@alexbruce2 He's the worst ,arrogant,person that I know;And He has an amazing tecnique,sure,but anythink else,in my opinion.Historical pianists are,Sergio Fiorenitno,B.Michelangeli....with the prasing and dynamic tha Pollini can only dream.I worked with him several times,and everytime I was bored.
@Ellinidara io pollini lo conosco personalmente, e devo dire che non è arrogante, il gusto musicale può variare,ma pollini è un grande, ce ne fossero!
@4785689 Anche io purtroppo,ci ho lavorato,e tanto,ha una mentalità limitata,è odioso,e noioso,il feaseggio di un Arrau qualunque Pollini se lo sogna.
@Ellinidara si.. la persona èp stramba O.o ma devo dire che fino ad un pò di tempo fa suonava molto bene, poi s'è perso, hai f/book? magari possiamo parlare in tranquillità
La sensación que da esta música es que un sensibilidad elevada está siendo ahogada trágicamente, víctima de su propio descontrol ante un deseo prohibido. Obra como declaración final de una vida que ya no es soportable y donde la paz ya no se encuentra en otro lugar, que en la muerte.
Muerte apreciable en las últimas notas, en las que el alma se va consumiendo. Y ya en las 3 últimas... con un último suspiro... se apaga.
The final low Ds are out of tune! How is that that final D is almost ALWAYS out of tune on every piano? Is it a fault of piano construction? Anyway, the performance her is rather amazing in a heartless, efficient way. This pianist has never moved me.
I don`t know why should he play in another way...especially this piece... a lot of people has a completely wrong, feminine-like image in their head about Chopin. His music shouldn`t be played in a mushy way. He surely had the capacity to paint all the emotions of the existing paletta, but wasn`t just some sugared oyster some people want to imagine. Therefore this interpretation is just right in my opinion. And yes, I`m even a woman :)
@acortot `who understand Chopin better`...hm, we can’t ask Chopin himself and I’m quite convinced these arguments are more about personal taste which is and should be of course different. So many great pianists exist and play Chopin amazingly and they are there because they are talented and great musicians. I am studying Chopin’s music for 16 years now and am a musician myself but I wouldn’t say I know everything and I’m right all the time.
@acortot 2 It is only my personal opinion that Pollini plays Chopin in a way that he is in my top 3 Chopin-players together with V. Ashkenazy and V. Horowitz.
Most people will kill me for saying I don’t like Rubinstein, but that’s the way it is. I acknowledge his talent, but as he plays e.g. the nocturnes it’s boring and too slow for me. But again, it is a personal opinion as I have my personal taste. I don’t think there should be only one authentic player, acknowledged by all.
@acortot 3 Also, this piece seems right for me played like this. I find this fragment is somewhat desperate and can be interpreted as furious or revolutionary. To reach the desired effect and to make the audience cry (or feel any other emotion through music or acting) it’s not the pianist/actor who should cry or express those feelings -just play in a way that MAKES the audience cry (or feel other emotions). It is one of the worst acting mistakes to really cry on stage, THAT ruins a performance.
@acortot 4 The musician/actor has to stay in control and while for someone Pollini seems heartless or cold for me he expresses music more while staying in control. I dislike it so much when a pianist is swinging on the chair and tries to make us believe he is soooo inspired and sensitive and elevated by the music. He only needs to interpret and be some kind of channel between the author and the audience, but there is no need to overact.
@ Ellinidara Also someone’s performance has nothing to do with what kind of person the actual artist is in private. These are qualities that should be separated. I don`t need a musician to be handsome or a great person. Of course it`s better if he is ;) but that`s not his job... if he`s not a nice person sorry for the other musicians who are working with him...but the audience doesn`t really care...
Chopin was a great fan of singing and made it the cornerstone of his teaching
maybe you should learn to sing too.. then you might finally understand that everyone MUST sing with their own voice and let their spirit free if they are to make any impact musically.
At the time of chopin NO PIANIST became famous by playing someone else's music..
Pollini teaches the audience that a great artist must blindly follow directions.. he is the perfect employee
@acortot you are funny, I am in fact a singer- I never said I was a pianist...
yeah, I guess Pollini is just a musical robot, that is why he is sitting there playing, winning the Chopin concourse and Deutsche Grammophone was making several mistakes recording with him, too ;)...but why aren`t you sitting there instead then? I always say: instead of criticizing show us how to do it better! no statues have been erected for critics...
@findelka1810 sure..if you want to see a modern pianist 'do it better' all you have to do is listen to Cortot or Koczalski for example.. they are modern, play on modern instruments but they respect the key elements of Chopin to a greater extent.
Chopin played on small-sounding, soft-voiced Pleyels which were suited mainly for salon-playing and he absolutely hated anyone who played hard.
he was often criticized, even in his youth, for producing a 'small sound'..
@acortot "he was often criticized, even in his youth, for producing a 'small sound'.." especially because we know that he was sick most of his life and there are friends remembering that he was so weak he played the ending of his own berceause pianissimo (which he originally wrote fortissimo) as he wasn`t able to phisically produce a fortissimo. he himself said that Liszt plays his etudes better than him...and we know very well Liszt had an entirely dipperent playing style.
@findelka1810 regarding his prediliction for pianissimo: wrong! it wasn't because of his sickness, as he was already playing softly when he was young.
It mostly had to do with fine nuances in tone-color, and his belief that the 'listener should complete the picture'.. plus, he didn't like thumpers and those who played in the 'German' style.
@acortot about the ff ending I meant the Barcarolle, sorry (not the Berceuse). it IS ff in the manuscript and it is needed there. why are you so sure? he still used fortissimo as it is written in many manuscripts...Listen to the op.32 no.1 nocturne. you can not always play only between pp and p. I like his delicate and sophisticated ways, but in certain pieces you have to use ff! That`s how life works, it`s not only happy and good days, but a variety of good and bad, daylight and darkness,etc.
@findelka1810 The key-point is that Chopin's fortissimo was not shouting.
it was a measured, relative fortissimo.. probably because as a person he was very conscious of pleasing and supporting the salon-atmosphere of the aristocratic elite..
@acortot what I want to point out is that there are no pianists approved by Chopin himself who would be authentic, and noone can be as Chopin could have been. therefore the choice is ours to choose and like the one we feel authentic based on our knowledge of Chopin and his music.this will evidently differ. I really hope you have nothing else to add as I`m telling you for about the 4th time, I`m getting tired over arguing about personal taste.
@acortot yeah, I know that all, but try to play in a concert hall on a Pleyel and in a way which is destined for salon-music and that will be an inevitable FAIL.you wouldn`t even hear it. the whole attitude, medium, audience and even the purpose of music has changed in the past 150-200 years. and Chopin himself wrote pieces like the revolutionary etude and many others which you can not play on a soft and effeminated voice. it simply doesn`t make sense.
@findelka1810 The Etudes are just that: studies.. they are different in approach. as far as the audience and attitude having changed, I agree.. but that's not necessarily a good thing for the music's sake. Soft does not necessarily mean effeminated, it is simply a choice in dynamics.. you can communicate manly energies softly.. not all men shout.
@findelka1810 obviously when you hear someone from 1900 like cortot, Koczalski etc. you hear a version which has been modified because of the bigger pianos, the grand dramaticism of post-industrial life etc. Nobody respects the pedal markings, they play around with the score (just like pollini does) BUT they are much closer to Chopin.
Modern opera singers have suffered a similar fate. How could a Tetrazzini exist today?? she sounds too natural to pass through the modern classical system
@findelka1810 as far as Pollini being excellent because DG made him so, I would like to point-out that DG is not exactly an 'artistic' label although it is the biggest.
There are a lot of pianists who are in the same league if not better than Pollini, but Pollini was 'chosen' because of his style, or lack of it.classical has become dehumanized to the point that only professionals and die-hard followers of classical can tell modern pianists apart. Paderewski, De Pachmann etc. were individuals
@acortot Vous vous rendez compte des sottises que vous assénez ? Maurizio Pollini est un grand artiste et il est respecté comme tel par l'immense majorité du public et la totalité des musiciens professionnels. Et son jeu témoigne d'une très haute individualité justement : le choix qu'il a fait d'un refus du sentimentalisme ou de l'originalité à tout prix est la voie choisi autrefois par de nombreux pianistes : est-il si différent de Dinu Lipatti ?
@pianotonton I don't think there is much in common with Lipatti's style and Pollini. The only thing they have in common is a clean execution with measured rhythms.
Michelangeli was also a clean player but he is neither Lipatti or Pollini.. as for the 'majority' .. for decades in most record stores the ONLY recordings of the preludes you could find were pollini.. that's the reason people know him I guess.
I think the final Ds owe their tuning to the quality of the sound in this recording. I doubt they would've let the winner of a Chopin competition play on an piano that was not tuned prior to the concert. :-)
awesome
Ihaveadream97 1 year ago
qué fuerte..........
se me ponen los pelos como escarpias
barbarabarbi 2 years ago
This composition is a letter of suicide
astronomo16 2 years ago
Perfectly set the sound in the 19th century
astronomo16 2 years ago
I hate Pollini in every sense,but I admit this performance is absolutely amazing.Thanks for sharing.
Ellinidara 2 years ago
@Ellinidara
Why do you hate him???????????????
alexbruce2 1 year ago
@alexbruce2 He's the worst ,arrogant,person that I know;And He has an amazing tecnique,sure,but anythink else,in my opinion.Historical pianists are,Sergio Fiorenitno,B.Michelangeli....with the prasing and dynamic tha Pollini can only dream.I worked with him several times,and everytime I was bored.
Ellinidara 1 year ago
@Ellinidara io pollini lo conosco personalmente, e devo dire che non è arrogante, il gusto musicale può variare,ma pollini è un grande, ce ne fossero!
4785689 1 year ago
@4785689 Anche io purtroppo,ci ho lavorato,e tanto,ha una mentalità limitata,è odioso,e noioso,il feaseggio di un Arrau qualunque Pollini se lo sogna.
Ellinidara 1 year ago
@Ellinidara si.. la persona èp stramba O.o ma devo dire che fino ad un pò di tempo fa suonava molto bene, poi s'è perso, hai f/book? magari possiamo parlare in tranquillità
sono Marco Augusto Basso
4785689 1 year ago
@4785689 ...rispetto le opinioni di tutti:) P.S. Facebook non mi avrà mai...! ;-)
Ellinidara 1 year ago
La sensación que da esta música es que un sensibilidad elevada está siendo ahogada trágicamente, víctima de su propio descontrol ante un deseo prohibido. Obra como declaración final de una vida que ya no es soportable y donde la paz ya no se encuentra en otro lugar, que en la muerte.
Muerte apreciable en las últimas notas, en las que el alma se va consumiendo. Y ya en las 3 últimas... con un último suspiro... se apaga.
astronomo16 2 years ago
He's just a boy. A boy!!!!
—Daniel Day Lewis, in "There Will Be Blood"
mdoub 2 years ago
yeh, but WHAT a boy!!!
findelka1810 2 years ago
you don't understand anything
CHOCSAVEPROB 2 years ago
The final low Ds are out of tune! How is that that final D is almost ALWAYS out of tune on every piano? Is it a fault of piano construction? Anyway, the performance her is rather amazing in a heartless, efficient way. This pianist has never moved me.
billyguns2 2 years ago
I don`t know why should he play in another way...especially this piece... a lot of people has a completely wrong, feminine-like image in their head about Chopin. His music shouldn`t be played in a mushy way. He surely had the capacity to paint all the emotions of the existing paletta, but wasn`t just some sugared oyster some people want to imagine. Therefore this interpretation is just right in my opinion. And yes, I`m even a woman :)
findelka1810 2 years ago 7
By the way Pollini has great recordings where he is not cold at all. Of course, when needed...
findelka1810 2 years ago
You hit the nail on the head! That was very well said.
Hervinbalfour 2 years ago
well said
his technique is example to be followed
callenishss 2 years ago
check out my recordings, see if u like them, thanks
you might, given your preference
callenishss 2 years ago
@findelka1810 Chopin's music should not be played in a mushy way but it shouldn't be played like you are beating the piano into submission either.
I think it was Cortot that mentioned that Pollini was good but it wasn't Chopin?
This is the beginning of the modern style. There are other pianists who understand Chopin better.
acortot 1 year ago
@acortot `who understand Chopin better`...hm, we can’t ask Chopin himself and I’m quite convinced these arguments are more about personal taste which is and should be of course different. So many great pianists exist and play Chopin amazingly and they are there because they are talented and great musicians. I am studying Chopin’s music for 16 years now and am a musician myself but I wouldn’t say I know everything and I’m right all the time.
findelka1810 1 year ago
@acortot 2 It is only my personal opinion that Pollini plays Chopin in a way that he is in my top 3 Chopin-players together with V. Ashkenazy and V. Horowitz.
Most people will kill me for saying I don’t like Rubinstein, but that’s the way it is. I acknowledge his talent, but as he plays e.g. the nocturnes it’s boring and too slow for me. But again, it is a personal opinion as I have my personal taste. I don’t think there should be only one authentic player, acknowledged by all.
findelka1810 1 year ago
@acortot 3 Also, this piece seems right for me played like this. I find this fragment is somewhat desperate and can be interpreted as furious or revolutionary. To reach the desired effect and to make the audience cry (or feel any other emotion through music or acting) it’s not the pianist/actor who should cry or express those feelings -just play in a way that MAKES the audience cry (or feel other emotions). It is one of the worst acting mistakes to really cry on stage, THAT ruins a performance.
findelka1810 1 year ago
@acortot 4 The musician/actor has to stay in control and while for someone Pollini seems heartless or cold for me he expresses music more while staying in control. I dislike it so much when a pianist is swinging on the chair and tries to make us believe he is soooo inspired and sensitive and elevated by the music. He only needs to interpret and be some kind of channel between the author and the audience, but there is no need to overact.
findelka1810 1 year ago
@ Ellinidara Also someone’s performance has nothing to do with what kind of person the actual artist is in private. These are qualities that should be separated. I don`t need a musician to be handsome or a great person. Of course it`s better if he is ;) but that`s not his job... if he`s not a nice person sorry for the other musicians who are working with him...but the audience doesn`t really care...
findelka1810 1 year ago
@findelka1810
Chopin was a great fan of singing and made it the cornerstone of his teaching
maybe you should learn to sing too.. then you might finally understand that everyone MUST sing with their own voice and let their spirit free if they are to make any impact musically.
At the time of chopin NO PIANIST became famous by playing someone else's music..
Pollini teaches the audience that a great artist must blindly follow directions.. he is the perfect employee
acortot 1 year ago
@acortot you are funny, I am in fact a singer- I never said I was a pianist...
yeah, I guess Pollini is just a musical robot, that is why he is sitting there playing, winning the Chopin concourse and Deutsche Grammophone was making several mistakes recording with him, too ;)...but why aren`t you sitting there instead then? I always say: instead of criticizing show us how to do it better! no statues have been erected for critics...
findelka1810 1 year ago
@findelka1810 sure..if you want to see a modern pianist 'do it better' all you have to do is listen to Cortot or Koczalski for example.. they are modern, play on modern instruments but they respect the key elements of Chopin to a greater extent.
Chopin played on small-sounding, soft-voiced Pleyels which were suited mainly for salon-playing and he absolutely hated anyone who played hard.
he was often criticized, even in his youth, for producing a 'small sound'..
acortot 1 year ago
@acortot "he was often criticized, even in his youth, for producing a 'small sound'.." especially because we know that he was sick most of his life and there are friends remembering that he was so weak he played the ending of his own berceause pianissimo (which he originally wrote fortissimo) as he wasn`t able to phisically produce a fortissimo. he himself said that Liszt plays his etudes better than him...and we know very well Liszt had an entirely dipperent playing style.
findelka1810 1 year ago
@findelka1810 regarding his prediliction for pianissimo: wrong! it wasn't because of his sickness, as he was already playing softly when he was young.
It mostly had to do with fine nuances in tone-color, and his belief that the 'listener should complete the picture'.. plus, he didn't like thumpers and those who played in the 'German' style.
acortot 1 year ago
@acortot about the ff ending I meant the Barcarolle, sorry (not the Berceuse). it IS ff in the manuscript and it is needed there. why are you so sure? he still used fortissimo as it is written in many manuscripts...Listen to the op.32 no.1 nocturne. you can not always play only between pp and p. I like his delicate and sophisticated ways, but in certain pieces you have to use ff! That`s how life works, it`s not only happy and good days, but a variety of good and bad, daylight and darkness,etc.
findelka1810 1 year ago
@findelka1810 The key-point is that Chopin's fortissimo was not shouting.
it was a measured, relative fortissimo.. probably because as a person he was very conscious of pleasing and supporting the salon-atmosphere of the aristocratic elite..
kings don't shout.. only dictators shout.
acortot 1 year ago
@acortot who is talking about shouting? still, I don`t agree. I don`t think he cared about what others said about his music.
findelka1810 1 year ago
@findelka1810 Juste une chose : Chopin n'a pas dit que Liszt jouait mieux ses études que lui.
pianotonton 1 year ago
@pianotonton you can bear testimony to that, right? :D LOL
findelka1810 1 year ago
@acortot what I want to point out is that there are no pianists approved by Chopin himself who would be authentic, and noone can be as Chopin could have been. therefore the choice is ours to choose and like the one we feel authentic based on our knowledge of Chopin and his music.this will evidently differ. I really hope you have nothing else to add as I`m telling you for about the 4th time, I`m getting tired over arguing about personal taste.
findelka1810 1 year ago
@acortot yeah, I know that all, but try to play in a concert hall on a Pleyel and in a way which is destined for salon-music and that will be an inevitable FAIL.you wouldn`t even hear it. the whole attitude, medium, audience and even the purpose of music has changed in the past 150-200 years. and Chopin himself wrote pieces like the revolutionary etude and many others which you can not play on a soft and effeminated voice. it simply doesn`t make sense.
findelka1810 1 year ago
@findelka1810 The Etudes are just that: studies.. they are different in approach. as far as the audience and attitude having changed, I agree.. but that's not necessarily a good thing for the music's sake. Soft does not necessarily mean effeminated, it is simply a choice in dynamics.. you can communicate manly energies softly.. not all men shout.
acortot 1 year ago
@findelka1810 obviously when you hear someone from 1900 like cortot, Koczalski etc. you hear a version which has been modified because of the bigger pianos, the grand dramaticism of post-industrial life etc. Nobody respects the pedal markings, they play around with the score (just like pollini does) BUT they are much closer to Chopin.
Modern opera singers have suffered a similar fate. How could a Tetrazzini exist today?? she sounds too natural to pass through the modern classical system
acortot 1 year ago
Comment removed
pianotonton 1 year ago
@findelka1810 as far as Pollini being excellent because DG made him so, I would like to point-out that DG is not exactly an 'artistic' label although it is the biggest.
There are a lot of pianists who are in the same league if not better than Pollini, but Pollini was 'chosen' because of his style, or lack of it.classical has become dehumanized to the point that only professionals and die-hard followers of classical can tell modern pianists apart. Paderewski, De Pachmann etc. were individuals
acortot 1 year ago
@acortot Vous vous rendez compte des sottises que vous assénez ? Maurizio Pollini est un grand artiste et il est respecté comme tel par l'immense majorité du public et la totalité des musiciens professionnels. Et son jeu témoigne d'une très haute individualité justement : le choix qu'il a fait d'un refus du sentimentalisme ou de l'originalité à tout prix est la voie choisi autrefois par de nombreux pianistes : est-il si différent de Dinu Lipatti ?
pianotonton 1 year ago
@pianotonton I don't think there is much in common with Lipatti's style and Pollini. The only thing they have in common is a clean execution with measured rhythms.
Michelangeli was also a clean player but he is neither Lipatti or Pollini.. as for the 'majority' .. for decades in most record stores the ONLY recordings of the preludes you could find were pollini.. that's the reason people know him I guess.
acortot 1 year ago
@acortot as I told you there is no point of this whole argument as personal tastes remain personal-and subjective.
You can have the last word if that is of any pleasure for you, but don`t expect me to change my mind. :)
findelka1810 1 year ago
I think the final Ds owe their tuning to the quality of the sound in this recording. I doubt they would've let the winner of a Chopin competition play on an piano that was not tuned prior to the concert. :-)
rhapsodyinblue18 2 years ago
wow i wonder if they have Irina Zaritskaya who came a close 2nd.
chad410 3 years ago