WFL: Chicago Fire vs. Jacksonville Sharks, 7/17/1974

[scrambang]

Why won't NFL films do a segment on the USFL like they did with the WFL? I find that very very curious....

[thecelebratedmisterk]

@scrambang Except they did, years ago. They did a whole half-hour show on it. How curious do you find that?

[scrambang]

@thecelebratedmisterk I have no recollection of NFL Films doing a USFL show, what year did they do one?

[thecelebratedmisterk]

@scrambang My bad, I TOTALLY read that wrong. They did the WFL one in 2001ish. But the thing is...NFL Films would have to actually have film to do a show on the USFL. At the start of the WFL "Lost Treasures" episode, Sabol said they didn't do one before that because they didn't have film until they found some. NFL Films isn't going to use ABC/ESPN tape to do an NFL Films show.

[zenmachinefilms]

Thanks for posting this. I remember the WFL.

We don't need the WFL or USFL to come back, but we do need an developmental league for the NFL. I thought it would be the UFL, but I guess not.

[opeth6969]

I wish we had a second major pro football league again. I wish the UFL could be more involved with the tv networks.

[RRaquello]

As a long time Bengals fan I remember Virgil Carter having a couple of pretty good years for us while Greg Cook was trying to overcome his injuries and before Kenny Anderson became the full time starter. He got us into the playoffs in 1970, only our 3rd year of existence.

[FRSFreeStateNow]

The WFL was an example of how not to run a Pro Football League. They didn't have the financing or the Management. And they tried to compete with the NFL in their markets and got killed for it. Chicago being a good example of this.

[slydawg221]

now there's an arena football team called the jacksonville sharks and they're the current AFL champs.

[joebradio]

A sideline mascot, a "helmet car' and a catchy team jingle -- it was almost like pro football

[fringbenefit]

Virgil Carter, I attended one game the Chicago Fire vs Philadelphia Bell, The Fire won when V. Carter threw a TD pass too Jack Daubin who went to the NFL and started Superbowl 12 for the Denver Broncos, The philadelphia Bell started a quarterback by the name of King Corcoran.

[lundehund44]

@fringbenefit The radio broadcast of that game can be found on the internet. I'm burning it to CD tonight in fact.

[kmtown043]

@fringbenefit I remember Jim "King" Corcoran. NFL Films once did a documentary about the Pottstown Firebirds, a minor league team that had the Philadelphia Eagles' old unis. The King was their quarterback. I believe he also played for Montreal in the CFL.

[amb1962]

Too bad the video doesn't show the Dickerod in use. :^)

Also, if I remember right, the Jacksonville Sharks folded in the middle of the season.

[thecelebratedmisterk]

@amb1962 Yeah, they made it 14 games before collapsing.

[indyfan22k]

Wow. Check out the Refs' wacky uniforms !

why call the time out at 9 seconds ? Call it it at 2, 3 or 4 seconds.

that's a very big crowd. Maybe it helped that the Bears were awful in the early to mid 1970s.

What Tv channel/network aired this ??

[thecelebratedmisterk]

@indyfan22k This particular game was on a local station in Jacksonville (I want to say WJXT-TV).

This was Chicago's second home game and they announced the crowd at 29,308 (after announcing 42,000 for their opener). The WFL was infamous for padding its attendance figures or giving away tons of free tickets.

[indyfan22k]

@thecelebratedmisterk

Its VERY difficult to make a profit when your letting in people for free.

[thecelebratedmisterk]

@indyfan22k That is correct. I think they did it to provide the appearance of popularity, which they thought would pay off. "If more people went, more people would go," that sort of thing. Once it - inevitably - came out that very few people had paid for tickets, the bubble burst. They simply didn't have enough money to do what they were doing - and the leagues that are trying to do it now are finding it even more expensive.

[CombatSportFan]

@thecelebratedmisterk Nothing wrong with trying to fill the stadium. In fact, I would say it's a MUCH better idea than the NFL's ridiculous blackout plan which completely cuts the knees out from under a team if they are trying to build up their popularity in a local market.

[thecelebratedmisterk]

@CombatSportFan Nothing wrong with trying to fill a stadium, but there IS something wrong with papering the house. While I agree the NFL's TV rules are archaic, they are at least consistent. No one has ever said you have a God-given right to watch home games on TV. You have 8 road games guaranteed to be on TV to "build up your popularity." And, let's be honest, this applies to a handful of markets (Oakland, Tampa Bay, Jacksonville) where, in a good economy, we're not having this conversation.

[CombatSportFan]

@thecelebratedmisterk Yeah, I had Jacksonville in mind while I was typing that in fact. I didn't know Oakland was having trouble filling the stadium now though.

[Kuteboi69]

@thecelebratedmisterk Wish you had your facts right. The Jags had an attendance problem one year. Im a Jags fan and stay in Jacksonville. And also a season ticket holder. Outside of 2009 our attendance has never been below 62,000. I wish people spoke on facts and not on perception. Just like its always been perceived that Jacksonville is not an football city, but weve had a team in in every football league that existed (including the Jacksonville Bulls of the USFL)

[thecelebratedmisterk]

@Kuteboi69 And they all failed.

[Kuteboi69]

@thecelebratedmisterk You idiot the WFL and USFL both folded. The Sharks owner, along with other owners in the WFL, didnt have money to even run the Franchises, and the USFL folded all together. And as far as the Jags, far from failer. 17 years old, 6 playoffs, divison champs twice, afc champs twice. Doesnt sound like failure to me. It kills me how you uneducated idiots always try to FIND something negative to say about Jacksonville. So actually YOU failed asshole!

[Rockhound6165]

Wow. Rare video indeed. Not much film left of this league.

[invincibleironman3]

i think Ike Lassiter of Jacksonville played for the Raiders. I remember George Atkinson talking about him, once.

[deeniemarie7]

@invincibleironman3 Yes,he played for the Raiders. He started for them in Super Bowl 2 against the Packers.

[artax84z]

I remember the Florida Blazer here in Orlando, they went to the World Bowl and lost to Birmingham Americans 22 to 21 I think. Would love to see some old games.

[Nascarfan880]

Thanks! been looking for one of these videos

[toeazy34]

@celebrated,

Is that the Vid where they show the championship trophy (WFL version of the Lombardi) being found in a closet by a janitor? If we're talking about the same vid its interesting, funny, and flat out entertaining. Also, if we're talking about the same vid, is it titled? I would love to track it down. Thanks, for the response and the post.

[thecelebratedmisterk]

@toeazy34 Should be the one, yes. It's an NFL Films Lost Treasures. I may be able to Youtube pieces of it eventually, I would have to track it down in my collection, though.

[toeazy34]

LOL at the helmet car @ 5:10. The WFL was about 5 or 6 years before my time but I remember some NFL teams having the helmet cars in the early 80's. As a kid, I thought it would be the coolest thing in the world to have in the driveway. Nowadays, I see the car and think WTF was I thinking? Anyway, great vid. I found this as I was looking for an NFL Films presentation they did on the WFL with Steve Sabol. It's a great production if anyone can find it.

[thecelebratedmisterk]

@toeazy34 I actually have that NFL Films production on tape, but it's like a half hour long. Maybe an hour.

[quietriotfan1976]

Plenty of NFL talent, very amatuer leadership. People may poke fun at the XFL, but I don't remember teams in the XFL having their uniforms impounded to go towards an unpaid laundry bill like Memphis had happen to them. 

[DTrainExpress]

@quietriotfan1976 It was the Charlotte Hornets that had their uniforms impounded, because they owed a laundry bill when they were the New York Stars. Memphis was the one team in the WFL that did have money and competent leadership with John Bassett.

In fact, from what I read Memphis and Philadelphia were the only two teams that didn't have any issues with their payroll.

[quietriotfan1976]

@DTrainExpress

Thanks for clearing that up. For some reason, I was stuck on Memphis being the team the repo happened to.

[sohemp]

I had the opportunity to play for the Fire #79 seen at the end of video. Although I was released with only 2 games left, it was the best time of my life. II have some programs and a few T shirts & a travel bag, but if there are any other video's available I sure would like to see them. Thanks for the video.

3gles1@comcast.net

[640wqbr]

I <3 the little Fire helmet car! Wish I had one!

[zenmachinefilms]

Thanks for posting this. I remember the WFL well. But it always bothered me the way the league raided the then NFL champion Dolphins dynasty by taking Csonka, Kiick and Warfield. But NFL players were woefully underpaid then, and the WFL filled a void. Too bad they couldn't last, even as a minor league.

[thecelebratedmisterk]

@zenmachinefilms So you're not big on the free market and on players having choices on where to play at the expiration of their contracts, then?

[Brian4043]

Great footage,Thanks for sharing.I've been looking for WFL footage and this is first I've come across thanks again.

[miketb42]

jimmy corcoran jr. has some great stuff of his dad (king corcoran of the philadelphia bell) and other wfl highlites on a video tape he owns. he runs "helmut hut"..i think it's easy to get in touch with him...

[alonenjersey]

Thanks so much for this very rare piece of Pro Football history. I did'nt think any video footage still existed. Great work! 

[m1049]

What is that contraption that guy is pushing at 5:05?

[uofm97]

@m1049I'm not sure what the thing is, but I think the guy pushing it is dressed as a clown, so my guess (I emphasize the word GUESS) is that it's supposed to be the front end of a fire truck. I did see a red siren on top of it, which is where my guess is coming from.

[wizeman5974]

I thought that was Mike Patrick (the same one who does college basketball for ESPN), and he confirmed it as he was signing off from this telecast. Thank you thecelebratedmisterk for sharing this. If you have any more WFL video, please share that too.

[thecelebratedmisterk]

@wizeman5974 Unfortunately, very little WFL original video (esp. game broadcasts) has survived. I'm amazed this did.

[Brian4043]

@wizeman5974 There are 2 excellent WFL websites on internet. I have 2 Sports sim games that i'm currently replaying the WFL seasons.

[BiffScooter1]

NFL Films did a hr thing on the WFL. It was broadcast on the NFL Network. Even had interview clips with founder Gary Davidson.

[thecelebratedmisterk]

@BiffScooter1 Yes, they've run it a couple of times. I have it on tape. Good stuff.

[BiffScooter1]

@thecelebratedmisterk Wow, someone still uses tape! DVD burner is the way to go now before the next out-of-date technology hits. 

[thecelebratedmisterk]

@BiffScooter1 I have it on DVD actually.

[ItalianQue]

I remember this League. Good to see that someone recorded the games. The NFL seems to hav emade sure NOBODY sees any evideance of this league ever existing.

[thecelebratedmisterk]

@ItalianQue Yeah, that's it. It wasn't that it was 1974 and a low-rent league. You know we don't have the original tapes of the Apollo XI moon landing, right? The WFL was fun, but it's conspiracy theory nonsense to say the NFL has squashed evidence of its existence.

[Cosmictalk]

I wasn't aware of this league when I was 10 Wish ESPN did a 30/30 WFL.

[thecelebratedmisterk]

@Cosmictalk 30 for 30 covers the years 1979-2009. But a Sports Century (if they still did that) would be great. The NFL Films one was about as definitive as you're going to get, though.