Telefunken color tv set from 1967 with ARD color logo

[Productions151]

A-R-D

[11DanTheMan111]

I purchased a Telefunken Hymnus stereo at a bodega and everything works flawlessly, even the short wave. Any idea on its age?

[MrMinimusss]

deutsches tv pogramm!

[eldorado303]

loved those old time tv's , were way cool.

[ismaelkhan]

SONY TRINITRON made some of the best tv's out there :)

[ferretmanboy]

Eurovision!!

[sirMAXX77]

damn, they certainly don't make em like that anymore. wouldn't be great to buy a tv in todays market that would last 40 years and picture would still rival technology then, that makes a big statement on how much homemade craftsmanship has fallen

[Crustenscharbap]

Nice TV. The Sound is very good. Better than some modern LED TV. Pal is very good because you can watch PAL+ on this TV. Thats 1280x512i Pixels at 50 FPS. Its nearly the same as 720p. German DVD's use that Format.

[Sheri451]

This was Germany

[baneskrbic]

Play modern 1080p games on this,using adapter.

;)

I do that sometimes.

[Elyasmcmdxiv]

During transmition, signal is exposed to magnetic fields of storms clouds that causes the subtle phase based color signal to modify its characteristics. Engineers thought of inverting phases of signal line by line during transmition so that the tv set circuit had to alternate its line phases as well. If it is deposited a 90° phase line the next will be -90°, but if it not occurs, it certainly underwent weather influency and the system PAL tv set auto-adjusts to maintain color tint pattern.

[miguelmouta]

@Elyasmcmdxiv I suppose you gave me the answer to why , no matter from German origin, Telefunken color TV sets did function so bad in Brazil. We are world champions of ray weather storms. Something little considered by the arians engineers.

[Elyasmcmdxiv]

@miguelmouta I agree. Some Telefunken tv models sold in Brazil made customers really upset. I think they were instable devices since original concept that even in a short time usage missed synchronism stability. Since that high temperature and moisture causes time life decrease in some components, I rather believe it lacked "climatization" for our tropical area.

[suuf1]

@Elyasmcmdxiv Please consider that Telefunken was sold over 20 years ago to french Thomson. All tv's branded "Telefunken" since the late 80-ies are in fact french tv's, made by Thomson

[Elyasmcmdxiv]

@suuf1 I supose the problems I and miguelmolta refered to ocurred long before the event. Thanks for the information. Adding more to it, Telefunken maintained a plant in Brazil and it was acquired by Gradiente in 1996.

[suuf1]

@Elyasmcmdxiv that's interesting! Telefunken had a very good reputation in Europe and tv's were more expensive than others. They never made many problems like Philips for example which were cheaper but massproduced and they used bad and leaking capacitors/condensators.

[UnchainTheNight1]

Why does a PAL set have scan lines? I thought they didn't have those.

[Fendervana]

Hey, the last clip called/song is called Telstar. Who was the orchestra and where did you get it? Thanks.

[Feisty1967]

How was the broadcast recorded in the first place? And how did you manage to play it back on an old TV set? Maybe old video recorder, compatible with TV.

[TeslaMaster]

1000 W? - No. 275 Watt, and this was a lower power consumption than colour tv sets of other brands.

[Alex80586]

1000W...?!

[Trekie92]

the good old times :P

[rajithaify]

what's the opening music?

[Tim5074]

how much watt have it

[Tim5074]

how much watt have it ??????????????

[drouliaseng]

is the circuit with tube or transistors?

[GUSTAVO118888]

guao like colours

[wrtlpfmpf]

What you can also see is that unlike NTSC, PAL can co-exist with monochrome video. With NTSC the frame rates are different for monochrome and colour signals. In PAL you can simply mix monochrome and colour signals.

[SuperSmasher97]

nice nice set

[larsmacher]

In DER zeit hätte sat.1 (wenn es es damals gegeben hätte) den Ident "Colour your live" perfekt nehmen können! Da währe es ja passend! Wenn jetzt Sat.1 das Erste währe.

[mikemcgee]

i didnt know it took germany this long to get color tv i was guessing that they got it in the late 50s like in england

[Terranuss]

There was no colour TV in England either until 1967. Same in France.

Germany, Britain and France all launched colour in 1967, followed by other European countries in the following years.

Before 1967, colour was only available in the US, Japan, and parts of Canada, nowhere else.

[teamascii]

Tests in england (using NTSC) WERE performed in the late 50s to early 60s, so they DID have test color programmes then.

Then they moved to 625 lines and PAL.

[Wiedeofan99]

they played "Telstar" from the Tornados --- wow!

[winterweib]

@Wiedeofan99 I was very afraid of this song when I was a small child :D

[JurglyWurgly]

I remember that ARD color logo when I was growing up in Zurich, Switzerland. We got our first color set in 1972 just in time for the Summer Olympics in Munich.

[JurglyWurgly]

There used to be an old joke that went like this:

Q: What does NTSC stand for?

A: Never Twice Same Color

[paoloangi1]

w telefunken x teo

[juni0r75]

PAL is based on NTSC, insofar as the chroma signal is interwoven within the luminance signal and that the signal TVs use to create colour is the same between the formats. PAL uses a signal which is Phase Alternating, literally changing phase by about 180° with each scan Line transmitted. This allows the TV to suppress hue errors on reception by comparing the two signals to each other. NTSC does not alternate like this. PAL and NTSC are simply encoding methods for the same chroma signal.

[UHF43]

But there are at least two other differences to point out: NTSC has a frame size of 720x540 pixels and a frame rate of 60 interlaced fields. PAL has a frame size of 768x576 pixels and 50 interlaced fields.

[juni0r75]

Absolutely right UHF43. I guess what I was getting at was the main differences between colour encoding vs the format differences. The differences in frame rate is due to the fact that in Europe they use 50Hz AC mains frequency and in the USA and part of Japan, they use 60Hz AC. Early TV would show rolling artifacts in the image if you tried to use a 60Hz (30fps) system on 50Hz AC and vice versa. It 's the frame rate that made European TV incompatible from US, rather than the colour encoding.

[pvx]

That's why I've always admired PAL--due to the "self-differential" signaling the chroma uses from line to line--such a simple & effective way to keep the color in check, and the main reason why you won't find a "tint" or "hue" control on a PAL set :).

If only RCA was smart enough to implement such when they developed what would become NTSC, then it would always be the same color... ;)

[lrd9999]

@pvx My understanding is that the hardware (delay line, if I'm remembering correctly) needed to support this check added a non-trivial amount to the cost of a TV. Since the cost of the first color TVs was $1100-$1500 in 1953 -- well over most people's budgets -- the extra cost was probably prohibitive at that time. RCA, with all its faults, deserves credit for adapting color to B&W NTSC (which many said was impossible), then supporting it for the 10 years it took for the public to accept it.

[peugteobike]

How many tubes does this set contain?is it a hybrid set?

[diesel4scania]

It is a hybrid set.

[TextFreeley]

Why did you cut it? The show was just starting! Now I'll have that song stuck in my head.

[ShaoLinJiangHU]

Telefunken, the best TV set that was made in Brazil in the 80's Years!

[0neofthem]

where do they sell this tv

[geebones]

funny thing is this last long and have better picture longer that lcd and plasma

[martybhoy72]

The PAL system was based on NTSC.

[thelyniezian]

Not sure about that???

[ableblanca510]

does it have HDMI

[spottydog4472]

Can someone change the channel...see what on the other side!

[degekkeorgelman]

How did they create that full color logos at the time? Animated pictures, or video synthesis or something?

[porcorosso81]

"PAL was superior to NTSC because PAL was a pure color system whereas NTSC was developed to be backward compatible with existing B&W TV sets. "

This is incorrect. Both PAL and NTSC modulate the colour subcarrier onto the B/W signal. The most important differences between those systems is:

1. 625 lines (PAL) instead of 525 lines (NTSC)

2. 50Hz (PAL) vs 60Hz (NTSC)

3. 4,47Mhz colour subcarrier (PAL) vs. 3,58Mhz (NTSC)

4. PAL combines the colour information of 2 lines for better colour stability

[lrd9999]

Nice TV! I understand that PAL was superior to NTSC for people who weren't bothered by the flicker. But I wouldn't want to live without any color or tint control; the factory defaults are usually un-naturally colorful, even with good reception. Do they still make PAL sets today with no adjustments?

[soldier501]

No, they didn't... You can easily adjust the Color Settings

[NebraskasWallpaper]

PAL was superior to NTSC because PAL was a pure color system whereas NTSC was developed to be backward compatible with existing B&W TV sets. NTSC virtually "threw" the color signal over the B&W "luminance" signal resulting in reduced resolution. I think the flicker issue had to do with Europe's electrical system operating at 50 Hz versus North America at 60 Hz but I don't know for sure about that.

[lrd9999]

I've heard it was due to the line frequency, but don't understand why it mattered. The TV PS being filtered, it shouldn't have been affected and nothing internal to TVs of either standard is clocked off the line freq. I would guess it had something to do with the interaction between the lights and the flicker of the screen. But I've seen computer monitors with all different refresh rates; the only ones affected were LCDs (which had a waterfall effect if the rate was close to 60Hz).

[uebergeek]

Each system was matched to the local A/C power frequency (60hz for US, 50 hz for Europe) to avoid beating (interference), possible if the video refresh rate and the A/C rate were different. So that's how PAL got to be 50 Hz and NTSC got to be 60 Hz. AFAIK, PAL seems to some people to flicker only because the video refresh rate is slower. The electrical system is not a direct cause of the flicker. Indirectly you could say it is, since it caused PAL to be designed at 50 Hz in the first place.

[juni0r75]

@lrd9999: It has to do with the fact that at the dawn of the TV era in the late 40's it was very difficult to get a completely clean DC rectification out of the available technology. If the frame rate of the broadcast varied from the AC mains frequency, the slight trace of the AC waveform in the high voltage DC current would cause a rolling artifact in the image which would be very obvious to the viewer. If frame rate=power frequency, any artifact would be stationary and not noticeable

[lrd9999]

@juni0r75 That makes sense, especially with some sets (at least in 120V countries) using half-wave rectifiers and diode-capacitor voltage multipliers. Thanks for the information!

[asiekierka]

PAL? PAL was just like NTSC, only it had superior color because of it inverting the colors every other line, so it could correct color errors automatically.

[UHF43]

All PAL tv sets have always had a color saturation adjusment. They didn't need the hue correction seen on NTSC sets. Nowadays, many tv sets have a color temperature adjustment that makes the image look warmer or cooler (more yellowish or more bluish), but I found it to be useless and annoying.

[leifvier]

abgefilmt mit super8 wie geil!

[cparamo]

Love the orchestra playing "Telstar" at the end!

[123demaio]

the 1956 rva ser looks better then this does

[soldier501]

PAL has the best quality of all the three systems.

[Fasouzafreitas]

And Brazil made a unique choice in 1972: PAL-M, PAL-color encoding with 525-line NTSC carrier, 6MHz per channel (VHF 2-13, UHF 14-69).

[mediamadman747]

During this, you half expect a Civil Defence "break-in."

[mnlwrnr]

PAL is the best system

[clays121]

@mnlwrnr If Pal is the best system tell me this, why do older computer like the Commodore 64 run slower in Pal mode, along with video game system lagging, also if Pal 50hz was so great, why did they have to make Pal 60hz just to be able to play modern game systems, and digital movie systems like DVD and Blu-Ray more proper. NTSC/ATSC FTW!!

[CommodoreCaravan1981]

@mnlwrnr might be but PAL is nothing more than the US NTSC system added with a delaying-line, a system to prevent bad colors which can occure on air-transmitting. and this delaying-line could be responsible for some laggs. today with digital broadcast or cable-TV there are few problems in transmitting, but in beginning of TV with analogue broadcast the engineers had to solve many problems to get a stable picture (and colors)...

[guimbadriver]

the amazing thing in the old telefunken color sets is the fact that they used RGB wide band amplifiers to drive each gun in the picture tube, the RCA used a system very cheap where the luminance signal drives the tree cathodes and the control grid the chrominance signals, this last system produces pictures very poor quality...

[VideyoJunkei]

Almost ALL USA sets drove the cathodes with the signal, usually the B/W video was sent to the emitters of the 3 drive transistors, and the RGB respective signals to the bases. The only sets I know of that "drove the grids" were 1970-73 or so SONY sets,the RGB drove the grids direct, with video still on the cathodes!!

[mjouwbuis]

With Sony, that would probably be the other way around, since a trinitron tube does in fact have 3 separate cathodes, but shares its grids between the guns.

[TLU79]

The main difference between German and US TV was (and still is) that most shows in Germany are broadcast live, even game shows. The taping only was for archiving or repeats. Thus shows like "Disco" or other entertainment shows like "The Generation Game" still exist in the archives and sometimes are repeated on those digital extra channels.

One of the highlights I have seen is the live coverage of the moon landing in July 1969. That over 7 hours lasting broadcast (in colour) was on in 1999 -30yrs

[kimberlyKfnOphiEAGLE]

I wonder whether German television kept more of their old videotaped programs than either the BBC or American networks. It seems like a lot of stuff here in the USA was 'wiped' except for some of the game shows.

[ma55aracin9]

then pat yourself on the back,because those dudes are still makin TV's-widescreen flat panels with full high definition capabilities-as well as DTV set tops,Personal Video Recorders and Digital Versatile Disc players

[Oelgo]

Oh, that's not really true!

Nowadays Telefunken is owned by a big Turkish (!) TV-manufactor who sells cheapy OEM-TV's from China under the former high quality German brand name Telefunken! But the good old Telefunken is no more...

Trust Me, my father was long time working as an engineer at the former E-parts-production (valves) of Telefunken, wich later was called TEMIC Microelectronics, wich now is owned by tiere-producer Continental under the name CONTItemic...but still Made in Germany ;-)

[UHF43]

Well, not exactly. The brand name "Telefunken" belongs to Daimler (which bought it alongside AEG, Telefunken's parent company). It's Daimler that licenses the use of the name Telefunken to other manufacturers. Shame on Daimler!

[kimberlyKfnOphiEAGLE]

Here in the US, the TV standard is changing to digital (ATSC), I believe the standard is changing in Great Britain also, what modern system is replacing PAL there? Just curious.

[laurdy]

DVB (Digital Video Broadcasting)

[tremorist]

the standard defintion tv is broadcasted in DVB T(errestrial),C(able) or S(atelite).HI-DEF in DVB S2,but still not regularly.

[fuckyoubugger]

Is it using valves or transistors, or even some early ics? I would love to see a circuit diagram

[TeslaMaster]

The tv set is on the way to the US. Here for this video, it was operated with 220v. Critical is the change from 50Hz to 60Hz, this results in an overload of the mains transformer.

[Kargaroc286]

so did you import this TV? how did you power it. the tv's power input should have been 240v 50Hz. American specs are half the voltage with 60Hz instead of 50HZ.

[akomor1]

how did you recorded that?

[TeslaMaster]

I have got an old video tape recording of this broadcast. The tv set was filmed with a digicam.

[akomor1]

digicam now, but in 1967 what?

[TeslaMaster]

They used Ampex video tape recorders with 2" tape.

[TLU79]

2 inch quadruplex tape. Very big machines. They used them until the early 80s.

The tape of that first broadcast is still in the archives... they didn't wipe as much as the BBC did at that time.

[kimberlyKfnOphiEAGLE]

Or here in the US. Some of the game shows and sitcoms survive, via syndication, but lots of historical TV broadcast stuff is GONE, besides what's been preserved by individuals and what the networks and local stations shot on film and kinescope...kine is not as good as 2-inch Quad tapes were!

[kimberlyKfnOphiEAGLE]

I like the quality of the color. Looks very rich compared to the old NTSC broadcasts. I wonder if that's just a difference in the phosphors or whether it's PAL's 625 lines providing more 'information' and greater detail.

[UHF43]

Both phosphors and PAL lines can make a difference, but I think that the main advantage of the PAL system is the automatic color correction provided by the alternating phase of color-subcarrier line by line. In fact this is the core of the system and where it takes its name (PAL = Phase Alternating by Line). The development of this system is one of the reasons that make color TV available in Europe only in the late 60's,

[UHF43]

because they wanted to avoid the annoying hue errors that are (or at least were those days) common to NTSC broadcasts. Any disturbance in NTSC reception make colors change its hue, while PAL is almost immune at this point. Even with a very weak singal, PAL will always display the correct color.

[UHF43]

PAL was adopted by most european countries with slight diffences (in the UK sound carrier is different) except France, that develop its own SECAM system, and east block countries that follow Russia in adopting French SECAM. This decision was taken in an attempt to prevent eastern viewers from watching western broadcasts.

[UHF43]

Here in Spain, color TV arrived in the early 70's and by 1975 most shows where in color. The Eurovision Song Contest that took place in Madrid in 1969 was produced in color using equipment lend by EBU/UER, but spanish viewers watched it in B/W.

[tsangari]

That was very interesting. I understood that. I wish I had the chance to see D2MAC, but this wasn't accessible to a 15 year old at the time :-)

[Qopel]

NTSC=Never Twice the Same Color

[dmine45]

@Qopel Yeah, but we had color 13 years before you all did in PAL territory :)

[lovemylogics]

Actually, the NTSC, in 1952, experimented with alternating phase, both by line and by field - but, because an economical 1H delay-line didn't exist, averaging between fields and frames had to be done by eye, leading to quadrature error on edges (30Hz flicker with field rate CPA), so the Orange-Cyan Wideband system was used instead. PAL and NTSC are VERY, VERY closely related - and Something Essentially Contrary to the American Method (SECAM) is just junk.

[kimberlyKfnOphiEAGLE]

as well as RCA VTR's like the TR-22 and TR-70B.

[imcooljt]

how times have changed

[desinfector]

Jaaaaah in Farbe!!!

[kdx125XD]

OH MY GOD Where can i get that version of the Telstar song that plays at the end of the video??? PLEASE I NEED THAT!!!!111111

[YoUpOintY]

in farbe,

very nice with telstar at the end.

[kimberlyKfnOphiEAGLE]

Hello, how were the NTSC and PAL picture tubes different, besides PAL having 625 lines to NTSC's 525? Were the phosphors different?

[t0nito]

I think phosphors were the same, it's the actual colour decoding system that is different, one of the difference is that PAL doesn't have a tint control, as tint is automatically corrected by the system, also the colour carrier NTSC is 3.58 MHz while PAL is 4.43 MHz. If you search for PAL in wikipedia you'll find detailed info about the difference between systems.

[sakura4000]

Hey wait, I wanna hear more of that Telstar song that got cut off at the end.

[gli7utubeo]

Neat. Wow, Telefunken. I use their vintage tubes in my amp.

[wooferfreak]

telefunken are still a make when i go on holiday i see telefunken tv sets in the electric shops

[akomor1]

it's not the same today

[Kargaroc286]

i see u live in the states. so where do you get all these PAL sets? do you get them imported?

[stgxf04]

Sorry this is not quite right. Sure it's a Telefunken CTV, which probably had a 4"-6" single loudspeaker, and would not have sounded anywhere near as good as the sountrack of your example!

[TeslaMaster]

It is a Telefunken CTV, and it is the original sound of this CTV with a 6" single loudspeaker which you can hear in this recording. The video was taken with the Canon Powershot A70.

[stgxf04]

I believed it was a Telefunken TV. It was the sound I had an issue with. Sorry to have doubted you. Perhaps it's my PC's loudspeakers  that sound too good!

[TeslaMaster]

There are great differences with loutspeakers in early television sets. I have had tv sets which sounds bad, and others sounds good. This PALcromat here was Telefunken's masterpiece, made especially for the introduction of color television in Germany in the fall of 1967.

[aconnor96]

In Farbe is German for "In color."

[coolbluelights]

Ja!

[Jal8919536]

Wow! I wish companies would make "antique-style" television sets for purchase just like they do with radios along with LP/CD/tape players you see advertised in catalogs.

[kimberlyKfnOphiEAGLE]

There is a set builder that makes sets similar to the old Philco 'Predicta' TV set..I'll have to google it later..

[NorthRiverTV]

What strikes me is that this particular TV set sounds beautiful! Great tone, and a nice picture too! Excellent restoration! And yes, I'd liked to have seen that first musical number played in it's entirety too! :)

[poussecafe3]

The Uk could have had colour tv in 1959 but it would have used the terrible 405 line system that had been closed in 1939 due to WW2. It was simply reopened in 1947. (German tv in Berlin was on air till late 1944). The British had to expensively open a 625 line tv system to carry colour pictures. Even that was held up by the French who would not use other countries technology. They wanted something called SECAM. I believe most Tvs today can receive both PAL and SECAM.

[TeslaMaster]

It's a pity that the British had not developed a 405 line color system. In the 1950's they experimented with 405 NTSC, and today I think this would been a reasonable alternative to other color systems. Today, high end tv sets can decode all color systems, NTSC like PAL or SAECAM.

[kimberlyKfnOphiEAGLE]

I remember seeing a picture of an early

Marconi color camera...it resembled RCA's TK-41. I think the Marconi company got some info from RCA to develop the camera.

[fuelyournews]

gute altes fernsehn usw dankefurdasvideozeiterlebniss!

[kimberlyKfnOphiEAGLE]

The music at the end of the clip is 'Telstar' which was originally recorded by a band called the Tornados.

[kimberlyKfnOphiEAGLE]

Why did it take the European countries a little longer to get color TV than over here in the US? Was it just that they had to adapt the PAL system to broadcast in color? That ARD video is gorgeous on that PAL set!

[anorak2]

First European economies weren't as wealthy then. People were still busy with getting tv at all.

Second most European countries had no commercial tv then, just public. So no pressure to outcompete rival stations by upgrading to colour.

Third, Europeans wanted to avoid the NTSC hue problem. Developping two approaches to this problem (PAL and SECAM) took time. The political quarrels about which of those to to standardise took even more time (and eventually lead nowhere, as we all know)

[wrestlingnewsdesk]

i was just getting in to that music at the end of the clip.

[DgaDM]

Schönes Gerät, das muß toll gewesen sein damals. Danke für's einstellen!

[aussiebeachut]

GOLD !!

[frugola92]

interesting!