Boehner and wildlife in the Arctic National Wildlife Refuge

[casualtiesofpunk]

The only thing I personally have against oils is the wasteful use of it as a fuel. besides fuel there ar 6000 documented uses for oil. not to mention peak oil is nothing more than propaghanda. the tar sands alone here in canada will yeild enough oil for 213.3 years (this does not include the feilds in the beaufort sea or arctic circle or even ANWR)

[03AZRoush]

John McCain calls it the Natural Refuge? hahah Its a National Refuge. This dude seriously has no clue what hes talking about

[Neoconhater]

Corporatists don't give a shit about wildlife, all they care about is money.

[jimbo2931]

And the enivironmetalists care about the average American? No they care more about protecting a piece of frozen tundra than lowing the price of gas for all Americans.

[Makaeff]

This drilling will not lower the price of gas, it is that simple.

[Neoconhater]

What is simple is this idiot jimbo, he is a huge moron.

This drooling idiot is a global warming denier.

[Neoconhater]

OOPS! I meant juhsepi. He is a regressive, drooling moron.

[juhsepi]

Did you know that the Porcupine caribou can be found standing alongside the Heat emitting pipelines during the harsh winter months.

And of the 19,000,000 acres that is the ANWR region, we are only looking to drill on 5,000 acres. Percentage wise that is .0263% or a quarter of a tenth of 1 percent.

I'm glad you enjoy paying for oil the way we are. But I'm sick of it.

Mind you I'm for renewable energies. But the technology isn't there yet. Let us get by with oil until it is!

[Neoconhater]

Mind you I'm for renewable energies. But the technology isn't there yet. Let us get by with oil until it is!

I agree with some of what you say. Yes we do need to continue the use of oil until we develop alternatives.

Unfortunately the Dumbya Regime has set us back a very long time by spending hundreds of billions on the neocon madmen adventures instead of R&D for our future.

I think the amount of oil in the Arctic is so minimal that it is a very stupid idea to drill there. Just leave it alone.

[juhsepi]

There is a significant enough volume of oil in a concentrated area to warrant drilling.

According to the USGS, at one million barrels a day there is a 15 year supply of oil. 1 million is 10% of what Saudi Arabia already produces.

That's pretty significant.

[Neoconhater]

15 years? Not the point. And 15 years from now we should be using something other than oil for most of our energy.

We need to end the oil age before it gets worse, this means putting effort into alternatives before we destroy the whole planet.

[juhsepi]

How can you say it's not the point?

"I think the amount of oil in the Arctic is so minimal that it is a very stupid idea to drill there. Just leave it alone."

I present to you the fact that Artic oil is not minimal and you brush it aside?

That equates to 5% of our Nations consumption. 7% of what we pay foreign leaders. That totals $120 million/day. In a year that is $43 Billion less going towards our nations debt.

And more money that could be focused toward finding what replaces oil...

[Neoconhater]

I'm glad you enjoy paying for oil the way we are. But I'm sick of it.

Fuck you, don't tell me what I like.

And more money that could be focused toward finding what replaces oil...

And if you believe your own dribble then you're a complete fucking moron! The oil corporation are NOT interested in alternatives, only BP has shown interest. The rest are basically saying....piss off. And I say the same thing to an ignorant chump like you! PISS OFF!

[Neoconhater]

Excuse me, you are a complete fucking moron, just like Boehner.

[juhsepi]

Ohhhh, wow, testy!

So this is how a liberal responds to facts? Sounds good to me.

So does this mean I win the debate? I mean usually when you (or any other liberal) have no point to make. You come out with the insults.

A little common sense never hurt anybody. But man you must hate it when someone slaps you in the face with facts that you can't argue.

[Neoconhater]

Slap in the face?

Oh no, you're a global warming denier, morons like you are slapping yourselves in the face.

[juhsepi]

Yet again, answer with your emotions and nothing to back it up with.

Tell me, What has the Earth temperature done in the last ten years?

What regulated the Co2 levels?

What is the largest consumer of Co2?

What major world even in the 1980's cause the earth's temperature to rise drastically thus driving the Global warming scare?(Careful, this is a trick question)

50 years ago, what was the big environmental scare?

Have you looked up the Roman, Minoan, and Medieval warming periods?

[juhsepi]

I'm not happy about what I'm paying for oil. Thats why I write letters to my Congresswoman and Senators pushing them to drill.

When did I tell you what you need to like?

When Oil companies are making 4% off a gallon, and the government is on average charging 47 cents or 11.75% on $4 gallon, I think it would be abundantly clear that there is plenty of money to focus on renewable research.

And by the way, that 4% is compared to the 14% that Bill Gates and the technology sector take in.

[Neoconhater]

And by the way, a few oil corporations just posted the biggest profits ever. 4% off a gallon is bullshit and you know it.

[juhsepi]

Oil is the single most demanded product. I'm not denying the shock about the profits. But I understand why they are making profits.

You and I control the economy, not big oil. You can make a stand by walking or biking to work, Carpooling, catching the bus, or do that skateboard thing from back to the future.

But don't blame big oil who is trying to match price with demand because EVERY BUSINESS DOES THIS. It's why you'll pay $12 for a steak at Chili's. If it was $13, you'd order a burger.

[TFRWGuy]

Everybody knows the most important thing about new drilling is the psychological impact this will have on the American people.

Our talent for psychologically manipulating peoples minds is why we Republicans are so successful.

Anyone who takes offense to being manipulated are just moonbats who hate America and want to surrender to terrorists.

The high price of gasoline is not important. It is common knowledge that perception control is the only thing that matters.

[pelayostyle]

What a boner. Looking for all that wildlife huh? CNN was playing a video of wildlife on that refuge. LOL.

[masterhook]

any new drilling will not help us out for between 15 and 17 year. I dont know about anyone else but I cant take the price of gas now, and there big plan will not help out for 15 years. give me a brake. Work to fix it now, not 15 years from now.

[jimbo2931]

Bill Clinton said the same thing 12 years ago.

[masterhook]

for the last 12 years big oil has had 32 million acres of the cost to drill in and have done nothing. Now they want more land offshore to do what with? They use only between 1% and 9% of the money they get from us to find new oil. Also if they did get the oil out of the gound it would go on to the world market not stay in the USA. How is this working to make the price at the pump better?

[juhsepi]

It has been proven that we can have oil refined in five.

[masterhook]

Then drill on the 68 million acres that oil companies have now. Including 34 mill. offshore and a lot of land up in alaska oil fields that are not protected. Big Oil use the GOP to kill the DRILL BILL that would have made them use the land to lose it, and would have keep the oil found on the lands in the USA. Why if they so much want to drill dont they use the land and why would they kill a good bill like that... I will give you 2 reasons, oil men in the white house and yea, MONEY.

[juhsepi]

It's a good question that I don't yet have an answer for. However, I am going to research why and give you a more appropriate response.

My gut instinct is because it is costly to survey, (for some reason $20 Million per survey sticks in my memory)

I realize that the bottom line for oil far exceeds that which is why I'll look further into this.

What I do know is with the current allotted land there is uncertainty of whats under it. ANWR doesn't.

See part two. . .

[juhsepi]

PART two:

Do you find it interesting though that action was taken to protect the Polar bear population that has gone from 5,000 to 25,000 in 30 years?

And when you add to the fact that the Porcupine caribou migrate towards the pipelines in an effort to survive harsh winters. Then one could argue that the pipeline is helping nature.

And I'm having a hard time finding Vacation packages to ANWR. Why is that?

[Neoconhater]

So what, how much warmer is the planet gonna be in five years? Oh, that right, you're one of those morons that thinks global warming is a hoax, go fuck yourself.

[juhsepi]

When you environmentalist radicals acknowledge that we are in no greater of a warming cycle, then was faced in the Minoan, Medieval, or Roman era. Then yes, I will talk about Global warming.

But since your group only believes the earth is 30 years old, then I'll stick to my guns and religion.

[masterhook]

Frist off Neoconhater was talking for him self not me. Yes there is a warming and cooling cycle, but that is only one part of it. With all the stuff we as humans have done it exacerbates it. CO2 is a greenhouse gas and over time it will not only add to the heating of the earth but makes us all sick. I live in LA and we deal with smog all the time. Its really bad and we need to do something so we have clean air. Drilling will not make are air any better or water cleaner.

[masterhook]

Most of the land that big oil has survey's been done but yet they will not drill there,why? Also why did they kill a bill that would have made them keep the oil in the USA. Exxon Mobil Corp. reported second-quarter earnings of $11.68 billion today the largest in the history of the US. This is why, the more they can keep the oil on the world market the more money they make. the higher oil is the more money they make, and we want to give them more land and keep giving them tax brakes, why?

[juhsepi]

Wouldn't we agree then that if there is less supply then demand goes up with price. If thats the case and Big oil just wants to make money and thats it, then why would they push to gain access to more supply?

Using this logic, isn't it fair to say that Democrats are fighting for big oil by not allowing access to increases in supply?

[juhsepi]

Hook, I don't believe I was grouping you two together. I think Youtube is just having issues with sorting our debate out...

As for Co2, we are clear that Co2 is what we produce constantly right? It is what we exhale. Co is Carbon Monoxide, Co2 is Carbon Dioxide which produces plant food. Trees, vegetation make this oxygen again.

And when Co2 levels rise it's because the temperature rises. Temperature controls Co2 not the other way around. The Earth regulates itself.

[masterhook]

but see here is a couple problems with that. We are adding a lot more co2 then the earth can deal with. We are letting the rain forest be cut down. The rain forest was what was keeping CO2 down but the less we have of that and the more CO2 the more harm to the earth.

[masterhook]

Also we need to be working to get away from fossil fuels and to more renewable fuels like biodiesel and we can start that right now by just stopping selling gas engines and just sell diesel. over the next 10 years we will have things in place to make the switch. yes, there will be gas cars for a long time down the road but we can make biodiesel cheaper then that it cost to get oil out of the ground and at the same time ad more plants that help get rid of CO2, do you see anything wrong with that

[juhsepi]

Here is the funny thing about that,

#1 The rainforest is 1.7 Billion acres. It cannot be harvested fast enough for it to disappear. Whats more Trees are not the only thing that produce oxygen. All plants produce oxygen. And it is those plants that thrive because that tree is gone.

#2 What else takes in Co2? At a greater rate then all the forests in the world combined? Oceans. Oceans take in excess Co2 and emit it when levels are down.

If the Trees become overwhelmed the Oceans help out.

[masterhook]

yet that's not happening. levels of CO2 are going up not down. There are things we can do today to put less CO2 In the Air and also get us away from oil. Even bush's EPA has said (yet they don't want to say it) that CO2 is bad for humans. what is wrong with my idea of stopping the selling of gas engines and only selling diesel engines? they right now get a lot better MPGs and can use biofuels with out any change over at all to it. the price out the door is about the same, so why is this not good

[juhsepi]

How is Co2 bad for humans? It's what we exhale. We produce it. It's not Co is Carbon Monoxide, this is what people die from when they sit in the garage with the car running.

You know what happens when you take in too much Co2? You gasp for fresh air, or pass out. And when your Co2 level goes down your fine.

(Continued)

[juhsepi]

(Continuation)

This is the first I've heard of your Diesel engine proposal.

So you want me to give up my car that is free and clear of a loan. And which I pay $3.77/gallon to fill (just this morning). And purchase a new vehicle and pay $4.30+/gallon.

Mind you, that $4.30+/gallon would be at the current demand rate. Imagine what it's going to cost me when I, along with everyone else have to start buying just diesel? We're talking $5-6 gallon minimum.

Is that really viable?

[masterhook]

your car will need to be replaces in the next 5 to 10 years right. So when you need to get your next car why should it not be a diesel? We can just stop adding new gas fueled cars to the road and over the next 10 to 15 year more then 75% of the cars on the road will be Diesel. In that time we also start to change the mix of Diesel fuel at the pumps to mix in more biofules. In most states Diesel2 is already being mixed with some parts biofule.

[masterhook]

new bio-oils, like from algae, are rapadly becoming a way to replace fossil fuels. If we would just put money into that then we would have a real shot of getting it right. Also bio-oils are cheeper to make it is to get oil out of the ground and more stable. Also we can make as much as we need right here in the USA and not look off shore or anything for it. This is a much better idea then to go and drill when we will not see anything really for min of 5 and max of 15 years.

[juhsepi]

According to a CNET special regarding Algae (on youtube), they say one acre can produce 10,000 gallons of fuel a YEAR.

Do you realize that to replace just what Saudi Arabia provides us in Oil for a day, with Algae, we would need a farm that is 10 MILLION ACRES

Saudi Arabia, not our biggest oil provider Canada!

So, we are asking for 5,000 acres in A mosquito infested, uninhabited "refuge". But as an alternative you want us to make a 10 Million acre mosquito farm to fix 14% of the problem?

[masterhook]

There is 30+ million acres that big oil is holding up, why not use that land. your idea of a 10 Million acre mosquito farm is wrong. The idea of a open pond systum to do this idea would not work. To get a bigger yeald you need to have a closed system. with that type of systum think up not out. It will work and is working now. You just need to think out side of the box and be willing to change. If not we will run out of oil and where will we be. We need action now not 8 or 10 year from now.

[juhsepi]

I've already touched on that. (Already reserved) So either you're not listening to how I keep answering your questions or you're running out of complaints.

"Think up not out" Explain, because I don't understand the point your trying to make.

And as I've said before, I AGREE that we need to work on renewable energies but until we get there WE NEED TO DRILL.

With oil we can afford to look into renewable energy.

And Nuclear energy sure would help too.

[gw2345]

what are you going to do in 15 and 17 years after nothing happens?

[jdu6]

@masterhook we need to start getting more money from the oil companies,,,they made a trillion dollars in the last 10 years,,and the money they make they buy back stock in their companies to gain controll on the price,,,which is to make gas more to buy....