Maxim! Bravo! Truly impressive. I can really not understand the polemic that seems to exist in the comments. Fascinating music, extraordinarily complex, and amazingly well played! Superb!
So I'll admit - I'm sort of close-minded. I want to like this. I really do. I mean, it's had a chance to learn from a few hundred years more than Bach. But it just doesn't sit with me. Bach seems more, uh, accessible. Is there a trick to accessing this, something special I should be paying attention to? What makes this interesting? I ask because I don't know, not because I doubt its interestingness. Any pointers?
@mmtrebuchet Dear Sir, I understand your disappointment about this music, but to understand it, you should know the history of these compositions, and the "history" of the composer. J. Demessieux, how was a genius and technically very gifted, while studing with Marcel Dupré, was invited by Dupré to write a very virtuosic work (Studies) for the Organ. This is the reason for which she wrote this impressive work, as a demonstration of the extent to which the Organ technique could be pushed to.
@musichiere70 Ah, I think I see what you mean - I was listening to the work like Bach, trying to extract a tune - but this isn't about a tune, it's about the instrument, the technique. With that in mind, it's very impressive! With Bach, it is OK to close your eyes and listen, but this etude is better appreciated with the video - watching this astonishing technique is the real marvel. I wish I had ankles like that!
@mmtrebuchet There certainly is an element of personal preference concerning any style of music on behalf of the listener. However it is rewarding to try to explore a creation beyond those initial boundries.
In his comment, Musichiere70 most accurately describes an approach to Mme Demessieux music. In extension, it is a great approach applicable to many creations that may seem less accessible upon first contact, but one that may eventually lead to exciting artistic discoveries.
I think that both original tommy and ThirtyTwoFoot are both wrong. Maxim is playing from a past up of the entire score - the approach most concert organists use. The reason it looks as though there is no score in the overhead shots is because the shield of the music desk light gets in the way. This is also why he does not need a page turner
@glenngrande I agree; utterly fantastic! Pedal octaves are notoriously difficult to play, and the fast passages are horrendously difficult, yet he pulls them off so easily! Thanks very much to the peformer and the poster!
@glenngrande I agree; utterly fantastic! Pedal octaves are notoriously difficult to play, and the fast passages are horrendously difficult, yet he pulls them off so easily! Thanks very much to the peformer and the poster! Qull magnifique!
@glenngrande I agree; utterly fantastic! Pedal octaves are notoriously difficult to play, and the fast passages are horrendously difficult, yet he pulls them off so easily! Thanks very much to the peformer and the poster! Quel magnifique!
ThirtyTwoFoot, there is no editing going on here as you say. Mr. Patel is a virtuoso, for one, two, his teacher studied with Demessieux herself, and three, he doesn't HAVE the score open on the music desk. He's got this piece memorized.
One thing is missing here.......the page turner! There is no way the player can take his hands off to turn, and in any case he would probably not reach as the music desk is so far away. It just goes to show that a great deal of editing has taken place here.
anybody who can play this etude is to be lauded. simply playing what's on the page is difficult enough. but demessieux knew what she was doing -- there is no need to add anything else to it. peter fennema's performance is the best i've ever heard by far out of about a dozen performances.
Jeanne Demessieux and Maxime Patel are both extraordinary. I love her works but, my God! what was she thinking? I felt like I had spiders crawling all over me until the end when I was able to finally brush them all off! lol One heck of an etude! BRAVO
Not necessarily. I mean, it seems excessive now, but back in the days of yore, before they improved that clunky, awkward invention called a coupler and moved the control down to the pedalboard, having (and needing) five manuals, one for each independent division, wasn't unusual. There are still uses for a fifth manual - it's usually the Solo for a reason. However, I think six is pushing it - nobody can reach up there. XD
You are preaching to the choir. I have played such instruments as the E. M. Skinner at St. Ann and the Holy Trinity in Brooklyn, NY and whenever I needed something from the 5th manual, I simply coupled it down to the 4th or even 3rd manual, using the appropriate unison off. More than four manuals is never necessary, in my view.
So, the question is, when does it cross the line from being Unnecessary But Awesome to Unnecessary And Stupid? Hell, with a digital combination action I think any decent performer ought to be able to take the Wanamaker and give a stunning rendition of Pictures At An Exhibition on the first three manuals alone. I'll concede the point, but in retrospect I think it really just boils down to personal taste. That said, if it were in my basement, I'd go with four. *runs*
To all laymen, please listen again, because, like a Picasso painting, modern music might be disturbing at first hearing. Besides, please consider that Mr. Patel's highly virtuosic performance is more precise and artistic than any olympic performance. To master such complex music - some of the most difficult ever written for organ - on that gigantic instrument is more challenging to a man than driving a Challenger shuttle. You could then be amazed by the «extreme» virtuosity of the performer.
Sorry, but from a a layman's point of view, this performance demonstrates the epitome of academic masterbation , IMHO.
And you organ virtuosos out there ponder why the 'King of Instruments' has little public appeal these days and recitals often do not attract standing room audiences...I think its because organists feel they must inflict such cacophony on the public.
To paraphrase a visual artitst, 'Art (in this case, Music) should not hurt the eyes(ears)....'
To pharrmoors: your musical incompetance hits you like a turd in the face. You know nothing and are not more than an infant when it comes to your stinking opinions.
Is there something WRONG with that? A recital isn't just one bloody piece long, you know. You educate people by slipping complex works like this in with the Bach and the Widor. You make it seem like this kind of music is all we play; most organists *can't* play works this difficult, and anyone who can OUGHT to be held in high regard.
Incidentally, it's plenty musical...the only reason your ears have to be hurting is an intolerance for mixtures and reeds.
@pharrmoors I fully agree with you about these studies!!! Regrettably they exercise a big fascination with all the organists and the music lovers who confuse(merge) technical performance and music! To criticize these studies recovers from a big taboo because they are considered unplayable
These spectacular Demessieux videos are on the Fugatto 025 DVD. I bought it from the Organ Historical Society (it is also available elsewhere). Aside from the wonderful performances, notice how well Federico Savio has recorded the performer so that you can see has hands and feet. These videos set a new high standard for the quality of organ performance recordings on YouTube (regardless of whether you appreciate Demessieux's compositions).
Excellent response! LOL!!!! I hate ass holes like this idiot. He SHOULD post himself playing this piece correctly since he's the expert. Ass wipes like this more often than not are not even musicians much less organists.......
Sorry, I normally keep it civil but I sort of lost is there. It is possible that this person has no idea that is peice is among the most physically difficult in the late literature. When one considers the diminutive woman that composed it, it is truly breath-taking.
Exactly! I'm with you, and no need to apologize. I haven't as much patience as you, and I tend to say the heck with being civil, just straighten them out. These posts are wonderful, and I wish that I could play like this gentleman and most other "real" organists for that matter. I appreciate them all and you as well for you obvious knowledge of the music written for the organ. Thank you!
...almost makes Sowerby's "Pageant" look easy.
kyotokid4 3 months ago
Maxim! Bravo! Truly impressive. I can really not understand the polemic that seems to exist in the comments. Fascinating music, extraordinarily complex, and amazingly well played! Superb!
jvinikour 7 months ago 4
This is my favorite movement of the exercises! Well played too!
carterdriggs 7 months ago 3
So I'll admit - I'm sort of close-minded. I want to like this. I really do. I mean, it's had a chance to learn from a few hundred years more than Bach. But it just doesn't sit with me. Bach seems more, uh, accessible. Is there a trick to accessing this, something special I should be paying attention to? What makes this interesting? I ask because I don't know, not because I doubt its interestingness. Any pointers?
mmtrebuchet 8 months ago
@mmtrebuchet Dear Sir, I understand your disappointment about this music, but to understand it, you should know the history of these compositions, and the "history" of the composer. J. Demessieux, how was a genius and technically very gifted, while studing with Marcel Dupré, was invited by Dupré to write a very virtuosic work (Studies) for the Organ. This is the reason for which she wrote this impressive work, as a demonstration of the extent to which the Organ technique could be pushed to.
musichiere70 8 months ago 4
@musichiere70 Ah, I think I see what you mean - I was listening to the work like Bach, trying to extract a tune - but this isn't about a tune, it's about the instrument, the technique. With that in mind, it's very impressive! With Bach, it is OK to close your eyes and listen, but this etude is better appreciated with the video - watching this astonishing technique is the real marvel. I wish I had ankles like that!
mmtrebuchet 8 months ago 4
@mmtrebuchet There certainly is an element of personal preference concerning any style of music on behalf of the listener. However it is rewarding to try to explore a creation beyond those initial boundries.
In his comment, Musichiere70 most accurately describes an approach to Mme Demessieux music. In extension, it is a great approach applicable to many creations that may seem less accessible upon first contact, but one that may eventually lead to exciting artistic discoveries.
AristideCavCol 8 months ago 3
Superb performance of this Etude. Maxime Patel presents a powerfull masterwork of Demessieux, using all his talent. Congratulations.
TheCatedral 9 months ago 3
You have to be what to play this piece like being in a promenade, a demigod? I cannot believe it took 3 dislikes.
voixdelabime 9 months ago 2
Forza Jack Penate
ryantbh 1 year ago 7
I think that both original tommy and ThirtyTwoFoot are both wrong. Maxim is playing from a past up of the entire score - the approach most concert organists use. The reason it looks as though there is no score in the overhead shots is because the shield of the music desk light gets in the way. This is also why he does not need a page turner
f600kcd 1 year ago
I would have believed there was no editing, until I noticed his book was open in some shots and not in others.
allanbars 1 year ago
Playing octaves is I think the most difficult technique in my opinion..... and he did it flawlessly!!!!
glenngrande 1 year ago
@glenngrande I agree; utterly fantastic! Pedal octaves are notoriously difficult to play, and the fast passages are horrendously difficult, yet he pulls them off so easily! Thanks very much to the peformer and the poster!
trompettechamade1 1 year ago
@glenngrande I agree; utterly fantastic! Pedal octaves are notoriously difficult to play, and the fast passages are horrendously difficult, yet he pulls them off so easily! Thanks very much to the peformer and the poster! Qull magnifique!
trompettechamade1 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@glenngrande I agree; utterly fantastic! Pedal octaves are notoriously difficult to play, and the fast passages are horrendously difficult, yet he pulls them off so easily! Thanks very much to the peformer and the poster! Quel magnifique!
trompettechamade1 1 year ago
Magnifique! Extremely difficult work very well done. Bravo!
firesong75 1 year ago
One word is all I can say: Unbelievable!!!
jv04jm 1 year ago
Magnifique, exemplaire. Sans commentaire. S'il existait une catégorie vingt étoiles, ce vidéo la mériterait. Bravo à Monsieur Patel.
TheCatedral 1 year ago
ThirtyTwoFoot, there is no editing going on here as you say. Mr. Patel is a virtuoso, for one, two, his teacher studied with Demessieux herself, and three, he doesn't HAVE the score open on the music desk. He's got this piece memorized.
originaltommy 1 year ago
@originaltommy Good for you! Somebody needed to say this! Patel is astounding! I've bought the DVD!
Larsky1010 1 year ago
One thing is missing here.......the page turner! There is no way the player can take his hands off to turn, and in any case he would probably not reach as the music desk is so far away. It just goes to show that a great deal of editing has taken place here.
ThirtyTwoFoot 1 year ago
10 fingers, 2 feet with the heel and toes playing, how on earth do you mange, absolutely fantastic!
lennieunderscoreboy 1 year ago
First rate playing indeed! BRAVO!
musicaorganum 1 year ago
anybody who can play this etude is to be lauded. simply playing what's on the page is difficult enough. but demessieux knew what she was doing -- there is no need to add anything else to it. peter fennema's performance is the best i've ever heard by far out of about a dozen performances.
lorganistic 2 years ago
Jeanne Demessieux and Maxime Patel are both extraordinary. I love her works but, my God! what was she thinking? I felt like I had spiders crawling all over me until the end when I was able to finally brush them all off! lol One heck of an etude! BRAVO
kempedkemp 2 years ago
Chamadewerk? Sounds more like Fartwerk.
PiedPuyper 2 years ago
I don't think anybody ever actually uses the sixth manual...it's probably just there for bragging rights and coupling purposes.
willowthebored 2 years ago
Even a FIFTH manual is preposterous - and totally unnecessary.
organman52 2 years ago
@organman52
Not necessarily. I mean, it seems excessive now, but back in the days of yore, before they improved that clunky, awkward invention called a coupler and moved the control down to the pedalboard, having (and needing) five manuals, one for each independent division, wasn't unusual. There are still uses for a fifth manual - it's usually the Solo for a reason. However, I think six is pushing it - nobody can reach up there. XD
willowthebored 2 years ago
You are preaching to the choir. I have played such instruments as the E. M. Skinner at St. Ann and the Holy Trinity in Brooklyn, NY and whenever I needed something from the 5th manual, I simply coupled it down to the 4th or even 3rd manual, using the appropriate unison off. More than four manuals is never necessary, in my view.
organman52 2 years ago
@organman52
So, the question is, when does it cross the line from being Unnecessary But Awesome to Unnecessary And Stupid? Hell, with a digital combination action I think any decent performer ought to be able to take the Wanamaker and give a stunning rendition of Pictures At An Exhibition on the first three manuals alone. I'll concede the point, but in retrospect I think it really just boils down to personal taste. That said, if it were in my basement, I'd go with four. *runs*
willowthebored 2 years ago
Academic..... maybe....?
Complicated.....definately....
Enjoyable.....undoubtably....
Even to the ear of a FOOL.....or "layman"
Mackaronni 2 years ago
@willow: You're totally wrong, read more abot Jeanne Demessieux please, and then you maybe understand this etudes.
rehruecken01A 2 years ago
To all laymen, please listen again, because, like a Picasso painting, modern music might be disturbing at first hearing. Besides, please consider that Mr. Patel's highly virtuosic performance is more precise and artistic than any olympic performance. To master such complex music - some of the most difficult ever written for organ - on that gigantic instrument is more challenging to a man than driving a Challenger shuttle. You could then be amazed by the «extreme» virtuosity of the performer.
keanur1 2 years ago
Maybe... but: not every modern music is good music only because it is modern and disturbing at first hearing.
You may find similar complex music in a Bach Triosonata on a baroque instrument.
It's very difficult to play, but I can't find why I should fall in love with this music.
sebastianKB 2 years ago 2
@sebastianKB And on the other hand, there are those of us that find this far more rewarding to hear/play than Bach.
mrn37 9 months ago 6
Sorry, but from a a layman's point of view, this performance demonstrates the epitome of academic masterbation , IMHO.
And you organ virtuosos out there ponder why the 'King of Instruments' has little public appeal these days and recitals often do not attract standing room audiences...I think its because organists feel they must inflict such cacophony on the public.
To paraphrase a visual artitst, 'Art (in this case, Music) should not hurt the eyes(ears)....'
I'm just sayin'
pharrmoors 2 years ago
To pharrmoors: your musical incompetance hits you like a turd in the face. You know nothing and are not more than an infant when it comes to your stinking opinions.
Sesquiltera 2 years ago
'Academic masturbation?'
Is there something WRONG with that? A recital isn't just one bloody piece long, you know. You educate people by slipping complex works like this in with the Bach and the Widor. You make it seem like this kind of music is all we play; most organists *can't* play works this difficult, and anyone who can OUGHT to be held in high regard.
Incidentally, it's plenty musical...the only reason your ears have to be hurting is an intolerance for mixtures and reeds.
willowthebored 2 years ago 2
@pharrmoors I fully agree with you about these studies!!! Regrettably they exercise a big fascination with all the organists and the music lovers who confuse(merge) technical performance and music! To criticize these studies recovers from a big taboo because they are considered unplayable
roethinger 8 months ago
Bravo !
cette enregistrement force le respect et la plus haute considération,
27bibi27 2 years ago
Wow, that's a large organ. I've never seen six manuals -- what's the sixth one called? Not a fan of the score, but LOVE the footwork on the pedals.
Doozieus 2 years ago
The sixth one is called
Chamadewerk unter Dach
organist12345 2 years ago
this organ is the same I have in my hall , in my House! but the neigborns sey me if I can to play lower!!
reivajthepianist 2 years ago
Am I the only one that finds this both frightening and hilarious at the same time?
csplendrig 3 years ago
Why hillarious?
Sesquiltera 2 years ago
These spectacular Demessieux videos are on the Fugatto 025 DVD. I bought it from the Organ Historical Society (it is also available elsewhere). Aside from the wonderful performances, notice how well Federico Savio has recorded the performer so that you can see has hands and feet. These videos set a new high standard for the quality of organ performance recordings on YouTube (regardless of whether you appreciate Demessieux's compositions).
dougjensen 3 years ago
T E R R I F I C !!!
organistspectacular 3 years ago
full of mistakes
ny1news 3 years ago
SO,we are all waiting for you to post yourself showing how it SHOULD be done....waiting.....waiting....uhh, I thought not.
pmzephyr22 3 years ago
Excellent response! LOL!!!! I hate ass holes like this idiot. He SHOULD post himself playing this piece correctly since he's the expert. Ass wipes like this more often than not are not even musicians much less organists.......
bhigdaddymark 3 years ago
Sorry, I normally keep it civil but I sort of lost is there. It is possible that this person has no idea that is peice is among the most physically difficult in the late literature. When one considers the diminutive woman that composed it, it is truly breath-taking.
pmzephyr22 3 years ago
Exactly! I'm with you, and no need to apologize. I haven't as much patience as you, and I tend to say the heck with being civil, just straighten them out. These posts are wonderful, and I wish that I could play like this gentleman and most other "real" organists for that matter. I appreciate them all and you as well for you obvious knowledge of the music written for the organ. Thank you!
bhigdaddymark 3 years ago
Let's see you play it!
Bachlives2 3 years ago
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lipsbach 3 years ago
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lipsbach 3 years ago
Demessieux is best when played in a large church and on a large organ. The music is more abstract than even Dupre. Thank-you for posting this.
redletterchurch 3 years ago
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roethinger 3 years ago
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roethinger 3 years ago
écrivez l'équivalent et nous en reparlerons!
757177 3 years ago
Wow! Thanks for posting this!
composerpan 3 years ago