LOL you gotta love the deception of religion. Its so screwed up that it makes you smile. Muslim will kill you and christians will steall all your money... And people want to know why we are atheist? Duh....
That muslim guy... he sounds so nice, and kind, and well meaning. Until you get to the point where he says, "Now, if you convert from Islam, we'll kill you."
If the only way to get someone to believe your 'truth' is a lie? Then your belief has a lot more in common with the lie than the truth.
This video explains why you don't see the likes of Joyce Meyer, Benny Hinn, and many other top tv evangelists debate atheists, .. they know damn well their beliefs are founded on very shaky ground. On their own turf, they exude confidence, but , i dare them to debate someone who doesn't share their beliefs.
Apologetics - another word for lying. And when one demonstrates beyond any possibility of doubt that they have lied, they are unabashed; and they just move right on to the next lie.
I am always "moved" by people's accounts who actually could rid themselves from religion - it is hard to understand for someone who hadn't been raised religiously.
In a similar vein of asking creationists to back up their claims...... Example.... when a creationist spouts about the second law of thermodynamics, just ask him/her how many laws there are (there are 4). If he says that correctly, ask him/her to recite at least one more besides the second. It is sort of fun to see them squirm and go ah, ah, ah..... this is usually when they start speaking in tongues.....
You have highlighted the reason why we are now seeing the increasing exodus of people from believer to athiest. In the past, we believed because we took these "teachers" as being people of intetrity and what they said was the truth. Now, as you so well illustrate, we can find out for ourselves. Religion is dying and everyone knows it. Only the hard core believers refuse to open their eyes, but that is because of their cognitive dissonance - look it up and you can then understand why they do it.
I'm a big fan so far, but I have to argue with cutting people off just because they were wrong about something. Now obviously it makes sense to cut people off for being totally misinformed about something big like religion or gravity, But I find it hard to believe that you cut people off for being misinformed simply about a passing meme on the internet, or maybe "I" am just miss understanding you? (its probably just me)
@falchion49 Lucky you! I was raised in a very conservative offshoot of the Pentecostal Church. It was very hard for me to break away and to start using logic and reason to analyse religious claims.
What the fuck he (8.40) means when he stated that he always answers the question that should have been asked? Pompous asshole, how the hell can he stated what the other person should have asked?
I left religion for almost exactly the same reason: I wanted to be a stronger, more effective minister as one of Jehovah's Witnesses by arming myself with facts & evidence, not knowing that my research will painfully destroy my faith, my whole world.
Now, I have no patience if a straight, direct answer I requested is meandering & avoiding my question. (btw, the Muslim converting the Jew story? I can't believe anyone would take that seriously! (wait- actually I do; that's why I'm an Atheist!))
So the differnce between christianity and islam is that Christians fake their believe in fear of eternal punishment in hell, which wont happen, and muslims fake their believe in fear of real punishment, to be killed, which very well cold happen.
Says a lot about islam, doesn't it?
BTW, I thought God was supposed to have made the heaven and the earth, so how could he have dwelt on an earth before he was God, as they want us to beleive here?
When you are standing outside their particular bubble it is sickening to watch them. I often imagine an intelligent space faring being watching us and in particular this thing called religion, they would be ROTFLTAO and crying at the same time.
@V00D00SIXXX I like the intro. And yes, I'd flip shit in a childish rage by throwing myself on the floor and holding my breath if you ever messed with it.
I think it is often a case of knowing that they have to lie in order not to upset the community they live in (give the people want they want to hear) or a case of not wanting to lose a well paid job (who else is going to employ that bloke with a sheet on his head?). btw so glad to see your channel resurrected.
I had to keep pausing during the Muslim part, I think he must have ''powdered his nose'' before going on air. He's talking awfully fast. It's staggering that any human being can can come out with such things with a grin on their face and a vacant look in their eye.
It's like the wheel is turning but the hamster is dead.
Arthur: Which is the greatest quality of knighthood? Courage? Compassion? Loyalty? Humility? What do you say, Merlin?
Merlin: The greatest? Well, they blend like the metals we mix to make a good sword.
Arthur: No poetry. Just a straight answer. Which is it?
Merlin: All right, then. Truth. That's it. Yes. It must be truth, above all. When a man lies, he murders some part of the world. You should know that.
Regarding your WLC comment, I agree to some extent. First of all he is an intelligent and therefore SHOULD know better, he SHOULD know that he is defending an indefensible world view. And I think the very syllogism of Kalam is used deceptively. However, I don't think you can say "he knows what's wrong with it". Because are you aware of any objection to it to which he hasn't responded in written form or in a debate or on his podcasts etc? So I think he believes the argument to be sound.
Collins trying to claim that his religion is based on a rational evaluation of facts is embarrassing. I would respect him if he just "This is what I believe."
You know I could even respect Collins if he just believed in God in general. Eventhough none of the philosophical arguments for God's existence actually work at all. I at least could understand that.
But that he specifically believes in all the absurdities of Christianity, that the most perfect being possible is reflected in the pages of the Bible. That is oh so hard to understand that a man of his calibre would fall for something like that. He should know better.
what a worthless douchebag that clip guy is. how should he respond? answer the god damn question with a YES. i'm in total agreement. Someone starts beating around bushes I'm done.
You did not become an atheist. You were born an atheist. What you did was to undo the indoctrination that we are all exposed to as innocent, trusting, malleable children.
The first step to becoming an atheist is admitting you have a problem believing.
Religion can be comforting but like all drugs it can be dangerous if abused. A little social religion, maybe once a week, can help you relax and harms no-one. But if you are not alert you will find it starts to take over your life.
But lies are all they have. I appreciate a good lie as much as anybody and I read lots of them for my own amusement, mostly Sci-Fi and Fantasy and sometimes even newspapers, although it's much harder to suspend disbelief with newspapers... However clumsy lies and particularly unscrupulous lies told by charlatans for pecuniary gain or self-aggrandizement, get my goat as well.
People who take serious matters seriously usually invest a significant portion of their time, life, and efforts on matters they deem important. Sometimes I wonder if part of the problem isn't what they have invested in religion and the comfort that believing in "God" lends to their attitudes about death, eternity, whatever; lying to themselves as much as others irrespective of what they "know". They say an old dog can't be taught new tricks; the same maybe applies to people and facts sometimes.
It amazes me just how some very well educated intelligent people fall into this habit (like Dr. Collins). I've had many exchanges with YECers here on YT and the will stand by 2 or 3 highly questionable "studies" or badly distort and mangle a study even after I've pointed out their major flaws and offered up dozens of peer reviewed studies refuting their claim. It gets even worse with conspiracy nuts.
This is an amazing and important video. One of the more important that you have posted V6. I'm new to your subs but I went through your old vids and watched nearly all.
This is as important as your deconversion story.
That Muslim's story was the most disgusting thing I've heard in a long time. I just hope, just as with their religion, it was all bullshit.
I wonder why some Christians can't seem to understand this simple concept: Getting caught in the silly little fibs only serves to get people to question your judgment on bigger issues.
They always say, "the overWHELMING evidence" and "MOUNTAINS of evidence" and so on... Yet there is none.
I spend a bit of time in chat rooms. It is interesting how many Christians leave their faith after they begin to question the nonsense for NephilimFree, shockofgod, or similar.
(Just watched up to 1.37 so far) Very similar to me. I was never full on Christian but I wanted to disprove a JW that was in my family. Next thing I know, I could see why they all were the same.
Another big difference between 30 year old memories then and now is that now we have photographs. A lot of what I remember from the '80s has been reinforced from seeing photos from that era over the years. Back then not only did they not have photos but probably none of the witnesses could even read or write Memories are a lot more flexible without photographic or even written documentation.
I am glad you mentioned WLC, he maintains that there were 5 witnesses within 7 years of the crucifixion and that this is the mostly widely attested fact in history. The fact that not one contemporary historian records these events doesn't make any difference to him.
... more than a couple decades ... What was the life expectancy at that time? Could those "witnesses" have been old enough to remember and also lived thirty years before recording the events?
This is quite normal and par for the course when dealing with ppl who r commanded to care only for what their god says while completely disregarding humans - especially atheists.
I remember having the mind of a theist. No matter what facts or evidence are presented to you, in your mind you always think, "I'm already right, so the other argument is obviously wrong by default." I'm glad I don't think that way anymore. Great vids voodoo.
@ARandomEpicGuy Thats a good point, and I think that the theist's self-assurance provides the best opening to deconvert them. The deception, both to others and themselves, talked about in this video is a (unconcious?) countermeasure against the fact that they hold an indefensible position.
One of the things that turned me away from religion was watching religious debates against atheists. I noticed that the pro-religious debaters usually make political arguments (such as demonizing and distorting the opponents viewpoint) while the atheist debaters typically give factual arguments (such as scientific and biblical quotes). It almost doesn't matter what the opponent says, William Lane Craig can deconvert ANYONE all by himself.
I've been debating christians on youtube for a couple of years now, there level of ignorance and indoctrination is pretty staggering, .. oh yeah, ..and the dishonesty.
Great video voodoosixxx. Think i might just stick this one in my favourites box.
You can't expect people who have lied to themselves to suppress their ability to reason not to lie to you. It's what Theists do, they think because they accept their lies you will too.
Answering the question you wished they asked, without saying that you're doing so, is pure and simply a lie. Lying isn't merely dishonest, it is a PROOF that the philosophy is a lie.
How do you know if these people are telling the truth? If they tell one lie, then everything they say is intended to deceive.
The Mormons like to call it "Milk before meat". It's easy to get people to believe that you can live with your family forever and Jesus loves you rather then, a group of ancient Jews directed by an extraterrestrial God built boats and settled America and foretold in their writings Columbus and the Revolutionary war.
I have to disagree with the mormon portrayal. I don't think he was lying, but rather pointing people to the "right direction". What I heard was that if he met a stranger asking advanced questions on mormonism, he would initiate him on the religion BEFORE answering his questions.
Consider the scientific equivalent. If a Nephi-like redneck challenged the principle of general relativity, would you rather give him an explanation that he cannot understand or point him to a physics 101 manual?
@jhony357 the mormon guy wasnt lying, just dodging (dishonestly) because he knows how stupid it sounds. not that it is a complex issue (its pretty straightforward actually) but rather something not to be discussed with the unindoctrinated.
if someone asked a yes or no question about relativity, i dont see there being a prob answering the question that was asked and then expounding if need be. dodging and changing the subject would have me questioning the persons credibility.
@V00D00SIXXX I see your point and agree on the most part of it. However, I still don't think the only option here is that he is acting out of dishonesty. At least we both agree on him wanting to indoctrinate someone before explaining ludicrous claims (He reminds me of scientologists on that regard). He may very well honestly believe what he preaches yet be scolded from people mocking him the second he says they can become gods. "If only you could know the Word..."
@V00D00SIXXX Regarding the second part, picture this scenario. Ray Comfort debates Richard Dawkins, and asks him "Do you believe that we came from monkeys?" "No", says Dawkins (We share a common ancestor with chimps). Then Comfort rushes to way of the master and creates a new video "The Pope of atheists denies evolution when confronted!", which becomes an instant hit.
See there the problem to answering directly yes/no to someone who cannot grasp the most basic notions of a topic?
@jhony357 The problem with your scenario is that a Ray Comfort would distort any interaction with a Dawkins, and that the base way to win that is not to play (Note that your scenario has Comfort misstating evolution, rather than making an obscure but true observation about it that Dawkins would consider embarassing). Indeed, Comfort suffers from the same 'white lie syndrome' V6 is talking about.
@Cafeeine "and that the base way to win that is not to play" Exactly! That's my point from the very beginning. I'm just trying to put myself in the shoes of that mormon guy for a moment. If a endless stream of catholics/baptits/muslims/etc. comes to that man always asking "Do you believe that we can become gods?" and then they distort whatever he says, the man will end up asking them to start understanding mormonism before answering that question.
@jhony357 That implies that the questioners are distorting Mormon beliefs. What is happening here is that he is trying to get his questioners to commit to uncritical acceptance before revealing the parts of the dogma most vulnerable to critical inquiry, and what that reveals is that he knows this disability of the dogma and tries its best to shield it from scrutiny.
@Cafeeine You are making a lot of claims about what he does and why he does it, and I think that is just wrong. That might be your personal impression, but it doesn't make your claims any more true. I personally do not know the reasons of his actions, but will not dare to attribute them on what I perceive from the short clip presented here. The only ting I'm advocating so far is that if I were facing a endless stream of idiots, I myself will point them to 101 books as well.
@Cafeeine If the misstatement of my scenario give you some trouble about understanding how one would burn out due to long exposure to pure stupidity, let's take it out of the equation. Change Comfort's statement for another classic "Then you believe that nothing happened to nothing and then that nothing exploded and everything was created?" Rinse and repeat.
Don't you wish, don't your REALLY WISH that Comfort takes some Physics and Bio 101 before spouting his crap?
@jhony357 Comfort has had all of this explained to him numerous times at length. The reason he doesn't understand it is because he doesn't want to understand it, because he already thinks its wrong, and here is the difference between him and an honest inquirer.
This too was a major reason I questioned Christianity and left. The constant lies and half-truths. It was too the point that I felt I had to research thoroughly anything that was written or spoken from a Christian to make sure it was accurate, and the vast majority of the time I discovered that it was not. They lie about science, church history, what the bible really says, everyday stories, other denominations, other religions and so on. Their mouths are a river of distortions and ignorance.
@typhoidX Actually, I was moved by the way he was speaking; and even felt joy knowing that there are preachers putting a speech of compassion towards those who does not share their religion, instead of the image of hatred that many of us have in our mind when thinking about muslim preachers.
Of course the fable ended the second he encouraged deceit and death threats to achieve their goals. WTF!?!?!?
@jhony357 I'm simultaneously amused & concerned. Amused - again - by the combination of gentle, compassionate demeanor & the advocacy of deceit & murder; but worried by the fact that there are people out there who are actually persuaded by such non-sense.
Great video. Your deconversion process (prep for ministry, researching for real proof, finding there's none..) comes very close to my own.
The breaking point for me was when my pastor said...after a long conversation..."I don't care if you're right. I'd rather preach the word of Jesus than the truth."
I still remember the look on his face when he said it - like a kid finally blurting out "ya, I stole the cookie - so what?!"
I completely agree with the principle of this video but Taqiyya, which was referenced, is supposed to only be in the event of threats on one's life (at which point I think it's perfectly moral to lie). Muslim apologist are largely no different from other apologists as I think this video showed.
They aren't deceptive because they are Muslims, they are deceptive because they are religious apologists.
"They arent deceptive because they are Muslims, they are deceptive because they are religious apologists"
You cant decide that one just like that. Especially not since certain outright deceptive strategies are directly commanded by traditional Islamic teachings themselves (e.g. reference to alleged historic precedent, reference to allegedly divinely commanded virtue of emulation, etc.).
I dont recall the "character of Jesus" demanding to lie in his name. (Maybe Im wrong.)
@Wrath0fKhan He says never to lie(and through referencing the Commandments not to bear false witness), but than lies at his trial. You know, bears false witness?
He doesn't demand it, but the Biblical Christ is clearly O.K. with Lying For Jesus.
@Wrath0fKhan "I spoke openly to the world. I always taught in synagogues and in the temple, where the Jews always meet, and in secret I have said nothing" (John 18:20 (NKJ))
Jesus said this to High Priest Annas in response to a question about his teachings. This is contradicted by both Matthew 13:10-11 and the Sermon on the Mount.
That was a play on words. Lying For Jesus normally does refer to Christians considering lying to people acceptable if it is in service of converting them/of God.
These are obviously references to some of those famous parallel stories inconsistencies. Even some of the actual "teachings" and or "divine doctrines" immediately surrounding these verses are dubious or even appalling (e.g. those who hear are bound not to understand, those who have not, even what they have shall be take away from them, authority from above to maim/kill people, etc.), however deriving "lying" and even more so "endorsement to lie" is a bit of a stretch.
About 30 years for the first gospel (Mark) and closer to 70 years for the last (John).
Mormons need to start answering the questions that they are asked instead of deciding what they want you to hear.
Notice in the story that after the guy converted they said that they would kill him if he continued to drink and that if he left that they would kill him too? Fear is a great motivator for a person to do anything, even if they don't want to (hell anybody?)
Excellent video! The biggest lie the religious tell is to themselves. In order to deal with the inconsistencies and atrocities of religion, such as a merciful god sending people to the torment of hell for eternity and the insanity of a merciful god demanding the genocide of multitudes, it is necessary to block rational thought processes with platitudes such as, “God works in mysterious ways,” and “The human mind is unable to comprehend the will of god.”
Collins complained they didn't tell him he was going to be interviewed about the gospels and wasn't an expert so they shouldn't have asked him but why in the hell would any Christian not be familiar with what was asked?
Decades don't matter. If you missed watching an automobile accident by less that 2 seconds....You didn't see it! These guys who profess that the 4 gospels are true fact...based on "hear say"....none of them were there!
voodoo, I have a question for you which I will send in a PM. : )
Gezus FuQ!!! Is this guy in the vid for real! The preacher guy, I mean that rhetorically!
@defect530 And don't worry, celebrities! If you manage to fail falling for Morm..er accepting the truth of Mormonism before you die, the LDS Church will baptise you posthumously into their fold, so you too can have your very own planet! (instead of just your own Planet Hollywood)
You're a dickhead if you think you can decide what is the right question. If you don't want to answer someone's honest question, then tell them you don't want to answer it.
I've seen another trick some Christians use. Probably without intent, but it seems to be very common with many Christians I've had scriptural discussions with.
They use a verse which corroborates their assertion, then when you use another verse which blows them out the water, they suggest reading such and such a verse. So you read it and lo and behold, it has zero relevence to any other verse in the discussion.
It's like they think you're a dog after a bone, so they throw a ball to distract you.
Christians, and theists in general don't find anything immoral about lying so long as the lie serves to help the cause of their religious beliefs. But what ends up happening is quite comical, they reach a point where their lies encompass every aspect of their beliefs and their beliefs depend entirely on the lies that they created to reinforce their beliefs in the first place...XD
LOL you gotta love the deception of religion. Its so screwed up that it makes you smile. Muslim will kill you and christians will steall all your money... And people want to know why we are atheist? Duh....
YouPickedTheWrongGuy 2 months ago
That muslim guy... he sounds so nice, and kind, and well meaning. Until you get to the point where he says, "Now, if you convert from Islam, we'll kill you."
If the only way to get someone to believe your 'truth' is a lie? Then your belief has a lot more in common with the lie than the truth.
Sines314 3 months ago
This video explains why you don't see the likes of Joyce Meyer, Benny Hinn, and many other top tv evangelists debate atheists, .. they know damn well their beliefs are founded on very shaky ground. On their own turf, they exude confidence, but , i dare them to debate someone who doesn't share their beliefs.
bonnie43uk 5 months ago
Apologetics - another word for lying. And when one demonstrates beyond any possibility of doubt that they have lied, they are unabashed; and they just move right on to the next lie.
stevehayes13 7 months ago
@wspol624 Kinda reminds me of the game, only way to win is to never encounter it...
zalmanusa 8 months ago
So... I'm 25 years old. Technically, by this logic... I could have witnessed my own birth, first hand. Pretty amazing.
First hand! Almost! ... 3 decades ago!
happysplodie 8 months ago
do you know a website where I can see the whole film
ThePeacefulAtheistt 8 months ago
I am always "moved" by people's accounts who actually could rid themselves from religion - it is hard to understand for someone who hadn't been raised religiously.
Baerchenization 8 months ago
In a similar vein of asking creationists to back up their claims...... Example.... when a creationist spouts about the second law of thermodynamics, just ask him/her how many laws there are (there are 4). If he says that correctly, ask him/her to recite at least one more besides the second. It is sort of fun to see them squirm and go ah, ah, ah..... this is usually when they start speaking in tongues.....
tbdonnelly67 8 months ago
@tbdonnelly67 You can probably outdo them at naming Commandments, too.
tctheunbeliever 8 months ago
You have highlighted the reason why we are now seeing the increasing exodus of people from believer to athiest. In the past, we believed because we took these "teachers" as being people of intetrity and what they said was the truth. Now, as you so well illustrate, we can find out for ourselves. Religion is dying and everyone knows it. Only the hard core believers refuse to open their eyes, but that is because of their cognitive dissonance - look it up and you can then understand why they do it.
grahambkk 8 months ago
@V00D00SIXXX "...I can't fathom why people would do that..."
Carl Sagan Points this out directly. When people are bamboozled long enough they tend to reject any evidence of the bamboozlement.
savageecho 8 months ago
@savageecho That rocks. Is that a quote or paraphrase?
no2religions 8 months ago
@no2religions Its a paraphrase from his book The Demon-Haunted World. Its a great book if you have the time.
savageecho 8 months ago
god is as simple as truth ... its our desire to reason our existance ... and the knowledge that we can't ...
greyrosetint 8 months ago
@greyrosetint Prove it.
GWJumpman 8 months ago
I'm disgusted at how that Muslim guy has a smile on his face when he says that if he renounces Islam he will be killed.
oliethefolie 8 months ago 3
@oliethefolie INDEED o_O
emikochan13 8 months ago
I'm a big fan so far, but I have to argue with cutting people off just because they were wrong about something. Now obviously it makes sense to cut people off for being totally misinformed about something big like religion or gravity, But I find it hard to believe that you cut people off for being misinformed simply about a passing meme on the internet, or maybe "I" am just miss understanding you? (its probably just me)
155shield 8 months ago
@155shield not for being misinformed, rather for purposely trying to deceive.
V00D00SIXXX 8 months ago 4
I'm lucky, I never have been religious. It gave me a completely different perspective.
falchion49 8 months ago
@falchion49 Lucky you! I was raised in a very conservative offshoot of the Pentecostal Church. It was very hard for me to break away and to start using logic and reason to analyse religious claims.
petion2010 8 months ago
What the fuck he (8.40) means when he stated that he always answers the question that should have been asked? Pompous asshole, how the hell can he stated what the other person should have asked?
petion2010 8 months ago
I left religion for almost exactly the same reason: I wanted to be a stronger, more effective minister as one of Jehovah's Witnesses by arming myself with facts & evidence, not knowing that my research will painfully destroy my faith, my whole world.
Now, I have no patience if a straight, direct answer I requested is meandering & avoiding my question. (btw, the Muslim converting the Jew story? I can't believe anyone would take that seriously! (wait- actually I do; that's why I'm an Atheist!))
727Phoenix 8 months ago
I alway thought faith was believing in a something without any evidence.
This means that once you start trying to prove your faith, you no longer have any.
lunda2222 8 months ago
@V00D00SIXXX Whats the name of the outro song?
emijin95 8 months ago
@emijin95 "Anybody listening?" by Queensryche
V00D00SIXXX 8 months ago 2
sounded like the standard muslim bedtime story told to children.
chickinstompin 8 months ago
So the differnce between christianity and islam is that Christians fake their believe in fear of eternal punishment in hell, which wont happen, and muslims fake their believe in fear of real punishment, to be killed, which very well cold happen.
Says a lot about islam, doesn't it?
BTW, I thought God was supposed to have made the heaven and the earth, so how could he have dwelt on an earth before he was God, as they want us to beleive here?
Thanks for the video
Cheers
ekhaat 8 months ago
When you are standing outside their particular bubble it is sickening to watch them. I often imagine an intelligent space faring being watching us and in particular this thing called religion, they would be ROTFLTAO and crying at the same time.
a300pilotster 8 months ago
A shorter intro would be better.
9mjb 8 months ago
@9mjb if i messed with the intro or even the outro.... id never hear the end of it.
V00D00SIXXX 8 months ago 11
@V00D00SIXXX I like the intro. And yes, I'd flip shit in a childish rage by throwing myself on the floor and holding my breath if you ever messed with it.
oexnorth 8 months ago
@wspol624 : D
deepashtray 8 months ago
Just brilliant. Loved it.
AuntieDiluvian 8 months ago
I think it is often a case of knowing that they have to lie in order not to upset the community they live in (give the people want they want to hear) or a case of not wanting to lose a well paid job (who else is going to employ that bloke with a sheet on his head?). btw so glad to see your channel resurrected.
pilgrimpater 8 months ago
I had to keep pausing during the Muslim part, I think he must have ''powdered his nose'' before going on air. He's talking awfully fast. It's staggering that any human being can can come out with such things with a grin on their face and a vacant look in their eye.
It's like the wheel is turning but the hamster is dead.
Zed1967 8 months ago
So, children, the important thing if you wnat to bring people to Christ, is that you _never_ get caught!
Brandt761 8 months ago
"He saw in the Jew a small measure of goodness..." oh, my, Is he not merciful? Is he not merciful!
Brandt761 8 months ago
How do you even know whether this guy knows that what he's saying isn't really accurate? He's a biologist, not a historian.
Brandt761 8 months ago
Beautifully done. I'm glad I subbed to you.
is3it7lonar 8 months ago
Arthur: Which is the greatest quality of knighthood? Courage? Compassion? Loyalty? Humility? What do you say, Merlin?
Merlin: The greatest? Well, they blend like the metals we mix to make a good sword.
Arthur: No poetry. Just a straight answer. Which is it?
Merlin: All right, then. Truth. That's it. Yes. It must be truth, above all. When a man lies, he murders some part of the world. You should know that.
Teloculos 8 months ago
Regarding your WLC comment, I agree to some extent. First of all he is an intelligent and therefore SHOULD know better, he SHOULD know that he is defending an indefensible world view. And I think the very syllogism of Kalam is used deceptively. However, I don't think you can say "he knows what's wrong with it". Because are you aware of any objection to it to which he hasn't responded in written form or in a debate or on his podcasts etc? So I think he believes the argument to be sound.
KnownNoMore 8 months ago
Collins trying to claim that his religion is based on a rational evaluation of facts is embarrassing. I would respect him if he just "This is what I believe."
ozmoroid 8 months ago
@ozmoroid
You know I could even respect Collins if he just believed in God in general. Eventhough none of the philosophical arguments for God's existence actually work at all. I at least could understand that.
But that he specifically believes in all the absurdities of Christianity, that the most perfect being possible is reflected in the pages of the Bible. That is oh so hard to understand that a man of his calibre would fall for something like that. He should know better.
KnownNoMore 8 months ago
what a worthless douchebag that clip guy is. how should he respond? answer the god damn question with a YES. i'm in total agreement. Someone starts beating around bushes I'm done.
TruthSurge 8 months ago
You did not become an atheist. You were born an atheist. What you did was to undo the indoctrination that we are all exposed to as innocent, trusting, malleable children.
The first step to becoming an atheist is admitting you have a problem believing.
Religion can be comforting but like all drugs it can be dangerous if abused. A little social religion, maybe once a week, can help you relax and harms no-one. But if you are not alert you will find it starts to take over your life.
Huttate1 8 months ago
But lies are all they have. I appreciate a good lie as much as anybody and I read lots of them for my own amusement, mostly Sci-Fi and Fantasy and sometimes even newspapers, although it's much harder to suspend disbelief with newspapers... However clumsy lies and particularly unscrupulous lies told by charlatans for pecuniary gain or self-aggrandizement, get my goat as well.
colourmegone 8 months ago
WOW So THAT's why when I ask a theist a question, they never answer it, they just ask me a different question??? Wow...okay thanks. XD
fruitikay 8 months ago
People who take serious matters seriously usually invest a significant portion of their time, life, and efforts on matters they deem important. Sometimes I wonder if part of the problem isn't what they have invested in religion and the comfort that believing in "God" lends to their attitudes about death, eternity, whatever; lying to themselves as much as others irrespective of what they "know". They say an old dog can't be taught new tricks; the same maybe applies to people and facts sometimes.
PawnBACM 8 months ago
Wish I could thumb this up multiple times, it's so good.
leet3lite 8 months ago
Kinda reminds me of the old saying: If you can't dazzle 'em with brilliance, baffle 'em with bullshit.
bvwatcher 8 months ago
//they were close to that [eyewhitness accounts]//
//whithin a couple of decades out//
how does admitedly second hand information a couple of decades after the fact come close to eyewhitness accounts?
demondim5 8 months ago
awesome video V6!
Paxmax 8 months ago
It amazes me just how some very well educated intelligent people fall into this habit (like Dr. Collins). I've had many exchanges with YECers here on YT and the will stand by 2 or 3 highly questionable "studies" or badly distort and mangle a study even after I've pointed out their major flaws and offered up dozens of peer reviewed studies refuting their claim. It gets even worse with conspiracy nuts.
deepashtray 8 months ago
You mean they're worthless liars and con men? Hey, we may as well start using the right words.
MrStillmans 8 months ago
This is an amazing and important video. One of the more important that you have posted V6. I'm new to your subs but I went through your old vids and watched nearly all.
This is as important as your deconversion story.
That Muslim's story was the most disgusting thing I've heard in a long time. I just hope, just as with their religion, it was all bullshit.
Parabol0086 8 months ago
I wonder why some Christians can't seem to understand this simple concept: Getting caught in the silly little fibs only serves to get people to question your judgment on bigger issues.
They always say, "the overWHELMING evidence" and "MOUNTAINS of evidence" and so on... Yet there is none.
I spend a bit of time in chat rooms. It is interesting how many Christians leave their faith after they begin to question the nonsense for NephilimFree, shockofgod, or similar.
TheHogTieChamp 8 months ago
(Just watched up to 1.37 so far) Very similar to me. I was never full on Christian but I wanted to disprove a JW that was in my family. Next thing I know, I could see why they all were the same.
Parabol0086 8 months ago
Another big difference between 30 year old memories then and now is that now we have photographs. A lot of what I remember from the '80s has been reinforced from seeing photos from that era over the years. Back then not only did they not have photos but probably none of the witnesses could even read or write Memories are a lot more flexible without photographic or even written documentation.
fooltard 8 months ago
Great video. Shows the dishonesty of many of these people.
biggingeryeti 8 months ago
The reason they lie is because if they just came out and said their beliefs people would laugh in their face.
petehjr1 8 months ago
I am glad you mentioned WLC, he maintains that there were 5 witnesses within 7 years of the crucifixion and that this is the mostly widely attested fact in history. The fact that not one contemporary historian records these events doesn't make any difference to him.
Tridhos 8 months ago
... more than a couple decades ... What was the life expectancy at that time? Could those "witnesses" have been old enough to remember and also lived thirty years before recording the events?
fegolem 8 months ago
This is quite normal and par for the course when dealing with ppl who r commanded to care only for what their god says while completely disregarding humans - especially atheists.
rictusgate 8 months ago
When clergy lie, they do it with an intent to collect cash to keep them afloat.
saxmanchiro 8 months ago
@V00D00SIXXX:I like to call this kind of behaviour "lying in the name of Jesus".Christians don't think of it as lying.Infact most theist do it.
harkying99 8 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Don't lie...?? They don't have a choice
sfg911 8 months ago
you need to put the fair use clause at the beginning of every video that you are going to be putting other's content into.
CrudOMatic 8 months ago
@CrudOMatic How about I put my fair foot up your ass.
Judicial78 8 months ago
I remember having the mind of a theist. No matter what facts or evidence are presented to you, in your mind you always think, "I'm already right, so the other argument is obviously wrong by default." I'm glad I don't think that way anymore. Great vids voodoo.
ARandomEpicGuy 8 months ago
@ARandomEpicGuy Thats a good point, and I think that the theist's self-assurance provides the best opening to deconvert them. The deception, both to others and themselves, talked about in this video is a (unconcious?) countermeasure against the fact that they hold an indefensible position.
deathtris 8 months ago
One of the things that turned me away from religion was watching religious debates against atheists. I noticed that the pro-religious debaters usually make political arguments (such as demonizing and distorting the opponents viewpoint) while the atheist debaters typically give factual arguments (such as scientific and biblical quotes). It almost doesn't matter what the opponent says, William Lane Craig can deconvert ANYONE all by himself.
deathtris 8 months ago
I've been debating christians on youtube for a couple of years now, there level of ignorance and indoctrination is pretty staggering, .. oh yeah, ..and the dishonesty.
Great video voodoosixxx. Think i might just stick this one in my favourites box.
bonnie43uk 8 months ago
I could watch your videos all day :)
MaddeVirus 8 months ago
Bingo, sir- bingo.
GrapplingIgnorance 8 months ago
You can't expect people who have lied to themselves to suppress their ability to reason not to lie to you. It's what Theists do, they think because they accept their lies you will too.
crossoldman 8 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
But you lie
RevDevilin 8 months ago
It's not 1981, people back then lived 30-50 years compared to our 70 -90 years, so back then it would be stretched out, and be more like 1950's
TheTomtompiper 8 months ago
Why would the scientist in the clip talk about "historical evidence for Christ" against his better knowledge?
MONEY. There are people, like the Templeton (?) Foundation, who give out Nobel-price-esque medals and honours that come with huge monetary benefits.
Bite your tongue, talk BS and get RICH. The American dream, baby!
HaploidCell 8 months ago
EXCELLENT VIDEO! Oh yeah, I'm a new subscriber.
5/5
mythicalhell 8 months ago
Great video!
dan91709 8 months ago
Answering the question you wished they asked, without saying that you're doing so, is pure and simply a lie. Lying isn't merely dishonest, it is a PROOF that the philosophy is a lie.
How do you know if these people are telling the truth? If they tell one lie, then everything they say is intended to deceive.
dan91709 8 months ago
Great vid man ! ! ! !
AtheistStream 8 months ago
The Mormons like to call it "Milk before meat". It's easy to get people to believe that you can live with your family forever and Jesus loves you rather then, a group of ancient Jews directed by an extraterrestrial God built boats and settled America and foretold in their writings Columbus and the Revolutionary war.
klausvanforester 8 months ago
Really good video...kudos...good to see you on the mend, peace be with :)
MasterOhSo 8 months ago
I have to disagree with the mormon portrayal. I don't think he was lying, but rather pointing people to the "right direction". What I heard was that if he met a stranger asking advanced questions on mormonism, he would initiate him on the religion BEFORE answering his questions.
Consider the scientific equivalent. If a Nephi-like redneck challenged the principle of general relativity, would you rather give him an explanation that he cannot understand or point him to a physics 101 manual?
jhony357 8 months ago
@jhony357 the mormon guy wasnt lying, just dodging (dishonestly) because he knows how stupid it sounds. not that it is a complex issue (its pretty straightforward actually) but rather something not to be discussed with the unindoctrinated.
if someone asked a yes or no question about relativity, i dont see there being a prob answering the question that was asked and then expounding if need be. dodging and changing the subject would have me questioning the persons credibility.
V00D00SIXXX 8 months ago 13
@V00D00SIXXX I see your point and agree on the most part of it. However, I still don't think the only option here is that he is acting out of dishonesty. At least we both agree on him wanting to indoctrinate someone before explaining ludicrous claims (He reminds me of scientologists on that regard). He may very well honestly believe what he preaches yet be scolded from people mocking him the second he says they can become gods. "If only you could know the Word..."
jhony357 8 months ago
@V00D00SIXXX Regarding the second part, picture this scenario. Ray Comfort debates Richard Dawkins, and asks him "Do you believe that we came from monkeys?" "No", says Dawkins (We share a common ancestor with chimps). Then Comfort rushes to way of the master and creates a new video "The Pope of atheists denies evolution when confronted!", which becomes an instant hit.
See there the problem to answering directly yes/no to someone who cannot grasp the most basic notions of a topic?
Peace.
jhony357 8 months ago
@jhony357 The problem with your scenario is that a Ray Comfort would distort any interaction with a Dawkins, and that the base way to win that is not to play (Note that your scenario has Comfort misstating evolution, rather than making an obscure but true observation about it that Dawkins would consider embarassing). Indeed, Comfort suffers from the same 'white lie syndrome' V6 is talking about.
Cafeeine 8 months ago
@Cafeeine "and that the base way to win that is not to play" Exactly! That's my point from the very beginning. I'm just trying to put myself in the shoes of that mormon guy for a moment. If a endless stream of catholics/baptits/muslims/etc. comes to that man always asking "Do you believe that we can become gods?" and then they distort whatever he says, the man will end up asking them to start understanding mormonism before answering that question.
jhony357 8 months ago
@jhony357 That implies that the questioners are distorting Mormon beliefs. What is happening here is that he is trying to get his questioners to commit to uncritical acceptance before revealing the parts of the dogma most vulnerable to critical inquiry, and what that reveals is that he knows this disability of the dogma and tries its best to shield it from scrutiny.
Cafeeine 8 months ago
@Cafeeine You are making a lot of claims about what he does and why he does it, and I think that is just wrong. That might be your personal impression, but it doesn't make your claims any more true. I personally do not know the reasons of his actions, but will not dare to attribute them on what I perceive from the short clip presented here. The only ting I'm advocating so far is that if I were facing a endless stream of idiots, I myself will point them to 101 books as well.
Peace.
jhony357 8 months ago
@Cafeeine If the misstatement of my scenario give you some trouble about understanding how one would burn out due to long exposure to pure stupidity, let's take it out of the equation. Change Comfort's statement for another classic "Then you believe that nothing happened to nothing and then that nothing exploded and everything was created?" Rinse and repeat.
Don't you wish, don't your REALLY WISH that Comfort takes some Physics and Bio 101 before spouting his crap?
jhony357 8 months ago
@jhony357 Comfort has had all of this explained to him numerous times at length. The reason he doesn't understand it is because he doesn't want to understand it, because he already thinks its wrong, and here is the difference between him and an honest inquirer.
Cafeeine 8 months ago
That Jew story was one of the most funny things ever, damn religion can be entertaining when you forget that it is a virus.
MacabreManifesto 8 months ago
That was simple and brilliant analysis.
Danmill23 8 months ago
8:24 "Whenever a person asks me an antagonistic question, I never answer that question. Rather, I answer the question they should have asked."
Read: "Whenever a person asks me a good question, I never answer that question. Rather, I construct a strawman and answer that."
TheRichDarkEarth 8 months ago 26
@TheRichDarkEarth Or rather more to the point: "Whenever someone deviates from my script, I will behave as if they haven't."
Cafeeine 8 months ago
Hearsay - Almost like an eyewitness account
MacabreManifesto 8 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
People lie all the time, often to themselves.
MisterEvil1 8 months ago
Outstanding video! Thank you.
Afontanez1962 8 months ago
And "God" does nothing about it. He'll just send everyone whom these liars mislead straight to hell.
IntelligentProbe 8 months ago
This too was a major reason I questioned Christianity and left. The constant lies and half-truths. It was too the point that I felt I had to research thoroughly anything that was written or spoken from a Christian to make sure it was accurate, and the vast majority of the time I discovered that it was not. They lie about science, church history, what the bible really says, everyday stories, other denominations, other religions and so on. Their mouths are a river of distortions and ignorance.
IntelligentProbe 8 months ago
Its hilarious to see that Muslim preacher advocate deceit & murder in such a gentle & cheerful demeanor, lol.
typhoidX 8 months ago
@typhoidX Actually, I was moved by the way he was speaking; and even felt joy knowing that there are preachers putting a speech of compassion towards those who does not share their religion, instead of the image of hatred that many of us have in our mind when thinking about muslim preachers.
Of course the fable ended the second he encouraged deceit and death threats to achieve their goals. WTF!?!?!?
jhony357 8 months ago
@jhony357 I'm simultaneously amused & concerned. Amused - again - by the combination of gentle, compassionate demeanor & the advocacy of deceit & murder; but worried by the fact that there are people out there who are actually persuaded by such non-sense.
typhoidX 8 months ago
Comment removed
typhoidX 8 months ago
Great video. Your deconversion process (prep for ministry, researching for real proof, finding there's none..) comes very close to my own.
The breaking point for me was when my pastor said...after a long conversation..."I don't care if you're right. I'd rather preach the word of Jesus than the truth."
I still remember the look on his face when he said it - like a kid finally blurting out "ya, I stole the cookie - so what?!"
TheHigherVoltage 8 months ago 18
How do you dig up these gems?
wrenforth 8 months ago
I completely agree with the principle of this video but Taqiyya, which was referenced, is supposed to only be in the event of threats on one's life (at which point I think it's perfectly moral to lie). Muslim apologist are largely no different from other apologists as I think this video showed.
They aren't deceptive because they are Muslims, they are deceptive because they are religious apologists.
DoubtingMarcus 8 months ago
@DoubtingMarcus
"They arent deceptive because they are Muslims, they are deceptive because they are religious apologists"
You cant decide that one just like that. Especially not since certain outright deceptive strategies are directly commanded by traditional Islamic teachings themselves (e.g. reference to alleged historic precedent, reference to allegedly divinely commanded virtue of emulation, etc.).
I dont recall the "character of Jesus" demanding to lie in his name. (Maybe Im wrong.)
Wrath0fKhan 8 months ago
@Wrath0fKhan He says never to lie(and through referencing the Commandments not to bear false witness), but than lies at his trial. You know, bears false witness?
He doesn't demand it, but the Biblical Christ is clearly O.K. with Lying For Jesus.
AndrewTheEternal 8 months ago
@AndrewTheEternal
"lies at his trial"
Could you remind me of that particular story?
"lying for Jesus"
Well... Ive heard that phrase of course. I thought it was designed to convey ridicule, to expose lying/deceiving preachers or even laity.
Wrath0fKhan 8 months ago
@Wrath0fKhan "I spoke openly to the world. I always taught in synagogues and in the temple, where the Jews always meet, and in secret I have said nothing" (John 18:20 (NKJ))
Jesus said this to High Priest Annas in response to a question about his teachings. This is contradicted by both Matthew 13:10-11 and the Sermon on the Mount.
That was a play on words. Lying For Jesus normally does refer to Christians considering lying to people acceptable if it is in service of converting them/of God.
AndrewTheEternal 8 months ago
@AndrewTheEternal Since Jesus lied in his own interest, the joke was that he was literally lying for Jesus instead of figuratively Lying For Jesus.
AndrewTheEternal 8 months ago
@AndrewTheEternal
These are obviously references to some of those famous parallel stories inconsistencies. Even some of the actual "teachings" and or "divine doctrines" immediately surrounding these verses are dubious or even appalling (e.g. those who hear are bound not to understand, those who have not, even what they have shall be take away from them, authority from above to maim/kill people, etc.), however deriving "lying" and even more so "endorsement to lie" is a bit of a stretch.
Wrath0fKhan 8 months ago
About 30 years for the first gospel (Mark) and closer to 70 years for the last (John).
Mormons need to start answering the questions that they are asked instead of deciding what they want you to hear.
Notice in the story that after the guy converted they said that they would kill him if he continued to drink and that if he left that they would kill him too? Fear is a great motivator for a person to do anything, even if they don't want to (hell anybody?)
lautz73 8 months ago
ahahaaaahahahaha the carpethead at 10:28 is fuckin unbelievable, but hey, that's what happens when they come out of the closet of "moderate izlam"
KilluaXIII 8 months ago
Excellent video! The biggest lie the religious tell is to themselves. In order to deal with the inconsistencies and atrocities of religion, such as a merciful god sending people to the torment of hell for eternity and the insanity of a merciful god demanding the genocide of multitudes, it is necessary to block rational thought processes with platitudes such as, “God works in mysterious ways,” and “The human mind is unable to comprehend the will of god.”
lc237 8 months ago
Bill lets people off the hook as its his style.
truvelocity 8 months ago
Collins complained they didn't tell him he was going to be interviewed about the gospels and wasn't an expert so they shouldn't have asked him but why in the hell would any Christian not be familiar with what was asked?
adrenacrumb 8 months ago
The 'nice' story is very, very creepy! How is that story nice?! Real or not it's a disgusting story
Nocturnalux 8 months ago
That preacher is a dick.
LittleTownInNorway 8 months ago
Decades don't matter. If you missed watching an automobile accident by less that 2 seconds....You didn't see it! These guys who profess that the 4 gospels are true fact...based on "hear say"....none of them were there!
voodoo, I have a question for you which I will send in a PM. : )
Gezus FuQ!!! Is this guy in the vid for real! The preacher guy, I mean that rhetorically!
FishHeadSalad 8 months ago
great marketing ploy! you too can become a god(mormans). if i was young and gullible i would probably fall for that.
defect530 8 months ago
@defect530 And don't worry, celebrities! If you manage to fail falling for Morm..er accepting the truth of Mormonism before you die, the LDS Church will baptise you posthumously into their fold, so you too can have your very own planet! (instead of just your own Planet Hollywood)
Cafeeine 8 months ago
4:30
So 3rd person omniscient is close to being witness accounts? Lol.
8:40
You're a dickhead if you think you can decide what is the right question. If you don't want to answer someone's honest question, then tell them you don't want to answer it.
TheAtheistPaladin 8 months ago
Woods of Jordan never approved my video responce to him, but I thought it relavent to your video here so I'm posting it as a responce here.
watch?v=31dKCozXJFY
WaiteDavidMSPhysics 8 months ago
That movie helped me to become an atheist, it didnt happpen intantly, but It did lead me to where I am today. To me its a great movie.
viicISrotcib 8 months ago
true true. christians have little sayings they like to say. they say them without even thinking about what they are saying.
defect530 8 months ago
I've seen another trick some Christians use. Probably without intent, but it seems to be very common with many Christians I've had scriptural discussions with.
They use a verse which corroborates their assertion, then when you use another verse which blows them out the water, they suggest reading such and such a verse. So you read it and lo and behold, it has zero relevence to any other verse in the discussion.
It's like they think you're a dog after a bone, so they throw a ball to distract you.
ShallowBeThyGames 8 months ago
@ShallowBeThyGames Not even a ball for that matter... "You're a dog after a bone so the tie a knot in a hawthorn tree".
ShallowBeThyGames 8 months ago
Two relevant links: liars for jesus (d0t) com
and
Go to Wikipedia and search for "Taqiyya"
CntrBrdr 8 months ago
I think the story about the jew and the muslim is good viral material. Where did you get the video from?
Very good points, by the way.
JennyFarlopez 8 months ago
Christians, and theists in general don't find anything immoral about lying so long as the lie serves to help the cause of their religious beliefs. But what ends up happening is quite comical, they reach a point where their lies encompass every aspect of their beliefs and their beliefs depend entirely on the lies that they created to reinforce their beliefs in the first place...XD
MrAudiovideodisco 8 months ago
First! Epic video man, very true.
weirddudeonice 8 months ago
Why would an all-powerful god need so many people to lie on his behalf?
cablepanos 8 months ago
I like your intro. Sounds like something big and important is coming
CntrBrdr 8 months ago
Hey, voodoo, what's your opinion on the casey trial?
GuitarFisherman2112 8 months ago