing a baptism is much easier than un-doing a circumsision.

[longfootbuddy]

you cant deny that you come from a line of human or tribe or race anymore than you can deny your human, that doesnt make you hitler unless you plan on killing them

[mplayer1021]

i understand what Andyilmatto is trying to say especially in reasoning #2 but, when you un-baptism its still all about Christianity. Yes, its a great thing when you become an atheist but why do you have to advertise it by denouncing Christianity, its now a separate religion (or lack there of) keep it that way.

[MrTsBastardChild]

I've been baptized more than once. That is about as sensible as being un-baptized. I am sure it is symbolic, but why would atheists want silly rituals when they are trying to stay away from that lifestyle? What would it accomplish?

[Andyilmatto]

Italian ex-catholic here: I de-baptized for 2 reasons.

1- For coherence: I don't believe in any god and I got baptized without anyone asking me if I wanted to.

2 - The Catholic Church counts the number of followers by counting the baptized people: many baptized people become atheists or change religion, yet they are still being counted as catholics. And I don't want to be one of them.

[narsil1984]

I was baptized a lutheran protestant. But, it doesnt matter at all to me : all they did was dress up in fancy cloth, sit in a church, sing some songs and talk to the ceiling, and then poured some water on my head. Every time Im walking in the streets when it rains I recieve more water on my head than that day, and every time I shower too.

It boils down to: you cant be considered a member of a group unless you yourself identify with that group.

[vwwarrior]

Well, I am personally in the camp of "whatever blows your hair back". If someone feels they need the psycological closure of being de-registered, then I don't think it's anyone elses job to shit on them for that. It's not about recognizing the "power" of the church, It's more about "I don not want to be counted as one of your adherants".

[sciencemile]

Hahaha, "John Hunt? I know his brother Mike".

Very witty, Mr. Jillette :P

[DeathstarGalactica]

When can we see Penn look up shit on wikipedia?

[pennsays]

So for those naysayers, what about viewing it less from a religious sense and more from a mental re-birth? The un-baptism could be a new start without it being a religious re-boot.

[sciencemile]

I'd still shy away from adding rituals to Atheism, though. It's a step towards muddying the waters. I personally don't care if I was baptized, it doesn't apply to me, and I don't believe it, and if a Mormon person baptizes me by proxy, that doesn't really matter either. It's just some guy speaking a bunch of gabble-dee-gook and dunking his head in some water.  I only get upset over the things that actually have real impact, like religion-inspired violence against fellow man.

[EuthanizeReligion]

Penn my good lad, Why is this a response to the Crossroads movie?

[Silverblack81]

If you spend you're life avoiding something that you were once affiliated with doesn't it still control you. If you leave the church and are an atheist that's your choice but you should just move on and leave it behind. What does getting de-baptized accomplish really.

[flowerpt]

The notion of getting un-baptized is absurd. To try is to give the concept credence.

Guess, what, somebody splashed some water on your head. You can't get un-splashed.

If you didn't consciously join, it's just somebody who has you on their mailing list. It's no different than if some prankster signs you up for the NAMBLA newsletter. OK, wait, that might not be the best comparison given the organization in question.

[Reproductivist]

I'm not baptized. I'd be interested in getting myself removed from government lists though; destroy my official identity.

[fortunatus]

I think you just mean individualist as opposed to collectivist (of wich tribalism is a sort).

[flowerpt]

to split hairs, there are twelve tribes in Judaism.

[Namirsolo]

Yes, Catholics believe that one cannot get into heaven unless they are baptized. I, too, was baptized and have since become an atheist. It means nothing to me anymore, so I'm not stressed about it.

[burnhippiesforfuel]

i was born again years before becoming an atheist. apparently i've already won pascal's wager.

[Panman38]

I imagine it's about as easy as trying to get your email address removed from a spam list.

[lombard34]

Could not agree more on the issue of tribalism. I reject all of these nonsense classifications.

But as for the main topic, while part of me agrees that there should be some way of having your name crossed off the list or whatever it is, I do think there is something to the idea that baptism is meaningless and that Atheists or other former-Christians should not give any legitimacy to it by getting upset about it. It is a nonsense ritual.

[PRWelke]

Shouldn't a church called "First Congo" have monkeys?

[JerkyChid]

New-old vid? no comments, barely any views but it's been up since last month

[JerkyChid]

ain't ya glad I didn't say first? ....god dammit...