Nooma- Breathe

[ColdFacedKilla]

But, for the sake of time, I will put this as simply as possible (ironically a paraphrase of Rob Bell): For some, the Bible itself has become a golden calf. The Bible is not the point. The point is knowing Jesus and the power of His resurrection. Instead of arguing over doctrine or scriptures, perhaps instead of talking endlessly about what the Bible IS, maybe Studying, Reading, and actually Doing what the Bible says is exponentially more important. We do not worship the Bible, but God alone.

[ColdFacedKilla]

But I'm off to bed for the moment, so feel free to leave a response for me to respond to in the morning ;) Love wins, amigo. Celebrate.

[ColdFacedKilla]

[Pt.6] Which leads me to ask, if God appeared to you tomorrow, and told you that hell does not exist, "Would you still follow Him, for all the love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness and self-control that you receive NOW, in THIS life?" Or are you just looking for "fire-insurance"? Are you more concerned with avoiding bad things, or doing good things? Do you spend more time avoiding sin, or seeking the good and holy things God has planned for you? In the end, LOVE wins.

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla You can't have the good and holy things God has planned for you without avoiding the sin. The very definition of Sin is to be disconnected from God. I could care less about "fire-Insurance" or your concept of sin. Sin is not an act. It's a state of being. That state of being is spiritual death. The spirit of God is no longer in you. Jesus came to save us because no man is capable of achieving salvation from works. You must be regenerated and born again spiritually.

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 But if the Jesus of the cross, the Jesus who forgave the whore when the church "leaders" stood ready to execute her, the Jesus who washed his disciples' feet, the Jesus who wept when Lazarus died, who asked His Father to forgive those who were crucifying Him, who accepted His task despite His fear, if that's not the Jesus we're talking about, then my apologies. I was under the impression that the Son reflected the Father (John 1:18), that those who follow the Son follow the Father.

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla That is the same being we are talking about. You are taking a small fraction of the actions of Jesus and building a doctrine with no context. Study further and you will see where your mistaken logic lies. Jesus did all those things. The only thing that will get you salvation is accepting his sacrifice on the cross for your sins. Love is the only doctrine that Jesus endorses true. Jesus said don't argue over doctrine and agree upon me. Love is secondary to The Lord Jesus Christ.

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 I'd point you to John 14:15-24, where Jesus tells his disciples repeatedly that those love Him will follow His commands. Now, He was probably talking about the two greatest commandments, wouldn't you say? Love the Lord with all your heart, soul, mind and strength, and love your neighbor as yourself. Funny how we seem to have no interest in dealing with that pesky second commandment, huh? If we love Jesus (and follow Him, and thus are "saved"), then we would follow His commands, right?

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla You define these as commandments. They are not. The proper context was in reference to doctrine. We know that Jesus hates religion. We see in what you just posted Jesus believes this is the only doctrine. We also know that Jesus said don't fight over doctrine but agree on me. Meaning Doctrine is not important Jesus is. Everything needs to be in context. Which is why verses were not in the orignal writings.

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 lol I'm pretty sure that, when the disciples asked Jesus what the greatest COMMANDMENT was, and He responded with these two, He made them commandments. Reread Matthew 22:36-40, where the specific word "commandment" is used three times in reference to these two spoken by Jesus to His disciples. But we can argue over commands vs. commandments all day long. Try again ;)

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla Read different translations. Do you honestly think the bible was translated perfectly? Do you honestly think that each word is exactly the same. It's absolutely not. In fact it's not even close in most cases. That would be the reason the context of this entire discussion with Jesus was over Doctrine and not covenants or commandments. Context is key something you can't seem to grasp because you base your context on your doctrine. You will never see the truth without bias.

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla Read different translations. Do you honestly think the bible was translated perfectly? Do you honestly think that each word is exactly the same. It's absolutely not. In fact it's not even close in most cases. That would be the reason the context of this entire discussion with Jesus was over Doctrine and not covenants or commandments. Context is key something you can't seem to grasp because you base your context on your doctrine. You will never see the truth without bias.

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla Love is the only doctrine Jesus said was correct. Love you God and your Neighbor. Jesus did not however say it would provide you with salvation. He said quite the opposite. He spoke regularly of Hell and Sin and turning from deviant behavior which prevented you from loving your neighbor. You could be the best person in the world and think you love everyone. None of that actually matters if your spiritually dead. Any opinion to the contrary is just that. It's not in the bible.

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 On that point we seem to agree. Sin is not a single act (since all sin is the same in God's eyes), but a state of being. Consider it this way: If I have to quit smoking, and all I do every minute of every day is tell myself, "I can't smoke." repeatedly to myself, will it be difficult for me to quit? What if, instead, I found more productive ways to relieve stress and replace my unhealthy habits with healthy ones? Running away vs. Running toward. There's quite a difference, actually.

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla Doing healthy and productive things is better. But you seem to be equating this with sin and it's not. The only thing that can truly help you avoid smoking again is the Holy Spirit. Love is not going to solve your problems. Love is not for you. Love is how we treat others. It's not a happy time. It requires we suffer fools and endure hardships for others. It's not about us it's about everyone else. It's not a way to heaven it's our natural state of being if we follow Christ.

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 Funny how you and I talk about the same things in different contexts, huh? Well, let me present you with this question, then: Do you believe the Holy Spirit is concerned with whether or not you're a smoker? If you are someone who smokes, do you lack the belief in Jesus necessary to overcome that habit? Once you become a "born-again," if you fall back into the habit of smoking later, was your "conversion" just false sensationalism? Does Jesus PROTECT you from sin, or FORGIVE you of it?

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla First why is smoking a sin? Sin is spiritual death. Smoking therefore is not a sin. But instead is an addiction. Addictions are your master and therefore God is not. So addiction is the real problem not smoking. Smoking is bad for your body so it's also not good. If you have faith in God he will redeem you from addictions, ailments, unclean spirits, and even death. We know this. Jesus testified to it.

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla Jesus also stated the holly spirit will leave you if you defile yourself (I am paraphrasing). When you choose addiction over God you have defiled yourself. I am always amazed that people have not done the basic study of the entire book they quote from to realize these things. Sin is not an action man can take (except Adam). We are born into sin we have no choice. We are evil beings from our inception. Jesus saves us by giving us a new spirit. We are not longer spiritually dead.

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 Well, where should we start with this one? Ephesians 1:13-14? John 14:16? 2Corinthians 1:22? Ephesians 4:30? Honestly, I don't know where to start. What you're referring to would probably be the OLD TESTAMENT Holy Spirit in- and out-dwelling (1Samuel 16:13-14). However, after the ascension of Christ into heaven in the NEW Testament, ALL of this changes (Acts 2). The PERMANENT indwelling of the Holy Spirit is the fulfillment of God’s promise to always be with us, to never forsake us.

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla Jesus does not PROTECT us from anything but spiritual death. Jesus did teach us how to protect ourselves from demons, sickness, thoughts of depravity, and the like. God sent the Holy Spirit to live in us that we could be free of these things. It's still our choice but we have the power and the tools to overcome it ourselves. We can cast out demons ourselves. We an heal people ourselves. We can do everything Jesus did and greater by his own admission. Only because Jesus Saved us.

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla You think your walking in love. Your judging what you think I believe. You have thrown out a doctrine which you think I must believe.You have no idea what I believe. That is not love. Love is patience, kindness, and long suffering. It's painful and not pleasant. Love is not an emotion it's an act. It's something you do for no other reason than it's right.

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 Right, I don't yet know what your beliefs are, because the only statements we have to try and understand your point of view were your comments from several months ago. But yes, thank you, I'm quite aware of the reflective qualities of love. And it's easy to love someone you agree with, no? My question to you would be, how often do you encounter people that you find difficult to love? Abortion doctors? Homosexuals? Atheists? Terrorists? Are they difficult for you to love and accept?

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla It's not difficult for me to love anyone. Acceptance of their behavior is not commanded, suggested, or even condoned in the bible. At the same time it is not my place to judge them for their sins. If I accept them which Jesus most certainly did not without repentance then I am of the world. If I tolerate them I can show them the love of Jesus Christ. Acceptance and Tolerance are polar opposites.

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 Would you be referring to the fact that sitting down to dine with "sinners" (a custom of acceptance) was considered unacceptable back in Jesus' day? Was there a line at the door for people to repent of their sins BEFORE sitting down at the table with Jesus? I wasn't aware of that fact lol.

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla There you go taking things out of context trying to win a debate instead of learn something. Jesus did not accept sin. Jesus told everyone of them to turn away from sin. He did not accept anyone that did not accept him. Jesus did not turn them away from his table either. He tolerated their sin nature because he walked in love. Jesus teaches that to be all things to all people. But we are not to become of the world. Jesus accepted those who called him lord. He tolerated most.

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 Oh, I wasn't aware that the Bible said to "tolerate sinners, and pray for those who persecute you." I guess you don't realize that you downplay the greatness and totality of Jesus' love by placing His Love within these parameters of "Love" and "Tolerate". A Jesus who simply TOLERATED those who didn't follow Him isn't a big enough Jesus for me to follow. Sorry. There's nothing extraordinary about that kind of love, the kind we see on the streets everyday lol.

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla Jesus is Jesus. You can't define him. You can't change him. Jesus loves man and hates sin. So how can he accept a man who has no desire to repent of their sin nature? You write like Jesus is moldable and can be turned into something else. Jesus is who he said he was in the bible. Take the entire bible in it's totality and you will find proper context. Just as Rob Bell you have used man's logic to define a deity. You have used your own definitions of love. Then you called it Jesus

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla If you were not aware that the bible told you to tolerate sinners it shows your total lack of biblical understanding. Jesus said love the man hate the sin. What do you think that means? Jesus said no man comes to the father but through him. What do you think that means? Jesus said no fornicators, adulterers, or the like will enter the kingdom of heaven. Does he not love those people too? Love is not enough to make it to heaven according to the only Jesus.

[ColdFacedKilla]

Welcome back to the conversation lol. Now, you claim Jesus told us to "hate the sin, love the sinner." Would you be referring to what I mentioned earlier, where Jesus told us to "love [our] enemies, and pray for those who persecute [us]"? If you thought Jesus was telling us to simply "tolerate" sinners instead of loving them as ourselves (because they're our neighbors as well), that does more to show your lack of understanding about the true nature of Jesus than anything you've written so far.

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla Your lack of understanding of basic human interaction seems to be flawed. Loving people is not the same as loving sin. Love does not require acceptance. Otherwise you are saying you either accept my position or you hate me. You can try to tell me this is not true but if love is dependent on acceptance those are your truths. If you work in the field you say you should know the basic definition of tolerance and acceptance and the difference between them.

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 Is my "lack of understanding" flawed? Or did you mean to say that just my understanding of basic human interaction seems to be flawed? And are we using our HUMAN interactions as a basis for our preconceptions of GOD's behavior? I think we are (and if you didn't catch it, by "we," I just mean "you" lol)~ "your truths"? Is there now more than one truth? Can I have a truth as well as you? Can they be total and complete opposite truths? Please, do enlighten me with this profound theory. lol

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla There is only one truth. Seriously man you think you have it figured out. But you are skipping the entire context in which you are spouting this stuff off. Which is a sign that you have not really read anything. Your just playing with words and debating this and judging my beliefs based on your morally superior beliefs. What you fail to realize is your beliefs use words like "probably". Don't judge is a good place to start your study. You assume a lot about me from the start.

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 lol Good point. Now go and do the same ;-) Try not to judge one person (Rob Bell, maybe?) based on one line in an interview (by the way, hopefully you found time in your busy school day- I mean, work day to read that. I know it's long, but it'll help you to open your mind up a little. Must be stuffy in there lol).

[ColdFacedKilla]

Welcome back to the conversation lol. Now, you claim Jesus told us to "hate the sin, love the sinner." Would you be referring to what I mentioned earlier, where Jesus told us to "love [our] enemies, and pray for those who persecute [us]"? If you thought Jesus was telling us to simply "tolerate" sinners instead of loving them as ourselves (because they're our neighbors as well), that does more to show your lack of understanding about the true nature of Jesus than anything you've written so far.

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 Welcome back to the convo lol. Now, you claim Jesus told us to "hate the sin, love the sinner." Are you referring to what I mentioned earlier, where Jesus told us to "love [our] enemies, and pray for those who persecute [us]"? If you thought Jesus was telling us to simply "tolerate" sinners instead of loving them as ourselves (because they're our neighbors as well), that does more to show your lack of understanding about the true nature of Jesus than anything you've written so far.

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 Welcome back to the convo lol. Now, you claim Jesus told us to "hate the sin, love the sinner." Are you referring to what I mentioned earlier, where Jesus told us to "love [our] enemies, and pray for those who persecute [us]"? If you thought Jesus was telling us to simply "tolerate" sinners instead of loving them as ourselves (because they're our neighbors as well), that does more to show your lack of understanding about the true nature of Jesus than anything you've written so far.

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 Welcome back to the convo lol. Now, you claim Jesus told us to "hate the sin, love the sinner." Are you referring to what I mentioned earlier, where Jesus told us to "love [our] enemies, and pray for those who persecute [us]"? If you thought Jesus was telling us to simply "tolerate" sinners instead of loving them as ourselves (because they're our neighbors as well), that does more to show your lack of understanding about the true nature of Jesus than anything you've written so far.

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla If Jesus accepted everyone then he would not have called people evil liars who's fathers were satan. He would have accepted the pharisees and not spoken out about them. He would have accepted the prostitute and not said turn away from your life of sin. That is not acceptance. That is love and patience explaining to her she was no worse than anyone else. Since we are all born evil it was not accepting her actions or lifestyle.

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 Wow. This entire time, I've been TALKING about accepting the person for exactly who they are in that moment. Perhaps, BECAUSE of His Love, Jesus ACCEPTS us all where we are right now, regardless of how long we've been walking with Him, but BECAUSE of His Love, He urges us not to stay stagnant where we are.

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla Jesus accepts the repentant. There is no evidence anywhere in the entire bible to the contrary. Any idea that you have that involves salvation without repentance of your sin nature is not supported with the bible at all. Jesus and God are bound by the very laws and convenants they have created. You don't get a pass because God loves you. Why then would God have sent Jesus to save us from our sin? Surely if Love was enough God could have just pardoned us all and saved us from hell

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 You say that you know what Love is. But you still seem to be confusing it with some touchy-feely human emotion. Are you sure Love wasn't enough to reconcile us to God? Because His only Son dying on the cross, that WAS Love, in its purest form. The Flood? That was because He Loves us. "Sodom & Gomorrah" (You misspelled it earlier)? Yep, you guessed it. Love. Those incidents that you point to saying, "These are the results of God's wrath!" are actually results of His Love for us.

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla I hate to tell you but God himself disagrees with you. Also Jesus disagrees with you that Love is all you need to be accepted into heaven. Your doctrine was established before you studied the bible. I am still not convinced you have ever studied it. Because even with your false doctrine you would have had to come across the statements Jesus made condemning people for living a life of sin. The debate is over at that point. Salvation requires more than love.

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 lol Did God appear to you just now and tell you that? Is He still around? Maybe you could ask Him why He killed all those people in His acts of genocide. However, one loose screw you still can't seem to correct is when you talk about "love." Now, if I was to say that I love Jesus, and spend my life following His commands, and die, you still say that my love was not enough to save me. Or are you still trying to separate "love" from its byproducts (i.e. the way we live our lives)?

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla Seriously man read the bible. God tells you in the bible. Just as I have said before. You have no clue what your talking about. Read it please. Plain as day write there in black and white text for all to read. No special powers necessary. Love does not equate to salvation. Show me the exact words in the bible that say it does. Show me where it says it? You can't because Jesus never said it. He did say exactly what was required and I have told you many times what it was.

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 Read the Bible?! What a concept! I guess that's all I had to do.. lol Wonder why I've been wasting all this time actually trying to apply what the Bible says, when all I had to do was read it. Thanks for clearing that up for me! Off to be a "real" Christian! xD xD

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla The fact that you even said "is He still around?" is very telling. How can you have a relationship with God if he is not around? I talk to God every day. Every day God talks to me. I am one of several million people that experience this phenomenon so I know I am not crazy. This is the divine power of the Holy Spirit. Again please study the bible and stop acting like you know something because Rob Bell said it.

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 lol I take it you aren't familiar with the term "sarcasm." I realize it's difficult to decipher sarcastic comments here on YouTube, so I'll be sure to amend any future sarcastic statements with a * or parentheses. It's okay, you don't have to worry your pretty little head about it. Our community will still continue to ask questions, grow in our faith, and not judge you for your different beliefs. And thank you for letting me know that someone like you prays lol. That was sarcasm, btw.

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla You should really re-read what my posts. I called you out on your emotion love long ago. I provided the biblical definition of love to you. I think it's clear I know what love is. Now you are using my own words against me? This debate was over at the beginning sadly. You can't prove anything you say and you reject the teaching of Jesus himself. Salvation is not free because Jesus Loves us. There is a stipulation which he state himself. Go find it and then tell me what it was.

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 You say that you know what Love is. But you still seem to be confusing it with some touchy-feely human emotion. Are you sure Love wasn't enough to reconcile us to God? Because His only Son dying on the cross, that WAS Love, in its purest form. The Flood? That was because He Loves us. "Sodom & Gomorrah" (You misspelled it earlier)? Yep, you guessed it. Love. Those incidents that you point to saying, "These are the results of God's wrath!" are actually results of His Love for us.

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 Do you actually read what you write before posting it? lol You talk about God & Jesus as if they are beings that can be understood within the parameters of our faulty logic. But the biggest giveaway that you know less about the Bible than even you claim is the fact that you still seem unable to grasp that the entire point of the Word of God being given to us, the superseding purpose of the Bible is to show God's great Love for His people, and their redemption through Christ's sacrifice.

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla You crack me up. Yes you can understand them with their own definitions they provided. That's why the bible was created. That is why the Holy Spirit was given to us. The fact that you think otherwise is proof that your doctrine is false as I have stated from the start. The bible was given to us because of salvation not to show us love. Salvation was given to us because of God's Love. Love is not why we got the bible. Nor is love what provides salvation.

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 Your zeal is commendable at best, but sorely misguided. Unfortunately, you lost what little credibility you had left here when you said, "The Bible [wasn't] given to us to show us love." Perhaps you were talking about the Law, which was given to us to show that no one has the ability to earn their own salvation. Perhaps you were taught incorrect doctrine from your leaders, which is no fault of your own. But perhaps Jesus will show Himself to you one day, on your road to Damascus ;) GL

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla Wow do you not see how arrogant and judgemental these comments are? I mean despite the fact that you seemingly won't prove your claims biblically. You have a severe moral superiority complex going on. Jesus has revealed himself to me many times. I have never been concerned with my credibility with you. The debate started over you telling me I had an unhealthy state of mind. Further judgements and moral superiority. I wonder is that love? No answer I bet.

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 xD

I tell you the truth about your mental state because I love you as a step-brother in God (since you and I seem to come from two different Jesus's lol). No one else has the heart to tell you *sadface* But don't worry, it'll wear off soon ;-)

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla Well I am glad you just put a nail in your own argument. First there are not step-brothers in heaven. LOL second you just spoke as a pharisee did to Jesus. Your prostitute in the square judgement argument was specifically in reference to what you just did. You did not tell me that in love at all. You told me that out of ignorance and pride. Thank you for that by the way. My work here is done. You have proven exactly what I have been saying better than I ever could. Good Job!

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 lmao isn't it hilarious that we can say the same stuff to each other? Alas, no one here is worried about what you think of them, or what you believe the Bible says. We all understand the importance of listening to our Creator. But, like I said, we don't worship the Bible. Go on about your book, and we'll keep worshiping God Himself. Sadly, no one here is gonna change their minds based on what you or I write, so it was fun while it lasted. Hilarious that you compare yourself to Jesus lol

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla I am done with your comical attempts to prove me wrong. You show me where the bible ever stated or inferred it was given to us to show us God's love and I will show you where God wanted to destroy all of man kind. That was not love by any definition. That was wrath as God clearly stated. Seriously use God's own words not Rob Bell's. You might learn something. God did not destroy entire races or people out of love. He did so out of wrath as he stated in the bible. I am done.

[ColdFacedKilla]

It's a shame that you still seem to think that God didn't love the people of Sodom. Did Jesus hate the Pharisees? Probably not. Was Jesus holding them to a higher standard than the rest of the people, since they claimed to be "teachers" of the law? Probably. Did that mean His disappointment was greater when He saw the supposed "leaders" of God's people acting like fools? I'll give you two guesses, but you'll only need one. Now, did the Bible specifically say "Jesus was disappointed with [cont..]

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla It's a shame you can't stop misquoting me. I never said he did not love them. I said the act of destroying them was not love. As God stated it was judgment also defined as Wrath in the bible. Jesus stated the Pharisees were of their father Satan. Hard to find any love in that statement. This is really bible 101 man. If you bothered to read anything about Jesus and the interaction with the Pharisees you would not have to guess or assume.

[ColdFacedKilla]

[cont..] the Pharisees, but didn't hate them"? No. However, that is what most people call "the result of reading, study, discussion and actual life application of the Word of God." Maybe a little less "God is this, God is that," and take a cue from Rob Bell. Don't shy away from the difficult questions because they may go against what you currently believe. Or worse, that they may turn your way of thinking around {gasp!}. What a horrible thing that would be, right? lol

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla I will say that I have a job where I must regularly deal with truly evil people. I don't hate them. I don't treat them any less than I would treat my own family. They are people just the same. I also deal with people society has written off as evil people. They are often times just lacking the skills to fit into society. They have never learned about Jesus or morality. They simply don't understand it. Who am I to condemn them? They are people and I show them respect and help them

[ColdFacedKilla]

Well, definitely kudos on doing your part to reach out to those that society (and let's face it, most of the modern "church") has cast out as exiles. As a long-time practitioner in the field of social work in America, I've seen more than I care to admit the evils of the legalistic church, more concerned with filling their coffers than redistributing the tithe among the community (which was the original intent behind it, and directly flies in the face of our capitalistic society).

[ColdFacedKilla]

I've witnessed the Church becoming a weak dog, following the drums of war & the nationalistic pride of this country's misguided zealots with its tail between its legs. When it becomes clearer to me every time I pick up the Bible that both God & Jesus intended for OUR relationship with Him to supercede the surrounding culture, it has become increasingly more frustrating to see our culture continue to shape those who claim to follow Jesus. So please excuse my jaded-ness. Now I'm really off to bed.

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla What you don't understand does not constitute a failure of the church. Jesus is the prince of peace yet he battled with Satan for 3 days in Hell. Jesus is coming back to wage war before the peace. You don't know the hearts of other men unless they tell you. Everything you just complained about is something you don't like. God has ordered mass genocide before. God made Egypt attack Moses so he could be glorified. Renew your mind with the bible and you will see your mistaken logic.

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla How does your doctrine explain Sadam and Gamora or the flood? It was Good because God did it. God does not always love man as evident by those actions. That is why Jesus was sent because God chose love over justice. But there is no way to the father without Jesus. Jesus requires you believe in your heart and confess with your mouth that he is lord and savior. No amount of new age love changes that. All you need to go to heaven.

[TheSunshine2006]

:)

[cheshirealleycat]

Bloody brilliant mate

[bella50008]

Pied Piper of Hell..(the real one).

[babysister32656]

Umm.... Rob Bell preaches from the Bible. If you have a problem with him then you have a problem with the Bible; and if you have a problem with the Bible then you have a problem with God. Everything Rob Bell teaches is backed up with scripture and with Bible facts. Fact is in Hebrew that breathe and spirit are the same word. Thats linguistics and you cant argue with that. Stop being so religious and read the Bible for yourself. Stop listening to the nay sayers of man who preach their opinions.

[frty130]

@babysister32656 Rob Bell also stated that Hell does not exist. Hell is clearly defined in the bible several times. Let's not forget the Lake of fire either. You can quote the bible and say it means anything. That does not mean that what you said is true. If your perverting the bible it's no longer truth. I can refute everything Rob Bell says with a bible verse. I can refute the few true things he says the same as the many false things he says. The bible taken out of Context is not God's word.

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 [Pt.1, b/c I already know this'll be lengthy] Well, you certainly have the right to your opinion, amigo. On the other hand, there are those of us who rejoice in what God does through Rob Bell's messages, namely inspiring stagnant, pew-filler Christians to get up out of their seats, to go out of the church, and into the world, actually FOLLOWING the one they call Christ. But there are both hands and feet in the Church, so maybe Rob's job description is a little different than your own.

[ColdFacedKilla]

[Pt.3] However, directly addressing your apparent disagreement with all things Rob Bell ("Hell does not exist"), allow me to direct you to an article that articulates the circumstances that led to the writing of his book "Love Wins," which I'm assuming is the source you're basing your disagreement upon: (time.com/time/magazine/articl­e/0,9171,2065289,00.html). If you don't have time to read the short article, I'll do my best to sum up the actions preceding his book...

[ColdFacedKilla]

[Pt.4] In 2007, Rob Bell's church holds an art exhibit during a series focused on peacemaking and finding peace in a broken world. One of the exhibits featured a quote by Mohandas Gandhi. A visitor to the exhibit (assuming it was a fellow church-goer) decided to take it upon themselves to stick a reminder (for all future visitors who might {gasp!} be inspired by said quote) to the exhibit itself: "Reality check: He's in hell." Wow. Good to see SOME people still keep Jesus' perspective {facepalm}

[ColdFacedKilla]

[Pt.5] In response to this misguided zealot's Post-It statement, Rob begins thinking "Really? Gandhi's in hell? We have confirmation of this? And someone decided to take on the responsibility of letting the rest of us know?" The following line from the interview explains his perspective: "Bell insists he is only raising the possibility that theological RIGIDITY — and thus a faith of EXCLUSION — is a dangerous thing." In other words, focusing on who you keep out rather than who you bring in.

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla Satan also teaches leave the church and go out into the world. Jesus Christ never said leave the church. Jesus did say go out into the world and become all things to all people. But don't become of the world and defile yourself. You know nothing about me or my religious views. What I will say is that you can't follow Jesus Christ if you don't know what he taught. You can't follow Christ without the Holly Spirit. Yet there are people claiming it's all a lie. Jesus taught otherwise

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla I think most people have no idea what Jesus taught or what his real reason for being here was. There are also those that know full well and still teach it was about being a good person and never sinning. Even Jesus said that was impossible. That is why we have grave through him. However without the Grace of Jesus Christ through his sacrifice you suffer eternal separation from God. That is not what Rob Bell believes at all. He has stated no loving God could do that.

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 You're right in that aspect. Most people filling the church buildings we've constructed for ourselves have NO idea what Jesus was about. They simply show up on Sunday, forget what they heard, and go about their weeks because "they go to church and are SAVED because they believe that Jesus existed," so they have nothing to worry about, especially concerning hell. They lead lives that have no interest in being transparent with one another, or leaning on one another as a community of faith

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla I have to say your a bit prejudiced unfairly on this point. I know because I previously had this same point of view. Then I decided to get to know these people I looked down upon for not being more like me. I realized I was wrong. I was judging them. I was being self righteous. I did not know them or what they believed. Just as you I made blanket judgements about most people. Then I learned what Jesus was about and why he actually came. I realized I was the fool. We can't judge

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 lol I'm afraid you misread the meaning of my post there entirely. I wasn't stating those as examples of those I find difficult to love. I was asking you if YOU have trouble showing the same love and acceptance to them that you so freely and undeservedly receive from God on a daily basis.

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla Contrary to popular belief God has rules. God is the definition of good. Satan simply means emnity with God. Anything God does is good contrary to man's opinion. God can't lie. When God speaks it becomes a reality as we see in Genesis. So he really can't lie. No curse can stand before God or it's destroyed. The earth and humans are cursed. So for God to come to the earth all of mankind would die. Sin is a dead spirit cut off from God. Not an act.

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 I hope you see the revolving door that we've entered here: You say that God will punish those who do wrong because He is a holy God. I say that God will forgive those who do not deserve His forgiveness because He is a loving God (and actually, NONE of us deserve His forgiveness, no matter what prayer we may have prayed when we were 9 years old kneeling in front of the pulpit), which seems to be one of the main reasons for Jesus to come, die, and rise again = [Reconciliation].

[ColdFacedKilla]

But if the Jesus of the cross, the Jesus who forgave the whore when the church "leaders" were ready to execute her, the Jesus who washed the feet of His disciples, the Jesus who asked His Father to forgive those who were crucifying Him, the Jesus who wept when Lazarus died, who still accepted His task despite His fear, if He's not the Jesus of question, my apologies. Because I was under the impression that the Son reflects the Father (John 1:18). And those who follow Him, follow the Father.

[ColdFacedKilla]

@frty130 [Pt.2] When you say that you can refute EVERYTHING Rob Bell says with Bible verses, are you referring to EVERYTHING in this particular video? Or were you referring to everything Rob Bell has ever suggested to all of us through his Nooma video series? If the former, I feel we can have a healthy discussion right here about the topic that Rob discusses in this barely-two-minute video. If the latter, then we'll need a much lengthier forum to bring you back to a healthy mental state.

[frty130]

@ColdFacedKilla Good to see you don't judge people. Hypocrites always think their clever and a follower of Christ. You have already established I am insane based on your own prejudice. Just like your Story of the note left on the Ghandi quote. Rob Bell does not follow Christ. He teaches a twisted doctrine. If any of his followers actually took the time to study their bible they would know this. The followers I know have no interest in ancient books. They are interested in feeling good about God.

[MyDebbiem]

@babysister32656 well said!

[Isaiah53Jesus]

This is SO wrong! When Adam ate the forbidden fruit, he died - the breath of God went out of him. To belong to God, one must be born again, from above (John 3). Jesus breathed on His disciples and said, "Receive the Holy Ghost". (John 20:22) Romans 8:9 - if you don't have the Holy Spirit, you do not belong to God. You must be born again. Rob Bell is a liar, a New Age change agent, and a false teacher. Run from him and the Emerging Church.

[rickgigliotti]

false teacher

[drjosephus]

wtf ?

[piper1800]

im not religious but i found this video powerful

[Bullpuma]

@piper1800 LCOB and ATMA(the american) are also powerful

[willwill100]

No. We are NOT divine dirt. This is very mistaken. You won't find such a claim within the pages of scripture.

[babysister32656]

Websters define divine as: of, relating to, or proceeding directly from God or a god.

As christians we are of God & relate to God & all humans are from God since He created us & all in His image. We are but dust the scriptures says. God made Adam out of the dust of the earth...DIRT. From what we came from so shall we return to. Dust to dust, so yes we're divine & yes we are dirt so Rob Bell is cleverly saying God made us & as Christians we are sanctified (separated & Holy). We are Divine Dirt.

[willwill100]

@babysister32656 What we DO know is that man was made in God's image, created for a relationship with the God of the universe. We don't proceed directly from God, we are not some kind of gradation of God's being. Created sure but don't proceed. We are not "a God" but we do relate to God. We need to be careful to preserve the distinction between the Creator and creation. God is divine and we are not; there are no degrees of divinity. Lev 19:2, we are to be like God but not "be God" at all.

[TheAnonynja]

The hell is this guy babbling on about o_O

[KeswickCamp08]

we watch these videos at camp :)

[YurikoUchiha]

@KeswickCamp08 I go to Keswick too!!!!! They didn't watch them when I was there, but they did when my sister was. I watch these in youth group all the time though.

[Sarrahbee]

This is definitely one of my favorite nooma videos

[hockeykid30b]

i love this video. it makes so much sence to me. it makes me appreciate god even more:)

[26kateness]

Don't try to impact on others your view of things. If you believe its wrong, that is your oppinion. Do not try to degrade someone elses point of view... its theirs too own as much as urs is

[frty130]

@26kateness The problem is God defines the correct point of view not the individual. You can't create your own God and bible and forget the parts your don't like. Rob Bell has to eliminate half the bible to make all his claims even possible. Those who are ignorant are deceived and hear what they want. Every Christian is commanded by Jesus to spread the correct Gospel of Jesus Christ. God defined himself in the bible. Rob Bell even admits this. He just leaves out the parts he does not like.

[PTHoopster14]

This is WRONG. That verse is talking about the length of life, not about how glorious we are. God created us as weak. Paul says in 1 Corinthians that in our weakness, He is strong. He crowned us with HIS glory and honor. Not our own.

Psalm 39:4-5 says, "Show me, O LORD, my life's end and the number of my days; let me know how fleeting is my life. You have made my days a mere handbreadth; the span of my years is as nothing before you. Each man's life is but a breath.

[sugarsled]

@PTHoopster14 Wait... didn't God create Adam as strong? He called him "good." Didn't he?

[Voileen]

I think what R.B. is saying (and this is just my opinion) is that we, as God's creation, have the potential to be as glorious as we were initially created to be. But this is impossible without God. For HE is the one who gives us strength. You are right in saying that we were crowned with HIS glory and honor, but through HIM we can become what HE first made us to be. Not perfect, because we are sinners, but spiritual. If spirit means breath, than what does spiritual mean? Breathed into.

[philWynk]

@PTHoopster14 No, Bell is correct. The writer of Hebrews actually uses the same interpretation of Psalm 8 as referring to the glory of man, in chapter 2 -- and associates it with the rising kingship of Messiah Jesus. Yes, the glory ultimately comes from God, but what of it? He's given it to us, and that's what Bell says.

Stop looking for heresy where there is none.

[blccwood]

its my favorite too!:)

[kassafrass1]

I watched Breathe for the first time last week and I LOVE it. The message just gives me goosebumps.

[PompousFlea]

Well that was pretty empty. Am I the only one who got nothing out of that other than a basic Hebrew/Greek lesson?

[DivineAnger]

this is my favorite nooma!

[Taidaishar]

I don't think he's saying that all people who breathe or have breath in them also have the spirit in them just because the same greek word is used.

I think he's just trying to point out the implications of that. There's a reason that the same word is used for both. Maybe he just wants you to think about what it means. Remember, these videos are just precursors to his actual sermons.

[021679]

He is saying that every person on earth have the spirit in them....unfortunatley and incorrectly. I hope you're right...but from what I know of Bell he is saying just that.

[emily51805]

there is a difference between having spirit- what all of us have, because we have been breathed into by the Creator- and The (Holy) Spirit. If you watch and listen again, I think you'll see what he's saying more clearly.

[vVLightSourceVv]

we actaully do all have the Holy Spirit dwelling within us...in Romans...im not sure where for sure sry..ill get back with that...it states that we all were born with righteousness and a sense of right and wrong which is the Spirit.Whether we listen to it or not is our choice

[Taidaishar]

I believe you are incorrect in that assertion LightSource. You will definitely have to produce scripture to back it up. I'm pretty sure the Holy Spirit comes to dwell within us when we are saved and not before that.

[vVLightSourceVv]

yes, i dont know what i was thinking writing that, i believe i meant to say that we all are born with a sense of right and wrong (which i wrongfully referred to as righteousness)....we all know that murder is wrong and stealing is frowned upon etc. The things we all know are wrong without being told so otherwise. that's a better way of phrasing it. I used the wrong words completely. Thank you very much for calling me out on that, i must have been really tired, i apologize profusely.

[bschluep2]

Thank you for speaking Truth.  Breath deeply - it's all good!

Namaste,

JS Michaels

[FunkmasterAndy]

This guy obviously doesn't understand the depravity of man. It's all about us isn't it Rob.

[amesford]

Well that preposterous! Because as humans and because of Adam we were born with a sin nature! It's true that "The heavens declare the glory of God and the firmament shows his handiwork." But we as creatures naturally hate God so much that we say his name as a curse word. So how could someone who will willingly blaspheme the name of God be praising him simply by breathing. If anything we breathem nothing but hatred for the anlmighty, just, creator God!

[amesford]

Christianity and absolutley no Biblical teaching then what I would assume is that if you are breathing then you must have the Holy Spirit in you, which would mean that everyone is saved, which we know is untrue.

[amesford]

I believe that when God calls someone to salvation and when they realize that they have violated his good and perfect law and they repent of their sins and trust in Jesus Christ as their savior , then they are saved.

To me Mr. Bells videos are confusing and are essentially hiding the true Gospel from unbelievers. If I was to watch this video having no background in

[nicoleiffound]

I don't believe that he's saying that everyone is saved because of course that's not true, but what he's saying is that everyone can be saved and that maybe unknowingly everyone is giving God's name the praise just by breathing

[amesford]

Sorry, in my comment I was being sarcastic, because that is what Mr. Bell makes it sound like.

[amesford]

So if breathe and spirit are the same word does that mean that the Holy Spirit is in everyone and everyone is saved?

[corbie157]

Amesford you ask 'does this mean everyone is saved' it means everyone, and i mean everyone, can be saved if you choose to be. Accept God as your Lord and Savior, and you have eternal life.

[BBurton8807]

Everyone can be saved, yes, but not everyone will be. The Bible is clear in Romans and in many other places that those whom God has foreknown will receive Christ and His righteousness. Christ's death was not limited in what it is able to accomplish because His blood is enough to cover all sin. Unfortunately, it won't because not everyone receives the conviction of the Holy Spirit

[DATCMOTO]

ANYTHING that seeks to elevate man is suspect.. give ALL the Glory & ALL the Praise to the LIVING GOD & in the name of His precious Son & our Saviour JESUS CHRIST! Oh Yes! forget fads, trying to be 'relevant' etc.. pursue personal Holiness.

[bigtakeshi]

does anyone know the music in this NOOMA? I swear it's Sigur Ros it sounds just like them!

[SpareTheTigro]

I believe it's the Album Leaf.

I know their music is in one of his videos.

[bigtakeshi]

true, but Rob is also a fan of Sigur Ros. He uses their music on both the gods aren't angry and everything is spiritual tours. Musically, this sounds more like Sigur Ros to me, but I'm doubting it's Sigur Ros because I have all of Sigur Ros' music up to when that Nooma was filmed and after and that that song is not on any of their CDs. Maybe it's neither Sigur Ros or The Album Leaf but someone else.

[pepporonipie87]

i watched this at youth group, and it really made me think!

[parkman234]

This is amazing.

[McGloire]

Gloire au Dieu tout-puissant! Mon sauveur