CCW 2.148: Batman - Battle for the Cowl REVIEW (Conclusion)

[AfroNinja0077]

I enjoyed the book but now that you bring up those points I absolutely agree that it wasnt that good. I wish it would have showed Dick, Time and Damian going out fighting Two-Face or Penguin or anyone!

[bob214100]

this book was made for $ thats it man ok .

[24dgking]

I actually enjoyed it

[comicculturewarrior]

As did many, making it the top-selling book DC had the months it was running.

Elliott

[H4XGD]

That said, this series (BfTC) sucked.

[H4XGD]

How in the world do bad-quality comics display capitalism?

Do you even understand what capitalism is? Lord, go learn something. Know what you're saying before it comes out of your mouth (or, int his case, your fingers).

[Regenmacher175]

I know why this book sold so well: people are becoming really stupid and don't expect really much from comics and as long as there are some fight scenes in there, no one's gonna complain. that's capitalism for ya.

[generaldark]

if dan didio likes to kill off charecters why cant he kill of jason todd? that would be GREAT!

[Regenmacher175]

They tried..didn't work out unfortunately. the joker came really close though.

[CollinBfilms]

You guys should write a superhero book about cliches. You know... main guy has a healing factor, people wear two masks... storylines don't get resolved, etc.

[herosymbiote]

I wanted to like this mini-series too, but that's what happens when you get somebody who is not a proven writer to write a story. By the way Jose, I love your Daniel, Loeb, and especially your Bendis rants. And alll of the time, I agree 100% with you!

[comicculturewarrior]

Thanks herosymbiote.  :)

J.

[BENWONDER]

Why in comics does wearing a mask make you pupilless?

[ADVS14U2NV]

Acme makes masks with built in Nictitating membranes for an extra $9.99.

[htownmmm]

After all this new kryton stuff i hope jms well finally

be able to write superman

[atbbuckeye]

I am curious if you guys think the new series Batman and Robin will be any good after Grant Morrisons R.I.P. debacle, and will Judd Winick be able to clean the stench off of the regular Batman title after the BFTC garbage. Although I have to say the entertainment of Jose going off on BFTC almost makes it worth while especially since I didnt buy any of them.

[comicculturewarrior]

I am really hoping Batman and Robin will be good atbbuckeye. It's the same team responsible for All Star Superman so that's a good start. I really disliked the ending to R.I.P. so hopefully Morrison gets back on track with this title.

I'm looking forward to see what Winick does in his book. I enjoyed the run he did on Batman a few years ago. Don't know if he'll be able to clean up Tony Daniel's shit though.

J.

[Nkerklaan]

I'll pick up Winnick's first issue if you guys give it a good review. I actually haven't read much by him but what I've heard kinda turns me off. I *did* kind of like DC Universe: Decisions though, but I dunno how much of that was him and how much was Bill Willingham.

[misanthropicmumlover]

you guys always mention the horrible avenger's titles like new and dark, but you never actually talk about the good ones like the initiative and slott's mighty. i'm curious to see what you think of those two comics. have you ever done a review on either?

[comicculturewarrior]

We have done reviews of both of those book in the past. I love Initiative (bought the new one this week) and like the writing on Mighty Avengers but I can't stand Koi Pham's "art".

J.

[misanthropicmumlover]

agreed, agreed and DEFINITELY agreed! koi pham's pencils are horrible. and i really don't understand how marvel allows that to happen on one of their top selling titles.

i also used to have a problem with ramos' art...but in the last two issues, the inking or the coloring technique or something makes it more tolerable.

[leightonslang]

Can you review Four eyes #3? I herd it was good but I dont really know if im going to get it or not

[comicculturewarrior]

I haven't read the first two issues so I may have to wait to get the trade to do a fair review leightonslang. I've heard good things about it.

J.

[comicculturewarrior]

FYI

The April sales numbers are in from Diamond. Batman BFTC #2 was ranked 6th and Flash Rebirth #1 was ranked 2nd. Jeeezus...

J.

[Nkerklaan]

To be fair, I actually liked Flash Rebirth #1. It wasn't GREAT, and I dunno if I'll bother with the rest of the series, but it was entertaining.

Barry Allen is boring as fuck, though.

[comicculturewarrior]

Ya, Eric Young finally turned heel! Bout damn time. Sorry that was off topic. :P

J.

[Nkerklaan]

As long as we're going off-topic: I tried to find Secret Warriors but couldn't in either of the stores I went to on Wednesday, but I did pick up Checkmate Vol. 1 since you were saying you like that as well, and I've always kinda sorta meant to check it out after hearing lots of good things and knowing Greg Rucka wrote it. I'm only the first issue or so in but I'm REALLY enjoying it so far.

[comicculturewarrior]

Cool. Let me know what you think after you read the whole trade.

J.

[Nkerklaan]

Just finished it - that was fucking AWESOME. One of the best things I've read in awhile.

Can't wait to read the rest.... now I know where my pocket change from the next couple weeks will be going...

[comicculturewarrior]

Ya, well, I've got great taste in comics. It's no surprise you that it was awesome. :)

Seriously though, I'm glad you liked it. After you read all the Rucka issues of Checkmate you should check out his Wonder Woman run if you get the chance. I think it is very underrated.

Can't wait for his run on Detective to begin.

J.

[Nkerklaan]

I actually picked up a bunch of stuff on Wednedsay that you guys reccomended, so we'll see how your supposed "great taste" holds up. =P

Really though, thanks for giving me the impetus I needed to finally check this out. Rucka can be hit or miss (Final Crisis: Revelations, anyone?) but when he's on, he's on. I'm definitely looking forward to his Detective as well.

Really, this is a great time to be a Bat-fan: Morrison, Rucka, AND Dini?

Well, and Winnick I guess.

[comicculturewarrior]

What else did you pick up?

J.

[Nkerklaan]

Uh... lessee here....

A couple things that I can't read yet because I couldn't find the first part: Exiles #2 and part two of Whatever Happened To The Caped Crusader... then Dark Reign: Fantastic 4 #1 and Power Girl #1, haven't read those yet...

Lockjaw & the Pet Avengers, which was great... Irredeemable 1 and 2, which is off to a good start (tho to be fair I actually got those because EVERYONE'S talking about it, not just you)...

Also Wolverine #72 (cough).

[comicculturewarrior]

That's all really great stuff...except for Wolvie #72. FF Dark Reign is turning out to be awesome. I'm so looking forward to Hickman taking over the regular book.

I picked up Amazing Spider-Man: The Short Halloween and Aliens #1 this week. Two books I wouldn't normally buy but they both turned out to be good.

J.

[Nkerklaan]

Haha, Short Halloween.

As far as stuff I picked up that you guys haven't mentioned: Warlord #1 and #2 (looking forward to those, cause what I read of the first series was awesome and I need a good fantasy comic), Final Crisis: Ink #1, Gotham Gazette: Batman Alive, and a bunch of GL and GL Corps as I attempt to fill all my gaps between the last trade I read and the current issue so I can be caught up in time for Blackest Night (NO HATIN').

[Nkerklaan]

I actually was eyeing Aliens, but I figured it couldn't possibly be good. I'm surprised to hear it was.

[comicculturewarrior]

I think we'll do a review of Aliens next week. You know, to kind of get away fr the superhero shit. Also, you'll be happy to hear that Elliott and I taped an alternative fiction segment which should be up in a couple of days.

J.

[Nkerklaan]

Awesome!

You guys are no longer part of the problem. ;-P

[comicculturewarrior]

That Gotham Gazette issue had some nice art in it.

J.

[Nkerklaan]

Haha oh man I just opened it and that has to be one of the worst opening splashes I've ever seen. Nothing gets me wanting to read a comic like a boring shot of a woman standing on a rooftop while delivering no less than 11 speech balloons worth of overwrought expository dialogue!

[comicculturewarrior]

I didn't buy it, I just flipped thought it. Did Fabian Nicieza write that thing?

J.

[Nkerklaan]

Hey whadyaknow, he did.

I thought he'd be too busy running around in a Deadpool costume or whatever it is he does these days.

[comicculturewarrior]

Now I remember why I didn't buy it.

J.

[locusmortis]

I read Warlord 1 and it was very good, I can heartily recommend it.

[LEGOcinema15]

Wow... what a fun review! Glad I'm missing out on this mini-series. If you can't come up w/ something original just take something that's been done and twist it in a different way. Tony Daniel must be seriously lazy. At least that's what I'm picking up from your reviews. Same case w/ Ultimatum, I wanted to like it, but it's a piece of crap. Maybe it will be the #2 worst comic book story of the year!

[comicculturewarrior]

No.  Tony Daniel IS NOT lazy. It is really, really hard to draw and write comics, and takes supreme effort to get them out on time. I also don't think this was all Daniel's story. I think he was given this story and told to execute it.

Worst book of the year? I wouldn't say that, just cuz I may not have liked it. Army of Darkness #18 was the worst book of the year!

Not cuz of the art. Dave Simon rocks. The writing SUCKED!

;-)

Elliott

[comicculturewarrior]

Um, Elliott's right. Tony Daniel is not lazy. He's just an untalented hack.

J.

[zcorp79]

But don't you think that DC gave the project to Daniel's because they knew he wouldn't over step the other books. I mean I read an interview were Winnick said that he basically had BFTC almost done and DC told him that they couldn't use the story because he did more than what they wanted and it was taking away from the other titles coming out.

[pobra17]

ya, that Serrano guy really blows ;)

[Nkerklaan]

Wasn't there a Battle For The Cowl: Man-Bat miniseries? Man-Bat should SO have become the new Batman. That would have been fucking awesome.

[Nkerklaan]

And the first story arc could have been called "Man-Bat Reversed" or something, and would explore the symbolism of Man-Bat reversing both his name and his role in the DCU, from hero to villain, paralleled with a literal reversal as he begins rapidly reverse-aging. And in order to obtain a cure he has to defeat Bat-Mite in a jousting competition where they're both riding triceratopses.

[Nkerklaan]

Seriously, DiDio - call me. There's plenty more gold where that came from.

[comicculturewarrior]

Dude, you should totally pitch that to DC!

You'll be Didio's new golden child!

Elliott

[Nkerklaan]

As long as he doesn't want me to go exclusive so I can still pitch my "X-Wolverines" idea to Joe Quesada.

[comicculturewarrior]

Holy fuck! DC needs to fire Geoff Johns' boring ass and sign you Nkerklaan. Screw Darkest Night. Give me Hal Jordan and Blackhand jousting on multicolored Triceratopses and lets call it a day.

J.

[Nkerklaan]

Actually, I would turn Green Lantern into an 80s cop show where Hal Jordan would always be slamming people into walls and hoisting them up by their shirt collars.

It would all lead up to a big eight-issue event exstravaganza where all the shirt collars Hal Jordan has ever grabbed achieve sentience and form the Shirt Collar Corps to take their revenge on him.

[comicculturewarrior]

O_o

J.

[Nkerklaan]

What, too ahead of its time?

[comicculturewarrior]

Are the collars starched?

J.

[Nkerklaan]

Good question.

Maybe the starch is what makes them sentient. Like its' starch from the multiversal "bleed" or Sector 666 or some other crazy bullshit like that.

[comicculturewarrior]

That could work then. :)

J.

[comicculturewarrior]

Are you Warren Ellis in disguise?

Elliott

[Nkerklaan]

I wish.

I'm actually Tony Daniel.

[pobra17]

Dude! That's even better than my Wolverine vs. Radioactive Zombies idea! you're good.

[johnnyhorror92182]

Dick Grayson's parents are coming back as Black Lanterns. (more brains)

[pmknight12]

Hey El? U mentioned that u liked (a little anyway) an insight that Dick had.

On your previous show,u said that there were a few things that u sorta' liked. What else did u think was palettable? | :- )

[comicculturewarrior]

It was out on time. It was a solid effort. Was it worth 3.99? Prolly not, but Tony Daniel has no control over that. I don't know if I could have done better myself with the same kind of pressure that Daniel faced on this project, so I'll give him props for that.

Elliott

[DVGamer7]

lolz knowing how bd some comics are, what goes through your head when people come in and buy it?

do you hurt inside? do you take their money with contempt? loz

[pobra17]

worst comic of the year... for sure. Best review of the year??... close, i still liked your review of the second issue better. It was still worth buying to enjoy this review on a more informed level, but next time i think i'll probably just send you guys my money as E suggested, it wasn't worth soiling my collection ;)

[MarvelBoy117]

i bet theyre gonna do stupid like have bruce evil, time travel, and make him blackmask.maybe as a blacklantern (that would be okay maybe)

[Baec]

did you guys notice how Dick switches to second person narration. And how come we never see nightwings actual face when he puts on the cowl.

[pmknight12]

As far as how horrendous comics were ine 90's, locus', are u sure that it's perhaps your memories of lmage that might be coloring your views on that decade?

lf not, nevermind... (0^0)

K.....O....

[BlackPhoenix06]

LMAO!!!!!!!!! Jose looks so disgusted by reviews end I couldn't stop laughing! Yea, Jason Todd having another mask under the Batman mask was a bit silly, no doubt. So was the casualty count after all the destruction Gotham endured. This is a series I don't think I'd like even it was for free. But I must say its supposed awfulness only makes me all the more curious.

[BlackPhoenix06]

YAY! Part 3! x-D

[pmknight12]

The 60s,70s,80s&90s all have something in common as far as the big two go anyway.

1. An occasional moment of brilliance.

2.. A few comics that maintained a level of fair 2 desent readability.

3. A whole lot of mediocre ( although at times still fun ) comics

ln the 2000's however, this is the 1st time where there seems 2 be a push 2 accept mediocrity as excellence.

My concern is if the creative bar is set so low.....on average, folks won't meet that standard.

Then what?

knight out

[locusmortis]

Well its never black and white, owners of comic book companies never cared about the actual content, just as long as they sold. Martin Goodman didn't know good comics from bad, he was just lucky that Stan and Jack were in the right place at the right time. Look what happened when he tried to start up his own company company at Atlas/Seaboard, it was a complete failure.

[locusmortis]

The quality of comic content is down to the editors, and I think comics are better now than in the mid 90s (well I suppose they couldn't be worse come to think of it)

The problem with the big two now is the editor in chief and the writers are in charge and the actual line editors are there as schedulers not as actual story and art editors shepherding the books and looking after them.

[comicculturewarrior]

There's a balance to be struck locus. I have heard stories from friends in the business who have editors that do much more than just shepherd books. Some are really hands-on and will butt heads with the talent they oversee. Now, I doubt that's what happens with writers like Bendis and Loeb, but it does happen. And I think the books are better for it.

Elliott

[locusmortis]

Of course and some editors have to deal with lazy or unmotivated talent who are who are too busy playing xbox to turn in a pencilling job. I know of an instance where Garth Ennis was so bored with a job that he subcontracted the work out to another writer...that one wasn't found out for a few years.

What I'm saying is the general line editors don't have as much power as they used to and if one stood up to bendis, Joey Q would pick Bendis side over an editors side every single time

[mastulogan]

Well mostly cause DC believes its big three will sell no matter who is one the team. And notice this...barely a full year after Cap's death, Batman 'dies' only to be replaced by his sidekick...nothing like new ideas...

[zcorp79]

It would of been nice of DC if they at least gave us the identity of the new Black Mask at least in this mini series.

[locusmortis]

bad week to be wearing a man u shirt jose, thank god for barca :)

[comicculturewarrior]

>:I

J.

[saar1707]

Can U please upload the next video today?

[locusmortis]

well theres ways of reading bad books without actually buying them lol

[kurumais]

remember dc hyped this thing as dont assume you know what is going to happen dont expect you know who is going to be batman and we got snookered

btw whats difference between damian and when they revamped jason todd after the real crisis? it seems to me a lot of the flaws and anger in jason are right there in damian . why is ok for damian to be robin now if it was a mistake for jason?

[generaldark]

loved the review here guys, could you do at least one review of how you guys feel about whats been going on with captain america?

[comicculturewarrior]

Can you wait till Cap #600 comes out? We will most likely be reviewing that book next month.

J.