to understand why i say there is a great deal of evidence for a non-historical Jesus you need to read the book my friend - then judge. I think you will be surprised.
You make a lot of interesting points and good ideas. However, when you state that there are "mountains of evidence" of no historical Jesus, you reveal youself as a charlatan. If you make such claims, you must show the mountains of evidence. Oh, by the way, I am a atheist so I don't believe and Jesus' divinity. I just know he was a real person, man.
to understand why i say there is a great deal of evidence for a non-historical Jesus you need to read the book my friend - then judge. I think you will be surprised.
@timfreke There are not "mountains of evidence" that Jesus did not exist. There iss NO Evidedence that he did exist. There is a difference. There is also no evidence of a missing link. Are you going to tell me that evolution is not true. By saying that Jesus did not exist, you are going against Sam Harris, Richard Dawkins and Christopher Hitchens. They all have PhDs. Do you? You say there was no Jesus but you have a relationship with him. This, too, is crazy. I'll pass on the book.
unless you actually look at our argument it is impossible for me to explain my comments because they will make no sense. All our evidence is full noted and the book is taught in many universities. You are making too many assumptions without proper investigation.
@timfreke When you say that 100 percent there was not a man named Jesus and then you claim to have a relationship with this nothingness, you are admitting you are insane. SeekHelp.
a great well researched book that should be required reading everywhere. i jsut wish they would have atlked about how jesus never ate animals and how these fake christians today think its okay to open up slaughterhouses and murder animals, and how the old testament god loved sacrificing innocent animals and stoning women.
There has always been an inner and outer meaning to religion. The majority follow a literal concept whereby personality seems to take the place of the basic principles. I believe the basic life principles in Christianity are lost on most people. I fail to see any real value, save an imposed moral acceptance many follow. When a life is based on principle and not the belief of imagined beings, such a life is more connected with reality and not belief systems
A pious image backed by money and power make all the difference in turning a cult into a "respectable" religion. A good example of this process would be the Mormon Church and the Church of Scientology. You could even expose all the lies and hypocrisy and it doesn't seem to make a difference, people will cling to their belief that they have found the One True Path/Religion. Image is EVERYTHING.
Every religion & cult has their nice, loving teachings. That's how they get you hooked. If you look at modern gurus and teachers you see nothing but arrogant abusive charlatans behind the scenes. Andrew Cohen, Byron Katie, A Course In Miracles, Osho, Abraham-Hicks, blah, blah (I could go on forever). They use classic mind control tactics (see Robert Jay Lifton). Why am I to think that in ancient times it wasn't the same thing? Why does time seem to give credibility to nonsense? (cont.)
Elevated 'I's. Convinced to see that we are flesh and blood bodies bound to mortality. Scientific minds clearly unable to see reality. Reasoning "We are not spirit. That is fallacy. We live and we die. That is all it appears to be. Anything more is fantasy."
Contrary to beliefs popular: You come 'back' when 'you' 'decease'. Death is life. Life is death. Until you release. Reincarnated until Karma is Dharma. Until 'Mine' is 'Ours'. Until living 'Life' = knowing your 'deaths' hour.
The 'Quest of Historical Jesus' by Albert Schweitzer highlighted how people through the centuries have moulded Jesus according to their social, political and religious values. But come on my friend, are you serious!!! quote 'mountain of overwheming historical evidence Jesus didn't exist' Get back to me when you've read the vast amount of literature on this subject, what a shame.
Would you consider debating William Lane Craig? Not that I can arrange it or anything! - but I'd like to see it. Gnosticism seems very convincing to me for various reasons. The metaphysics of Christianity seem to make more sense, & be compatible with other traditions, if you cut out the historicity. But personal intuition *can* be wrong. As I remember, what sets your thesis apart from similar views is that you claim textual analysis reveals that later literalist writings of St Paul were faked.
Thanks for responding so quickly- it took me aback to be honest. In controversies like this, you can argue about the motives people may have to hold their views, & I think that's valid. But since each 'side' can play the same game, I'm more interested in specifics- such as the evidence for the authenticity or otherwise of Paul's later writings. I'll email Dr Craig as well. Possibly it's naive to think that I could help to bring this debate about, but wth?
you're right Scott - no one story is the same as the Jesus story - but all the motifs in the gospel narrative are found in various Pagan stories - and of course all that really matters is the death and resurrection motif - and that is ubiquitous - Tim
The problem I see with the Dionysus (or Mithras) comparisons to Jesus is that much of the storyline is NOT similar (but is often reported as such) or the parts that ARE similar ,no more make the stories the same than saying Major Dad is based upon All in the Family because they both involve family dynamics, a father, and some kids--on and, isn't it strange they were both filmed on a back lot in Hollywood? So Star Trek is kinda similar too.
Why "let go" of the historical Jesus why not embrace both? Am I an historical person? I suppose that is one perception of reality, but perceiving life as a dream makes all so called historical reality simply a fictional dream reality no more or less real than the historical Jesus may be.
@jagg1951 ~ well first of all, if you've read the book, you'll know that the "literal" jesus is a myth. he's a figure that evolved from the pagan religions of dionysus-osiris, mithra, adonis, bacchus, attis, etc.
the bible is rife with forgeries, propaganda, and completely absent of any historical proof.
why believe it? it isn't true, historical christianity is an authoritarian dogmatic mythology that demonizes those who don't believe as devil worshipers and heretics.
A myth? Much truth abounds in myths. If you take the teachings attributed to the character Jesus in the correct context you find who Jesus is. John called Him "The Word" Jesus said he was the "way" the "Truth" and the "life"
Truth lies in the content of the word, not in the speaker. I have read the words attributed to Jesus and have found the truth within in them. When one puts aside their own personal agenda then the correct context will reveal the truth of the real Jesus to you
@jagg1951 ~ you try to sound "enlightened", but you completely gloss over what i said with the same antiquated argument. i guess repeating something makes it true for you.
"you have read the words attributed to jesus". and none of these words were written in real time. nor is there any document in real time of his life. some god. his authors plagiarized the bible, which can be proven.
by pretending this isn't true, you are worshiping and praying to dionysus and calling him jesus.
Gloss over what you said? PAY ATTENTION! It doesn't matter when the words were written. It doesn't matter who said the words first. Plagiarism is a moot point. The words speak for themselves and I will reiterate my last post, John tells us Jesus IS the word not the speaker of the words. If you cannot conceptualize and grasp the meaning of the good news or gospel then it only speaks of your own ignorance in this matter. In the beginning was the WORD Read and understand John 1
@jagg1951 ~ you worship dionysus, but call him jesus.
the bible was written by pagan religions centuries before the christian version of jesus was even conceived. let me see if i can "conceptualize" this point for you. the first chevrolet corvettes were sold in 1953. your argument is that the 2010 corvette is the original and true corvette, while every corvette before that was a myth.
@tomitstube Try reading the book you are attempting to criticize. I told you read the gospel of John first verse. IN THE BEGINNING, before anything else existed before your precious pagan religions existed was THE WORD and the word became flesh and dwelt among men. Jesus said Before Abraham I am. Concept is Jesus is the Word of God or goodness truth and righteousness and the word was with God and the word was god.A rose by any other name\religion is Jesus...
@jagg1951 ~ i've read the book. just recently. lol, that's why i'm telling YOU to read it.
the bible was written by humans a hundred years after the (undocumented) jesus. so to say
"the word" (in the bible) came first is sheer nonsense. dionysus is the original god-man, that came from a virgin, that was murdered, and rose again 3 days later... 4000 years earlier. why can't you get this?
obviously you are incapable of understanding the bible. What John was saying is that before anything existed including dionysus, the spirit of Truth and Righteousness existed ....that is who Jesus really is. The words attributed to Jesus can be synthesized into the two commandments... 1 Love truth and righteousness above all else and 2 Love others as yourself.
@jagg1951 ~ obviously you have this mental block with reality and logic. anyone can say something was said in the past. but without witness or proof? and now you attribute something jesus said before he ever (fictitiously) existed? huh?!
i can't argue facts with someone who just pulls things out of thin air. later.
You still don't get it. It doesn't matter who said it, when they said it . All that matters is what was said. Is the content of the message valid in any context. You may not interpret what was said in the words attributed to Jesus in the Gospel story the same way I do so you will not see the truth in them the way I do. For example when Jesus said I bring a sword he was describing truth as a sword. A KKK father will be against his son if that sons truth says discrimination is wrong.
@tomitstube I haven't got time to go into it but you clearly haven't studied ancient history (classical & New Testament) and know the difference between myth and historical narrative. Now, I'm not saying of course everything in the gospels is historically reliable, but to say it's all pagan myth is a shame, it makes me sad to think the historical Jesus is reduced to this.
I use your book to teach spiritual awareness at The Temple of Ancient Wisdom In Copperas Cove, TX . Here we live Gnostic lives as Initiates of the path least travelled. Thanks to your wonderful contribution the path may become a highway! May The Divine in you continue to shine and bring joy to those in bondage! Blessings! Rafaela M. Jorge Smith HP
I know personally what you are saying about Jesus, I found that Christ inspires my life ever so strongly, much more than before I knew this truth. Jesus the master teacher lives in our hearts trough time and space.
I am happy to know that so many people are coming around to do the research for the sake of self empowerment and spiritual oneness. I am not Christian, like you I am just Human.
Jesus was not a Christian, he was a Jewish Rabbi. His sheep are all who love truth righteousness and others The goats are those who do not love truth righteousness and others.everyone is either a sheep or a goat in the end.Choose this day who you will serve.
I bought this book without knowing anything about who this guy was. It was interesting and to be honest it explained a lot.
I'm not particularly religious because I was forced to attend church as a child and noticed too many things that were totally unbelievable even to a child.
I'm not saying I don't belive but I know the bible was re written so how do we know everything happened the way it was printed?
well I think you get your knowledge from Sufism in Islam, like ibn al arabi.
he did believe in God and he did believe in jesus and all prophets in his book the bezels of wisdom he talk about them.
The prophet of God, said (know yourself you know God) that mean the truth is with-in us, that not a myth, he said that more1400 years ego, think what makes him say that? and that what are you saying in a different way but the same.
this guy carries on and on about "his personal" theories. using terms such as "i dont THINK" etc... lets put little seeds of doubt in peoples minds who are really just looking for an excuse to let go. Its quite pathetic making statements like that when you CAN research historical FACTS about the bible.
@arnofourie what historical facts? even isreali archeologists have admitted that moses was a myth, that david's kingdom never happened. there is not any of evidence that christ ever lived, jospehus never met him much evidence his mention was a forgery. so what evidence of the bible do you have? this guy is speaking what millions know its not just his perspective its a universal truth you come to by going with in. something you know nothing about since you just bow down to external authority
The Jesus Mysteries has been debunked for quite some time now. There are similarities between previous pagan religons and Christianity but those similarities are not nearly as close as the writers of the Jesus Mysteries claim. Google Debunking the Jesus-Mithra Myth.
Imagine if the Bible is the just that the greatest story ever told, that will be the biggest lie placed on mankind, or hypnosis for that matter. It looks like the early church fathers struggled to find a historical jesus too.
Wow. Thanks Tim, for for gathering up all the miscellaneous confusion in my head from Christianity and clearing the way for this moment to really happen, really snap with aliveness. !! We're alive, what the eck is going on! lol
They name him Dionysus, Zagreus, Nyctelius, Isodaites, and they construct allegories and myths proper to the stories of death and destruction followed by life and rebirth.~ Plutarch
Plutarch means more to me than whatever scripture Christians can cite. People should read up on him.
After reading your three books it begs the question - "Is Gnosticsm and similar religions based on the literalistic beleif that 'we are all of one conscientiousness perceiving itself into existance'".....
What emperical evidance is there for this? I like your arguments but you lost me on the 3rd book with 'literalist scientists'
Im sticking with athiesm... but you mounted a good argument for a Jesus myth. Like atheism, your religion is based on free thought too which is great.Fantastic reading
Love your points. I'm atheist but I listened at the request of a muslim friend to "The Passion of Esa" after doing some astrotheology searches on Easter. His accusations are based on cuneiform writings that claim Jesus is Baal. Resurrected, crucified with two criminals etc. Clearly mythology. Abdur Raheem Green predictably says how the Koran is so much better but it is still a good listen. The pagan Christ Baal compaired to a supposed real man with the sayings of Jesus.
The Bible talks about the doctrine of devils, this exposition of Christ is not of God, you can't just adapt or ajust a jesus according to your taste because true christianity is all about renouncing our conception of things and our mentality and being renewed in our mind and soul by the Word of God to becomme likke Christ and be partakers of HIS divine nature !
Some people have a personal relationship with Christ, and some are real. If you believe, or do something that He doesn't like, He'll let you know, believe me. When He allows a personal relationship, it's His business, and no one elses. You are responsible for your relationship, and that's what you should be working on, not mine, or others'. You cannot judge what is right or real. Jesus does what he wants to do, and there is nothing you can change about it.
I shure do agree with you, I do not speak of my own but do refer to the scriptures.
True that Christ is Almighty and can do whatever he joly well wants to, but never shall he contradict the scriptures for Christ is the author of the whole scriptures. He is the Word which abideth with God in the begining.
Scriptures has been given by God in order to test the spirits so we wont be fooled.
I started watching and researching everything Freke after hearing his thoughts on a TV prog about the bible. His thoughts struck such a place of truth... It was those words that lead me on a two year study of Gnostic ideas, and where I finally found my place and where my ideas fit. Check out his books, they are absolutely fascinating. I joined his site, much info there too...wish he spoke in Canada!
I read the book....it opened my eyes......life changing....thank you.
slawdogmcgraw 17 hours ago
to understand why i say there is a great deal of evidence for a non-historical Jesus you need to read the book my friend - then judge. I think you will be surprised.
Tim Freke
timfreke 2 weeks ago
You make a lot of interesting points and good ideas. However, when you state that there are "mountains of evidence" of no historical Jesus, you reveal youself as a charlatan. If you make such claims, you must show the mountains of evidence. Oh, by the way, I am a atheist so I don't believe and Jesus' divinity. I just know he was a real person, man.
JayGatsbyOdysseus 2 weeks ago
@JayGatsbyOdysseus
to understand why i say there is a great deal of evidence for a non-historical Jesus you need to read the book my friend - then judge. I think you will be surprised.
Tim Freke
timfreke 2 weeks ago
@timfreke There are not "mountains of evidence" that Jesus did not exist. There iss NO Evidedence that he did exist. There is a difference. There is also no evidence of a missing link. Are you going to tell me that evolution is not true. By saying that Jesus did not exist, you are going against Sam Harris, Richard Dawkins and Christopher Hitchens. They all have PhDs. Do you? You say there was no Jesus but you have a relationship with him. This, too, is crazy. I'll pass on the book.
JayGatsbyOdysseus 2 weeks ago
@JayGatsbyOdysseus
unless you actually look at our argument it is impossible for me to explain my comments because they will make no sense. All our evidence is full noted and the book is taught in many universities. You are making too many assumptions without proper investigation.
timfreke 2 weeks ago
@timfreke When you say that 100 percent there was not a man named Jesus and then you claim to have a relationship with this nothingness, you are admitting you are insane. SeekHelp.
JayGatsbyOdysseus 2 weeks ago
i am reading this book right now...
MissMallorina 1 month ago
Tim is a wonderful educator, and the man interviewing him is very bright and asking the right questions. Great interview.
Tonithenightowl 1 month ago
a great well researched book that should be required reading everywhere. i jsut wish they would have atlked about how jesus never ate animals and how these fake christians today think its okay to open up slaughterhouses and murder animals, and how the old testament god loved sacrificing innocent animals and stoning women.
normalguyable 6 months ago
There has always been an inner and outer meaning to religion. The majority follow a literal concept whereby personality seems to take the place of the basic principles. I believe the basic life principles in Christianity are lost on most people. I fail to see any real value, save an imposed moral acceptance many follow. When a life is based on principle and not the belief of imagined beings, such a life is more connected with reality and not belief systems
martenlander 8 months ago
Oh, and I forgot to mention Neale Donald Walsh, someone Mr. Freke endorses.
selinakyle 8 months ago
A pious image backed by money and power make all the difference in turning a cult into a "respectable" religion. A good example of this process would be the Mormon Church and the Church of Scientology. You could even expose all the lies and hypocrisy and it doesn't seem to make a difference, people will cling to their belief that they have found the One True Path/Religion. Image is EVERYTHING.
selinakyle 8 months ago
Every religion & cult has their nice, loving teachings. That's how they get you hooked. If you look at modern gurus and teachers you see nothing but arrogant abusive charlatans behind the scenes. Andrew Cohen, Byron Katie, A Course In Miracles, Osho, Abraham-Hicks, blah, blah (I could go on forever). They use classic mind control tactics (see Robert Jay Lifton). Why am I to think that in ancient times it wasn't the same thing? Why does time seem to give credibility to nonsense? (cont.)
selinakyle 8 months ago
Elevated 'I's. Convinced to see that we are flesh and blood bodies bound to mortality. Scientific minds clearly unable to see reality. Reasoning "We are not spirit. That is fallacy. We live and we die. That is all it appears to be. Anything more is fantasy."
Contrary to beliefs popular: You come 'back' when 'you' 'decease'. Death is life. Life is death. Until you release. Reincarnated until Karma is Dharma. Until 'Mine' is 'Ours'. Until living 'Life' = knowing your 'deaths' hour.
souldoctor73 9 months ago
@souldoctor73 Dedicated to Timothy Freke.
souldoctor73 9 months ago
first read the book my friend - then comment on the evidence and the research we have done - check the bibliography
Tim Freke
timfreke 10 months ago
The 'Quest of Historical Jesus' by Albert Schweitzer highlighted how people through the centuries have moulded Jesus according to their social, political and religious values. But come on my friend, are you serious!!! quote 'mountain of overwheming historical evidence Jesus didn't exist' Get back to me when you've read the vast amount of literature on this subject, what a shame.
krishnamurtiism 10 months ago
Would you consider debating William Lane Craig? Not that I can arrange it or anything! - but I'd like to see it. Gnosticism seems very convincing to me for various reasons. The metaphysics of Christianity seem to make more sense, & be compatible with other traditions, if you cut out the historicity. But personal intuition *can* be wrong. As I remember, what sets your thesis apart from similar views is that you claim textual analysis reveals that later literalist writings of St Paul were faked.
gerontodon 10 months ago
@gerontodon
i'd happily debate with anyone my friend
and .. .yes ... i think it is pretty much established now that the later letters attributed to Paul are not by Paul.
All the best
Tim
timfreke 10 months ago
@timfreke
Thanks for responding so quickly- it took me aback to be honest. In controversies like this, you can argue about the motives people may have to hold their views, & I think that's valid. But since each 'side' can play the same game, I'm more interested in specifics- such as the evidence for the authenticity or otherwise of Paul's later writings. I'll email Dr Craig as well. Possibly it's naive to think that I could help to bring this debate about, but wth?
gerontodon 10 months ago
Oh my...consciousness is expanding. It's the new Big Bang! Great video.
Jimsterr 10 months ago
you're right Scott - no one story is the same as the Jesus story - but all the motifs in the gospel narrative are found in various Pagan stories - and of course all that really matters is the death and resurrection motif - and that is ubiquitous - Tim
timfreke 10 months ago
The problem I see with the Dionysus (or Mithras) comparisons to Jesus is that much of the storyline is NOT similar (but is often reported as such) or the parts that ARE similar ,no more make the stories the same than saying Major Dad is based upon All in the Family because they both involve family dynamics, a father, and some kids--on and, isn't it strange they were both filmed on a back lot in Hollywood? So Star Trek is kinda similar too.
ScottMacFie 10 months ago
Why "let go" of the historical Jesus why not embrace both? Am I an historical person? I suppose that is one perception of reality, but perceiving life as a dream makes all so called historical reality simply a fictional dream reality no more or less real than the historical Jesus may be.
jagg1951 1 year ago
@jagg1951 ~ well first of all, if you've read the book, you'll know that the "literal" jesus is a myth. he's a figure that evolved from the pagan religions of dionysus-osiris, mithra, adonis, bacchus, attis, etc.
the bible is rife with forgeries, propaganda, and completely absent of any historical proof.
why believe it? it isn't true, historical christianity is an authoritarian dogmatic mythology that demonizes those who don't believe as devil worshipers and heretics.
tomitstube 1 year ago
@tomitstube
A myth? Much truth abounds in myths. If you take the teachings attributed to the character Jesus in the correct context you find who Jesus is. John called Him "The Word" Jesus said he was the "way" the "Truth" and the "life"
Truth lies in the content of the word, not in the speaker. I have read the words attributed to Jesus and have found the truth within in them. When one puts aside their own personal agenda then the correct context will reveal the truth of the real Jesus to you
jagg1951 1 year ago
@jagg1951 ~ you try to sound "enlightened", but you completely gloss over what i said with the same antiquated argument. i guess repeating something makes it true for you.
"you have read the words attributed to jesus". and none of these words were written in real time. nor is there any document in real time of his life. some god. his authors plagiarized the bible, which can be proven.
by pretending this isn't true, you are worshiping and praying to dionysus and calling him jesus.
tomitstube 1 year ago
@tomitstube
Gloss over what you said? PAY ATTENTION! It doesn't matter when the words were written. It doesn't matter who said the words first. Plagiarism is a moot point. The words speak for themselves and I will reiterate my last post, John tells us Jesus IS the word not the speaker of the words. If you cannot conceptualize and grasp the meaning of the good news or gospel then it only speaks of your own ignorance in this matter. In the beginning was the WORD Read and understand John 1
jagg1951 1 year ago
@jagg1951 ~ you worship dionysus, but call him jesus.
the bible was written by pagan religions centuries before the christian version of jesus was even conceived. let me see if i can "conceptualize" this point for you. the first chevrolet corvettes were sold in 1953. your argument is that the 2010 corvette is the original and true corvette, while every corvette before that was a myth.
tomitstube 1 year ago
@tomitstube Try reading the book you are attempting to criticize. I told you read the gospel of John first verse. IN THE BEGINNING, before anything else existed before your precious pagan religions existed was THE WORD and the word became flesh and dwelt among men. Jesus said Before Abraham I am. Concept is Jesus is the Word of God or goodness truth and righteousness and the word was with God and the word was god.A rose by any other name\religion is Jesus...
jagg1951 1 year ago
@jagg1951 ~ i've read the book. just recently. lol, that's why i'm telling YOU to read it.
the bible was written by humans a hundred years after the (undocumented) jesus. so to say
"the word" (in the bible) came first is sheer nonsense. dionysus is the original god-man, that came from a virgin, that was murdered, and rose again 3 days later... 4000 years earlier. why can't you get this?
tomitstube 1 year ago
@tomitstube
obviously you are incapable of understanding the bible. What John was saying is that before anything existed including dionysus, the spirit of Truth and Righteousness existed ....that is who Jesus really is. The words attributed to Jesus can be synthesized into the two commandments... 1 Love truth and righteousness above all else and 2 Love others as yourself.
jagg1951 1 year ago
@jagg1951 ~ obviously you have this mental block with reality and logic. anyone can say something was said in the past. but without witness or proof? and now you attribute something jesus said before he ever (fictitiously) existed? huh?!
i can't argue facts with someone who just pulls things out of thin air. later.
tomitstube 1 year ago
@tomitstube
You still don't get it. It doesn't matter who said it, when they said it . All that matters is what was said. Is the content of the message valid in any context. You may not interpret what was said in the words attributed to Jesus in the Gospel story the same way I do so you will not see the truth in them the way I do. For example when Jesus said I bring a sword he was describing truth as a sword. A KKK father will be against his son if that sons truth says discrimination is wrong.
jagg1951 1 year ago
@tomitstube I haven't got time to go into it but you clearly haven't studied ancient history (classical & New Testament) and know the difference between myth and historical narrative. Now, I'm not saying of course everything in the gospels is historically reliable, but to say it's all pagan myth is a shame, it makes me sad to think the historical Jesus is reduced to this.
krishnamurtiism 10 months ago
I use your book to teach spiritual awareness at The Temple of Ancient Wisdom In Copperas Cove, TX . Here we live Gnostic lives as Initiates of the path least travelled. Thanks to your wonderful contribution the path may become a highway! May The Divine in you continue to shine and bring joy to those in bondage! Blessings! Rafaela M. Jorge Smith HP
RafaelaMJorgeSmith 1 year ago
I know personally what you are saying about Jesus, I found that Christ inspires my life ever so strongly, much more than before I knew this truth. Jesus the master teacher lives in our hearts trough time and space.
RafaelaMJorgeSmith 1 year ago
I am happy to know that so many people are coming around to do the research for the sake of self empowerment and spiritual oneness. I am not Christian, like you I am just Human.
RafaelaMJorgeSmith 1 year ago
@RafaelaMJorgeSmith
Jesus was not a Christian, he was a Jewish Rabbi. His sheep are all who love truth righteousness and others The goats are those who do not love truth righteousness and others.everyone is either a sheep or a goat in the end.Choose this day who you will serve.
jagg1951 1 year ago
I love the way your book has opened the world to the reality of history and the myths in our religious belief systems.
RafaelaMJorgeSmith 1 year ago
Tim Freke... you rock.
RHODA4649 1 year ago
I bought this book without knowing anything about who this guy was. It was interesting and to be honest it explained a lot.
I'm not particularly religious because I was forced to attend church as a child and noticed too many things that were totally unbelievable even to a child.
I'm not saying I don't belive but I know the bible was re written so how do we know everything happened the way it was printed?
little1akasweetheart 1 year ago
well I think you get your knowledge from Sufism in Islam, like ibn al arabi.
he did believe in God and he did believe in jesus and all prophets in his book the bezels of wisdom he talk about them.
The prophet of God, said (know yourself you know God) that mean the truth is with-in us, that not a myth, he said that more1400 years ego, think what makes him say that? and that what are you saying in a different way but the same.
manny054 1 year ago
this guy carries on and on about "his personal" theories. using terms such as "i dont THINK" etc... lets put little seeds of doubt in peoples minds who are really just looking for an excuse to let go. Its quite pathetic making statements like that when you CAN research historical FACTS about the bible.
arnofourie 1 year ago
@arnofourie what historical facts? even isreali archeologists have admitted that moses was a myth, that david's kingdom never happened. there is not any of evidence that christ ever lived, jospehus never met him much evidence his mention was a forgery. so what evidence of the bible do you have? this guy is speaking what millions know its not just his perspective its a universal truth you come to by going with in. something you know nothing about since you just bow down to external authority
robaquarian 1 year ago
@arnofourie And those are?
mirellale 1 year ago
The Jesus Mysteries has been debunked for quite some time now. There are similarities between previous pagan religons and Christianity but those similarities are not nearly as close as the writers of the Jesus Mysteries claim. Google Debunking the Jesus-Mithra Myth.
InternetUser1999 2 years ago
Yawn
abode787 2 years ago
Imagine if the Bible is the just that the greatest story ever told, that will be the biggest lie placed on mankind, or hypnosis for that matter. It looks like the early church fathers struggled to find a historical jesus too.
BachTantra 2 years ago
@BachTantra the early church fathers? whom exactly are you talking about and where do you get this actual evidence from?
arnofourie 1 year ago
Wow. Thanks Tim, for for gathering up all the miscellaneous confusion in my head from Christianity and clearing the way for this moment to really happen, really snap with aliveness. !! We're alive, what the eck is going on! lol
Explorer766 2 years ago
They name him Dionysus, Zagreus, Nyctelius, Isodaites, and they construct allegories and myths proper to the stories of death and destruction followed by life and rebirth.~ Plutarch
Plutarch means more to me than whatever scripture Christians can cite. People should read up on him.
JuniusFaction 2 years ago 2
After reading your three books it begs the question - "Is Gnosticsm and similar religions based on the literalistic beleif that 'we are all of one conscientiousness perceiving itself into existance'".....
What emperical evidance is there for this? I like your arguments but you lost me on the 3rd book with 'literalist scientists'
Im sticking with athiesm... but you mounted a good argument for a Jesus myth. Like atheism, your religion is based on free thought too which is great.Fantastic reading
mcfad35 2 years ago 2
Myths which are believed in tend to become true...
w w w (dot) u s m i n c (dot) o r g
Hosea22 3 years ago
Love others as yourself, because we are one.
When you realise the truth in the second part of that sentence, the enlightement is instantaneous.
2ndSoul2nd 3 years ago 2
Love your points. I'm atheist but I listened at the request of a muslim friend to "The Passion of Esa" after doing some astrotheology searches on Easter. His accusations are based on cuneiform writings that claim Jesus is Baal. Resurrected, crucified with two criminals etc. Clearly mythology. Abdur Raheem Green predictably says how the Koran is so much better but it is still a good listen. The pagan Christ Baal compaired to a supposed real man with the sayings of Jesus.
DrakeDorosh 3 years ago
The Bible talks about the doctrine of devils, this exposition of Christ is not of God, you can't just adapt or ajust a jesus according to your taste because true christianity is all about renouncing our conception of things and our mentality and being renewed in our mind and soul by the Word of God to becomme likke Christ and be partakers of HIS divine nature !
philippeclement 3 years ago
Some people have a personal relationship with Christ, and some are real. If you believe, or do something that He doesn't like, He'll let you know, believe me. When He allows a personal relationship, it's His business, and no one elses. You are responsible for your relationship, and that's what you should be working on, not mine, or others'. You cannot judge what is right or real. Jesus does what he wants to do, and there is nothing you can change about it.
Belle19700 3 years ago
I shure do agree with you, I do not speak of my own but do refer to the scriptures.
True that Christ is Almighty and can do whatever he joly well wants to, but never shall he contradict the scriptures for Christ is the author of the whole scriptures. He is the Word which abideth with God in the begining.
Scriptures has been given by God in order to test the spirits so we wont be fooled.
philippeclement 3 years ago
Everyone has a different Jesus. Doesn't that also argue against oneness as such, just as much as it argues against a historical Jesus?
HebaruSan 3 years ago
I started watching and researching everything Freke after hearing his thoughts on a TV prog about the bible. His thoughts struck such a place of truth... It was those words that lead me on a two year study of Gnostic ideas, and where I finally found my place and where my ideas fit. Check out his books, they are absolutely fascinating. I joined his site, much info there too...wish he spoke in Canada!
lorettablonde 3 years ago 2