Elizabeth Peyton Live Forever at the NEW MUSEUM

[ZaneOneTwo]

But in all honesty this is Crap.

[ZaneOneTwo]

Damn I hate all these art snob hipsters! I've been painting for years and your vision is your vision! There is no right or wrong in creation.

[ludalo]

"if she was..." but she is not... and this is art now, not 2 centuries ago.

[popeyeisgood]

she is only partially responsible for continuously making shitty work with no substances in it. those stupid patrons and greedy dealers/ museum curators are also responsible. she could sucks all her life making bad painting and no one can point at her and tell her that's wrong. but with the money and frame she got one wonders why people would actually regard these terrible garbage as anything worth being put into a museum. to me the museum lost all its credibility because of it.

[popeyeisgood]

*fame i meant..

I also think larry qualls's comment is the result of the way the grad schools are operating now, not the artists/students themselves. i agree that when you walk into an open studio day or a thesis show they are usually filled with crap. but that has a lot to do with the way the candidates were being chosen. a vicious cycle, more artists dreaming of making it by going to grad schools and more grad schools pushing certain 'looks' or 'style' by admitting these people.

[TheRk1111]

There's nothing like bad "high art " that is so low key it is passed off as cutting edge. This kind of brushwork has been going on since A. Ryder, the last years of Picasso, F.Bacon and was dynamic and new as apposed to derivative and hollow to the senses; Immature angst in a stunted idea. And, that curator working on this her entire life? If thats the case please stop what you are doing and go find some high "high" or high "bad" art.

[ketchumart]

Elizabeth Peyton reminds me a lot of Alice Neel, only with less grit and personality. Painting celebrities can be well and good, though the stylization is redundant. Her painting is "fine" in that the color shines and her paint handling is swift / efficient. However, I am surprised by her powerhouse status in the art world.

[Thadfrog]

crap

[darkmiguel3]

while i apretiate the way the work was done she just seems like the norman rockwell of our time. if her work is conceptual i dont know im not feeling that part its probably there but in a very sutle way

[claureic]

I like her paintings, but when you watch this video right after Philip Guston's small paintings, it's like drinking sweet grape juice right after a great Burgundy...

[radioslashmusicmixer]

While I found the shakiness of the video rather difficult to watch even for James Kalm I did enjoy the opportunity to see the show and couple of comments. I found that the speaker seemed almost embarrassed when interviewed and this coexisted with the other critic seeing her work as graduate student work. This brings me to wonder what the difference between her work and thousands of students or artists might be. Nevertheless there seems to be some special intangible presence in her paintings.

[Frvescent]

thanks, interesting to see and hear your commentary

[NiklasBlaAndersson]

I have made a drawing/mixed media artpiece inspired from a painting done by elizabeth peyton. It's on my channel. come check it out. She is truely an amazing artist!

5 stars!

[JoleneMKoch]

This video doesn't do her work justice. You need to see it in real life. Then you can truely make judgements of it.

Personally, I very much like her works. Her choice of mediums and how they're used is fantastic.

[bloodmakesnois]

a mi me gusta, ¿porque el artista debe siempre impactar con alguna nueva técnica o mensaje en su obra?, no estoy de acuerdo, me gustan sus retratos simples y ambiguos, los colores rojos de los labios, los dibujos a lápiz y creo que representa el gusto contemporaneo de esta época

[KaosOrdered]

no siempre debe impactar con nueva tecnica, pero por lo menos una muestra de talento no solo hacer algo con reminiscencias de pinturas de un adolescente. lo peor que puede hacer un pintor es ser empapelado de la pared.

[IzzyIsou]

Love how that critic called - this stuff sucks. No theories, no B.S, it just sucks.

Some of these "artists" get into galleries and museums, and have others collecting them, but it DOES NOT mean they are any good.

This stuff is bland, unimaginative and carries no resonance (yawn).

[dedprofet]

What horrible muck, she is definitely what's wrong with painting today. She has no talent so she pretends to be clever. How does anyone take this shit seriously if I were at that exhibition I would have openly laughed at the farce that is Elizabeth peyton.

[MrWowforever]

i'm not a big fan of her work...but if you were to openly laugh at her work in the show at the new museum......nobody would care, beyond seeing you as a pisser in the church, which is more of a cliche than miss peytons paintings

[dedprofet]

well you berating me for being being a pisser is more of a cliché than me being a pisser... now anyone with half a wit can use the word cliché...use a thesaurus.

[MrWowforever]

tartar sauce

[dedprofet]

Thanks Spongebob....

[MrWowforever]

thanks patrick

[adhesive16]

Relational Aesthetics, really ? Someone should explain to the curator that simply being married to Rirkirt, (there by being related and having relations) Does NOT make you a relational aesthetics artist. By her rationale of "participatory life long project" our interactions, videos, and messages on youtube can be situated as relational participatory communal projects as well, and perhaps more so than representational paintings. I agree with home slice GRAD School work :o( Thanks 4 the video

[cpkelley]

Her work is almost like smudgy, brushy Alex Katz..or more like like his studies that I saw at Phillips Academy in Andover, MA a while ago. It's intimate, but gimmicky and from magazines. Some days I enjoy it, others I'm indifferent. It will be interesting to see how her work holds up over time. I do agree with much of the criticism posted here.

[0602rockyrocket]

I love it when a critic actually calls it the way it really is, no bullshit! the truth is, she straight up sucks as a painter!!! anyone in the right gallery with hype behind them, can be considered a great painter. period!!!

[vrgneto]

hi! Thanks for posting this video. Im a art student from Brazil and Im making a work about E.Peyton and this came in the right time!

[claureic]

Hi,

I am a French collector living in Brazil. I own an E. Peyton painting. If you need any help with your work, and if I can help you, let me know...

[Savorist]

In terms of raw talent, Peyton is nothing special. I mean, if she was in the 18th century, she'd be laughed out of the museum for her lack of precision. The only thing that makes her work worthwhile is that she PAINTS revolutionary people like Kurt Cobain or Eminem - she reaps the benefits of their fame and legacy by painting them... I don't know... nothing special to me. Cute paintings, but memorable? No.

[hankjunior]

If Elizabeth Peyton was a band, she would be a Garage Band with a string of number one hits.

I like her work.

[RichardCorral]

i don't like her paintings. they suck. nice colors though.

[zipthwung]

relational esthetics seems like another name for beuysian green party stuff or kaprows happenings - if portrait painting is relational then i guess everything relates, and im not related.

[spawndawnacl]

Here at least there are no sacred boundaries of the art conversation. Luscious color comes straight from every tube for all of us. That much polish on the statement sounded like an apology or at least a well earned nervousness. The only part of Cobain that I admire is his music. I come down with the palsy when exposed to interviews, notebooks, DVD's and posters. Paintings of posters don't lessen the effect. Very, very forgetable.

[claureic]

I read the Momus piece on Peyton. If so many people dismiss her art the way he and Qualls do, then there is surely something good in it...

[humbcam]

Elizabeth Peyton is great!

[claureic]

There is a small orange painting in the show (Piotr, 1996) that is framed as if it were a Vermeer, with a huge dark wooden frame (the painting was on the cover of the monography Rizzoli did on Peyton in 2005). It appears on the video. I think that frame also says a lot about the collector's ego...I had the same sorry experience once when I saw a Dubuffet painting imprisoned in a huge tacky golden frame. It really killed the painting, as I am sure it would have killed the artist to see it...

[jameskalm]

Ive actually spent about twenty years exploring the question of the frame in relation to painting. This is a complex conceptual realm, a boarder between art and everything else. What happens within that boarder? Does it extend to the gallery, the museum, the Art Media? Read Derridas The Truth in Painting, a cornerstone of Post-Modernist theory.

[claureic]

Interestingly, you can sometimes say that the frame cuts off the work of art from the rest of the world, but you can also maintain the opposite, as Bacon did, saying that the frame and the glass shield both serve as an entrance into the realm of art. I'll follow your advice and try and read Derrida...

[LawrenceCharlesMille]

Frames are a problem for me. Bacon's framed paintings impressed me at his Met show. As I recall they were all the same. And the large paintings were all about the same size.

Recently I saw a bunch of my paintings from the 1970's hanging without frames. Wooden panels. Very energetic. And I thought they needed to be framed lest the energy run off the walls. I'll read Derrida. Thanks.

[claureic]

One thing that I find disappointing, from what I can guess through the video, is the fact that many paintings are framed. You just don't want to add a frame to a Peyton painting, because the frame hides that gesso underlayer that James very rightly points out in his comment and that is part of the work itself. It just doesn't make any sense to frame a Peyton work...

[MrWowforever]

it's probably because the prices are rather high and the collectors want to protect the investment, but i completely agree...i always hate frames on ALL paintings. imagine the edge of a Reubens or a Dali (all that illusion rolling of a flat plane)...Rothko's edges are like clouds falling off an envelope:)

[McCainTheTurdburglar]

I know you, I read your reviews on Amazon! LOL! You know your stuff. Anyway, I appreciate the detailed reviews. And I appreciate the videos James.

[cpkelley]

I've been interested in Peyton's work since 1999 or so. It's interesting to see this and especially seeing how much her career has evolved in the last couple years. Her work seems so immediate (fast brush strokes). Does anyone know her speed of execution/production? Are these one day paintings? As always, thank you for posting an amazing collection of videos. These are important documents.

[LawrenceCharlesMille]

The work is alive. The conceptual talk goes over my head. Alice Neel of her generation? Thanks James. Best-

[monkcycle]

Is figurative art today that is conceptual to be visually enticing/luring and informed with the standards of the past? Peyton, is working in a very straightforward figurative manner that cannot but be compared to the standards of masters. This is where she unfortunately fails (just as so much of e. fischl's work). Someone like Hockney is 'right in the middle'. Is to be conceptual to mean a loss of 'standards'; particularly with figurative work? Does anyone know or state the differences?!

[jameskalm]

Not to paint Peyton with too broad a brush but, conceptualism today seems a convenient devise to cloak just about every sin out there, whether incompetence, cynicism, narcissism or blatant greed. Because its become an excuse for everything, it means nothing. Probably a harbinger signaling the end of trendy conceptualism. JK

[MrWowforever]

All thoughts are based on concepts, so all thought is conceptual. An Agnes Martin painting is as conceptual as a Joseph Kosuth installation. Conceptual Art is an oxymoronic term that has trickled down to imply that some work has more "concepts of a higher order", and therefore it's smarter. This leads to misconceptions like 'dumb painters'. All work (abstract,figurative,text-base­d,photo,video,etc.)is equally capable of producing that special something :)just my opinion:)

[RonSchira]

agreed

[jameslour]

very well said. bravo

[claureic]

I own paintings by Guston, Twombly and Peyton. Put them in the same room and you really get a kick out of it. "Grad student work", when she is one of the great colorists active on the contemporary scene...I think it is very easy to make such a negative criticism without justifying anything. That guy embodies the saying that cricticism is the power of the impotent (la puissance des impuissants).

[jameskalm]

Dear claureic,

I own paintings by Guston, Twombly and Peyton Youre just my kind of art lover. If you want a real kick, you can come by my studio any time. JK

[claureic]

Hi James,

I am a French collector who lives in Brazil. Next time I travel to NYC, it will be a pleasure. In the meantime, I shall keep enjoying your videos.

[claureic]

Outstanding video James. Congratulations.

[RonSchira]

Not all critics are like that, but it seems to me that Qualls is approaching this from an academic training perspective and not accepting the conceptual. It reminds me of my financial advisor's comment to me about selling my art, "Does it make money because it's good art, or is it good art because it makes money?" I like her work for the reason she is an original and never wavers from her first impulse, and I am an art critic, thanks JK

[monkcycle]

thanks james,

you are a very generous man with your commitment to the videos. i appreciate that. i know peyton is a 'superstar' (and take note that i wish any artist to be one and succeed to the 'nth' degree); but she truly is mediocre and larry qualls knows what he is talking about. most people/artists see no difference between a holbien, manet, hockney and peyton- when they should be able to describe those differences...

[McCainTheTurdburglar]

Kinda cool to see what Peter Schjeldahl looks like. As far as the art, I'm not digging it but she's a art world superstar so I guess plenty do. More power to 'em.

I wonder how the economy is going to effect sales for those at the top like Peyton.

[MrWowforever]

Artists at the top of the sales pyramid like Miss Peyton are usually collected by collectors at the top of the collectors pyramid(lots of money and passion for collecting). She will continue to appeal, it's everyone else who will suffer; all of us emerging artists:(

[jameskalm]

Hey Wowster,

You cant have painting with out pain.

Click the Statistics & Data bar and follow the link to iMomus, livejournal ein Berliner bolgger with an insightful post on Payton titled Peyton Place or altermodern. Its a good read, thanks iMomus.

[MrWowforever]

thanks for the tip mr. kalm.....seems like lots of pain is coming, maybe the rents will go down:)

[MrWowforever]

The imomus piece brings up some valid points, her choices are related to fandom, her taste. this has always bored me, like imomus, i find her 'tastes' rather conventional for an artist. she's making this an issue by showing us her choices, and they bore me, or, they don't surprise me. But, for me, her paint handling is more the subject than her literal subjects. She's a pretty good painter, but not my cup of tea:)

[MrWowforever]

Fandom=Populism=Peyton....look­ at how fast the view count is rising!

[claureic]

This is what I meant, Mr Wowforever, and I totally agree with your point that her paint handling is the subject. The fact that as a person, she may have boring tastes is of minor importance in my opinion.

[MrWowforever]

Sure....as a person she may have boring tastes, but as an artist she is choosing to make her (boring)choices the subjects of her paint handling. this is were she loses me and gains a lot of questionable attention.imomus' point, i think, is that artists should/could be vehicles for a subversive taste menu instead of serving up culturally over-exposed celebrities. I like her paint handling, but i think the Cecily Brown show up now serves paint handling up in much more interesting ways, for me:)

[claureic]

Boring subjects do not necessarily make boring paintings (look at Morandi...). If you look at Peyton's later portraits (Matthew Barney), I don't think the subject and the way she painted it are boring. She is beginning to become less of a Vanity Fair artist then maybe she was before. As for the Cecily Brown show, I will only be able to savor it from the book I ordered at Amazon's.I trust your word on that, even though I think that De Kooning already exhausted the subject long before she did...

[MrWowforever]

Morandis 'subjects' are wonderfully boring, they have no involvement with the MEDIA. Mrs. Peytons choices are richer lately, she's growing up. BUT, the notion that Dekooning ,or anyone, exhausted any 'subject' is crazy! Everything is available to me as a painter, EVERYTHING. Art cannot be exhausted, only artists.Invention and pure will can overcome anything, even Dekooning.

[claureic]

OK. Let me rephrase: when I look at a Cecily Brown, I see a weaker De Kooning; that is all I meant...

[MrWowforever]

i know, i'm just being difficult:)

[McCainTheTurdburglar]

Hey MrWow, have you seen the Sue Williams show at David Zwirner? They sorta remind me of some of DeKooning's later paintings- although kinda cartoony. I think they're gorgeous. Violent and gorgeous at the same time.

[MrWowforever]

no...but i've seen her shift over the years from the early 'aggressive' work to the painterly transformation of that energy. I saw some paintings four years ago that looked good...is it still up?

[McCainTheTurdburglar]

youtube user ballenato63 has a walk through up. Check it out.

[MrWowforever]

yeah.. they remind me of Giles Lyon, Inka Essenhigh, kenny scharf and then Carrol Dunham and then Peter Saul and then .....it feels a little familiar is my point, competent, but not the best

[MrWowforever]

thanks for the tip:)

[jameskalm]

I was at the opening, unfortunatly too much video backlog to record, but I found the work obviously derivative of Arturo Herreras. Theres a whole school of Williamsburg artists who are making the same pictures.

[McCainTheTurdburglar]

Thanks James. Will have to look up Arturo Herreras as I'm not familiar with him.

[blackberryjuice1]

haters haters everywhere... "grad student work" LOL.

[jameskalm]

It's not about hate, its a question of aesthetics.

[jordanyounce]

Wow, I didnt know art critics were that...agressive about judgement. Great video...thanks for adding it.