I know this is going to seem like a silly question - but I am not sure of the answer. It seems that there are several types of "Gold chloride" as in: AuCl AuCl2 AuCl3 and HAuCl (which I have a 1g vial of somewhere) Please can you tell me which I need - as once I know which, I can find out how to produce it (if not the HAuCl which I have already). Also, how nice to have a useful video set to music instead of "thumpy noise". Thank you Mark
I know some people use tannic acid as a reducing agent. I do not have any sodium tannate, but If I can procure some, I will try it. What do you think it does better than sodium citrate? So far, I've had the best results using sodium carbonate plus maltodextrin. There are quite a few reagents that work pretty well.
@michalchik The colors are affected by both particle size and shape. Initially the color is bluish black, and in that state the particles are rod shaped. As the particles become round, the color changes to ruby red.
The citrate ions are adsorbed onto the surface of the gold particles, and act as stabilizer to keep the particles from agglomerating into larger particles. It is the sodium ions from the sodium citrate that actually reduces the gold chloride to metallic gold particles.
@michalchik Good catch!. Why did I say that? To reduce the gold, each gold atom has to pick up 3 electrons from somewhere, and that has to come from the citrate. The thought that was bouncing in my head when I answered you was that any metal except platinum can reduce gold. The oldest formula I have found for CG is from the 1600's, and was to make gold chloride from aqua regia and solid gold metal, then reducing the gold chloride by immersing a piece of tin metal in the solution.
Could you please describe an unit used as a "magnetic pole generator"(where to get it) and what makes the bubling in the probe? If you be so kind and post links where to buy the components, please?
The hotplate has a magnetic stirrer built in which I purchased from an eBay vendor. The gold chloride is available from saltlakemetals(dot)com. Sodium and potassium citrate are food additives which I also got from an eBay vendor. The bubbling is just the liquid boiling.
hey, im doing a lab report for this same reaction for my inorganic chem class at UIC. i was just wondering if you know how to relate Wavelength to approximate size of the resulting nanoparticles. i did one reaction with sodium borohydrate and another one with sodium citrate. i have one peek at 532nm with absorbency of 0.1034, and another peek at 520 nm with absorbency of 1.0190. ( the second one was for the sodium citrate, the first was for NaBH4)
Its my understanding that the plasmon resonance is described by Mie Scattering Theory. You might want to take a look at that. I think there are some simplifications possible with particles much smaller than the wavelength of light. I would think red gold would fall into that category.
There is an alchemical method of producing powerfully charged colloidal gold that is far different from normal colloidal gold. Dry iron filings, powdered stibnite, and potassium chloride are combined in a certain proportion and heated. Antimony trichloride fumes are produced (which has been charged by the IRON) and condensed to form a highly corrosive "Virgin's Milk" which dissolves gold via direct chlorine ion transfer. Make your colloidal gold with that gold chloride. You will be amazed.
A) How is is different? What physical attributes are different?
B) Direct chlorine ion transfer is the same as making CG via electrolysis, where the chlorine from the salt directly dissolves gold metal by making gold chloride.
C) Can you do a video showing it done and the results you get?
F me running, when that turned purple I almost died! I blow glass and gold fuming depending on the amount fumed results in different colors as well, just never thought i'd see it happen in good ol' h2o.
Yes, the basic method is the reduction of a metal salt with a reducing agent. With gold, the salt is gold chloride, and the reducing agent is sodium citrate. The citrate also acts as a stabilizer to keep the gold particles from clumping together.
Chemists usually make colloidal silver this way using a silver salt such as silver nitrate, and a reducing agent. There are many edible reducing agents which can be also be used including glucose, fructose, and maltodextrin.
@kephranet thanks for the quick response and i have one more question if you used silver nitrate what would it yeild like would the the NO3 be released yeilding a pure silver citrate or what?
@dougebfresh1 You get metallic silver nanoparticles along with leftover sodium citrate, sodium nitrate, probably tiny amounts of nitric acid etc. I would not ingest this. Chemists make it this way for other uses. My favorite method is electrolytically producing silver oxide and silver chloride, then reducing those salts to metal using maltodextrin or glucose as the reducing agent and stabilizer. Then there are no toxic byproducts.
Funny a lot of sites who sell this stuff say red is smaller then 100 nanometer and purple was under 40 nanometer. I suppose there trying to rip off then?
@kephranet Red is larger particle size isnt it? That's why it turns red when you react it for longer. Longer rxn time gives the particles more time to aggregate into larger particles.
No, not right. Red is the smallest that can be made with Turkevich method. Particles are less than 20nm. The color changes from dark blue to red because the particles are changing shape from rods to spheres.
Do you happen to know how to make the colloidal gold, gold chloride again? Or even into metallic gold? The reason I ask is because I get colloidal gold when melting gold powders and would like to recover it. You can see how to get metallic gold out of the chloride in my video if you'd like. Thanks in advance.
why cnat you use citric acid, i did after a few failed attempts with sodium citrate(added the citric acid to the sodium citrate and gold mix and it turned red in like 10 min
Please post your stoichiometry and long term stability. When I used citric acid, the resultant CG was very unstable, with resultant large particle sizes
@kephranet awseome thanks for that do. been doing a hell of alot of reading thought you might be able to help are you able to explain the difference between ionic silver and colloidal silver. With the colloidal gold you can definately drink this can you? So many different stories on all these that it's not funny.
@pathakmallika Yes, this does work. The method was developed by John Turkevich et al and published in some scientific journals in the early 50's. You can prove that it is in fact a colloidal dispersion by shining a light through the side and observing a Tyndall cone, characteristic of the scattering of light by small particles. I recognise this as colloidal gold anyhow, the purple color is because of the surface plasmon resonances.. I've done it as part of my research!
No it is not. And silver nitrate is not a specific test for gold chloride. It will produce the same result with just about any chloride, IE: table salt.
okay, but i read on mesogold, that real colloid is metallic gold nanoparticles, which isnt use very simple technique... have you tried adding 1% silver nitrate to some of that liquid that you make?
I read somewhere if white clouds form, then thats gold chloride,
This method has been the primary method of making gold nanoparticles for over 50 years. Yes its simple, and yes it is indeed gold nanoparticles. No need to add silver nitrate because there is an excess of reducing agent which insures that there is no gold chloride left.
Yes, gold chloride is toxic. However, after doing the process, there is no gold chloride left, it has been transformed back into gold metal. Thats the whole point; colloidal gold is gold metal, not gold chloride.
And I would not recommend sea salt. You must use pure sodium chloride, distilled water. Remember, you are trying to do chemistry in the ppm range, so your chemicals should be more pure than that.
Good video, but I tried this process with a watered down sea salt and it didn't change colors. What type of sodium citrate are you using and did you get it in liquid or did you make your own liquid.
Also - have you heard of making Gold Colloid in the same way you make the Silver Colloid - which is by connecting a 9 - 12v bat/adapter to the pure (.9999 [99%] ) silver or pure 24k gold rods in distilled water?
I know about the silver way with the 9 - 12v elec - but can this really be done with the Gold rods?
why would U add the sodium citrate in? I thought gold chloride is a electrolyte, water souable, a perfect for a gold supplement? am I missing something?
Citrate is a reducing agent which helps convert gold chloride to metallic gold particles. The citrate ions themselves adsorb to the gold giving it the negative charge which keeps the particles apart.
If by adding the Citrate converts the gold chloride to metallic gold particles, would then connecting the 9 - 12v bat/adapter to pure Gold rods in distilled water work but cutting out the actual making of the Colloid you show in your video here?
I did not invent this process. It is the standard process colloidal gold has been made for 50 years. (Turkevich method). There is probably some hydrochloric acid, sodium chloride, and citrates left in the solution, but there are no toxic compounds, and everything is in the ppm range. There are less chlorides than in a bottle of club soda.
Hi- Say that is very cool. Thanks for sharing this with us all. I'm interested in making colloidal gold myself but I have some questions about it. Using your process here, how do we know what the final product is? I mean does it only contain pure water and pure colloidal gold after it's finished or are there still chlorides left in the solution? We would only want to be ingesting pure gold particles suspended in pure water right? Thanks and look forward to your comments.
I have a small suggestion. The colloidal gold ram ozone for 2 nights, but do with the high voltage lamps. Please let me know if anything is done with the colloid. In my opinion, this is a good way for white gold:)
Do you drink this? What effects do you get? People say they get different effects from different methods. Like some who drink purple feel speedy, or red calm, or happy and relaxed. What do you feel?
I have taken this, and I would say it has given me a happy feeling, plus it definitely helped my arthritis and myopathy in my legs. I do not recommend others do this, as that is a personal decision to make. After more than a year, it has done me no harm. Your mileage may vary.
will this work with silver nitrate instead of the gold compound?
TheChemlife 2 weeks ago
guymark 6 months ago
@guymark Either HAuCl4 or AuCl3 work. Probably any chloride of gold will work though.
My supplier (Salt Lake Metals) says its AuCl3.
kephranet 6 months ago
@kephranet
Fantastic. Thank you for that :)
guymark 6 months ago
Protect that vial, man! The gold chloride will react with the light!!
mvszao 7 months ago
@mvszao The manufacturer says it is not light sensitive, and I have had no problem storing it unprotected.
kephranet 7 months ago
kephranet man!!! you are a genius!!! thanks a lot for you information!!! God bless!
inocentforever 8 months ago
What is the temperature while stirring?
asel2587 8 months ago
@asel2587
My understanding was that it was boiling - and that it continued to boil throughout the process.
guymark 6 months ago
from my studies i would suggest trying sodium tannate - let me know how that works for you
33vibe 9 months ago
@33vibe
I know some people use tannic acid as a reducing agent. I do not have any sodium tannate, but If I can procure some, I will try it. What do you think it does better than sodium citrate? So far, I've had the best results using sodium carbonate plus maltodextrin. There are quite a few reagents that work pretty well.
kephranet 9 months ago
So is the colors it goes through related to the particle size? What becomes of the citrate?
michalchik 10 months ago
@michalchik The colors are affected by both particle size and shape. Initially the color is bluish black, and in that state the particles are rod shaped. As the particles become round, the color changes to ruby red.
The citrate ions are adsorbed onto the surface of the gold particles, and act as stabilizer to keep the particles from agglomerating into larger particles. It is the sodium ions from the sodium citrate that actually reduces the gold chloride to metallic gold particles.
kephranet 10 months ago
@kephranet How could ionic sodium reduce gold? I don't believe that last part.
michalchik 10 months ago
@michalchik Good catch!. Why did I say that? To reduce the gold, each gold atom has to pick up 3 electrons from somewhere, and that has to come from the citrate. The thought that was bouncing in my head when I answered you was that any metal except platinum can reduce gold. The oldest formula I have found for CG is from the 1600's, and was to make gold chloride from aqua regia and solid gold metal, then reducing the gold chloride by immersing a piece of tin metal in the solution.
kephranet 10 months ago
have you tried making gold bigger than that..in the 40 nm range? let me know your recipe if u have. Also, how do you normally characterize your gold?
puriamrita85 11 months ago
@puriamrita85
No, but according to the scientific literature, reducing the amount of citrate will make the particles larger.
kephranet 11 months ago
Did this process yield monodisperse gold? What was the size of the particles? Also, why did you reduce the stir rate before adding the citrate?
puriamrita85 11 months ago
@puriamrita85
Yes the particles are monodisperse, 10 to 20 nm spheres. There was really no reason for changing speed of the stirrer. I have no idea why I did.
kephranet 11 months ago
Very nice!
Could you please describe an unit used as a "magnetic pole generator"(where to get it) and what makes the bubling in the probe? If you be so kind and post links where to buy the components, please?
Smokofilomidanek53 11 months ago
@Smokofilomidanek53
The hotplate has a magnetic stirrer built in which I purchased from an eBay vendor. The gold chloride is available from saltlakemetals(dot)com. Sodium and potassium citrate are food additives which I also got from an eBay vendor. The bubbling is just the liquid boiling.
kephranet 11 months ago
sorry i forgot to mention taht we used UV/vis
sonisucks 1 year ago
hey, im doing a lab report for this same reaction for my inorganic chem class at UIC. i was just wondering if you know how to relate Wavelength to approximate size of the resulting nanoparticles. i did one reaction with sodium borohydrate and another one with sodium citrate. i have one peek at 532nm with absorbency of 0.1034, and another peek at 520 nm with absorbency of 1.0190. ( the second one was for the sodium citrate, the first was for NaBH4)
sonisucks 1 year ago
@sonisucks
Its my understanding that the plasmon resonance is described by Mie Scattering Theory. You might want to take a look at that. I think there are some simplifications possible with particles much smaller than the wavelength of light. I would think red gold would fall into that category.
kephranet 1 year ago
There is an alchemical method of producing powerfully charged colloidal gold that is far different from normal colloidal gold. Dry iron filings, powdered stibnite, and potassium chloride are combined in a certain proportion and heated. Antimony trichloride fumes are produced (which has been charged by the IRON) and condensed to form a highly corrosive "Virgin's Milk" which dissolves gold via direct chlorine ion transfer. Make your colloidal gold with that gold chloride. You will be amazed.
AlchemistShaman 1 year ago
@AlchemistShaman
A) How is is different? What physical attributes are different?
B) Direct chlorine ion transfer is the same as making CG via electrolysis, where the chlorine from the salt directly dissolves gold metal by making gold chloride.
C) Can you do a video showing it done and the results you get?
kephranet 1 year ago
F me running, when that turned purple I almost died! I blow glass and gold fuming depending on the amount fumed results in different colors as well, just never thought i'd see it happen in good ol' h2o.
mmaaxx1198 1 year ago
can this method be used for making colloidal silver and or colloidal copper and what does the sodium citrate actually do??
dougebfresh1 1 year ago
@dougebfresh1
Yes, the basic method is the reduction of a metal salt with a reducing agent. With gold, the salt is gold chloride, and the reducing agent is sodium citrate. The citrate also acts as a stabilizer to keep the gold particles from clumping together.
Chemists usually make colloidal silver this way using a silver salt such as silver nitrate, and a reducing agent. There are many edible reducing agents which can be also be used including glucose, fructose, and maltodextrin.
kephranet 1 year ago
@kephranet thanks for the quick response and i have one more question if you used silver nitrate what would it yeild like would the the NO3 be released yeilding a pure silver citrate or what?
dougebfresh1 1 year ago
@dougebfresh1 You get metallic silver nanoparticles along with leftover sodium citrate, sodium nitrate, probably tiny amounts of nitric acid etc. I would not ingest this. Chemists make it this way for other uses. My favorite method is electrolytically producing silver oxide and silver chloride, then reducing those salts to metal using maltodextrin or glucose as the reducing agent and stabilizer. Then there are no toxic byproducts.
kephranet 1 year ago
What is the diffrence between the red and purple color? Wich one is smaller?
zimstinka 1 year ago
@zimstinka
Red is smaller particle size.
kephranet 1 year ago
@kephranet
Funny a lot of sites who sell this stuff say red is smaller then 100 nanometer and purple was under 40 nanometer. I suppose there trying to rip off then?
zimstinka 1 year ago
@kephranet Red is larger particle size isnt it? That's why it turns red when you react it for longer. Longer rxn time gives the particles more time to aggregate into larger particles.
XReflection 1 year ago
@XReflection
No, not right. Red is the smallest that can be made with Turkevich method. Particles are less than 20nm. The color changes from dark blue to red because the particles are changing shape from rods to spheres.
kephranet 1 year ago
Do you happen to know how to make the colloidal gold, gold chloride again? Or even into metallic gold? The reason I ask is because I get colloidal gold when melting gold powders and would like to recover it. You can see how to get metallic gold out of the chloride in my video if you'd like. Thanks in advance.
metalicmario 1 year ago
why cnat you use citric acid, i did after a few failed attempts with sodium citrate(added the citric acid to the sodium citrate and gold mix and it turned red in like 10 min
681observer 1 year ago
@681observer
Excellent....
Please post your stoichiometry and long term stability. When I used citric acid, the resultant CG was very unstable, with resultant large particle sizes
kephranet 1 year ago
@kephranet where did you buy your hotplate stirrer hard to find a seller hope you can help thanks
vkturbo176hp 1 year ago
@vkturbo176hp
I bought it from an eBay vendor. It was about $90 If I remember correctly.
kephranet 1 year ago
@kephranet awseome thanks for that do. been doing a hell of alot of reading thought you might be able to help are you able to explain the difference between ionic silver and colloidal silver. With the colloidal gold you can definately drink this can you? So many different stories on all these that it's not funny.
vkturbo176hp 1 year ago
@kephranet what ppm is the final product thanks
vkturbo176hp 1 year ago
@vkturbo176hp
Its 40ppm with the amount of chemicals I used in the video.
kephranet 1 year ago
Does this actually work? Also how to prove to smone that it is indeed gold nanoparticles
pathakmallika 1 year ago
@pathakmallika Yes, this does work. The method was developed by John Turkevich et al and published in some scientific journals in the early 50's. You can prove that it is in fact a colloidal dispersion by shining a light through the side and observing a Tyndall cone, characteristic of the scattering of light by small particles. I recognise this as colloidal gold anyhow, the purple color is because of the surface plasmon resonances.. I've done it as part of my research!
BobStinkfulla 1 year ago
and how stable is your solution? Do you keep it in a dark place?
isihan 1 year ago
Hi Im a newbe how do you make gold chloride ? thanks
MrWolverine777 2 years ago
I buy it, but it is made by dissolving pure gold in Aqua Regia, which is pretty dangerous stuff.
kephranet 1 year ago
@kephranet
Dissolving gold in aqua regia makes hydrogen chloroaurate, not gold chloride.
chao129 1 year ago
@chao129 Dissolving gold in aqua regia produces the tetrachloroaurate(III) ion, which is a chloride of gold.
BobStinkfulla 1 year ago
so please tell me is Sodium Citrate the same as Citric Acid? i will test the other method with Silver nitrate.
Sumermagor 2 years ago
No it is not. And silver nitrate is not a specific test for gold chloride. It will produce the same result with just about any chloride, IE: table salt.
kephranet 2 years ago
how do you measure .15 grams
center123100 2 years ago
I use a beam balance, model Ohaus Centogram 311, or a reloading powder scale.
kephranet 2 years ago
okay, but i read on mesogold, that real colloid is metallic gold nanoparticles, which isnt use very simple technique... have you tried adding 1% silver nitrate to some of that liquid that you make?
I read somewhere if white clouds form, then thats gold chloride,
Sumermagor 2 years ago
This method has been the primary method of making gold nanoparticles for over 50 years. Yes its simple, and yes it is indeed gold nanoparticles. No need to add silver nitrate because there is an excess of reducing agent which insures that there is no gold chloride left.
kephranet 2 years ago
Isnt Gold Chloride highly toxic???
And the other gold colloid you make is gold chloride too. i did a research on it
Sumermagor 2 years ago
Yes, gold chloride is toxic. However, after doing the process, there is no gold chloride left, it has been transformed back into gold metal. Thats the whole point; colloidal gold is gold metal, not gold chloride.
kephranet 2 years ago
is this handel or hyden
jaffijaffer 2 years ago
I don't remember which. Any classical music gurus out there?
kephranet 2 years ago
Where can I get the sodium citrate.
abchandyman 2 years ago
eBay,
And I would not recommend sea salt. You must use pure sodium chloride, distilled water. Remember, you are trying to do chemistry in the ppm range, so your chemicals should be more pure than that.
kephranet 2 years ago
Good video, but I tried this process with a watered down sea salt and it didn't change colors. What type of sodium citrate are you using and did you get it in liquid or did you make your own liquid.
Thanks for a reply.
abchandyman 2 years ago
oh dang in my town the water was slitly purple
freedomefighter13 2 years ago
I will rephrase my question
what is the list for this process?
Also - have you heard of making Gold Colloid in the same way you make the Silver Colloid - which is by connecting a 9 - 12v bat/adapter to the pure (.9999 [99%] ) silver or pure 24k gold rods in distilled water?
I know about the silver way with the 9 - 12v elec - but can this really be done with the Gold rods?
Thank you very much!!!
anastasios333 2 years ago
Yes, you can make this with gold rods. It is not as simple as making colloidal silver though.
See my other video on making CG with a gold rod.
kephranet 2 years ago
why would U add the sodium citrate in? I thought gold chloride is a electrolyte, water souable, a perfect for a gold supplement? am I missing something?
osirisisisis 2 years ago
Citrate is a reducing agent which helps convert gold chloride to metallic gold particles. The citrate ions themselves adsorb to the gold giving it the negative charge which keeps the particles apart.
kephranet 2 years ago
is the gold in a metallic state more effective?
then the other state, whats it called? a salt state?
osirisisisis 2 years ago
If by adding the Citrate converts the gold chloride to metallic gold particles, would then connecting the 9 - 12v bat/adapter to pure Gold rods in distilled water work but cutting out the actual making of the Colloid you show in your video here?
anastasios333 2 years ago
where do you buy all the ingredients from?
anastasios333 2 years ago
eBAY
kephranet 2 years ago
I did not invent this process. It is the standard process colloidal gold has been made for 50 years. (Turkevich method). There is probably some hydrochloric acid, sodium chloride, and citrates left in the solution, but there are no toxic compounds, and everything is in the ppm range. There are less chlorides than in a bottle of club soda.
kephranet 2 years ago
Hi- Say that is very cool. Thanks for sharing this with us all. I'm interested in making colloidal gold myself but I have some questions about it. Using your process here, how do we know what the final product is? I mean does it only contain pure water and pure colloidal gold after it's finished or are there still chlorides left in the solution? We would only want to be ingesting pure gold particles suspended in pure water right? Thanks and look forward to your comments.
zendog48 2 years ago
What type of burner are you using?
POSEIDONRSW 2 years ago
Its just an electric hot plate with a magnetic stirrer. I bought it on eBay.
kephranet 2 years ago
I have a small suggestion. The colloidal gold ram ozone for 2 nights, but do with the high voltage lamps. Please let me know if anything is done with the colloid. In my opinion, this is a good way for white gold:)
neewton73 2 years ago
Do you drink this? What effects do you get? People say they get different effects from different methods. Like some who drink purple feel speedy, or red calm, or happy and relaxed. What do you feel?
ducky923 2 years ago
I have taken this, and I would say it has given me a happy feeling, plus it definitely helped my arthritis and myopathy in my legs. I do not recommend others do this, as that is a personal decision to make. After more than a year, it has done me no harm. Your mileage may vary.
kephranet 2 years ago
Is this safe to ingest? Do you take it internally?
Naddycat 2 years ago