Bronowski (The Ascent of Man) on Auschwitz & Science

[spylab]

he had relatives in that pond

[Suraky]

@CarloTheGambino "only the uk could ..." ... sounds like something Hitler would have said of Germany.

[novadrian]

Oh dear. It was all going so well until you decided to tamper with what must be one of the greatest documentary series ever. Just back and watch the entire series. Something might go in.

[Boldenberg]

4 million huh ?

[jondavidgriffin]

@Boldenberg give or take

[CarloTheGambino]

a Great British legend, only the UK could produce a mind like Bronowski

[apostate001]

This should have been shown and shown again at the beginning of the George W. Bush administration as the certitude of the dogma of the modern American christian right wing was no less destructive, yes in pure numbers, but not in magnitude to those impacted.

[thedeeliciousplum]

Incredible. Jacob Bronowski has managed to share within just a few lines what we can choose to use, so as to better understand the world around us.

[EyeLean5280]

I agree with andrewridgway. That ending you stuck on is trivializing and tacky. And the fact that you haven't removed it in the year you've had since andrew pointed it out speaks very poorly of your taste and judgment.

[wbarquez]

Some of the great tragedies in human history happened because some people wanted to be like God in the wrong way, like Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden.

[O1LSL1CK]

Watched this in a lecture 2day...Moving stuff :-|

[lynchie3000]

"Into this pond were flushed the ashes of some four million people"

Then, in July 1990, they went and lowered the Auschwitz death toll from 4m to 1.1m.

But the six million figure stays.

That's not science.

[O1LSL1CK]

@lynchie3000 considering that he had spoken in this same episode about the dangers of dogmatic certainty - he isn't really contradicting anything...

[jjdecani]

@lynchie3000 Do you understand that this has not the slightest thing to do with the point Bronowski is making? Do you?

[lynchie3000]

@jjdecani Do you understand that my point had nothing to do with Bronowski's philosophising. Do you?

[koenraad72]

Gripping.

[SIRSIMSY]

I watched the original broadcast of this and when I saw your link I just knew which of all the programmes you would chose and I was not wrong. It has stuck in my memory ever since.

Thank you and thank you Jacob Bronowski.

[elgato425]

At the end of the series, there is an interview with Sir David Attenborough, who describes several aspects of the filming of this series. In this interview he states this one clip was done only one time and Mr. Bronowski's comments were straight off the cuff and not rehearsed. His passion and conviction clearly shows his humanity.

[hdtwoodsman]

This is Bronowski's Sermon on the Mount. He's my hero... and I don't throw that word around carelessly.

[ChiTownLiz]

Oh, that stepping into the pond...he's moving towards the edge, and I'm thinking "be careful, you're going to get your shoes wet" and then he does, and then he keeps going, and of course by the time the bottom of his pants are wet I realize what's happening...geez, that's a powerful gesture.

[Candidafox]

Look at the PopeJohnEdgarIV: Ascent of Man, (5 of 6), Knowledge or Certainty. It's the ep this clip came from. Much better.

Dr Bronowski refers to "a principle of monstrous certainty" as fueling the Nazi actions.

It's not just the Nazis, though, he's talking about anyone who acts from the same unswerving, unquestioning attitudes.

[OoYesIKnowOoYesIKnow]

@Candidafox

Dear Canada,

Yes, what you said and also, personal relations with private associates; folk who are not able to hear another person.

.

They remain "unswerving unquestioning and attudinal" without getting an update ... or reality check as to their behaviour. in a social context of friends; worrying!

.

Cheers.

from,

del-boy.

[Candidafox]

The point of this clip is that it is the yearning for "absolute knowledge" that makes us cling to dogma. He contrasts this with the answers of science, which are tentative. By necessity, they have to be: there is always the possibility of being wrong, in science. Religion almost never allows such an idea. It holds itself divinely inspired, and therefore absolute. That is what creates arrogance of the kind that created the Holocaust.

[OoYesIKnowOoYesIKnow]

@Candidafox I think in this comment, the description is lacking a 'person'. Those things you say are quite right, they require a person with such a disposition that facilitates and carries-out any specific idea. . Folk who are so motivated, must have an additional personal 'perverse' interest, this may originate in their childhood; they, in their adult life, seek retribution for a childhood slight, which at the time for the child was a big event. . . Cheers. from, del-boy.

[duckgeezer]

I don't believe in any god but still found the clip moving.

I first saw it almost 40 years ago.

I recorded it to a VHS tape and watched it over and over.

Shame about the silly advert at the end which shatters the mood of the clip.

[itsallfake100]

The BBC documentary 'My Father, The Bomb, And Me' brought me here. Before that documentary i did not know who Dr Bronowski was and what he was famous for. Im so glad i just came across that documentary. Thank alot BBC Iplayer.

[stepheng1483]

There is no evidence whatsoever that 4 million Jews were killed in Auschwitz, that is a massive exageration.

Whenever laws are required to force people to go along with a "truth" it is obvious there is something to hide.

[EddieTheDaddyHitler]

I think you'll find he is clearly talking out of his arse, he pathetically claims absurdly that 4m died at Auschwitz which is an out right lie which i'm sure he knows is wrong being an academic but he needs to keep to the lie as to keep the nonsense 6m number in the public eye. Why don't you check out the actual dead number from the Nurenberg trial. I think you'll find they agreed that 300,000 died there, the verdict can be seen on youtube.

[WNxFish]

@EddieTheDaddyHitler Ok. So it was 300,000. Does that make it any less of a tragedy? Does it give Bronowski's words less meaning?

[EddieTheDaddyHitler]

@WNxFish

I wonder why Jacob Bronowski member of the hate religion that is of course Judaism didn't bother to do a story on the real victims of the era, the tens of millions of European civilains murdered by communism, can't do that though can he? The victims weren't Jewish and the communist murder regime was run almost entirely by Jews, lets remeber the holodomor the greatest tragedy of the last 100 years, possibly over 10m Ukranians deliberately starved to death.enough with this 6m Jew farce!

[WNxFish]

@EddieTheDaddyHitler With that logic you can no longer claim that 9/11 is a tragedy- it was merely a paltry 3000 . . .

Do you see how foolish you sound? No one is denying that there were awful things done to non-Jews. No one is denying even that what was done to the Jews were worse than anyone else (though it was one of the worst that targeted a specific ethnic group). Saying that he shouldn't talk about it is like saying a survivor of Nagasaki shouldn't talk about it because Hiroshima was worse

[EddieTheDaddyHitler]

@WNxFish

Regarding 9/11 I'm more concerned with the reasons it was attacked in the first place plus the over 1 million innoncent Iraqi's that have been butchered in the aftermath to apparently "protect our freedom".

[rrdab1]

@EddieTheDaddyHitler You are a moron. The internet allows anonymous cretins a voice when they deserve none. Know your place and stay quiet in your ignorance.

[EddieTheDaddyHitler]

@rrdab1

Which part specifically do you disagree with?

[bi1iruben]

@WNxFish Agree - what he says is ".. of some 4 million people" - I think he clearly is talking about concentrationcamps as a whole at this point, rather than Auschwitz alone, or indeed of that particular corner of the Auschwitz.

[EddieTheDaddyHitler]

4m?!  Pull the other one, only in Jewish fantasy land can a few hundred thousand magically turn into 4m.

[MC2233z]

Science is this computer - watching this video. What I may do next is use Science to figure out why Auschwitz was created in the first place. Or I may not. What he seems to lable or condem is "thinking"... without an ability to move toward compassion. Where one locks down against this ability only to be invaded by a mind of scarcity and false needing or fear.

[miss1mosaic]

Get this.

[Mmmyess]

Ruined one of the most profound moments in all video history. Such a shame.

[randomgasattack]

After more than 2 years since being uploaded, that this has so shamefully few views is a damning indictment of modern society.

[andrewridgway]

goddamit dude--it's such an amazing and powerful clip. he steps into the pond that he has just said contains the ashes of four million people, scoops up the mud and says, "you have to touch people"

and then that fucking 'yo' thing at the completely destroys a moment of pathos. seriously. what the fuck.

[spylab]

@andrewridgway he had relatives in that pond

[hdtwoodsman]

A brilliant man in a series that should be watched by all. Viewing AoM was like returning to my favorite class in college.

[Zhenobia]

Yo! Excellent video. Science and reason will improve our planet. Fundamentalist memes will doom us. Hitler was a fundamentalist. Don't let another Hitler come into power...

[robert496]

Complete rubbish. The small pond could not have contained 32000 tonnes of ash (8 kilos per person). More sentimental holo rubbish that supports the massive fraud and the theft of Palistine.

[dbes02]

Theft of Palestine? By whom -

the Turks?

the British?

the 70% of the Mandate set up as Jordan?

the West Bank annexed by Jordan as a base to attack Iarael?

the Gaza strip occupied by Egypt as a base to attack Israel?

Israel - formed after the UN voted for allocating land for a Jewish state?

[Zhenobia]

WTF? Are you one of those aryan idiots that thinks the holocaust was a hoax?

[FrankinHolland]

That is a racist statement cloaked in political correctness.

[Zhenobia]

What? I am being racist against racists?????

[Sefardisafran]

I cry for all my family I never met!

Sefardisafran

Hoboken NJ

USA

[ronnieknotts]

We have to touch people...

That's easy right?

Alas?

[jdvhal]

Whoever posted this and then wrote this:

"To help stop the madness and move humanity into the next phase of our evolution,"

has misunderstood the purpose of this clip.

[Yoism2]

Is that so? Check out the links in the description of this video if you believe that.

[jdvhal]

As I said - you have misunderstood the purpose of this clip.

[Yoism2]

That's not much of a comment, "You are wrong." And then, "As I said, you are wrong."

[Taberham]

@Yoism2 jdvhal is right I'm afraid.

[Taberham]

@Yoism2 No - jdvhal is right. Bronowski doesn't say anything about religious righteousness in this clip. And it's not 'science versus' anything

[westrouge7]

@jdvhal

I agree. Bronowski is arguing against totality, which also means against intolerance, even if religious dogma is probably wrong.

[Alexknobsob]

FEMA camps