Author Jonah Goldberg on Glenn Beck 2/18 - Liberal Fascism

[MrAppleseed88]

I can think of no better way to spend the fruits of industrialization then the betterment and advancement of our people.

That is what National Socialism means to me.

Workers are the cause of all wealth, and they must be paid extremely large amounts of money for their efforts to make sure all their needs are taken care of.

We must never waste resources on a few fat lazy people whom only benefit off the labors of others.

People, Government, then profits.

[ThePyro3825]

Four ideologies crawled out of the rubble following WW1: Communism (USSR), Fascism (Italy), National Socialism (Germany), and Statism (Japan).

They had several things in common:

1. suppressed individual civil rights in the name of national security

2. state control the economy in the name of national prosperity

3. Emphasis on the colors red and/or black

Far-left or far-right, it doesn't matter, anyone who advocates this collectivist bullshit is a douchebag who deserves to die.

[CarlMinez]

Oh jesus christ.

Ive heard rumors of Glenn Beck but this surpasses my wildest prejudgment.

His reference to Adolf Hitler and vegetarianism is by far the most laughable political ad hominem argument I have ever heard.

[CarlMinez]

I have yet to read the book so I cant very well tell how much of this is truth. However Goldberg is a conservative syndicated columnist and author. Not exactly a trustworthy source of information.

Official definition: " Neo-fascism usually includes nationalism, anti-immigration policies or, where relevant, nativism, anti-communism, and opposition to the parliamentary system and liberal democracy."

[Kougeki1000]

Glenn is such an idiot. He goes on and on and on praising George Washington and Thomas Jefferson, James Madison and John Adams and pretends to hold the exact same standards and values as they but then he goes on and spews this kind of anti-liberal, anti-US propaganda, does this moron not realize that the Founding Fathers were the most liberal and progressive intellectuals of their time? Glenn, seriously, America is BUILT ON LIBERALISM, the conservatives wanted to stay as a British protectorate!

[jazzbo66zz]

The Fascists attacked liberalism because it seemed to them the principle premise of modern society. Theirs was a resentment of loneliness; their one desire was for a new faith, a new community of believers, a world with fixed standards and no doubts, a new national religion that would bind all Germans together. All this liberalism denied. Hence they hated liberalism, blamed it for making outcasts of them for uprooting them from their imaginary past, and from their faith. –Fritz Stern

[MrReco12]

Hitler was a capitalist.

Privatization,crushing of trade unions, coalition with the conservative parties, aid to General Franco, destroying democracy, worship of German traditional values(militarism etc) , extreame homophobia and huge buisness profitis for Fredrick Flick and Gustuv Krupp(who the Nazi kindly provided slave labor to build up their financial empires).

Sounds alot like the other right wing hero: General Augusto Pinochet

[AmericaTops]

Liberals are the most fascistic of ALL people! They LOVE to feel "important" by controlling other people's lives! Fascism is appealing to LIBERALS, because they have the "little dictator"-type personality, and LOVE to dictate to others and control their lives THROUGH GOVERNMENT and bureaucracies! That's liberalism dead-on. The author means that fascism can "SEEM" good and appealing (order, control, etc.), but it's horrible, and like socialism - TO BE REJECTED.

[FuttBucker667]

@AmericaTops Liberalism, socialism, and fascism are not interchangable, not even a little. Do yourself a favor and actually read a book for once and turn off the News because you're talking like an idiot.

[jufebato]

the reason fascism appeals to people is because is appealing...

what a great argument Jonah.

[tbone5665]

I thought Beavis and Butthead were taken off the air?

[kolomgorov]

I would like to agree with dragknuckle below however, fascism has nothing but contempt for the individual. And liberalism has taken on some of that characteristic.

[gmakepiece]

ANY P.J O'ROURKE zombietime com drsanity blogspotcom thepeoplescubecom dissectleft blogspotcom [Left] Liberal Fascism J.Goldberg The Death Of the GrownUp D.West Liberty&Tyranny M.Levin colonelrobertneville blogspotcom roadsassycom The Capitalist Manifesto A.Bernstein America Alone & Lights Out M.Steyn marksteyn com The Case Against Obama D.Fredosso The Audacity of Deceit B.OLeary therealcubacom The Real Che Guevara & the Idiots who idolise him H.Fontova Babalublogcom trenblindad com hfontovacom

[gmakepiece]

komradegorgonzola: Bravo comrade! You used todays state approved label of "knuckledragger!" for an enemy of the people! And there are so many we have to increase the glorious bullet production! Since we signed the Stalin Hitler pact, we too can use "untemenschen" or any sub-human label for any criticism of the GLORIOUS OBAMESSIAH PEOPLE'S REVOLUTION! We at the Al Gore Enviromental Stormtroopers Collective salute you! Ever onward with the moral vanity fraud of leftard liberalism!

[kolomgorov]

What are you talking about?

[kolomgorov]

When Hitler came to power the first thing he did, before even persecuting the Jews, was to round up the communists, social democrats, or any leftist he could find and put them into camps. The thesis of this book is stupid, connecting liberals and fascists through environmentalism is like saying because Hitler built highways in Germany anyone who builds highways is like Hitler. It's stupid because the building of highways and environmentalism is not what defined the Nazi's.

[kolomgorov]

What defined National Socialism is rabid nationalism, imperialism, Social Darwinism, a belief in military strength, a belief that might makes right, a belief that the strong dominate the weak. This and not environmentalism defined the Nazis. And this is right not left.

I'm not interested in defending what has become of liberals, in my opinion they are authoratiarian and don't deserve defending. But the thesis put forward here is so un-historic and stupid only Glenn Beck could believe it.

[gmakepiece]

komradegorgon: Excellent cognitive dissonance comrade! Bravo! We must counter the fascist neocons who try 2 discredit the GLORIOUS OBAMESSIAH PEOPLE'S REVOLUTION! Continue diverting awareness from facts like Hitler was a man of the collectivist total govt socialist left! Almost identical 2 all other socialist communist collectivism but with German characteristics! Excellent. I promote U 2 Commissar Obama 1st Class with 5 Al Gore stars! thepeoplescube com drsanity blogspot com bestobamafacts com

[gmakepiece]

kommissargrovel: Er, U have either not read the book or refused 2 counter a fact. beyond an emotional logical fallacy snit. YOU are sadly stupid, thus you use it twice in one post instead of gee, counter facts.

[kolomgorov]

While it's true under national socialism the state took control over industry, it was mostly for military production rather than the distribution of welfare. Also National Socialism was not "collectivist" in the liberal sense -- Hitler was dominated by Social Darwinist views in which only the fittest survived and he applied this view to everything. He was deeply anti-egalitarian. The concept of sheltering the weak with the state would be abhorrent to him.

[FozzilinyMoo]

jrmsher33: This issue really disrupts your worldview, doesn't it?

Seriously, though, read the book. While it's obvious Goldberg has a conservative agenda, the book makes some substantial points. You're wrong about fascism being anti-liberal (which, I take to mean, anti-collectivism). The German Nazi party, after all, was the National Socialist Workers party of Germany, which screams collectivism.

[ciraldofan]

But their (Nazis) collectivism was based on the idea of one race & one country, not one class. They allowed ALL social classes to exist, & unbiased histories show that corportate taxes were LOW under Hitler, who was loved by middle class & up....there was no move to redistribute wealth, so there was no socialism...Shirer & others point out they used that term in early 20s to attract working class...once they had power (funded by wealthy industrialists) they no longer worried about workers.

[dragknuckle]

Hitler's "fascism" was very different from the fascism of Mussolini and Franco. To focus only on Hitler, who had a derivative form of fascism, is to fail to understand what fascism is all about.

[jrmsher33]

Next he'll come out with a book "Communist Capitalists"

This is how stupid Glenn Beck is at 4:16 he makes the argument that anyone who calls someone a fascist is themselves, fascist.

I guess than Glenn Beck is a fascist for calling liberals fascist.

[TheOSullivanFactor]

So? Doesn't make his point any less sound. Glenn phrased it poorly and Goldberg clarified.

If I'm fat, and I call you fat, you're still fat.

[jrmsher33]

Everyone with any type of true political education, you know the kind you actually have to study for, knows that fascism is a popularist entity. Glenn Beck; you can't change definitions at your own free will because you want to tie in a word with something because you hate it.

A fascistic government is

Anti-liberal

Anti-international

Anti-multiculturalistic

Anti-democratic

Anti-intellectual

Pro-militarist heroism

Pro-nationalistic

These are the laws that define fascism, not vegetarianism!

[dragknuckle]

You are only looking at the superficial aspects of fascism that you dislike. By your definition every communist leader in the world was a fascist.

Fascism was a collectivist, highly regulated, anti-capitalist, profit-sharing, welfare-state system.

[themostimproved]

Fascism was pro-welfare? Really, do you have any sources? I would think that a society based on social darwinism would abhor welfare. I am not attacking you, just curious.

[dragknuckle]

It is a matter of historical fact that Mussolini expanded the Italian welfare state.

Here is a quote from "The Cambridge Economic History of Europe" : "The Charter of Labour... enumerated the benefits to which the worker was entitled, including education, health and welfare programmes, paid holidays, training, and placement."

I would suggest that you consider that social Darwinism is an individualistic ideology, whereas Fascism, like Communism, had nothing but contempt for the individual.

[dragknuckle]

BTW, thank you for being intellectually honest and seeking the reason behind my statement, rather than just attacking me. I know that there are good people on all sides of the political spectrum.

[themostimproved]

FYI I'm a libertarian leaning individual, I just considered fascism our evil right wing cousins. Sort of like how Ghandi and Stalin are both lefties, but have nothing in common.

[gmakepiece]

theleastimproved: Libertarian, eh? Ya don't say. But there's something profoundly lacking in your fundamental reading, understanding and analytical inabilities, is there not?

[jrmsher33]

That's just the economic system. The fascist system is defined by those facts mentioned above. To say fascism is simply an economic system is ridiculous.

[dragknuckle]

I didn;t say that it was JUST an economic system, I said that it had a huge economic component which you completely ignored.

You just listed the things you dislike about fascism without looking at how many fascist policies you yourself might support. And when you say liberal, you should be careful, since traditional liberalism is very different from the collectivist utopian liberalism of today.

The core philosophy of fascism is collectivism over individualism in pursuit of a perfect society.

[jrmsher33]

The "collectivist utopian" liberalism is a myth brought on by the likes of Beck and other doomsdayers. Even Goldberg himself stated in an interview that liberals are not fascist. Fascism is not liberal nor conservative, it's a very 1920's sociology experiment.

It's modernism based in eugenics and anti internationalist patriotic movements. Those are key concepts of Fascism.

[dragknuckle]

Who are the opponents of eugenics today? Conservatives, especially the religious ones, who say that you ought not abort a baby just because it has a birth defect.

Who are the outspoken opponents of "globalization" and "multinationals"? Liberals.

Have you ever listened to an Obama speech? "Lets all work together (collectivism) to provide affordable health care, eliminate poverty, pollution, and baldness, and everyone in the world will love America (utopia)". (I paraphrase for satirical effect)

[gmakepiece]

jrmshmersh: Balls. ANY P.J O'ROURKE [Left] Liberal Fascism J.Goldberg The Death Of the GrownUp D.West zombietimecom drsanity blogspotcom thepeoplescubecom dissectleft blogspotcom roadsassycom The Capitalist Manifesto A.Bernstein Liberty&Tyranny M.Levin America Alone&Lights Out M.Steyn marksteyn com The Case Against Obama D.Fredosso The Audacity of Deceit B.OLeary therealcubacom The Real Che Guevara&the Idiots who idolise him H.Fontova Babalublogcom trenblindad com hfontovacom

[gmakepiece]

Comrade kolomgorov: What am I talking about? Nothing 4 your feeble intellect little man, so go 2 sleep now & enjoy your weakling collectivist dreams of Che the child killer love. You'll wake up with a boner & B able 2 have a realy good tug over that great Che poster U bought. Be like Che! Arrest your parents,confiscate their property for the REVOLUTION & have them shot! Viva Che the child killer! thepeoplescube therealcuba com hfontova com drsanity blogspot com dissectleft blogspot com

[jrmsher33]

Glenn Beck didn't even know what fascism was? You'd think that somebody who talks about politics all the time would read a book on one of the most popular political movements in the past 90 years. Wow, talk about uneducated. The book states fascism is popularist movement. Liberalism isn't popular in America only 18% of Americans identify themselves as liberal.

See if you're a vegetarian, you're a fascist! If you like the environment you're a fascist.

[jrmsher33]

Jonah Goldberg is making up his own generic definition of fascism just because some moron called him a fascist.

Every politically educated person knows the parallels between socialist philosophy and Fascism to point this out is redundant. But liberalism, while it could be totalitarian if pushed into law has nothing to do with fascism. Since liberalism in economic terms means more pure capitalism, and in social terms is a multicultural internationalist movement; the opposite of fascism.

[mizilus]

so, is the hysterical glenn beck still having 'fantasies" about killing michael moore?

And since we're on the topic of delusional extremists is jonah golberg still trying to project his fascist tendencies on the "liberals"?

See below:

fas.cist [fash-ist]

-noun

1. a person who believes in or sympathizes with fascism.

2. (often initial capital letter) a member of a fascist movement or party.

3. a person who is dictatorial or has extreme right-wing views.

[EdnaSweetlove]

What a wonderful interview. One twisted fascist interviewing another twisted fascist and agreeing to call anti-fascists fascists. Only in fascist America.

[gmakepiece]

Dear EdnaShithead. Bravo! YOU are in the book! A Koskid Logical Fallacy Cognitive Dissonant Marxist Leftard Democrat indoctrinated drone! And YOU HAVEN'T READ the BOOK, HAVE YOU asshat? Thus you forgot to counter on an actual POINT where Jonah and his book are wrong. Outstanding! u stupid bastard! I love you!

[EdnaSweetlove]

Why not learn some manners, you common twerp.

[gmakepiece]

Dear EdnaShitheadSelfLove. Er, maybe learn some thinking skils. Ever heard of Logical Fallacy, Cognitive Dissonance, Okhams Razor etc? Nope, just Liberal mass Marxist Fascist drivel as per usual. Critical Theory on then, bub. Your teachers have made you and your friends into eterally mindless juvenile Leftard "twerps". Twerp on, incurious deluded bore & fake rebel.

[EdnaSweetlove]

You really are a common little piece of illiterate uneducated rubbish, grovelling in the cesspit of your own ignorance and working class stupidity. Believe me, my cat is better educated than you and more knowledgeable about philosophy. Try learning how to spell, you ignoramus.

[gmakepiece]

EdnaShithead Your cat, eh? Er, R U really sure that ya perception & judgements well, merely insane? Ah "common&working class" ergo bad? Riiight. Good luck with that. Ironically this makes U a class clown! Hardeeha Er, not illiterate. Voracious reader chum highly literate & my IQ is rather high. But U Remotional over having your fantastical paradigms challenged. It can be painful 4 a silly Marxist product sodden indoctrinated sausage Leftard twerp. Still, keep ya chin up & smile. Toodle ooh.

[EdnaSweetlove]

I see you are Australian which explains your illiterate stupidity.

[christopherduke]

I hate to say this, but this Australian ate your lunch. LOL

[christopherduke]

You ate EdnaSweetlove's lunch. I agree 100% with you. Common sense knows no sovereign boundaries. I'm so tired of libtards!

[gmakepiece]

chris: Thanks! You'll dig these: Any PJORourke drsanityblogspotcom thepeoplescubecom bestobamafacts com dissectleftblogspot com. Me: colonelrobertnevilleblogspot com, [Left] Liberal Fascism Jonah Goldberg, The Death Of The Grown Up Diana West Stealth Jihad Robert Spencer, America Alone Mark Steyn bestobamafacts com The Case Against Obama David Fredosso jihadwatchorg brusselsjournalcom WhileEuropeSlept Bruce Bawer theprophetofdoomnet WhyTheyHate by BrigitteGabrielle Radical Son David Horowitz

[gmakepiece]

EdnaSocialistlove. I quote U: "I see you are Australian which explains your illiterate stupidity". Excellent Left Liberal racist bigotry. Bravo. 51% of Australians were born overseas, so that makes them all subhuman eh? Oh, I get it. Leftard codespeak 4 U only mean white people. Check & Nuance. Ah, & U R a self loathing or straight out racist circus geek? 5 stars then! U R in Liberal Fascism, Diana West Death of the Grown Up, Radical Son David Horowitz & thepeoplescube com drsanityblogspot com

[EdnaSweetlove]

I'm bored with your loopy trash. Conversation ended.

[christopherduke]

In other words, you mean "I have no argument to counter this except namecalling". LOL. You embarassed yourself and libtards worldwide!

[EdnaSweetlove]

Name calling? I suppose your childish term "libtard" is deep intellectual comment is it? Calling you a retard would be a compliment too far.

[themostimproved]

This is sooooo retarded. My dad has this book. It's stupid. The New Deal was Fascist? Woodrow Wilson was a fascist? Democrats where racist before the Civil Rights Act (which actually polizarized the parties, there was Progressive Republican, like Theodore Roosevelt, and Conservative Democrats like George Wallace)

[gmakepiece]

themostthick: Five stars asshat! Dear EdnaShithead. Bravo! YOU are in the book! A Koskid Logical Fallacy Cognitive Dissonant Marxist Leftard Democrat indoctrinated drone! And YOU HAVEN'T seriously read or understood the BOOK, HAVE YOU asshat? Thus you forgot to counter on an actual POINT where Jonah and his book are wrong. Outstanding! u stupid bastard! I love you!

[themostimproved]

Um what. I don't even follow your insults. Calling democrats Marxist really is often horribly inaccurate. I find it interesting that you accuse me of fallacies and yet do not back up your insults with ANYTHING. Just insults after insult after insult, NO examples. NOTHING.

[gmakepiece]

theleastimproved: Bravo comrade! You used todays state approved denial, lies, fake insult attribution, avoidance and wilful ignorance to counter the meaningless facts of "gmakepiece" the right wing fascist neocon Bush/Hitler/Hallibuton racist enemy of the people! All criticism of the GLORIOUS OBAMESSIAH PEOPLE'S REVOLUTION is racist! We at the Al Gore Enviromental Stormtroopers Collective salute you!  Ever onward with the conformist tantrum and moral vanity fraud of leftard liberalism!

[themostimproved]

I'm a right winger....... and you have no "facts" just insults. I never even MENTIONED obama. You were the one to even MENTION my "GLORIOUS OBAMESSIAH PEOPLE'S REVOLUTION" Even though I don't agree with the stimulus, his strengthing of unions, and all his spending. I never mentioned race, once. I just said you insults make no sense, at all.

[luxfero]

fascism is state socialism. nazi stands for national socialist. if mussolini hated socialists he would have separated himself from hitler

[Christ724]

actually both hated socialism/communism

but they also despised laissez faire capitalism

so they sought a "Third Way"

which is just mixing both

[Scott1821]

Agreed.

[Scott1821]

See Christ724's post.

[ciraldofan]

National Socialism just a term, like People's Republic of China - which isn't a republic, or for the people. Hitler hated liberal minded people & TRUE SOCIALISTS, and had them killed. He made pacts with conservative institutions, like the Roman Catholic Church & Lutheran bishops, and Big CEO's of Corporations. He was admired by a number of right-wing American businessmen, and loved by the German Middle Class, who were very traditional & conservative, not liberal.

[ciraldofan]

Hitler's National "Socialism" had little in it that was socialist. He courted the corporate big wigs, the army brass, etc. From '32 to '36, wages FELL for the average German worker. In May of '33, he had labor leaders arrested and sent to Dauchau, then outlawed the right to strike. He then proceeded to throw socialists, commies, liberal college profs, etc., into prison and had most shot. Nothing socialist or left about the Nazis, the term is a misnomer, like People's REPUBLIC of China.

[peppermintjohn666]

'National Socialism' literally means 'racial unity'. Socialism had different connotations for him, hitler regarded marxism as an invention of jewish agitation , but bekieved i social justice. hitler thought the race was the nation and in that nation he wanted social cooperability. racial unity.

[gmakepiece]

ciraldopefatass READ the fucking book, U dopey bastard. Watching a vid of an enormously successful 4 very good reasons author of an empirical footnoted massively sourced best selling book that not a SINGLE Leftard has been able 2 show is incorrect on a SINGLE point, & then "thinking" & babbling like the indoctrinated fascist Left Liberal Marxist Nazi drones descibed in that book, would my dear little mass produced unoriginal infected twerp define a cognitive dissonance. Logical fallacy on.

[LordAgonis]

@luxfero Fascism is actually a form of National Syndicalism, Socialism is entirely different.

[AshleeandRyanFan]

hi!! MSG me on M.S.N. ID is in my profile.

umm lets have sex 2night 32

[flyinggeng]

Fascism and Socialism are cut from the same cloth.

Fascism is a national and racial oriented ideology of producing, distributing, and sharing wealth.

Socialism is a class and occupation oriented ideology of producing, distributing, and sharing wealth.

These fine differences cause fascists and socialists and to declare each other heretics and want to kill each other. The comparison to differences between religious sects is pretty good.

[Scott1821]

Musolini hated soccialists. His blackshirts killed them. Musolini wanted to unite all classes under nationalism, that is not socialism. Duh.

[soundwaves85]

Did Glen Beck graduate high school? Does he really know anything about socialism and fascism? More likely he's another talking head without any new ideas or real intelligence. You can take a shit on a peice of paper and put a cover on it, but that doesn't change the fact that its still shit.

[Christ724]

the thing about Mussolini is that he MIXED socialistic policies with capitalism, sort of what todays liberals try to do, he did hate socialists but he also hated free markets, he was a corporatist

[jumpinbeanz]

They said they were but their ideology is practically identical. As I only have only limited space to elaborate but to use an analogy: Muslims hate Jews and Vice Versa but th religion is most similar to Islam is Judaism and vice versa.

[ktownwreck]

there is a huge problem with this: mussolini defined his movement as anti liberal, and anti socialist, as well as anti individualist.. fascism is also extremely nationalistic, anti communist, and in many cases, capitalist to a very high degree.. liberal democrats believe in haratio alger and economic market liberalism, individualism, and entrepreneurial economics.