Preterism and Church History: Eusebius' Church History

[RCSCROLLS]

Yeap they rather rely on their Pastors point of view that way they dont have to study for themselves. Have a Merry Christs - Mass

[nijjhar1]

Hi,

Jews made many changes in the Bible and Eusibius points some out. I am interested to hear from you. Let us expose hypocrisy.

[davecyco]

Has anyone considered that some preterists may be right and that the prophecies may also have fulfillment in other ages as well?

Many things in God's Word can be understood in various ways, after all.

Rome is the whore, ever since antipope Benedict XV came into his antipapacy.

[valu777]

Jesus, yielded up the ghost behold, the veil of the temple was rent in twain from the top to the bottom; and the earth did quake, and the rocks rent the graves were opened; and many bodies of the saints which slept arose,came out of the graves after his resurrection, and went into the holy city, and appeared unto many Now when the centurion, and they that were with him, watching Jesus, saw the earthquake, and those things that were done, they feared greatly, saying Truly this was the Son of God.

[FcukLars]

The preterist train of thought is a last ditch effort to make Christ's prediction of his 2nd (3rd?) coming a historical reality when anyone with half a brain knows it didn't occur.

[Masonictoaster9]

You hope not, so you can go on your merry way. The light in the clouds did indeed come and it was Christ coming in his kingdom over Jerusalem. This strange supernatural occurence and others like armies battling in the sky is rercorded by the Roman historian, Tacitus. Christ met his people in the spirit and that is what the Bible means about "we shall meet the Lord in the air." Air here is the greek word aemi meaning breath of life - not the sky. Second Peter was written about you. Read it.

[Blogrich55]

Gee, I guess you don't have half a brain then, do you? LOL

[FcukLars]

I have enough of a brain to have read Tacitus, Suetonius, Josephus, et al. and enough of a brain to agree that the preterist train of thought is more sound than the futurist train of thought. Christ didn't return in 70 A.D.

[Blogrich55]

"Christ didn't return in 70 A.D." Fcuklars

Try telling that to the Jews that were in Jerusalem when the temple was burned to the ground, the sacrifices abolished, the Jews were put in slavery and scattered all over the world. Stuff happened. You are NOT an expert on apocalyptic literature or eschatology.

[FcukLars]

I agree. Stuff happened. This is all well documented in secular history. I never claimed to be an expert in apocalyptic literature or eschatology --- I'm merely well read in both. Both Revelation (AD68/9) and Daniel (BC164)were written at times when jewish national morale was at its lowest. So strong was the jewish faith that they required messiah to come bail them out during these low points in its history. Messiah came in the form of Judas Maccabee the first time. Noone came in A.D. 70.

[Blogrich55]

"Noone came in A.D. 70." FcukLars

#1.

I can tell by your comments you're knowledgeable on the subject but not quite correctly oriented. We need to remember there were 2 groups of Jews in those days. The original Christians were Jews who accepted their Messiah. The others were those who pledged allegiance to Cesar and said let His blood be on their heads to crucify Him.

Now the ones who rejected Jesus persecuted the others. Read Acts as I'm sure you have. His coming was to rescue the persecuted

[Blogrich55]

#2. Christian Jews who were being tormented by both the non-believing Jews and the Roman government who the NBJs had set on the Christian Jews. The JCs had been warned by Christ to flee when they saw the abomination of desolation and did so.

Luke calls the A of D the surrounding of Jerusalem by Roman soldiers. He talks about the days of vengeance. A cursory reading of Matthew 19-23 would show that many of the parables concerned the NBJs and they knew it. Matt 23:33-39 is crucial to understand.

[FcukLars]

All of what you just typed is common knowledge. As far as being "correctly oriented" preterists cannot even agree on Rev. 18:4. Those who say that "her" refers to Rome; this "prophecy" was fulfilled 20 years prior (49 or 52 AD, depending on source) to Revelation's being written when Claudius issued the edict mentioned in Acts 18:2. and Suet. Claud. 25.2. Those who say "her" refers to Jerusalem - well they had to move quick as Rome was already on the march whilst the scrolls were being written

[FcukLars]

Each and every one of Daniel's/Revelation's "prophecies" were written after the fact except for the expectations of a heavenly warrior messiah to materialize and vanquish the Seleucids/Romans. Which occured in neither case. It is also contradictory to believe that the messiah would vanquish the Romans when the scriptures have Christ saying that his coming would occur directly after the Romans destroyed the Jewish temple.

[FcukLars]

The "representive judgement" train of thought of some preterists is also incorrect. Not only is it incorrect - it's a copout. Christ was supposed to come down out the clouds, vanquish Rome and rule the world for 1,000 years. In order to account for that obvious discrepancy preterist belief reduces the 1,000 reign to a mere 40 years.

[RCSCROLLS]

@FcukLars Why would Christ leave Heaven to be in this place, Hes here now and has been ever hear where ever two or three are gathered in my name there I am in the Midst.

There is no physical reign of Christ here.!! you sound like a first century Jew that says Messiah didnt come because Hes not here as King. Wait to the both of you find out that He is here, the earth is His footstool.

[Blogrich55]

You don't know that about Daniel or the Apocalypse. I have heard a lot of German higher criticism and it always sounds perfectly speculative. What some of the Jews expected to happen is irrelevant. Jesus told them His kingdom was not of this world. The scriptures don't say Christ would destroy Rome or come after the temple was destroyed.

I would suggest you read THE PAROUSIA by J S Russel or WHO IS THIS BABYLON by Don K Preston before you make up your mind.

So you're an atheist, right?

[FcukLars]

Yes I do. Daniel was merely an ongoing history book written by multiple authors. Revelation follows the same pattern; the earliest historical references regard the principate of Caius (Caligula), the bulk of the "judgements" are fulfilled during the principate of Claudius, and a smattering of Nero is thrown in for good measure. There is nothing speculative about this.

[RCSCROLLS]

@FcukLars He did it with the Roman armies like Daniel says 9

[Blogrich55]

I don't, personally care what some preterists think, That some believe the Harlot to be Rome just because she sits on the 7 hills is unimportant to me. The preponderance of the evidence points to Jerusalem.

I admit to being remiss in not producing videos on the harlot of the Apocalypse. I have a lot of other things to do first. But the approach I take doesn't leave much doubt as to who the Bible claims she is. The Jews didn't have the authority to do things. They used Rome to do them.

[Bibletouchstone]

Right, Blogrich55. The matter is not so much about what some preterists think and believe. The matter is over the fulfillment of the Scriptures. No doubt, preterism is too immature, and eschatology is too difficult for everyone all preterists to be correct about everything. Our concern is what the Scriptures reveal.

[FcukLars]

And what the scriptures reveal is contradiction. The author of Revelation was apparently unaware of Christ's prediction of the temple's destruction. According to the revelator Christ was to appear and vanquish Rome when Rome began besieging Jerusalem.

[RCSCROLLS]

@FcukLars Where does John state that Christ would appear at the besieging of Jeusalem

[FcukLars]

The harlot and beast was the city and principate of Rome. The two beasts were government and organized (jewish) religion. Supposing the "millennial reign" was from 33-70 A.D then that's when lightning should have killed Vespasian's/Titus' leigons, judgement day, and a then cube as large as half of the continental United States comes down from the skies and the new age begins.

[Blogrich55]

"and a then cube as large as half of the continental United States comes down from the skies and the new age begins." FcukLars

ROFLOL your wooden literalism is most amusing XD

[FcukLars]

Nevertheless the events of Matt. 24 do not gibe with Rev. 20:9. Jerusalem cannot be the whore of Babylon to be destroyed in fire forever and ever and yet be the "beloved city" which was spared by divine intervention.

[RCSCROLLS]

@FcukLars Jerusalem was the Whore and where does it say that it will be devinely protected, it was God who destroyed Jerusalem with nations and armies of Rome.

Matt 24 fits the end of 66 AD perfectly

[Blogrich55]

@FcukLars says "Nevertheless the events of Matt. 24 do not gibe with Rev. 20:9. Jerusalem cannot be the whore of Babylon to be destroyed in fire forever and ever and yet be the "beloved city" which was spared by divine intervention.' ROFLOL

I think someone needs to read Galatians 4:21-31 CAREFULLY before posting.The whole point is there were 2 Jerusalems. The Church is the New Jerusalem coming down out of Heaven like a bride adorned for her husband. The Harlot is the actual city of Jerusalem.

[RCSCROLLS]

@FcukLars The harlot was Jerusalem its found in Matt 23 21 till the end of that chap.

and revelation 17 is found inEzekiel 16, its not me that says this its Jesus

rcscrolls@aol.com

[RCSCROLLS]

@Blogrich55 Jerusalem also has 7 mts Hills.

the Harlot is Jerusalem REV 17 Eze 16 Matt 23 at the end.

[Blogrich55]

@RCSCROLLS Yes she does have 7 hills bro! Yet honestly, no matter HOW much sound biblical evidence we produce, I am afraid the multitude prefer their traditions. God bless!

[RCSCROLLS]

@Blogrich55 No body ever said Christ returned Matt 24 is about His presence not His return or appearing

THE SIGN of His presence parousia ie coming

[Blogrich55]

@RCSCROLLS "No body ever said Christ returned Matt 24 is about His presence not His return or appearing

THE SIGN of His presence parousia ie coming"

I don't recall saying you DID say it. Some full preterists believe that. Merry Christmas.

[Bibletouchstone]

@Blogrich55 I totally agree; btw, "the sign" is nominative in the text, and the "coming" is participial.