World At War: Red Star 2 of 5

[chuckbuckbobuck]

At the end of the war, I am surprised that the Russians didn't kill more German civilians, soldiers, etc. after the ungodly brutality they unloaded on the Russian populace!

[SkullOfYorick]

@chuckbuckbobuck Yes, they were probably used to brutality, though, having lived under Stalin for over a decade!

[chrisdevins]

I have respect for the Russians. After this they went on to capture Berlin.

[quicklern818]

how much to lick mayonnaise out of that woman's mustache?

[sleptopia]

I personally went through this as a young boy and it is the hardest thing you can ever do. Both my parents were killed and I was sent to live with my Aunt. Once the war ended I came to live in the USA where I was beaten up and bullied at school. My family was poor so clothes were hard to come by. No American can say they went through worse than me and say their country is so great. My life was ruined by this war and Americans taking full credit just annoys me.

[NEWLOVE559]

@sleptopia without American trucks your army had no chance

[immortal4942]

in Leningrad the Russians should have built underground tunnels and bomb shelters not go running around in streets.

[spudnick3490]

@immortal4942

You do realize they didn't have time for tunnels....

[movitmovit]

to me this is the most moving segment of the most moving episode of the entire WaW series.

[0NoName9]

Only hate and money are capable of making people do miracles.

[antimatterXXXIII]

Jan 1942 - 4000 people a day dead from starvation or shell fire. A 9/11 every day - for months on end. The siege was not lifted for another 2 years. The endurance of these folks is astounding beyond words.

[thejohn95]

if the nazis weren't so cruel they would have gotten these cities to surrender so much easier. that was why the romans were often so successful. the russian people knew that if they surrendered they would suffer a fate worse than death at the hands of the nazis.

[DrCruel]

Thus, why it become possible an account of a war between two brutal, Leftist, fascist ideological factions and sympathize with one while criticizing the other. The achievement of endurance was by the long suffering Russian people of Petrograd, against the Bolsheviks as much as the Nazis, no the brutal Stalinists who used the people of the city like cannon fodder against their all-too-recent allies.

[DrCruel]

The problem we have in understanding what fascism was (and is) has to do with the dominance of Marxist memes and jargon underlying the dialogue. It is as if we tried to understand chemical reactions using the themes and symbols of alchemy. All too often, the Marxists use this jargon to promote themselves while denigrating competing factions that are virtually identical to them. "Fascism" is a term frequently used to accentuate such imaginary distinctions, much as a business might used branding.

[DrCruel]

It is also important to remember that, until Marxists invented the idea that fascism was a "Right-wing" ideology, that fascists wer thought to be on the Left (and in fact, during the early years of Italian fascism, were thought to be ideological allies of the mainstream Left). In fact these various Leftist authoritarian ideologies had far more in common with each other than with the supposedly "weak, bourgeois" democratic, free market societies they sought to destroy and usurp.

[DrCruel]

Leftspeak is a distinctive jargon. It is meant to deliberately deceive, in the name of promoting an otherwise indefensible authoritarian agenda by people who think of the general public as little better than farm animals (thus the brilliant sarcasm of Orwell's "Animal Farm"). I openly admit that Leftspeak terms are inconsistent, confused, and frequently ridiculous outside of the Left's ideological context..

[DrCruel]

I argue that "fascism" has no descriptive meaning within the context of Leftist ideology, outside of being a pejorative. Fascism is actually a reformed spinoff from Marxist theory, merging the nepotistic feudalism of practical Marxism with the idea of state-staked corporate syndicates. The system in the modern PRC is a good example of this, and is increasingly becoming prevalent in other Marxist states (such as the Indochinese Empire of Vietnam).

[DrCruel]

@emvillalta It's actually a description, reminiscent of George Orwell's coining of the term Newspeak, to refer to the curious use of semantics by Leftist to obscure truth, hamstring rational dialogue and further their otherwise indefensible objectives. For example, "people's democratic republic" used to refer to a despotic socialist oligarchy, or "social justice" being used to describe policies of oppression, racial supremacy and lawlessness.

[randy95023]

You know that Hitler and the Nazis were bad when they make Stalin and the Soviets look like the "good guys"...

[DrCruel]

I hope that, at this late date, we would have freed ourselves of the evils of Nazism, Bolshevism, Marxism, Maoism, and other irrational secular totalitarian faiths. I would think that the totalitarian forms of socialism, so prevalent in the 20th century, with racism, exploitation and bald-faced hypocrisy so intrinsically at their core, would have lost their adherents long ago. Sadly, there are still petty and debased people who still ache to lord over others and leach their earnings..

[GarabeBang]

too bad after the city was liberated stalin doesn't to murder thousands of his own liberated people. soviet union = third reich

[movitmovit]

for me personally this is the most moving episode of the world at war series. over the years i have seen this episode more times than i can remember.

the scene where olga rybakova talks about how they "began to feel alive" in the spring of 1942 always moves me deeply.

[RDDR4848]

The Soviet people were indeed marvellously stoic and resilient in the face of invasion. No other people could have withstood the German invasion so well; and no other people other than the Germans would have attempted such an invasion. I've never been convinced that the Anglo-American armies in occupied Germany would ever have defeated the Red Army in a conventional war if the Western Allies had gone to war against the Soviet Union in the mid-1940s, as Patton and some others wanted.

[askjiir]

Russia has always had bad leaders. It's tragic. Good and brave people, bad leaders.

[GOfilms01]

i can never watch a video about the soviets during the war without admiring the spirit and determination of the people. truly amazing and admirable.

[DrCruel]

It was nothing for them. In the name of Marxism, the Bolsheviks had already killed more Soviet citizens before the war than the Nazis would kill during the whole of it. Nor did the Bolsheviks stop murdering their own citizens simply because the Nazis had invaded.

It's also worthy to note that many brave Ukranian partisans who fought the Nazis turned their guns on the Red Army when they came back to reassert their authority. It took Stalin four years to put them all down..

[GOfilms01]

@DrCruel im not complimenting their government, im complementing the people under it.

[DrCruel]

The debt that Western civilization owes to the Russian people goes without saying. They have saved Europe and the world, on a number of occasions throughout history.

But they had been enduring the depradations of socialists long before those of the Nazi variety decided to join the fray. At least in the case of the German fascists, they had the opportunity to give them what they deserved. As for the Russian fascists, it would take over four decades more to be rid of them.

[GOfilms01]

@DrCruel yeah, the largest flaw in communist doctrine is the establishment of the temporary dictatorship of the proletariet, because for this dictatorship to be temporary and bloodless you need honest politicians who are willing to give up power. something i don't think the world will ever see.

[DrCruel]

The largest ideological flaw in communist doctrine is that it's fundamentally wrong - Ayn Rand put it best, when she flipped the traditional Marxian view of workers and exploiters. But from a practical standpoint, in light of the actual intentions of Marxists, there isn't anything wrong with communist doctrine at all - it's a means of fooling people into letting themselves be enslaved, then using terror and cruelty to keep them down. For the Marxists in power, the system works flawlessly.

[commonzac]

@DrCruel you're an idiot. try reading Marx himself, instead of Marxists, to see what communism is. and just so you know, marx was primarily a critic of the capitalist mode of production and, as such, he set out no "doctrine" for the systems overthrow or for the erection of a new socialist society. its best to read later marx"ists" as revisionists, and those that went fundamentally against the grain of what was then understood as socialism.

[DrCruel]

@commonzac Well, sir, I'm clearly not an "idiot". I'm quite knowledgeable about Marxism and its history throughout the 20th century. I've read the Communist Maifesto, Marx's letters from the US during his tenure as a journalist as well as his correspondence with Engels, and much of Das Kapital.

[DrCruel]

@commonzac Marx was vague about his intentions, but was quite clear about the violence he expected his ideas would necessitate. There is sufficient cause in the Communist Maifesto alone to assert this. I would also contend that the Marxists that follow his ideas are seditionist racists that are ethically little better than Nazis - and in many cases, decidedly worse.

So, with all due respect, feel free to go screw yourself.

[commonzac]

@DrCruel you'll have to recall, dear sir, that the manifesto is just that -a manifesto. as such it is as much an analysis piece as it is one that would serve to popularize the idea of scientific socialism, which in 1848, was not the dominant strain, as well as a means to motivate the base of what was admittedly an incredibly small german workers party. i don't know exactly what you mean by Marx being vague about his intentions, which, as I mentioned earlier, was nothing more or well than...

[commonzac]

@DrCruel outlining the emergence, rise, and subsequent fall of a particular social system. surely this scientific work of his was intended to shore up socialist analysis and action, and provide direction. but again, he had no "intentions" per se, but simply outlined the process by which the capitalist mode of production would, through the force of its own internal contradictions, collapse. so if outlining the contours of an unequal and exploitative social system is seditious to you, than that...

[DrCruel]

@commonzac There was little that was "scientific" about Marx's ideas. Certainly the concept that a theory needs to be demonstrable and verifiable seem to have little effect on Marxist theorists. They will support teh same old fraudulent claims regardless of how often they have proven wrong in practice. My assumption at this point is that the function of Marism is not to approach economics "scientifically", but rather to give license to thievery and slavery.

[commonzac]

@DrCruel that speaks volumes of the fascistic tendencies inherent in your politics.

[DrCruel]

@commonzac "Fascist" is a Leftspeak codeword for "dissentor", so there's no shock to see a Left fascist accusing others of that criminal ideology - Stalin called Trotsky a "fascist" after all. The irony is that fascism - especially in the German form - was indistinguishable from Bolshevism outside of its more moderate brutality against religious people and those involved in commerce. Nazism was as much an embodiment of Marxist thought as was Stalinism or Maoism.

[DrCruel]

@commonzac I mean just that. Like Hitler and Lenin (two subsequent socialist despots that borrowed heavily from Marx), he seemed more to be interested in telling his radical followers what they wanted to hear, more to drum up support for his leadership than to address real issues. His fight with Bukharin was more a struggle for power than an issue of diametric ideas, as neither really had coherent systems of thought.

[GOfilms01]

@DrCruel yeah, the largest flaw in communist doctrine is the establishment of the temporary dictatorship of the proletariet, because for this dictatorship to be temporary and bloodless you need honest politicians who are willing to give up power. something i don't think the world will ever see.

[randy95023]

Horrid Trivia Note: More Soviet Civilians and Soldiers died in the seige of Leningrad than TOTAL war dead of USA, Britain and France. Rather than just leave a blockade force to keep Leningrad under seige, Hitler used massive amounts of men, artillery and Luftwaffe to try to destroy the city. Senselessnes of Hitler's ego once again bled forces that could have been used more productively elsewhere. Had Hitler not been so obsessively maniacal the Germans might have won in the east...

[ehisboy1]

Leningrad was not entirely under siege thanks to Finland....If the finnish would complete the encirclement maybe Leningrad would have another fate.The russians do not forgot this on peace negotiations after war.

[scorkungen]

Where the hell were the siberian divisions?

[VCVvideo]

in this war the russians got it hard and in comparison with the allies got of easy. but define easy when every war leading up to this point was of a lesser scale less bloody and even the first world war pales in comparison to this war

[Evocati2008]

interesting to learn that Leningrad was not entirely under seige, that they had a link to russia through the lake to the north.

[CIAagent11]

Gotta admire the determination of the commies. You'll work fifteen hours a day with no food if the alternative is being killed by the nazis.

[stuky800]

Indeed a good place to live your youth in Russia between 1941-1945, you were hunted down by friends and by ennemies.

[askjiir]

Im so glad I wasn't born then, in that particular place..

[thx291]

What a shitty life that must have been. Having all those hardships against the Germans and even if they won they'd still be living under Stalin.

[askjiir]

The burden of the Russian people...

[pix042]

07:30 approx. a lot of those dead people ahve just been listening to another speech from Uncle Joe Stalin, the cunt. They were alright before he started off.

[chinopisces]

Grow a brain, idiot.

[tinternet66]

Some thing about this old dear tells me she a dam good sort.

Looking after her mother like that. She should be up for a god dam medel Once more not only did she look after her own mother, Her old mans mother to. I have to say though if mothers got medels she be up for a mother. Fucker

[schroederdevrient]

Long Live Comrade Stalin!

Very few things are hated by the West more than the divine Russian WW2 victory.The reason is simple,the sociopathic West has never stopped dreaming about conquering Russia,gonociding her population and taking the vast resources.Everything that occurs in politics has as the ultimate goal controlling Eurasian resources.All the lies about Stalin are designed to weaken Russia politically and to bring NWO sociopaths closer to possible control over Russia.

[redriot74]

iam english and i have nothing but praise for the russian people and the sacrifice they made through sheer will and effort they overcame the nazi foe, without them i dont see the allies prevailing on there own!?

[calicheSCOT]

What a deranged view of history you have...

[meocaott]

The Russians now want to be important at all cost but their backwardness in technology puts them among the 3rd word countries.

So they embark in chauvinistic adventures like bullying neighboring countries into submission and blaming the West and glorifying Stalin.

Saying this but we still highly regard Stalin's contribution in beating the Nazis.while remember his crimes.

[VanoPitersky]

Google "Soviet space program" and also "moon landing hoax".

[VanoPitersky]

What currently puts Russia among 3d world countries is not the lack of technology (ours is light years ahead of any country) but the treasonous scum currently ruling Russia which is turning it into a resource colony.

[pix042]

Your Virgin Islands technology may not be 'light years' ahead for much longer. Your country is waning. China will move ahead in 50 years.

[Angmarr]

oh boy, you really believe this?

[AndrewPowergo]

wtf are you talking about? this is really true. Everyone russian know that is Leningrad is city-hero of ww2. yea people died on the streets. people eat 250grammes of bread in day almost 3 years. fucking nazis want to kill us all. Thank god that my grandpa is still living.

[antimatterXXXIII]

@AndrewPowergo Good for your old granddad! My respect for the Russian people grows by the minute. I wish US and Russia would form an alliance and impose peace, if you know what I mean :) Too bad the people have been so poorly served by their political leaders over the decades. But that's all past now.

[FelixRohatyn]

@AndrewPowergo Fins set there and watched as people starved, it could have been very easy to supply the city around Ladoga and through Fin territory. Fins did not care about anything they just wanted to be on the right side. Russia should have occupied Finland too. I think theres a score to be settled there between Russia and Finland. Maybe if Russians didnt invade Finland first it would have been different.

[crocfme]

The Russians were victims of both Stalin and Hitler. Their resiliance is to be admired.The Western allies could not have defeated the Nazis without them.

[Dudeohh]

russia has never been great from the tsars to the commies- especially evil Stalin, to currently - russians are always living in misery even during the cold war they weren't a super power- they just had a storng military thats it no economic powerhouse or unity

[tranmere789]

Russian people will never avoid more political nightmare if they don't wanna have serious talk also about the truth of WW2. It wasn't indeed so glorious as "Great Patriotic War" jargon is explaining to them. Stalin supported Hitler since 1937. It was his plan. He wanted big war, coz it was the only chance to conquer whole Europe or great deal of Europe. Stalin was of course successfull but he was a warcriminal just like Hitler.

So why to celebrate a brutal warcriminal on "Day of Victory".

[tranmere789]

People in west have to understand than when Red Army was marching forward there was a second army, NKVD army ,behind them shooting every soldier who didn't want to go forward. Every commander was personally responsible that his unit don't escape.

Despite all of this hundreds of thousands of red army soldiers surrendered - especially when commanders of their units were killed. Red Army soldier was not a superhuman.

[VanoPitersky]

You mean in other armies deserters are given medals ?

Nazis fought a war of extermination upon us.Deserters are shot on the spot or hung in every army and at all times but in WW2 desertion by a Russian was tantamount to the highest form of treason because losing the war to the Nazis meant extermination of the entire Russian nation.

The Western cowards who sent spam while we spent blood of 27 million cannot begin to imagine what genuine mass heroism it took for Russians to win WW2.

[calicheSCOT]

But without that spam, Russia would have failed.

[askjiir]

Not guaranteed. Most Russian supply was manufactured by the russians themselves. Bot ofcourse still very helpful

[calicheSCOT]

It was not helpful, but vital. The sheer amount of material lost by the Red Army during the opening months of Barbarossa crippled the Russian war machine. Have a look at some statistics and you will be amazed at the vast amount of material that was given to the Soviet Union during the war from planes to shoes. Something Stalin was not going to brag about.

[tranmere789]

This tv-film just an offspring of 70's - an golden age of western leftwing "liberal" naivism. Infact NKVD and Red Army had to put soviet soldiers under pressure. More dissiters were executed in 1944-45 than in 1941. Amazing thing was that the moral of soviet soldiers was not were high in latter part of the war. Especially men of ethnical minorites (almost 50%) were easily surrendered POW's. And those whose were not long ago "liberated by Red Army".

[KeyNesew]

War produced no heroes. Indeed, Europe was liberated by soldiers, and soldiers are formed to kill. Irregardless, there is no doubt that the people of the then USSR fought with whatever they had to crush the worse threat of Nazi ideology from Germany.

[hondoLS]

The Russian people perplex me. Its almost as if they are content in their misery. From their slavic origins to their subordination under the Tsars to their oppression under Stalin and willingness to fight endless bloody wars. And now they democratically elect a dictator and establish an oligarchy. Fascinating.

[askjiir]

Good point

[shuhelali]

4000 deaths a day !

[biigzen]

Those Russkies were some super hard core mo-fo's...Glue soup in freezing temperatures and working unending days in factories. and they STILL whooped the krauts. Talk about bad ass

[askjiir]

You got that right

[ProjectCC]

lol easy buddy don't be so Emo

[henkbress]

wow these russians are extremely courageous, and i have to say, the germans are even more evil than i thought. Starving an entire city of 2.5 million people, kind of seems like a very big war crime... Well i guess that's kind of a short summary of ww2, courageous russians versus the evil germans.

[Taramriel]

The Communicst officials grew fat whilst the people made glue soup and cannibalised each other. Russian people are great, Russian leaders, terrible.

[calibre9mm]

wow man no-one us westerners could really relate to what the european civillians went thru in those times

[Suikoden420]

so true

[spencnaz]

Very very true and I'm from the US. When you get to see the results of the war 60 years on it makes you realize what happened there and the terrible costs paid in human life because of political and racial pride.

[DrCruel]

@calibre9mm But for the Russians under Bolshevism, this was almost normal. During the Holodomor, the Marxists forcibly starved not a city to death, but an entire people. Ukrainian farmers died in the millions of starvation as their food was stolen from them by Bolshevik commissars.

[DrCruel]

Hitler, a socialist, was outrageously brutal to the Soviet people. But the Bolsheviks killed more of them before WW II than the Nazis would kill throughout the war. And in fact many of the partisans who fought against the Nazis continued their fight once theRed Army returned, for four long years after the Second World War officially ended. The Bolshevik-led killings went on long after the war.

[endothaler]

isnt the term "damoosebelly" a term used by German soldiers to describe Russia?

[damoosebelly]

most certainly not...love the trite sense of humor, though ;)