The Ancient Greek used to say, one could enter heaven if a single question was answered, " Have You ever made any-one cry? " l suppose you just missed that boat John Pike, if we go by the Ancient Greeks. If we go by just to-day's standards, Lt John Pike is just a barbaric, uncivilised human being, please stay in your own country and do not travel especially to Australia. l highly doubt whether my fellow country men or women could cope with an arrogant prick like you. thank you for your time.
if you encounter an arrogant cop who transgresses and you dont knockem the fuck out (sans females) you need help. your reign is over as "gods" because its been verified you are dogs. the rabid ones must be automagically put to speel.
99%-haters support a broken system- a system that allows what has become an annual tradition of colleges raising tuition in double digit % with no real justification, a system that allows 'made in china' to replace millions of american jobs at a trillion $ annual deficit, a system that allows wall st/banks to legally rape our economy, a system thats become an oligarchy with our elected gov officials openly bought & paid for-
these cops & thier cheerleaders (unknowingly) are the systems lapdogs
Someone told me to check this out because the cops went to far with the pepper spray.. I hate that our rights are being taken but they were breaking the law.. they need to protest with staying within the law otherwise the cops do what they have to... you say they didnt have to? noone was threatening them? I say get a permit and you wouldnt have these probs.. good luck
but it would have been pretty empty even if it had been meant that way. I hadn't seen the clip you shared, so maybe you haven't seen this one: watch?v=WmJmmnMkuEM
Note how this clip shows that even after the police are surrounded by students, the crowd gives way as the police back away to leave (without any use of pepper spray). They were never trapped. This clip also confirms that in the video we're commenting on the snippet we hear at the end is "You CAN go"
What it does is confirm that there were -some- students, and certainly not all, who started backing away at the last minute... right around when the pepper spray started flying.
Which is not only expected... but the purpose of pepper spray.
As far as the video confirming that the students said "you can go"???
WHERE? Gimme the time stamp, and I'll listen again.
You're right; I'm not dishonest, or daft. I hadn't seen the clip that you posted in your response. But honestly, I don't think it has anything to do with the use of pepper spray. First off, it wasn't a threatening statement; it was shouted once and its goal was to express the desire to continue a peaceful protest. Besides, at the time it was shouted, you can clearly see that the police were not surrounded. They had a clear path back to their car--so not only was it not threatening
"First off, it wasn't a threatening statement; it was shouted once and its goal was to express the desire to continue a peaceful protest."
Wait, wait, wait.
You start out by saying that you're not dishonest.... but then you tell me that their statement: "You can leave, when you let them go", is about their desire to continue a peaceful protest??
If you surround me with your friends, and give me conditions on when I can leave, its a threat!
@johnabbottnet Where do you get the idea that the protestors told the cops they couldn't leave? In the video it sounds to me like they're saying "You CAN go." If they were saying the opposite, it seems unlikely that the crowd would have given way as the police began to back out and away (as they did at the end of the clip).
the one sentence, child-like comments calling the protestors hippies, commies...is indictive of the conservative mind- just like thier rightwing proganda machine (talk radio/corporate media) has handled this movement, attack the indivual, not the message-
if you can stomach the rightwing proganda machine, youll see/hear the same points parroted on these posts-
nevermind that our country is heading toward (or in the middle of) a crash, as long as everything is peachy-rosy for the 1%ers-
aztecadog, youre a fucking ignorant fuck. This video isnt being shown entirely. These protesters were given several warnings. They were breaking the law by blocking public entry by staying there. These protesters are shitting and pissing in public parks.
@80barmando yeah, maybe they were breaking the law, so did the protestors for the womens/workers/civil rights/anti-war movements-
sometimes breaking the law is the right thing to do-
now the fat cats in wall st who walked away with billions/trillions did it all 'legally' (since thier handpuppets in DC made it legal), does that make it right?
thats the state of our country, arrest/pepper spray those doing the right thing, while looking away from those rapeing our country in front of us-
cops & thier conservative cheerleaders have been on the wrong side of history time and again, workers rights, womens rights, civil rights, anti-war protestors have all been beaten/jailed & at times killed for fighting for needed change, change that was necassary for our nations future-
once again, cops & thier conservative cheerleaders are on the wrong side of history-
our economy is broken, our nations future is imperil, our gov represents $ not us....
@dstir23 You're making assumptions, something smart people should avoid. Ignorance seems to fit you well. I would try to have a discussion with you, but you've already showed everyone that you're incapable. Have a good day and try not to be so angry.
"historys a good indicator, if the establishment uses its dogs on you, your on the right side-"
I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest that you neither study history, nor English, nor logical progression.
Your logic suggests that the police were called not because the protesters were a nuisance, noise, and health problem on campus... but because they were RIGHT?
what upsets me the most is that people like the Westboro Babtist Church are able to picket funerals but whenever there is an actual cause to fight for, this happens. America is fucked up yo.
Kent State all over again. What's next, live rounds? Violent attacks against peaceably assembled protestors are completely indefensible. There is NO REASON to harm a peaceful protestor who is NOT resisting arrest. There was NO REASON why anyopne should have been harmed "just to get the tents down". Students have a right to be there. They PAID to be there. It's their university. Without students there would be no university. No one else's rights were being infringed by their presence there.
"Violent attacks against peaceably assembled protestors are completely indefensible. There is NO REASON to harm a peaceful protestor who is NOT resisting arrest."
You cannot surround the police and tell them that you will 'let them go' when they let the already arrested protesters go.
They already resisted arrest. That's what you don't get. That's why they linked arms and surrounded the cops. THEN they told the cops that the cops couldn't leave???
The proper police procedure would have been to simply arrest and carry each student away one at a time. But, clearly THAT would have required more effort than campus police were willing to use. Campus police should be PROHIBITTED from ever using pepper spray or tazers on anyone who is not being violent. It's just wrong. These police are clearly lacking in training in proper police procedures.
"The proper police procedure would have been to simply arrest and carry each student away one at a time. "
That's what they were doing. Then the protesters noticed that they were running out of protesters, linked arms, surrounded the cops, and told the cops that they couldn't leave until they let go of the previously arrested peeps.
And yes, the procedure with ANY police force is to use pepper spray on anyone who is actively resisting arrest.
Kent State all over again. Violent attacks against peaceably assembled protestors are completely indensible. There is NO REASON to harm a peaceful protestor who is NOT resisting arrest. There was NO REASON why anyopne should have been harmed "just to get the tents down". Students have a right to be there. They PAID to be there. It's their university. Without students there would be no university. No one else's rights were being infringed by their presence there.
@TomPage1 First off, pepper spray is painful but has no lasting effects at all, hardly a violent attack. Second off they were resisting. Passive resistance (going limp so they can't move you) is still classified as resistance. They were ordered to move, and refused, which is disobeying. The police attempted to move them first, and they resisted, and so they were pepper sprayed as a result. P.S. it's not THEIR university, it is the university they attend. They own nothing. Rage harder.
@LordSigland I didn't see them blocking traffic or causing problems. I haven't seen any video evidence of protesters not letting someone into a building who was trying to walk by. The protesters who were sitting on the ground could easily be stepped over and I'm sure if someone asked them they would let that person through. Until I see evidence of them preventing people from going to work or class I fail to see why police were required.
According to the letter (you can actually read it if you freeze frame it) there were people in the protest who did not go to school there. There were also tents there, and the noise was disturbing classes. Which kinda defeats the whole 'school' thing.
You said that you were sure that the students would let someone through if they asked. Yet, they surrounded the cops and told the cops that they couldn't leave until the cops ceded to their demands.
@johnabbottnet It's a protest. It doesn't have to be all students especially at a public university like UC Davis. Were the tents blocking doors into buildings? As for the noisy protests disturbing classes, give me a break. I went to UC Berkeley and there were noisy protests on campus all the time. If it got too noisy you closed the window. Your point about students surrounding cops has nothing to do with letting students thru. And, no way did nerdy students intimidate armed cops.
"It doesn't have to be all students especially at a public university like UC Davis. "
Wrong. Its private property. On any campus, yes, even UC Davis, you'll see signs on all of the property warning people that they are trespassing if they are not students.
There is a reason for that.
Colleges get sued every time someone who doesn't belong there does something bad.
Your whole argument that 'if it gets too noisy, close the window' is ridiculous.
It doesn't matter if the students are "nerdy" (which certainly doesn't apply to those who are skipping classes!) or if they are ex football players. A cop does not have to wait for someone to pull a weapon to feel threatened if a group of people surround them and tell them that they can't leave.
Why don't you get how wrong that is?
How dumb do you have to be in order to condone that?
Here's a simple recipe for not getting pepper sprayed: don't threaten the cop.
@johnabbottnet the cop wasted like 5 seconds shaking the pepper spray, the students would have tackled him by then, The correct procedure of action in this case would have been to start shooting, just to be safe since there's so many students.
@johnabbottnet Wow, three responses in a row from you, one in which you call me dumb. Nice arguing. I agree if students surround cops and push them around and the cops feel threatened then pepper spray is in order. Is that what you saw in this video? I saw students sitting calmly and passively on the ground and a cop calmly spraying each of them in the face. You seem to think that's necessary. I don't. If you want to have a thorough debate about this i suggest you email me.
@johnabbottnet YOU are putting words in my mouth. Another sign of a weak argument. I am not condoning threats toward cops. The sentence you just quoted by me proves that. Any cop who feels threatened by the students in that video you just showed me should find a new line of work. That's like pepper spraying an old lady (which has happened) because you feel "threatened" by her. The point still remains that the protest did not need to be broken up.
"Any cop who feels threatened by the students in that video you just showed me should find a new line of work."
Any cops who is SURROUNDED by the people that he is trying to arrest, and then TOLD that he/she can't leave until they let loose those who they previously arrested???
Explain to me how that is not a threat?
Once again, when you TELL SOMEONE THAT THEY CANNOT LEAVE, IT IS A THREAT!
@johnabbottnet You need to calm down or you're going to stroke out. My point is that context matters when it comes to "threats." If you are surounded by dozens of 90 year old women with walkers who tell you that you can't leave, is that the same thing as being surrounded by dozens of gang members who say the same thing? You seem to think both of these situations call for pepper spray because all threats are the same. I think the context of the "threat" matters and should determine the response.
"You need to calm down or you're going to stroke out. My point is that context matters when it comes to "threats.""
Just so that I'm clear on this:
I need to calm down. For typing. Whereas the 'harmless' protesters, who link arms, surround the police, and tell them that they can't leave... mean no harm?
Then why make the threat?
Here's the difference between the protesters and the women with walkers; the women with walkers COULDN'T surround the cops. The students DID.
@johnabbottnet I told you to calm down because your last post had an abundance of words in all caps. That lead me to believe that you intended those words to be screamed at me in which case your blood pressure must have been elevated while typing. Look, I'm willing to have a debate with you, and I'm legitimately interested in identifying the fundamental points that we disagree on. The least you could do is contribute to the debate without using such a dick-ish tone. Let's talk.
Just so that we're clear on this; you think that I'm screaming at you because I used caps, and you took that as me having elevated blood pressure, and a 'dickish tone'.
Yet, when the actual protesters surrounded the cops, then tell the -cops- that they can't leave... there is nothing dickish about that?
Your concept of what is acceptable behavior is clearly skewed towards anything the protesters do as being 'right'.
@johnabbottnet Again, you're putting words in my mouth. I never said anything about whether the Davis Protesters were being dicks or not. My evaluation of your tone is unrelated to my evaluation of the protesters. I think a lot of protesters are definitely dicks, but not all of them. Being a dick at a protest is not illegal. If you want to continue this I suggest you respond to the personal message I sent you. No one wants to read any more of this banter.
@johnabbottnet I don't know why you just dodged my question about old ladies with walkers. It's important for me to figure out whether you think context matters at all in this situation. So I ask again: If dozens of old women protesters (I'll change it to fast walking, mobile women) surround the police and tell them they can't leave, is that a threat? If so, should the police feel as threatened as they would if they were surrounded by armed gang members? Are these "threats" equal?
You were comparing 20 year old students who had -already- fought with the cops who were trying to arrest them with old ladies with walkers.
Your intent was clear; to minimize what the protesters had already done. Because here's the thing with old women in walkers: They can't link arms. They can't resist arrest. They aren't 20 year old kids.
@johnabbottnet You completely misunderstood the purpose of my question. I'm in no way making an equivalency between 20 year olds and old ladies. I'm trying to find out if you think that context matters. Do we agree that old women saying something is different than armed gang members saying the same thing (the two extremes)? This allows us to identify where we disagree on the spectrum of what constitutes a serious "threat." I explain this better in the message I sent you.
Yes, context matters. Which is why I'M THE ONE WHO KEEPS PROVIDING IT, while you keep pretending like all they did was sit in a circle and sing kumbaya.
These were not 90 yo women with walkers. They were not yogis who were sitting there telling the cops "go ahead and arrest me".
AFTER the cops had arrested their friends, they SURROUNDED THE COPS and told them that they couldn't leave.
That's a fuckload of context to leave out. Wouldn't you say?
But here's what's really annoying: you keep putting the word threats in quotes. As if telling the cops that they can't leave is not a threat!
Again; students are not old women with walkers. If we're going to have a conversation, stop making dumbass comparisons to try to minimize what the students actually are: 20 year olds, who are usually at the peak of physical conditioning.... as compared to old people.
Which is why it previously took 4 cops to haul one away.
@johnabbottnet I'm putting the word in quotes to demonstrate that our ideas of what constitutes a "serious" threat don't appear to be the same. You seem to be using the word "threat" to mean "serious threat." If I'm going to use the word "threat" to describe what the davis students did, it is important for me to demonstrate that our definitions are different. This discussion requires more than 400 character responses. Again, I suggest you respond to my message.
@johnabbottnet I haven't necessarily acknowledged that it's a threat in this case. I've acknowledged that there is a spectrum where one side is "dangerous threat" and the other side is "no threat at all." This situation falls somewhere in between. Yes maybe it is a "threat" but I'm not sure that's the best word to describe what they said. They just said, "you can't leave." they didn't say or insinuate that violence would be used. The only response was for protesters to link arms.
@johnabbottnet I'm being completely honest. I'm trying to elevate this conversation to a philosophical discussion, because I think we have fundamental ideological disagreements which need to be addressed before the conversation continues. You seem to think that people telling you that you can't leave is a serious/dangerous threat no matter who the people are or the environment that they say it in. I fundamentally disagree with you on that. Respond to the message I sent you.
You're trying to downgrade this to a philosophical discussion, rather then deal with reality.
This was not philosophy. When a group of cops charged with removing protesters arrest them, literally have to haul them off... and then the same group links arms and surround them???
And THEN tell the cops that they can't leave?
That's a dangerous environment.
The fact that you won't acknowledge this is ever apparent.
@johnabbottnet It is also worth noting that there was one person leading the chant where the protesters said, "we won't let you leave." It was a call and response thing. That doesn't mean that every protester wanted to keep the cops there, it meant that at least one did. But let's say all the protesters agreed with him. Let's even for the sake of argument say that this can be viewed as a "threat." Not quite a threat from gang members but more serious that a threat from old ladies.
So the rest of the crowd was just mindlessly repeating what the one guy said... but even though they had surrounded the cop, they did not mean to mindlessly repeat the threat.
And they were not going to mindlessly follow up with the same mob-rule mentality... but were going to turn away as soon as someone suggested doing something "ridiculous" (like telling cops that they couldn't leave.)
@johnabbottnet I cut this response off short, because 400 characters was not enough, and I sent your profile a personal message to continue the conversation. I suggest we continue the discussion there because 400 characters isn't enough to respond to anything unless we're just trying to win the argument by throwing ad hominem attacks back and forth. Plus, no one wants to read this conversation.
I'm responding here because this is how the conversation started in the first place. Yes, I'll also respond to your e-mail. But its important for me to refute what you're saying here.
I'm not throwing ad hominem attacks, but pointing out that anyone who simply repeats a threat, without realizing that they are repeating a threat, is mindless.
If you can give a better characterization of that behavior, explain it.
And this is where your reasoning completely falls apart. Because the cop actually went up to each one of them to explain to them that their actions meant that the cops would react with force. And every single one of them nodded or acknowledged what the cops said.
Beyond that, they sat still as the cops pulled out pepper spray, despite being warned what their actions meant.
So no... they were not exactly disagreeing with the call and response.
Because the cops certainly gave them a chance to say "oh, and btw, I don't agree with those threats that they just made against you. Even though I just repeated what they said. I'm just not that bright, and repeat things without acknowledging what they are. Like if you were to say 'heil hitler' right now? I'd repeat it. Its just a thing we do."
@johnabbottnet You need to clarify these last two points in a personal response to my profile. In fact I'm not sure exactly what your point is. The students sitting on the ground were no threat to the cops. That's objectively true. My argument from the very beginning is that the cops did not need to pepper spray the kids on the ground. If they felt threatened by the kids standing they should have pepper sprayed them. I address this in my personal message to you.
You were defending the people repeating the statements by saying, in essence, 'well maybe they didn't agree with the threat... but just repeated it'.
To which I respond:
If they are dumb enough to repeat a threat to the cops, why wouldn't the cops worry that they would also follow along with the person making the threat?
Once someone cedes to mob mentality, mob mentality is the actual threat.
@johnabbottnet That being said, if you are trying to break up a peaceful protest and are armed with riot gear, and students tell you that you cannot leave, you should not feel immediately threatened imo. If you try to leave and the students become aggressive then yes pepper spray is in order. I would like to think that armed campus police in riot gear would carefully consider a violent response toward peaceful protesters and determine that pepper spray is a last resort.
"if you are trying to break up a peaceful protest and are armed with riot gear, and students tell you that you cannot leave, you should not feel immediately threatened imo"
Why?
Because cops haven't been harmed by 'peaceful' protesters before?
We both know that this isn't true.
It is not the cops job nor responsibility to see whether or not someone who is threatening them will follow through on their threat. Their job is protect THEMSELVES as well.
It is not a cop's job to take your shit, and like it, as you are disobeying the law.
It is not a cop's job to ignore your threats.
The cops job is to protect me, as well as you. To protect themselves first, so that they can protect us both.
I will never understand the self-centeredness and arrogance that dictates that the protesters should be able to threaten cops and not be responsible for their actions. Or that the cops should not take them seriously.
The cops were removing protesters the old-fashioned way, until the protesters decided to up the ante and link arms. And THEN the protesters surround the cops?
And THEN threaten the cops?
That's an all-in move.
That's a pretty big bluff.
You can't blame the cops for taking a bunch of 20 year olds seriously when they surround them and tell them that they can't leave.
A "last resort" move would be to pummel the students with batons. Or shoot them.
But that's not what the situation called for. The situation called for getting the students who were surrounding them to disperse. Now how would you have done that?
@johnabbottnet Show me a video where students/protesters are using force against cops. There was nothing "threatening" about that last video you showed me.
@johnabbottnet It depends on the context of who is telling me I can't leave. Everything falls on spectrum. If I'm at a party and a friend tells me that I can't leave yet, that's not a threat. If I'm surrounded by gang members with weapons who tell me I can't leave, that is a threat. If I'm surrounded by peaceful protesters who tell me I can't leave that falls somewhere inbetween. You and I disagree on how "threatening" it is.
It is not the cops job to decide whether or no you actually have a good point to protest.
It is not their job to decide whether or not you are 'serious' when you surround them with hundreds of students, and then tell them that they can't leave.
The cops primary job is to avoid physical harm to himself. They are not a free punching bag. You do not have the right to threaten them, nor is there any right to resist arrest.
@johnabbottnet they should have just shot them instead, with so many of them around the cops won't miss, and they wont be fighting back after the cops shoot them.
OMG. There was about 2000 students and only 50 fat cops and you all let them do this to you? Instead of standing their chanting stupid slogans, you should have rushed the cops like they do in CHina, Europe, and every other nation. Americans are fuckin pussies.
What laws did these students break by sitting down on a sidewalk and acting on their right to free speech? Unlawfully assembled???? What the fuck does that mean?
@jbtaaron It means they had no permit. They blocked the sidewalk, created a disturbance and then refused to move after verbal warnings and physical attempts to extract them.
@LadyLiberty1885 I'm sorry, LadyLIBERTY. Our constitution does not declare that you have the right to peacefully assemble "With a permit during these hours of the day and are subject to violence by cops". Nope. It simply states that people have the right to peacefully assemble. What the cops have done is nothing to poke fun or to laugh at. People don't remember Kent State and how police got out of hand thinking protesters got out of hand. Because of this incident it sparked protests all over.
@nategiz95 The First Amendment becomes null and void on private property, such as UC Davis.
Permits for a right to assemble peacefully wouldn't even allow you to protest here unless it was from the university itself.
And regardless of what it says in the original Constitution, you need to realize that there are unwritten amendments to the amendments themselves. Know those alterations to the Constitution, because that IS your responsibility as a citizen.
@trialchamp1 My problem is with the administration's decision to force the protesters to stop protesting. Administrators at a school like UC Davis should be sympathetic to students who engage in public discourse via protests. Civil disobedience among students in the past is something that most UC schools are proud of (see the free speech movement at Berkeley). Plus it really didn't seem like these protests were preventing people from getting to work or class.
"Unlawfully assembled???? What the fuck does that mean?"
It means that they were on private property. It didn't belong to the college students. Just as when you go into a Kmart, it doesn't give you the right to stand in the door, no matter how angry you are.
@small6676 I agree, at the beginning of the footage it is clear as day that the officer is holding a peace of paper reading off the laws they are breaking (why else would it be silenced). The whole thing is people looking at the event out of context. They broke the law, refused to cooperate, were acted upon accordingly. Why doesn't the whole country throw a fit about the people getting sprayed and tased on Cops? Same thing.
@helptheprincess7 the students were informed they were unlawfully assembled and were subject to arrest... I do not see what the big deal is when they get sprayed..
taking loans to skip class, protest, and get arrested? that crap goes on your record. you're retarded, go to class, get your education. best way to change the system is to become part of it.
I do not have to see anymore of the videos or statements. There was a request for removal of the tents based on health and safety by the very school with which these students have taken loans to attend, reside at and pay to maintain. They as students are not in charge. The response of police is sad but very justified. As a man afraid of nothing, I would and will not accept nor allow a challenge of my demands,personal right or athaurity, orders or prevention of following orders. Occupiers STFU!!!
What is the national focus on right now? If a movement even hits the national stage politicians have to care. What happens when a movement like Occupy hits the voter base and actually resonates? What the movement needs is direction. They have people united behind some basic premises. Now they need to to unite behind a real plan. If that can happen, then protests like these will be the catalyst for many more to take up their ranks. For every victim, hundreds more join their cause.
@callsignspanky If you think peaceful protesting is acting like a 5 year old you obviously haven't heard of the civil rights movement. This protest is doing its job, its getting media coverage so that states senators and reps pay attention to the people. Are you suggesting people get violent? Becoming violent will only alienate people and bring down the full force of the law.
It is a shame that the top two comments as of this are in favor of the police action. Nothing can justify harming another person. It is as simple as that. Your uniform does not mean anything other than your willingness to act as a henchman for government.
OBAMA's UNION HENCHMEN COPS.OBAMA's democratic clowns up in SACRAMENTO created this mess by whoring out to the LABOR UNIONS catering to ILLEGALS bankrupting CALIFORNIA. OBAMA's democratic clowns have wasted billions on UNION jobs like COPS, jailguards, & DMV cubicle hamster jobs in CA - the kind of jobs that raised our taxes, raise our kids tuition, & pepper spray our kids & bankrupted this great state. I feel so sorry for these students. OBAMA & his democratic cronies has fucked them over.
“Each person has the right to resist an unlawful arrest. In such a case, the person attempting the arrest stands in the position of a wrongdoer and may be resisted by the use of force, as in self- defense.” (State v. Mobley, 240 N.C. 476, 83 S.E. 2d 100).
@scottandrewhutchins When People are told that they are not allowed on private property they are unlawfully protesting, even in the vid. they said there was resistance which means that they were fighting back, therefore the police had to use force, I.E. pepper spray on the protestors to get them to leave.
@skordijhl The very concept of "unlawful protest" is unconstitutional and oxymoronic. Get your Constitution-hating jingoistic ass to a fascist banana republic!
@mtbizzle5 The real question, is DO YOU UNDERSTAND THE CONCEPT? Or are you just a communist? Who do you think owns a University? The students? WRONG. Get your facts straight please.
I love how everyone is mad at Police Brutality. What's it going to take for it to be justified? When these riots get violent and turn into the ones in Canada, Egypt, England? I think this is actually good. This Occupy movement is contradictory because instead of standing around all day and repeating words, you could actually DO something to make a change. Protesting is basically acting like 5 year olds. And if everybody's afraid of cops now, they're not motivated to make these protests violent.
@CallsignSpanky Thank you so much. It made my night to see someone else actually understanding the situation here. Whatever the reason people, the college grounds are privately owned, and an order was given to vacate the premise. That is, the person who controls the area told you to leave, now those protesters are trespassing. The police arrived to enforce a broken law, and they did so with the minimum force required. They used pepper spray, big deal. It's an irritant, not a club beating.
@CallsignSpanky Oh ya? what are they gonna do? Write a letter to their senator? Use their vasts amount of money to influence politics? This is the only way people can act =p And of course we can't let the protests get that bad, but there is a middle ground. the police were unprovoked. This is not how you react to peaceful protest.
@scottandrewhutchins My god, what? They were surrounded and couldn't get out. What else do you call that?
Why don't you stop painting your finger nails black, painting abstract garbage, running around with hand-me-downs, and telling people to "fight the system maaaaan"
The cops are useless? You sir, sound even more useless then them. Watch who calls the cops in a flash when some shit goes down that bothers you.
@CallsignSpanky I have called cops when I was getting death threats and getting my power shut off by my neighbor. they refused to do anything. The cops were not being threatened in any way. they were interrupting a 100% legal and Constitutional protest. The use of pepper spray on protesters, whether or not any laws are broken, is illegal under Lundberg v. Humboldt. You are defending a criminal act.
@scottandrewhutchins Then defend it I shall, because I think all stupidity needs to be mowed over.
You 5 year olds wanna sit and link arms in my way, Then I hope the nearest Self-Defense store has plenty of Pepper Spray. Maybe the fifth time because pissed on the face will make you understand that you need to move your ass and work for a living, not bothering and protesting for it like a Communist.
@CallsignSpanky You have the "ree-tard" mentality that cops are automatically the good guys. You are a fascist. If you piss on legal protesters, you belong in prison for assault. Part of the reason people are protesting is because no one is hiring, and the banks are no longer providing business start-up loans; therefore, telling us to work is telling us to do slave labor. It's better to protest than to do slave labor.
@scottandrewhutchins I don't care what cops are, good or bad, they don't help out in my community but at the same time I'm not going to fuck with them like you idiots do. IF I piss on legal protesters, then I'll gladly go to jail, and when I get out, just come right back and do it again. Doesn't that mentality sound familiar? Oh yeah that's how you morons act. If you want to protest instead of actually making money, then why don't you just end your life? Reality check please?
@scottandrewhutchins You take everything seriously don't you? No wonder you are a unrealistic pessimist.
You're allowed to protest, on public property correct? This university is private property, regardless of if the students pay to be there. They agree to follow all rules and requests or they will be punished? So the landlord, in this situation the Chandler, allowed cops to come and do as they found pleased.
why so many american protestors in northcorea?
JMCool78 1 month ago
The Ancient Greek used to say, one could enter heaven if a single question was answered, " Have You ever made any-one cry? " l suppose you just missed that boat John Pike, if we go by the Ancient Greeks. If we go by just to-day's standards, Lt John Pike is just a barbaric, uncivilised human being, please stay in your own country and do not travel especially to Australia. l highly doubt whether my fellow country men or women could cope with an arrogant prick like you. thank you for your time.
TheWindsoftara 2 months ago
if you encounter an arrogant cop who transgresses and you dont knockem the fuck out (sans females) you need help. your reign is over as "gods" because its been verified you are dogs. the rabid ones must be automagically put to speel.
brand1angel 2 months ago
Excellent job by the police!
3527mike 2 months ago
police are such bastards! i hope they all burn in hell!
those motherfucking cunt sucking pigs!
scarywinkoproductios 2 months ago
99%-haters support a broken system- a system that allows what has become an annual tradition of colleges raising tuition in double digit % with no real justification, a system that allows 'made in china' to replace millions of american jobs at a trillion $ annual deficit, a system that allows wall st/banks to legally rape our economy, a system thats become an oligarchy with our elected gov officials openly bought & paid for-
these cops & thier cheerleaders (unknowingly) are the systems lapdogs
aztecadog 2 months ago
HAHAHAHA!!! Thats hella FUNNY!
925jdb 2 months ago
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abovexproductions 2 months ago
Someone told me to check this out because the cops went to far with the pepper spray.. I hate that our rights are being taken but they were breaking the law.. they need to protest with staying within the law otherwise the cops do what they have to... you say they didnt have to? noone was threatening them? I say get a permit and you wouldnt have these probs.. good luck
don7777s 2 months ago
@johnabbottnet
but it would have been pretty empty even if it had been meant that way. I hadn't seen the clip you shared, so maybe you haven't seen this one: watch?v=WmJmmnMkuEM
Note how this clip shows that even after the police are surrounded by students, the crowd gives way as the police back away to leave (without any use of pepper spray). They were never trapped. This clip also confirms that in the video we're commenting on the snippet we hear at the end is "You CAN go"
lshim671 2 months ago
@lshim671
I've seen variations of this one.
I don't think that you've seen all of the clips.
In this video, you get to see that there are two groups of cops: one that is surrounded, and the ones in the outer circle.
You've extrapolated this into the idea that the cops were not surrounded... when in fact, they were.
Furthermore, the idea that some of the students backed away a full minute AFTER the one cop pulled out pepper spray? That's not exactly settling.
johnabbottnet 2 months ago
@lshim671
What it does is confirm that there were -some- students, and certainly not all, who started backing away at the last minute... right around when the pepper spray started flying.
Which is not only expected... but the purpose of pepper spray.
As far as the video confirming that the students said "you can go"???
WHERE? Gimme the time stamp, and I'll listen again.
johnabbottnet 2 months ago
@johnabbottnet
You're right; I'm not dishonest, or daft. I hadn't seen the clip that you posted in your response. But honestly, I don't think it has anything to do with the use of pepper spray. First off, it wasn't a threatening statement; it was shouted once and its goal was to express the desire to continue a peaceful protest. Besides, at the time it was shouted, you can clearly see that the police were not surrounded. They had a clear path back to their car--so not only was it not threatening
lshim671 2 months ago
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@lshim671
"First off, it wasn't a threatening statement; it was shouted once and its goal was to express the desire to continue a peaceful protest."
Wait, wait, wait.
You start out by saying that you're not dishonest.... but then you tell me that their statement: "You can leave, when you let them go", is about their desire to continue a peaceful protest??
If you surround me with your friends, and give me conditions on when I can leave, its a threat!
johnabbottnet 2 months ago
@lshim671
"Besides, at the time it was shouted, you can clearly see that the police were not surrounded. "
This too is bunk. What are you talking about?
What car? They are surrounded in the video I showed you. Even this video confirms that the students surrounded the cops.
Beyond that... it would be daft for them to tell them that 'they can leave when they let them go' if they DID NOT surround the cops.
It would literally be senseless to say.
johnabbottnet 2 months ago
@johnabbottnet Where do you get the idea that the protestors told the cops they couldn't leave? In the video it sounds to me like they're saying "You CAN go." If they were saying the opposite, it seems unlikely that the crowd would have given way as the police began to back out and away (as they did at the end of the clip).
lshim671 2 months ago
@lshim671
You can't seriously be that daft, or dishonest.
watch?v=MGagKL_tvS8
The protestors say "If you let them go, we will let you leave"
Now how in the world did you misunderstand that????
johnabbottnet 2 months ago
TO PROTECT AND TO SERVE U ASSHOLES
bobbycoyote 2 months ago
the one sentence, child-like comments calling the protestors hippies, commies...is indictive of the conservative mind- just like thier rightwing proganda machine (talk radio/corporate media) has handled this movement, attack the indivual, not the message-
if you can stomach the rightwing proganda machine, youll see/hear the same points parroted on these posts-
nevermind that our country is heading toward (or in the middle of) a crash, as long as everything is peachy-rosy for the 1%ers-
aztecadog 2 months ago
Fucking idiots with their stupid ass tactics. All fucking retards. The police are just doing their jobs.
wafflesnfrenchtoast 2 months ago in playlist More videos from asucd
fucking hippies. cops should have just shot them instead of weak ass pepper spray
pli31295 2 months ago
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HugeHeroesFan 2 months ago
overthrow the government of USA no more oligarchy
DarkprinX2500 2 months ago
Wallstreet sent those cops there... they have the power .. they run USA
DarkprinX2500 2 months ago
AMERICA POLICE STATE COMING SOON!!!
RESIST THE BANKERS!!!
RESIST WALLSTREET
DarkprinX2500 2 months ago
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Lotus777Man 2 months ago
yeah I honestly side with the cops when I see the full story and im a college student.
DangerIslandMan 2 months ago
@DangerIslandMan why were the cops there in the first place.. why interrupt a peaceful protest. in the first place
DarkprinX2500 2 months ago
Fuckin geeds
10drewe 3 months ago
Just one thing to say:
FUCK THE PIGS!
robonightmare 3 months ago
I love how the police man just brushed the little guy with the beenie away like he was nothing. And the little guy was still trying to act tough lol.
shadowgrail 3 months ago
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shadowgrail 3 months ago
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/watch?v=hhPdH3wE0_Y&feature=player_embedded#! u may want to watch this
ch1leang0d 3 months ago
pigs
Mikeanglo 3 months ago
aztecadog, youre a fucking ignorant fuck. This video isnt being shown entirely. These protesters were given several warnings. They were breaking the law by blocking public entry by staying there. These protesters are shitting and pissing in public parks.
80barmando 3 months ago
@80barmando They are public parks and they are the public. So technically they aren't breaking the law and they can be there.
SoKissMe2 3 months ago
@80barmando yeah, maybe they were breaking the law, so did the protestors for the womens/workers/civil rights/anti-war movements-
sometimes breaking the law is the right thing to do-
now the fat cats in wall st who walked away with billions/trillions did it all 'legally' (since thier handpuppets in DC made it legal), does that make it right?
thats the state of our country, arrest/pepper spray those doing the right thing, while looking away from those rapeing our country in front of us-
aztecadog 3 months ago
cops & thier conservative cheerleaders have been on the wrong side of history time and again, workers rights, womens rights, civil rights, anti-war protestors have all been beaten/jailed & at times killed for fighting for needed change, change that was necassary for our nations future-
once again, cops & thier conservative cheerleaders are on the wrong side of history-
our economy is broken, our nations future is imperil, our gov represents $ not us....
if your not pissed, your braindead
aztecadog 3 months ago
Was it worth it? Stop feeling so entitled.
guy197714 3 months ago
@guy197714 Youre probably a fucking cop you son of a bitch. Unlike you, we smart people dont like to be taken advantage of.
dstir23 3 months ago
@dstir23 You're making assumptions, something smart people should avoid. Ignorance seems to fit you well. I would try to have a discussion with you, but you've already showed everyone that you're incapable. Have a good day and try not to be so angry.
guy197714 2 months ago
@dstir23 Cunt.
guy197714 2 months ago
They should have used rubber bullets on them. It would have cleared them bitches out fast.
wassomeoneelse 3 months ago
have cops ever been on the right side of history?
womens rights, workers rights, civil rights, anti-war protesters have all been beaten/jailed at times killed by cops-
historys a good indicator, if the establishment uses its dogs on you, your on the right side-
aztecadog 3 months ago
@aztecadog
"historys a good indicator, if the establishment uses its dogs on you, your on the right side-"
I'm going to go out on a limb and suggest that you neither study history, nor English, nor logical progression.
Your logic suggests that the police were called not because the protesters were a nuisance, noise, and health problem on campus... but because they were RIGHT?
johnabbottnet 3 months ago
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ＡＬＥＲＴ！The senate just passed bill 1876 which now allows the military to detain American citizens, indefinitely with no trial.
Icureditwithmybrain 3 months ago
If they held signs saying UC Davis hates free speech, would they have been arrested?
bookwormwebgirl 3 months ago
FUCK THE PO-PO!
juicehea 3 months ago 2
what upsets me the most is that people like the Westboro Babtist Church are able to picket funerals but whenever there is an actual cause to fight for, this happens. America is fucked up yo.
eazeymac92 3 months ago
Kent State all over again. What's next, live rounds? Violent attacks against peaceably assembled protestors are completely indefensible. There is NO REASON to harm a peaceful protestor who is NOT resisting arrest. There was NO REASON why anyopne should have been harmed "just to get the tents down". Students have a right to be there. They PAID to be there. It's their university. Without students there would be no university. No one else's rights were being infringed by their presence there.
TomPage1 3 months ago
@TomPage1
"Violent attacks against peaceably assembled protestors are completely indefensible. There is NO REASON to harm a peaceful protestor who is NOT resisting arrest."
You cannot surround the police and tell them that you will 'let them go' when they let the already arrested protesters go.
They already resisted arrest. That's what you don't get. That's why they linked arms and surrounded the cops. THEN they told the cops that the cops couldn't leave???
johnabbottnet 3 months ago
The proper police procedure would have been to simply arrest and carry each student away one at a time. But, clearly THAT would have required more effort than campus police were willing to use. Campus police should be PROHIBITTED from ever using pepper spray or tazers on anyone who is not being violent. It's just wrong. These police are clearly lacking in training in proper police procedures.
TomPage1 3 months ago
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@TomPage1
"The proper police procedure would have been to simply arrest and carry each student away one at a time. "
That's what they were doing. Then the protesters noticed that they were running out of protesters, linked arms, surrounded the cops, and told the cops that they couldn't leave until they let go of the previously arrested peeps.
And yes, the procedure with ANY police force is to use pepper spray on anyone who is actively resisting arrest.
johnabbottnet 3 months ago
Kent State all over again. Violent attacks against peaceably assembled protestors are completely indensible. There is NO REASON to harm a peaceful protestor who is NOT resisting arrest. There was NO REASON why anyopne should have been harmed "just to get the tents down". Students have a right to be there. They PAID to be there. It's their university. Without students there would be no university. No one else's rights were being infringed by their presence there.
TomPage1 3 months ago
@TomPage1 First off, pepper spray is painful but has no lasting effects at all, hardly a violent attack. Second off they were resisting. Passive resistance (going limp so they can't move you) is still classified as resistance. They were ordered to move, and refused, which is disobeying. The police attempted to move them first, and they resisted, and so they were pepper sprayed as a result. P.S. it's not THEIR university, it is the university they attend. They own nothing. Rage harder.
Xangba 3 months ago
@LordSigland I didn't see them blocking traffic or causing problems. I haven't seen any video evidence of protesters not letting someone into a building who was trying to walk by. The protesters who were sitting on the ground could easily be stepped over and I'm sure if someone asked them they would let that person through. Until I see evidence of them preventing people from going to work or class I fail to see why police were required.
wergo22 3 months ago
@wergo22
According to the letter (you can actually read it if you freeze frame it) there were people in the protest who did not go to school there. There were also tents there, and the noise was disturbing classes. Which kinda defeats the whole 'school' thing.
You said that you were sure that the students would let someone through if they asked. Yet, they surrounded the cops and told the cops that they couldn't leave until the cops ceded to their demands.
johnabbottnet 3 months ago
@johnabbottnet It's a protest. It doesn't have to be all students especially at a public university like UC Davis. Were the tents blocking doors into buildings? As for the noisy protests disturbing classes, give me a break. I went to UC Berkeley and there were noisy protests on campus all the time. If it got too noisy you closed the window. Your point about students surrounding cops has nothing to do with letting students thru. And, no way did nerdy students intimidate armed cops.
wergo22 3 months ago
@wergo22
"It doesn't have to be all students especially at a public university like UC Davis. "
Wrong. Its private property. On any campus, yes, even UC Davis, you'll see signs on all of the property warning people that they are trespassing if they are not students.
There is a reason for that.
Colleges get sued every time someone who doesn't belong there does something bad.
Your whole argument that 'if it gets too noisy, close the window' is ridiculous.
johnabbottnet 3 months ago
@wergo22
It doesn't matter if the students are "nerdy" (which certainly doesn't apply to those who are skipping classes!) or if they are ex football players. A cop does not have to wait for someone to pull a weapon to feel threatened if a group of people surround them and tell them that they can't leave.
Why don't you get how wrong that is?
How dumb do you have to be in order to condone that?
Here's a simple recipe for not getting pepper sprayed: don't threaten the cop.
johnabbottnet 3 months ago
@johnabbottnet the cop wasted like 5 seconds shaking the pepper spray, the students would have tackled him by then, The correct procedure of action in this case would have been to start shooting, just to be safe since there's so many students.
MrBigEnchilada 3 months ago
@johnabbottnet Wow, three responses in a row from you, one in which you call me dumb. Nice arguing. I agree if students surround cops and push them around and the cops feel threatened then pepper spray is in order. Is that what you saw in this video? I saw students sitting calmly and passively on the ground and a cop calmly spraying each of them in the face. You seem to think that's necessary. I don't. If you want to have a thorough debate about this i suggest you email me.
wergo22 3 months ago
@wergo22
"I agree if students surround cops and push them around and the cops feel threatened then pepper spray is in order. "
watch?v=MGagKL_tvS8
Watch video.
Watch cops tell protesters that they will be subject to force if they do not disperse.
Watch protesters respond by telling cops that they will they will not let them leave until they release the people that they've previously arrested.
These are things that are not arguable.
You are condoning threats to cops.
johnabbottnet 3 months ago
@johnabbottnet YOU are putting words in my mouth. Another sign of a weak argument. I am not condoning threats toward cops. The sentence you just quoted by me proves that. Any cop who feels threatened by the students in that video you just showed me should find a new line of work. That's like pepper spraying an old lady (which has happened) because you feel "threatened" by her. The point still remains that the protest did not need to be broken up.
wergo22 3 months ago
@wergo22
I am putting nothing in your mouth.
"Any cop who feels threatened by the students in that video you just showed me should find a new line of work."
Any cops who is SURROUNDED by the people that he is trying to arrest, and then TOLD that he/she can't leave until they let loose those who they previously arrested???
Explain to me how that is not a threat?
Once again, when you TELL SOMEONE THAT THEY CANNOT LEAVE, IT IS A THREAT!
In what instance is that NOT a threat???
johnabbottnet 3 months ago
@johnabbottnet You need to calm down or you're going to stroke out. My point is that context matters when it comes to "threats." If you are surounded by dozens of 90 year old women with walkers who tell you that you can't leave, is that the same thing as being surrounded by dozens of gang members who say the same thing? You seem to think both of these situations call for pepper spray because all threats are the same. I think the context of the "threat" matters and should determine the response.
wergo22 3 months ago
@wergo22
"You need to calm down or you're going to stroke out. My point is that context matters when it comes to "threats.""
Just so that I'm clear on this:
I need to calm down. For typing. Whereas the 'harmless' protesters, who link arms, surround the police, and tell them that they can't leave... mean no harm?
Then why make the threat?
Here's the difference between the protesters and the women with walkers; the women with walkers COULDN'T surround the cops. The students DID.
johnabbottnet 3 months ago
@johnabbottnet I told you to calm down because your last post had an abundance of words in all caps. That lead me to believe that you intended those words to be screamed at me in which case your blood pressure must have been elevated while typing. Look, I'm willing to have a debate with you, and I'm legitimately interested in identifying the fundamental points that we disagree on. The least you could do is contribute to the debate without using such a dick-ish tone. Let's talk.
wergo22 3 months ago
@wergo22
Just so that we're clear on this; you think that I'm screaming at you because I used caps, and you took that as me having elevated blood pressure, and a 'dickish tone'.
Yet, when the actual protesters surrounded the cops, then tell the -cops- that they can't leave... there is nothing dickish about that?
Your concept of what is acceptable behavior is clearly skewed towards anything the protesters do as being 'right'.
johnabbottnet 2 months ago
@johnabbottnet Again, you're putting words in my mouth. I never said anything about whether the Davis Protesters were being dicks or not. My evaluation of your tone is unrelated to my evaluation of the protesters. I think a lot of protesters are definitely dicks, but not all of them. Being a dick at a protest is not illegal. If you want to continue this I suggest you respond to the personal message I sent you. No one wants to read any more of this banter.
wergo22 2 months ago
@wergo22
I'm not putting words into your mouth.
On the contrary, I'm explaining to you that you're whole set of balance is off.
You thought I had a 'dickish tone' because I used caps.
Yet, you refuse to call the protesters dickish for surrounding the cops and threatening them.
johnabbottnet 2 months ago
@johnabbottnet I don't know why you just dodged my question about old ladies with walkers. It's important for me to figure out whether you think context matters at all in this situation. So I ask again: If dozens of old women protesters (I'll change it to fast walking, mobile women) surround the police and tell them they can't leave, is that a threat? If so, should the police feel as threatened as they would if they were surrounded by armed gang members? Are these "threats" equal?
wergo22 3 months ago
@wergo22
I didn't dodge your question.
I made fun of you for your comparison.
You were comparing 20 year old students who had -already- fought with the cops who were trying to arrest them with old ladies with walkers.
Your intent was clear; to minimize what the protesters had already done. Because here's the thing with old women in walkers: They can't link arms. They can't resist arrest. They aren't 20 year old kids.
johnabbottnet 2 months ago
@johnabbottnet You completely misunderstood the purpose of my question. I'm in no way making an equivalency between 20 year olds and old ladies. I'm trying to find out if you think that context matters. Do we agree that old women saying something is different than armed gang members saying the same thing (the two extremes)? This allows us to identify where we disagree on the spectrum of what constitutes a serious "threat." I explain this better in the message I sent you.
wergo22 2 months ago
@wergo22
Yes, context matters. Which is why I'M THE ONE WHO KEEPS PROVIDING IT, while you keep pretending like all they did was sit in a circle and sing kumbaya.
These were not 90 yo women with walkers. They were not yogis who were sitting there telling the cops "go ahead and arrest me".
AFTER the cops had arrested their friends, they SURROUNDED THE COPS and told them that they couldn't leave.
That's a fuckload of context to leave out. Wouldn't you say?
johnabbottnet 2 months ago
@wergo22
But here's what's really annoying: you keep putting the word threats in quotes. As if telling the cops that they can't leave is not a threat!
Again; students are not old women with walkers. If we're going to have a conversation, stop making dumbass comparisons to try to minimize what the students actually are: 20 year olds, who are usually at the peak of physical conditioning.... as compared to old people.
Which is why it previously took 4 cops to haul one away.
johnabbottnet 2 months ago
@johnabbottnet I'm putting the word in quotes to demonstrate that our ideas of what constitutes a "serious" threat don't appear to be the same. You seem to be using the word "threat" to mean "serious threat." If I'm going to use the word "threat" to describe what the davis students did, it is important for me to demonstrate that our definitions are different. This discussion requires more than 400 character responses. Again, I suggest you respond to my message.
wergo22 2 months ago
@wergo22
You saw it as a big enough threat to use water cannons.
Did you not????
johnabbottnet 2 months ago
@wergo22
On the positive side, at least you're finally calling it a threat.
You disagree that the cops should RESPOND to a threat, but at least you're calling it a threat.
Now here's where things get complicated: you say that cops should not respond to a threat that is not a threat.
Should the protesters have dispersed once they knew that they were about to get pepper-sprayed? Where does their responsibility come into this?
johnabbottnet 3 months ago
@johnabbottnet I haven't necessarily acknowledged that it's a threat in this case. I've acknowledged that there is a spectrum where one side is "dangerous threat" and the other side is "no threat at all." This situation falls somewhere in between. Yes maybe it is a "threat" but I'm not sure that's the best word to describe what they said. They just said, "you can't leave." they didn't say or insinuate that violence would be used. The only response was for protesters to link arms.
wergo22 3 months ago
@wergo22
"I haven't necessarily acknowledged that it's a threat in this case. "
In that case, you're not being honest anymore. You're being a lawyer.
When I'm surrounded by people and told that I can't leave... I take that as a threat.
If you react differently, then I think you're genuinely slow witted and/or trying to defend the indefensible.
johnabbottnet 2 months ago
@johnabbottnet I'm being completely honest. I'm trying to elevate this conversation to a philosophical discussion, because I think we have fundamental ideological disagreements which need to be addressed before the conversation continues. You seem to think that people telling you that you can't leave is a serious/dangerous threat no matter who the people are or the environment that they say it in. I fundamentally disagree with you on that. Respond to the message I sent you.
wergo22 2 months ago
@wergo22
Uh no.
You're trying to downgrade this to a philosophical discussion, rather then deal with reality.
This was not philosophy. When a group of cops charged with removing protesters arrest them, literally have to haul them off... and then the same group links arms and surround them???
And THEN tell the cops that they can't leave?
That's a dangerous environment.
The fact that you won't acknowledge this is ever apparent.
johnabbottnet 2 months ago
@johnabbottnet It is also worth noting that there was one person leading the chant where the protesters said, "we won't let you leave." It was a call and response thing. That doesn't mean that every protester wanted to keep the cops there, it meant that at least one did. But let's say all the protesters agreed with him. Let's even for the sake of argument say that this can be viewed as a "threat." Not quite a threat from gang members but more serious that a threat from old ladies.
wergo22 3 months ago
@wergo22
So the rest of the crowd was just mindlessly repeating what the one guy said... but even though they had surrounded the cop, they did not mean to mindlessly repeat the threat.
And they were not going to mindlessly follow up with the same mob-rule mentality... but were going to turn away as soon as someone suggested doing something "ridiculous" (like telling cops that they couldn't leave.)
There was a limit to their mindlessness?
johnabbottnet 2 months ago
@johnabbottnet I cut this response off short, because 400 characters was not enough, and I sent your profile a personal message to continue the conversation. I suggest we continue the discussion there because 400 characters isn't enough to respond to anything unless we're just trying to win the argument by throwing ad hominem attacks back and forth. Plus, no one wants to read this conversation.
wergo22 2 months ago
@wergo22
I'm responding here because this is how the conversation started in the first place. Yes, I'll also respond to your e-mail. But its important for me to refute what you're saying here.
I'm not throwing ad hominem attacks, but pointing out that anyone who simply repeats a threat, without realizing that they are repeating a threat, is mindless.
If you can give a better characterization of that behavior, explain it.
johnabbottnet 2 months ago
@wergo22
And this is where your reasoning completely falls apart. Because the cop actually went up to each one of them to explain to them that their actions meant that the cops would react with force. And every single one of them nodded or acknowledged what the cops said.
Beyond that, they sat still as the cops pulled out pepper spray, despite being warned what their actions meant.
So no... they were not exactly disagreeing with the call and response.
johnabbottnet 2 months ago
@wergo22
Because the cops certainly gave them a chance to say "oh, and btw, I don't agree with those threats that they just made against you. Even though I just repeated what they said. I'm just not that bright, and repeat things without acknowledging what they are. Like if you were to say 'heil hitler' right now? I'd repeat it. Its just a thing we do."
johnabbottnet 2 months ago
@johnabbottnet You need to clarify these last two points in a personal response to my profile. In fact I'm not sure exactly what your point is. The students sitting on the ground were no threat to the cops. That's objectively true. My argument from the very beginning is that the cops did not need to pepper spray the kids on the ground. If they felt threatened by the kids standing they should have pepper sprayed them. I address this in my personal message to you.
wergo22 2 months ago
@wergo22
You were defending the people repeating the statements by saying, in essence, 'well maybe they didn't agree with the threat... but just repeated it'.
To which I respond:
If they are dumb enough to repeat a threat to the cops, why wouldn't the cops worry that they would also follow along with the person making the threat?
Once someone cedes to mob mentality, mob mentality is the actual threat.
johnabbottnet 2 months ago
@johnabbottnet That being said, if you are trying to break up a peaceful protest and are armed with riot gear, and students tell you that you cannot leave, you should not feel immediately threatened imo. If you try to leave and the students become aggressive then yes pepper spray is in order. I would like to think that armed campus police in riot gear would carefully consider a violent response toward peaceful protesters and determine that pepper spray is a last resort.
wergo22 3 months ago
@wergo22
"if you are trying to break up a peaceful protest and are armed with riot gear, and students tell you that you cannot leave, you should not feel immediately threatened imo"
Why?
Because cops haven't been harmed by 'peaceful' protesters before?
We both know that this isn't true.
It is not the cops job nor responsibility to see whether or not someone who is threatening them will follow through on their threat. Their job is protect THEMSELVES as well.
johnabbottnet 3 months ago
@wergo22
It is not a cop's job to take your shit, and like it, as you are disobeying the law.
It is not a cop's job to ignore your threats.
The cops job is to protect me, as well as you. To protect themselves first, so that they can protect us both.
I will never understand the self-centeredness and arrogance that dictates that the protesters should be able to threaten cops and not be responsible for their actions. Or that the cops should not take them seriously.
johnabbottnet 3 months ago
@wergo22
And pepper spray is not a "last" resort.
Its not even the first one.
The cops were removing protesters the old-fashioned way, until the protesters decided to up the ante and link arms. And THEN the protesters surround the cops?
And THEN threaten the cops?
That's an all-in move.
That's a pretty big bluff.
You can't blame the cops for taking a bunch of 20 year olds seriously when they surround them and tell them that they can't leave.
johnabbottnet 3 months ago
@wergo22
A "last resort" move would be to pummel the students with batons. Or shoot them.
But that's not what the situation called for. The situation called for getting the students who were surrounding them to disperse. Now how would you have done that?
Without, you know, harming anyone?
johnabbottnet 3 months ago
@johnabbottnet Show me a video where students/protesters are using force against cops. There was nothing "threatening" about that last video you showed me.
wergo22 3 months ago
@wergo22
Saying that a group of people surrounding you and telling you that you can't leave is just daft.
Wait: let's put it another way. What do you call it when someone tells you that you can't leave? Give it a name.
Go!
johnabbottnet 3 months ago
@johnabbottnet It depends on the context of who is telling me I can't leave. Everything falls on spectrum. If I'm at a party and a friend tells me that I can't leave yet, that's not a threat. If I'm surrounded by gang members with weapons who tell me I can't leave, that is a threat. If I'm surrounded by peaceful protesters who tell me I can't leave that falls somewhere inbetween. You and I disagree on how "threatening" it is.
wergo22 3 months ago
@wergo22
It is not the cops job to decide whether or no you actually have a good point to protest.
It is not their job to decide whether or not you are 'serious' when you surround them with hundreds of students, and then tell them that they can't leave.
The cops primary job is to avoid physical harm to himself. They are not a free punching bag. You do not have the right to threaten them, nor is there any right to resist arrest.
johnabbottnet 3 months ago
@johnabbottnet they should have just shot them instead, with so many of them around the cops won't miss, and they wont be fighting back after the cops shoot them.
MrBigEnchilada 3 months ago
lol 0:44
zalelinda 3 months ago
"the whole world is watching" yeah watching your dumb asses getting pepper sprayed.
Redrobottyler 3 months ago
OMG. There was about 2000 students and only 50 fat cops and you all let them do this to you? Instead of standing their chanting stupid slogans, you should have rushed the cops like they do in CHina, Europe, and every other nation. Americans are fuckin pussies.
GrassyKnollTrolls 3 months ago in playlist More videos from asucd
@GrassyKnollTrolls What's the point of being an unmasked troll? Doesn't that take the fun out of it?
wergo22 3 months ago
@GrassyKnollTrolls
Thanks for making it apparent why the cops pepper sprayed the students after they surrounded the cops and told them that they couldn't leave.
johnabbottnet 3 months ago
lmao 01:58 hey guys! lets play some paintball???
deafchurchrvb1 3 months ago
Interesting to me how I saw no people resisting arrest, or fights broken out.
ZeroXAgony 3 months ago
They need much more pepper spay!
ooderbraten1 3 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
let me teach u a little something,
u can have your protest no problem.
you cannot interfere with public pathways like walkways and blocking streets, it against the law. look it up
police say you can not block the way, move or we are going to pepper spray you.
NO! we are standing up for the protest and you are trying to stop us so we are going to try to make you look bad!
the cops ARE in the right, you CANNOT disobey the law and think the protest is some how going to save you herpa derp =S
silentbl00d 3 months ago
Order more pepper spray!
ooderbraten1 3 months ago
What laws did these students break by sitting down on a sidewalk and acting on their right to free speech? Unlawfully assembled???? What the fuck does that mean?
jbtaaron 3 months ago
@jbtaaron It means they had no permit. They blocked the sidewalk, created a disturbance and then refused to move after verbal warnings and physical attempts to extract them.
LadyLiberty1885 3 months ago
@LadyLiberty1885 I'm sorry, LadyLIBERTY. Our constitution does not declare that you have the right to peacefully assemble "With a permit during these hours of the day and are subject to violence by cops". Nope. It simply states that people have the right to peacefully assemble. What the cops have done is nothing to poke fun or to laugh at. People don't remember Kent State and how police got out of hand thinking protesters got out of hand. Because of this incident it sparked protests all over.
nategiz95 3 months ago
@nategiz95 The First Amendment becomes null and void on private property, such as UC Davis.
Permits for a right to assemble peacefully wouldn't even allow you to protest here unless it was from the university itself.
And regardless of what it says in the original Constitution, you need to realize that there are unwritten amendments to the amendments themselves. Know those alterations to the Constitution, because that IS your responsibility as a citizen.
Ignorance is not an excuse.
trialchamp1 3 months ago
@trialchamp1 My problem is with the administration's decision to force the protesters to stop protesting. Administrators at a school like UC Davis should be sympathetic to students who engage in public discourse via protests. Civil disobedience among students in the past is something that most UC schools are proud of (see the free speech movement at Berkeley). Plus it really didn't seem like these protests were preventing people from getting to work or class.
wergo22 3 months ago
@jbtaaron Shut up stupid
ooderbraten1 3 months ago
@jbtaaron
"Unlawfully assembled???? What the fuck does that mean?"
It means that they were on private property. It didn't belong to the college students. Just as when you go into a Kmart, it doesn't give you the right to stand in the door, no matter how angry you are.
johnabbottnet 3 months ago
@small6676 I agree, at the beginning of the footage it is clear as day that the officer is holding a peace of paper reading off the laws they are breaking (why else would it be silenced). The whole thing is people looking at the event out of context. They broke the law, refused to cooperate, were acted upon accordingly. Why doesn't the whole country throw a fit about the people getting sprayed and tased on Cops? Same thing.
chickdan5 3 months ago
@helptheprincess7 the students were informed they were unlawfully assembled and were subject to arrest... I do not see what the big deal is when they get sprayed..
smalls6679 3 months ago
dirty hippies obey the law and no of this would have happened!
smalls6679 3 months ago
@smalls6679 I didn't know protesting was against the law.
HelpThePrincess7 3 months ago
@HelpThePrincess7 it's not, when you have a permit to do so on private land or in a public space which requires one.
LadyLiberty1885 3 months ago
taking loans to skip class, protest, and get arrested? that crap goes on your record. you're retarded, go to class, get your education. best way to change the system is to become part of it.
zachallred 3 months ago
I do not have to see anymore of the videos or statements. There was a request for removal of the tents based on health and safety by the very school with which these students have taken loans to attend, reside at and pay to maintain. They as students are not in charge. The response of police is sad but very justified. As a man afraid of nothing, I would and will not accept nor allow a challenge of my demands,personal right or athaurity, orders or prevention of following orders. Occupiers STFU!!!
dirtybilly09 3 months ago
fucking hippies.
TomValedro 3 months ago 2
This has been flagged as spam show
what did they do again?
tylerloverfication 3 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Feel free to direct your complaints and opinions to Mr Pike (the officer that is suspended in this video). Remember, he's still a police officer.
John A. Pike
POLICE LIEUTENANT
UC Davis
Phone: 530-752-3989
Cell: 530-979-0184
japikeiii@ucdavis.edu
Address: 4005 Cowell Blvd, Apt 616. Davis, CA 95618-6017
johnwcpc 3 months ago
What is the national focus on right now? If a movement even hits the national stage politicians have to care. What happens when a movement like Occupy hits the voter base and actually resonates? What the movement needs is direction. They have people united behind some basic premises. Now they need to to unite behind a real plan. If that can happen, then protests like these will be the catalyst for many more to take up their ranks. For every victim, hundreds more join their cause.
snoman99991 3 months ago
If you can call that a peaceable assembly.
Phantom30378 3 months ago
@callsignspanky If you think peaceful protesting is acting like a 5 year old you obviously haven't heard of the civil rights movement. This protest is doing its job, its getting media coverage so that states senators and reps pay attention to the people. Are you suggesting people get violent? Becoming violent will only alienate people and bring down the full force of the law.
grlndamoon 3 months ago
@grlndamoon No, no way am I promoting violence, on the contrary I am saying I hope these if anything discourages violence.
@WannaBeWhiteMan You're right.
CallsignSpanky 3 months ago
@grlndamoon
The protesters have already aliened the public. They just aren't bright enough to figure that out yet.
johnabbottnet 3 months ago
Fuck the police~
synaluvia 3 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
WHAT CAN THESE STUDENTS DO?
READ THIS BLOG BY CALIFORNIA STUDENT RIGHTS ATTORNEY MICHELLE BALL
edlaw4students.blogspot.com/2011/05/tedious-college-policies-and-procedures.html
EdLaw4Students 3 months ago
It is a shame that the top two comments as of this are in favor of the police action. Nothing can justify harming another person. It is as simple as that. Your uniform does not mean anything other than your willingness to act as a henchman for government.
MaximusJacobus 3 months ago
@MaximusJacobus
"Nothing can justify harming another person."
Not even if they told you that you couldn't leave?
johnabbottnet 3 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
OBAMA's UNION HENCHMEN COPS.OBAMA's democratic clowns up in SACRAMENTO created this mess by whoring out to the LABOR UNIONS catering to ILLEGALS bankrupting CALIFORNIA. OBAMA's democratic clowns have wasted billions on UNION jobs like COPS, jailguards, & DMV cubicle hamster jobs in CA - the kind of jobs that raised our taxes, raise our kids tuition, & pepper spray our kids & bankrupted this great state. I feel so sorry for these students. OBAMA & his democratic cronies has fucked them over.
UCSDEngineerDoctor 3 months ago
“Each person has the right to resist an unlawful arrest. In such a case, the person attempting the arrest stands in the position of a wrongdoer and may be resisted by the use of force, as in self- defense.” (State v. Mobley, 240 N.C. 476, 83 S.E. 2d 100).
scottandrewhutchins 3 months ago
The UC Davis pepper sprayer's e-mail address is japikeiii@ucdavis.edu. His phone number is (530) 979-0184.
I'm sure Spanky would love to tell him how much he likes it when cops criminally assault people.
scottandrewhutchins 3 months ago
@scottandrewhutchins When People are told that they are not allowed on private property they are unlawfully protesting, even in the vid. they said there was resistance which means that they were fighting back, therefore the police had to use force, I.E. pepper spray on the protestors to get them to leave.
skordijhl 3 months ago
@skordijhl This is not private property, idiot!!!
scottandrewhutchins 3 months ago
@skordijhl The very concept of "unlawful protest" is unconstitutional and oxymoronic. Get your Constitution-hating jingoistic ass to a fascist banana republic!
scottandrewhutchins 3 months ago
fucking hippies
Lmberjack7 3 months ago
@luminozero Privately owned? Do you understand the concept of state school? University of California at Davis??? Good job
mtbizzle5 3 months ago
@mtbizzle5 The real question, is DO YOU UNDERSTAND THE CONCEPT? Or are you just a communist? Who do you think owns a University? The students? WRONG. Get your facts straight please.
CallsignSpanky 3 months ago
@callsignspanky look, someone with a pair of balls you have my respect
Darkromani 3 months ago
I love how everyone is mad at Police Brutality. What's it going to take for it to be justified? When these riots get violent and turn into the ones in Canada, Egypt, England? I think this is actually good. This Occupy movement is contradictory because instead of standing around all day and repeating words, you could actually DO something to make a change. Protesting is basically acting like 5 year olds. And if everybody's afraid of cops now, they're not motivated to make these protests violent.
CallsignSpanky 3 months ago 7
@CallsignSpanky Thank you so much. It made my night to see someone else actually understanding the situation here. Whatever the reason people, the college grounds are privately owned, and an order was given to vacate the premise. That is, the person who controls the area told you to leave, now those protesters are trespassing. The police arrived to enforce a broken law, and they did so with the minimum force required. They used pepper spray, big deal. It's an irritant, not a club beating.
luminozero 3 months ago
@CallsignSpanky Violence tends to discredit movements though. You want public support.
MajorJakobs 3 months ago
@CallsignSpanky Oh ya? what are they gonna do? Write a letter to their senator? Use their vasts amount of money to influence politics? This is the only way people can act =p And of course we can't let the protests get that bad, but there is a middle ground. the police were unprovoked. This is not how you react to peaceful protest.
bbbk123 3 months ago
@bbbk123 You're correct but this "peaceful" protest escalated when the protesters surrounded the police and basically trapping them.
@MajorJakobs You want public support but if the people calling "Police" whenever they need it cannot complain when someone else needs them.
CallsignSpanky 3 months ago
@CallsignSpanky The cops were in no way "trapped." Cops are useless. They are tools for the wealthy.
scottandrewhutchins 3 months ago
@scottandrewhutchins My god, what? They were surrounded and couldn't get out. What else do you call that?
Why don't you stop painting your finger nails black, painting abstract garbage, running around with hand-me-downs, and telling people to "fight the system maaaaan"
The cops are useless? You sir, sound even more useless then them. Watch who calls the cops in a flash when some shit goes down that bothers you.
CallsignSpanky 3 months ago
@CallsignSpanky I have called cops when I was getting death threats and getting my power shut off by my neighbor. they refused to do anything. The cops were not being threatened in any way. they were interrupting a 100% legal and Constitutional protest. The use of pepper spray on protesters, whether or not any laws are broken, is illegal under Lundberg v. Humboldt. You are defending a criminal act.
scottandrewhutchins 3 months ago
@scottandrewhutchins Then defend it I shall, because I think all stupidity needs to be mowed over.
You 5 year olds wanna sit and link arms in my way, Then I hope the nearest Self-Defense store has plenty of Pepper Spray. Maybe the fifth time because pissed on the face will make you understand that you need to move your ass and work for a living, not bothering and protesting for it like a Communist.
CallsignSpanky 3 months ago
@CallsignSpanky You have the "ree-tard" mentality that cops are automatically the good guys. You are a fascist. If you piss on legal protesters, you belong in prison for assault. Part of the reason people are protesting is because no one is hiring, and the banks are no longer providing business start-up loans; therefore, telling us to work is telling us to do slave labor. It's better to protest than to do slave labor.
scottandrewhutchins 3 months ago
@scottandrewhutchins I don't care what cops are, good or bad, they don't help out in my community but at the same time I'm not going to fuck with them like you idiots do. IF I piss on legal protesters, then I'll gladly go to jail, and when I get out, just come right back and do it again. Doesn't that mentality sound familiar? Oh yeah that's how you morons act. If you want to protest instead of actually making money, then why don't you just end your life? Reality check please?
CallsignSpanky 3 months ago
@CallsignSpanky Pissing on people is illegal. Protesting is Constitutionally guaranteed, so you have no point.
scottandrewhutchins 3 months ago
@scottandrewhutchins You take everything seriously don't you? No wonder you are a unrealistic pessimist.
You're allowed to protest, on public property correct? This university is private property, regardless of if the students pay to be there. They agree to follow all rules and requests or they will be punished? So the landlord, in this situation the Chandler, allowed cops to come and do as they found pleased.
CallsignSpanky 3 months ago
@CallsignSpanky How is a state school private property?
scottandrewhutchins 3 months ago
@CallsignSpanky I hope you get laid off, and it takes you three years to get someone to hire you. That's what college graduates deal with these days.
scottandrewhutchins 3 months ago