Video #19, "Rick's Pipe Dream" Magnetic Motor - Generator Project

[100roberthenry]

hmmm...try using the magnets in a sine wave pattern!..attrack-repel..gradu­ally..just a thought!..youll probably find a specific freq according to size etc....benefits of non moving stator!...cheers.

[TheRickoff]

@100roberthenry - Hi Rob, you may find video #32 of interest, which utilizes a sweeping rotor magnet pattern. It does work as an attraction layout, but one cannot utilize attraction and repulsion this way in the same direction of rotation. In other words, in order to gain some repulsion acceleration, the rotor magnet interacting in repulsion with the stator would first have to pass under the stator and then repel away from the stator. Until it passes, it is working against rotation.

[sjh7132]

Moving the stator introduces energy into the system. If you push the stator into a position where it repels the magnets, you might as well have pushed the magnets with your hand.

[TheRickoff]

That's why I'm currently revising the prototype to accomplish moving the stator by magnetic interactions. See my last comment here for more details. Also see the 'more info' area of video #21 for a link to the Pipe Dream website, where you will find animation and animation info links for the new MOSTAT method on the Archive page.

[TheRickoff]

The animation is not a continuous one, but with 32 frames it shows two pole shifting movements of the stator, and the basic magnetic interactions that cause these movements. Be sure to watch the animation in a full screen view, or it will not display properly. -Rick

[jillyand]

I know you are worried about using a cam due to any drag you might put on the system, use a second magnet wheel with timing push magnets - on the back of the stator put a fixed push magnet to push towards the wheel as the wheel turns it will pluse the stator and no drag to your project timing is everything.

great work you are very close if you get get the timing down.

[TheRickoff]

Hi jillyand, and thanks for your post. Magnetic movement of the stator carriage is what I am currently working on. See my latest 3 videos for views of the slider carriage. Two magnets at the center hub will be used to repel the carriage outwards, and two more at the outer perimeter will repel the carriage inwards at the proper timing points (directly after the tail end magnet of a rotor group passes the carriage).

[OverUnityNow1]

This look like a Mylow design, It did not work.

Any magnet with a push or pull won't do any work, unless you move a magnet to allow the magnet flux to change a staionary starting point.

[TheRickoff]

This is totally different than any of the  Mylow designs, and I guess you missed something - the whole point of this design is to MOVE the stator.

[OverUnityNow1]

One thing is clear, most people think that magnet will do work. Magnets is a statinary force, just like a weight that pushes or pull.

No work can be done unless you move a magnet flux.

Like I said before, you have to put energy into the magnet flux to counter the wheel movement.

I'm just tring to help, I know what i'm talking about......

You might want to design a cam to allow the magnet move, like a crank design.

Think of a gear in the center that turns a crank of a ratio of 1:4 or more.

[OverUnityNow1]

The size of the rim will allow enough movement to get close to what you tring to do. You are having fun playing , so I don't want to waste your time.......

Have fun!

[TheRickoff]

It won't help to do anything that would counter the wheel movement, when that very movement is exactly what is needed to produce rotation. Your cam idea is correct, though, and it happens to be the modification I am currently working on.

[ilgalane]

thank you! for sharing

[TheRickoff]

Thank you for watching.  :)

[Asymmatrix]

I get it now Rick. You're designing an affordable testbed to facilitate others to try the experiment, and you are not claiming to have succeeded with a PMM at this point. No harm done, carry on.

[TheRickoff]

Yes, exactly. I want to enable as many people as possible to build this apparatus and join the effort to move this project forward to a successful conclusion. If all have the same build then what works for one will work for all. This is an open source project in development, and what you see here are the developmental stages in progress.

[Asymmatrix]

Wouldn't it have been easier to test out a revolutionary world-changing universe-changing moving arm stator on a small mockup, instead of posting three dozen videos? Of course there are naysayers, none of this has ever worked. The only thing that does seem to work is gaining an audience by keeping the hopeful masses in suspense. If I had such a revolutionary device I would have built it and tested it before engaging in this type of thing. People have enough disappointment in their lives already.

[TheRickoff]

Yes, it would have been easier, but doomed to failure. This needs to be built large enough to have adequate inertial momentum and leverage. There is a definite purpose behind all that I do, whether you understand that or not.

[TheRickoff]

None of this has been done exactly as I am doing it, so claims that it can't work because others have failed are groundless. Your math appears to be off just as far as your thinking. Three dozen = 36, and I only have 19 videos. If you are worried that my project will end up disappointing you then don't watch its progress. It's quite that simple. I stated up front, and several more times, that I may not succeed at my first attempt for a self runner, so I am in no way offering false hopes.

[TheRickoff]

If indeed I do happen to fail, I will know why and I will work at eliminating the cause of that failure. I have the rest of my life to get this right, and I won't stop trying. A failed attempt doesn't mean I have been defeated, but rather only that success has been postponed. Your negative defeatist attitude is a model for certain failure. Those who give up easily, or who won't even hazard a try, can never expect or hope to succeed.

[knowledgemonger]

In this video you are clearly storing energy into the system by forcing the rotor into a position where the magnets are repelling. When you let go of the rotor, the energy you put in is available to cause some rotation. The rotation stops when the friction consumes all of the energy.

The situation is very like placing a ball near the top of a ramp. The ball rolls down and the potential energy is converted to kinetic and then to heat via friction.

[TheRickoff]

Yes, the starting point that I used was the high repulsion margin at the tail end of a north facing magnet group, and this gave a spring like effect in conjunction with the north stator pole to start rotation. The second positive rotational force is encountered at the next magnet group, which is south facing and thus in attraction with the stator north pole, causing further acceleration.

[TheRickoff]

It was not friction that finally stopped the rotor after its 135 degree movement, but rather the two decelerative forces that followed:

1. Attraction force at the tail end of the south facing group.

2. Repulsion force at the lead end of the next following magnet group which is a north facing group.

The only reason those two forces stopped rotation is because the stator poles were not swapped at the end of the south facing group, as they would be with a moving stator. Demo used fixed.

[centraflow]

Hi Rick

Good video, Take no notice of the flack, this does work when you have the minimum of work needed to move the stator. As a scientist I have had to take some flack as well but to get to the result, be it bad or not, you have to go to the end of your experimenting. As you know I have been doing things here, and it does work, but at the moment I am not willing to show the thing working until I have things working as well as I want them, that is the scientist in me. Mike

[neorules]

Just responding to the Edison statement which is a good attitude to take toward failure after the success is achieved, although, if you really look into it Edison was not really the inventor of the light bulb concept. Is there a plan to have the stator movement built in or will all the energy continue to come from someone moving it?

[TheRickoff]

Yes, I realize Edison was not the first to invent a light bulb, and qualified my statement with the words,"practical lightbulb." Several had been invented earlier by others, but none proved practical because the filaments would burn out very quickly. As to the stator movement, yes I am currently working on my automated stator tracking and timing mechanisms, which will also utilize an entirely different stator mount. Will show that soon.

[TheRickoff]

Thanks for the encouragement, Mike, and don't worry - the flack won't deter or detour me.

[centraflow]

Hi Rick

I do not know where some people come from, I am a qualified scientist and I think you are doing a GREAT JOB, if only people knew what we go through to get to the end result, not always as we want it, but we go to the end. Rick, I have done what you have been doing and it will work as I am sure you are now realising. As of now I do not know what you will do exactly with the movementb of your stator, that is to say how it is moved, but it will work with the minimum of work used.

Mike

[onthecuttingedge2005]

Look Rick, I am not saying what you are doing is wrong, I am just saying you're not doing it the right way. and once again, the machine doesn't move unless you touch it with your magic hands.

any adjustments with your hands is creating work, that work is stored in the rotor, the rotor will move until all its stored energy is lost and then it will stop, until you bring in the magic hands again.

I am actually all for this technology, I am just giving you experienced advice.

[TheRickoff]

You can give me all the discouraging "experienced advice" you want, but it won't change my plans or my drive to succeed where others have failed. If I am doing anything wrong that prevents me from succeeding, I will modify what I see needs changing. So far, no modifications to my original plans have been necessary, so I definitely must be doing something right. I know you won't agree, but that doesn't bother me. Don't think that I'm asleep at the wheel if I don't make future replies.

[AlienNRG]

TheRickoff,

Quit replying to the dummies and continue with your experiments.

Most everyone thinks: since mylow had to use mono filament fishing line to make his magnetic rotor spin, then you are doomed to failure.

I say: Hoist a high and proud middle finger to them.

Keep trying, changing (if needed) and improving.

P.S. before you reply to the naysayers, check out how many videos they have posted to disprove you.:-)

[TheRickoff]

I agree, Alien.  I really don't want to waste time with those who can't see the forest through the trees. I haven't seen any naysayer videos yet that disprove what I am showing and saying. They talk about hundreds, or thousands, of videos showing moving stators that don't get the job done, but I have only come across a very few people who experimented with moving stators, and they were doing something entirely different than what I have planned.

[onthecuttingedge2005]

it is more intuitive to find perpetual energy rather than perpetual motion. there is a difference.

[TheRickoff]

I'm well aware of the difference.  I am not presenting this as a perpetual motion device. Rather, I am attempting to utilize available established forces in the most efficient manner possible, and in a model that can be easily replicated by everyone else wanting to build this device. perhaps I will fail, as you seem to hope, on my first attempt. But that doesn't mean I will always fail. After all, how many times did Edison fail before finding a successful way to make a light bulb?

[TheRickoff]

As an inventor, Edison made at least 1,000 unsuccessful attempts at inventing a practical light bulb. When a reporter asked, How did it feel to fail 1,000 times?, Edison replied, I didnt fail 1,000 times. The light bulb was an invention with 1,000 steps. Should Edison have given up after the first unsuccessful attempt? If not, then why should I give up if my first attempt proves unsuccessful? And remember that my first attempt success or failure is yet to be proven.

[TheRickoff]

I think that the question that really needs to be answered here is why are you so hell bent on attempting to disprove or discredit my methods? Do you have something better to share with us? If so, let's see it. If not, then it's time for you to move on an quit being an unwelcome distraction. I won't waste any more time debating with you. Come back in a month, and then comment on what you see at that time. Redundant negative statements of opinion have no place here.

[onthecuttingedge2005]

everyone avoids the work being done by the magic hand, the system will do no work if you keep your hands to yourself. the Gyroscopic forces are only stored energy that your magic hand induced. when that stored energy is used up it will come to an equilibrium once again, it is for certain that if you do not use the right stator the system will not perpetuate.

[TheRickoff]

False assumption, o.t.c.e. I have clearly shown that the system does do work, and refer you to my previous reply as proof.

[onthecuttingedge2005]

Your hand is acting as the stator action, it is doing work where normally the system will seek an field equilibrium.

[TheRickoff]

How do you explain the rotational movement that occurs when the stator was fixed and my hand was not being used at all? Watch near the end of the video when I slow the rotor down. When the rotor is moving very slowly you can clearly see the accellerative forces at work as the rotor obviously and significantly speeds up at those attraction and repulsion points. You also see the rotor finally come to rest due to decelleration forces, but this is only the result of the fixed stator.

[mogodbilealadamnbama]

Hi, I have question. I have an idea for overunity using magnets as well. I'm not quite done with the model, but I looks good on paper (haha).

Anyway, assuming one of these contraptions actually runs, won't the magnets eventually de-gauss each other and is the energy available equal to that which it took to polarize the magnets?

[overunitydotcom]

135 degrees is not enough.

You need to get it rotating more than 360degrees.

Get yourself a few 90 degrees iron core bars

like this video shows it:

/watch?v=u5mYm5nO5Fw

and then put them between your stator

and rotor magnets.

You need to asymmetrically guide the magnetic flux away from the sticky spots.

Regards, Stefan.

[TheRickoff]

Stefan, I know you mean well but you just aren't getting it. I am only showing that the machine will produce continuous rotation on its own for a 135 degree rotation with a fixed stator. But I won't be using a fixed stator and do not need to worry about "sticky spots" and counter-rotational repulsion resistance because a moving stator avoids those negative forces while turning them into productive accellerative forces. Watch the accellerations occur at 8 points during each revolution.

[overunitydotcom]

Okay, and how do you get the energy to move the

stator arm ?

Sorry, I just skipped some parts of the video, cause I was in a hurry...

[TheRickoff]

Stefan, the 135 degree demo showed 2 accelerative forces followed by 2 decelerative forces, and that was only because the stator was in a fixed position. When moving the stator, all the forces are accelerative, and there are 8 of them per revolution, but only 4 stator movements required. Also, each stator movement required less force than any one accelerative force produced. The excess force from the accelerative effects is stored in the rotor and flywheel as inertial momentum.

[TheRickoff]

Watch near the end of the video, where I deliberately slown down the stator to where it is barely moving, and you will clearly see the accelerations at the tail end of the north groups and lead end of the south groups, where accelerative repulsion and attraction effects, respectively, occur. Keep in mind that there are also an equal number of decelerative effects occurring because I have locked the stator in place with the north pole over the rotor magnets.

[TheRickoff]

And yet the rotations, though very slow, continue through several magnet groups which oppose the fixed stator, and this is simply due to inertial momentum. With higher speeds there is greater inertial momentum available, and with a moving stator there are no decelerative effects. I'm sure you can't imagine how small a force is actually required to move the stator magnet. It is almost negligible, and I have no doubts that the stored rotor and flywheel energy is more than enough to handle this.

[gazzaka]

I think I want to make one :-) very good

[TheRickoff]

Glad to hear that, gazacca. Have you acquired the builder's pdf yet? If not, then e-mail me and I will see that you receive a copy.

[jbignes5]

You would make the track have a wavy cut in it to move the stator any way you like to enable the flip of the magnet stator poles by rotation of the poles instead of a side to side motion. I would think there would be a better gain in power and speed capabilities using rotational actuator for the stator. I could be wrong but it might do better then side to side.

[TheRickoff]

Actually my current plan will provide side to side movement of a track riding carriage, while the stator itself will rotate on a pivoting arm. Many ways to accomplish the stator movement, and I have looked into a great many of these possibilities. My focus is to keep things as simple as possible for the sake of other replicators. In the end, I may require further modifications or enhancements, and will employ whatever I deem to be suitable and necessary.

[jbignes5]

I think they are right a good analogy would be loading a sping then holding it back till you need it. The force needed to move the stator would far outweight what you get in drived motion. Of course the spring has captured energy but you loaded it. The only way around it is to look for a less resistive way to move your stator. Say rotational movement. You could make a round track that the movement gets focused any way you want and use that to flip the poles quicker at higher speeds.

[lost10x]

So I will do this for you. Since such is the problem with this, think out side the OU game box. What else could provide an input of a system to offset balance. Thermal, Air pressure variations, Ionization by normal atmospheric systems,gravity, etc.

When you reach the point folks are trying to tell you exists, Look for other sources than magnets for a drive of the stator action.. Then you may find a useful item.

[TheRickoff]

The magnetic interactions causing thrust and accelleration can definitely help move the stator. Momentum is the other key driving force for this. The inertial momentum of the wood flywheel, steel bike rim, and the weight of the magnets, should be enough to more than meet the remaining force required, imho.

[lost10x]

Did you do some thing to cause it to rotate??

Oh yes you did. You placed the wheel with the input energy from your body (mr HAND) to a position of unbalance of magnetic force. Yes you get a nice motion from this position, yet if you would be able to measure the torque and forces needed to get to that position you could easily see the problem.

I know you do not have the equipment. Yet this will show as you try and find a way to keep the stator movement going.

[TheRickoff]

Yes, lost10x, I placed the wheel in a loaded repulsive position to start rotation. What you fail to acknowledge, though, is that during rotation that point is always made available by a combination of stator movement pole switching and flywheel inertial momentum.

[Cloxxki]

Good vid! I fear the critics won't be convinced just yet.

Their question probably would be the amount of megnetic resistance your hand is overcoming when making that pole switch. Does the stator want to change position, and if not, how strong is the resistance relative to the 2 positive input into the wheel it's just given? And if it really want to switch poles, how much resistance is required on the stator to prevent it from slipping out of position where the magnetic interaction is preferable?

[TheRickoff]

Hi Cloxxki, The stator only moves at the tail end of a group, where there is repulsion effect. That effect, however, is moving away from the stator at that point in time and therefore has very little resistive effect upon the movement.