very nice. i'd rather the bullet deliver all it's energy within the target than much of it beyond the target. i figured that 9mm fmj would've passed all they way through.
ummm all it compares is bullet penetration it doesn't even dwell on the fact that hollow points expand within the target and cause much more internal damage and for self defense that would be much better. if your going to label your video a vs. or comparison don't use biased facts and present the whole truth, or make a part 2 and link it in the video.
I meant as far as carrying out in public and having to use your gun not just at home, but if you kill someone in self defense you will most likely spend a long time in jail I've heard all kinds of crazy stuff the legal system uses to put the blame on you
@DanielGlock26 Your key words are SELF DEFENSE, if it truly is self defense, then you won't spend any time in jail at all. And I'm pretty sure if someone shoots me in the hip and I fall over, I'm still going to pull out my gun! Thumbs up for CNS!!!
@koiashesembers no no sir you misunderstand hes from America the country where if you get hurt breaking and entering YOU CAN SUE. where if you spill coffee on yourself and its hot YOU CAN SUE. the country where if you shoot and kill someone breaking into your house that's right you get THROWN IN JAIL.
(note: my source is the fact that all of those have already happened)
@koiashesembers dude i'm from America and yes i know what it is you have to be in the fear of peril of death or serious bodily harm of you or another which basically means hey if hes in your house and we think you didn't have to fear it then your ass is going to jail.
(note: review of source ALREADY HAPPENED {this means you were already proven wrong by historicist fact buddy})
@killer85x NO YOU DON'T!!!!! CASTLE DOCTRINE: (which you obvioulsy didn't look up, has NO ELEMENT OF FEAR OR HARM, IT IS PRESUMED!
"Under the intruders bill, courts in most criminal and civil matters would presume that people using deadly force had acted reasonably against ANYONE unlawfully inside their residence, business or vehicle, whether the trespasser was armed or not"
And you can't say "it already happened", are we talking about the past or present? You do know women can vote, right?
@koiashesembers actually i did and weather it is to be presumed or not even with the castle doctrine people still have gotten thrown in jail for shooting someone in there own home in self defense. proving me right....you mad bro?
@killer85x ok, by you saying, "you mad bro?" confirms your 12 years old, and its impossible to have an intelligent conversation with someone who still believes in santa. Believe what you will, when you graduate, then come talk to me. i've got better things to do than argue with someone who believes everything he sees on tv and read on wikipedia.
@koiashesembers acctually its an attempt at humor to diffuse a situation where someone (you) seam to be becoming hostile that hostility directed at another (me) due to the simple fact that even though you provide adequate evidence to be correct in the eyes of science of theory i am still right in reality. it's like one of those math questions that if you provide the variables and work it out algebraically it works however you take it and apply it to actual values and it (con.)
@killer85x works in an odd way to com out differently than it should in theory. by the way i am 17 and "you mad bro" does not prove i am "12 years old" it proves that like most humans on the earth i have a sense of humor. I would also liek to point out that you made several incorrect assumptions about me through the fact that i used a humorous phrase. i assume since you gave up on showing fact and continued with the shear force of insult this means i have dumbfounded you sir. TeeHee:P
@killer85x So because i point out the fact that you know nothing about what you're talking about and you are probably 12, which I wasn't far off, is hostile and an insult. Not by far. You have yet to show any facts, or any proof, or any published rules or cases to support your "proof" so while you think you dumbfounded me, every time you post something without any proof other than saying "it's happened before," shows that in fact no nothing of which your speaking.
@koiashesembers dude do you know what the news is? and if you pay attention i said i am 17 ignoramus. and the reason i haven't posted proof is because you cant post links but here is something simple you can do. go to google - search "long island man arrested for defending home with ak-47 from gang" - read story - don't try and argue with a supposed 12 year old that knows more about what goes on in the country than you.
@killer85x Thanks for posting that info, it helps me prove my point. The gang bangers in your story were on his front lawn, and were verbally threatening him. He shot into the grass, 4 warning shots, and was arrested reckless endangerment for using too much force, as the people "standing on his lawn yelling at him" did not display weapons. In the original post this arguement started over, i believe you said if you shoot someone in your house you will get sued.... SO........
@koiashesembers you have yet to post anything related to someone being sued for shooting someone in their house. That was a total irrrelevant case that has nothing to do with civil liability, or being sued for shooting someone. While i applaud your efforts, please consult with your high school law teacher and ask for another example, or just give up and let us all move on with our lives, because i am, i'm not going to argue what i know is right, and obviously you do too
@koiashesembers: You also apparently should look up castle doctrine: about 20 states do not have CD laws on the books. Also, a large number of those who do have only done so for a couple years now, and it is a fact that people have been sued over injuries someone sustained while unlawfully breaking into someone's house.
@koiashesembers: Also yes, saying "You mad bro?" is stupid and douchebaggish, but so is typing in all caps while arguing a point that you yourself apparently haven't researched thoroughly.
@koiashesembers: Ah, so you blast people for speaking intelligent and idiotically? Seems to me like it's not my tone then, it's just the fact someone pointed out you were wrong.
There's a simple solution to that, and it's not to chip in your two cents if you don't know what you're talking about.
The idea is to stop your killer, not to destroy him, otherwise your no better than he is, I heard shots to the hip will make your attacker fold over and fall to the ground and most likely survive
@DanielGlock26 Well good luck with that, but im just goin to stick with the sound method of shooting my attacker untill they stop breathing and or twitching. If somebody is trying to harm me or my loved ones im not taking chances, they are getting a full magasine in the chest and then several in the head just to be sure they dont get back up again.
@KaelanFournierTV See hydrostatic shock. If a bullet passes through the target, energy is being wasted. Hollow points are more devastating because they're transferring all their kinetic energy directly into tissue. FMJs are a poor choice for a self defence cartridge.
That's either some heavy ballistic gel or some anemic rounds. 7" out of a 9mm and only 10.5" out of a .40 is pretty bad. Were they light grain for caliber?
Hollow points are designed to spread out on impact to make sure your taking down whatever your aiming at. So the wider circumference of the bullet will give it less penetration with greater damage
Both are good for different reasons. Overall if you are a good shot FMJ is the way to go. Penetration is key and when a bullet hits the spine, the perp drops like a bad habit !
I will always use full metal jacket, better penetration and my odds are good for hitting a bone and getting a ricochet. plus i want my headshots to hit the brain.
My point is that I don't think that in practice shooting someone with an expanding bullet is going to have as much of an immediate "dropping" effect so much as immediately maiming someone and making it harder to reciprocate the attacker, if it was really self-defense I would be concerned about incapacitation, not putting fragments of bullets verses clean-hole.
@wikieditspam the whole point of useing expanding projectiles is that they transfer more energy into the target causing the incapication you mentioned more reliably than say a non expanding bullet which mainly just makes a hole... people are very resiliant and it actually does take alot ot put them down.
@cwross1976 My concern is more about putting them back up afterward, and yeah if there is a crooked individual trying to kill you, you'd probably not be thinking about that.
@cwross1976 Hollow points are also good in situations where there may be a high possibility of colateral damage. A hollow point is less likely to penetrate and hit the person behind the target.
If I ever have a gun, or more importantly, if I ever need a gun, I don't think that I'll use hollow points or other "expanding bullets". I don't think that I'd intentionally try to kill a man, maybe try to put him out of the fight. If it's self defense you should put the objective on incapacitating an attacker, not maiming, not killing. If he's not trying to hurt you after that, you should do everything you can to keep him from dieing. If it was life and death, shoot him in the heart.
@wikieditspam I somewhat agree with you. I never want to intentionally want to kill anyone but I'd still use JHPs simply because I'd rather kill/maim an attacker than risk the bullet going thru and hitting someone who isn't trying to hurt/kill me.
legally speaking, if you say you were shooting merely to wound someone, then obviously your life was not threatened to the point of having your life in danger, and youll be prosecuted. Legally, the only time you may use a firearm in self defense is when your life/limb or that of another is in danger. You can then shoot to stop that dangerous person. Never shoot to kill, saying you did that will put you in jail. shoot to stop. center mass, use hollow points until they drop, then call a lawyer
@labartic legislation's a little fuzzy on self defense, my point was that even if you're being attacked by someone whose trying to kill you, you shouldn't try to kill him.
@wikieditspam That sounds nice and pretty in theory, but when you're faced with someone who has a gun/lethal weapon and is attacking you and/or those who you care for, many people will do whatever it takes to stop them, including lethal force.
OK. Well, we already know that a FMJ will penetrate more than an expanding soft-point or hollow-point. A ballistic vest will stop either. What is more important and what they didn't show is the wound cavity created by both. The standard depth of a body is 12". You only need to make it through half that and have the bullet shred internals to be effective in one round. Hollow-point or frangible is the way to go without over penetration. If they don't go down, shoot for the head.
@Lonewlf7676 i guess you don't want it to go through and strike an un-intended target and do collateral damage. so HP is the only way to go for self-defence open carry?
@torontothegood There are a variety of expanding or fragmenting types of bullets. Hollowpoint is one. But yes,(in a nutshell) you want all the energy and damage contained in the offending subject and not going through the wall or person behind them. If you take for example that once a .45 slug penetrates and expands it leaves a wound channel nearly as wide as a quarter you should be able to get a good idea as to the reasoning.
@torontothegood You would have to drill a hole in FMJ's to get close to the performance of a designed HP. Fragmenting rounds are designed to have chunks fly off(spray inside basically) after the hit. Shoot FMJ for paper punching, but just buy a box or two of what you want to carry for personal defense. Shoot a mag or so to make sure it hits the same with your sights, and call it a day. How often do you really expect to be firing PD rounds that you need to worry about the cost? Next to never?
This is not an accurate test. The ballistic gel is free moving, unlike the average 160 lb. person. As a paramedic, I've seen my fair share of bullet wounds and I can tell you, this gel does not reflect the damage a simple 9mm can do. A person has much more weight behind them than this block of gel, meaning energy isn't lost in the jiggling and backward movement like it is in this video.
these arguments are ridiculous. If any of you knew anything about ballistics you would know that for hunting dangerous prey you need a deep penetrating heavy projectilelike the s&w 50cal hard cast 400 gr. bullet will drop a cape buffalo in its tracks.self defense ammo is a different subject. you want to penetrate half way thru the tissue without over penetration and you want massive tissue cavitation. you want to create massive trauma thats what stops a person.respond please.
with hollowpoint the round mushrooms, helping to shread organs, whilst reducing the risk of it leaving the targets body and hitting a bystander. different rounds for different purposes.
@MrCrispy616 The whole thing with reduced risk of overpenetration is so overblown. In most shootings some or most rounds miss, and the hollowpoint isn't going to help bystanders then. I'd rather take an FMJ that's already gone through someone than a JHP that missed any day.
Back in the 90s I ues to poach deer in a wooded aera inside the city limits with a .22 rifle..When I connot get a head shot,A behind the shoulder shot had suprising results...The bullet would sometimes enter the ribcage and bounce off a bone and make a hole in the opposite direction...The deer in this area were not skiddish at all due to noise from a truck weigh station next to it.All that noise from the trucks starting and stopping was loud.I lost a few deer so I statred uesing a 30-30 then
@zeno57 The cops came looking for me.I heard them walking down the creek so I sat by a oak and they just walked right by,,,its a good thing for them they did not see me..Now the weigh station is gone and they built a park where I use to hunt deer in the city.
a better test would've been to compare the size of the temporary cavity produced by each round then get a 12" block of gel and compare the sizes of the exit wound, that would show the difference in the damage capability of the 2 rounds.
@jordana8899 Knox Origional Gelatine Unflavored. Any grocery store carries it. 4 packs to 1-1/2 cups water. Mix slow so you dont get alot of bubbles for about 5 minutes. Let sit in fridge for about 6 hours. Take out, run hot water around it to remelt and get the containers you want and pour into that. Let sit for about 33 hours. Do the second step if you want it more like flesh and meat for realistics wounds. Minimum you want is 6" x 3" so it is a reasonable target at a decent distance.
Most FMJ bullets will do the job, some do a better job than others - keep in mind - even a .22 will bring down a horse if placed properly.
Shot placement is more important, too many overlook that or assume a bullseye when looking for test results in blubber gel or water etc. Make your shot a precise placement and do not over worry on cal or other issues. Practice accuracy under stress - much better for needed survival success. BTW, I prefer FMJ 40 cal loaded in a Sig 226 with a 20 round mag.
Yea, if you wana kill your attacker and every person standing 150 feet behind him, if you can even get good enough shot placement to hit the said assailant.
The way people got gangrene when getting shot with hollow points is because as it was hitting there body it would catch pieces of their clothing and and the fibers would cause infection that goes along with the notches in the bullet
@XsamboliciousX Any wound is acceptable to Gangrene. Once you are cut, the cut can become infected from not being cleaned and can lead to Gangrene. Sometimes soldiers would lay in fields for hours if not days before getting treated would end up with Gangrene. Unfortunately, that is what most wounds did, they become infected as they could not locate all pieces of clothing or whatever as it entered and already became infected before treatment and by that time was to late and needed to be removed.
to someones comment about my comment about fmj bullets being used not nessesarily to kill but to remove 2 more men from the battlefield to remove the wounded one. kiss. it means keep it simple stupid. gamggreen, are you kidding? in 1899 they knew british "dum dums" were killing people? sorry, a bullet is red hot when fired. no germs from it. maybe the mud they were crawling in? back then they were shooting people at 600 yards. if you screw up the end of you bullets you wont hit anything.
Shot placement is the most important thing however. Defense rounds like hollow points just make shot placement a little bit easier due to expansion and fragmentation. You can be lethal with a .22 cal with proper shot placement for example if you shoot somebody in the eye with a break action pellet gun even. And 9mm hardball vs 9mm personal defense rounds they each serve their purpose. A 9mm hardball would be the round to penetrate an armored target.
the point of the nato rules on full metal vs expanding sound wrong but really make sense. the point is not to kill the enemy with expanding bullets. with a solid hard point the bullet will pass through a soldier. thats one down and two more to get him off the battlefield. three enemy not shooting at you with one shot.
@Davidautofull You're right man. That doctrine was developed during the cold war to use against the numerically superior Soviet forces. Too bad Soviet doctrine doesn't include helping a wounded comrade, they can wait til the fight is over. Sometimes unless the round strikes something vital, you don't even know you've been hit. With an expanding round you have a better chance of the enemy "knowing".
You would think that the military would look into updating this old tactic, it's a shame really...
@Davidautofull I thought rules like using fully jacketed rounds and so on were to prevent use of weapons that were especially designed to inflict an extra level of harm. Am I wrong? Of course, shotguns seem to have gotten around that one...heh heh.
@45calibermedic yes you are. The Hague conference of 1899 asked the countries that were present to abstain from the use of rounds that expanded this came from the British and others cutting off the tip of the bullet so they would cause extra damage (it is a war where you try to kill people) but it had the unintended effect that the wounds it caused tended to become easily infected and turn gangrenous causing extra suffering.even though they wanted to kill them instantly.
also there is a loop hole (as always there is one) a country can decide to not abide by this rule if they state it in a letter to the Netherlands government and wait one year so that the Netherlands can tell the other countries then they can use it.
@Davidautofull as i stated on another comment they dont use expanding rounds because of the Hague convention of 1899 because expanding rounds on the battle field are harder to heal/treat and can easily cause gangrene making the guy you were trying to kill instantly suffer a long slow painful death. this rule came about because the British used to use dumdum rounds (full metal jacketed rounds with a notch cut in the top to cause expanding or fragmenting effects when the round impacted)
Getting hit with any bullet is gonna hurt and any bullet can kill. For self-defense in a civil country thats not war-torn its hollowpoints all the way or a semi auto shotgun .
well if you where shooting at people lined up the fmj will be somehow effective but i still go with the hallowpoint coz of the damage it can do to the body
Is it true if you take 2 bullets, the same construction, diameter, and weight, the faster it goes above 1200 ft/sec on impact the less penetration it will have on soft tissue; but penetrate hard/dense tissue better? I think it was an article on Garret ammo website. They use the same .458 bullets in their 45-70 as used in Win .45 Magnums and .458 Lott cartridges. As the bullet became faster in the Win Mags and Lotts, they pentrated less in Gel.
@qaching heat doesnt really have much to do with it, its the speed of the bullet, its going so fast, even hitting soft tissue it would be like hitting a rock... sort of like how you can jump into water fine from a short distance, but when really high if you jump into water it would be like jumping into concrete
Math does a lot of things for many people, but sometimes math and chemistry does not give the full story behind a person being shot. From what I got from your argument, size does not matter. Thats true if you can hit them in the vital organs all the time every time. But that simply does not happen, you also got to worry about clothing, bpv's(bullet proof vest's) among other things. A little 22 short is not going to stop a person cracked up on cocain if you hit them in the center mass, a 40 will
If I ever get in a situation that justifies fire I prefer NOT to have penetration because I have no control ovwer the bullet iself after it hits the assailant
I like the premise of the vid, hollow point are much more effective than FMJ rounds, but a profile view of the ballistics gel would have given a better illustation of the ballistic science behind the hollow point.
FMJs are the only bullets allowed in the military because of the Geneva Convention. A pity HPs are not permitted as they're much better at causing damage to tissue and organs. Only law enforcement and commercial use are allowed HPs.
After 12 years working as an urban Paramedic, I can tell you I that there is a dramatic difference in patients that are hit with multiple 9mm rnds vs patient's hit by a single .357, .40, or .45. rnd. Those shot with 9mm still alive; those shot with .40 - dead on the scene.
One patient, shot by the Sherriff's Dept 13 times (center mass) with 9mm rnds, that actually fought with me as I tried to save his life (he died before we got to the ER). That dept. moved to .40 shortly after the incident
@dandersononutube Your right about everything you said. The 9mm has better penetration (not when loaded with JHP) and is a lighter round. Your also right about handguns being not that important when it comes to modern day warfare. In close quarter combat carbines and shotguns are better choices. Your side arm is pretty much a last ditch effort. But there is no doubt why Police Depts. are switching to .40 and .45. It's because the 9mm does not pack enough punch. They want knock down power.
you can make 1 hell of a vagina out of that stuff !
DrWrongPaul 18 hours ago
These guys are entirely missing the point of hollow points. They're SUPPOSED to break after penetration so of course they won't go in as far.
Jarek4 2 days ago
So shooting someone results in a slight truffle shuffle.
mysticalpotato86 1 week ago
I think this stupid ass video pissed everyone off ? Lmao
HamTheDog 1 week ago
i learn more stuff in school then i did with that video
SuperCharliewright 1 week ago
please die for posting this.
offdaheez 2 weeks ago
A hollow point isn't designed to go through body mass a fmj is though
greenwing66 3 weeks ago
Must have been .40+P ammo vs regular 9mm, the .40 is a slower round.
Not an accurate test.
two45triox 3 weeks ago
very nice. i'd rather the bullet deliver all it's energy within the target than much of it beyond the target. i figured that 9mm fmj would've passed all they way through.
yz9890 3 weeks ago
ummm all it compares is bullet penetration it doesn't even dwell on the fact that hollow points expand within the target and cause much more internal damage and for self defense that would be much better. if your going to label your video a vs. or comparison don't use biased facts and present the whole truth, or make a part 2 and link it in the video.
killer85x 3 weeks ago
Omg they killed flubber...you bastards!!
charlesjones32787 3 weeks ago 4
does anyone notice that the first shot says that it is FMJ...but the slow mo replay says that it is hollow point
TacticalSuperMonkey 3 weeks ago
can u give me 5 min with that stuff
OGKILLa9365 3 weeks ago
Stop hurting menbrillo
712maggot 3 weeks ago
nice job!
MrSeankim5 3 weeks ago
LOL, good comments jamie 56795 and cheesypie12! very humorous
radix7508 4 weeks ago
but will it blend?
drsteevo5 1 month ago
I meant as far as carrying out in public and having to use your gun not just at home, but if you kill someone in self defense you will most likely spend a long time in jail I've heard all kinds of crazy stuff the legal system uses to put the blame on you
DanielGlock26 1 month ago
@DanielGlock26 Your key words are SELF DEFENSE, if it truly is self defense, then you won't spend any time in jail at all. And I'm pretty sure if someone shoots me in the hip and I fall over, I'm still going to pull out my gun! Thumbs up for CNS!!!
koiashesembers 1 month ago
@koiashesembers no no sir you misunderstand hes from America the country where if you get hurt breaking and entering YOU CAN SUE. where if you spill coffee on yourself and its hot YOU CAN SUE. the country where if you shoot and kill someone breaking into your house that's right you get THROWN IN JAIL.
(note: my source is the fact that all of those have already happened)
killer85x 3 weeks ago
@killer85x please research the Castle Doctrine....... nice little tidbit from over here in this country called america!
koiashesembers 2 weeks ago
@koiashesembers dude i'm from America and yes i know what it is you have to be in the fear of peril of death or serious bodily harm of you or another which basically means hey if hes in your house and we think you didn't have to fear it then your ass is going to jail.
(note: review of source ALREADY HAPPENED {this means you were already proven wrong by historicist fact buddy})
killer85x 2 weeks ago
@killer85x NO YOU DON'T!!!!! CASTLE DOCTRINE: (which you obvioulsy didn't look up, has NO ELEMENT OF FEAR OR HARM, IT IS PRESUMED!
"Under the intruders bill, courts in most criminal and civil matters would presume that people using deadly force had acted reasonably against ANYONE unlawfully inside their residence, business or vehicle, whether the trespasser was armed or not"
And you can't say "it already happened", are we talking about the past or present? You do know women can vote, right?
koiashesembers 2 weeks ago
@koiashesembers actually i did and weather it is to be presumed or not even with the castle doctrine people still have gotten thrown in jail for shooting someone in there own home in self defense. proving me right....you mad bro?
killer85x 1 week ago
@killer85x ok, by you saying, "you mad bro?" confirms your 12 years old, and its impossible to have an intelligent conversation with someone who still believes in santa. Believe what you will, when you graduate, then come talk to me. i've got better things to do than argue with someone who believes everything he sees on tv and read on wikipedia.
koiashesembers 1 week ago
@koiashesembers acctually its an attempt at humor to diffuse a situation where someone (you) seam to be becoming hostile that hostility directed at another (me) due to the simple fact that even though you provide adequate evidence to be correct in the eyes of science of theory i am still right in reality. it's like one of those math questions that if you provide the variables and work it out algebraically it works however you take it and apply it to actual values and it (con.)
killer85x 1 week ago
@killer85x works in an odd way to com out differently than it should in theory. by the way i am 17 and "you mad bro" does not prove i am "12 years old" it proves that like most humans on the earth i have a sense of humor. I would also liek to point out that you made several incorrect assumptions about me through the fact that i used a humorous phrase. i assume since you gave up on showing fact and continued with the shear force of insult this means i have dumbfounded you sir. TeeHee:P
killer85x 1 week ago
@killer85x So because i point out the fact that you know nothing about what you're talking about and you are probably 12, which I wasn't far off, is hostile and an insult. Not by far. You have yet to show any facts, or any proof, or any published rules or cases to support your "proof" so while you think you dumbfounded me, every time you post something without any proof other than saying "it's happened before," shows that in fact no nothing of which your speaking.
koiashesembers 1 week ago
@koiashesembers dude do you know what the news is? and if you pay attention i said i am 17 ignoramus. and the reason i haven't posted proof is because you cant post links but here is something simple you can do. go to google - search "long island man arrested for defending home with ak-47 from gang" - read story - don't try and argue with a supposed 12 year old that knows more about what goes on in the country than you.
killer85x 1 week ago
@killer85x Thanks for posting that info, it helps me prove my point. The gang bangers in your story were on his front lawn, and were verbally threatening him. He shot into the grass, 4 warning shots, and was arrested reckless endangerment for using too much force, as the people "standing on his lawn yelling at him" did not display weapons. In the original post this arguement started over, i believe you said if you shoot someone in your house you will get sued.... SO........
koiashesembers 5 days ago
@koiashesembers you have yet to post anything related to someone being sued for shooting someone in their house. That was a total irrrelevant case that has nothing to do with civil liability, or being sued for shooting someone. While i applaud your efforts, please consult with your high school law teacher and ask for another example, or just give up and let us all move on with our lives, because i am, i'm not going to argue what i know is right, and obviously you do too
koiashesembers 5 days ago
@koiashesembers: You also apparently should look up castle doctrine: about 20 states do not have CD laws on the books. Also, a large number of those who do have only done so for a couple years now, and it is a fact that people have been sued over injuries someone sustained while unlawfully breaking into someone's house.
PooPoo2U 1 week ago
@koiashesembers: Also yes, saying "You mad bro?" is stupid and douchebaggish, but so is typing in all caps while arguing a point that you yourself apparently haven't researched thoroughly.
PooPoo2U 1 week ago
@PooPoo2U Sorry everyone, I didn't know i was among lawyers...... research? wow, youtube really is full of high schoolers.
koiashesembers 1 week ago
@koiashesembers: Ah, so you blast people for speaking intelligent and idiotically? Seems to me like it's not my tone then, it's just the fact someone pointed out you were wrong.
There's a simple solution to that, and it's not to chip in your two cents if you don't know what you're talking about.
PooPoo2U 1 week ago
The idea is to stop your killer, not to destroy him, otherwise your no better than he is, I heard shots to the hip will make your attacker fold over and fall to the ground and most likely survive
DanielGlock26 1 month ago
@DanielGlock26 Well good luck with that, but im just goin to stick with the sound method of shooting my attacker untill they stop breathing and or twitching. If somebody is trying to harm me or my loved ones im not taking chances, they are getting a full magasine in the chest and then several in the head just to be sure they dont get back up again.
Computinator 1 month ago
Comment removed
nchiker1971 1 month ago 19
@nchiker1971 compared penetration lengths... .were you not paying attn?
chisleu 1 week ago
@nchiker1971 More wiggle from the hollow point. Showed that at least
Rodgerinho 6 days ago
@nchiker1971 It showed the results from comparing FMJ rounds and Hollow Pointed rounds and proved that hollow points are better for stopping someone.
MrJp990 5 days ago
seems like something out of japanese porn
BetaGeneticz 1 month ago
Well the movie Hollow Point is good I gotta say Full Metal Jacket was better.
KaelanFournierTV 1 month ago
@KaelanFournierTV See hydrostatic shock. If a bullet passes through the target, energy is being wasted. Hollow points are more devastating because they're transferring all their kinetic energy directly into tissue. FMJs are a poor choice for a self defence cartridge.
RFID666 1 month ago
Most common caliber of modern ammunition have 12" of wound penetration minimum, choose a caliber is just about personal taste.
Keysforge 1 month ago
and your point is what in this video...what a waste of time...i could have just farted and learned more
treeelizard 1 month ago
That's either some heavy ballistic gel or some anemic rounds. 7" out of a 9mm and only 10.5" out of a .40 is pretty bad. Were they light grain for caliber?
akiratubo 1 month ago
Hollow points are designed to spread out on impact to make sure your taking down whatever your aiming at. So the wider circumference of the bullet will give it less penetration with greater damage
bkeller96 1 month ago
I am guessing the first shot was supposed to be the 9mm fmj
cwjj83 1 month ago
@southchatham
That's what she said :)!!!!!!
TacticalGA 2 months ago
where the fuck do I start.
4AJWP 2 months ago
I believe you have a typo between the 9mm FMJ and the slow mo of the same round
joemamajoker1011 2 months ago
there's a bit of difference between actual slow motion, and just spreading out the frames
MonkeyboyGWW 2 months ago
wth is the point in making a video like this if we don't get to see the wound channel through the gel and the projectiles after being fired?
tatiminy 2 months ago
Both are good for different reasons. Overall if you are a good shot FMJ is the way to go. Penetration is key and when a bullet hits the spine, the perp drops like a bad habit !
TommyGuns40 2 months ago
@TommyGuns40
I agree. This video shows that the 9mm hollow point is not penetrating enough. I'll take 14" of penetration over 7".
southchatham 2 months ago
@southchatham What are you trying to penetrate that is 14" thick? How deep below the skin surface do you think the heart is?
Raoul3657 1 month ago
That's still a bit shallow - must be silvertips.
bubba55l 3 months ago
I will always use full metal jacket, better penetration and my odds are good for hitting a bone and getting a ricochet. plus i want my headshots to hit the brain.
ChesterDoraemon 3 months ago
@jamie56795 This is free though.
ChokedByRainbows 3 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
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burstbuzzyboy 3 months ago
I have the weirdest boner right now...
CheeseyPie12 3 months ago 30
@CheeseyPie12 you must be a politician :)
vladdrac88 2 months ago
lame, show the results man!
johnsix54 3 months ago
My point is that I don't think that in practice shooting someone with an expanding bullet is going to have as much of an immediate "dropping" effect so much as immediately maiming someone and making it harder to reciprocate the attacker, if it was really self-defense I would be concerned about incapacitation, not putting fragments of bullets verses clean-hole.
wikieditspam 3 months ago
@wikieditspam the whole point of useing expanding projectiles is that they transfer more energy into the target causing the incapication you mentioned more reliably than say a non expanding bullet which mainly just makes a hole... people are very resiliant and it actually does take alot ot put them down.
cwross1976 3 months ago
@cwross1976 My concern is more about putting them back up afterward, and yeah if there is a crooked individual trying to kill you, you'd probably not be thinking about that.
wikieditspam 3 months ago
@cwross1976 Hollow points are also good in situations where there may be a high possibility of colateral damage. A hollow point is less likely to penetrate and hit the person behind the target.
Jackle61 3 months ago
Wow. That really cleared things up nicely.
W857TYWH408576NW0348 3 months ago
should've used a clear jelly next time
PaulDavidT 3 months ago
in the words that a policeman uses to justify his actions of shooting... "i felt my life was in danger"
blackriflex39 3 months ago
If I ever have a gun, or more importantly, if I ever need a gun, I don't think that I'll use hollow points or other "expanding bullets". I don't think that I'd intentionally try to kill a man, maybe try to put him out of the fight. If it's self defense you should put the objective on incapacitating an attacker, not maiming, not killing. If he's not trying to hurt you after that, you should do everything you can to keep him from dieing. If it was life and death, shoot him in the heart.
wikieditspam 3 months ago
@wikieditspam I somewhat agree with you. I never want to intentionally want to kill anyone but I'd still use JHPs simply because I'd rather kill/maim an attacker than risk the bullet going thru and hitting someone who isn't trying to hurt/kill me.
chasingaugust 3 months ago
legally speaking, if you say you were shooting merely to wound someone, then obviously your life was not threatened to the point of having your life in danger, and youll be prosecuted. Legally, the only time you may use a firearm in self defense is when your life/limb or that of another is in danger. You can then shoot to stop that dangerous person. Never shoot to kill, saying you did that will put you in jail. shoot to stop. center mass, use hollow points until they drop, then call a lawyer
labartic 3 months ago
@labartic So if the limb of another person, like my friends arm, is in danger I can shoot someone? Just looking for you to clear this up. Thx tips.
filmmetoo 3 months ago
@filmmetoo if someone is coming at you with a chainsaw, you can shoot them. basically if severe bodily injury may occur, you can shoot.
labartic 3 months ago
@labartic legislation's a little fuzzy on self defense, my point was that even if you're being attacked by someone whose trying to kill you, you shouldn't try to kill him.
wikieditspam 3 months ago
@wikieditspam That sounds nice and pretty in theory, but when you're faced with someone who has a gun/lethal weapon and is attacking you and/or those who you care for, many people will do whatever it takes to stop them, including lethal force.
fkkkkkenig 3 months ago
This video shows some mild bangs, and some wobbling stuff.
I can get that from porn.
jamie56795 3 months ago 187
@jamie56795 You just made my day.
Uberriffic 3 months ago
@jamie56795 don't forget penetration
Dandadudemedia 3 months ago
@jamie56795 this is porn to gun nuts.
newdude32 3 months ago
@newdude32 no, porn is porn to gun nuts, this is just somebody shooting at gello
cwross1976 3 months ago
@jamie56795 and penetration ;)
MASTRCHIEFMOE 3 months ago
@jamie56795 you can also get 10.5 inches of penetration from porn
YoUrInBaTcOuNtRyNoW6 3 months ago
@jamie56795 And with much better quality I might add
liljtellem 2 months ago
@jamie56795 hahahahahah
caboolturescumbag 1 month ago
@jamie56795 plus it has penetration
thelukai14 1 month ago
@jamie56795 and 7 inch penetration...
TronCatKTA 1 month ago
@jamie56795 Keep in mind it makes liberal use of the word "penetration"
applesau5 2 weeks ago
Is it wierd I got a bonor from this?
TrickshottersxD 4 months ago
Comment removed
MrSoulTracker9 4 months ago
that stuff you are shooting at looks yummy
556todd 4 months ago
OK. Well, we already know that a FMJ will penetrate more than an expanding soft-point or hollow-point. A ballistic vest will stop either. What is more important and what they didn't show is the wound cavity created by both. The standard depth of a body is 12". You only need to make it through half that and have the bullet shred internals to be effective in one round. Hollow-point or frangible is the way to go without over penetration. If they don't go down, shoot for the head.
Lonewlf7676 4 months ago
@Lonewlf7676 i guess you don't want it to go through and strike an un-intended target and do collateral damage. so HP is the only way to go for self-defence open carry?
torontothegood 4 months ago
@torontothegood There are a variety of expanding or fragmenting types of bullets. Hollowpoint is one. But yes,(in a nutshell) you want all the energy and damage contained in the offending subject and not going through the wall or person behind them. If you take for example that once a .45 slug penetrates and expands it leaves a wound channel nearly as wide as a quarter you should be able to get a good idea as to the reasoning.
Lonewlf7676 4 months ago
@Lonewlf7676 for cost savings. can you just take a regular bullet and score a couple of lines on the tip to make it into a 'fragmenting' bulllet?
seems to to the same thing, right?
torontothegood 4 months ago
@torontothegood You would have to drill a hole in FMJ's to get close to the performance of a designed HP. Fragmenting rounds are designed to have chunks fly off(spray inside basically) after the hit. Shoot FMJ for paper punching, but just buy a box or two of what you want to carry for personal defense. Shoot a mag or so to make sure it hits the same with your sights, and call it a day. How often do you really expect to be firing PD rounds that you need to worry about the cost? Next to never?
Lonewlf7676 4 months ago
@Lonewlf7676 that's a good point. i'll do just that. thanks.
torontothegood 4 months ago
This is not an accurate test. The ballistic gel is free moving, unlike the average 160 lb. person. As a paramedic, I've seen my fair share of bullet wounds and I can tell you, this gel does not reflect the damage a simple 9mm can do. A person has much more weight behind them than this block of gel, meaning energy isn't lost in the jiggling and backward movement like it is in this video.
domitrias 4 months ago
these arguments are ridiculous. If any of you knew anything about ballistics you would know that for hunting dangerous prey you need a deep penetrating heavy projectilelike the s&w 50cal hard cast 400 gr. bullet will drop a cape buffalo in its tracks.self defense ammo is a different subject. you want to penetrate half way thru the tissue without over penetration and you want massive tissue cavitation. you want to create massive trauma thats what stops a person.respond please.
MrFrogg46 4 months ago
@MrFrogg46 Nicely said. I wasn't going to bother reading all the nonsense on this one,..but your two cents is worth a nod.
Lonewlf7676 4 months ago
What was the bullet weight and power? (plus, or plus P or just regular)
SmokeRingsPipeDreams 4 months ago
with hollowpoint the round mushrooms, helping to shread organs, whilst reducing the risk of it leaving the targets body and hitting a bystander. different rounds for different purposes.
MrCrispy616 4 months ago 27
@MrCrispy616 The whole thing with reduced risk of overpenetration is so overblown. In most shootings some or most rounds miss, and the hollowpoint isn't going to help bystanders then. I'd rather take an FMJ that's already gone through someone than a JHP that missed any day.
aluisious 1 month ago
Back in the 90s I ues to poach deer in a wooded aera inside the city limits with a .22 rifle..When I connot get a head shot,A behind the shoulder shot had suprising results...The bullet would sometimes enter the ribcage and bounce off a bone and make a hole in the opposite direction...The deer in this area were not skiddish at all due to noise from a truck weigh station next to it.All that noise from the trucks starting and stopping was loud.I lost a few deer so I statred uesing a 30-30 then
zeno57 4 months ago
@zeno57 The cops came looking for me.I heard them walking down the creek so I sat by a oak and they just walked right by,,,its a good thing for them they did not see me..Now the weigh station is gone and they built a park where I use to hunt deer in the city.
zeno57 4 months ago
of course FMJ will do better...more aerodynamic..
suggest testing on something different
tsdoom32x 4 months ago
"no but 9mm is just as powerful as 40"
joeratti 4 months ago
a better test would've been to compare the size of the temporary cavity produced by each round then get a 12" block of gel and compare the sizes of the exit wound, that would show the difference in the damage capability of the 2 rounds.
IHitmanAirsoft 4 months ago
Comment removed
red0ubtable 4 months ago
You messed up at 0:08 -The round that was said to be used was a hollow point, yet it penetrated 14". That is, you put HP where FMJ should have been.
saints360row 4 months ago
It would have been more interestig if they had shown the weight of the bullets used. Nice video anyway, thanks!
Lazarus0357 4 months ago
ya fuckin' penetration whores. Has nothing to do with meat shock.
uranium2008 5 months ago
I... just like seeing things getting shot. I also like Beef. Working, being a man, and peeing standing up.
LOL, no I didn't vote for Obama. Didn't you read the first part?
SurvivalistCrutch 5 months ago 2
For the love of god, what is this delicious looking thing? It looks like a giant caramel bar! where can I get one, or what is it called?
jordana8899 5 months ago
@jordana8899 It's ballistics gel and you can get the recipe for it on google.
YukonJack 5 months ago
@YukonJack Thanks!
jordana8899 5 months ago
@jordana8899 Knox Origional Gelatine Unflavored. Any grocery store carries it. 4 packs to 1-1/2 cups water. Mix slow so you dont get alot of bubbles for about 5 minutes. Let sit in fridge for about 6 hours. Take out, run hot water around it to remelt and get the containers you want and pour into that. Let sit for about 33 hours. Do the second step if you want it more like flesh and meat for realistics wounds. Minimum you want is 6" x 3" so it is a reasonable target at a decent distance.
duane2072 5 months ago
@duane2072 Thank you so much for sharing that. I will try to make it.
jordana8899 5 months ago
@jordana8899 When your remelting it, dont let the running hot water get in the gelatin. It wont be the same consistancy if you do.
duane2072 5 months ago
apples and oranges, different calibers, the point was lost
auradud3 5 months ago
Most FMJ bullets will do the job, some do a better job than others - keep in mind - even a .22 will bring down a horse if placed properly.
Shot placement is more important, too many overlook that or assume a bullseye when looking for test results in blubber gel or water etc. Make your shot a precise placement and do not over worry on cal or other issues. Practice accuracy under stress - much better for needed survival success. BTW, I prefer FMJ 40 cal loaded in a Sig 226 with a 20 round mag.
yaahme 5 months ago
9mm is perfect for war but its not realy the greatest round for SD
xundeadpkerx 5 months ago
0:08 its like smacking a ass
UniversalHere 5 months ago
This has been flagged as spam show
HEY EVERYONE CHECK OUT MY 10MM VS 357 MAG VS FROZEN HAM TEST!!!
SonsOfLiberty65 6 months ago
10mm is the perfect defensive round
pjicleanair420 6 months ago
@pjicleanair420
Yea, if you wana kill your attacker and every person standing 150 feet behind him, if you can even get good enough shot placement to hit the said assailant.
Breakneckhydra1 5 months ago
A full metal jacket from a big flat nose round will still kill plus it will penetrate.
SavageHmr 6 months ago
It's funny to watch a slab of blubber jiggling after repeatedly shooting it.
tallswede80 6 months ago
The way people got gangrene when getting shot with hollow points is because as it was hitting there body it would catch pieces of their clothing and and the fibers would cause infection that goes along with the notches in the bullet
XsamboliciousX 6 months ago
@XsamboliciousX Any wound is acceptable to Gangrene. Once you are cut, the cut can become infected from not being cleaned and can lead to Gangrene. Sometimes soldiers would lay in fields for hours if not days before getting treated would end up with Gangrene. Unfortunately, that is what most wounds did, they become infected as they could not locate all pieces of clothing or whatever as it entered and already became infected before treatment and by that time was to late and needed to be removed.
duane2072 5 months ago
to someones comment about my comment about fmj bullets being used not nessesarily to kill but to remove 2 more men from the battlefield to remove the wounded one. kiss. it means keep it simple stupid. gamggreen, are you kidding? in 1899 they knew british "dum dums" were killing people? sorry, a bullet is red hot when fired. no germs from it. maybe the mud they were crawling in? back then they were shooting people at 600 yards. if you screw up the end of you bullets you wont hit anything.
Davidautofull 6 months ago
Shot placement is the most important thing however. Defense rounds like hollow points just make shot placement a little bit easier due to expansion and fragmentation. You can be lethal with a .22 cal with proper shot placement for example if you shoot somebody in the eye with a break action pellet gun even. And 9mm hardball vs 9mm personal defense rounds they each serve their purpose. A 9mm hardball would be the round to penetrate an armored target.
jeff19872011 6 months ago
thats what she said to pretty much every comment here...lol
tlinjr 7 months ago
so the hollow point and the full metal jacket one penetrate exactly the same?
Mropticalgreen 7 months ago
@Mropticalgreen No, the HP penetrates about half of what the FMJ does. The first shot had a mislabeled slow-motion replay.
7h3647h32in6 7 months ago
the point of the nato rules on full metal vs expanding sound wrong but really make sense. the point is not to kill the enemy with expanding bullets. with a solid hard point the bullet will pass through a soldier. thats one down and two more to get him off the battlefield. three enemy not shooting at you with one shot.
Davidautofull 7 months ago
@Davidautofull You're right man. That doctrine was developed during the cold war to use against the numerically superior Soviet forces. Too bad Soviet doctrine doesn't include helping a wounded comrade, they can wait til the fight is over. Sometimes unless the round strikes something vital, you don't even know you've been hit. With an expanding round you have a better chance of the enemy "knowing".
You would think that the military would look into updating this old tactic, it's a shame really...
ssj3barua 7 months ago
@Davidautofull I thought rules like using fully jacketed rounds and so on were to prevent use of weapons that were especially designed to inflict an extra level of harm. Am I wrong? Of course, shotguns seem to have gotten around that one...heh heh.
45calibermedic 6 months ago
@45calibermedic yes you are. The Hague conference of 1899 asked the countries that were present to abstain from the use of rounds that expanded this came from the British and others cutting off the tip of the bullet so they would cause extra damage (it is a war where you try to kill people) but it had the unintended effect that the wounds it caused tended to become easily infected and turn gangrenous causing extra suffering.even though they wanted to kill them instantly.
iceman27406 6 months ago
also there is a loop hole (as always there is one) a country can decide to not abide by this rule if they state it in a letter to the Netherlands government and wait one year so that the Netherlands can tell the other countries then they can use it.
iceman27406 6 months ago
@Davidautofull as i stated on another comment they dont use expanding rounds because of the Hague convention of 1899 because expanding rounds on the battle field are harder to heal/treat and can easily cause gangrene making the guy you were trying to kill instantly suffer a long slow painful death. this rule came about because the British used to use dumdum rounds (full metal jacketed rounds with a notch cut in the top to cause expanding or fragmenting effects when the round impacted)
iceman27406 6 months ago
i was hoping to see ".50 cal....Exploding jelly"
jparis99 7 months ago
dude you shoude use the same gun
mackkathy1 7 months ago
0:04 14"" penetration, hahaha
glennzone12 7 months ago
i really should be studying...
nextVTgenerati0n 7 months ago
@aaron95 Excuse my sex joke but you just left yourself wide open for that one. Deep penetration is more damaging???? TWSS
halopartyboy 8 months ago
Getting hit with any bullet is gonna hurt and any bullet can kill. For self-defense in a civil country thats not war-torn its hollowpoints all the way or a semi auto shotgun .
Brewfu 8 months ago
well if you where shooting at people lined up the fmj will be somehow effective but i still go with the hallowpoint coz of the damage it can do to the body
octavianAgustus 9 months ago
oooo please do a .45 acp vid!
skizzerbo 9 months ago
Is it true if you take 2 bullets, the same construction, diameter, and weight, the faster it goes above 1200 ft/sec on impact the less penetration it will have on soft tissue; but penetrate hard/dense tissue better? I think it was an article on Garret ammo website. They use the same .458 bullets in their 45-70 as used in Win .45 Magnums and .458 Lott cartridges. As the bullet became faster in the Win Mags and Lotts, they pentrated less in Gel.
mojothemigo 9 months ago
@mojothemigo yeah, basically. it's like dipping your hand in water or slapping the water.
pinhead61187 9 months ago
i dont get it
a hollow point will expand itself when entering soft tissue (like a mushroom)
now how can metal bend and expand against soft tisseu???
metal is allot harder than soft tissue
wtf?
qaching 9 months ago
@qaching its also not solid and extreamly hot
cheeseshoes 9 months ago
@qaching heat doesnt really have much to do with it, its the speed of the bullet, its going so fast, even hitting soft tissue it would be like hitting a rock... sort of like how you can jump into water fine from a short distance, but when really high if you jump into water it would be like jumping into concrete
TopOfTheLine3 9 months ago
@TopOfTheLine3
that makes allot of sense
thx man
qaching 9 months ago
i want to chew a chunk of ballistic jell looks deliciously chewy :)
Lilweedkila510 9 months ago
Math does a lot of things for many people, but sometimes math and chemistry does not give the full story behind a person being shot. From what I got from your argument, size does not matter. Thats true if you can hit them in the vital organs all the time every time. But that simply does not happen, you also got to worry about clothing, bpv's(bullet proof vest's) among other things. A little 22 short is not going to stop a person cracked up on cocain if you hit them in the center mass, a 40 will
SSshane6d9 9 months ago
If I ever get in a situation that justifies fire I prefer NOT to have penetration because I have no control ovwer the bullet iself after it hits the assailant
VinnyS914 10 months ago
I like the premise of the vid, hollow point are much more effective than FMJ rounds, but a profile view of the ballistics gel would have given a better illustation of the ballistic science behind the hollow point.
adambox14 10 months ago
FMJs are the only bullets allowed in the military because of the Geneva Convention. A pity HPs are not permitted as they're much better at causing damage to tissue and organs. Only law enforcement and commercial use are allowed HPs.
SpecJack15 10 months ago
50 caliber would of been good.
chaquator 11 months ago
After 12 years working as an urban Paramedic, I can tell you I that there is a dramatic difference in patients that are hit with multiple 9mm rnds vs patient's hit by a single .357, .40, or .45. rnd. Those shot with 9mm still alive; those shot with .40 - dead on the scene.
One patient, shot by the Sherriff's Dept 13 times (center mass) with 9mm rnds, that actually fought with me as I tried to save his life (he died before we got to the ER). That dept. moved to .40 shortly after the incident
chrisfev01 11 months ago
@chrisfev01 50 cent heard someone got shot more than him and was still breathing, clearly something had to be done
tartarsaucin 11 months ago
High quality videos. I love them. Keep comparing rounds plus grains in the bullets. Thank you
weaponseducation 1 year ago
haha
manlykviipa 1 year ago
the .40 was noticeably more powerful than the 9mm. it almost made the whole gel block jump up from the table
joeratti 1 year ago
@dandersononutube Your right about everything you said. The 9mm has better penetration (not when loaded with JHP) and is a lighter round. Your also right about handguns being not that important when it comes to modern day warfare. In close quarter combat carbines and shotguns are better choices. Your side arm is pretty much a last ditch effort. But there is no doubt why Police Depts. are switching to .40 and .45. It's because the 9mm does not pack enough punch. They want knock down power.
Obscenejesster 1 year ago