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Ever? They shouldn't have asked in that context, but I certainly think there are times the police are within their rights to ask for an ID; at the very least, if you're doing something to an item of property that would be illegal to do if you weren't the owner (like jimmying a car door), they should ask for ID.
Bob Dylan strolling around a neighborhood after a long show, and gets caught up with the cops, when some guy somewhere is killing some other cat, or robin a bank. Real intelligent country we live in.
Ok....let's say bob is a child molester scoping out His next victim..oh don't check ID ..you a dumb ass with to much time on your hands please get back to the real world..
@ernestgonz So is it going to say Child Molester on his drivers license? If you want to live in a country where men with guns can force you to prove who you are... then you need to hop in a time machine and go back to Germany during the late 30's.
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penn, you ought to check out the jericomovie channel. he has a lot of interesting things to say about moral absolutes, and i think you would like him.
I'm 22, I"m a big Bob Dylan fan, and once I graduate from college in about 6 months, I intend to get into law enforcement.
This seems to just be a Terry Stop that happens all the time. Basically, from Terry v. Ohio, officers can stop and frisk people with a reasonable suspicion burden of proof (51% sure) that a crime is being committed or about to be committed. Most states also have "stop and identify" laws which require people that have been stopped by police to identify themselves.
Maybe law enforcement officers are being pressured with too much responsibility? Not where I live, but it could be problem in this situation. Friendly dialog helps develop a relationship with officers - rather than assuming an authoritarian role and attempting to force the general public into submission. I've experienced both approaches and the former instilled a sense of security and respect for the officers.
Bob Dylan is an American legend and I am truly proud to be from the same country as he is. He'd probably hate that statement but whatever. I could watch footage of him from the mid 60's for hours and if you watch No Direction Home you will (as well as a bunch of other great videos of other artists). I love that he was looking in an old house.
Agreed. With police powers being what they are, this entire nation is a check point.
I actually disagree, if the cop didn't know who Dylan was and he saw him looking in the windows of an old house the cop had a right to ask for ID. The sad truth is that people lie, and although making the hotel vouch for his name is extreme if anything were to happen to that property they would at least know that a man named Bob Dylan was looking around that place, it's kind of suspicious.
hmm, you ever heard of nazi germany "show me your papers!" what if you don't have your ID on you? what would you let the cop arrest you? perhaps soon enoough youll be considered a terrorist if you dont have an ID. is that what you want?
Yes I have but there's good news. This isn't Nazi Germany. If someone look like they were stealing your car would you want someone to stop them or be afraid of looking like some Nazi. Bob Dylan was doing something suspicious and although it doesn't seem like it all that often cops are essentally there to serve and protect.
umm,hello...if you dont have a valid id then you are either:1)bob dylan,aka-robert zimmerman,or 2)someone who wants trouble from the cops,...i prefer to carry a simple thing called a wallet with my drivers license(how unusual)since it comes in handy when i need to go out and drive to the store,but peeps like bob dont have these worryys....because we all know that they want to arrest someone and ittl be you if your stupid enough to allow it!
Thanks Penn for you insight and comments. The guy who called Obama a Nazi has a right to speak his opinion,but it was the 9/11 that changed all of that. I now carry my ID everywhere in my pocket because now they HAVE the right (whether we like it or not) to stop us and detain us if necessary. This type of Nazi control started with GW Bush, not Obama. I doubt that we will ever go back to the way it was, the good old days....
Bob Dylan rocks. Im guna watch your stuff now because you are a Dylan fan as well. and you seem like a cool guy... I believe now is the time for your tears haha good stuff
i agree that we shouldn't need to show our "papers" but if someone is doing anything remotely suspicious i also believe that the police have an obligation to take every step necessary to rule out harm. if a guy with a history of burglary was lurking around a house and they called it in it'd matter. since its bob dylan, it didn't, and looks like harassment.
I thought this issue was resolved about twenty years ago? The supreme court ruled that people are not required to show the cops an ID just for the hell of it.
I feel that Identification can be used for security reasons however I don't believe that mandating people carry ID on them at all times is a good idea.
BUT... This is a tricky issue. As a general principle, citizens who are minding their own business are not obligated to "show their papers" to police. In fact, there is no law requiring citizens to carry identification of any kind.
Nonetheless, carrying an ID is generally required when you're driving a vehicle or a passenger on a commercial airline. These requirements have been upheld on the premise that individuals who prefer not to carry ID can choose not to drive or fly.
What really bothered me about all those cutesy articles was the implicit assumption in them that Bob Dylan should somehow be treated differently by the police just because he's famous.
Where were the libertarians defending Gates? Where was the outrage? Most of what I heard was (ex:) "stupid racist gates should know better!" and "when the cops are around you must OBEY!!!"
I think the cops did the smart thing...rolling up on a house and see some guy wandering around, and when asked his name, says "Bob Dylan". 9 out of 10 cops would have said, "yeah, and I'm the pope" and arrested him on the spot for being a smart-ass. These were actually decent cops that took the time to go get an ID and keep an innocent from holding up the system and making the rest of us pay for it via taxes because they didn't have an ego to maintain.
I'm sure if it had been a wanted pedophile or arsonist or carjacker or building bomber... and they hadn't checked ID and he got away... everyone's story would be different. It's a matter of moderation and people can't seem to think in anything but absolutes. We have rules as guides and people to enforce them that we are supposed to trust. If we don't trust the people instead of the rules... that's the problem... that is why this society is fucked.
famous white guy gets arrested and you don't hear about it for 3 weeks. Same week Obamas black buddy gets arrested and thats all you hear about. All you have to do is cooperate, not call the cops motherfucker, and you will be on your way.
There's always a time and a place to ask for ID. If you're just walking down the street, no you don't need to provide it without reasonable cause. If you were snooping around houses, then sure that's suspecious activity.
Number 1 situation where ID check is a must: Credit card uses. First-line of defense against identity theft once your cards get lifted.
What about a civil problem without any police involvement like a traffic accident equalling more than $500 damage?
The last time I checked, California law says people need to disclose and report auto accidents, if personal/property damages are more than $500.
By Law, should we allow civilians to collect personal info from other civilians, in a civil case where no laws were broken...and the $500 damage limit is debatable?
Perhaps they asked him for his name and he told them the truth. And hearing such familiar name they perhaps wanted to check it out in case it was false.
They may not have known what he looks like but had probably heard of him.
I agree with him. I think its another small violation of our personal rights and freedoms. Our government is too big. The only ones that benefit from a government such as ours is the people in power, not the citizens.
Not all states have stop-and-identify laws, and it's up to you (the citizen) to know if your state does, or not.
If Bob Dylan was poking around an abandon building at night then the police have reasonable suspicion that a crime might be occurring, or will occur. In this instance stop-and-identify applies.
You can always refuse to present ID. It's up to you to decide if it's worth the trouble.
It's funny how people think, most people would agree with you " How Dare they ask Bob Dylan for his ID, we shouldn't have to prove who we are"
But when you hear the police stopped Mr. Terrorist but didn't ask him for his ID & he goes out & does something EVIL. You'll hear on the news, if the police after stopping just ran him through the system they would of found out he was on the FBI's top 10 most wanted & they could of stopped him before he did it.
Cops carry a little wallet with the pictures and descriptions of the top 10 most wanted. Also with people who have big warrants in there jurisdiction. They do this so they DONT HAVE TO get the ID. They can see a crack-head with a warrant in a crack area and pull right up on him and arrest him.
My point is cops know who have warrants and such and I believe that this instance with Dylan was kind of unnecessary.
Well normally I agree with you with almost everything you say in fact I sometimes wonder if I traveled back through time and became you (we even look alike) except for the manga thing I can't believe you don't like manga. But anyway it sounds like the police didn't do anything, maybe they had no reason to ask him for an id but just asking is no big deal. If someone is doing something suspicious you might not want to take their word for it that they aren't doing anything wrong.
lol yeah I think the new dub is a little better Where tetuso says "they don't care (who their messiah is) as long as he destroys things" and the part where the voice of reason says tetsuo isn't a god and some one else is like: "aw shut up" and pushes him off the car. Screw the gift of a bible someone should give penn the gift of akira after a show lol. He could do a blog on it. Did you know they're making a new one? Tommy from third roc is plasying tetsuo....I could totaly see him in a way
I think it was ok to ask for ID but from that point having to prove the ID is legitimate was uncalled for. PS please tell Penn I love BS and have it on dvd
To answer your question: I see this as a big deal when abused, but not when done lawfully.
I think when an officer can articulate a suspicion that a crime involved, it's reasonable for him to ask a citizen to identify himself and log the contact in case a crime is actually committed.
I don't think it's reasonable (or even tolerable) for an officer to demand ID from a citizen at random without such suspicion.
I can't agree more. This happened to me once when I was in college.
I was meeting my girlfriend in front of certain building one night and we were going to walk back to my house. When I spotted her I crossed the street to go over to her and this police officer approaches us and asks what we we're doing. After we told him we were just walking, he asks us both for IDs and runs a background check on us.
Where do cops get off asking anyone anywhere for IDs when they're doing nothing wrong?
I value freedom more than safety because what value does safety have if I can't enjoy myself in the manner I choose. I also see nothing wrong with the police asking for id just as much as my right to refuse to provide an answer.
There is a distinction between presenting an ID Document and identifying yourself.
In most states, a policeman who has an articulable suspicion you might have committed, are committing, or will commit a crime can detain you and require you to identify yourself. This is so they can account for those present if a crime does occur. But they have to be able to articulate the suspicion later.
To identify yourself, you can say your name, birth date, etc. You do not need a document.
You're wrong on this one. People need to carry ID all the time. Cop's don't know who they are dealing with. Every time they approach someone it could be a wanted Criminal, it protects us all.
It's called "privacy rights". Like free speech. What country are you from? Do you have rights there? Or do you like getting beaten when you say the wrong thing?
Our basic civil rights protect us all, more than any police can.
How does the ID protect anyone? Even if he had been a wanted criminal, it wouldn't have said so on the ID. Do you expect police to memorise the names of all wanted criminals? Throughout history, one of the main uses of ID laws (possibly THE main use), has been to let police harass people (usually from whatever group is despised at the time) when they have no evidence for any normal crimes.
Do I expect the police to memorize all perps names? Yes I do. It just makes sense to have ID on you at all times. Simply prove you're cool and move on.
So anyone should be able to go anywhere and do anything, anytime they want.And not have to prove who they are. That's scary stuff there.You Hippies are scare me a lot.
When all the dipshit media can do is comment on "OMG they didn't recognize him! hee hee" it pisses me off so much.
I read this story and reacted with anger at the absolute idiocy of these assholes not to realize that YOU DONT HAVE TO PROVE WHO YOU ARE IN A FREE COUNTRY!!!!!
"Papers please" that's NAZI FUCKING GERMANY SHIT! Why would anyone defend that?!
Maybe we can get Bob Dylan a lapel pin with a "star" proving that he's a famous star... WTF
My reading of the press reports is that Dylan volunteered to go with the cops back to the hotel. So he may have been free to refuse.
But I agree, when the police "ask" you to do something there is an implicite threat of violence behind the request. That's why I said it was a tougher call and didn't say it was OK.
Bob Dylans music will always leave an impression on music for ever, his lyrics were powerful. But as an idol, im sad to say, hes not. I cant think of one instance, he was actually protesting. He was in his music, but if your going to do that type of music, you have to show up to a protest every now and again.... Otherwise some will think your just a protest/hippy time profiteer.
no i think it is alright to a certain degree. It is not required to have an ID, not required to have a driver's license . But a cop at any point should be able to see someone out of the ordinary and ask for ID, if they have one, to check to see if the man is a wanted man or a fugitive of the law or flagged in the system for some reason or another.
It should be their right, but the cops get a right like that and they will always take it too far.
A cop's job gives him the right to decide what is ordinary or requires special attention. its part of their job.
whether its suspicious smells inside a car (drugs), odors coming from a house (dead body), or a suspicious package left at the airport.
ATM in the USA legally the government can hold you indefinitely with no charges or evidence if they believe it a threat to national security. They don't need to prove it, they don't care about your "rights". That is where it goes too far.
Penn is so right here...who cares if it's Bob Dylan or Joe Schmoe? If no crime is involved, or even suspicion, why do you need to prove who you are? I'm appalled by the submission of young people now...Look at the comments here.
I'm a big fan of Penn but this Libertarian stuff goes too far. It is no problem to ask a guy who looks like he is snooping around aimlessly for his I.D. Freedom doesn't mean that you are free to do anything society just short of a crime, there are many precautionary things done in our society to help keep us safe.
There are absolutes in life, and liberty is one of them. At least the definition that this country was founded on. Be very careful about what you give away, it doesn't come back. If you feel like you need to give up liberty to be "safe", you may find you have neither.
If I choose to peer into the windows of a house, and a cop rolls by, I would expect the cop to stop and ask for ID if he chooses. I wouldn't expect to get tasered.
We need I.D.s. We need to know who you are so you're not mistaken for a criminal with warrants outstanding. We need to know if you're on the sex offender registry especially if you're hanging out at a playground. We need to know if you live in the house you claim is yours, or if you're a stalker with a restraining order. We need to know if the name on your ID matches the one on your gun permit, prescriptions, vehicle registration, etc. Or else you'd be outraged that you weren't being protected.
Totally unrelated to the vid, but: The sidebar ad is for "Moxie" Girlz. ;) I just thought that was kind of ironic as it's Penn's daughter's name and it's not a word y'hear very often. :)
As for the "girlz" themselves? They appear to be little more than a slightly less abrasive version of the Bratz dolls. Great. Just what we needed.
I think there is nothing wrong with asking for ID in this case. I am a Bob Dylan fan and I might not be able to recognize him on the street, so I might react the same way. If someone claimed to be any celebrity I might find it suspicious. For example, let's say that some crazy dude was looking through the house and the cops asked him who he was and he said: "I'm Bill Clinton" or "I'm Batman" or any other name of renown. I think the cops were right to be mistrusting.
I'm sure that to a libertarian, having to show ID to police is a big deal, but in the real world, we are just talking about a cop who is too young to know who Bob Dylan is.
Hell, I'm 21 and if I was a cop and I saw an old man looking spaced out, standing around starring at an abandoned building in the middle of the night, I'd probably ask him for ID. For all I know, he could be like my grandfather with Alzheimers and he needs to get home.
It's fascinating that so many people don't understand why a society where you can be demanded to prove who you are at a moments notice is reprehensible.
LITERALLY one step away from tattoos on our arms, and ghetto curfew.
sorry Penn-lack of id leads to taking him back to the hotel, he's vouched for- NO WANTS OR WARRANTS are found active for him-he's THEN free to go-had he had id at the scene-they'd have checked for active wants/warrants, found none-he's free to go [bear in mind the cop has NO clue who he is, which is the sad part-any music listener SHOULD know of him, if not all about him, like people our age would]
when i refused to show id when just walking, one angry cop said to me, "while you're defending your civil liberties, you're wasting our time!" well too bad. don't waste your time stopping people just going for a walk.
AGREED! But I think that's why it's important to ALWAYS carry a smart phone with you and record the authorities. On the job means on the record! Next time..ASK THE POLICEMAN for HIS/HER ID!
I'm gonna have to disagree with Penn on this one. I think it's fine for police to ask for I.D. with anyone they interact with, so that if something did happen or happens later, they know who they were talking with. In fact, I think it's the law that anyone must present I.D. to a peace officer upon demand, driving or not. If the officer didn't know who he is, I think that's fine. He was just doing his job.
Hearing this reminds me of the national ID plan. I agree that if a person is clearly doing nothing wrong, a simple acknowledgment from the officer would be okay. I also say that if you are not doing anything wrong, why should you have a problem showing an officer your id.
Every state in the union has a state issue id, and without that, an officer can detain you until your identity can be confirmed. That should only happen when no harm is being done.
I understand the ideal for absolute personal liberty. I don't understand how having to show your ID under specific circumstances violates personal liberty.
@jjrglobal - I'm not saying the police are infallible and that they are just "doing their job" but they do place their lives on the line. If the police did not bother insisting and Bob Dylan turned out to be a house burglar, the police would be faulted for not insisting on checking, no? So damned if they do, damned if they don't?
the police are not held responsible for not checking every single random persons ID. Ordering a citizen to show ID for just walking around and sightseeing is wrong. If he was a burglar then check his ID when he is breaking and entering. If Bob was breaking and entering and they saw that then that'd be totally different.
@splein23 - The problem is, from Penn's video, is that you don't get the full news story.
From all accounts, Bob Dylan was wearing a hood on a rainy day peering into houses. The police were absolutely correct in insisting on identification.
If it was any random guy instead of an icon, it wouldn't even be a news story. If a hooded guy was looking into houses on my block, i'd call the police and want them to be damned sure of who he was and what he was doing.
cops can ask questions but they shouldn't accuse people of maybe doing something. Which is why I don't like police check points because they're assuming your drunk and then when you stop they talk to and then find out you're innocent. I know of personal stories where people were acting suspicious and people called the police and caught a burglar but it's not always right in every case. My main point is that you shouldn't get arrested for not being able to prove who you are.
@splein23 - I agree, the police should not detain you simply for being unable to prove who you are. But that's not what the point was.
If you are doing something awfully suspicious (peering into houses wearing something that obstructs a view of your face) while being unable to prove who you are and what you were doing is a different story.
The police would get an equal number of angry people if the police simply let the guy go and he broke into a house and stole things/hurt someone. Lose/lose?
I am not saying you should be compelled to, I am saying, I don't blame a cop for detaining you until they make sure. Cops are there to protect us. While there may be some dick cops, they are still there to protect us.
And anyone with a gun gets a yes sir from me anyway, but I know what a slug can do to flesh if you piss off a cop.
i get asked for my ID taking a walk at night. i get searched, i get my name taking down. because i was talking a walk on the sidewalk. at night. in my neighborhood.
same thing happened to me just walking on the sidewalk at night, except i didn't get searched. i had no id on me and i told them i didn't think i had to answer all their questions when i'm just going for a walk. eventually 4 police cars showed up, including the police chief. i respectfully stood my ground and they eventually let me go after like 40 minutes. pretty ridiculous i say.
I agree with you, but the supreme court under Clinton ruled that failure to show ID to a cop was disobeying a lawful order. The way the constitution is being currently "interpreted" the cop has every right to demand ID, and your SOL if you don't have one.
I remember when it happened, I heard it on the news, and i expected outrage. Hell I was outraged. But the only reaction i saw was a bunch of heads nodding. Free doesn't mean what you think it means anymore.
If the policeman doesn't ask for confirmation of identity, and then later that same person is found to have killed someone or whatever, then the cop would be held accountable. He'll be asked why he didn't stop the guy before he did something wrong, and the answer is when the cop was talking to him, he didn't know who he was, whether or not he had prior convictions, and he hadn't done anything illegal yet.
There isn't a good answer to this. Either way, the cop is screwed, and we're screwed.
Good response!! It's a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation. Both positions have negative consequences. It's up to society to decide which is the lesser of 2 evils.
i dotn think i agree with penn here, why should celebs get special treatment, if the cop didnt know who dylan was but knew OF him, and this guy claimed to be dylan, you kinda wanna make sure hes not lying or anything, hence the purpose of a ID
I don't believe he DOES have to show an ID (unless of course he's actually driving).
As the law stands now he has to STATE his name--but he doesn't have to PROVE he is who he says he is.
Although, if he was actually on someone's property and looking into a window, that's probably technically a crime--so the officers may have been offerring him a "deal" by saying if he SHOWS his ID they won't arrest him.
I am constantly being stopped in my neighborhood and questioned for minutes at a time for taking walks at night in my neighborhood, when I'm home from school. It's happened three times this summer. I'm a college student, so my sleep schedule is pretty whacked even when I'm home, but anytime after sundown is fair game for me to be asked for my ID, my criminal history (none), what my business is, etc., etc.
one time a cop asked for my ID when i was just walking down the road (dressed like a freak, yes, but still, i was just walking) and i responded with, "vere are your papers, heir jew?"
Yeah they tend to get pissed about that. I've had similar shit happen to me. The weird thing though is it's always by cops who have seen me at work (subway) and I live in a small town. The rookie cops are the worst about it b/c they're just too antsy about shit.
i discovered Bob when i was 19, 4years ago, and he is one of my favorite artist.
i disagree with the ID thing. they check ID's to make sure you're not wanted for anything and, if it's a traffic stop, to make sure the car isn't stolen. also, what about passports?
The only time you have to provide ID is if you are driving a car, otherwise all you have to provide is your name and address if asked by a police officer. This is the law in most states, though it does differ from state to state.
if you are not driving a car and they do not have reasonable suspicion for criminal activity, you usually don't even have to give them your name or address.
Actually, if they ask, yes you do, and if you refuse to give your name and address then they can arrest you until they can figure out who you are. This is established law in most states. However, you do not have to show ID, unless driving a car. If you really dont want to give your name I guess you could make one up since you do not have to show ID.
that's not true. stop spreading false info. go look up the law. they can ask you, but you don't have to answer. they need "reasonable suspicion" for you to be required to answer...and that's in states that have "stop and identify" laws. i believe 24 states have them. and btw, they can't arrest you without "probable cause"
false. that is not the law in any state, nevermind most states. you are NOT always required to give them your name/address when not driving a car. go look up the law yourself. seriously go do it and educate yourself.
You are correct, you do not have to answer, the Fifth Amendment gives you that right, but if you do not they can arrest you until they can find out who you are. The Supreme Court has already ruled on this, why you dont go educate yourself. 'Reasonable suspicion?' Do you think that really matters? Yes it should but do you really think it does?
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OJHanz 9 months ago
Ever? They shouldn't have asked in that context, but I certainly think there are times the police are within their rights to ask for an ID; at the very least, if you're doing something to an item of property that would be illegal to do if you weren't the owner (like jimmying a car door), they should ask for ID.
IoEstasCedonta 9 months ago
Well said!
JPMagicca 10 months ago
love. penn.
spershall 1 year ago
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VelariValencia 1 year ago
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Bob can peer into my home anytime he wants.
letsif 1 year ago
Bob Dylan strolling around a neighborhood after a long show, and gets caught up with the cops, when some guy somewhere is killing some other cat, or robin a bank. Real intelligent country we live in.
dirtynuke 1 year ago
Ok....let's say bob is a child molester scoping out His next victim..oh don't check ID ..you a dumb ass with to much time on your hands please get back to the real world..
ernestgonz 1 year ago
@ernestgonz So is it going to say Child Molester on his drivers license? If you want to live in a country where men with guns can force you to prove who you are... then you need to hop in a time machine and go back to Germany during the late 30's.
heylover3 1 year ago
Hi Penn fans. Penn Says videos have been discontinued, so you won't be seeing any new content on here. You can check out our Profile on our Channel Page for more info. We'll still be checking in, so hope to keep chatting with you all! Thanks!
pennsays 1 year ago
bob smells
that cheap bastard
yorkandpomona 1 year ago
penn, you ought to check out the jericomovie channel. he has a lot of interesting things to say about moral absolutes, and i think you would like him.
zach9899 1 year ago
I'm 22, I"m a big Bob Dylan fan, and once I graduate from college in about 6 months, I intend to get into law enforcement.
This seems to just be a Terry Stop that happens all the time. Basically, from Terry v. Ohio, officers can stop and frisk people with a reasonable suspicion burden of proof (51% sure) that a crime is being committed or about to be committed. Most states also have "stop and identify" laws which require people that have been stopped by police to identify themselves.
macatron 2 years ago
@macatron And apparently it's case law in New Jersey where this happened.
pennsays 1 year ago
Maybe law enforcement officers are being pressured with too much responsibility? Not where I live, but it could be problem in this situation. Friendly dialog helps develop a relationship with officers - rather than assuming an authoritarian role and attempting to force the general public into submission. I've experienced both approaches and the former instilled a sense of security and respect for the officers.
bitRAKE 2 years ago
Bob Dylan is an American legend and I am truly proud to be from the same country as he is. He'd probably hate that statement but whatever. I could watch footage of him from the mid 60's for hours and if you watch No Direction Home you will (as well as a bunch of other great videos of other artists). I love that he was looking in an old house.
Agreed. With police powers being what they are, this entire nation is a check point.
VictoryCough 2 years ago
I actually disagree, if the cop didn't know who Dylan was and he saw him looking in the windows of an old house the cop had a right to ask for ID. The sad truth is that people lie, and although making the hotel vouch for his name is extreme if anything were to happen to that property they would at least know that a man named Bob Dylan was looking around that place, it's kind of suspicious.
bigbignnasty 2 years ago
hmm, you ever heard of nazi germany "show me your papers!" what if you don't have your ID on you? what would you let the cop arrest you? perhaps soon enoough youll be considered a terrorist if you dont have an ID. is that what you want?
guitaraddict4life 2 years ago
Yes I have but there's good news. This isn't Nazi Germany. If someone look like they were stealing your car would you want someone to stop them or be afraid of looking like some Nazi. Bob Dylan was doing something suspicious and although it doesn't seem like it all that often cops are essentally there to serve and protect.
bigbignnasty 2 years ago
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Bob Dylan should be arrested.
potamuspeter 2 years ago
dylan was magic...and i wasnt even around for his era.
mysticx0 2 years ago
Bob Dylan is one of the greatest artists ever at all.
KurbyTBB 2 years ago
This comment has received too many negative votes show
Bob dillan is a dick.....so is his "step daughter"....
igknightus 2 years ago
i showed a cop what happens when you say " what are you doing?" to me. Got tailed for over a month. Couldnt even walk my dog.
Z1CAUSEDEATH 2 years ago
Nice quote at the end haha
badtown88 2 years ago
I'm 14 and i love Bob Dylan, and this 24 year old guy didn't? That's so sad.
AwesomeV2 2 years ago 2
Good god I lol'd at "Do some bob dylan profiling. Maybe get a beer with the president."
Spo8 2 years ago 2
umm,hello...if you dont have a valid id then you are either:1)bob dylan,aka-robert zimmerman,or 2)someone who wants trouble from the cops,...i prefer to carry a simple thing called a wallet with my drivers license(how unusual)since it comes in handy when i need to go out and drive to the store,but peeps like bob dont have these worryys....because we all know that they want to arrest someone and ittl be you if your stupid enough to allow it!
ocolet1964 2 years ago
You technically don't have to prove who you are unless you are driving. The police don't believe that though.
AndrewBroxton 2 years ago
Thanks Penn for you insight and comments. The guy who called Obama a Nazi has a right to speak his opinion,but it was the 9/11 that changed all of that. I now carry my ID everywhere in my pocket because now they HAVE the right (whether we like it or not) to stop us and detain us if necessary. This type of Nazi control started with GW Bush, not Obama. I doubt that we will ever go back to the way it was, the good old days....
dwnull 2 years ago
Penn and Teller is a real cool guy. He leiks Bob Dylan and doesn't afraid of anything.
NexIuguolo 2 years ago
It's happened to me, and I may not be famous, but I'm in full agreement.
aldfkjldasfkj 2 years ago
Bob Dylan rocks. Im guna watch your stuff now because you are a Dylan fan as well. and you seem like a cool guy... I believe now is the time for your tears haha good stuff
luckytigers8 2 years ago
I actually live where bob dylan gew up, and just a couple blocks away from his old house
mitchskater 2 years ago
i agree that we shouldn't need to show our "papers" but if someone is doing anything remotely suspicious i also believe that the police have an obligation to take every step necessary to rule out harm. if a guy with a history of burglary was lurking around a house and they called it in it'd matter. since its bob dylan, it didn't, and looks like harassment.
penn rocks!
anonazero 2 years ago
A lot of great thoughts for a pretty tricky situation. Thanks for sharing guys!
pennsays 2 years ago
I agree 1000% If you're not breaking the law then you should not be asked for ID!
20lbsledge 2 years ago 5
Robert Zimmerman right?
20lbsledge 2 years ago
I thought this issue was resolved about twenty years ago? The supreme court ruled that people are not required to show the cops an ID just for the hell of it.
wolfinside 2 years ago
I feel that Identification can be used for security reasons however I don't believe that mandating people carry ID on them at all times is a good idea.
WarcowUshi 2 years ago
I agree.
BUT... This is a tricky issue. As a general principle, citizens who are minding their own business are not obligated to "show their papers" to police. In fact, there is no law requiring citizens to carry identification of any kind.
Nonetheless, carrying an ID is generally required when you're driving a vehicle or a passenger on a commercial airline. These requirements have been upheld on the premise that individuals who prefer not to carry ID can choose not to drive or fly.
topangapan 2 years ago
What really bothered me about all those cutesy articles was the implicit assumption in them that Bob Dylan should somehow be treated differently by the police just because he's famous.
bklimt 2 years ago
Where were the libertarians defending Gates? Where was the outrage? Most of what I heard was (ex:) "stupid racist gates should know better!" and "when the cops are around you must OBEY!!!"
Please give me a link.
debaser71 2 years ago
I think the cops did the smart thing...rolling up on a house and see some guy wandering around, and when asked his name, says "Bob Dylan". 9 out of 10 cops would have said, "yeah, and I'm the pope" and arrested him on the spot for being a smart-ass. These were actually decent cops that took the time to go get an ID and keep an innocent from holding up the system and making the rest of us pay for it via taxes because they didn't have an ego to maintain.
enjoue 2 years ago
I'm sure if it had been a wanted pedophile or arsonist or carjacker or building bomber... and they hadn't checked ID and he got away... everyone's story would be different. It's a matter of moderation and people can't seem to think in anything but absolutes. We have rules as guides and people to enforce them that we are supposed to trust. If we don't trust the people instead of the rules... that's the problem... that is why this society is fucked.
montblanckupo 2 years ago
famous white guy gets arrested and you don't hear about it for 3 weeks. Same week Obamas black buddy gets arrested and thats all you hear about. All you have to do is cooperate, not call the cops motherfucker, and you will be on your way.
beetlekill123 2 years ago
That's really simple. Have you not ever seen those commercials about writing checks instead of using debit cards?
poorkinghaggard 2 years ago
There's always a time and a place to ask for ID. If you're just walking down the street, no you don't need to provide it without reasonable cause. If you were snooping around houses, then sure that's suspecious activity.
Number 1 situation where ID check is a must: Credit card uses. First-line of defense against identity theft once your cards get lifted.
blipbo 2 years ago 3
This is true.
What about a civil problem without any police involvement like a traffic accident equalling more than $500 damage?
The last time I checked, California law says people need to disclose and report auto accidents, if personal/property damages are more than $500.
By Law, should we allow civilians to collect personal info from other civilians, in a civil case where no laws were broken...and the $500 damage limit is debatable?
ZombiedustXXX 2 years ago
Perhaps they asked him for his name and he told them the truth. And hearing such familiar name they perhaps wanted to check it out in case it was false.
They may not have known what he looks like but had probably heard of him.
pete975 2 years ago 2
I agree with him. I think its another small violation of our personal rights and freedoms. Our government is too big. The only ones that benefit from a government such as ours is the people in power, not the citizens.
funnygreenmen 2 years ago
Not all states have stop-and-identify laws, and it's up to you (the citizen) to know if your state does, or not.
If Bob Dylan was poking around an abandon building at night then the police have reasonable suspicion that a crime might be occurring, or will occur. In this instance stop-and-identify applies.
You can always refuse to present ID. It's up to you to decide if it's worth the trouble.
microsystem 2 years ago
It's funny how people think, most people would agree with you " How Dare they ask Bob Dylan for his ID, we shouldn't have to prove who we are"
But when you hear the police stopped Mr. Terrorist but didn't ask him for his ID & he goes out & does something EVIL. You'll hear on the news, if the police after stopping just ran him through the system they would of found out he was on the FBI's top 10 most wanted & they could of stopped him before he did it.
funeralsong34 2 years ago
Thumbs up. This man makes sense.
JonTerp 2 years ago 2
Cops carry a little wallet with the pictures and descriptions of the top 10 most wanted. Also with people who have big warrants in there jurisdiction. They do this so they DONT HAVE TO get the ID. They can see a crack-head with a warrant in a crack area and pull right up on him and arrest him.
My point is cops know who have warrants and such and I believe that this instance with Dylan was kind of unnecessary.
MrTaylorN 2 years ago
As usual, a lot of folks agree with Penn. Any souls out there disagree and not see the big deal in being asked for ID?
pennsays 2 years ago
Well normally I agree with you with almost everything you say in fact I sometimes wonder if I traveled back through time and became you (we even look alike) except for the manga thing I can't believe you don't like manga. But anyway it sounds like the police didn't do anything, maybe they had no reason to ask him for an id but just asking is no big deal. If someone is doing something suspicious you might not want to take their word for it that they aren't doing anything wrong.
Limejello10512 2 years ago
oh and btw with regard to manga penn if you want a good commentary on human nature, corrupt government and religion I suggest renting/buying akira
(Though it has psychic powers it's a sci fi movie so I think it's okay)
Limejello10512 2 years ago
i love that movie, and my sisters name is akira
screaming4moreramen 2 years ago
lol yeah I think the new dub is a little better Where tetuso says "they don't care (who their messiah is) as long as he destroys things" and the part where the voice of reason says tetsuo isn't a god and some one else is like: "aw shut up" and pushes him off the car. Screw the gift of a bible someone should give penn the gift of akira after a show lol. He could do a blog on it. Did you know they're making a new one? Tommy from third roc is plasying tetsuo....I could totaly see him in a way
Limejello10512 2 years ago
I think it was ok to ask for ID but from that point having to prove the ID is legitimate was uncalled for. PS please tell Penn I love BS and have it on dvd
marktisgod 2 years ago
"As usual, a lot of folks agree with Penn. Any souls out there disagree and not see the big deal in being asked for ID?"
I disagree with Penn.
jinitron 2 years ago
No, I don't see "the big deal" about showing an ID here. The phrase, "The big deal" is your interpretation.
If someone was snooping around my house, and a cop rolled by, I would hope the cop would ask the person for an ID.
Do all of us want do-nothing cops, that are 1/2 cop and 1/2 lawyer? I worry a lot more about the illegal actions of law enforcement.
Dylan could get a fanboy/lawyer to work pro bono on this, if he feels there is an issue.
I live in the real world.
ZombiedustXXX 2 years ago
To answer your question: I see this as a big deal when abused, but not when done lawfully.
I think when an officer can articulate a suspicion that a crime involved, it's reasonable for him to ask a citizen to identify himself and log the contact in case a crime is actually committed.
I don't think it's reasonable (or even tolerable) for an officer to demand ID from a citizen at random without such suspicion.
See: en.wikipedia (dot) org /wiki/Stop_and_Identify_statutes
VeniVidiVid 2 years ago 4
I agree
DeathstarGalactica 2 years ago
100% Correct!
atchisrj1 2 years ago
Agreed. As a side note, I love your Showtime Bullshit show. Lie Detector is one of my favs. I'm still practicing
DrakIems 2 years ago
They insist on ID because we live in fascism, PAPERS PLEASE!!!
NO TICKET!
UrinationNation 2 years ago
man the show penn & teller rocks!
legomii 2 years ago
He was looking for the house where Springsteen wrote "Born to Run". That's what I heard.
JugglingG 2 years ago
I can't agree more. This happened to me once when I was in college.
I was meeting my girlfriend in front of certain building one night and we were going to walk back to my house. When I spotted her I crossed the street to go over to her and this police officer approaches us and asks what we we're doing. After we told him we were just walking, he asks us both for IDs and runs a background check on us.
Where do cops get off asking anyone anywhere for IDs when they're doing nothing wrong?
ezmorningrebel 2 years ago 3
I value freedom more than safety because what value does safety have if I can't enjoy myself in the manner I choose. I also see nothing wrong with the police asking for id just as much as my right to refuse to provide an answer.
ALittleBitPregnant 2 years ago 2
There is a distinction between presenting an ID Document and identifying yourself.
In most states, a policeman who has an articulable suspicion you might have committed, are committing, or will commit a crime can detain you and require you to identify yourself. This is so they can account for those present if a crime does occur. But they have to be able to articulate the suspicion later.
To identify yourself, you can say your name, birth date, etc. You do not need a document.
VeniVidiVid 2 years ago 3
even a 24 year old should know who bob dylan is
hisoj 2 years ago 3
Many Libertarians are just Anarchist by a different name. Plus the Dylan was on private property...
brutus149 2 years ago
You're wrong on this one. People need to carry ID all the time. Cop's don't know who they are dealing with. Every time they approach someone it could be a wanted Criminal, it protects us all.
mcgaugh57 2 years ago
It's called "privacy rights". Like free speech. What country are you from? Do you have rights there? Or do you like getting beaten when you say the wrong thing?
Our basic civil rights protect us all, more than any police can.
juice797 2 years ago 2
This comment has received too many negative votes show
This is not 1776 it's a different world and people must identify themselves for the safety of all of us.
mcgaugh57 2 years ago
How does the ID protect anyone? Even if he had been a wanted criminal, it wouldn't have said so on the ID. Do you expect police to memorise the names of all wanted criminals? Throughout history, one of the main uses of ID laws (possibly THE main use), has been to let police harass people (usually from whatever group is despised at the time) when they have no evidence for any normal crimes.
kittyprydekissme 2 years ago 3
Do I expect the police to memorize all perps names? Yes I do. It just makes sense to have ID on you at all times. Simply prove you're cool and move on.
mcgaugh57 2 years ago
mcgaugh, your not an american, get out of our country
humantestdummy 2 years ago
Because you say so? Not likely I just see thr world clearly. Wake up and get real.
mcgaugh57 2 years ago
You shouldn't have to "prove your cool". Cops and prosecutors need to prove you're not cool. That's the way liberty and due process works.
DavidCaddock 2 years ago 2
So anyone should be able to go anywhere and do anything, anytime they want.And not have to prove who they are. That's scary stuff there.You Hippies are scare me a lot.
mcgaugh57 2 years ago
I think that should be the new legalese for guilt and innocence.
Judge: "Forman, how do you find the defendant?"
Jury Foreman: "We find the defendant uncool on four counts of harshin' the plaintiff's buzz, your dudeness."
:) The world would be a much cooler place.
LazyIrish829 2 years ago 2
those who give up liberty for a little temprary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety - benjamin franklin
humantestdummy 2 years ago 2
I heard Bob Dylan is coming out with a Christmas CD. I can't picture Bob Dylan singing Christmas music.
vipervenomous 2 years ago
Libertarians ROCK!!!
We love you, Penn!!!
perfectmonster 2 years ago 2
Do the Bob Dylan impression
booneman76 2 years ago
When all the dipshit media can do is comment on "OMG they didn't recognize him! hee hee" it pisses me off so much.
I read this story and reacted with anger at the absolute idiocy of these assholes not to realize that YOU DONT HAVE TO PROVE WHO YOU ARE IN A FREE COUNTRY!!!!!
"Papers please" that's NAZI FUCKING GERMANY SHIT! Why would anyone defend that?!
Maybe we can get Bob Dylan a lapel pin with a "star" proving that he's a famous star... WTF
juice797 2 years ago 2
If they demanded ID then I am 100% on board. If they asked for it and Dylan was free to refuse, then it's a tougher call.
Prytonis 2 years ago
He wasn't free to refuse... obviously... if he was free to refuse then they wouldn't have detained him for it.
juice797 2 years ago
My reading of the press reports is that Dylan volunteered to go with the cops back to the hotel. So he may have been free to refuse.
But I agree, when the police "ask" you to do something there is an implicite threat of violence behind the request. That's why I said it was a tougher call and didn't say it was OK.
Prytonis 2 years ago
Thanks for clearing that up.
In soviet amerika, the police volunteer YOU.
juice797 2 years ago 2
Bob Dylans music will always leave an impression on music for ever, his lyrics were powerful. But as an idol, im sad to say, hes not. I cant think of one instance, he was actually protesting. He was in his music, but if your going to do that type of music, you have to show up to a protest every now and again.... Otherwise some will think your just a protest/hippy time profiteer.
dg4rez 2 years ago
uh no not really.. people considered his music protest when in reality..so dylan says.. that it was universal music.. but i dunno
he protested in his music and that is more than enough i say.. yu dont have to show up to charitys and shoit to prove something..
i belive he preformed in live aid which helped starving people in africa by the way
reekytex 2 years ago
I was asked to show my ID by a Cop once. Only because he thought I might have been someone else. Didn't bother me the least bit.
Sammonoske 2 years ago
Fuck the cops. Sincerely.
atari67 2 years ago
no i think it is alright to a certain degree. It is not required to have an ID, not required to have a driver's license . But a cop at any point should be able to see someone out of the ordinary and ask for ID, if they have one, to check to see if the man is a wanted man or a fugitive of the law or flagged in the system for some reason or another.
It should be their right, but the cops get a right like that and they will always take it too far.
Jackalofdeath 2 years ago
"But a cop at any point should be able to see someone out of the ordinary..."
What the definition of out of the ordinary?
I don't think you should have to identify yourself unless you are suspected of a crime.
dlhitch2007 2 years ago
A cop's job gives him the right to decide what is ordinary or requires special attention. its part of their job.
whether its suspicious smells inside a car (drugs), odors coming from a house (dead body), or a suspicious package left at the airport.
ATM in the USA legally the government can hold you indefinitely with no charges or evidence if they believe it a threat to national security. They don't need to prove it, they don't care about your "rights". That is where it goes too far.
Jackalofdeath 2 years ago
Penn is so right here...who cares if it's Bob Dylan or Joe Schmoe? If no crime is involved, or even suspicion, why do you need to prove who you are? I'm appalled by the submission of young people now...Look at the comments here.
pretorious700 2 years ago 3
nice job as always Penn
freemarketcapitalist 2 years ago
Bob Dylan fans should check out Phil Ochs, if you haven' t already. The two were "friends" have sim. writing styles.
KultureJamCollective 2 years ago
I'm a big fan of Penn but this Libertarian stuff goes too far. It is no problem to ask a guy who looks like he is snooping around aimlessly for his I.D. Freedom doesn't mean that you are free to do anything society just short of a crime, there are many precautionary things done in our society to help keep us safe.
AtheistDawa 2 years ago
There are absolutes in life, and liberty is one of them. At least the definition that this country was founded on. Be very careful about what you give away, it doesn't come back. If you feel like you need to give up liberty to be "safe", you may find you have neither.
pretorious700 2 years ago
If I choose to peer into the windows of a house, and a cop rolls by, I would expect the cop to stop and ask for ID if he chooses. I wouldn't expect to get tasered.
ZombiedustXXX 2 years ago
We need I.D.s. We need to know who you are so you're not mistaken for a criminal with warrants outstanding. We need to know if you're on the sex offender registry especially if you're hanging out at a playground. We need to know if you live in the house you claim is yours, or if you're a stalker with a restraining order. We need to know if the name on your ID matches the one on your gun permit, prescriptions, vehicle registration, etc. Or else you'd be outraged that you weren't being protected.
haypenny 2 years ago
I have no idea who that is.
ProJanitor 2 years ago
So we shouldn't show ID for anything?
HEY EVERYBODY! WANT A BOB DYLAN AUTOGRAPH! I GOT A BUNCH! I'LL SELL THEM FOR 5 BUCKS A PIECE! TRUST ME, THE GUY SIGNING THEM IS BOB DYLAN!
JerkyChid 2 years ago
Okay, Let's say someone wants to to the bank and tries to withdraw money from your account. Then do you think they should prove who they are?
KarateKidX 2 years ago
Totally unrelated to the vid, but: The sidebar ad is for "Moxie" Girlz. ;) I just thought that was kind of ironic as it's Penn's daughter's name and it's not a word y'hear very often. :)
As for the "girlz" themselves? They appear to be little more than a slightly less abrasive version of the Bratz dolls. Great. Just what we needed.
behnnie 2 years ago
I think there is nothing wrong with asking for ID in this case. I am a Bob Dylan fan and I might not be able to recognize him on the street, so I might react the same way. If someone claimed to be any celebrity I might find it suspicious. For example, let's say that some crazy dude was looking through the house and the cops asked him who he was and he said: "I'm Bill Clinton" or "I'm Batman" or any other name of renown. I think the cops were right to be mistrusting.
HerbyIsGood 2 years ago
Except... Batman is a comic book character
elegantmoose 2 years ago
I'm glad someone doesn't know who Bob Dylan is.
Celebrity worship is awful.
culwin 2 years ago
Imagine all the fake indignation of folks who read that some police officer didn't recognize Lawrence Welk some time in the '70s.
Not everyone is a devotee in the cult of celebrity.
captaincracklins 2 years ago 2
Dylan is Dylan! How anyone Can't know who Bob Dylan is...Is bith Amazing and Sad!
FresnoTimeLord 2 years ago
WOW obama needs to see this bigtime!
his little marxist friend yells and says 'yo mama' for not knowing who a harvard professer is and THE BOB DYLAN just says 'okay sir'!!
but then again we are the ones who 'riot at town halls' and should 'peacfully protest' like the ACORN and the californian riots!
MockStoneLLC 2 years ago
im 15 and im a big bob dylan fan!
MockStoneLLC 2 years ago
I'm sure that to a libertarian, having to show ID to police is a big deal, but in the real world, we are just talking about a cop who is too young to know who Bob Dylan is.
Hell, I'm 21 and if I was a cop and I saw an old man looking spaced out, standing around starring at an abandoned building in the middle of the night, I'd probably ask him for ID. For all I know, he could be like my grandfather with Alzheimers and he needs to get home.
"Hey, I'm Bob Dylan!"
"Sure pal. Let's see some ID."
EscpdFrmPsykward 2 years ago
Bob who ???
XIS99 2 years ago
It's fascinating that so many people don't understand why a society where you can be demanded to prove who you are at a moments notice is reprehensible.
LITERALLY one step away from tattoos on our arms, and ghetto curfew.
hossrex 2 years ago 3
OMG! I'm 18 and I know Bob Dylan is , how can anyone not know who he is ?
calamazue1989 2 years ago
i think that if you are going to protest by not having an id you better first know if city county state law requires you have one or not
dragonflychainsaw 2 years ago
sorry Penn-lack of id leads to taking him back to the hotel, he's vouched for- NO WANTS OR WARRANTS are found active for him-he's THEN free to go-had he had id at the scene-they'd have checked for active wants/warrants, found none-he's free to go [bear in mind the cop has NO clue who he is, which is the sad part-any music listener SHOULD know of him, if not all about him, like people our age would]
slan, Jim
greenhawk46 2 years ago
Somalia: Libertarian Paradise
Libertarian; the only political system we can see completely failing.
TheVigilante2000 2 years ago
Somalia= Feudalism ≠ Libertarianism
Scrapheap71 2 years ago 2
I'm 24 and not even a Dylan fan and I'd recognize him right away.
BananaHurricane 2 years ago
when i refused to show id when just walking, one angry cop said to me, "while you're defending your civil liberties, you're wasting our time!" well too bad. don't waste your time stopping people just going for a walk.
chaos120 2 years ago
Ayn Rand said it best: Civilization is the process of setting man free from men.
dstrube1 2 years ago
Am I being detained or am I free to go?
lehman 2 years ago 2
"You were ALWAYS free to go!" So, was this a voluntary stop then? Ask a cop if I don't have ANY ID on me, are you going to arrest me?
These cops and boarder patrol agents need to STOP wasting our time.
crumblycake1969 2 years ago
AGREED! But I think that's why it's important to ALWAYS carry a smart phone with you and record the authorities. On the job means on the record! Next time..ASK THE POLICEMAN for HIS/HER ID!
crumblycake1969 2 years ago
if one is doing nothing wrong, then one dose not need to prove who they are.
DiceWarwick 2 years ago
I'm gonna have to disagree with Penn on this one. I think it's fine for police to ask for I.D. with anyone they interact with, so that if something did happen or happens later, they know who they were talking with. In fact, I think it's the law that anyone must present I.D. to a peace officer upon demand, driving or not. If the officer didn't know who he is, I think that's fine. He was just doing his job.
rich0319726 2 years ago
Hearing this reminds me of the national ID plan. I agree that if a person is clearly doing nothing wrong, a simple acknowledgment from the officer would be okay. I also say that if you are not doing anything wrong, why should you have a problem showing an officer your id.
Every state in the union has a state issue id, and without that, an officer can detain you until your identity can be confirmed. That should only happen when no harm is being done.
Mr500sheetsofpaper 2 years ago
Is there a law requiring citizens to have a state issue ID?
jjrglobal 2 years ago
No law, but police are allowed to detain you if you don't have an idea. The cop is being a dick, but he has the ability.
Mr500sheetsofpaper 2 years ago
@Mr500
"I also say that if you are not doing anything wrong, why should you have a problem showing an officer your id."
It is exactly this type of backwards thinking that lead to the loss of civil liberties for everyone.
jjrglobal 2 years ago
I understand the ideal for absolute personal liberty. I don't understand how having to show your ID under specific circumstances violates personal liberty.
@jjrglobal - I'm not saying the police are infallible and that they are just "doing their job" but they do place their lives on the line. If the police did not bother insisting and Bob Dylan turned out to be a house burglar, the police would be faulted for not insisting on checking, no? So damned if they do, damned if they don't?
kbernstar 2 years ago
the police are not held responsible for not checking every single random persons ID. Ordering a citizen to show ID for just walking around and sightseeing is wrong. If he was a burglar then check his ID when he is breaking and entering. If Bob was breaking and entering and they saw that then that'd be totally different.
splein23 2 years ago
@splein23 - The problem is, from Penn's video, is that you don't get the full news story.
From all accounts, Bob Dylan was wearing a hood on a rainy day peering into houses. The police were absolutely correct in insisting on identification.
If it was any random guy instead of an icon, it wouldn't even be a news story. If a hooded guy was looking into houses on my block, i'd call the police and want them to be damned sure of who he was and what he was doing.
kbernstar 2 years ago
cops can ask questions but they shouldn't accuse people of maybe doing something. Which is why I don't like police check points because they're assuming your drunk and then when you stop they talk to and then find out you're innocent. I know of personal stories where people were acting suspicious and people called the police and caught a burglar but it's not always right in every case. My main point is that you shouldn't get arrested for not being able to prove who you are.
splein23 2 years ago
@splein23 - I agree, the police should not detain you simply for being unable to prove who you are. But that's not what the point was.
If you are doing something awfully suspicious (peering into houses wearing something that obstructs a view of your face) while being unable to prove who you are and what you were doing is a different story.
The police would get an equal number of angry people if the police simply let the guy go and he broke into a house and stole things/hurt someone. Lose/lose?
kbernstar 2 years ago
I am not saying you should be compelled to, I am saying, I don't blame a cop for detaining you until they make sure. Cops are there to protect us. While there may be some dick cops, they are still there to protect us.
And anyone with a gun gets a yes sir from me anyway, but I know what a slug can do to flesh if you piss off a cop.
Mr500sheetsofpaper 2 years ago
i get asked for my ID taking a walk at night. i get searched, i get my name taking down. because i was talking a walk on the sidewalk. at night. in my neighborhood.
grendelee 2 years ago
same thing happened to me just walking on the sidewalk at night, except i didn't get searched. i had no id on me and i told them i didn't think i had to answer all their questions when i'm just going for a walk. eventually 4 police cars showed up, including the police chief. i respectfully stood my ground and they eventually let me go after like 40 minutes. pretty ridiculous i say.
chaos120 2 years ago
The cops were just trying to intimidate you.
Good job on standing your ground! I've been able to avoid cops searching my car using the same tactics. >:-)
Scrapheap71 2 years ago
it was on the way to a store too. all the time. theres a cop seach point in front of the store now? just for me, lol
grendelee 2 years ago
I agree with Penn 99% of the time and this is another one of those instances.
cubbyguy1 2 years ago
I agree with you, but the supreme court under Clinton ruled that failure to show ID to a cop was disobeying a lawful order. The way the constitution is being currently "interpreted" the cop has every right to demand ID, and your SOL if you don't have one.
I remember when it happened, I heard it on the news, and i expected outrage. Hell I was outraged. But the only reaction i saw was a bunch of heads nodding. Free doesn't mean what you think it means anymore.
novellScott 2 years ago
Under Clinton?
rja125 2 years ago
You HAVE to do your Dylan Impersonation
PLEASE?
darthvaderyoda 2 years ago
If the policeman doesn't ask for confirmation of identity, and then later that same person is found to have killed someone or whatever, then the cop would be held accountable. He'll be asked why he didn't stop the guy before he did something wrong, and the answer is when the cop was talking to him, he didn't know who he was, whether or not he had prior convictions, and he hadn't done anything illegal yet.
There isn't a good answer to this. Either way, the cop is screwed, and we're screwed.
ZachsMind 2 years ago
Good response!! It's a damned if you do, damned if you don't situation. Both positions have negative consequences. It's up to society to decide which is the lesser of 2 evils.
Scrapheap71 2 years ago
oh many YOU GOTTA DO THE DYLAN IMPERSONATION!!!
TheObnubilators 2 years ago
i dotn think i agree with penn here, why should celebs get special treatment, if the cop didnt know who dylan was but knew OF him, and this guy claimed to be dylan, you kinda wanna make sure hes not lying or anything, hence the purpose of a ID
drklucavi 2 years ago
RIGHT ON!
CoconutsandBananas 2 years ago
I loathe the premise of an ID.
That is about control to me.
volumedealer1 2 years ago 3
I don't believe he DOES have to show an ID (unless of course he's actually driving).
As the law stands now he has to STATE his name--but he doesn't have to PROVE he is who he says he is.
Although, if he was actually on someone's property and looking into a window, that's probably technically a crime--so the officers may have been offerring him a "deal" by saying if he SHOWS his ID they won't arrest him.
GetMeThere1 2 years ago
If you are doing nothing wrong, needing to see your ID is harassment. Plain and simple.
mlodge87 2 years ago 3
I am constantly being stopped in my neighborhood and questioned for minutes at a time for taking walks at night in my neighborhood, when I'm home from school. It's happened three times this summer. I'm a college student, so my sleep schedule is pretty whacked even when I'm home, but anytime after sundown is fair game for me to be asked for my ID, my criminal history (none), what my business is, etc., etc.
MisterDaskLives 2 years ago
one time a cop asked for my ID when i was just walking down the road (dressed like a freak, yes, but still, i was just walking) and i responded with, "vere are your papers, heir jew?"
he didn't think it was funny
yetidetective 2 years ago 2
Yeah they tend to get pissed about that. I've had similar shit happen to me. The weird thing though is it's always by cops who have seen me at work (subway) and I live in a small town. The rookie cops are the worst about it b/c they're just too antsy about shit.
cdowg187 2 years ago
PLEASE LEGALIZE PENN IN CANADA!!
Joshbuckler 2 years ago 2
I Agree is is very similar to Nazi Europe and papers. The facist state has risen against the people but we will and our uniting
qualisarx 2 years ago
i discovered Bob when i was 19, 4years ago, and he is one of my favorite artist.
i disagree with the ID thing. they check ID's to make sure you're not wanted for anything and, if it's a traffic stop, to make sure the car isn't stolen. also, what about passports?
AnUglyAmerican 2 years ago
Well said Penn.
istolvampire 2 years ago
The only time you have to provide ID is if you are driving a car, otherwise all you have to provide is your name and address if asked by a police officer. This is the law in most states, though it does differ from state to state.
RCW314159 2 years ago
if you are not driving a car and they do not have reasonable suspicion for criminal activity, you usually don't even have to give them your name or address.
chaos120 2 years ago
Actually, if they ask, yes you do, and if you refuse to give your name and address then they can arrest you until they can figure out who you are. This is established law in most states. However, you do not have to show ID, unless driving a car. If you really dont want to give your name I guess you could make one up since you do not have to show ID.
RCW314159 2 years ago
that's not true. stop spreading false info. go look up the law. they can ask you, but you don't have to answer. they need "reasonable suspicion" for you to be required to answer...and that's in states that have "stop and identify" laws. i believe 24 states have them. and btw, they can't arrest you without "probable cause"
chaos120 2 years ago
false. that is not the law in any state, nevermind most states. you are NOT always required to give them your name/address when not driving a car. go look up the law yourself. seriously go do it and educate yourself.
chaos120 2 years ago
You are correct, you do not have to answer, the Fifth Amendment gives you that right, but if you do not they can arrest you until they can find out who you are. The Supreme Court has already ruled on this, why you dont go educate yourself. 'Reasonable suspicion?' Do you think that really matters? Yes it should but do you really think it does?
RCW314159 2 years ago