It's not a joke. However, my beliefs have refined significantlysince the making of this video (which admittedly isn't very good). Even though I have grown deeper into my faith, the world has much better defenders of the Gospels than I. Knowing what I know, I probably would not have made this video, or I would have, at least, made it much differently.
It has opened the door some great conversations between myself and good people like yourself, so it's not all bad.
@Drandon It's good to hear that you're not trapped by your own dogmatism. Sometimes we need to ask ourselves 'What if I'm wrong?' before we can learn anything new. All the best with your journey. Pop by my channel for some further challenges to your faith ;-)
THE "WORLD" & THE PEOPLE OF IT ARE GOING TO FACE HORRIFIC CONSEQUENCE FOR THEIR ACTIONS. THE HATE IN THE COMMENTS PROVES ALL THE MORE HOW EVIL AND NASTY THEY ARE, NOTHING U SAY OR DO WILL UPSET ME OTHER THAN I KNOW WHERE YOUR HEADED I WILL FEEL SORROW WHEN U PASS THRU ON YOUR WAY TO ETERNAL DAMNATION, GOD IS JUST AND THIS HE WILL STAND UPON. THE DEVIL CAN HAVE THIS WORLD AND ALL THE DEMONS IN IT, BUT KNOW HE WONT BE RULING BUT BE BURNING RIGHT ALONG SIDE OF YOUR ETERNAL SOUL.
You are a troll, a sad little redneck sitting there in the dark preaching into your camera at night, trying to convince yourself as you sit there and speak that what you're saying isn't complete bullshit. I'm feel so bad that you will live your life feeling like you have to trudge through it, just waiting to go to heaven. You will miss the beauty of life, the fragility and preciousness, just waiting for something that wont come.
I was a christian for 17 years, I was steeped in the bible and it's wisdom, I still agree with most everything as far as pertaining to morality though some of it is skewed and dated. And no nothing traumatic made me lose my faith or anything, I owe that to logical thought and further understanding of science. I have a full understanding of Christianity and its "basics." I love that you think im ill-informed of Christianity...and that's why I disagree with you. It's not, you're just wrong
Oh god you're they guy commenting on imrational's videos...you make yourself sound like a fool, you believe the impossible things in the bible? You really think that noah got 2 of all animals on a ship? Why is there not a concentration of all animals in one area?
Anyway, to think that God made Jesus into a sacrifice to "appease" himself is sick. it's like a crush video or something. People like you are single handedly slowing the progression of mankind. you are a disgrace to the species
Perhaps the only thing of import that you said in this entire post is "Oh God". That's a good place for you to start, because I don't think that I will have the answers you seek.
A disgrace to the species? That's new. However your insults are simply a confirmation of what God promised for those who follow Christ, i.e. mockery and persecution.
So, by your insults you have fulfilled His prophecy, strengthened my resolve, and run Smack into his sovereign will.
@Drandon If you would like to have a serious discussion about Christianity and the atrocoties committed for and by God I would love to. I would love to show you how you and I are more moral and "good" than God, or how Christianity is the single most oppressive regime that mankind has ever known. If you wish to debate with me please be ready to think logically and rationally...leave your mysticism at home
Nothing about such a conversation would be serious or useful. It would be a silly effort on both our parts. The fact is, until John 6:44 happens for you, nothing I say will change your mind about God. If you do read it substitute the word "draws" for "drags" because that is the original Greek meaning fo the word.
Besides I visited your channel, and have discovered you to be a fellow guitar player. I can no longer have a beef with you according to The Guitarists Handbook. :-P
I honestly wonder what makes you think YOUR "god" is the correct god? Perhaps you're following the wrong god and will still burn in hell...Who knows right? ^^
Why does it matter to you what I believe? Even though I welcome, and enjoy the discussion, these repeated attempts atheistic evangelism seem a little strange to me, especially from the "don't force your beliefs on me" crowd.
Maybe you could explain the motivation behind them.
@Drandon lol I'll take that as an "I don't know" on your part.
P.S. I wasn't trying to convert you as you're obviously implying, I couldn't care less what religion you are, I simply wanted you to tell me WHY your god was the correct god.
You obviously care what I believe, or else why even enter the conversation? I can site scripture, but you will not accept that. I can tell you of miraculous personal experience, but you will discount it as coincidence.
John 6:44 answers this perfectly. None of us can come to God, lest he drags us into his presence in the first place. I will never have an answer for you that you haven't already heard, and rejected.
Sorry, Sin, There is only one real truth, and I am not its source.
@Drandon Unfortunately that line does not explain why your god is THE god. Most religions have scripture to follow. Although personal experience is credible for you, it is not for the general public. For example, I have many personal experiences leaning towards my own theory that I am God. Why would you believe me? For someone who seems so eager to spread the word of your god, you've come across as quite useless in my opinion...Thank you for your time Sir.
You asked me, specifically, why I believe. The problem is a majority of those ques have come by way of scripture and personal experience.
And that's the point. Believing in Christ is not about religion. It's about a relationship which can't be taught. It has to be sought first genuinely, so it can be fully experienced later.
As it stands now, you ARE your own god, and nothing I say can change that. I would rather be truthful and useless, than waste my time chasing bad fruit.
Personal experience is subjective, and not usable as evidence....unless you would like to get torn apart in peer review. Please, cite scripture all you want, because everyone can cite scripture, and can use it to justify any view they like.
I don't site scripture as proof, except when I'm talking to fellow believers. It is a fruitless effort when dealing with atheists. Science does not specifically support the God of the Bible, nor does it refute it.
Since there are more than a few Christians who (wrongly) accept evolution as the means of God's creation, that would be evidence that, we, as a whole, have more freedom to explore what is truth than those who, for whatever reason, have completely discarded God.
The analogy in the video is admittedly a simplistic one. My question is, why wouldn't you want to take what has been freely offered?
The question I ask myself, if faced with ultimate judgment on my life, are there things that I have done which deserve punishment. I can't speak for you, but for me the answer is yes, I've done lots of things that deserve punishment.
God doesn't want me to burn. He made a way so that I don't have to.
I guess Jesus learned what it was like to be an Amalokite infant.At lleast they did'nt smasj Jesus' skull in.Tell me when did Jesus unequivocally denounce slavery??? =/
Jesus did not come into this world to challenge all of its social and political sins. His purpose was so much bigger than that. It was larger, even, than the salvation it eventually granted.
The Amalokites attacked the Jews first, while they were weak and hungry, as they were escaping from Egypt. Their eventual destruction was retaliation for that attack. 1 Sam 15:2
Harsh? Absolutely. But you'll never hear me say that God is fuzzy-wuzzy. He is very dangerous. Period.
@Drandon You have no idea what this character did.You have only stories what a bunch of thug collated into a book.Your explanation is a ratinalization for a belief system.The sooner you realize this the sooner your mind will be free.
Let me clarify something. I'm not religious. I don't follow a dogma. I used to be an agnostic, looking at this from the outside in, wondering what the Hell people saw in God.
But what happened inside of me is more than mere religion. Maybe I'm delusional, or crazy. But seriously, how much more open-minded can a person be, to believe the things I do?
I am freer now than I ever was as an agnostic. And I wouldn't trade this peace for anything.
Jesus suffered a bad weekend for our sins, terminal cancer patients suffer more than Jesus ever did.
Atheists are angry because the PRIMARY ROADBLOCK to all social, moral and political progress in this country is fed, fostered and tethered to religious faith. Religious faith is a cancer that saps ones ability to think critically, and degrades attempts at progress. Religion already set us back about 1,000 years with the Dark Ages, and I'm not set to see that happen again.
How then, did we make it to be the most powerful, technologically advanced country in the world, where even the poorest people in this country are richer than 85% of the rest of the ENTIRE world? With such a largely religious populace?
The vast majority of scientists are of a religious faith. Physicists have the highest number of atheists, about 42% of them, and yet, science trudges forward.
So let me ask you. Are you willing to go the China route, and imprison Christians?
Cont. OK, so you don't like religion I get it. But atheists sound ridiculous when they start blathering on about the dark ages, and Inquisitions, which occurred centuries ago - and largely involved the oppressing of CHRISTIANS.
If you're truly concerned about religious oppression, then you need to be speaking out against:
a.) Islamo-fascist nations like Saudi Arabia, and Iran, and..
b.) Atheist nations like China, Vietnam, Burma, and North Korea, which imprison and murder Christians.
Religion is one of the most divisive influences extant. It easily creates In-group/out-group thinking and promotes violence and ignorance. The Dark Ages and the Inquisitions were times of power for the church, and had heretics afraid to study, for fear the church would retard progress, and then torture them for fun.
I'm speaking out against all religions, as they're all needless, vapid and a drain on resources that could easily be spent doing better things.
China, Burma, North Korea, and Vietnam are nations run by atheist dictatorships which oppress millions of the religious, especially Christians.
I do not blame this on atheism. Just as I do not blame the Inquisitions on Christians, or even Catholics. The human heart, is at its core, evil, and there will always be oppressors looking for a way to submit the masses.
I'll ask again - do you think religion should be outlawed if it is so dangerous?
I would never outlaw religion. I firmly believe, as our founders, many of them not Christian did. You have the right, endowed by the collective will of the people of this nation, to believe whatever codswallop you wish, so long as your beliefs and activities do not contravene the rights of other citizens.
The separation of church and state is important because when the church is in power, things really get nasty.
'Condoms cause AIDS' says the pope. What a fallible retard.
Cite the source of your figures, as they seem to be laughably bad, and nowhere near an accurate representation of the state of reality. The more educated we become, the more we eschew religious faith and all of its inane trappings.
We became the most powerful and technologically advanced country in the world thanks to the founding fathers, who framed a secular nation that would provide freedom for all, and an entrepreneurial spirit at its heart.
The point which you completely glossed over, is that a majority of the people who make this country work from farmers to scientists, believe in a higher power. All your whining about Christians is stupid on the surface, because the vast majority of the people who've made this country great - are Christians, or believers in a God.
If what you say about Christianity is true we should be a third world nation, but we aren't. Be intellectually honest or move on to something else.
Half or more of the founding fathers of this very nation either found religion to be an absurd exercise in dicking around with supposed holy texts, or believed in deism. They understood the power of a secular constitution and the protection that a separate of church and state would allow. Thomas Jefferson could teach you something about intellectual honesty and school you about your 'beliefs' while still getting our founding documents written.
Hey Mizar, Google: number of scientists who believe in god.
The very first link gives a synopsis of the numbers I was talking about. It's on Live science (dot) com, which is not a Christian, or religious site, at all, and I believe the editors are largely pro-evolution. They just refuse to drown in the poison of political correctness, and intellectual dishonesty.
Hey Drandon, google the fields of all the scientists that you're talking about. I don't give two shits if a scientist studying hydrodynamics believes in god, because his field doesn't much relate to the whole debate. Look at Evolutionary Biologists, Cell Biologists, Paleontologists, etc. We need samples of the people who deal with life, and who understand the Biblical accounts of creation to be sorely lacking in sense and in explaining life or any of its mechanisms.
Stop reading wikipedia. Google: Number of scientists who believe in God. The second link is on a secular science website. The study results are vastly different than what you'll find on a user-contributed Wiki.
You mean the Japanese-Americans, and yes I do remember. I'm not sure how that's relevant, given that, while it was a horrible mistake, it had nothing to do with religion whatsoever.
So, I'll ask again. If Christianity is dangerous should the practice be outlawed?
Let me get this straight, you dismiss wikipedia & in turn point to google as a more valid source? The irony (not that I got tmy sources from wiki to begin with).
And yes it had nothing to do with religion, yet it does debunk your assumption of the higher moral ground held by a so-called Xian nation.
"So, I'll ask again..." - when did you ask the first time? Im not promoting atheist-state but a secular state as it was intended.
Secular is atheist by default? The very definition of secularism is a state seperate from religion, neither endoring or denying.
And you say we already have one? Prop 8, Faith-based initiatives, 10 Commandments, religion taught as science, etc... not to mention how 1 cannto win votes without religious undertones... Clean the lens on fkn your glasses!!
I don't have a problem with secular society. I have no more desire for a church state than you do. I have a problem with the constant whining, and victimhood of people in this country who have no idea what real oppression and victimization actually is.
These are your examples of religious tyranny? Really? In Saudi Arabia if we were caught having this conversation we'd BOTH be murdered. Grow up. The world isn't always going to favor your worldview, and it shouldn't.
"constant whining, and victimhood of people in this country who have no idea what real oppression and victimization actually is". It sounds to me like youre saying we shouldnt "wine" about gay rights, womens rights, discrimination, education, or anything else because its not as bad in comparison to other countries that do worse? That not only sounded incredibly dismissive but stupid. Youre admitting things arent fair in this democracy but we should just "deal with it". Man, FUCK YOU
Nothing is fair, Key. Even the Bible says that. Besides with 6 billion opinions worldwide the only way to get a consensus on what's fair, is with brute force. That's what we saw centuries ago with the inquisitions, and that's what we see today in communist and/or theistic dictatorships.
You're not a victim. You can live like one, but, just know that an attitude of victimization will do you more harm than the most bigoted asshole ever could.
To be fair, the creationists are going about it the only way they can. When you get a paper about magic peer-reviewed, you know that you'll be crowned the new 'Court Jester' faster than ID got shot down as re-heated creationism in a can.
Their only way to get it recognized is to go for an end-run around all of the institutions in place to safeguard our youth.
Our country is supposed to be secular, meaning that the federal and state governments must have no say about religion. They can't endorse or deny any one religious viewpoint and must either support every single one, or support none. The founding fathers opted to have it support none because it's cheaper, easier, less stressful and indeed more free that way.
also do you really believe that if you are good you will go to a place up in the sky that is full of gold and pearls and everyone gets a mansion? Sounds exactly like gluttony and greed to me. But I thought there was no sin in the alleged heaven. Do you not understand that there is no such thing is infinite, infinite is a human devised idea...infinite is not real. Everything is finite, there is no eternity. if im wrong give me one example of something infinite. Something you can prove
Sorry buddy, but 'Congress shall make no law RESPECTING THE ESTABLISHMENT OF RELIGION' This means, quite explicitly (and can be corroborated with private notes and writings from the founding fathers) that Congress can make no laws that give benefit to, or the appearance of government support to any one religion to the exclusion of other viewpoints. Either they give all religious viewpoints the same power, or they give none of them the power. That's the heart of it.
Christ made an offer to you for you not to suffer the pain of the punishment he (or his dad) created for what they consider a sin without explanation. And you thank him?
You might as well thank the Dr who gave you the antidote to the very poison he infected you with in the first place.
Here's the rub, and this is what many find so difficult about Christianity. God does exactly what he wants, to whom he wants. Ultimately, I have to trust what the Book says: that he is "holy" and especially "just".
Because if he isn't, you guys are right. He's a tyrant. But he IS real. And I would gladly DIE for that belief. I do not have the right words to convert you. My hope is God reveals Himself instead.
The only hope you have beyond that, is that I'm mad as a hatter.
@Drandon-You sound defeated & you are wrong. You dont HAVE to trust what the book says. You can trust your own judgment. Within your comment I found nothing fear scared shitless to doubt/judge him for being a tyrant even though he acts like one simply out of the fear of a more powerful being threatening you with hell. He may be mightier but it doesnt make him right or just. Once the fear is gone the rest will follow. Until then, dont question & follow blindly like only a loving god would want
Boo Hoo, Jesus was so abused, Oh my, he suffered just like millions of others have. But then He got to pop back up and hold a nice fish fry for his buddies, the others didn't. Please tell me why Jesus didn't sacrifice himself to forgive original sin so that we could all return to the Garden? Was God just too dumb to think of that or perhaps that would have eliminated all those very human priests that depend on the gullible for their plush lifestyle.
Jesus sacrificed himself to spare you pain? Yet supposedly God's curse still stands and was not lifted by Jesus's death. If it were, christian women wouldn't suffer from the pains of childbirth.
That would make sense, except that God makes no such promise to Christians. In fact, if you look through the New Testament, what you find is Christians getting stoned, dragged, cut open, tortured, crucified, crucified upside down, disemboweled, and locked away into deep dungeons. The lucky ones get exiled.
The new covenant has nothing to do with erasing God's curse. It means the debt of my sin has been paid for. I will still suffer the hardships of this life. Just not alone.
So God still made everything, knowing that his creation would be imperfect, knowing that they would commit original sin, for which he would condemn them and curse them, and then send himself down as his son, to suffer for a couple of days to cleanse the debt of the sins that he created us to commit, only to have him rise up after his weekend of torture to be in heaven forever.
This is more laughably absurd than solipsism.....and just about as needless to bother with.
Yea, the problem is. The wealthy man who's offering you the money is actually also the judge. And you know who he's paying? himself. Is it gracious for someone to pay themself money because of a judgment he made about the breaking of laws which he intentionally designed in such a way that everybody, without exception, would break them. Generous indeed.
"So are you denying that God exists? Or do you just have a problem with God in general? "
I do deny that god exists. But I have a problem with the idea that people consider this to be "generous" behavior. I think the mental gymnastics you have to go through before you can consider that situation as anything but sadistic are quite extensive. The purpose of my post is to try to reveal the implications of the situation you're describing.
Imagine if your parents locked you in the basement of their house and threatened to torture you if you didn't devote your life to worshiping them and do everything they asked.
BUT, if you worship them and love them, they say they'll let you go without doing EVERYTHING they said. Yes, they're so generous to let you out of the cage they forced you into.
Darned time zones, caused by a planet that isn't fixed.
So no response from me until we rotate into the appropriate position once more and you confirm that you have read the appropriate lie that is Exodus and found that which you were unaware of.
You're either talking about the Ten Sepher Moses smashed, or the rather extensive list of detailed (and sometimes strange) instructions that God gives throughout Duet. and Exodus.
If it is the Sepher, then we have no idea what was on it, so it's moot. I assume the ten which made it are the most important to God.
If you're talking about the rest, then there are close to 260 "commandments" throughout the Bible, not just Exodus. What's your point?
Do correct me if I err here but, frok my memory of actually reading the bible, the story goes that Mister Moses calls a halt in the trek through the wilderness and, because he wants to talk to his divine friend in private, hike to the top of a convenient mountain, probably incorrectly called Sinai.
After quite a while, he shuffles back down bearing the oft-quoted ten commandments.
He is appalled to find that his people have fabricated a golden calf , somehow, and are devoting themselves to worshipping same.
Mo is so shocked and angry that he loses control of his upper extremities and drops the stone tablets bearing the first ten commandments and they shatter.
Hot diggety!
Now he admonishes his followers but has to sprint back up the said miount to get a second copy.
OK so far?
Rather oddly, the second ten are totally different from the first.
Depending on which version you read he didn't lose control, he got pissed and smashed them. For whatever reason they didn't make it in, so they aren't included in the original Decalogue.
it should have been clear that I was paraphrasing. I don't have an English language KJV in the house, only in Tagalog, which I do not speak.
Let's just say that, whenever I read the bible last, some years ago, this is what I remember reading.
Reason? - too much water under the bridge now. Can't recall. Too many real life things going on around me. The least of which is anything that includes a god. I have no time for such a monster as depicted.
Wow! Do you really believe this stuff?
I mean, if you're just having a joke, it's not very funny.
Listen to this vid through and ask yourself "what if everything I just said is all made up?"
calmreason 5 months ago
@calmreason
It's not a joke. However, my beliefs have refined significantlysince the making of this video (which admittedly isn't very good). Even though I have grown deeper into my faith, the world has much better defenders of the Gospels than I. Knowing what I know, I probably would not have made this video, or I would have, at least, made it much differently.
It has opened the door some great conversations between myself and good people like yourself, so it's not all bad.
Drandon 4 months ago
@Drandon It's good to hear that you're not trapped by your own dogmatism. Sometimes we need to ask ourselves 'What if I'm wrong?' before we can learn anything new. All the best with your journey. Pop by my channel for some further challenges to your faith ;-)
calmreason 4 months ago
THE "WORLD" & THE PEOPLE OF IT ARE GOING TO FACE HORRIFIC CONSEQUENCE FOR THEIR ACTIONS. THE HATE IN THE COMMENTS PROVES ALL THE MORE HOW EVIL AND NASTY THEY ARE, NOTHING U SAY OR DO WILL UPSET ME OTHER THAN I KNOW WHERE YOUR HEADED I WILL FEEL SORROW WHEN U PASS THRU ON YOUR WAY TO ETERNAL DAMNATION, GOD IS JUST AND THIS HE WILL STAND UPON. THE DEVIL CAN HAVE THIS WORLD AND ALL THE DEMONS IN IT, BUT KNOW HE WONT BE RULING BUT BE BURNING RIGHT ALONG SIDE OF YOUR ETERNAL SOUL.
starfire19752007 1 year ago
You are a troll, a sad little redneck sitting there in the dark preaching into your camera at night, trying to convince yourself as you sit there and speak that what you're saying isn't complete bullshit. I'm feel so bad that you will live your life feeling like you have to trudge through it, just waiting to go to heaven. You will miss the beauty of life, the fragility and preciousness, just waiting for something that wont come.
hebijebi03 1 year ago
Luke 6:22-23
22 Blessed are you when men hate you, and ostracize you, and insult you, and scorn your name as evil, for the sake of the Son of Man.
23 Be glad in that day and leap for joy, for behold, your reward is great in heaven For in the same way their fathers used to treat the prophets.
Thanks for the pick-me-up, NoRel.
Drandon 1 year ago
I love the way christians talk about Christ as if they were there and they know exactly what he was thinking.. it's hilarious!
xNoReligionx 1 year ago
I was a christian for 17 years, I was steeped in the bible and it's wisdom, I still agree with most everything as far as pertaining to morality though some of it is skewed and dated. And no nothing traumatic made me lose my faith or anything, I owe that to logical thought and further understanding of science. I have a full understanding of Christianity and its "basics." I love that you think im ill-informed of Christianity...and that's why I disagree with you. It's not, you're just wrong
hebijebi03 1 year ago
Oh god you're they guy commenting on imrational's videos...you make yourself sound like a fool, you believe the impossible things in the bible? You really think that noah got 2 of all animals on a ship? Why is there not a concentration of all animals in one area?
Anyway, to think that God made Jesus into a sacrifice to "appease" himself is sick. it's like a crush video or something. People like you are single handedly slowing the progression of mankind. you are a disgrace to the species
hebijebi03 1 year ago
Perhaps the only thing of import that you said in this entire post is "Oh God". That's a good place for you to start, because I don't think that I will have the answers you seek.
A disgrace to the species? That's new. However your insults are simply a confirmation of what God promised for those who follow Christ, i.e. mockery and persecution.
So, by your insults you have fulfilled His prophecy, strengthened my resolve, and run Smack into his sovereign will.
Thanks for reading.
Drandon 1 year ago
@Drandon If you would like to have a serious discussion about Christianity and the atrocoties committed for and by God I would love to. I would love to show you how you and I are more moral and "good" than God, or how Christianity is the single most oppressive regime that mankind has ever known. If you wish to debate with me please be ready to think logically and rationally...leave your mysticism at home
hebijebi03 1 year ago
@hebijebi03
Nothing about such a conversation would be serious or useful. It would be a silly effort on both our parts. The fact is, until John 6:44 happens for you, nothing I say will change your mind about God. If you do read it substitute the word "draws" for "drags" because that is the original Greek meaning fo the word.
Besides I visited your channel, and have discovered you to be a fellow guitar player. I can no longer have a beef with you according to The Guitarists Handbook. :-P
Drandon 1 year ago
I honestly wonder what makes you think YOUR "god" is the correct god? Perhaps you're following the wrong god and will still burn in hell...Who knows right? ^^
Sin355 1 year ago
@Sin355
Why does it matter to you what I believe? Even though I welcome, and enjoy the discussion, these repeated attempts atheistic evangelism seem a little strange to me, especially from the "don't force your beliefs on me" crowd.
Maybe you could explain the motivation behind them.
Drandon 1 year ago
@Drandon lol I'll take that as an "I don't know" on your part.
P.S. I wasn't trying to convert you as you're obviously implying, I couldn't care less what religion you are, I simply wanted you to tell me WHY your god was the correct god.
Sin355 1 year ago
@Sin355
You obviously care what I believe, or else why even enter the conversation? I can site scripture, but you will not accept that. I can tell you of miraculous personal experience, but you will discount it as coincidence.
John 6:44 answers this perfectly. None of us can come to God, lest he drags us into his presence in the first place. I will never have an answer for you that you haven't already heard, and rejected.
Sorry, Sin, There is only one real truth, and I am not its source.
Drandon 1 year ago
@Drandon Unfortunately that line does not explain why your god is THE god. Most religions have scripture to follow. Although personal experience is credible for you, it is not for the general public. For example, I have many personal experiences leaning towards my own theory that I am God. Why would you believe me? For someone who seems so eager to spread the word of your god, you've come across as quite useless in my opinion...Thank you for your time Sir.
Sin355 1 year ago
@Sin355
You asked me, specifically, why I believe. The problem is a majority of those ques have come by way of scripture and personal experience.
And that's the point. Believing in Christ is not about religion. It's about a relationship which can't be taught. It has to be sought first genuinely, so it can be fully experienced later.
As it stands now, you ARE your own god, and nothing I say can change that. I would rather be truthful and useless, than waste my time chasing bad fruit.
Drandon 1 year ago
@Drandon
Personal experience is subjective, and not usable as evidence....unless you would like to get torn apart in peer review. Please, cite scripture all you want, because everyone can cite scripture, and can use it to justify any view they like.
MizarShadow 1 year ago
@MizarShadow
I don't site scripture as proof, except when I'm talking to fellow believers. It is a fruitless effort when dealing with atheists. Science does not specifically support the God of the Bible, nor does it refute it.
Since there are more than a few Christians who (wrongly) accept evolution as the means of God's creation, that would be evidence that, we, as a whole, have more freedom to explore what is truth than those who, for whatever reason, have completely discarded God.
Drandon 1 year ago
Why do you get puniched for not wanna take that money
MyPerfectBehind 1 year ago
@MyPerfectBehind
Hello Perfect,
The analogy in the video is admittedly a simplistic one. My question is, why wouldn't you want to take what has been freely offered?
The question I ask myself, if faced with ultimate judgment on my life, are there things that I have done which deserve punishment. I can't speak for you, but for me the answer is yes, I've done lots of things that deserve punishment.
God doesn't want me to burn. He made a way so that I don't have to.
Drandon 1 year ago
I guess Jesus learned what it was like to be an Amalokite infant.At lleast they did'nt smasj Jesus' skull in.Tell me when did Jesus unequivocally denounce slavery??? =/
lipoicacid 1 year ago
@lipoicacid
Jesus did not come into this world to challenge all of its social and political sins. His purpose was so much bigger than that. It was larger, even, than the salvation it eventually granted.
The Amalokites attacked the Jews first, while they were weak and hungry, as they were escaping from Egypt. Their eventual destruction was retaliation for that attack. 1 Sam 15:2
Harsh? Absolutely. But you'll never hear me say that God is fuzzy-wuzzy. He is very dangerous. Period.
Drandon 1 year ago
@Drandon You have no idea what this character did.You have only stories what a bunch of thug collated into a book.Your explanation is a ratinalization for a belief system.The sooner you realize this the sooner your mind will be free.
awatersign 1 year ago
@awatersign
Hello, and thanks for that Watersign.
Let me clarify something. I'm not religious. I don't follow a dogma. I used to be an agnostic, looking at this from the outside in, wondering what the Hell people saw in God.
But what happened inside of me is more than mere religion. Maybe I'm delusional, or crazy. But seriously, how much more open-minded can a person be, to believe the things I do?
I am freer now than I ever was as an agnostic. And I wouldn't trade this peace for anything.
Drandon 1 year ago
Also, I really appreciate how cool you were in your comment. For what it's worth, bless you my friend.
Or if you're uncomfortable with the notion of blessings. May you be extremely lucky. 8-)
Drandon 1 year ago
Jesus suffered a bad weekend for our sins, terminal cancer patients suffer more than Jesus ever did.
Atheists are angry because the PRIMARY ROADBLOCK to all social, moral and political progress in this country is fed, fostered and tethered to religious faith. Religious faith is a cancer that saps ones ability to think critically, and degrades attempts at progress. Religion already set us back about 1,000 years with the Dark Ages, and I'm not set to see that happen again.
MizarShadow 1 year ago
@MizarShadow
How then, did we make it to be the most powerful, technologically advanced country in the world, where even the poorest people in this country are richer than 85% of the rest of the ENTIRE world? With such a largely religious populace?
The vast majority of scientists are of a religious faith. Physicists have the highest number of atheists, about 42% of them, and yet, science trudges forward.
So let me ask you. Are you willing to go the China route, and imprison Christians?
Drandon 1 year ago
@Drandon
Cont. OK, so you don't like religion I get it. But atheists sound ridiculous when they start blathering on about the dark ages, and Inquisitions, which occurred centuries ago - and largely involved the oppressing of CHRISTIANS.
If you're truly concerned about religious oppression, then you need to be speaking out against:
a.) Islamo-fascist nations like Saudi Arabia, and Iran, and..
b.) Atheist nations like China, Vietnam, Burma, and North Korea, which imprison and murder Christians.
Drandon 1 year ago
@Drandon
Lawl, atheist nations?
Religion is one of the most divisive influences extant. It easily creates In-group/out-group thinking and promotes violence and ignorance. The Dark Ages and the Inquisitions were times of power for the church, and had heretics afraid to study, for fear the church would retard progress, and then torture them for fun.
I'm speaking out against all religions, as they're all needless, vapid and a drain on resources that could easily be spent doing better things.
MizarShadow 1 year ago
@MizarShadow
China, Burma, North Korea, and Vietnam are nations run by atheist dictatorships which oppress millions of the religious, especially Christians.
I do not blame this on atheism. Just as I do not blame the Inquisitions on Christians, or even Catholics. The human heart, is at its core, evil, and there will always be oppressors looking for a way to submit the masses.
I'll ask again - do you think religion should be outlawed if it is so dangerous?
Drandon 1 year ago
@Drandon
I would never outlaw religion. I firmly believe, as our founders, many of them not Christian did. You have the right, endowed by the collective will of the people of this nation, to believe whatever codswallop you wish, so long as your beliefs and activities do not contravene the rights of other citizens.
The separation of church and state is important because when the church is in power, things really get nasty.
'Condoms cause AIDS' says the pope. What a fallible retard.
MizarShadow 1 year ago
@Drandon
Cite the source of your figures, as they seem to be laughably bad, and nowhere near an accurate representation of the state of reality. The more educated we become, the more we eschew religious faith and all of its inane trappings.
We became the most powerful and technologically advanced country in the world thanks to the founding fathers, who framed a secular nation that would provide freedom for all, and an entrepreneurial spirit at its heart.
MizarShadow 1 year ago
@MizarShadow
The point which you completely glossed over, is that a majority of the people who make this country work from farmers to scientists, believe in a higher power. All your whining about Christians is stupid on the surface, because the vast majority of the people who've made this country great - are Christians, or believers in a God.
If what you say about Christianity is true we should be a third world nation, but we aren't. Be intellectually honest or move on to something else.
Drandon 1 year ago
@Drandon
Half or more of the founding fathers of this very nation either found religion to be an absurd exercise in dicking around with supposed holy texts, or believed in deism. They understood the power of a secular constitution and the protection that a separate of church and state would allow. Thomas Jefferson could teach you something about intellectual honesty and school you about your 'beliefs' while still getting our founding documents written.
MizarShadow 1 year ago
@MizarShadow
Hey Mizar, Google: number of scientists who believe in god.
The very first link gives a synopsis of the numbers I was talking about. It's on Live science (dot) com, which is not a Christian, or religious site, at all, and I believe the editors are largely pro-evolution. They just refuse to drown in the poison of political correctness, and intellectual dishonesty.
Drandon 1 year ago
@Drandon
Hey Drandon, google the fields of all the scientists that you're talking about. I don't give two shits if a scientist studying hydrodynamics believes in god, because his field doesn't much relate to the whole debate. Look at Evolutionary Biologists, Cell Biologists, Paleontologists, etc. We need samples of the people who deal with life, and who understand the Biblical accounts of creation to be sorely lacking in sense and in explaining life or any of its mechanisms.
MizarShadow 1 year ago
@Drandon
Imperialism.
"The vast majority of scientists are of a religious faith".
Not just wrong, but outrageously wrong. Over 90% of scientists in the world are atheists.
"Are you willing to go the China route, and imprison Christians?"
Do you remember what we did to our Chinese-American citizens during the war?
Key2daUnderground 1 year ago
@Key2daUnderground
Stop reading wikipedia. Google: Number of scientists who believe in God. The second link is on a secular science website. The study results are vastly different than what you'll find on a user-contributed Wiki.
You mean the Japanese-Americans, and yes I do remember. I'm not sure how that's relevant, given that, while it was a horrible mistake, it had nothing to do with religion whatsoever.
So, I'll ask again. If Christianity is dangerous should the practice be outlawed?
Drandon 1 year ago
@Drandon
Let me get this straight, you dismiss wikipedia & in turn point to google as a more valid source? The irony (not that I got tmy sources from wiki to begin with).
And yes it had nothing to do with religion, yet it does debunk your assumption of the higher moral ground held by a so-called Xian nation.
"So, I'll ask again..." - when did you ask the first time? Im not promoting atheist-state but a secular state as it was intended.
Key2daUnderground 1 year ago
@Key2daUnderground
And what the hell is a Xian nation? I don't make any claim to higher moral ground.
"Im not promoting atheist-state but a secular state as it was intended."
Secular is atheist by default, and you already have it.
Drandon 1 year ago
@Drandon
Secular is atheist by default? The very definition of secularism is a state seperate from religion, neither endoring or denying.
And you say we already have one? Prop 8, Faith-based initiatives, 10 Commandments, religion taught as science, etc... not to mention how 1 cannto win votes without religious undertones... Clean the lens on fkn your glasses!!
Key2daUnderground 1 year ago
@Key2daUnderground
I don't have a problem with secular society. I have no more desire for a church state than you do. I have a problem with the constant whining, and victimhood of people in this country who have no idea what real oppression and victimization actually is.
These are your examples of religious tyranny? Really? In Saudi Arabia if we were caught having this conversation we'd BOTH be murdered. Grow up. The world isn't always going to favor your worldview, and it shouldn't.
Drandon 1 year ago
@Drandon
"constant whining, and victimhood of people in this country who have no idea what real oppression and victimization actually is". It sounds to me like youre saying we shouldnt "wine" about gay rights, womens rights, discrimination, education, or anything else because its not as bad in comparison to other countries that do worse? That not only sounded incredibly dismissive but stupid. Youre admitting things arent fair in this democracy but we should just "deal with it". Man, FUCK YOU
Key2daUnderground 1 year ago
@Key2daUnderground
Nothing is fair, Key. Even the Bible says that. Besides with 6 billion opinions worldwide the only way to get a consensus on what's fair, is with brute force. That's what we saw centuries ago with the inquisitions, and that's what we see today in communist and/or theistic dictatorships.
You're not a victim. You can live like one, but, just know that an attitude of victimization will do you more harm than the most bigoted asshole ever could.
Bless you, man.
Drandon 1 year ago
@Key2daUnderground
To be fair, the creationists are going about it the only way they can. When you get a paper about magic peer-reviewed, you know that you'll be crowned the new 'Court Jester' faster than ID got shot down as re-heated creationism in a can.
Their only way to get it recognized is to go for an end-run around all of the institutions in place to safeguard our youth.
MizarShadow 1 year ago
@Drandon
Our country is supposed to be secular, meaning that the federal and state governments must have no say about religion. They can't endorse or deny any one religious viewpoint and must either support every single one, or support none. The founding fathers opted to have it support none because it's cheaper, easier, less stressful and indeed more free that way.
MizarShadow 1 year ago
@MizarShadow
The Constitution says: "Congress shall make NO LAW..." regarding religion.
"No law" technically means they supposed be totally hands-off.
If they can make "no laws" the Supreme Court cannot make rulings on them. Thus, the governing or religion is left to the individual states.
Yet the Federal Government has completely usurped religious control from the states, in the name of secularism. Do you really believe this is better?
Drandon 1 year ago
also do you really believe that if you are good you will go to a place up in the sky that is full of gold and pearls and everyone gets a mansion? Sounds exactly like gluttony and greed to me. But I thought there was no sin in the alleged heaven. Do you not understand that there is no such thing is infinite, infinite is a human devised idea...infinite is not real. Everything is finite, there is no eternity. if im wrong give me one example of something infinite. Something you can prove
hebijebi03 1 year ago
@Drandon
Sorry buddy, but 'Congress shall make no law RESPECTING THE ESTABLISHMENT OF RELIGION' This means, quite explicitly (and can be corroborated with private notes and writings from the founding fathers) that Congress can make no laws that give benefit to, or the appearance of government support to any one religion to the exclusion of other viewpoints. Either they give all religious viewpoints the same power, or they give none of them the power. That's the heart of it.
MizarShadow 1 year ago
reaching out?
or reaching?
I would say grasping at a delusion!
3101010 1 year ago
@3101010
Thanks for watching.
Drandon 1 year ago
Christ made an offer to you for you not to suffer the pain of the punishment he (or his dad) created for what they consider a sin without explanation. And you thank him?
You might as well thank the Dr who gave you the antidote to the very poison he infected you with in the first place.
You make no sense.
Key2daUnderground 1 year ago
@Key2daUnderground
Here's the rub, and this is what many find so difficult about Christianity. God does exactly what he wants, to whom he wants. Ultimately, I have to trust what the Book says: that he is "holy" and especially "just".
Because if he isn't, you guys are right. He's a tyrant. But he IS real. And I would gladly DIE for that belief. I do not have the right words to convert you. My hope is God reveals Himself instead.
The only hope you have beyond that, is that I'm mad as a hatter.
Drandon 1 year ago
@Drandon-You sound defeated & you are wrong. You dont HAVE to trust what the book says. You can trust your own judgment. Within your comment I found nothing fear scared shitless to doubt/judge him for being a tyrant even though he acts like one simply out of the fear of a more powerful being threatening you with hell. He may be mightier but it doesnt make him right or just. Once the fear is gone the rest will follow. Until then, dont question & follow blindly like only a loving god would want
Key2daUnderground 1 year ago
Boo Hoo, Jesus was so abused, Oh my, he suffered just like millions of others have. But then He got to pop back up and hold a nice fish fry for his buddies, the others didn't. Please tell me why Jesus didn't sacrifice himself to forgive original sin so that we could all return to the Garden? Was God just too dumb to think of that or perhaps that would have eliminated all those very human priests that depend on the gullible for their plush lifestyle.
crossoldman 1 year ago
Jesus sacrificed himself to spare you pain? Yet supposedly God's curse still stands and was not lifted by Jesus's death. If it were, christian women wouldn't suffer from the pains of childbirth.
imrational 1 year ago 2
@imrational
That would make sense, except that God makes no such promise to Christians. In fact, if you look through the New Testament, what you find is Christians getting stoned, dragged, cut open, tortured, crucified, crucified upside down, disemboweled, and locked away into deep dungeons. The lucky ones get exiled.
The new covenant has nothing to do with erasing God's curse. It means the debt of my sin has been paid for. I will still suffer the hardships of this life. Just not alone.
Drandon 1 year ago
@Drandon
So God still made everything, knowing that his creation would be imperfect, knowing that they would commit original sin, for which he would condemn them and curse them, and then send himself down as his son, to suffer for a couple of days to cleanse the debt of the sins that he created us to commit, only to have him rise up after his weekend of torture to be in heaven forever.
This is more laughably absurd than solipsism.....and just about as needless to bother with.
MizarShadow 1 year ago
Yea, the problem is. The wealthy man who's offering you the money is actually also the judge. And you know who he's paying? himself. Is it gracious for someone to pay themself money because of a judgment he made about the breaking of laws which he intentionally designed in such a way that everybody, without exception, would break them. Generous indeed.
mrbluesky323 1 year ago
@mrbluesky323
So are you denying that God exists? Or do you just have a problem with God in general?
Drandon 1 year ago
This has been flagged as spam show
@Drandon
"So are you denying that God exists? Or do you just have a problem with God in general? "
I do deny that god exists. But I have a problem with the idea that people consider this to be "generous" behavior. I think the mental gymnastics you have to go through before you can consider that situation as anything but sadistic are quite extensive. The purpose of my post is to try to reveal the implications of the situation you're describing.
mrbluesky323 1 year ago
@mrbluesky323
(Continuation)...
Imagine if your parents locked you in the basement of their house and threatened to torture you if you didn't devote your life to worshiping them and do everything they asked.
BUT, if you worship them and love them, they say they'll let you go without doing EVERYTHING they said. Yes, they're so generous to let you out of the cage they forced you into.
mrbluesky323 1 year ago
first he was dragged kicking and screaming, and then he made a choice to do it for us? sorry, what?
kendrawhisp 1 year ago
Ten commandments?
There were TWENTY.
draagon66 1 year ago
@draagon66
Do tell.
Drandon 1 year ago
@Drandon
You mean to say that you haven't read your bible?
Come now - it's your instruction manual.
OK - just read the fabrication entitled Exodus.
When you have done your research as suggested, then you'll know.
draagon66 1 year ago
i'm off to sleep now.
Darned time zones, caused by a planet that isn't fixed.
So no response from me until we rotate into the appropriate position once more and you confirm that you have read the appropriate lie that is Exodus and found that which you were unaware of.
G'night, Jim Boy.
draagon66 1 year ago
@draagon66
You're either talking about the Ten Sepher Moses smashed, or the rather extensive list of detailed (and sometimes strange) instructions that God gives throughout Duet. and Exodus.
If it is the Sepher, then we have no idea what was on it, so it's moot. I assume the ten which made it are the most important to God.
If you're talking about the rest, then there are close to 260 "commandments" throughout the Bible, not just Exodus. What's your point?
Drandon 1 year ago
@Drandon
Do correct me if I err here but, frok my memory of actually reading the bible, the story goes that Mister Moses calls a halt in the trek through the wilderness and, because he wants to talk to his divine friend in private, hike to the top of a convenient mountain, probably incorrectly called Sinai.
After quite a while, he shuffles back down bearing the oft-quoted ten commandments.
BUT
see pt 2
draagon66 1 year ago
pt2:
He is appalled to find that his people have fabricated a golden calf , somehow, and are devoting themselves to worshipping same.
Mo is so shocked and angry that he loses control of his upper extremities and drops the stone tablets bearing the first ten commandments and they shatter.
Hot diggety!
Now he admonishes his followers but has to sprint back up the said miount to get a second copy.
OK so far?
Rather oddly, the second ten are totally different from the first.
see pt 3
draagon66 1 year ago
Pt3:
Thus, there are twenty commandments as distinct from the 'laws' ... of which there are 613?
Trusting that I have not misquoted your instruction manual too cruelly.
Kit.
draagon66 1 year ago
@draagon66
Depending on which version you read he didn't lose control, he got pissed and smashed them. For whatever reason they didn't make it in, so they aren't included in the original Decalogue.
So what's the reason for bringing them up?
Drandon 1 year ago
@Drandon
Have you no respect for poetic licence?
it should have been clear that I was paraphrasing. I don't have an English language KJV in the house, only in Tagalog, which I do not speak.
Let's just say that, whenever I read the bible last, some years ago, this is what I remember reading.
Reason? - too much water under the bridge now. Can't recall. Too many real life things going on around me. The least of which is anything that includes a god. I have no time for such a monster as depicted.
draagon66 1 year ago