well since when do you control marrige buddyt? you can have your beliefes but mrrige has a specific definition!!! thats why we have dictonarys! and for all "religios libirties" i can create one right now saying you must kill everyone and say but i believe this!! but the state would say get over it and stop killing people.. just like religion has to get over itself and except change
1. Just because someone is gay doesn't preclude them from having a stable, loving relationship.... nor does it preclude them from having children.
2. There are already churches out there (Whether you like them or not... ) that already give same-sex couples marriage rights... so there is no infringement on your religious beliefs.
I live in Canada and churches can marry who they want. also what makes you think that a gay person would want to get married in a church that doesn't support them. God I am so thankful I live in Canada.
the bible! i am sick and tired of hearing the bible! and i'm christain! do u know how annoyed a fellow christain has to get to want to make these ignorant people shut up about the bible?
Tell me then, who did "invent" marriage? I've got some pretty ancient scriptural sources, that connect christianity with marriage.... What have you got?
1- If I hear correctly, then infertile couples should not marry, elders either, couples who don't want kids either. You want to protect marriage, then outlaw divorce too, it's against your stupid god.
2- Just like in Canada, religions would still have the right to remain the bigots that they are, for we are talking about civil rights, not about your stupid religion.
3- You either are a freakin liar saying you have any gay friend, or you should be ashamed to not consider them as your equals.
I got married last summer. To those that oppose my marriage. Why? How does my marriage affect you or your marriage? It doesn't..any more than yours affects me. 18,000 couples were married last summer. How were any of you affected negatively?? Answer: you weren't.
3. Churches already have the right to marry or not to marry any couple that they chose. They already have that protection. That would not change with same sex marriages. Personally, I wouldn' want to get married in a church that didn't want to marry me...but maybe that's just me.
Why are the couples on shows like "Who Wants to Marry a Millionaire" and "The Bachelor" more deserving of the legalization and validation and protection of their relationship than any long term, committed same sex couple??
2. If it's your belief that marriage is to legalize couples in long-term monogomous relationships, then why can't I marry my partner of 10 years?? I know many, many same sex couples that have been together 10, 15, 20+ years. Are they not valid couples worthy of legal protection??
Though you state your beliefs without saying hateful things about gay people; here are the reasons why you should not be able to impose your beliefs on others. 1. If your belief is that marriage is for procreation, then your belief would mean that elderly or infertile couples would not me anb to marry. Or for that matter, any couple that just didn't want to have any children. Correct??
To those saying "how can you impose your beliefs on others??" you need to step back and realize that a lot of people feel imposed upon when their definition of marriage is not respected, and their values are thrown by the wayside.
Issues like this will come down to awareness and sympathy through understanding, not force-feeding the arguments from one side to another. In most cases, people will hide behind definitions because they cannot define what makes them intrinsically believe to be right.
you state marriage in your belief.....: fine but to try to impose your belief onto others by law is the problem. iam not willing to take a right away from someone. neither should you.
First, not everyone has your definition of marriage and imposing that to everyone is plain wrong. Second, what about infertil couples? Shouldnt we let them marry since they cant procreate? Third, your statement about "religious liberties" being reduced has no ground at all. CA S. Court ruling on gay marriage clearly states that no religious liberty would be affected.
Stripping away peoples right is never the right choice. Whats next? If people like you did that, it may come back to you.
It's pure lies. Gay marriage has been legalized in Canada for YEARS and not one religious institution has "faced legal consequences". Gay marriage has NOT been taught in any schools either. The ONLY way you people can get the vote is because of the downright LIES and the fear mongering you spread. What does that say about you and your so-called religious institutions?
Prop 8 will be overturned once the truth of these lies come to the surface.
All one has to do is look at Massachusetts and the what has happened there to understand how the queer movement would use homosexual marriage as a tool to force "political correctness" on us all.
All one has to do is look at the Salem witch trials and what has happened there to understand how the religious movement would use religion as a tool to burn people alive and spread hate for having a mole, a pimple or for simply disagreeing with them and their "political correctness".
There are many examples(MANY) that I could use here to disregard your "point". If that's all you got, I suggest you educate yourself a little bit more on the world, it's history and civil right movements.
you are talking about what happened 300 years ago; I am talking about what has happened over the last two years (and is still ongoing).... it doesn't take a genius to understand which position is more relevant!
300 years ago. You're right. You would THINK we'd have a little bit more common sense BY NOW. Apparently not. As for being a "genius", what kind of 'genius' would look at one situation (which was pure anti-gay propaganda lies btw) and mark it as gospel? And what kind of genius wouldn't educate themselves on what is TRULY going on here? Oh yeah, that "genius" would be you.
I am just commenting that bad things that two years ago are a lot more relevant than bad things that happened 300 years ago.... your post seems to avoid that idea.
No, my post makes a point that human rights in general, in ANY form (c'mon now...think BIG) are just as relevant today as they were 300 years ago. You seemed to miss that idea.
Remember who's behind this hateful proposition. Religious EXTREMISTS from Utah. The SAME people who call the Catholic church "that great whore" and who won't let African-Americans join their faith because they are a "filthy people." Now they're spreading their hatred into California.
Good, thoughtful comments. Marriage has been between man & woman for several thousand years.Redefining marriage alters society in unacceptable ways. Choose your lifestyle, but don't expect everyone else to call it good. I can love my children, but not like their choices. I can love gay people without liking their choices.There are consequences to every choice we make in life. I choose to protect the natural family.I choose to protect parents rights, freedom of speech & religion. I vote YES on 8!
Myth 1# Marriages sev thousand years blah blah... You obviously don't know how or when marriage was created.
And, People believed the sun went around the moon for several thousands of years because of their narrow perspective, they were wrong, think about that one.
You say you choose to protect, yet you're protecting... by stripping a couples rights to marriage?
You're choosing to keep rights and freedoms from people, citizens because of your personal beliefs, that is fundamentally anti-American
1ran123 Just don't go imposing your personal beliefs. And as to equality there are rights that do not go with domestic partnership. Domestic partnerships are not recognized by other states and countries that do allow same-sex marriage. Domestic partnership also do not have the opportunity for immigration rights for their spouses if they are foreign nationals. Also, I've taught for 16 years at the elementary level and I have never once had a discussion in my class about marriage or any kind.
1ran123 Do you really think that same-sex couples want this right so they can marry in a Christian church? Same-sex couples have been marrying since June 17 and there has not been one reported case of a church being forced to marry them. But you'll probably say we'll eventually file suit to get the right. Well anyone can file suit, but that doesn't mean they'll win and if the courts are just and fair they won't. Religion is a private matter and should remain sacred to those who practice it.
1rams123 What this seems to be about for you is trying to make other feel bad about who they are so you can feel better about yourself. And just to provide a little clarification in regards to same-sex couples wanting to get married in a Christian church, there are plenty of denomination that would allow that already. Furthermore the courts have decided time and time again that the rights and practices of the church are sacrosanct and that government does not have the right to interfere.
1ran123 There is plenty of conclusive evidence to show otherwise you are just unwilling to do the research or believe it. It seems what you choose to do is to hate people because of something you don't understand. Homosexuality also exists in the animal kingdom how do you explain that? God's will is expressed in the world around us and it is simple arrogance to declare that you somehow have a better knowledge and understanding of the will of God than anyone else.
And as for the animal kingdom, humans should not take tips from lower irrational animals on how to behave. And besides that, instances of homosexuality among animals are most often acts of aggression and rape and dominance, not love. Just because animals do something, does not mean that us hummans, who know better than they do, are justified in doing it. Otherwise, according to you then, I suppose people have the right to eat their young too?
1rams123 Interestingly how you selectively choose to twist something you understand into something negative.There are many cases of homosexuality in the animal kingdom that have nothing to do with aggression or dominance. 2 male penguins together for life is not aggression. No, we don't eat our young we just go to other countries and kill adults & children, too-many time this violence is born out of some misguided religious fervor. Your anger and fear cloud your judgement! I feel sorry for you.
This is an issue of religious liberty. Parents need to have a say in what is taught as morally acceptable to their children in schools. Yes, it does have a lot to do with schools... schools are required to teach about marriage, don't believe the lies. Catholic orphanages have been shut down (as has happened in Europe and Massachusetts) because they refuse to allow gay couples to adopt!! That is only a scratch on the surface of the consequences thus far. Time will tell what's next. Yes on Prop 8!
Does your religious liberties include the right to hate and discriminate? Because mine does! My religion states I have to refuse to talk to niggers. In my work this poses a problem because there are a lot of these niggers around! I was fired from my workplace because I refused to talk to niggers, so I sued on grounds that my religious liberties have been violated at the workplace. All those liberal judges who ruled in favor of equal rights for niggers in the '60s destroyed democracy.
Can you say "straw man"?A "religion" such as the hypothetical one you have posed is clearly false and bigoted and does not deserve to exist.Christians are not bigoted because homosexuality is a lifestyle choice, not a race.There is no conclusive unrefuted evidence to show otherwise.For every scientific exmpl that 'proves' homosexuality is not a choice, there is a counterexample. Many people have gone from gay to straight to gay and this is proven fact.Therefore, this is not a civil rights issue.
oh, and I am fully aware that my comments are not transmitted in a rational but hateful style; well, no one likes to be hated you know and you started the thing by coming up with logical fallacious arguments for defending a hate issue.
Prop 8 is discrimination pure and simple. Domestic Partnerships are not accepted by other states or countries that recognize same-sex marriage. Prop 8 is about fear and power. It's about the majority imposing its will on a minority. Knowing about gays and lesbian or being around them doesn't turn people gay. Just like being around a left handed person doesn't make you left handed. Prop 8 is born our of hatred and fear. Live your life and let others live theirs. Say no to hate! Vote No on 8!
This is not an issue likable to Brown vs Board of education. Homosexuality is a lifestyle choice, not a race... there is NO refuted conclusive evidence to show otherwise. And what is unequal about not having the title "marriage" while having all other rights it grants, other than not having the ceremony in you local Christian Church? If people choose to live deviant lifestyles, and create contracts amongst themselves, that is their choice, and the state should honor it, but it is no marriage.
Bob-I agree. There is too much at stake here to redefine marriage. I will reject this dangerous social experiment and vote to protect families and the future of society! YES on 8!
Encroach upon religious liberties? Nope. Sorry Bob, but you're totally wrong on this one. Churches have NEVER been required to perform any marriages they didn't want to. And the CA Supreme Court specifically addressed that and ensured it would not be the case. Please read up on this before you vote to turn a group of people (including your gay "friends") into second class citizens.
So producing children is a MAJOR component of marriage? Hmm.. I recently got married and the wedding vows didn't say ANYTHING about children. They just talked about love, cherish, honor, "till death do us part", etc. Pretty strange, huh? I mean, since you say that creating children is the MAJOR thing about marriage and a loving relationship is only a secondary aspect of it.
So let's make marriage only legal for people who can prove they are fertile and intend to have children, right?
1rams123 Separate is never equal! Look up Brown vs. the Board of Education where the supreme court ruled that "separate is inherently unequal." Should we return to the separate but equal policy? Domestic partnerships are not equal to marriage. Correction-no orphanages were shut down.A Catholic adoption service in Mass. decided to suspend its adoption service because it did not want to comply with Mass. law. And remember when you use name calling you really undermine your own credibility.
You are ignorant, prop 8 does not take anyone's rights or protection away! Under the constitution any person can create a contract with any other person, including Gays. Gays already have the rights they want, they just want to hi-jack the title "Marriage"! The people who will lose those rights are those who refuse to accept giving this title to a gay union. Parents, Photographers, ... Orphanages have been shut down because they wont let gays adopt children.Eventually Churches will be affected.
There is equal protection under the law. Look up California Family Code 297.5. Registered Domestic Partnerships are afforded all the same rights as married couples. By the way marriage has never been a fundamental right for anyone, hetero or homosexual. You have to meet certain requirements to qualify for ANY license- marriage included.
Great comment! I totally agree. Marriage has always been between a man and a woman. I believe society is getting worse, not better, and the fact that we even have to define marriage, because of all of the gay activism and encroachment on individual and religious freedoms is proof of that. Everyone, please vote YES on Proposition 8. Protect morality in our society, protect your children, your marriages, your parental rights and religious freedoms! Great video! Thanks for sharing!
Lehonti911 I don't presume to know what is right for everyone and even with people with whom I disagree I believe it's their right to feel the way they do and express their feelings, but that right should not be legislated. People are calling Obama a socialist because he wants to make the tax laws more fair. But it's funny that no one is calling the Christian right socialist when the want to legislate who can enter into a contract.
Lehonti911 Let's address pedophilia. Pedophilia is not between two consenting adults. Same-sex marriage is about a legal government recognized contract between two adults. You don't have to approve of it. You don't have to like it. But wouldn't you prefer to live in a country where everyone is protected not just some. Incest well that's a funny one because that too has been practiced for thousands of years. In ancient Egypt the royal lineage was kept pure by practicing it.
Lehonti911 marriage between to consenting adults who have rights under the constitution is what we're are talking about. Let's address bigamy first. Bigamy was legal and accepted for thousands of years in many cultures. Only in the last few hundred years has that practice been abandoned. Who's right about that one? The people who practiced for thousands of years or our current culture. Who should decide? Should it be you? Are you all knowing? Are you god?
Lehonti911 Who decides what is appropriate? Slavery used to be appropriate Discrimination against women used to be appropriate. Genocide has even been appropriate. Who gets to decide that? That's the same kind of thinking that led to the atrocities in Nazi Germany. And as to this dividing line- so what you are saying is that all heterosexual marriages are health? Is that why the divorce rate has reached 50%.
Point 2- Religious freedom. If you had done a little research you would realize that the courts have historically favored religious institutions in order to preserve the spiritual practices and traditions on any belief. Only when religious organizations enter into government contracts are they subject to anti-discrimination laws. And if you truly believe in religious freedom you would respect the rights of other religions that do embrace same-sex marriage. Vote No on 8! Equality for all!!
Scrolls - it isn't discrimination to support traditional marriage over alternative forms. In marriage, there has always been a dividing line between what is appropriate or healthy, and what is not. Voting No on prop 8 isn't really about giving marriage rights to all -- if it were, you'd have to include marriages of incest, pedophila, bigamy, with the argument that because they love eac hother they shouldn't be excluded. But you're not. You just want to move the line to include homosexuals.
Point 1- Does that mean that only men and women who produce offspring can marry? Does the woman need to be impregnated prior to the marriage to meet your standard? What about barren couples should their marriages be annulled? By your same argument should unmarried couples with children be forced to marry?
It really is a shame to see "marriage" redefined. It DOES have unforeseeable consequences for our society and legislation must be put forth to protect religious org's.
HOWEVER, since 1996 DOMA has unconstitutionally prevented same-sex unions from being "marriage" at the federal level, denying 1,138 rights from these couples (even if they may be the same at the state level, as in California).
I'm gay, btw. Don't blame us for this redefinition, blame DOMA.
Way to go! I'm glad that you understand the issue. It's hilarious when those who wish to validate their lifestyle by "throwing it in the face of school children and threatening churches with hate-crime-accusation pose the question: How will it affect you?
Actually, nothing is being imposed on you in any way. Your rights are not affected by same-sex marriages. However, our rights are certainly affected by Prop. 8.
We are simply fighting for equality and you're standing in our way imposing your beliefs against our equal rights.
We simply want equal rights -- we are not out to change your rights at all.
So what do you think forcing our children to believe that same sex marriage is ok is doing? You do not believe that that is changing our rights? The definition of marriage is: The union between a man and a woman. Why are you fighting for a term that doesn't even apply to man and man and woman and woman unions? Also if your forcing us to accept same sex unions, destroying our sacred marriages, what do you think you are doing? Marriage is Sacred, lets keep it that way.
Prop 8 has nothing to do with marriage or schools. Even the California Superintendent of schools says so.
Don't believe it? Read it yourself.
The Yes on 8 campaign is simply using scare tactics to win your support - much like the Bush Administration used to lead us into a misguided war. Don't be duped by scare tactics.
NO ON PROP 8.
BECAUSE MINORITY RIGHTS SHOULD NOT BE LEFT UP TO A MAJORITY VOTE.
well since when do you control marrige buddyt? you can have your beliefes but mrrige has a specific definition!!! thats why we have dictonarys! and for all "religios libirties" i can create one right now saying you must kill everyone and say but i believe this!! but the state would say get over it and stop killing people.. just like religion has to get over itself and except change
YOMYPEEPZ555 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Slavery and polygamy and sexism are approved by the bible.
No on prop8 and the bible.
NKWIA12 1 year ago
Wow. So many strawmen arguments here.
1. Just because someone is gay doesn't preclude them from having a stable, loving relationship.... nor does it preclude them from having children.
2. There are already churches out there (Whether you like them or not... ) that already give same-sex couples marriage rights... so there is no infringement on your religious beliefs.
Zuul030 2 years ago
lol churches would be fine.
I live in Canada and churches can marry who they want. also what makes you think that a gay person would want to get married in a church that doesn't support them. God I am so thankful I live in Canada.
DAIGORO14 2 years ago
the bible! i am sick and tired of hearing the bible! and i'm christain! do u know how annoyed a fellow christain has to get to want to make these ignorant people shut up about the bible?
jackthayer 2 years ago
fuck you and your bible...
POLYMORPHLEGION 2 years ago
i think you missed out a point
you vote yes on prop 8 because you are
an idiot
fuck religion! christianity didn't invent marriage so with wich right do they suppres other peoples lives
SteilAmSeil 2 years ago
Tell me then, who did "invent" marriage? I've got some pretty ancient scriptural sources, that connect christianity with marriage.... What have you got?
Twarrior4 2 years ago
1- If I hear correctly, then infertile couples should not marry, elders either, couples who don't want kids either. You want to protect marriage, then outlaw divorce too, it's against your stupid god.
2- Just like in Canada, religions would still have the right to remain the bigots that they are, for we are talking about civil rights, not about your stupid religion.
3- You either are a freakin liar saying you have any gay friend, or you should be ashamed to not consider them as your equals.
montrealpsycho 2 years ago
lol if i chose to be gay, then you chose to be a fugly ginger! yeah exactly bitch!
mot881 2 years ago
I got married last summer. To those that oppose my marriage. Why? How does my marriage affect you or your marriage? It doesn't..any more than yours affects me. 18,000 couples were married last summer. How were any of you affected negatively?? Answer: you weren't.
hig 3 years ago
I'm glad to hear that you got married, congrats!
xTHUNDERGALOREx 3 years ago
Thank you.
hig 3 years ago
Welcome!
xTHUNDERGALOREx 3 years ago
3. Churches already have the right to marry or not to marry any couple that they chose. They already have that protection. That would not change with same sex marriages. Personally, I wouldn' want to get married in a church that didn't want to marry me...but maybe that's just me.
hig 3 years ago
Why are the couples on shows like "Who Wants to Marry a Millionaire" and "The Bachelor" more deserving of the legalization and validation and protection of their relationship than any long term, committed same sex couple??
hig 3 years ago
2. If it's your belief that marriage is to legalize couples in long-term monogomous relationships, then why can't I marry my partner of 10 years?? I know many, many same sex couples that have been together 10, 15, 20+ years. Are they not valid couples worthy of legal protection??
hig 3 years ago
Though you state your beliefs without saying hateful things about gay people; here are the reasons why you should not be able to impose your beliefs on others. 1. If your belief is that marriage is for procreation, then your belief would mean that elderly or infertile couples would not me anb to marry. Or for that matter, any couple that just didn't want to have any children. Correct??
hig 3 years ago
To those saying "how can you impose your beliefs on others??" you need to step back and realize that a lot of people feel imposed upon when their definition of marriage is not respected, and their values are thrown by the wayside.
Issues like this will come down to awareness and sympathy through understanding, not force-feeding the arguments from one side to another. In most cases, people will hide behind definitions because they cannot define what makes them intrinsically believe to be right.
buttaflutta 3 years ago
BOB YOUR A FAG
irokharderthnrok 3 years ago
you state marriage in your belief.....: fine but to try to impose your belief onto others by law is the problem. iam not willing to take a right away from someone. neither should you.
nonthiestnc 3 years ago
what a homo! HAhhahaaAHAHA
Irishuwerehere 3 years ago
Another thing Bob,
I suggest you read this very well explained document that will (maybe) help you understand the issue a bit more (no spaces)
affirmation . org / pdf / 2008_09_18_thurston . pdf
ch5342 3 years ago
Bob,
First, not everyone has your definition of marriage and imposing that to everyone is plain wrong. Second, what about infertil couples? Shouldnt we let them marry since they cant procreate? Third, your statement about "religious liberties" being reduced has no ground at all. CA S. Court ruling on gay marriage clearly states that no religious liberty would be affected.
Stripping away peoples right is never the right choice. Whats next? If people like you did that, it may come back to you.
ch5342 3 years ago
It's pure lies. Gay marriage has been legalized in Canada for YEARS and not one religious institution has "faced legal consequences". Gay marriage has NOT been taught in any schools either. The ONLY way you people can get the vote is because of the downright LIES and the fear mongering you spread. What does that say about you and your so-called religious institutions?
Prop 8 will be overturned once the truth of these lies come to the surface.
killahead 3 years ago 4
All one has to do is look at Massachusetts and the what has happened there to understand how the queer movement would use homosexual marriage as a tool to force "political correctness" on us all.
blueroguehog 3 years ago
All one has to do is look at the Salem witch trials and what has happened there to understand how the religious movement would use religion as a tool to burn people alive and spread hate for having a mole, a pimple or for simply disagreeing with them and their "political correctness".
There are many examples(MANY) that I could use here to disregard your "point". If that's all you got, I suggest you educate yourself a little bit more on the world, it's history and civil right movements.
killahead 3 years ago 4
you are talking about what happened 300 years ago; I am talking about what has happened over the last two years (and is still ongoing).... it doesn't take a genius to understand which position is more relevant!
blueroguehog 3 years ago
300 years ago. You're right. You would THINK we'd have a little bit more common sense BY NOW. Apparently not. As for being a "genius", what kind of 'genius' would look at one situation (which was pure anti-gay propaganda lies btw) and mark it as gospel? And what kind of genius wouldn't educate themselves on what is TRULY going on here? Oh yeah, that "genius" would be you.
killahead 3 years ago 2
I am just commenting that bad things that two years ago are a lot more relevant than bad things that happened 300 years ago.... your post seems to avoid that idea.
blueroguehog 3 years ago
No, my post makes a point that human rights in general, in ANY form (c'mon now...think BIG) are just as relevant today as they were 300 years ago. You seemed to miss that idea.
killahead 3 years ago
ugh, tard. Historically marriage has always been a social institution to establish a contractual obligation to society.
HerrBasty 3 years ago
fuck religion
THEdownfallOFmanKIND 3 years ago
0:23 That's exactly why my 70 year old grandma can't marry her sterile boyfriend!
0:28 Love is secondary in a marriage? My mother's ex-husband felt the same way!
1:09 No! The Supreme court while allowing gay marriage also protected churches right to deny marriage to gays in the same decision
DJ Cárdenas
Sales Manager - Great Affinity Sales
greataff 3 years ago
Remember who's behind this hateful proposition. Religious EXTREMISTS from Utah. The SAME people who call the Catholic church "that great whore" and who won't let African-Americans join their faith because they are a "filthy people." Now they're spreading their hatred into California.
SAY NO TO HATE! NO ON 8!
SarahPALINhatesYOU 3 years ago
Good, thoughtful comments. Marriage has been between man & woman for several thousand years.Redefining marriage alters society in unacceptable ways. Choose your lifestyle, but don't expect everyone else to call it good. I can love my children, but not like their choices. I can love gay people without liking their choices.There are consequences to every choice we make in life. I choose to protect the natural family.I choose to protect parents rights, freedom of speech & religion. I vote YES on 8!
cbg1757 3 years ago
Myth 1# Marriages sev thousand years blah blah... You obviously don't know how or when marriage was created.
And, People believed the sun went around the moon for several thousands of years because of their narrow perspective, they were wrong, think about that one.
You say you choose to protect, yet you're protecting... by stripping a couples rights to marriage?
You're choosing to keep rights and freedoms from people, citizens because of your personal beliefs, that is fundamentally anti-American
Gelandri 3 years ago
being gay or not being gay is primarily a moral/religious issue.
in a country that purports to be under a secular rule of law this should not be an issue.
if you do not agree with gay marriage...dont get one!
your (or mine, if I had any) religious views are private and are not to be forced, by law or convention on any one outside your own skin.
to sum up.
keep your fucking religious views out of my constitution you fucking narrow minded bigots!
just shut the fuck up!
zencat999 3 years ago
1ran123 Just don't go imposing your personal beliefs. And as to equality there are rights that do not go with domestic partnership. Domestic partnerships are not recognized by other states and countries that do allow same-sex marriage. Domestic partnership also do not have the opportunity for immigration rights for their spouses if they are foreign nationals. Also, I've taught for 16 years at the elementary level and I have never once had a discussion in my class about marriage or any kind.
ScrollsofKasumiyama 3 years ago
1ran123 Do you really think that same-sex couples want this right so they can marry in a Christian church? Same-sex couples have been marrying since June 17 and there has not been one reported case of a church being forced to marry them. But you'll probably say we'll eventually file suit to get the right. Well anyone can file suit, but that doesn't mean they'll win and if the courts are just and fair they won't. Religion is a private matter and should remain sacred to those who practice it.
ScrollsofKasumiyama 3 years ago
1rams123 What this seems to be about for you is trying to make other feel bad about who they are so you can feel better about yourself. And just to provide a little clarification in regards to same-sex couples wanting to get married in a Christian church, there are plenty of denomination that would allow that already. Furthermore the courts have decided time and time again that the rights and practices of the church are sacrosanct and that government does not have the right to interfere.
ScrollsofKasumiyama 3 years ago
1ran123 There is plenty of conclusive evidence to show otherwise you are just unwilling to do the research or believe it. It seems what you choose to do is to hate people because of something you don't understand. Homosexuality also exists in the animal kingdom how do you explain that? God's will is expressed in the world around us and it is simple arrogance to declare that you somehow have a better knowledge and understanding of the will of God than anyone else.
ScrollsofKasumiyama 3 years ago
And as for the animal kingdom, humans should not take tips from lower irrational animals on how to behave. And besides that, instances of homosexuality among animals are most often acts of aggression and rape and dominance, not love. Just because animals do something, does not mean that us hummans, who know better than they do, are justified in doing it. Otherwise, according to you then, I suppose people have the right to eat their young too?
1rams123 3 years ago
1rams123 Interestingly how you selectively choose to twist something you understand into something negative.There are many cases of homosexuality in the animal kingdom that have nothing to do with aggression or dominance. 2 male penguins together for life is not aggression. No, we don't eat our young we just go to other countries and kill adults & children, too-many time this violence is born out of some misguided religious fervor. Your anger and fear cloud your judgement! I feel sorry for you.
ScrollsofKasumiyama 3 years ago
This is an issue of religious liberty. Parents need to have a say in what is taught as morally acceptable to their children in schools. Yes, it does have a lot to do with schools... schools are required to teach about marriage, don't believe the lies. Catholic orphanages have been shut down (as has happened in Europe and Massachusetts) because they refuse to allow gay couples to adopt!! That is only a scratch on the surface of the consequences thus far. Time will tell what's next. Yes on Prop 8!
1rams123 3 years ago
Does your religious liberties include the right to hate and discriminate? Because mine does! My religion states I have to refuse to talk to niggers. In my work this poses a problem because there are a lot of these niggers around! I was fired from my workplace because I refused to talk to niggers, so I sued on grounds that my religious liberties have been violated at the workplace. All those liberal judges who ruled in favor of equal rights for niggers in the '60s destroyed democracy.
RationalEmotive 3 years ago
Can you say "straw man"?A "religion" such as the hypothetical one you have posed is clearly false and bigoted and does not deserve to exist.Christians are not bigoted because homosexuality is a lifestyle choice, not a race.There is no conclusive unrefuted evidence to show otherwise.For every scientific exmpl that 'proves' homosexuality is not a choice, there is a counterexample. Many people have gone from gay to straight to gay and this is proven fact.Therefore, this is not a civil rights issue.
1rams123 3 years ago
of course I am being ironic, but this is how silly your freedom of religion argument sound to me, you bigoted faggot! (get the irony here?)
Shut the fuck up, just shut the fuck up and leave my constitution and my civil liberties alone, you bigoted fucking cunt!
RationalEmotive 3 years ago
oh, and I am fully aware that my comments are not transmitted in a rational but hateful style; well, no one likes to be hated you know and you started the thing by coming up with logical fallacious arguments for defending a hate issue.
RationalEmotive 3 years ago
I hope you have a child who turns out to be gay. I hope this child is conflicted and torn over his "family values" upbringing.
I hope this child kills himself. Then you'll understand.
SerLoras 3 years ago
Prop 8 is discrimination pure and simple. Domestic Partnerships are not accepted by other states or countries that recognize same-sex marriage. Prop 8 is about fear and power. It's about the majority imposing its will on a minority. Knowing about gays and lesbian or being around them doesn't turn people gay. Just like being around a left handed person doesn't make you left handed. Prop 8 is born our of hatred and fear. Live your life and let others live theirs. Say no to hate! Vote No on 8!
ScrollsofKasumiyama 3 years ago
This is not an issue likable to Brown vs Board of education. Homosexuality is a lifestyle choice, not a race... there is NO refuted conclusive evidence to show otherwise. And what is unequal about not having the title "marriage" while having all other rights it grants, other than not having the ceremony in you local Christian Church? If people choose to live deviant lifestyles, and create contracts amongst themselves, that is their choice, and the state should honor it, but it is no marriage.
1rams123 3 years ago
Bob-I agree. There is too much at stake here to redefine marriage. I will reject this dangerous social experiment and vote to protect families and the future of society! YES on 8!
bebelove110 3 years ago 2
Hi again Bob,
Encroach upon religious liberties? Nope. Sorry Bob, but you're totally wrong on this one. Churches have NEVER been required to perform any marriages they didn't want to. And the CA Supreme Court specifically addressed that and ensured it would not be the case. Please read up on this before you vote to turn a group of people (including your gay "friends") into second class citizens.
MajorArcana11 3 years ago
Hi Bob,
So producing children is a MAJOR component of marriage? Hmm.. I recently got married and the wedding vows didn't say ANYTHING about children. They just talked about love, cherish, honor, "till death do us part", etc. Pretty strange, huh? I mean, since you say that creating children is the MAJOR thing about marriage and a loving relationship is only a secondary aspect of it.
So let's make marriage only legal for people who can prove they are fertile and intend to have children, right?
MajorArcana11 3 years ago
1rams123 Separate is never equal! Look up Brown vs. the Board of Education where the supreme court ruled that "separate is inherently unequal." Should we return to the separate but equal policy? Domestic partnerships are not equal to marriage. Correction-no orphanages were shut down.A Catholic adoption service in Mass. decided to suspend its adoption service because it did not want to comply with Mass. law. And remember when you use name calling you really undermine your own credibility.
ScrollsofKasumiyama 3 years ago
Life is short and happiness is fleeting. Don't waste your life trying to deprive others of their happiness.
Vote No on 8!
Vote No on 8!!
Vote No on 8!!!
Equal protection under the law for everyone!
ScrollsofKasumiyama 3 years ago
You are ignorant, prop 8 does not take anyone's rights or protection away! Under the constitution any person can create a contract with any other person, including Gays. Gays already have the rights they want, they just want to hi-jack the title "Marriage"! The people who will lose those rights are those who refuse to accept giving this title to a gay union. Parents, Photographers, ... Orphanages have been shut down because they wont let gays adopt children.Eventually Churches will be affected.
1rams123 3 years ago
There is equal protection under the law. Look up California Family Code 297.5. Registered Domestic Partnerships are afforded all the same rights as married couples. By the way marriage has never been a fundamental right for anyone, hetero or homosexual. You have to meet certain requirements to qualify for ANY license- marriage included.
Vote YES on Prop. 8!!!!
usingmyvoice 3 years ago
Great comment! I totally agree. Marriage has always been between a man and a woman. I believe society is getting worse, not better, and the fact that we even have to define marriage, because of all of the gay activism and encroachment on individual and religious freedoms is proof of that. Everyone, please vote YES on Proposition 8. Protect morality in our society, protect your children, your marriages, your parental rights and religious freedoms! Great video! Thanks for sharing!
ivoteyesonprop8 3 years ago
Lehonti911 I don't presume to know what is right for everyone and even with people with whom I disagree I believe it's their right to feel the way they do and express their feelings, but that right should not be legislated. People are calling Obama a socialist because he wants to make the tax laws more fair. But it's funny that no one is calling the Christian right socialist when the want to legislate who can enter into a contract.
ScrollsofKasumiyama 3 years ago
Lehonti911 Let's address pedophilia. Pedophilia is not between two consenting adults. Same-sex marriage is about a legal government recognized contract between two adults. You don't have to approve of it. You don't have to like it. But wouldn't you prefer to live in a country where everyone is protected not just some. Incest well that's a funny one because that too has been practiced for thousands of years. In ancient Egypt the royal lineage was kept pure by practicing it.
ScrollsofKasumiyama 3 years ago
Lehonti911 marriage between to consenting adults who have rights under the constitution is what we're are talking about. Let's address bigamy first. Bigamy was legal and accepted for thousands of years in many cultures. Only in the last few hundred years has that practice been abandoned. Who's right about that one? The people who practiced for thousands of years or our current culture. Who should decide? Should it be you? Are you all knowing? Are you god?
ScrollsofKasumiyama 3 years ago
Lehonti911 Who decides what is appropriate? Slavery used to be appropriate Discrimination against women used to be appropriate. Genocide has even been appropriate. Who gets to decide that? That's the same kind of thinking that led to the atrocities in Nazi Germany. And as to this dividing line- so what you are saying is that all heterosexual marriages are health? Is that why the divorce rate has reached 50%.
ScrollsofKasumiyama 3 years ago
Great points! Great video! Yes on religious freedom! Yes on free speech! No on sign-stealing! YES on PROP 8!
aliciaburkriley 3 years ago
Point 2- Religious freedom. If you had done a little research you would realize that the courts have historically favored religious institutions in order to preserve the spiritual practices and traditions on any belief. Only when religious organizations enter into government contracts are they subject to anti-discrimination laws. And if you truly believe in religious freedom you would respect the rights of other religions that do embrace same-sex marriage. Vote No on 8! Equality for all!!
ScrollsofKasumiyama 3 years ago
Scrolls - it isn't discrimination to support traditional marriage over alternative forms. In marriage, there has always been a dividing line between what is appropriate or healthy, and what is not. Voting No on prop 8 isn't really about giving marriage rights to all -- if it were, you'd have to include marriages of incest, pedophila, bigamy, with the argument that because they love eac hother they shouldn't be excluded. But you're not. You just want to move the line to include homosexuals.
Lehonti911 3 years ago
Point 1- Does that mean that only men and women who produce offspring can marry? Does the woman need to be impregnated prior to the marriage to meet your standard? What about barren couples should their marriages be annulled? By your same argument should unmarried couples with children be forced to marry?
ScrollsofKasumiyama 3 years ago
Where's his white hood?
Actually, considering his looks, *any* hood would help this poor slob.
GreatUmbrage 3 years ago
If you are a good creation of God you should know that God created each and everyone of us EQUALLY.
If not, I hope someday you will have a gay child or grandchild in your family so you can understand more about the matter.
God gives us a lot of choices in life.
But if you choose to be ignorant... please don't blame Him.
Vote NO on Prop 8.
because EQUALITY for ALL AMERICANS !
mzlolalee2008 3 years ago
It really is a shame to see "marriage" redefined. It DOES have unforeseeable consequences for our society and legislation must be put forth to protect religious org's.
HOWEVER, since 1996 DOMA has unconstitutionally prevented same-sex unions from being "marriage" at the federal level, denying 1,138 rights from these couples (even if they may be the same at the state level, as in California).
I'm gay, btw. Don't blame us for this redefinition, blame DOMA.
IanKenn 3 years ago
Way to go! I'm glad that you understand the issue. It's hilarious when those who wish to validate their lifestyle by "throwing it in the face of school children and threatening churches with hate-crime-accusation pose the question: How will it affect you?
crkempton 3 years ago
In your video say it's your "belief" -- it is not fair for you to impose your "beliefs" on others. Enough said.
iprozach 3 years ago
Just as its not fair for you to impose your own beliefs upon the supporters of Prop 8.
MrTungate 3 years ago
Actually, nothing is being imposed on you in any way. Your rights are not affected by same-sex marriages. However, our rights are certainly affected by Prop. 8.
We are simply fighting for equality and you're standing in our way imposing your beliefs against our equal rights.
We simply want equal rights -- we are not out to change your rights at all.
iprozach 3 years ago
So what do you think forcing our children to believe that same sex marriage is ok is doing? You do not believe that that is changing our rights? The definition of marriage is: The union between a man and a woman. Why are you fighting for a term that doesn't even apply to man and man and woman and woman unions? Also if your forcing us to accept same sex unions, destroying our sacred marriages, what do you think you are doing? Marriage is Sacred, lets keep it that way.
Dabeadchic 3 years ago
Prop 8 has nothing to do with marriage or schools. Even the California Superintendent of schools says so.
Don't believe it? Read it yourself.
The Yes on 8 campaign is simply using scare tactics to win your support - much like the Bush Administration used to lead us into a misguided war. Don't be duped by scare tactics.
NO ON PROP 8.
BECAUSE MINORITY RIGHTS SHOULD NOT BE LEFT UP TO A MAJORITY VOTE.
iprozach 3 years ago
The first line of my last response should read, "children or schools" - not "marriage or schools."
iprozach 3 years ago
since when does marriage involve children?
why does someone who's born different deserve less rights?
why do you care,you have your right?
its not about religion,its whats fair,
homosexuality happens amoungs in nature,animals do it,and
so do humans,
that defination need revisal.
marriage is shared between two people who love eachother.
why should you be selfish to take anyones rights.
SkinnyHoe 3 years ago
Because that's what the script said.
sammyseattle 3 years ago