Wrestling Roundtable #2 12/8/07 Part 4 - Future Monday Night Wars? continued

[nateiow]

american fans like to forget tna beats wwe raw smackdown nxt superstar in the uk and there doing well for them selfs world wide for rateings and attence and sell out the same builds that wwe do

[nateiow]

wcw hate from the wwe fans has now passed to tna

[azeron112]

The main problem in wrestling today is wrestlers that are liked by the fans are not given the push they deserve. RVD was way over and the only reason he was given the WWE title was due to the ECW PPV. After that he was back to being watered down with limited move sets.

Theres too many marks in the exec level and cliques in the writing level for wrestling to ever be good again.

[MRobert21]

Smarks (even I for a bit when I used to be a smark) whined and cried forever that RVD was being held down and deserved the title, so WWF listened and gave RVD the title. The next day he was caught speeding down the road at 100 miles per hour while doing drugs (being the class act he is RVD then flipped the court off too in front of the press), so he got buried as he deserved. Now RVD is headed to the minor league with all the other trustees of modern chemistry to point his thumbs and flip around

[azeron112]

Not sure if I'm a Smark being that I wrestled for Eddie Sharkey & Terry Fox in Minnesota. But RVD isn't the first WW/Whatever Champ to be caught with something. It's just that RVD's case was made even bigger thanks to the internet.

Superstar, Hogan & Sheik were caught with stuff while they were champs & it wasn't for weed or Vicodin like in RVD's case. But much harder stuff.

[MRobert21]

Sure you are a smark even if you worked some indy shows some place some time. I never said RVD was the only WWF wrestler caught with drugs, but that makes him no less of a moron for speeding down the road doing drugs and then acting like a punk in court. RVD proved he does not care about the business and he only cares about himself, so he rightly got the title yanked off him and got put back where he belongs. RVD can have fun in TNA where drug abuse is encouraged and he has burned his bridges

[cheatguru2173]

Appearently TNA President Dixie Carter is not putting TNA iMPACT! on monday nights. So iMPACT! is not competing, its doing a great fanbase around the world. And besides WWE is a WCW clone. And don't make me say it again...TNA is the best in the future.

[the69ryin]

just putting this out there, but isnt / wasnt the brand split, raw and smack down, made to give wwe its own competition from itself to stop other brands like tna

[MRobert21]

The original purpose to the brand split was so 1 day Nipple H could have half the company to run and Shane could have half the company to run (now Shane is out and Nipple H gets the whole thing). TNA and other indies were not a consideration in the brand split. Originally it was supposed to be Shane gets WCW and Nipple H gets WWF, but McMahon could not revive dead WCW. Only the Billionaire Princess Dick Sucking Dixie's Big Daddy Carter keeps the TNA epic fail floating to keep her happy for now

[putzbasterd]

somoa joe is just a fat slob

[landrykkb]

TNA better improve their product fast and do what made them successful to begin with as opposed to trying to keep up with WWE or copycatting WCW!There's no chance of them competing right now and that's not because WWE's product is so superior to theirs.

[GuardianRebelDave12]

you forgot Pittsburgh was WWF in the territory deal, WWF would be in town every 4 moths and WCW would come maybe once every 2 years and they would play they AJ Palumbo center, which was and still is at best a 2nd rate building which only held 5000 people and u had WWF playing Civic Arena (now Mellon Arena) which can hold 17,000 or 18,000 for wrestling. (btw WWF holds the Mellona arena attendance record with 18,132 for summerslam 95 and a house show in jan 98) i was there for both

[RandomMindz]

If TNA ever was to go into a Monday Night Wars, they would only go against FOR SURE ROH and most likely lose unless they have more creative writers

[RandomMindz]

I don't really care of most people's opinions, but I would LOVE to see TNA take on the WWE!! I am SICK of the WWE!! They have nothing to give for the fans to watch for! At least TNA have old stars I pretty much missed from the old days of the WWF. WWE's overrated in my opinion, and I wold like a big god damn change when it goes out of buisness and TNA take over!!

[SMCrazy25]

old stars who have about 1 good year left until they either seriously disable themself or bust a hip. having old stars is wat killed WCW

[RandomMindz]

Oo

is that right? Well learn new things every day.

However, even if that is the case, I HATE the new superstars in teh WWE! NONE of them are any good! Cena was good, but now just overrated. Orton's just a big time wuss. Batista, a typical steroid muscle freak, etc. etc. And what's even more upseting is that the most talented in the WWE roster is the most underrated!

[SMCrazy25]

That's how WWE has always been but eventually those underrated stars became champions ex. Jeff Hardy, Matt Hardy, Edge.

TNA does the same matches you could fine in the glory days of WWE or WWF

[RandomMindz]

highlight the word eventually...

GREAT talent in the WWE that were in the undercard were practically never promoted

let me run you the list:

The Hardy Boyz (ecw championship is bullshit!!)

Val Venis (come on! He had IC reigns!!)

Hardcore Holly (classic!)

William Regal (comming soon)

Super Crazy/Juvetud/Pschosis (lawn mower my ass!!)

Finlay (midget my ass!!)

[IvonoftheGWF]

The Hardys are moving up the ranks, No one but the actual WWE Exec's take the new ECW seriously, but what does that say about what they think they are doing with him? And Jeff is a lot farther than he should be, after his last screw up with Heroine, he was never gonna even be considered for a title again, but here he is every night with Triple H enduring his long promos and substanceless matches. which means they are either considering him, or are punishing him by putting him with Triple H

[IvonoftheGWF]

As for the others listed, Val Venis deserved nothing more than IC titles, he just wasn't cut to be a good world champion. And Bob I refuse to call him hardcore Holly doesn't deserve to live, much less wrestle. William Regal and Finlay both deserve to hold at least 1 World title each before they retire, And they should have many more matches together, because it's fun to see them stiff each other to death. And the only problem with the mexicools was everything but Super Crazy.

[RandomMindz]

alright, maybe Val Venis = IC

but I like Hardcore Holly! He would've been an awesome brawler, not a freakin jobber!

Super Crazy was awesome! I never seen a suplex moonsault over the top rop like that! It was wicked! He'd at least should've been champion of SOME thing! Talent like that the WWE constantly overlooks!!

[RandomMindz]

mmm true, but I still think Matt should be considered a real world title. Nice to see him hold a belt that "seems" prestigious, although it is actually garbage. Matt should know by now everyone loves Jeff's high risk, and he should do something of equal calibur. I am not saying he should jump off a ladder or anything, but at least start some kickass feud...

then again, jumping off a ladder doesn't sound like a bad idea....

[RandomMindz]

---

New meet that deserves big:

Shelton Benjamin

John Morrison

Evan Bourne

Cryme Tyme

[RandomMindz]

"Tna does the same matches you could fine in the glory days of WWE/F"

OO REALLY!??!

NOW I HAVE TO GET SPIKE TV!

[IvonoftheGWF]

To quote Jay-Z, TNA couldn't bust a grape in a fruit fight. It could never compete with a backyard promotion, much less WWE. I think if ROH could someday gain some form of fianancial backing and a TV deal, it would have a small chance of competing.

As for Joe going to WWE, I could definatly see it. I'd love to see him go to Smackdown

[RandomMindz]

Okay, I would like for you to take a look at Umaga and Samu and ask yourself would Samoa Joe, a TNA world champion, would get a GRAND push in the WWE? For all I know, WWE will tone down all of his wrestling skills, and maybe even give him a fogey finisher just as dull and exaggerated like the Samoan Spike!

[IvonoftheGWF]

Well, I'm not so sure about that, Joe is quite established, so I don't think they could change him all that much, I mean he wouldn't be able to be NEARLY as stiff as he normally is, but they probably wouldn't mess with him too much other than that. Besides, from what I've seen of Joe in TNA, and the premise of him being there in the first place, it couldn't hurt him that bad. And Umaga is still good, And I at first didn't like the samoan spike, but now I think it's an OK finisher.

[StrongLifeForce]

TNA CANNOT go up against WWE in another "Monday Night War". Because they have to get bigger & better FIRST. Otherwise, it would be like a 150lb guy going up against a 300 lbs guy. David vs. Goliath plus they don't want to lose again till they get their s*** together.

[WrestlingRoundtable]

We said of that during the show. More specifically, they can't grow, let alone compete, until they get their shit together.

-E, Wrestling Roundtable

[StrongLifeForce]

Uhm, mostly what I heard was the musician(forgot his name) talk about Samoa Joe going over to the WWE and how it would be better for him to do so. The discussion took a back alley route off the main course. I would have simply compared the two instead of arguing about Samoa Joe...Just one topic. I just thought that I would point that out based upon what I heard the discussion gravitate around. Anyhow, keep up the great work. You never know TNA may become stronger and WWE weaker through time.

[ResisantFailure86]

I've been a WWE fan for 16 years, since 1992. i was 6 years old.. i was always for WWE i was completely anti-WCW, i suppored WWE 100%. now i'm for TNA. Think of it, TNA is doing what WCW did only they are doing it better! and they are taking guys from WWE, Christian, Booker T, Kurt Angle, hell even Ref. Earl Habner. and for HVPhilips, how can you sit there and compare Samoa Joe to Umaga??? I would love to see Umaga do half of what Joe can do, it won't happen. TNA is going straight to the top.

[WrestlingRoundtable]

I have thought of it, and I think you've got it completely reversed, heh. If TNA were doing what WCW did, let alone doing it better, it'd at least be beating WWE in the ratings(it's not even close) for a long period of time by promoting a drastically different product(it's also not). Taking in WWE rejects isn't great in and of itself(In fact, it's not good generally), it's what you do with them. TNA, while recently successful in their own right, still has a long way to go. Thanks.

-E

[RandomMindz]

I'd believe it!!

I have a theory about the TNA going against WWE...pretty much an hypothesis..

I'll send you an email about it....

by they way, did u guys get my LAST message?

[HVPhilips]

Last thing,Samoa Joe,no matter how good a wrestler and charismatic he is,he would be nothing more than a fucking umaga clone.His physique would be made fun off,his force would be removed,and last but not least...he would be given a racist samoan gimmick.If you aren't made by Vince,then you ain't gonna make it..

[WrestlingRoundtable]

Well, here's where I disagree ; We all know the rumor of them wanting him to be another Rikishi years ago. Difference is that was 1. Before he became a name in TNA 2. His boy Cena became McMahon's golden calf. So consequently, I would tend to believe that if McMahon's top draw, whom he must trust, said, "Let me work with this guy, he's great", AND put a major hole in TNA in the process, then it's more likely now Joe wouldn't be a savage like Umaga. Though I could be wrong - they are stupid :)

-E

[HVPhilips]

Also,they need to push they're own talent,rather than depend on the fucking washed up guys.If they would use they're own talent,pursue useful vets(ie. RVD,)than they would improve.One last thing,its clear that Dixie Carter is a businesswoman,not a wrestling fan.

[WrestlingRoundtable]

Perhaps she's neither, because if she was a businesswoman I'd guess it wouldn't have been 6 years before they finally saw a profit, heh. But really, you have to be both! In my opinion, you have to be a fan first - would YOU buy this stuff? That, in turn, will lead you to making good business decisions. You know, giving the people what they want? Silly idea, I know

-E, Wrestling Roundtable

[HVPhilips]

My problem with TNA is simple....They fuck up with the most obvious things.They've got all these washed up WWF/WCW rejects,and the indy world is so fucking packed with young lions,it isn't even funny.Why go after scott hall,when you can go after bryan danielson,build him up 4 a year,and put him against someone like joe or angle??

[WrestlingRoundtable]

You're absolutely right, but that's because you're using sense & logic, which is something those in the 'wrestling bubble' who run TNA aren't doing. Rather than creating something/someone anew(which is ONLY what has started a hot period in wrestling), they panic and stick to their good-old-boy mentally of going with someone who drew money...of course, the problem is that was YEARS AGO, and NOW is not YEARS AGO. Sorry, but one 'hey, it's that guy I used to like' pop isn't worth it

-E

[SdMahasuver]

Eddie was very lucky that he got to the main event spot, not because he did not have talent but because he was in the right place at the right time. If there was no brand extension and if Paul Heyman did not create the tag team division on Smack Down(which prety much cemented the stardom of Edge/Rey/Eddie/Benoit, and had a good use on Kurt to boost him back to the main even spot), I can not see Eddie getting the opportunity to become anything bigger than a mid carder.

RIP Eddie.

[WrestlingRoundtable]

That's a good point, because it was around this time in 02/03 that Eddie got so over that they felt they had to push him to the top. I think Guerrero did good business for them too, but it's also good for him in this case that was a brand split because who knows if he'd have gotten that spot over the RAW guys like HHH/HBK/Benoit. Very good points, thanks

-E, Wrestling Roundtable.

[scipio2009]

Why wouldn't Samoa JOE, working with guys like Angle, Cage, AJ Styles, Booker T, Roode, Tomko and the other top guys in TNA, be successful for TNA?

JOE is a different enough kind of performer, from anything else that's going on in wrestling.

Why can't a talent, like JOE, be TNA's answer to the NWO angle that finally launched WCW?

[WrestlingRoundtable]

Top Guys? Roode? ha, anyway, problem is Joe's worked with most of those guys and TNA's remained the same. Why? B/c he hasn't utterly destroyed those guys. Tomko for example, of all people, has beaten him multiple times! If you had watched our previous videos, you'd know that we all agree Joe could have been THE thing for TNA, like Austin in WWF 98 or nWo in WCW 96. He has that much 'it factor', charisma & uniqueness that, done right, could have lead TNA to the next level. That is not so today

-E

[classix89]

Good video! Keep it up!

You guys got yourself another subscriber!

[WrestlingRoundtable]

Thanks very much. We appreciate every subscriber and invite you to get involved in the process. If you'd like to submit questions, suggestions, get others to subscribe, and even offer criticisms, feel free to share, disagree or whatever you choose. Thanks again

-E

[LawrenceRoundTable]

Thanks.

-Lawrence, WrestlingRoundtable

[WrestlingRoundtable]

Thank you very much, check back Christmas Eve. Or, the day before the Winter Solstice according to the Julian Calendar.

[rattgroupie]

That was great, can't wait for the next video.

[PesciFTW]

Proudly Loyal "If it ain't wwf I won't watch it"

[WrestlingRoundtable]

Ouy vey, I can't wait to have you on the show