@CndTxc Hi, I went to your channel and watched Toby; first, please know that "twiddling with your hands" is not how one puts a horse on the bit. There are two basic principles--acceptance of contact, and acceptance of the aids. Basically, your horse must always go forward from the leg. I see Toby balking/backing up often; this means he doesn't always respect your leg. Would recommend riding him in a smaller area where you can really get after him for napping. (Response cont'd next msg)
@CndTxc (my response continued): Second, acceptance of the bit means if you touch the rein, he softly chews the bit (not chomping/pulling/leaning). Then you combine: get the horse forward, the inside rein flexes the jaw (makes neck round), get solid/honest but soft contact on the outside rein, and then you've connected the back end to the front end through your leg/seat/hands so half halts can go through. That is a really simplistic way to explain it, but that's the principle.
@MojoandGodiva okay, i was told in a few lessons that i should ask him to go down by moving my hands and play with his mouth, he is only 4 but i was just wondering, thanks.
@pandorawarrior1: Thanks for the suggestion. Just FYI, I don't have questions as to how to put my horse on the bit; I post these videos to chronicle the progression of my young horse's training mainly for my own benefit to see how far we've come, but I also hope they help out other people trying to train youngsters, as well. :) Anyway, I do feel that Sylvia Loch is an excellent resource: I watched her "on the bit" videos many years ago, and have read at least one of her books.
If you find he is dropping his head too much and pulling your hands down, I would just give him a bit of a pull and just keep your hands up? It works with my horse and if you want him to be still tucking, I'd just use alot of leg:) It works with my TB gelding and he is also green:)
@BoldEleganceRider Hi and thanks for the excellent comment. I did end up doing that with her, and that did help teach her not to "root" on the reins rudely as she does in this video. As I've said, this video was from over 1 year ago, and it shows the first time I had tried to get her to go on the bit so she did all kinds of crazy evasive maneuvers; if you look at our more recent videos, you can see that her contact is much improved and steadier now. :) Thanks again though!
Good job letting her stretch down into the bit! :) Im just starting my OTT gelding and am working on him being on the bit aswell, stretching is the best thing i have felt so far that lets him have full freedom and not feel constrained! :)
@imfanfreakintastic Thank you!!!!!! Yes, I was just trying to offer her steady contact and keep an even tension on the reins no matter WHAT she did with her head, which was pretty challenging at this stage since she was all over the place. Thankfully, she did like to stretch down a lot naturally so that did help her learn to relax. She's come a long way since this video was taken over a year ago, but we still have far to go!! We are doing our very best! Good luck with yours!
Your horse is not on the bit rather he is the opposite of what you want in this video. Even though he is young this is something you do not want to be teaching your horse these bad habits at this age. Your horse is very overbent.
@hunterjumper210 This was the 1st time I had ever asked her to go on the bit. Obviously, the 1st time, it's not going to be perfect. I posted this video to illustrate the ongoing PROCESS of how contact is established, and how much rider finesse is required to react to a horse's attempts to go above or behind the bit: i.e., I calmly continued offering steady contact and kept her in front of my leg no matter what she tried. Our recent videos show how very steady and correctly bent she is now.
@pazzimo2010 Why would you post such an unhelpful and irrelevant comment? Please keep all comments constructive and pertinent to the actual video. Thanks.
you need to get him sitting more behind and lift the shoulder...... he is leaning because he is on the forehand and cannot balance himself. one you have the hind end active and the shoulder up the out line and the contact will be much more stable and light :)
@tp1992100 Hi and thx for your comment--however, please note (as stated in the description) that this was over 1 yr ago, and also the FIRST TIME I ever asked my newly broke 5yo mare to go on the bit. Obviously, she is on the forehand because she is an unbalanced and crooked baby horse, and so cannot "SIT" on her hindquarters like an upper level horse. She was also fighting the new feeling of contact. Despite this, you can see I have her very forward (tracking up quite well w/active hind legs).
@tp1992100 (Reply #2) Please visit our YouTube channel to see our more recent videos, which chart our continued systematic progress through the levels of dressage. My mare has now been under saddle for just over a year, and already shows much more engagement behind and thus more elevation of the forehand and steadier contact/bit acceptance. She is pretty solid Training Level now, and schooling some First Level movements. Thanks again for watching and for the comment.
@hanah22596 Hi and thanks for your question! Please see the 11-part response I wrote to **tinkersboyandhanni about the same question. If you have any more specific questions, please feel free to write back and I'll do my best to answer specifcally. :)
my horse is a bright bay version of yours 0_0 lol but she is having trouble accepting contact, we are in the process of buying a sweet iron with a peanut and im gonna see if that works today, your mare is gorgeous :) xxx
@Shazzxox16 Hi, I hope the new bit is working for you! TB mares can be so fussy, LOL. I am using a KK ultra bit (regular, not dynamic version) and that works best for us (my girl didn't like the dynamic). Please also be sure to measure the bit width carefully to ensure a proper fit. For example, my mare will NOT go comfortably in a 5", but the 5.25" fits her great. You'd think that that extra 1/8" on either side wouldn't make that much difference, but trust me, it did for my mare!!
@Shazzxox16 P.S. At least in my experience, TB mares tend to be less accepting of contact initially than some horses. Mine is particularly bossy, and she simply didn't WANT me to tell her where to go! Plus, she is so big and unbalanced that she would mostly dive forward leaning crazily on the bit (hollowing back/head in the air was never a huge problem for us...running around out of control on the forehand was). What helped most was suppling/building her strength under saddle. Good luck!!
@theratlady Thank you so much for the kind compliment. She is much more steady/accepting of bit contact now than she was in this video; please check out our channel for our latest video progress! :)
Hey i have a 4yr warmblood tht i have just broken in. She is being difficult and accepting the down and going dowm :P how did you get you mare to do it??
@tinkersboyandhanni (#1) Hi, sorry it's taken me a while to get back to you. My mare is VERY bossy and accepting contact was a huge issue for us initially. Like I said in another response, what helped most was building her strength/suppleness first, mainly on the lunge in side reins. Our biggest issue was that she did not want/understand that when rein pressure is applied, she must instantly give/flex on that side. Stand in front of your horse on the ground and gently apply pressure on one rein.
@tinkersboyandhanni (#2) Your mare should turn her head in that direction without tilting her head. As soon as she starts to follow to that side, instantly release the rein pressure. That is their reward and what teaches them to give as soon as you ask. Once this is safely established on both sides you do this under saddle. As soon as you take that outside rein (say tracking left, it would be the right rein) she should flex down and turn her nose to the right. If she fights you, she doesn't
@tinkersboyandhanni (#3) understand yet. Best to do this at trot so you still have forward momentum helping you, and stay on the rail so you don't have to worry about steering/gettin into trouble. So keep holding the pressure on that outside rein UNTIL you get the slightest, tiniest give, and as SOON as you do, give a huge release (huge loop in the rein) and praise her. If your timing is right she should get this VERY QUICKLY. Once she is round, sneakily take back the rein and drive her forward
@tinkersboyandhanni (#4) It is sort of a misunderstanding to drive the horse forward first when they are not properly submissive to the bit (round) because then all they learn is to run forward on the forehand. You have to get her round first before you can do anything. So once she is accepting of going around flexed even for a few strides, you push her forward INTO your steady rein contact. As soon as you feel her take the bit, you release with both reins just a little, and thus the reins
@tinkersboyandhanni (#5) get longer as she follows the bit down, stretching down into the contact you have offered in the new lower place. It does take a bit of balance for a young horse to carry your weight and stretch down so try to do this only on straight lines at first and also do your best to stay as upright in the saddle as possible (not easy when your hands are giving down) to help her balance you. You should always be able to feel her mouth, BUT she shouldn't be LEANING on you.
@tinkersboyandhanni (#6) This does require some feel/experience on your part...it would help if you had a trainer or if you could ride a horse that knows how to do it so you can feel just how much weight should be in both reins. A young horse will frequently lean on one rein or the other, lean on both, or WORSE, flex down but then go "behind the bit," where there is no weight in either rein. You must always push the horse OUT to the bit with your legs, not take the reins in until you get contact
@tinkersboyandhanni (#7) Again, everything is more tricky with a young horse because they are all over the place AND they have no idea what you want but if you are patient and have good balance (which you must, if you successfully broke your young horse) then I'm sure you will eventually get it! In summary, establish strong contact on the outside rein--counterflex her to the outside if you need to--but then give as soon as she gives/flexes down. Repeat until she flexes as soon as you touch that
@tinkersboyandhanni (#8) outside rein, always making a big fuss (praise + huge rein release) as a reward for her doing it correctly. THEN slowly make the releases smaller and smaller until you can have nearly steady contact on the outside with almost invisible gives, and as soon as she's round push her forward with your legs. If she falls on her face (leans), give a half halt and then get her back on her hindquarters and make sure she's still round and push her forward again. You may need to
@tinkersboyandhanni (#9) readjust her balance like this literally dozens of times on a single lap around a normal-size arena (e.g., every other stride) depending on how well she carries herself naturally. IF she doesn't understand half halts yet, the best thing is to do trot-walk transitions where you push her correctly into the bit, and then once those are good, ALMOST do a trot-walk and as she gathers herself, then immediately push her forward again. Work at it and she will become steadier
@tinkersboyandhanni (#10) and more accepting. But definitely don't think that getting her flexed should take weeks...she should flex down within MOMENTS of your taking that outside rein, but getting her properly ON THE BIT where she is balanced, responsive, and has equal weight in both reins is what takes a LONG TIME AND A LOT OF WORK--straightening her on both sides, building her strength, half halts, etc. Stretching down, like on a trot circle, is just an extension of being on the bit,
@tinkersboyandhanni (#11) since if she IS properly on the bit and not just posing in a flexed position, when you GIVE her more rein and continue to push her forward, she should follow your hands down until her nose in the dirt. Again, don't expect too much at first because it does take a lot of strength for a young horse to carry you AND have their nose down at the same time, especially on turns. Hope that makes sense! Feel free to write back with any more questions.
Try a different bit! A kk with a peanut in the middle will help her to relax her jaw and except the contact. Or do you have the bit too low in her mouth? She is going forward nicely and you are keeping her at a steady pace but she is not happy with your bit or it's adjustment. Just a suggestion!
@rideinrain I am actually using a KK double-jointed snaffle here. Just FYI, this particular mare is exceedingly bossy/dominant, and it's taken quite some time for her to relax, accept contact, and submit to the rider's will. In this video, she had only been broke ~3 weeks, and this was the 2nd ride that I had ever asked her to take more contact, so understandably, she was pretty fussy about it, but is trying to understand. If you watch our recent videos, you'll see how much we've progressed. Thx
pretty :) ive been trying to get my Thoroughbred on the bit but he never listens and just sticks his head in the air like a girrafe :\ hes 8yo and came off track about 5 months ago so i dont really blame him..but it annoys me lol
@jacsonandsilver Hi! Thanks for watching, and the kind comment. :) If your horse just got off the track 5 mos. ago (congrats on your new horse, btw!!), he definitely needs time to get used to carrying himself AND a rider in a whole new way!! Patience! :) And teach him to go forward from your leg, and offer steady/inviting rein contact, and half halt, and when he's ready (strong/flexible enough), he'll get it! OTTBs need time, but they're so smart and athletic, and have heart like no other breed!
this is what my arab does and hes 13!! he just puts his head down and doesnt accept it. Any tips? Your a good rider :)
ChloeRosie14 1 week ago
hey, well if you watch some of my videos of Toby could you give me some adivse he doesnt respond to twiddling with your hands?xxx
CndTxc 2 weeks ago
@CndTxc Hi, I went to your channel and watched Toby; first, please know that "twiddling with your hands" is not how one puts a horse on the bit. There are two basic principles--acceptance of contact, and acceptance of the aids. Basically, your horse must always go forward from the leg. I see Toby balking/backing up often; this means he doesn't always respect your leg. Would recommend riding him in a smaller area where you can really get after him for napping. (Response cont'd next msg)
MojoandGodiva 2 weeks ago
@CndTxc (my response continued): Second, acceptance of the bit means if you touch the rein, he softly chews the bit (not chomping/pulling/leaning). Then you combine: get the horse forward, the inside rein flexes the jaw (makes neck round), get solid/honest but soft contact on the outside rein, and then you've connected the back end to the front end through your leg/seat/hands so half halts can go through. That is a really simplistic way to explain it, but that's the principle.
MojoandGodiva 2 weeks ago
@MojoandGodiva okay, i was told in a few lessons that i should ask him to go down by moving my hands and play with his mouth, he is only 4 but i was just wondering, thanks.
CndTxc 2 weeks ago
watch sylvia lochs video, some very insightful and very helpful information
pandorawarrior1 1 month ago
@pandorawarrior1: Thanks for the suggestion. Just FYI, I don't have questions as to how to put my horse on the bit; I post these videos to chronicle the progression of my young horse's training mainly for my own benefit to see how far we've come, but I also hope they help out other people trying to train youngsters, as well. :) Anyway, I do feel that Sylvia Loch is an excellent resource: I watched her "on the bit" videos many years ago, and have read at least one of her books.
MojoandGodiva 2 weeks ago
If you find he is dropping his head too much and pulling your hands down, I would just give him a bit of a pull and just keep your hands up? It works with my horse and if you want him to be still tucking, I'd just use alot of leg:) It works with my TB gelding and he is also green:)
BoldEleganceRider 1 month ago
@BoldEleganceRider Hi and thanks for the excellent comment. I did end up doing that with her, and that did help teach her not to "root" on the reins rudely as she does in this video. As I've said, this video was from over 1 year ago, and it shows the first time I had tried to get her to go on the bit so she did all kinds of crazy evasive maneuvers; if you look at our more recent videos, you can see that her contact is much improved and steadier now. :) Thanks again though!
MojoandGodiva 1 month ago
Good job letting her stretch down into the bit! :) Im just starting my OTT gelding and am working on him being on the bit aswell, stretching is the best thing i have felt so far that lets him have full freedom and not feel constrained! :)
Hope she turns out amazing! good job. x
imfanfreakintastic 2 months ago
@imfanfreakintastic Thank you!!!!!! Yes, I was just trying to offer her steady contact and keep an even tension on the reins no matter WHAT she did with her head, which was pretty challenging at this stage since she was all over the place. Thankfully, she did like to stretch down a lot naturally so that did help her learn to relax. She's come a long way since this video was taken over a year ago, but we still have far to go!! We are doing our very best! Good luck with yours!
MojoandGodiva 1 month ago
shes really pretty,how old?x
keepcalmandrideon 3 months ago
@keepcalmandrideon Thank you! In this video, she was 5. Now, she's 6. :)
MojoandGodiva 1 month ago
Your horse is not on the bit rather he is the opposite of what you want in this video. Even though he is young this is something you do not want to be teaching your horse these bad habits at this age. Your horse is very overbent.
hunterjumper210 4 months ago
@hunterjumper210 This was the 1st time I had ever asked her to go on the bit. Obviously, the 1st time, it's not going to be perfect. I posted this video to illustrate the ongoing PROCESS of how contact is established, and how much rider finesse is required to react to a horse's attempts to go above or behind the bit: i.e., I calmly continued offering steady contact and kept her in front of my leg no matter what she tried. Our recent videos show how very steady and correctly bent she is now.
MojoandGodiva 4 months ago 2
ur so defensive :/
pazzimo2010 5 months ago
@pazzimo2010 Why would you post such an unhelpful and irrelevant comment? Please keep all comments constructive and pertinent to the actual video. Thanks.
MojoandGodiva 4 months ago 3
you need to get him sitting more behind and lift the shoulder...... he is leaning because he is on the forehand and cannot balance himself. one you have the hind end active and the shoulder up the out line and the contact will be much more stable and light :)
tp1992100 8 months ago
@tp1992100 Hi and thx for your comment--however, please note (as stated in the description) that this was over 1 yr ago, and also the FIRST TIME I ever asked my newly broke 5yo mare to go on the bit. Obviously, she is on the forehand because she is an unbalanced and crooked baby horse, and so cannot "SIT" on her hindquarters like an upper level horse. She was also fighting the new feeling of contact. Despite this, you can see I have her very forward (tracking up quite well w/active hind legs).
MojoandGodiva 8 months ago
@tp1992100 (Reply #2) Please visit our YouTube channel to see our more recent videos, which chart our continued systematic progress through the levels of dressage. My mare has now been under saddle for just over a year, and already shows much more engagement behind and thus more elevation of the forehand and steadier contact/bit acceptance. She is pretty solid Training Level now, and schooling some First Level movements. Thanks again for watching and for the comment.
MojoandGodiva 8 months ago
Can i ask how you're teaching her to go on the bit? i don't have much knowledge of how to do it and i have the problem with my little welshy.
hanah22596 10 months ago
@hanah22596 Hi and thanks for your question! Please see the 11-part response I wrote to **tinkersboyandhanni about the same question. If you have any more specific questions, please feel free to write back and I'll do my best to answer specifcally. :)
MojoandGodiva 10 months ago
my horse is a bright bay version of yours 0_0 lol but she is having trouble accepting contact, we are in the process of buying a sweet iron with a peanut and im gonna see if that works today, your mare is gorgeous :) xxx
Shazzxox16 11 months ago
@Shazzxox16 Hi, I hope the new bit is working for you! TB mares can be so fussy, LOL. I am using a KK ultra bit (regular, not dynamic version) and that works best for us (my girl didn't like the dynamic). Please also be sure to measure the bit width carefully to ensure a proper fit. For example, my mare will NOT go comfortably in a 5", but the 5.25" fits her great. You'd think that that extra 1/8" on either side wouldn't make that much difference, but trust me, it did for my mare!!
MojoandGodiva 10 months ago
@Shazzxox16 P.S. At least in my experience, TB mares tend to be less accepting of contact initially than some horses. Mine is particularly bossy, and she simply didn't WANT me to tell her where to go! Plus, she is so big and unbalanced that she would mostly dive forward leaning crazily on the bit (hollowing back/head in the air was never a huge problem for us...running around out of control on the forehand was). What helped most was suppling/building her strength under saddle. Good luck!!
MojoandGodiva 10 months ago
@MojoandGodiva thanks for the tips! xxxx
Shazzxox16 9 months ago
She looks good
theratlady 1 year ago
@theratlady Thank you so much for the kind compliment. She is much more steady/accepting of bit contact now than she was in this video; please check out our channel for our latest video progress! :)
MojoandGodiva 10 months ago
Hey i have a 4yr warmblood tht i have just broken in. She is being difficult and accepting the down and going dowm :P how did you get you mare to do it??
tinkersboyandhanni 1 year ago
@tinkersboyandhanni (#1) Hi, sorry it's taken me a while to get back to you. My mare is VERY bossy and accepting contact was a huge issue for us initially. Like I said in another response, what helped most was building her strength/suppleness first, mainly on the lunge in side reins. Our biggest issue was that she did not want/understand that when rein pressure is applied, she must instantly give/flex on that side. Stand in front of your horse on the ground and gently apply pressure on one rein.
MojoandGodiva 10 months ago
@tinkersboyandhanni (#2) Your mare should turn her head in that direction without tilting her head. As soon as she starts to follow to that side, instantly release the rein pressure. That is their reward and what teaches them to give as soon as you ask. Once this is safely established on both sides you do this under saddle. As soon as you take that outside rein (say tracking left, it would be the right rein) she should flex down and turn her nose to the right. If she fights you, she doesn't
MojoandGodiva 10 months ago
@tinkersboyandhanni (#3) understand yet. Best to do this at trot so you still have forward momentum helping you, and stay on the rail so you don't have to worry about steering/gettin into trouble. So keep holding the pressure on that outside rein UNTIL you get the slightest, tiniest give, and as SOON as you do, give a huge release (huge loop in the rein) and praise her. If your timing is right she should get this VERY QUICKLY. Once she is round, sneakily take back the rein and drive her forward
MojoandGodiva 10 months ago
@tinkersboyandhanni (#4) It is sort of a misunderstanding to drive the horse forward first when they are not properly submissive to the bit (round) because then all they learn is to run forward on the forehand. You have to get her round first before you can do anything. So once she is accepting of going around flexed even for a few strides, you push her forward INTO your steady rein contact. As soon as you feel her take the bit, you release with both reins just a little, and thus the reins
MojoandGodiva 10 months ago
@tinkersboyandhanni (#5) get longer as she follows the bit down, stretching down into the contact you have offered in the new lower place. It does take a bit of balance for a young horse to carry your weight and stretch down so try to do this only on straight lines at first and also do your best to stay as upright in the saddle as possible (not easy when your hands are giving down) to help her balance you. You should always be able to feel her mouth, BUT she shouldn't be LEANING on you.
MojoandGodiva 10 months ago
@tinkersboyandhanni (#6) This does require some feel/experience on your part...it would help if you had a trainer or if you could ride a horse that knows how to do it so you can feel just how much weight should be in both reins. A young horse will frequently lean on one rein or the other, lean on both, or WORSE, flex down but then go "behind the bit," where there is no weight in either rein. You must always push the horse OUT to the bit with your legs, not take the reins in until you get contact
MojoandGodiva 10 months ago
@tinkersboyandhanni (#7) Again, everything is more tricky with a young horse because they are all over the place AND they have no idea what you want but if you are patient and have good balance (which you must, if you successfully broke your young horse) then I'm sure you will eventually get it! In summary, establish strong contact on the outside rein--counterflex her to the outside if you need to--but then give as soon as she gives/flexes down. Repeat until she flexes as soon as you touch that
MojoandGodiva 10 months ago
@tinkersboyandhanni (#8) outside rein, always making a big fuss (praise + huge rein release) as a reward for her doing it correctly. THEN slowly make the releases smaller and smaller until you can have nearly steady contact on the outside with almost invisible gives, and as soon as she's round push her forward with your legs. If she falls on her face (leans), give a half halt and then get her back on her hindquarters and make sure she's still round and push her forward again. You may need to
MojoandGodiva 10 months ago
@tinkersboyandhanni (#9) readjust her balance like this literally dozens of times on a single lap around a normal-size arena (e.g., every other stride) depending on how well she carries herself naturally. IF she doesn't understand half halts yet, the best thing is to do trot-walk transitions where you push her correctly into the bit, and then once those are good, ALMOST do a trot-walk and as she gathers herself, then immediately push her forward again. Work at it and she will become steadier
MojoandGodiva 10 months ago
@tinkersboyandhanni (#10) and more accepting. But definitely don't think that getting her flexed should take weeks...she should flex down within MOMENTS of your taking that outside rein, but getting her properly ON THE BIT where she is balanced, responsive, and has equal weight in both reins is what takes a LONG TIME AND A LOT OF WORK--straightening her on both sides, building her strength, half halts, etc. Stretching down, like on a trot circle, is just an extension of being on the bit,
MojoandGodiva 10 months ago
@tinkersboyandhanni (#11) since if she IS properly on the bit and not just posing in a flexed position, when you GIVE her more rein and continue to push her forward, she should follow your hands down until her nose in the dirt. Again, don't expect too much at first because it does take a lot of strength for a young horse to carry you AND have their nose down at the same time, especially on turns. Hope that makes sense! Feel free to write back with any more questions.
MojoandGodiva 10 months ago
Try a different bit! A kk with a peanut in the middle will help her to relax her jaw and except the contact. Or do you have the bit too low in her mouth? She is going forward nicely and you are keeping her at a steady pace but she is not happy with your bit or it's adjustment. Just a suggestion!
rideinrain 1 year ago
@rideinrain I am actually using a KK double-jointed snaffle here. Just FYI, this particular mare is exceedingly bossy/dominant, and it's taken quite some time for her to relax, accept contact, and submit to the rider's will. In this video, she had only been broke ~3 weeks, and this was the 2nd ride that I had ever asked her to take more contact, so understandably, she was pretty fussy about it, but is trying to understand. If you watch our recent videos, you'll see how much we've progressed. Thx
MojoandGodiva 1 year ago
she looks lovely!
mryoshiieee 1 year ago
@mryoshiieee Thank you so much!! :)
MojoandGodiva 1 year ago
pretty :) ive been trying to get my Thoroughbred on the bit but he never listens and just sticks his head in the air like a girrafe :\ hes 8yo and came off track about 5 months ago so i dont really blame him..but it annoys me lol
jacsonandsilver 1 year ago
@jacsonandsilver Hi! Thanks for watching, and the kind comment. :) If your horse just got off the track 5 mos. ago (congrats on your new horse, btw!!), he definitely needs time to get used to carrying himself AND a rider in a whole new way!! Patience! :) And teach him to go forward from your leg, and offer steady/inviting rein contact, and half halt, and when he's ready (strong/flexible enough), he'll get it! OTTBs need time, but they're so smart and athletic, and have heart like no other breed!
MojoandGodiva 1 year ago