Most "evil" people don't necessarily believe in satan just like most "good" people don't necessarily believe in Jesus. Both have been blinded from accepting their dependence on or their personal need for either. Each one is trying to get by on their own merits, by their own power, their own way. This is foolishness since each one of us is serving and drawing power from either Jesus or the devil. We are in bondage to whom we obey.
Final point, if you continue to investigate Wicca (which I encourage you to do), take any information on Alex Sanders with a grain of salt. He came to Wicca by way of ceremonial magick, and even his own contemporaries considered him to be (as we say in the States) a few fries short of a Happy Meal. It seems he used magick not as a way to change reality, so much as a way to escape it.
You seem sincere enough in your question, though, and I gotta respect you for that.
Two more points, then I'll shut up and go away. First, the real reason we don't believe in the devil is that there is no particular reason we should.
You seem to imply that we (Neopagans at large) are in denial. We aren't. We're in another religion entirely. The most widely accepted source of information on the devil comes from the bible. However, if we considered the Bible to be an authoritative source, we would necessarily be Christians, and not Witches/Wiccans/Pagans.
Look, both the forces of creation and destruction are real in the universe. Both are absolutely necessary for the universe to function. But neither are morally good nor evil. Nor are they at war with each other, or organized around specific personalities (God vs. the devil, for instance).
Morality is strictly a *human* issue; it's part of what makes us what we are. The war between good and evil occurs within us, not in the cosmos at large. How we see the world reflects what is going on inside.
@witchcraft3328 I agree. We deny the existance eternal punishment or a course for all evil, however, we never deny the existance of malevolance. We cannot be considered satanic as such a concept has no place whatsoever in our religion. Like with unfamiliar people, spirits can be good or bad. Just as a human can commit an act of malevolence, as can a spirit. We cleanse ourself of such things to follow a path of light. However, like with many things, there are risks and failures,
I believe why it the existence of Satan is inconceivable to most pagans is because Satan is a Christian creation. Wiccans would thus not believe in that which does not follow their own belief system or their own personal beliefs. Furthermore, though Satan is inconceivable, the thought of a leading evil spirit or devil isn't, but their are plenty of early Pagan deities that fit the bill. So having them be the same person isn't as valid merely for the fact that they belong to two different beliefs
katelling1 i used to be a christian. trust me, when you look through the pages of the bible and really tink, the reason the bible was created becomes clear. im not going to say because i dont want to upset anyone, but i can promise it is not evil- just unnecessary in this age. and i also realized that god does exist, but not in the way that the bible says and not in the sence of there being one (technically.)
This is still a work in progress. I sincerely hope your eyes become opened and you accept Jesus into your lives before it's too late, for their is a time-limit. I know many will troll me and I accept that, but if just one person accepts Christ, then it will be worth it.
It was a very hard lesson for me to learn. I realized I wasn't as smart as I thought. There are beings out there far older and smarter (and more devious) than I could ever imagine. I concluded that there is no truth in Paganism, only confusion. Multiple answers to the same questions across all pantheons. I realized I had allowed myself to be duped. I had to make amends and accept the consequences of my actions. I had to accept God's discipline as a child does from a Parent who truly cares.
themselves and others. Satan works very hard to deny his own existence. For how can people oppose that which they do not believe in? By denying his own existence people are fooled into thinking what they do doesn't matter, whom they worship is irrelevant because all paths lead to the same God. Adam and Eve wanted to be like God, which is the very thing Paganism promises, to be architects of their own fate apart from Yahweh. Such is the trap of Satan through Paganism.
by omission Jesus verified at Matthew 4:9 where Satan offered all the kingdoms of the world if Jesus would bow down and worship Satan. Jesus never denied that Satan wasn't the ruler of the world, so by that reasoning it can be concluded that Satan IS the ruler of the world, whether we acknowledge it or not. As to Paganism, 2 Corinthians 11:14 speaks of Satan transforming himself into an angel of light, as do his followers try to make themselves appear good, when in fact they are misleading
Most of the time though the information turned out to be wrong. It seemed they function more as individuals and not as an organized unit, hence the discrepancies because they failed to "talk" to one another. I concluded that the words of Revelation 12:9 ""So down the great dragon was hurled, the original serpent, the one called Devil and Satan, who is misleading the entire inhabited earth; " were correct and that we as a race are being misled. Satan is called the ruler of this world, which
and then use that information to mislead us away from Yahweh and Jesus. By concentrating on what we want, rather than what God wants, we fall into their trap. Sometimes as a Pagan I received information that seemed correct, but I realized that since the fallen angels have been around for so long, it would be easy enough for them to come by that information that we seek. Either by direct observation of others or communicating with others of their kind and then relaying that info to us.
Using divination techniques, channeling and spirit mediumship I could get multiple answers to the same questions or an answer that could have a very broad/general interpretation. Rarely did I get anything specific. Remembering what I read in the Bible, I came to the conclusion that the fallen angels are masquerading as the "gods" of Pagan religion/mythology. Considering they have been around since before humans were created, they are in a prime position to observe, learn about what we want
When I left the Jehovah's Witnesses, I delved into Paganism, most particularly Druidry (hence my Youtube handle). What I found was that the Pagan "gods" really don't have humanity's best interests at heart. Rarely does one get what they ask for. There seems to be a great variation on what is Truth. There are discrepancies between pagan religions on where we came from, why we are here and where we are headed. Almost to a fault there is disagreement as to how the universe was created.
Over 500 years ago, a counterfeit Jesus appeared to a Catholic nun and gave her revelations, which are very similar to the doctrines of wicca, feminism, and pantheism. Her name was Julian of Norwich. All of her teachings have been recently revived in the Anglican church. They are promoting her as a “Christian mystic.” There is nothing truly of God in her teachings there are many examples
I'm a pagan, and i don't believe in evil spirits. I believe in misguided spirits, who only appear evil to us humans because we dont understand them. If evil spirits did exist however, i would find it perfectly plausible that they were all individual without a leader such as the christian satan. I tend to see the christian satan as a culminated metaphor of all the un-Godly and un-holy potentials and actual acts of humanity?
@The1hope4all I believe that all spirits have an instinct to move on to whereever/whatever is next after death. However, some people during their mundane lives are so strongly skeptical that when they die their spirits become confused and dont know where to go/what to do. They then manifest on the mundane plane so that we can still very briefly and roughly percieve them, and see them as acting 'evil'. I dont believe that should be guided by anyone, but psychics can help them and guide them.
Rebel angels, and their degraded brothers the demons, have always been in contact with humans, shaping the cultures of mankind throughout history. Ceremonies and festivals honoring the "fallen angels pretending to be gods" have been preserved by being absorbed by institutionalized paganism, Catholicism, as well as simply being the trendy thing to do, as in our own self-deifying New Age and Neopagan culture. But the Bible clearly warns against these other gods, who are not really gods.
Since Paganism is earlier the Jewish faith and the Jewish faith is older than the Catholic one, and catholicism is older than protestant would that not be red light that protestant if not all religion is false.
I know an agnostic who seems to be influenced by something evil. When this man attacks me, I feel like I'm being oppressed. But it could be he's just got a mental problem
Satan is crazy. So when he's not denying his own existence, he's exalting himself above all things.
To all non-Christians: TEST whatever it is you believe, by undergoing a Christian exorcism. See how well it holds up, before Christ, Who embodies the TRUTH in His Person.
No excuses. No hesitation. If you're CONFIDENT in what you believe, then this test shouldn't frighten you. But if you're in fact terrified, then know that you're feeling the fear of the entity that possesses you.
@MyFriendLeonard1 wait what? Are you actually telling Christians to try to exorcise the Holy Spirit from their personages? That makes little to no sense. That in and of itself would be tantamount to one of the greatest sin's a Christian could commit and would not be something that they should attempt if they truly believe in God.
@MyFriendLeonard1 yeah, your right you did, sorry I was trying to read through all 6 pages (at the time I posted all those posts) and was a bit hasty in my reading. Again apologies for misreading.
Of coarse there are evil spirits just like there are evil people,and as for the 2 shining beings if you would of posted the whole story it sead that he had left them alone after he know they wear evil and as for the wiccan read cast the circle thrice about to keep the evil spirits out would you not want to keep the evil spirits out ? that should show you most of us want nothing to do with evil spirits.
@s81710 But the points are: 1. Some witches don't believe in evil spirits. These people did acknowledge that evil spirits exist (whether they conciousely wanted anything to do with them or not is another matter). 2. If evil spirits exist then why is it so inconceivable to the majority of pagans that a leading, more prominent evil spirit exists? Christians would call him Satan but non-Christians may have other names for the same being? Just trying to get people thinking outside the box. : - )
@Shazoolo hypothetically let's say saten is the leader of evil spirits who's to say that saten is the saten of the bible. also who's to say that if there is a saten that he's evil some satanist say that saten is the good being and god is the evil being.
@Shazoolo but lets look at other beings like us the humans and the angels . there is no one human thats leading us, now is there? but there are presidents and kings. I think that the some of the spirits in the book of Goetia are rulers of legions of demons. just like kings and presidents are to us. but i think that just like there is no one human ruling all of us, there is no one demon ruling all of them. As above so below, you know?
@Shazoolo because since we are all connected to the "divine" for lack of better words, alll our thoughts go into this state too. and there are evil people with evil thoughts in the world- prominentley murderers, but dictaters such as adolf hitler as well. some spirits are more powerful than others, but none is truly dominating as the very nature ofsuch spirits means that theyre evil for different reasons. you just have to learn to avoid them, but they dont have a leader.
@s81710 as history,ancient history and most importand historicity of religions is one of my expertize fields in which i hold diploma i can surely tell you that from most ancient..no no..fro the VERY BEGINNING of civilisation in mesopotamia,sumer,akkadia and later babylon you had satanism(paganism) ...all religions you see today came from ONE single religion in which ppl worshiped ONE GOD...but as they started to form tribes and then moved and strted to form different cultures...they corrupted ..
@giska1000 this is pure and simple a lie. The oldest form of Monotheism has its origins in Egypt well after the birth of Civilization, and it was at the time considered a great heresy and people attempted to wipe its record from the face of history (note this had no direct relation to Judaism). There was no single religion worshiping a single god that originated in Mesopotamia. Mesopotamian Religion was all Polytheist in origin.
EDIT: at least Mesopotamian Religion was all Polytheist in origin until the creation of Zoroastrianism, which happened a LONG time after the creation of Judaism. So there is that.
@PneumaAnima you are an idiot sir,because you have pre sumeric,i.e pre mesopotamian sources,and later mesopotamian and directly egyptian sources of worshiping ONE SUPREME GOD...and later rest of other gods,demo gods,heroes and heorines,mythical animals etc were added to it,it all depends of cultural perspecitve...every culture added something from their own folklore and made their own version..but all fo them till the end had one ultimate supreme God....
@giska1000 I believe you mean "Demi" gods... anyways, could you please CITE your sources for a pre-sumeric / pre-mesopotamian reference to a single supreme God from outside the Bible? Because without your sources being cited I will continue to doubt you. I have never heard of any reference to a single god in the area now referenced by Historians as the Fertile Crescent aside from the Zoroastrian God and the Abrahamic God. All other references need citation.
@PneumaAnima ..and whats even more incredible,all of them also had one ruler of evol spirits and creatures...i.e the one who caused everything to go from order to disorder...its almost like zoroastrism with variations....one supreme god and one leader and ruler of underworld,demon world.etc.....this is history and historicity of religions...roots of religions,btw when i speak about religions i dont speak about Judeo Christianity because its not religion,nor can be classified as such...
@s81710 ..worship of One God and they started to add more ,,gods,, ..demi gods(fallen engels etc) and to worship creation(like sun,stars,animals etc) ...so all religions basically came from ,,common ancestor,, with certain variety within it because of cultural reasons...they all worshiped supreme being....God...and all of them had that being as the one that bears the light(lucifer) light bearer...sun god...etc....the fact is..that if you read the bible....you ll see that indeed there was ONE...
@s81710 ..one cherubim that was perfect before God...he was 2nd...only God,His creator was higher than him....and that cheruvim was lucifer,perfect in his beauty,wisdom and everything...but he bacame prideful..and he wanted to become like God...he rebelled and he dragged with himself 3rd of angels....so..yes indeed..if there is evil..there MUST be an independent source of evil...first cause of evil.....there must be FIRST ONE that misused,violated free will...and became source of all sin....
Shows how much you know about the Bible. The Bible doesn't portray Satan that way but instead tells about how he was the most beautiful created being and how he was the highest ranking angel.
Assuming that EVERYTHING that isn't from the Christian God must by default be from Satan then I guess all witches must be somehow worshiping Satan. And while there are a few (I've never personally met any) Satanic witches, the vast majority aren't. Most brujos are Catholic. Most root doctors are Baptist. I'm Pagan. I've even met a few atheist witches. None of us actively worships Satan and the vast majority don't believe a spiritual being of total evil exists. But you all believe what you will.
@DancingRabbit52 No that's just some of your extremist misleading information again. Like how yesterday you ignored christian prosecution because it didn't bode well with your anti-christian , pro-pagan agenda. I can see through you like a 2 way mirror boy.
@SupremeAmerican Christian persecution ended with Constantine. That's a fact. Sure, the church persecuted all sort of heritics and Pagans. Sure, there were religious wars toward the end of the Middle Ages where one sect of Christianity killed another sect. If you want to identify one of those sects with The True Christian Church and others with the false church, then sure there was anti-Christian persecution. But the history books don't see it that way. My info above IS accurate. Prove me wrong.
@DancingRabbit52 You just did it again. - The church persecuted christians that refused to worship a pagan version of their faith, and instead turned to the biblical texts.. You deny this? Yes or no ------ LOL
@SupremeAmerican Are you talking about during the late Roman Empire or during the Reformation? If you are talking about the late Roman Empire, my answer is NO. The church persecuted various heretical groups but they could not be by any stretch of the imagination be considered biblical. If you mean during the Reformation, YES. The Roman Catholic Church did actively perecute the biblically oriented protestants.
@DancingRabbit52 you seem to be under the mistaken impression that Christians are no longer persecuted anywhere in the world. This is a lie. There are still Christian Persecutions happening and even murders of Christians in the name of other Religions happening around the world to this day.
@PneumaAnima No. I realize that there are places like North Korea, China, Saudi Arabia, Iran... where Christians can not worship openly or evangelize, and may be murdered by zealots. Doubtless there are many other places as well. However, the US, the UK are not among them. While any religious persecution and any murder is significant and wrong, we are not talking Diocletian or the religious wars of the early modern period.
@DancingRabbit52 Well I suppose I can agree with the fact that it isn't quite on the same level as the Roman Empire's persecution of Christians. However at the same time I just wanted to remind people that persecution of Christians still happens. that was my primary objective. I am not trying to say that Pagans have it any easier, I just want to remind people that Pagans aren't alone in getting persecuted in this day and age.
@PneumaAnima Exactly! Christians along with most every other religious group face persecution of some kind some where and it is wrong. I think we also need to consider the level of persecution. Do we mean being actually killed or do we mean fired from a job, or just being talking about us and being mean. Pagans in west Africa and the middle east face death but in the US it is mainly job, child custody and housing related. However in the US, it is the Christians who do the persecuting.
@DancingRabbit52 correct. The level of persecution is important. Additionally some things that people often interpret as persecution really shouldn't be considered as such. For example, name calling while cruel in some cases isn't really any worse than what childhood bullies do in general and we don't usually send children to jail for calling each other names do we? Assault, loss of jobs, loss of housing, death, all because of religion or other social things are persecution strictly speaking.
@PneumaAnima Wow! More agreement here. Verbal bullying is wrong/unpleasant but isn't persecution. So, ok, why in light of the 'do unto others...' do some Christians actively persecute Pagans in the US? We are talking fire from jobs, take custody of children, cancel lease/rent agreements. Are they just not very good examples of being Christian or does Christianity actually condone persecution Pagans?
@DancingRabbit52 I think it has to do with a general misunderstanding of Biblical Antecedents and a general lack of common Christian Morals on the part of some Christians. You see in Pre-Christian times there were plenty of instances of times when the Jews would actively attempt to persecute non-Jewish people. However this was primarily done with the intent of rescuing their promised land from such people, at least thats my understanding. Jesus however said "Love your enemy as yourself." so yeah
@PneumaAnima Just focusing on what happens in modern times because none of us can change what happened in history... let me make sure I understand you perfectly. You are saying that persecution is wrong period. It is wrong for Moslems, Atheists, whatever to persecute Christians and it is just as wrong for Christians to persecute Pagans.
@DancingRabbit52 to the extent that I define persecution much more narrowly than alot of people. For example I don't consider verbally ribbing a person, or refusing to let a person into one's home business, to be persecution the way that some people do. But generally if one is doing more blatant acts of persecution, then yes, I will agree that it is wrong.
Please note that evangelism is not on my list of persecution qualifying items. Freedom of Speech is one of my most treasured rights.
@PneumaAnima I also agree on the evangelism thing. As a Pagan I do NOT evangelize. I don't mind of a Jehovah's Witness or a Baptist knocks on my door. I'm polite and sometimes chat and some times don't because I'm busy. The same for street preachers. I think they are anoying and terribly ineffective but I either walk on by or engage them depending on my mood but it's their right of freedom of speach to do it. At work, I do have a problem with evangelism especially by a boss.
@DancingRabbit52 The problem I encounter the most often, is that people who aren't Christian automatically equate Evangelism with Indoctrination. And that simply isn't what Evangelism is. Or at least it isn't what Evangelism is SUPPOSED to be. I would sooner equate proper Evangelism to an invitation to faith in Christianity. It isn't meant to be forced upon a person. Unfortunately too often, especially in the case of street preachers, forcing the word down people's throats is what happens.
@PneumaAnima Street preachers are just loud, rude, obnoxious and argumentative. I have never seen anyone convert or known anyone to convert or even heard of anyone who converted as a result of hearing one. Thing is even with nice invitations to faith, one or two is fine but at some point they become like spam or junk mail. I've already said 'no, no thank you, no thank you very much' I am quite happy with my faith. I am not interested in trying out yours, thank you.
@DancingRabbit52 I will agree on that. The ideal form of Evangelism as I have understood it is to go to a person ask if they would like to hear the Gospel, if they say yes, then continue the discussion, if they say no, then kindly thank them for their time and then leave them alone. At least that is the understanding I have gotten from my sister who is heavily involved in Missionary work.
@PneumaAnima I think that respectful, low key approach is not only more Chrisitan but is much more likely to have success. It doesn't feed the ego though and would require a great deal of humility. I do think that if Christian practiced it there would be more converts than all the street preacher, door knockers and evangelists combined. Pagan 'evangelism' is more low key. Somebody comes to me asks about the Goddess and if they are over 18, I tell them
@DancingRabbit52 I gotta question. Do you acknowledge the fact that the very concept of deception is a very real concept as a whole? You probably wont. I bet you are nodding your head in agreement while you read this. And your going to try and manipulate your answer otherwise in your reply, because the answer frightens you.
@SupremeAmerican I think a person can decieve themselves or be decieved by another person. You believe something that turns out not to be true because you want to or because the person is very persuasive. No, I don't believe in an overall spiritual conspiracy by Satan to pull the wool over everyone's eyes. Is that plain and non-manipulative for you?
@DancingRabbit52 Nope. You manipulated. I asked a very simple question, i will ask it again. ---- " Is there an overall singularly whole concept of deception that exists?" Don't bring satan into it. Just answer the question.
@SupremeAmerican I don't understand what you mean by "an overall singularly whole concept of deception". If you mean that the vast majority of people on earth are being decieved. NO.
@DancingRabbit52 You just wont do it will you. I'll ask one more time. " Does the concept of deception exist?" What's the answer. Is there a concept of deception in this existence? You know. Like the concept of say...... Life or death.
@SupremeAmerican Sure the concept of deception exists. I disagree with the Greeks in that I don't believe that concepts are real. Things, people, stuff is real. Concepts are ideas held in the mind that may or may not exist in real life. The concept of unicorns exists but that doesn't mean that I'm going to stumble over a real life unicorn one day.
@DancingRabbit52 Unicorns are part of the concept of imagination, and imagination is an actuality. The concept of deception itself is an actuality so you have failed yet again.
@SupremeAmerican its so sad to see english speakers being decieved by so many verses in bbile..like unicorn that you mentioned..i ll suggest you..actually i ll send you video about unicorns in the bible...its not the bet,but at least an decent explanation for english speaking nations that unicorns in the bible are not horses with one horn..but they are real creatures known as rhynoceros unicornis....again if you want i ll send you video about unicorns in the bible...
@SupremeAmerican Amazing! I disagree with you and... oh no! I've failed. Oh, I've failed! Let me bang my head against my computer desk. For shame! I've failed. (not!)
Cite your sources! Which philosopher teaches imagination=actuality? Give me book and page number. And I will give you book and page number where another philosopher teaches the opposite. Philosophy is interesting but it is not hard science.
@DancingRabbit52 The demons are actually here, disguised as Christians trolling the comments of those who don't necessarily agree with everything they think they know.
@dannukesem I realize that we have trolls here. Perhaps I am one. I don't for a moment think that actual demons are pecking away at a keyboard somewhere or that the humans who are are demon possessed. I think we just have some rather unhappy people who get pleasure from making what they hope are offensive posts.
@YeshuaisLord100 I think you are envoking the True Scotsman Fallacy here. One can argue over what is a True Christian but when you say that all Christians act Christlike because those who don't aren't true Christians anyway... It doesn't prove being a Christian makes you a better person, it just redefines Christian to exclude those who aren't. I accept all here who claim to be Christians to be Christians. Who am I to judge? Some just aren't very good ones.
Ooh, now here's a thought - If I had the time, it'd be a simple thing to put together "The Denial of the GODDESS in Modern Christianity", eh? *Plenty* of material to work with there, no?
They probably deny the existence of Satan because Satan is Biblical. Therefore, acknowledging Satan would be validating the Bible. That would be problematic.
@carcabe: They probably deny the existence of the Goddess because the Goddess is of the World. Therefore, acknowledging the Goddess would be validating reality. That would be problematic.
They may believe in spirits, benign and evil, but they do not believe in the Christian notion of Satan--a Father of Lies, the deceiver and a trickster and the opposite of the divine. But from the Christian point of view, anything that is not of God is Satanic, so I suppose there is no arguing with that logic. But technically, they do not believe in the Christian Satan. Every Pagan/Witch/Wiccan has their own path, and some are not limited to those peeps you quoted. You are well-read. Good job
@fruitikay In this existence, there are very real concepts. The concept of love, the concept of truth, etc etc. Those are of God. Now there are also concepts of lies, deceit, and ill-intent. Those are the concepts of satan.
@SupremeAmerican Yes, from your Christian point of view. Within the sphere of YOUR religion, you would think that. However, Pagans do not BELIEVE in the Christian notion of Satan. The devil with horns, etc. They believe in many different evil spirits, but they don't call him Satan, they don't believe he's out to ruin the cosmic plan and help deceive people into hell. That is not a part of their theology. That's like saying Native Americans believe in Satan because they also believe in ev spirits
@richard4president Jesus Christ. I KNOW HE DOESN'T HAVE HORNS. I was using that as an example for the devil of the Bible, who is a SPIRIT and obviously not a physical being. However, when you watch Shazo's vid, there are PICTURES of the DEVIL with horns because he is typically pictured like that in CHRISTIAN paintings from way back when to characterize who he is. Holy cheesburger.
@fruitikay By the way, I don't believe the Devil has horns. Just some handy pictures to represent him and so people have a quick and easy understanding of who is represented.
@fruitikay no i am just stating the similarities that are being overlooked. The very concept of deceit itself is a one-collective-whole-concept. They just dont give it a name like christians do.
@SupremeAmerican Meh, I disagree. Unfortunately all of Creation can be said to have originated with God. Saying something doesn't originate with God but with Satan is missing the point of God's Omnipotence and the fact that he created the entire cosmos. Therefor it is important to remember that it was God who created all of existence including the negative concepts and emotions.
Most "evil" people don't necessarily believe in satan just like most "good" people don't necessarily believe in Jesus. Both have been blinded from accepting their dependence on or their personal need for either. Each one is trying to get by on their own merits, by their own power, their own way. This is foolishness since each one of us is serving and drawing power from either Jesus or the devil. We are in bondage to whom we obey.
LetitiaMLane 4 months ago
Final point, if you continue to investigate Wicca (which I encourage you to do), take any information on Alex Sanders with a grain of salt. He came to Wicca by way of ceremonial magick, and even his own contemporaries considered him to be (as we say in the States) a few fries short of a Happy Meal. It seems he used magick not as a way to change reality, so much as a way to escape it.
You seem sincere enough in your question, though, and I gotta respect you for that.
MrSionnach1 4 months ago
Two more points, then I'll shut up and go away. First, the real reason we don't believe in the devil is that there is no particular reason we should.
You seem to imply that we (Neopagans at large) are in denial. We aren't. We're in another religion entirely. The most widely accepted source of information on the devil comes from the bible. However, if we considered the Bible to be an authoritative source, we would necessarily be Christians, and not Witches/Wiccans/Pagans.
MrSionnach1 4 months ago
Look, both the forces of creation and destruction are real in the universe. Both are absolutely necessary for the universe to function. But neither are morally good nor evil. Nor are they at war with each other, or organized around specific personalities (God vs. the devil, for instance).
Morality is strictly a *human* issue; it's part of what makes us what we are. The war between good and evil occurs within us, not in the cosmos at large. How we see the world reflects what is going on inside.
MrSionnach1 4 months ago
@ithinkshepissesgravy I hail from that thar neck of the woods!
Shazoolo 5 months ago
@witchcraft3328 I agree. We deny the existance eternal punishment or a course for all evil, however, we never deny the existance of malevolance. We cannot be considered satanic as such a concept has no place whatsoever in our religion. Like with unfamiliar people, spirits can be good or bad. Just as a human can commit an act of malevolence, as can a spirit. We cleanse ourself of such things to follow a path of light. However, like with many things, there are risks and failures,
TheConchita8Kimbley 5 months ago
I believe why it the existence of Satan is inconceivable to most pagans is because Satan is a Christian creation. Wiccans would thus not believe in that which does not follow their own belief system or their own personal beliefs. Furthermore, though Satan is inconceivable, the thought of a leading evil spirit or devil isn't, but their are plenty of early Pagan deities that fit the bill. So having them be the same person isn't as valid merely for the fact that they belong to two different beliefs
witchcraft3328 6 months ago
katelling1 i used to be a christian. trust me, when you look through the pages of the bible and really tink, the reason the bible was created becomes clear. im not going to say because i dont want to upset anyone, but i can promise it is not evil- just unnecessary in this age. and i also realized that god does exist, but not in the way that the bible says and not in the sence of there being one (technically.)
blesed be )0(
trandomphatguy 6 months ago
This is still a work in progress. I sincerely hope your eyes become opened and you accept Jesus into your lives before it's too late, for their is a time-limit. I know many will troll me and I accept that, but if just one person accepts Christ, then it will be worth it.
drevildruid 7 months ago
It was a very hard lesson for me to learn. I realized I wasn't as smart as I thought. There are beings out there far older and smarter (and more devious) than I could ever imagine. I concluded that there is no truth in Paganism, only confusion. Multiple answers to the same questions across all pantheons. I realized I had allowed myself to be duped. I had to make amends and accept the consequences of my actions. I had to accept God's discipline as a child does from a Parent who truly cares.
drevildruid 7 months ago
themselves and others. Satan works very hard to deny his own existence. For how can people oppose that which they do not believe in? By denying his own existence people are fooled into thinking what they do doesn't matter, whom they worship is irrelevant because all paths lead to the same God. Adam and Eve wanted to be like God, which is the very thing Paganism promises, to be architects of their own fate apart from Yahweh. Such is the trap of Satan through Paganism.
drevildruid 7 months ago
by omission Jesus verified at Matthew 4:9 where Satan offered all the kingdoms of the world if Jesus would bow down and worship Satan. Jesus never denied that Satan wasn't the ruler of the world, so by that reasoning it can be concluded that Satan IS the ruler of the world, whether we acknowledge it or not. As to Paganism, 2 Corinthians 11:14 speaks of Satan transforming himself into an angel of light, as do his followers try to make themselves appear good, when in fact they are misleading
drevildruid 7 months ago
Most of the time though the information turned out to be wrong. It seemed they function more as individuals and not as an organized unit, hence the discrepancies because they failed to "talk" to one another. I concluded that the words of Revelation 12:9 ""So down the great dragon was hurled, the original serpent, the one called Devil and Satan, who is misleading the entire inhabited earth; " were correct and that we as a race are being misled. Satan is called the ruler of this world, which
drevildruid 7 months ago
and then use that information to mislead us away from Yahweh and Jesus. By concentrating on what we want, rather than what God wants, we fall into their trap. Sometimes as a Pagan I received information that seemed correct, but I realized that since the fallen angels have been around for so long, it would be easy enough for them to come by that information that we seek. Either by direct observation of others or communicating with others of their kind and then relaying that info to us.
drevildruid 7 months ago
Using divination techniques, channeling and spirit mediumship I could get multiple answers to the same questions or an answer that could have a very broad/general interpretation. Rarely did I get anything specific. Remembering what I read in the Bible, I came to the conclusion that the fallen angels are masquerading as the "gods" of Pagan religion/mythology. Considering they have been around since before humans were created, they are in a prime position to observe, learn about what we want
drevildruid 7 months ago
When I left the Jehovah's Witnesses, I delved into Paganism, most particularly Druidry (hence my Youtube handle). What I found was that the Pagan "gods" really don't have humanity's best interests at heart. Rarely does one get what they ask for. There seems to be a great variation on what is Truth. There are discrepancies between pagan religions on where we came from, why we are here and where we are headed. Almost to a fault there is disagreement as to how the universe was created.
drevildruid 7 months ago
Over 500 years ago, a counterfeit Jesus appeared to a Catholic nun and gave her revelations, which are very similar to the doctrines of wicca, feminism, and pantheism. Her name was Julian of Norwich. All of her teachings have been recently revived in the Anglican church. They are promoting her as a “Christian mystic.” There is nothing truly of God in her teachings there are many examples
zipfreer 9 months ago
katelling 1
God loves everyone he send his only son Jesus to die in the cross for all our sins come to him while there is still time tomorrow might be too late
katelling1 9 months ago 2
I'm a pagan, and i don't believe in evil spirits. I believe in misguided spirits, who only appear evil to us humans because we dont understand them. If evil spirits did exist however, i would find it perfectly plausible that they were all individual without a leader such as the christian satan. I tend to see the christian satan as a culminated metaphor of all the un-Godly and un-holy potentials and actual acts of humanity?
madlandlizard 9 months ago
@madlandlizard If those spirits are misguided, who, or what, should they be guided by, do you think? And why have they failed to be properly guided?
The1hope4all 8 months ago
@The1hope4all I believe that all spirits have an instinct to move on to whereever/whatever is next after death. However, some people during their mundane lives are so strongly skeptical that when they die their spirits become confused and dont know where to go/what to do. They then manifest on the mundane plane so that we can still very briefly and roughly percieve them, and see them as acting 'evil'. I dont believe that should be guided by anyone, but psychics can help them and guide them.
madlandlizard 6 months ago
Poor pagans. Perfectly deceived and don't want truth.
megawolf7 9 months ago
I think reason why god made witchcraft a sin is that to have any magical power that person are used by evil spirits. Angels do not give out power.
spark300c 9 months ago
Rebel angels, and their degraded brothers the demons, have always been in contact with humans, shaping the cultures of mankind throughout history. Ceremonies and festivals honoring the "fallen angels pretending to be gods" have been preserved by being absorbed by institutionalized paganism, Catholicism, as well as simply being the trendy thing to do, as in our own self-deifying New Age and Neopagan culture. But the Bible clearly warns against these other gods, who are not really gods.
zipfreer 9 months ago
Since Paganism is earlier the Jewish faith and the Jewish faith is older than the Catholic one, and catholicism is older than protestant would that not be red light that protestant if not all religion is false.
BillyT4evr 9 months ago
I know an agnostic who seems to be influenced by something evil. When this man attacks me, I feel like I'm being oppressed. But it could be he's just got a mental problem
Lambieschmoo 9 months ago
Very good.
Satan is crazy. So when he's not denying his own existence, he's exalting himself above all things.
To all non-Christians: TEST whatever it is you believe, by undergoing a Christian exorcism. See how well it holds up, before Christ, Who embodies the TRUTH in His Person.
No excuses. No hesitation. If you're CONFIDENT in what you believe, then this test shouldn't frighten you. But if you're in fact terrified, then know that you're feeling the fear of the entity that possesses you.
MyFriendLeonard1 9 months ago
@MyFriendLeonard1 wait what? Are you actually telling Christians to try to exorcise the Holy Spirit from their personages? That makes little to no sense. That in and of itself would be tantamount to one of the greatest sin's a Christian could commit and would not be something that they should attempt if they truly believe in God.
Talk about Blasphemy Challenges...!
PneumaAnima 8 months ago
@PneumaAnima No. I said non-Christians. Read it again. : D
MyFriendLeonard1 8 months ago
@MyFriendLeonard1 yeah, your right you did, sorry I was trying to read through all 6 pages (at the time I posted all those posts) and was a bit hasty in my reading. Again apologies for misreading.
PneumaAnima 8 months ago
@PneumaAnima Heh. You nearly gave me a heart attack! I said wha' - ? : D
MyFriendLeonard1 8 months ago
@MyFriendLeonard1 yeah sorry about that :(
PneumaAnima 8 months ago
@PneumaAnima : D
MyFriendLeonard1 8 months ago
Of coarse there are evil spirits just like there are evil people,and as for the 2 shining beings if you would of posted the whole story it sead that he had left them alone after he know they wear evil and as for the wiccan read cast the circle thrice about to keep the evil spirits out would you not want to keep the evil spirits out ? that should show you most of us want nothing to do with evil spirits.
Blessed Be
s81710 9 months ago
@s81710 But the points are: 1. Some witches don't believe in evil spirits. These people did acknowledge that evil spirits exist (whether they conciousely wanted anything to do with them or not is another matter). 2. If evil spirits exist then why is it so inconceivable to the majority of pagans that a leading, more prominent evil spirit exists? Christians would call him Satan but non-Christians may have other names for the same being? Just trying to get people thinking outside the box. : - )
Shazoolo 9 months ago 4
@Shazoolo hypothetically let's say saten is the leader of evil spirits who's to say that saten is the saten of the bible. also who's to say that if there is a saten that he's evil some satanist say that saten is the good being and god is the evil being.
s81710 9 months ago
@Shazoolo but lets look at other beings like us the humans and the angels . there is no one human thats leading us, now is there? but there are presidents and kings. I think that the some of the spirits in the book of Goetia are rulers of legions of demons. just like kings and presidents are to us. but i think that just like there is no one human ruling all of us, there is no one demon ruling all of them. As above so below, you know?
witchcraftlover 8 months ago
@witchcraftlover oh yeah and idk much about angels. maybe Mary is their leader since shes Queen of Angels. so forget i mentioned them lol
witchcraftlover 8 months ago
@Shazoolo because since we are all connected to the "divine" for lack of better words, alll our thoughts go into this state too. and there are evil people with evil thoughts in the world- prominentley murderers, but dictaters such as adolf hitler as well. some spirits are more powerful than others, but none is truly dominating as the very nature ofsuch spirits means that theyre evil for different reasons. you just have to learn to avoid them, but they dont have a leader.
trandomphatguy 6 months ago
@s81710 as history,ancient history and most importand historicity of religions is one of my expertize fields in which i hold diploma i can surely tell you that from most ancient..no no..fro the VERY BEGINNING of civilisation in mesopotamia,sumer,akkadia and later babylon you had satanism(paganism) ...all religions you see today came from ONE single religion in which ppl worshiped ONE GOD...but as they started to form tribes and then moved and strted to form different cultures...they corrupted ..
giska1000 9 months ago
@giska1000 this is pure and simple a lie. The oldest form of Monotheism has its origins in Egypt well after the birth of Civilization, and it was at the time considered a great heresy and people attempted to wipe its record from the face of history (note this had no direct relation to Judaism). There was no single religion worshiping a single god that originated in Mesopotamia. Mesopotamian Religion was all Polytheist in origin.
PneumaAnima 8 months ago
EDIT: at least Mesopotamian Religion was all Polytheist in origin until the creation of Zoroastrianism, which happened a LONG time after the creation of Judaism. So there is that.
PneumaAnima 8 months ago
@PneumaAnima you are an idiot sir,because you have pre sumeric,i.e pre mesopotamian sources,and later mesopotamian and directly egyptian sources of worshiping ONE SUPREME GOD...and later rest of other gods,demo gods,heroes and heorines,mythical animals etc were added to it,it all depends of cultural perspecitve...every culture added something from their own folklore and made their own version..but all fo them till the end had one ultimate supreme God....
giska1000 8 months ago
@giska1000 I believe you mean "Demi" gods... anyways, could you please CITE your sources for a pre-sumeric / pre-mesopotamian reference to a single supreme God from outside the Bible? Because without your sources being cited I will continue to doubt you. I have never heard of any reference to a single god in the area now referenced by Historians as the Fertile Crescent aside from the Zoroastrian God and the Abrahamic God. All other references need citation.
PneumaAnima 8 months ago
@PneumaAnima ..and whats even more incredible,all of them also had one ruler of evol spirits and creatures...i.e the one who caused everything to go from order to disorder...its almost like zoroastrism with variations....one supreme god and one leader and ruler of underworld,demon world.etc.....this is history and historicity of religions...roots of religions,btw when i speak about religions i dont speak about Judeo Christianity because its not religion,nor can be classified as such...
giska1000 8 months ago
@s81710 ..worship of One God and they started to add more ,,gods,, ..demi gods(fallen engels etc) and to worship creation(like sun,stars,animals etc) ...so all religions basically came from ,,common ancestor,, with certain variety within it because of cultural reasons...they all worshiped supreme being....God...and all of them had that being as the one that bears the light(lucifer) light bearer...sun god...etc....the fact is..that if you read the bible....you ll see that indeed there was ONE...
giska1000 9 months ago
@s81710 ..one cherubim that was perfect before God...he was 2nd...only God,His creator was higher than him....and that cheruvim was lucifer,perfect in his beauty,wisdom and everything...but he bacame prideful..and he wanted to become like God...he rebelled and he dragged with himself 3rd of angels....so..yes indeed..if there is evil..there MUST be an independent source of evil...first cause of evil.....there must be FIRST ONE that misused,violated free will...and became source of all sin....
giska1000 9 months ago
@giska1000 ok thin lol
s81710 9 months ago
Shows how much you know about the Bible. The Bible doesn't portray Satan that way but instead tells about how he was the most beautiful created being and how he was the highest ranking angel.
Holy french fry.
richard4president 9 months ago
Assuming that EVERYTHING that isn't from the Christian God must by default be from Satan then I guess all witches must be somehow worshiping Satan. And while there are a few (I've never personally met any) Satanic witches, the vast majority aren't. Most brujos are Catholic. Most root doctors are Baptist. I'm Pagan. I've even met a few atheist witches. None of us actively worships Satan and the vast majority don't believe a spiritual being of total evil exists. But you all believe what you will.
DancingRabbit52 9 months ago
@DancingRabbit52 No that's just some of your extremist misleading information again. Like how yesterday you ignored christian prosecution because it didn't bode well with your anti-christian , pro-pagan agenda. I can see through you like a 2 way mirror boy.
SupremeAmerican 9 months ago
@SupremeAmerican Christian persecution ended with Constantine. That's a fact. Sure, the church persecuted all sort of heritics and Pagans. Sure, there were religious wars toward the end of the Middle Ages where one sect of Christianity killed another sect. If you want to identify one of those sects with The True Christian Church and others with the false church, then sure there was anti-Christian persecution. But the history books don't see it that way. My info above IS accurate. Prove me wrong.
DancingRabbit52 9 months ago
@DancingRabbit52 You just did it again. - The church persecuted christians that refused to worship a pagan version of their faith, and instead turned to the biblical texts.. You deny this? Yes or no ------ LOL
SupremeAmerican 9 months ago
@SupremeAmerican Are you talking about during the late Roman Empire or during the Reformation? If you are talking about the late Roman Empire, my answer is NO. The church persecuted various heretical groups but they could not be by any stretch of the imagination be considered biblical. If you mean during the Reformation, YES. The Roman Catholic Church did actively perecute the biblically oriented protestants.
DancingRabbit52 9 months ago
@DancingRabbit52 you seem to be under the mistaken impression that Christians are no longer persecuted anywhere in the world. This is a lie. There are still Christian Persecutions happening and even murders of Christians in the name of other Religions happening around the world to this day.
PneumaAnima 8 months ago
@PneumaAnima No. I realize that there are places like North Korea, China, Saudi Arabia, Iran... where Christians can not worship openly or evangelize, and may be murdered by zealots. Doubtless there are many other places as well. However, the US, the UK are not among them. While any religious persecution and any murder is significant and wrong, we are not talking Diocletian or the religious wars of the early modern period.
DancingRabbit52 8 months ago
@DancingRabbit52 Well I suppose I can agree with the fact that it isn't quite on the same level as the Roman Empire's persecution of Christians. However at the same time I just wanted to remind people that persecution of Christians still happens. that was my primary objective. I am not trying to say that Pagans have it any easier, I just want to remind people that Pagans aren't alone in getting persecuted in this day and age.
PneumaAnima 8 months ago
@PneumaAnima Exactly! Christians along with most every other religious group face persecution of some kind some where and it is wrong. I think we also need to consider the level of persecution. Do we mean being actually killed or do we mean fired from a job, or just being talking about us and being mean. Pagans in west Africa and the middle east face death but in the US it is mainly job, child custody and housing related. However in the US, it is the Christians who do the persecuting.
DancingRabbit52 8 months ago
@DancingRabbit52 correct. The level of persecution is important. Additionally some things that people often interpret as persecution really shouldn't be considered as such. For example, name calling while cruel in some cases isn't really any worse than what childhood bullies do in general and we don't usually send children to jail for calling each other names do we? Assault, loss of jobs, loss of housing, death, all because of religion or other social things are persecution strictly speaking.
PneumaAnima 8 months ago
@PneumaAnima Wow! More agreement here. Verbal bullying is wrong/unpleasant but isn't persecution. So, ok, why in light of the 'do unto others...' do some Christians actively persecute Pagans in the US? We are talking fire from jobs, take custody of children, cancel lease/rent agreements. Are they just not very good examples of being Christian or does Christianity actually condone persecution Pagans?
DancingRabbit52 8 months ago
@DancingRabbit52 I think it has to do with a general misunderstanding of Biblical Antecedents and a general lack of common Christian Morals on the part of some Christians. You see in Pre-Christian times there were plenty of instances of times when the Jews would actively attempt to persecute non-Jewish people. However this was primarily done with the intent of rescuing their promised land from such people, at least thats my understanding. Jesus however said "Love your enemy as yourself." so yeah
PneumaAnima 8 months ago
@PneumaAnima Just focusing on what happens in modern times because none of us can change what happened in history... let me make sure I understand you perfectly. You are saying that persecution is wrong period. It is wrong for Moslems, Atheists, whatever to persecute Christians and it is just as wrong for Christians to persecute Pagans.
DancingRabbit52 8 months ago
@DancingRabbit52 to the extent that I define persecution much more narrowly than alot of people. For example I don't consider verbally ribbing a person, or refusing to let a person into one's home business, to be persecution the way that some people do. But generally if one is doing more blatant acts of persecution, then yes, I will agree that it is wrong.
Please note that evangelism is not on my list of persecution qualifying items. Freedom of Speech is one of my most treasured rights.
PneumaAnima 8 months ago
@PneumaAnima I also agree on the evangelism thing. As a Pagan I do NOT evangelize. I don't mind of a Jehovah's Witness or a Baptist knocks on my door. I'm polite and sometimes chat and some times don't because I'm busy. The same for street preachers. I think they are anoying and terribly ineffective but I either walk on by or engage them depending on my mood but it's their right of freedom of speach to do it. At work, I do have a problem with evangelism especially by a boss.
DancingRabbit52 8 months ago
@DancingRabbit52 The problem I encounter the most often, is that people who aren't Christian automatically equate Evangelism with Indoctrination. And that simply isn't what Evangelism is. Or at least it isn't what Evangelism is SUPPOSED to be. I would sooner equate proper Evangelism to an invitation to faith in Christianity. It isn't meant to be forced upon a person. Unfortunately too often, especially in the case of street preachers, forcing the word down people's throats is what happens.
PneumaAnima 8 months ago
@PneumaAnima Street preachers are just loud, rude, obnoxious and argumentative. I have never seen anyone convert or known anyone to convert or even heard of anyone who converted as a result of hearing one. Thing is even with nice invitations to faith, one or two is fine but at some point they become like spam or junk mail. I've already said 'no, no thank you, no thank you very much' I am quite happy with my faith. I am not interested in trying out yours, thank you.
DancingRabbit52 8 months ago
@DancingRabbit52 I will agree on that. The ideal form of Evangelism as I have understood it is to go to a person ask if they would like to hear the Gospel, if they say yes, then continue the discussion, if they say no, then kindly thank them for their time and then leave them alone. At least that is the understanding I have gotten from my sister who is heavily involved in Missionary work.
PneumaAnima 8 months ago
@PneumaAnima I think that respectful, low key approach is not only more Chrisitan but is much more likely to have success. It doesn't feed the ego though and would require a great deal of humility. I do think that if Christian practiced it there would be more converts than all the street preacher, door knockers and evangelists combined. Pagan 'evangelism' is more low key. Somebody comes to me asks about the Goddess and if they are over 18, I tell them
DancingRabbit52 8 months ago
@DancingRabbit52 I gotta question. Do you acknowledge the fact that the very concept of deception is a very real concept as a whole? You probably wont. I bet you are nodding your head in agreement while you read this. And your going to try and manipulate your answer otherwise in your reply, because the answer frightens you.
SupremeAmerican 9 months ago
@SupremeAmerican I think a person can decieve themselves or be decieved by another person. You believe something that turns out not to be true because you want to or because the person is very persuasive. No, I don't believe in an overall spiritual conspiracy by Satan to pull the wool over everyone's eyes. Is that plain and non-manipulative for you?
DancingRabbit52 9 months ago
@DancingRabbit52 Nope. You manipulated. I asked a very simple question, i will ask it again. ---- " Is there an overall singularly whole concept of deception that exists?" Don't bring satan into it. Just answer the question.
SupremeAmerican 9 months ago
@SupremeAmerican I don't understand what you mean by "an overall singularly whole concept of deception". If you mean that the vast majority of people on earth are being decieved. NO.
DancingRabbit52 9 months ago
@DancingRabbit52 You just wont do it will you. I'll ask one more time. " Does the concept of deception exist?" What's the answer. Is there a concept of deception in this existence? You know. Like the concept of say...... Life or death.
SupremeAmerican 9 months ago
@SupremeAmerican Sure the concept of deception exists. I disagree with the Greeks in that I don't believe that concepts are real. Things, people, stuff is real. Concepts are ideas held in the mind that may or may not exist in real life. The concept of unicorns exists but that doesn't mean that I'm going to stumble over a real life unicorn one day.
DancingRabbit52 9 months ago
@DancingRabbit52 Unicorns are part of the concept of imagination, and imagination is an actuality. The concept of deception itself is an actuality so you have failed yet again.
SupremeAmerican 9 months ago
@SupremeAmerican its so sad to see english speakers being decieved by so many verses in bbile..like unicorn that you mentioned..i ll suggest you..actually i ll send you video about unicorns in the bible...its not the bet,but at least an decent explanation for english speaking nations that unicorns in the bible are not horses with one horn..but they are real creatures known as rhynoceros unicornis....again if you want i ll send you video about unicorns in the bible...
giska1000 9 months ago
@SupremeAmerican Amazing! I disagree with you and... oh no! I've failed. Oh, I've failed! Let me bang my head against my computer desk. For shame! I've failed. (not!)
Cite your sources! Which philosopher teaches imagination=actuality? Give me book and page number. And I will give you book and page number where another philosopher teaches the opposite. Philosophy is interesting but it is not hard science.
DancingRabbit52 9 months ago
@DancingRabbit52 The demons are actually here, disguised as Christians trolling the comments of those who don't necessarily agree with everything they think they know.
dannukesem 9 months ago
@dannukesem I realize that we have trolls here. Perhaps I am one. I don't for a moment think that actual demons are pecking away at a keyboard somewhere or that the humans who are are demon possessed. I think we just have some rather unhappy people who get pleasure from making what they hope are offensive posts.
DancingRabbit52 9 months ago
@DancingRabbit52 Sometimes the Christians act like little devils,,,,
dannukesem 9 months ago
@dannukesem yes, Christians that don't follow the teachings of Christ, which means they aren't Christians
YeshuaisLord100 9 months ago
@YeshuaisLord100 I think you are envoking the True Scotsman Fallacy here. One can argue over what is a True Christian but when you say that all Christians act Christlike because those who don't aren't true Christians anyway... It doesn't prove being a Christian makes you a better person, it just redefines Christian to exclude those who aren't. I accept all here who claim to be Christians to be Christians. Who am I to judge? Some just aren't very good ones.
DancingRabbit52 9 months ago
Ooh, now here's a thought - If I had the time, it'd be a simple thing to put together "The Denial of the GODDESS in Modern Christianity", eh? *Plenty* of material to work with there, no?
MsGingergingercat 9 months ago
They probably deny the existence of Satan because Satan is Biblical. Therefore, acknowledging Satan would be validating the Bible. That would be problematic.
carcabe 9 months ago
@carcabe: They probably deny the existence of the Goddess because the Goddess is of the World. Therefore, acknowledging the Goddess would be validating reality. That would be problematic.
There. Fixed that for ya! ;D
MsGingergingercat 9 months ago
Fifth! Booyah!
MsGingergingercat 9 months ago
They may believe in spirits, benign and evil, but they do not believe in the Christian notion of Satan--a Father of Lies, the deceiver and a trickster and the opposite of the divine. But from the Christian point of view, anything that is not of God is Satanic, so I suppose there is no arguing with that logic. But technically, they do not believe in the Christian Satan. Every Pagan/Witch/Wiccan has their own path, and some are not limited to those peeps you quoted. You are well-read. Good job
fruitikay 9 months ago
@fruitikay Well read but Sneeky :o)
greenelf12 9 months ago
@fruitikay In this existence, there are very real concepts. The concept of love, the concept of truth, etc etc. Those are of God. Now there are also concepts of lies, deceit, and ill-intent. Those are the concepts of satan.
SupremeAmerican 9 months ago
@SupremeAmerican Yes, from your Christian point of view. Within the sphere of YOUR religion, you would think that. However, Pagans do not BELIEVE in the Christian notion of Satan. The devil with horns, etc. They believe in many different evil spirits, but they don't call him Satan, they don't believe he's out to ruin the cosmic plan and help deceive people into hell. That is not a part of their theology. That's like saying Native Americans believe in Satan because they also believe in ev spirits
fruitikay 9 months ago
@fruitikay Shows how much you know about Christian's Satan, who does NOT have "horns."
richard4president 9 months ago
@richard4president Jesus Christ. I KNOW HE DOESN'T HAVE HORNS. I was using that as an example for the devil of the Bible, who is a SPIRIT and obviously not a physical being. However, when you watch Shazo's vid, there are PICTURES of the DEVIL with horns because he is typically pictured like that in CHRISTIAN paintings from way back when to characterize who he is. Holy cheesburger.
fruitikay 9 months ago
@fruitikay By the way, I don't believe the Devil has horns. Just some handy pictures to represent him and so people have a quick and easy understanding of who is represented.
Shazoolo 9 months ago
@fruitikay no i am just stating the similarities that are being overlooked. The very concept of deceit itself is a one-collective-whole-concept. They just dont give it a name like christians do.
SupremeAmerican 9 months ago
@fruitikay Actually i am not a member of a religion.So that doesnt apply to me.
SupremeAmerican 9 months ago
@SupremeAmerican Meh, I disagree. Unfortunately all of Creation can be said to have originated with God. Saying something doesn't originate with God but with Satan is missing the point of God's Omnipotence and the fact that he created the entire cosmos. Therefor it is important to remember that it was God who created all of existence including the negative concepts and emotions.
PneumaAnima 8 months ago
All you are doing is playing off someone elses belife's to justify another how about proving evil spirits first?
greenelf12 9 months ago
First!!
MrZetterlund777 9 months ago
@MrZetterlund777 thirrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrd
SupremeAmerican 9 months ago
@SupremeAmerican Heeeeeyyyy, I didn't see all you guys... :P
MrZetterlund777 9 months ago