The Perils of Hydro Fracking in NY State's Marcellus Shale

[electricmeg]

My electricity comes from Niagara falls. No gas or petroleum products in my house. Use a fuel efficient auto and work from home. How easy it is for you to ASSUME, dcuttamane.... and make accuasations based on your assumptions. Gas Industry professionals confirm that in all cases, Hydro-fracking causes methane to rise to the surface ground water. I guess you'll have a nice short life.

[dcuttamane]

This is the fact of life here in this particular formation. So what are we gonna do now? get rid of CNG cars and stop heating homes. NO, we are going to do the best we can to minimize impact. You're a hypocrite because you dont care the least about other countries and how they are affected so you can live nicely and have a vehicle that you fill with gas and a home covered in vinyl siding. All these things take resources. You are the opponent. Understand though, the proponents are more in numbers

[dcuttamane]

I think this whole discussion is funny. The narrator of this film is probably wearing petroleum based fibers on her body, more than likely has electricity and possibly gas ran to her house. It may be that she lives without these luxuries, but i highly doubt that. I am sitting on a frack as I write this. The safety measures are huge. Things used to be less stringent, but now there are a lot of measures in place. I live in PA. My yard has petroleum byproducts and gas coming out of the ground.

[8201woody]

ur a dumb bitch... how deep is ur water supply? 50 to 500 feet? gas is thousands of feet below that. 75% for ur water wells are fracked ur letting other un educated people tell you what in it...

[electricmeg]

Frack IS underground earthquakes which release radon, methane and other NORM's into the ground, water and air.... in addition they keep used frack water in "ponds" lined with garbage bags... when it evaporates into the air, it gets trapped in clouds and rained back down on us. When it seeps out of the ponds, it goes directly into the ground water, into the streams.

Your cursing shows me what a low life UR, your rant shows how uneducated UR. Go drink a glass of frack water.

[prime3end]

It should be called EXPLOSIVE hydro fracking, because it uses high explosives to fracture the rock along the horizontal and deep portion of the well. Explosions of this type are not precise, it will absolutely contaminate the water supply. To remove this crap from the water supply, you would have to build, and send the water through a fractional distillation plant (a refinery). The big rush, why it's being forced down our throats , once water is poisoned, no objections to more wells.

[jes166]

NO RACKING WAY!!!!!! :):)

[mobilizeyourbiz]

@ rabidpensfan : that was the disaster that got my attention. What a horrific thing; the frackers just dumped the toxic wastewater into what had been the most pristine river in PA and destroyed it, completely. They are immune to prosecution so they do what they want.

[rabidpensfan]

I have a question for anyone that is employed by the hydrofracking industry in West Virginia or Pennsylvania for that matter. What happened at Dunkard Creek in Northern West Virginia and SW Pennsylvania?

[electricmeg]

Oh - so they bring you in and don't hire local people. Exactly my point.

There are different kinds of fracking, just like conventional gas drilling. You should know this if you are who you say you are. Where the gas is exceptionally deep, they use the "bad" kind of fracking. But in ALL cases of hydrofracking, the "earthquakes" generated to release the gas cause Naturally Occurring Radioactive Materials to be released into the ground, the air, and the water. Also releases methane into the water

[rowdykain8]

@electricmeg They bring us in because nobody up here knew how to frac. But they have 4 crews and we can start ging home. So they do have All local people! Yes there are different kinds of fracing (Nitrogen, slick water and foam)but the depth of the well does not determine that. It is what the customer wants that determines what we do. And what radioactve materials? The only radioactive devices on location is flow meters. These to not go into the well and methane in mother nature no us!

[rowdykain8]

@ekectrucmeg I did not have room to address you other "facts" so i will do that as well. First I fid it strange that a rig is drilling in NY but the govenor has issue a "stay" on drilling and fracing until the SGEIS is completed (that is until 6-1-11) Also the "million gallon" spill in PA is a little overblown. A million gallons of water is more then we would use to pump down one stage on a well. That is 2381 full water tanks. WOW! Facts are fun.

[electricmeg]

Brine is used in "conventional" gas drilling, as in my mother's gas well in western new york. It is not used in hydrofracking. Even brine water is caustic in its own way. It has been admitted by fracking companies that they have to use the chemicals for a variety of reasons - lubrication, rust prevention, etc. - so again, your information is wrong.

Really, I'd love to know - who's paying you to spread this misinformation?

[rowdykain8]

@electricmeg 'hydrofracking" is what I do! Brine water is used. It comes in two weights 10lb and 18lb. It depends on the climate of the area on the kind we use. Here we use the lighter in Nov and Dec. and the heavy now because its colder day and night. This is not misinformation but FACT. Do u think I would stay in a hotel for 16 days at a time to look at the snow? Fracing companies and drilling companies are two different things. We don't drill. All we do in the frac. I know the process.

[electricmeg]

Either you are misinformed, ingorant, or lying. The illegal dumping of fracking water has KILLED rivers all over the country. I'd love to know how you cleaned up that one-million gallon spill of fracking water in PA just a few months back? Careful? Calculated? NOT. Fracking is purely a profit-driven practice which ignores the cost to the environmemnt.

I don't care if people are gun-toting or bible thumping - that's your right as an American citizen. That's the BEAUTY of this country.

[rowdykain8]

@electricmeg fracing water is just that, WATER! The only water used in the fracing process that is not fresh water is brine. Brine costs 3 times as much a fresh. So for that reason we only use it to winterize the pumps and wellhead so they don't ice up. This is around 420 barrels on location nothing more. That is far from a million. The fracing process costs about 1-3 million a head. Energy companies do this because if they don't the well will only produce half the gas as it would if they didn't

[electricmeg]

@rowdykain8 West Virginia is the forgotten land of the US! It's heaven for people like you. Also, I guess you don't count all the wells have blown up, killing people, because of your shoddy practices.

And you're wrong again, there is PLENTY of gas drilling in NY. My mom has a rig on her land; it's all over the state.

You are very misinformed. When you're dying of some bizarre form of cancer, think back on me. I will only wish you well.

[rowdykain8]

@electricmeg I guess we are forgotten because we clink to our bibles and guns a little to much for a liberal? Back to the issue. I know alittle more about this field then you belive me to know. You see I do this for a living. Fracing. It is a very careful and calculated process. Any spill over a gallon is cleaned up, reported to DEP and investagated. You really need to stop drinking the cool aid and go out on a frac job and see for yourself how it really works before you speak as if u know.

[electricmeg]

@rowdykain8 You're so full of it. Creating JOBS? Puleeze. I'm so tired of the lies. There's no revenue. In fact, NY State's gas drilling regulations are archaic and we earn something like .001% in taxes. Nice rosy picture you're painting! Too bad it's a fake.

[rowdykain8]

@electricmeg you know why there is no revenue from taxes is because there is no drilling or fracing going on in the state of NY. You don't have to worry about NY though. By the time y'all get around drilling the energy companies will be gone and so will all of the jobs and money! Thats fine with me. We welcome all the money and jobs in WV that y'all are not smart enough to take. Besides we have been doing this (fracing) for the past 10 years and have none of the effects you point too. Wonder Y ?

[electricmeg]

Hydrofracking has been going on for years, and years, and years - in almost 40 states! It's not new! Who are you to say that only YOU could possibly know about it? We have hundreds of people studying it!!!! Obviously someone is paying you to discredit public discourse.... what a lame job!!!

[Nate10Z]

@meg there are no man camps, the guys stay at hotels. They are drug tested once atleast every two months. And buying into something or not, its here creating jobs for people. Unless you are an engineer like me with experience, you don't know anything about this new process that only a few companies world wide can use.

[Nate10Z]

@meg there are no man camps, the guys stay at hotels. They are drug tested once atleast every two months. And buying kinto something or not, its here creating jobs for people. Unless you are an engineer like me with experience, you don't know anything about this new process that only a few companies world wide can use.

[electricmeg]

The topic has been researched by THOUSANDS of people, mostly on my side of the fence, as people on your side of the fence couldn't care less for the environment and fresh water. Fracturing, is by its very nature, a horrific process, causing underground earthquakes to release the gas from the shale. Perhaps YOU need to do some research. I just got ANOTHER video of a person's water contaminated by fracking - and this person didn't even lease their land for drilling.

[electricmeg]

The topic has been researched by THOUSANDS of people, mostly on my side of the fence, as people on your side of the fence couldn't care less for the environment and fresh water. Fracturing, is by its very nature, a horrific process, causing underground earthquakes to release the gas from the shale. Perhaps YOU need to do some research. I just got ANOTHER video of a person's water contaminated by fracking - and this person didn't even lease their land for drilling.

[Nate10Z]

you should consider researching the topic. there are few companies who are willing to use this method, mainly due to the cost. never the less I have only personally witnessed one issue which was quickly and easily resolved. our customers have their water tested 3 times per week before during and a year after to ensure their water is safe.

[Nate10Z]

Any of you people ever hear of green fracturing??? As an engineer for a company who employs this method i can say that you are all wrong.

[electricmeg]

@Nate10Z : no, never heard of green fracturing, although some gas companies claim they use only biodegradable products. nevertheless, fracking releases Natural Occuring Radioactive Materials (NORMs) into the ground, water, and air; uses excessive amounts of fresh water; clogs our highways and chokes our air with diesel trucks; and completely reduces the quality of life. There is NOTHING good about hydrofracking.

[rowdykain8]

@electricmeg There are a few exceptions...... using gas to say....cook your food, heat your home, as and alternative fuel to gasoline. Oh, there are a few more. Creating jobs in a state that doesn't have many, boositng the economy of small towns that havn't seen this much commerce since the 50's. That also leads to more tax revenue for education, social programs (Liberal like these), new roads ect..ect.. I gues those things don't matter?

[LarkaSojourn]

You talk about conserving energy, but why is it no one ever speaks about the employment of WOOLS. The use of these fibres will save more energy than people realize and combined with severe power conservation life can go on without these toxic technologies. Individuals have to decide to do it already.

[electricmeg]

@LarkaSojourn - do you mean wool as in from sheep? or is there something I don't know about?

[LarkaSojourn]

@electricmeg Alpaca, Angora, wools of all varieties, we must use them in protection to offset the intensity of demand for heat. Peru makes far better use of wool than Americans do i've found. I've bought many handmade pieces from them and feel that we underestimate the value of wool in protection from seasonal necessity for warmth.

[shinokiba]

I live in Sullivan County, and we need some jobs.

[electricmeg]

@shinokiba yes we sure do!!!!

[toosad444]

Link will not post, article title is: Radioactive waste surfaces at Texas gas sites

In Denton, Tarrant and Wise counties, all kinds of equipment – from pipes and separators to frac and brine-hauling tanks – were decontaminated of NORM – the most toxic waste the wells can generate.

[BeAnEarthNut]

there is lots to test for in your water, the chemical they use to get Gas out of rock,Google this: boric acid used in fracking, you will find lots of things

[BeAnEarthNut]

i have a comment for them, i want to say they Will contaminate many fresh water drinking wells all over the place, one drill site can affect about up to 5 miles around the site

[mygypsysoul16]

Did You Know They Are already Dumping the Toxic Waste in Sullivan County ?

[electricmeg]

@mygypsysoul16 WHAT? No! I have not hear this. Tell me more!

[ThreeBallz]

@mygypsysoul16

Don't tell "crosbo67" that.... he will say that only "SOME" of the waste is toxic and then mention something about microtox tests and beer.... lol WAKE UP.....

[electricmeg]

No such thing as non-toxic fracking fluids. Don't know how the gas companies are able to get away with their lies, legally..... they do lie EXTENSIVELY. In NY we have the voice of NYC, which has helped greatly. The only way to stop it is to get EVERYONE involved and VOCAL. It CAN be stopped, but not with people sitting on their butts saying, "What can I do?" Harrass your local legislature, your state legislature, your federal legislature. The gas is sold to the Chinese! It's not even for us!!

[ThreeBallz]

Very well spoken. I have pretty much come to the conclusion that we are doomed. Money makes the world go around and greed will be our demise.

Some people made comments about non-toxic fracking fluids. If they exist will that solve the problem of peoples drinking water being contaminated with gas vapors? Wake up.

[crosbo67]

@ThreeBallz Wake up? Read all the comments before you make statements like that to others. I said numerous times that fracing can cause communication between water and gas zones causing toxic contamination. However, this video was about how toxic frac fluids are, which is not the case at all. Some frac fluids pass "Microtox" tests,meaning you can drink it,the soap you wash down the drain won't pass the test. Its funny how people that watch the movie "gasland" become environmental experts..

[ThreeBallz]

@crosbo67

You are right I did watch gasland and it was enough for me to see that it is damaging our water supplies. Based on the water and gas zones contaminating each other is enough to ban this from happening. The frac fluids are toxic. If you work for one of these companies and are trying to defend them I hope you lose your job and starve. Wake up and find a new job.

[ThreeBallz]

@ThreeBallz

Oh and it's funny how this guy/gal keeps saying "some" frac fluids are non-toxic. Let me cover myself by saying "some".... Must be a lawyer. Anyone know some good lawyer jokes?

[crosbo67]

@ThreeBallz Fact of the matter is, humans need natural gas/oil to survive. The world population is too large to be sustained the way we used to live. Even if we didn't drive cars, or use electricity, how would we keep from freezing to death in the winter? I wonder how long the remaining forests would last if hundreds of millions of people needed wood for heat, maybe 2 years?  Your choice, heat the house with wood or gas. What's your choice?

[ThreeBallz]

@crosbo67

Actually their are more trees in the USA now than in the last 100 years. As for using wood or gas/oil for energy their is a funny thing called solar power, wind power, water turbine power, and yes even nuclear power. Other energy source alternatives can be developed and are being developed but then again I may have just gotten this information by watching another documentary.... which makes me an expert.

[crosbo67]

@ThreeBallz I hope you're right, but we need it today not tomorrow. If we want to stop Marcellus shale fracing, we need to stop the demand for it. Trying to stop the supply (oil/frac companies) is just delaying the inevitable.

[crosbo67]

@ThreeBallz My last comment on this topic, THE FRAC FLUIDS USED IN THE MARCELLUS SHALE (ie. slickwater) ARE DRINKABLE!  Try researching yourself instead of getting biased opinions from a movie.

[ThreeBallz]

@crosbo67

Even if it WAS drinkable and I don't believe it is I don't want water supplies contaminated with gas. If their is the slightest risk of contamination then it should NOT be even considered. WAKE UP.

[crosbo67]

@ThreeBallz If you really want to make a difference, try convincing the hundreds of millions of people causing a demand for gas to switch to other sources. If anyone that does not want fracing near their community and is still using natural gas for anything, they are hippocrates. Classic "Not in my back yard" attitude.

[CleanWaterActionPA]

We in Pennsylvania, which also rests on the Marcellus Shale, are similarly very concnerned about the dangers associated with natural gas drilling. Clean Water Action is working to fight against the gas companies by pushing for more strict regulations, and enlisting the help of citizens and activists to do so.

[keepruvthknight]

your speech is very informative, but next time, you should eliminate the use of lively jazz music that could be distracting to the viewer. Don't mean to be critical, just a heads up ( :

[SuperBrandone]

I'm from Columbia County PA....and they're starting this where I'm from. My town is situated on the Susquehanna River....this utterly sickens me. We need to learn to figure out alternate sources of energy. I now live in Maryland, right along the Chesapeake bay, and as we all know, water runs downhill. What they are doing in PA and NY is going to affect alot of other places. It's very sad and I wish it could be stopped.

[electricmeg]

@SuperBrandone We are really doing everything we can to stop it in NY and I think that once we are able to do it, the fury will snowball into the other states where hydrofracking is already in place. Too many horrible stories.

[electricmeg]

@cobblewright - what about the NORMs that come up with the gas - you recycling that too?

[cobblewright]

And while the public still debates and frets about surface fluid handling and footprint, industry is already quickly approaching near 100 percent reuse and recycling of waste water in closed loop systems that minimize the surface spill risks. In reality, shale gas development has evolved into primarily a traffic nuisance.

[crosbo67]

@cobblewright 100% agreement

[crosbo67]

I'm not arguing that gas drilling in general is ok for the environment, as i know there are many side effects to drilling and water contamination, I've seen it first hand. I will stand by my words though, SOME frac fluids are safe, which include most that are used in the marcellus. I've drank "Crosslinked" beer before at my old work a couple years ago, and i'm living today.

[electricmeg]

@crosbo67 I truly appreciate your input and would like to learn more about "non-toxic" frack water. But perhaps, ultimately, the issues that concern most of us are the risks to fresh water (which can be the frack water as well as all of the NORMs that are released during the process), the environment, public health, property values, the infrastructure etc etc etc. Unfortunately the rest of these issues don't get much attention during the leasing process. 

[electricmeg]

@crosbo67 Also, I would love to hear more about your experience in the fracking industry.

[electricmeg]

HI crosbo67 - I'm just wondering if I can see you drink some of the "harmless" frac water? That would truly convince me that it's benign.

[meldaby22]

@electricmeg i'll swim in the pit!

[crosbo67]

sorry i can't paste the link i wanted to for some reason, just google the words "Environmentally friendly frac fluids" and click on the second link that shows up (from BJ services).

[crosbo67]

Here is an example. Every frac company has their own types of fluids, but all are similar. I worked in the industry for years so I know the straight facts, not the distorted facts that the media gives you.

[electricmeg]

Hi crosbo67 - I would love to know where you're getting your information from.... because during my year long research on this subject I have come across only the opposite information - as have many hundreds of other people. Frac fluids drinkable?!!!!! and yes, the major problem we are dealing with is when fresh water gets contaminated, but there are so many other complicated, connected issues as well.

[crosbo67]

On last comment, remember that methane is what is being produces as a gas, along with lots of other small chained hydrocarbons. The condensate fluids also come out of these wells that are toxic as well. Once the frac fluid comes in contact with condensates and formation water, it will also be toxic. Once the frac fluid pumped, contacts the formation and flows back it will be toxic, but on the way down, it isn't.

[crosbo67]

Hydrocarbon based frac fluids are often used in deep oil wells (~3000m) because the wells are sensitive to water. These fluids are extremely toxic, but so is the crude oil these wells are producing. For gas wells such as marcellus, the fluids must pass a "microtox" test if fracing will occur near any water zones. These frac fluids are drinkable. Again, the problem is when fracing causes a connection between a water zone and a gas zone. This is the cause flammable water from people's taps.

[ThreeBallz]

@crosbo67

and this is acceptable to you.... of but your just focusing on your "drinkable" frac fluid.... but it's OK to have flammable gas in our water.... i am reading your posts... and see that you worked in the industry so your comments are the one's that are "biased". Or perhaps you are in denial that you have contributed to the destruction of the environment and the future of our children. "drink your water Billy" "But it tastes horrible and I saw daddy lighting it on fire". lol

[crosbo67]

There are hundreds of types of frac fluid used designed for each type of formation and zone of exploration. Most frac fluid require 500-1000 cP of viscosity, which require additives that are often very toxic. In the case of Marcellus, they are doing "Slickwater" treatments that only require ~10cp of viscosity. They use materials similar to guar (found in ice cream) to get this small viscosity.

[electricmeg]

By the way.... most Marcellus Gas will be sold abroad; not used in the US. It is not clean energy, and it will not wean us off foriegn oil.

[electricmeg]

If you study ANY of the accidents in the past year alone on the east coast, you will find complete annihilation anywhere where "frack water" has spilled, either above or below the surface of the earth. There IS bad stuff that comes up with the gas - including radon and methane, but what goes down is a death cocktail of neurotoxins, carcinogens and mutagens. If you have signed a contract under the impression that hydrofracking is safe, I urge you to contact your local citizens' group.

[crosbo67]

Marcellus shale is fraced with what is called "Slickwater" which today use 100% environmentally friendly chemicals (food grade polymers to increase viscosity) in their recipes. If these chemical do enter water zones the only concern is it can provide food for bacteria, but this is eliminated with chlorine(which we drink every day). The concern of fracing is it can cause communication of gas zones with water zones, causing contamination. The frac chemical however, are completely safe.

[electricmeg]

Moop87 - I accidentally deleted your comment when I was trying to respond!! Yikes!

I have never heard of them NOT using the 5% chemical brew. Can you tell me where you get your information so I can check it out?

[MrJosephSchmoe]

If we drill for gas anywhere it should be on the island of manhattan. They have already bulldozed and paved their landscape and polluted their rivers to the point that they will not sustain life. That is where all the pipelines ultimately end up anyway, and these are the clowns that will be heating their buildings and powering their lights with the fuel. Its a win win

[electricmeg]

Hi Joe Schmoe -

I agree, NYC and big cities like that are not sustainable. There's 9 million people in NYC.... that's a lot of energy needs! But having lived there for 18 years, I totally understand the benefits of having a population center like that. It's a fundamental center of learning, culture, politics, finance, and all sorts of other important human achievements. They are making a huge effort to turn it into a Green City, which is not an overnight job by any means!

[slcloveskms]

wow. u are truely uneducated. how do u heat your home in the winter or get to work? u should get on your hands and knees and thank the oil and gas industry for your lazyness.

[electricmeg]

I heat my house with wood. I work at home, so I only have to drive to the grocery store and if they had continued fueling cars with peanut oil, as they did a hundred years ago, that would be a very good thing. Humanity lived without petroleum products for 25,000 years. Perhaps you should educate yourself my friend. It's a big wide world out there, full of things you might learn if you just opened your mind...

[electricmeg]

After they drill the hole, they force millions of gallons of the toxic solution into the earth to force the gas out - this has been known to cause cracks in the earth, including earthquakes. Storage of the fluid after the frack is also a very vulnerable stage. Then, after they are finished with a well, they have to get rid of the toxic fluid, and have been known to dump it wherever people aren't looking. So, from what I understand there are 3 possible points of contamination.

[SyracuseSoothsayer]

Meg, at what points in the drilling process do you fear chemical leaks. I mean specific points. There are a number of steps in the process. Thanks.

[gazzer]

I don't believe the gas company, there are horror stories.

 Money talks.