Brian McLaren_s Attack Against Hell and Jesus Atonement.wmv

[YouTubricant]

I <3 Brian McLaren and all his contemporaries. Suck my emergent cock, you ignorant, insecure traditionalists.

[UniversalismRefuted]

@YouTubricant Probably not if it's as small as your "mind".

[YouTubricant]

@UniversalismRefuted When it comes to universalism, who are trying to convince of its refutability? Others? Or yourself?

[UniversalismRefuted]

@YouTubricant Who said anything about universalism or convincing anyone about it? It's folly is axiomatic.

[YouTubricant]

@UniversalismRefuted All I know is, I cannot believe anything that does make sense to me. No one can. One cannot actually believe something if their brain won't let them believe it. I am a Christian, and I believe with all my heart in the way of Jesus, but the idea of a God that says, "I love you unconditionally, but if you don't realize that fact before your earthly body expires, I will send to hell for eternal torment" does not sit right with my brain for a plethora of reasons.

[UniversalismRefuted]

@YouTubricant Well it's not your brain that prevents you, it's your heart.

[YouTubricant]

@UniversalismRefuted Oh believe me, my heart most definitely screams "No!" to the idea of an unconditionally loving God who allows people to go to hell.

[UniversalismRefuted]

@YouTubricant "Unconditionally loving" towards who?

[YouTubricant]

@UniversalismRefuted Towards everyone. Is that not obvious?

[UniversalismRefuted]

@YouTubricant See it really doesn't matter what "makes sense" which is code speak for "I don't like that" because God's decree's are the only and final arbiter of truth.

[YouTubricant]

@UniversalismRefuted You're damn right I "don't like that". Know why? Because it doesn't "make sense". These things go hand-in-hand.

[UniversalismRefuted]

@YouTubricant Well there's alot of things that God does that "don't make sense to finite man" and that's why He is God and you are not.

[YouTubricant]

@UniversalismRefuted Alright, so if the Bible said that it was okay to kill people, would you just say, "Well that doesn't seem right to me, but I'm just a man! Who am I to discern what's right?"? And yes, I know that it does not actually say that.

[UniversalismRefuted]

@YouTubricant Well we're not dealing with man made hypotheticals, we're dealing with what God has said.

[YouTubricant]

@UniversalismRefuted No. I proposed a hypothetical situation, therefore, that's what we are dealing with. Answer the question. If the Bible said that, would you respond in that way?

[UniversalismRefuted]

@YouTubricant Yes you did. You said "what if..." That is called hypothetical meaning it never really happened. Also, it doesn't matter what you or anyone else says, thinks or feels. In fact the apostle Paul addressed this in Romans 9 when he said "who are you o man who talks back to God".

[YouTubricant]

@UniversalismRefuted I am not talking back to God. I am talking back to traditional interpretations and traditionalists that I find questionable.

[UniversalismRefuted]

@YouTubricant Questioning what God can or cannot do with His creation? That sure is talking back to Him. According to Romans 9, God can do whatever He chooses with His creation. It has nothing to do with interpretations, that's what the text says.

[YouTubricant]

@UniversalismRefuted You've got me all wrong. I do NOT question what God can or cannot do. I question what people say God DOES do. Huge difference.

[UniversalismRefuted]

@YouTubricant Well when the text says what God does then there isn't any room to argue.

[YouTubricant]

@UniversalismRefuted Well that takes us right back to my point. I don't believe that the text actually says that that's what God does. Just out of curiousity, why is it so important to you that universalism or universalisticness be refuted?

[YouTubricant]

@UniversalismRefuted I should clarify my point a little further: I don't believe that from what we read in the Bible, we can make the jump to the traditional view of hell and be 100% sure about it. And that doesn't just go for hell; that goes for a ton of Biblically based concepts.

[UniversalismRefuted]

@YouTubricant Really? Well I'm sorry that it's that way for you because there are a ton of people who it's not that way for. So I guess you people are right by default and we're wrong because you say so?

[YouTubricant]

@UniversalismRefuted Yes, I am well aware that my view on this puts me in the minority among other Christians. And why do you keep responding as if I believe this stuff just for the hell of it or something (pun intended)? I don't know for sure who's right and who's wrong and neither do you. All we can do is use our critical thinking skills and determine what we believe to be true. We have simply come to different conclusions in this case. But hey I really want to hear your answer to my question.

[UniversalismRefuted]

@YouTubricant You don't know who's right or you don't want to know who's right? It seems that you have no room for the orthodox view to be right because you just don't like it.

[YouTubricant]

@UniversalismRefuted Why the hell would I not want to know who's right?! My whole purpose in questioning things is that I am seeking after truth. Truth is all I want. I feel like I made this very clear a few comments back. And you can accuse me all you want of not believing in things simply because I don't like them, but you made a fucking YouTube channel devoted to refuting universalism; sounds like you really, really don't like universalism. Oh, and please answer my question!!!

[UniversalismRefuted]

@YouTubricant I did answer your question, I said we're not dealing with hypotheticals, we're dealing with what the bible says so your "what if" question has no bearing on reality. The bottom line is that the bible does not teach that everyone get's saved and it teaches that the unrepentant do not enter God's kingdom but go to a place of punishment.

[YouTubricant]

@UniversalismRefuted I am well aware that my first question had no bearing on reality, but how you answer it is important. My point in asking the question is that unhesitantly accepting things because we think that they "came from God" or whatever is very dangerous because it takes away the factor of human discernment, which you can never completely get away from. I'll just retype the question I was referring to: Why is it so important to you that universalism or universalisticness be refuted?

[UniversalismRefuted]

@YouTubricant Why should I answer a question that has no basis in reality? It doesn't deal with the facts nor what the word of God says. It's as useful as debating scenarios in Star Wars.

Universalism (if it is false...and it is) equals a false gospel and gives false security to the unbeliever's conscience.

[YouTubricant]

@UniversalismRefuted What you're doing by playing the no-bearing-on-reality-so-it-do­esn't-matter card is copping out. If you ask a person if they would go around killing people if the U.S. gov't decided to legalize murder and that person says that they most definitely would, can we not draw conclusions about their mental state even though the played-out situation will never actually happen?! But for the THIRD TIME NOW, let me ask you...why is it so important to you that universalism be refuted?

[UniversalismRefuted]

@YouTubricant It's neither a "card" nor a "cop-out" because the bible doesn't teach such a thing so asking me what I would do if it did is a non sequiter. Why refute universalism? I answered that in the previous post (because it's a LIE).

[YouTubricant]

@UniversalismRefuted See, this is the very root of our disagreement. You say that the Bible indisputably teaches the traditional doctrine of hell, whereas I say that I am not so sure that it does (or that it even matters if it does).

[UniversalismRefuted]

@YouTubricant The doctrine of Hell is the secondary issue, what we're talking about is that the bible does not teach that every person that God ever created is redeemed. Once you understand that fact then Hell is easier to deal with.

[BADDOOKUS]

Another New Age false prophet