Wow, Ana, you're not very bright, are you? So you think that women should be denied their human rights because of a non-existing being that may or may not be living in the future? Does this actually make any sense to you? You're striving for less rights for all, a lowered standard of living for all....you're really taking a huge step backwards, aren't ya? No one with a functioning brain in their head is gonna fall for your idiotic views, dream on.
@animejerk05 Would you say the same about parents throwing children out of their house because "they have no right to be dependents of me. The rights of toddlers, infants, and tweens does not supercede the rights of adults who had them. There is no right to be taken care of."
@JessesanMan Throwing a newborn baby out of a window and forcing a women to be pregnant for 9 months and forcing her to bear a child are two very different things. Prolifers keep comparing irreverent things and comparing them with the same weight. No a women cannot throw a newborn out a window. But yes she can decide she doesnt want to be pregnant for 9 months she doesnt want go through child birth she doesnt want to wake up in the morning with pregnancy sickness.
@animejerk05 What exactly are you talking about then? Morning sickness and few hours of a very natural pain is a small inconvenience when compared with the bigger picture.
@JessesanMan So basically in your head its ok to take the rights away from another person in favor of the bigger picture. Oh I see thats how Pro lifers think
@heatbucspies55 your a idiot did you read the last post I was calling him ignorant because he profile pro choicers by saying that women get abortions for convience witch simply isnt true. Yes its ignorance and propaganda spreaded by prolifers and christians organizations
Never heard a woman regret giving birth (they complain about the pain, but had no regrets), but you can't count the number of women who regret their abortions.
@packofwolves93 Did you not watch the vid. One choice versus a lifetime of choices. And if you don't want to be pregnant then use condoms. Or pills. Or both. 25 cents and no harm done VS. hundreds of dollars and a dead baby.
@JessesanMan sometimes pills and condoms dont work.....also if someone is raped and gets pregnant then, because of your way of thinking, they cant get rid of that thing...makes total sense
@packofwolves93 What percent of abortions even apply to that? More than half of abortions are from women who just don't want children and crudload more are from teens who are pressured into it. Most rape victims actually choose to have their rape-conceived children. Don't ask me why.
Ive been watching a couple of this women videos and Ive notice that she uses a lot of circular logic and just plain propaganda to try and prove a point.
Wow, seriously? Thinking the opportunity cost in choices of a fetus compares to the actual choice made by a grown woman is senseless for the same reason we don't consider the opportunity cost of the millions of sperm who die in the process of making a child: potentialities are not actualities. Not getting something you never had (and in particular because you never existed) is not the same as losing something you otherwise would have by virtue of the fact that you do exist, as an autonomous prsn
@Superlativesweetie If you but sperm in a basin with something connected to them to keep them alive, they simply stay sperm. they do not change. If you were to put an embryo in some sort of tech that would keep them alive like an artificial womb, then they would grow and mature. Embryos and fetuses are two "stages" of early human life. Sperm and ova are excrement that could potentially start a life. That's a huge major difference.
If you dislike abortions, don't get one. Most people don't like others telling them what to think or do with their own bodies. The rest watch FOX and Pat Robertson.
I am grateful to my parents who cooperated with God to give me life.I as a human have not the right to decide who is to live and who is to die.A baby in the womb is alive;an adult should take all the necessary means to preserve their lives until their alloted time that God chooses.I am not indifferent to the sufferings some people go through; but killing a baby in the womb is not the solution.What has the baby done wrong except to be conceived in the mothers' womb ,which should be a safe haven
@lazydazs What choice has a living baby been given? They don't choose to be conceived. They can't choose their parents or their early life. You might have had a decent childhood, but what if you were born into a family filled with rape and torture for yourself, would you still have the same perspective?
I guess because you are "pro-life", in that a living being should be given the choice as to whether or not it wishes to live, you are also "pro-suicide"?
aren't related to my baby and it's well being. For whom are these options more emotionally stressing and scarring? Ask yourself that next time you want to tell someone that abortion is wrong.
I am currently pregnant and for the time being taking the steps needed to terminate my pregnancy. Abortion isn't just cut and dry. Today was my ultrasound to judge how far along I am; seeing something that could one day be a person I created is really difficult. Having to make any choice makes me feel like a monster. I'm sixteen. An abortion takes away the choices of someone who doesn't know the difference, but pro-life takes away the rest of my already conscious thoughts that...
@PokemonBandAid If you want, then you can find a family for your child. There are organizations ready and willing to help girls like you find a good family for your baby, and for no cost. Meanwhile, how much are you going to have to pay the abortionists?
If you can make it through those nine months, then you can be proud and say that you were strong enough.
Many women regret their abortions, but I never heard of a woman regretting giving birth to a child.
@JessesanMan women regret adoption much more than late term abortions. A women is 2x more likely to be sucidal from giving her newborn baby to adoption than she she from having an late term abortion. she also more likely to feel much more regret and mental pain from adoption That being said late term abortions only represent 4% of all abortions total And a women that has a 1st term abortion witch is 85% of abortion rarley feels regret and has no long term emotional effects
@formerevolutionist "What if a woman is forced to get an abortion that she does not want? Where are the Pro-Choice people then?"
I had a nightmare like that once!!! I was raped, and I told the doctors I wanted to keep the baby because I knew that abortion was murder, but they put me "under" and aborted the baby anyway, and when I came to, all the Pro-Choice people just said that I was a dumb teenager who deserved to have my baby slaughtered and all that. ;-;
Why have I never seen pro-choicers campaigning for women who are trying to keep their baby? Pro-lifers are always eager to help such women, but the pro-choicers couldn't care less.
@dmmchn That is funny. Can you at least show me where they even mention helping or supporting women who want to keep their babies? To them, "choice" merely means choosing whether or not they are going to kill the baby.
@formerevolutionist Well, I guess in your opinion, so long as the "baby" isn't murdered, the rest of its life is unimportant. In your opinion, if a mother has an abortion, this is far worse than having the baby and then systematically abusing it.
Burning a baby with a cigarette, in your opinion, is not as bad as having an abortion, right?
See how I applied the same logic you applied to the pro-choice argument to your argument?
Don't be a moron on purpose, it doesn't help your argument.
if pro-lifers really cared about the unborn, why do they say "theres options", like "you can adopt", but then not immediately offer to adopt that child?
Theres enough pro-life people to adopt every potential abortion. So, why aren't you doing that, if you care so much?
@formerevolutionist "Bad arguments" meaning ones you don't agree with? Tsk tsk.
And... I think that in most "revolutionary" differences of opinion, if you aren't part of the solution, you're part of the problem.
So you basically stand outside abortion clinics and say "DO NOT HAVE AN ABORTION", and when you're presented with the question, what else can I do?, you reply.. "I dunno".
Also, a foetus is not a baby. A baby is not a child, a child is not an adult.
@dmmchn If you would study logic and rhetoric you would know what bad arguments are.
Of course a fetuses, babies, children, and adults are different. However, they are still human. Is it okay to kill an innocent adult? Is it okay to kill an innocent child or baby? If not, then why is it okay to kill a fetus? It is no less human than a baby, child, or an adult.
@formerevolutionist Clearly, you have done less study in the field of logic than I have.
By your argument, logically, all components and stages of human life are equivalent. Thus, by choosing to not be pregnant, a woman is denying human life.
The point of the pro-choice argument is to draw a clear definition between "murder" and "choosing not to be impregnated". I think you'll find that pro choice people are (in general) against late term abortions.
@dmmchn If you claim that I don't understand logic as well as you do, then don't use fallacies, yourself. It just reflects poorly on you.
I'm glad that you understand that all stages of life are equally valid. No one is less of a human because of the current stage they are in. How does that support the claim that not getting pregnant is murder? If you think this is what pro-lifers believe, then you are mistaken.
I have a question: WHY are most pro-choice people against late-term abortions?
@formerevolutionist What fallacies exactly have I used? Do you know what a fallacy is? Pro-lifers use that word a lot, it must be in the pamphlet.
I never said that not getting pregnant was murder.
This video moves away from the idea that a foetus is equal to a human being, and instead claims that having an abortion denies a human the right to life. But, so does not being pregnant. If a pregnant woman considering abortion had just not had sex on that particular day, what's the difference?
@formerevolutionist Why are pro choice people against late term abortions.. because at 7-9 months the foetus body is developed enough for the brain to develop. The brain being the deciding factor of humanity, in this case.
@formerevolutionist I would just like to jump in to say that if you think that all of the stages of life are equal, then you should think a sperm cell, and an egg cell, are both equal to an adult human. Those are both living cells. So, if a man ejaculates, he should try and keep all the little sperm cells alive, because they are living, and technically human stages of life? In my opinion, that is a very stupid argument. A fetus is not equal to people who are born at all.
@keilareadman Because the human life begins at conception, not at meiosis, not at the third trimester. The moment the new human's DNA is its own individual genetic code. That is where it all begins.
Depends. Is it an abortion to save womans life? Even pro-loofas support those.
But if its a "gotcha" question about women who wants a baby till its in the birth canal & she suddenly changes her mind and wants to abort it (ie urban legend)
I can tellyou why I have problems w/ it. I support a womans right to get unpregnant. Someone who wants to get unpregnant, when
shes BEEN pregnant for 6, 7 months, kinda loses me.
@JessesanMan yes there techically alive and human but you cant force a women to carry another person against her will so that person can now have life. You cant take the rights away from 1 and give it to another. A women must decide to go through a pregnancy and give life to another person. You cannot force her against her will for what ever reason to give up her life for 9 months so another can breathe life its absurd.
I'm done arguing with you, dmmchn - just like every other Pro-Choicer I've ever come across, you're illogical and will do whatever you can to delude yourself further. Not intentionally, of course, but none of your arguments have been logical or reasonable, and I have no desire to continue "debating" with you when you bring up arguments that are based on biased opinion and full of flaws, and then when I demand you cite a source for something, you don't. So, have a good day, and farewell.
@amanda2324 Well, for a start, you're not actually arguing, you're just saying "But Dr Lejeune says this and therefore it must be a fact".
You haven't at any point in time pointed out a logical flaw with my arguments, unless you consider "it doesn't agree with my opinion" as a logical flaw.
Your ONLY argument is based on opinion, and the supposed validity of that opinion. So, I guess if I'm a kettle, you are a big, black pot.
@amanda2324 And incidentally, I don't have a biased opinion at all. My "biased opinion" is that if something has a functional human frontal lobe then it is a human. And, science has shown (if you did a 10 second google search) that the frontal lobe only begins to develop in the last few weeks of gestation. Lots of foetuses miscarry on their own - not every sperm, ova or foetus is destined to become human. Aborting a zygote is barely different from a woman choosing to have a period.
@dmmchn There is no basis for this assertion. In fact, it is invalid because it is contradicted by known medical science. Many babies are born prematurely WITH all parts intact. By your logic it would be okay to kill anyone who has had a frontal lobotomy. After all, it is no longer human, right? Where do you get the idea that someone with human DNA is not a human until it has all its parts?
@formerevolutionist What are you talking about, there is no basis for this assertion? Have you done any research into it or are you just spouting verbatim what it says on pro life websites (hint : I know the answer is yes).
Dr Donald Stuss in particular has done enough research to pinpoint the frontal lobe as being "what makes us human". How has medical science proven that a foetus is human? PS - the answer is not "It is a medical fact".
@formerevolutionist Also, there has been research done that shows the frontal lobe only begins to develop in the last 7 weeks of pregnancy; the rest of gestation the body develops into something that can support the frontal lobe.
We are not talking about altered humans, or those who have already been born, we are trying to draw a satisfactory line for when a human life BEGINS. I believe that a frontal lobotomy is equivalent to execution anyway. More unethical than execution though.
@dmmchn " I think it is fair to say that our frontal lobe is what makes us "human".. otherwise we would be simply animals, reacting."
Incorrect - again, you're stating your own opinion. Is an infant, whose frontal lobes are less developed than mine, less human than I am? Am I less human than those whose frontal lobes are more developed than mine? Again, you're stating opinions that are based on logical fallacies and bias.
@amanda2324 What??? No, it is not my opinion that our frontal lobe makes us human, it is an actual scientific fact. Donald Stuss, a brain expert (who has actually done experiments to verify his opinion - do you see the difference?) has discovered the frontal lobe is the basis of what makes us human.
@dmmchn I ask again - so an infant, whose frontal lobes are not yet fully developed, less human than me? Hm? I don't think so. Is someone whose frontal lobes are more developed than yours more human than you are? Hm? I don't think so. This guy may have proven that frontal lobes give us human consciousness or whatever, but is that truly what makes us human? No. It's one of the advantages we have over animals, but we humans still have different DNA, etc, from animals. Not just the "frontal lobes."
@amanda2324 Yes, an infant is less human than you. Yes, the more developed a persons frontal lobes are, the more human behaviours they are capable of. I think you're actually getting it.
It is the "only" advantage we have only other animals; our perception of time and complex social structure.
@amanda2324 And as far as DNA? Undersea worms which breathe sulfur share around 75% of our DNA. I don't think you understand genetics, DNA is simply a code which tells our cells to grow in a specific way. It's our DNA that allows us to have huge frontal lobes. So.. I don't really understand what you're trying to argue here.
@dmmchn Well what about the man who doesn't even half the front half of his brain? If you google half headed man, you will see what I'm talking about. Is he just not human?
@amanda2324 Your argument seems to be "if it has human DNA it has human rights". A dead body has human DNA, does it still have human rights? No. Because it lacks something humans do, the capability for consciousness.
The only way your argument can make any logical sense is from the "possible human life" point of view; in which case, you must include at least ova as a potential human life. An embryo is a human without 9 months of gestation, an ova is an embryo without a sperm, and thus a human.
@dmmchn Actually, it also lacks life. So your analogy is flawed.
That is incorrect. The conceived embryo is not possible human life, it is already scientifically proven to BE human life. It is alive, but at an early stage of development. Therefore, again, you're using flawed arguments. Not only that, you're assuming you know what I am arguing, and you obviously don't. I never argue on the basis for "potential human life."
@amanda2324 No, it is not scientifically proven to be human life. How is it proven to be human life? Your only response is "because Dr Lejeune agrees". That is not a scientific proof.
@dmmchn Furthermore, NO, an embryo is a human. That is a fact. What, does it just MAGICALLY become human later on? That's pretty stupid. An apple seed that has just begun growth is a tiny apple tree. See? You're not making any sense whatsoever. Furthermore, Dr. Lejeune doesn't just think it. You're running on assumptions. Please provide better, logical arguments.
@amanda2324 No, it is not a fact, it is your opinion. And, no, there is no magic, its' called "gestation".
An apple seed that has begun growth is not an apple tree; an apple tree has leaves and grows apples. You are the one making no sense at all. If you're going to take a reductionist view, you must continue and also consider an apple seed to be an apple tree.
@dmmchn No, it is not my opinion. It is a fact supported by scientists. You have yet to provide ANY sort of scientific proof, only statements that you could have just as easily pulled out of thin air.
And incorrect again! If the apple tree does not have trees, or have apples (like an infertile apple tree) it is STILL an apple tree! You are basing your arguments on what something can or cannot do, which is fallacious.
@amanda2324 Which scientists! Theres only "one" scientist, and its his opinion. Show me the evidence, show me the experiments. There are none, because it is simply opinion.
Again, you are trying to provide a reductionist view, in which case you must believe that an ova is also a human being. I dont think you know what fallacious means. It is perfectly logical that if something does not have the properties of something, it is not that something. Wheres the fallacy?
@amanda2324 Which scientists! Theres only "one" scientist, and its his opinion. Show me the evidence, show me the experiments. There are none, because it is simply opinion.
Again, you are trying to provide a reductionist view, in which case you must believe that an ova is also a human being. I dont think you know what fallacious means. It is perfectly logical that if something does not have the properties of something, it is not that something. Wheres the fallacy?
@amanda2324 YOUR argument is actually far less logically consistent. You want to reduce things to their basic components, but only as far as you are willing to go to support your views. An apple tree that cannot bear fruit is not an apple tree, it is an "apple tree that can't bear fruit". Boiling a germinated seed is not the same as cutting down a tree.
@LiveActionFilms Here's an idea Ana: You can keep and have all of the babies you want, but you honor the constitution and give others the responsibility to make their own decisions.
@alakbakbak No. A sack of shit is a sack of shit. Human fetuses are humans in the early stage of life. I don't know why you said this stupid stuff, or why two people liked your comment, but if you have nothing constructive to say, don't say it.
@amanda2324 Your assumptions are faulty. How do you know all the "poor African children" are unwanted? But if they were all unwanted as you say, it would be better for them not to be born at all so they would not suffer
@bitcheznhos And exactly who are you to decide what is better? I've talked with people who've helped orphans, homeless families, orphaned homeless children, and people who grew up in those conditions but were now adults, and all of them say that they would not have wanted to be aborted. So your assumption may only correct for you - however, you have no right to say that that's how it is for everyone else.
@amanda2324 AND FURTHERMORE!! If you're so into possible human lives, I should hope you are continually pregnant. You best not be wasting any precious human ova, that are potential human lives! Just think, by deciding to not be pregnant right now, you're robbing a potential human of a great possible life!!!
@amanda2324 A foetus is a possible human life, not an actual human life. I don't think its a great leap of logic from "foetus" to "ova", since neither are human beings.. and since you care about one...
@dmmchn Um, you're wrong. The fetus has 46 Chromosomes, the number that is required for a human, while the "ova" does not. 23 chromosomes will not do much of anything by itself.
@amanda2324 46 chromosomes or not, a foetus can't do anything even vaguely human like, it cannot even breathe without being attached to another human. A foetus won't do much of anything by itself.
@dmmchn So? Neither does an infant. Why are you judging something based on what it can or cannot do? A person who is in a coma can't do much. Are they not human? A person who is brain dead can't do much. Are they not human? Humanity is not based on a persons capabilities. If it were, there would be a lot of humans who would be referred to as "not human."
@amanda2324 No, but a foetus is not yet a human. A person in a coma "was" a human. A person who is braindead "was" a human.
I would probably go as far as to say that they're not really living a human life anymore anyway, but that's not what we're arguing here.
A baby is a potential human life, a foetus is a potential baby, and an ova is a potential foetus. If you want to blur the lines, you have to go all the way, that's all I'm saying.
@dmmchn Now I KNOW something is wrong with your logic. A baby IS a human, period! The braindead and those in a coma still ARE human!
That's some of the most immoral, unscientific bull you've said yet! You really don't know what you're talking about. A fetus IS a baby, an ova is just an egg which will remain an egg. Egg + sperm = baby. Doesn't take rocket science to figure that one out. And science supports this. You've yet to say anything even remotely based on facts, only your opinion.
@amanda2324 No. What I said is fact - there is a distinction between ova, foetus and baby. The only opinion that is involved is yours, and that opinion is that there is no distinction between foetus and baby. Babies have their brain mostly developed, whereas a foetus does not; I would class a human as being a conscious entity, a foetus is not capable of consciousness.
@dmmchn I think it is reasonable to say that a human being is mostly defined as something capable of conscious thought. The comatose.. well yes, still human. Braindead people WERE human. Now they are dead.
And, again, with regards to opinion, the idea that you can call something immoral because it disagrees with your opinion indicates that you have a strong bias away from being interested in fact. Finally? Egg + sperm = foetus. Foetus + 7-9 months gestation = baby. Not rocket science.
@dmmchn Well, I don't care what YOU "classify" as a human being. I am STATING scientific FACTS. Dr. Jerome Lejeune, Father of Modern Genetics, and many other scientists agree that human life begins at conception. You have yet to state any source; all you've said is that you are stating fact, but it is not fact unless you can prove it, and you have not provided evidence, let alone proof, that it is fact. You're just preaching your opinion and then saying I'M the one doing that. Hypocrite.
@amanda2324 Mmm.. no, you're stating his opinion, not a scientific proof. Just because someone has some dealings in science does not make all of their opinions scientific facts.. as you said. "he agrees that life begins at conception". Not "He has done conclusive scientific tests and concluded that a foetus and a baby are equivalent".
Note the difference; you calling me a hypocrite is laughable, at least I haven't tried to name drop when presenting my opinion.
@amanda2324 And, I have stated facts - A sperm + egg = a foetus, a foetus requires 7-9 months to become a baby. Explain to me how any of that is "my opinion".....
@dmmchn It does not take 7-9 months to become a baby, it takes 7-9 months before the baby is normally ready for a natural birth to take place. After all, the youngest BABY to survive a premature birth was only 21 weeks, which is less than 7 months, only about 4 months. Therefore, your statement is false. Also, you have not cited where you got that self-claimed fact, so either you're lying, or you're just stating your opinion. Well, techniqually you'd be lying either way.
@dmmchn It does not take 7-9 months to become a baby, it takes 7-9 months before the baby is normally ready for a natural birth to take place. After all, the youngest BABY to survive a premature birth was only 21 weeks, which is less than 7 months, only about 4 months. Therefore, your statement is false. Also, you have not cited where you got that self-claimed fact, so either you're lying, or you're just stating your opinion. Well, techniqually you'd be lying either way.
@amanda2324 Your statement comes from the opinion of someone else, not a scientific fact.. so where exactly are you getting your "facts" from? If I find a bunch of pHd' holders who believe the world is flat, in your opinion does that mean the world is flat?
I get my facts from, you know, the book about human development. The egg is fertilised, it splits, it grows into an embryo, which then develops into a baby. Are they not the facts? If a baby is ready after 4 months, why does it take 9?
@amanda2324 And, with regards to the 4 month old, it's nice to understand the ethics behind your point of view. If it looks human in any way and breathes, it must BE a human. The problem with your moral standpoint is that it only takes into consideration how wonderful it is to "have" a child, like some kind of possession. Nevermind the quality of that childs life... I think its very wrong ethically for them to have "saved" it's life.. it will likely never develop mentally.. how cruel.
@dmmchn I've seen mentally retarded people live full lives. They are happy, interesting human beings. They were given a chance at life and grabbed it by the horns. It is always better to give someone a chance than deny it to them entirely.
"I believe you will fail, so I won't even let you try."
@JessesanMan They're almost always supported by other people for their entire lives. If they were completely independent, they wouldn't be considered retarded.
And, again, every single menstrual period is a denied human life.
@dmmchn Excuse me? Are you blind? "I am STATING scientific FACTS. Dr. Jerome Lejeune, Father of Modern Genetics, and many other scientists agree that human life begins at conception." Please explain to me how a "Father of Modern Genetics" would only have a mere -opinion- about this? You fail. If you cannot provide me with any note-worthy scientists to believe otherwise, I have no reason to listen to you. Furthermore, it's not because it LOOKS human, it IS human. Huge difference there, buddy.
@amanda2324 Nope, it's his opinion. Sorry, but you're confused as to what "science" is. A scientific opinion is one that is proven by empirical evidence. The earth rotates around the sun, this can be proven via experiment. What experiments has Dr Lejeune done regarding this subject? None. Just because he is "father of modern genetics", it does not make his opinion any less an opinion. YOU fail at understanding science.
@dmmchn I understand science very well. Making assumptions makes you look very stupid. Furthermore, since he's the Father of Modern Genetics, he probably knows a lot more science than you do (after all, he's the one who found the cause of Down Syndrome, and he studied fetuses, so yeah...). This really shows how stubborn and arrogant you are. His opinion is worth a LOT more than yours, because he's a scientist and actually studies this sort of thing hands on, unlike you.
@amanda2324 It's reasonable to assume you have no idea about science, since you can't tell the difference between "opinion" and "scientific fact". So what if he studied foetuses. Yes, he has done a lot of research into genetics, but that doesn't make his "opinion" into a "fact". It's like arguing that since Stephen Hawking does not believe that god was necessary to create the universe, it is a fact, because he is a scientist who studies the universe.
@dmmchn Actually, it looks like it is YOU who do not understand the difference between opinion and scientific fact. Furthermore, if you do your research (which you obviously haven't) no one has been able to disprove Dr. Jerome's stance. They've only been able to prove him more correct. So, until you can provide some evidence for your side, the evidence is on mine. You whining about whether or not his scientific fact is an opinion - that's only your opinion. You have no proof otherwise.
@amanda2324 Well.. obviously, you cant disprove an opinion.. because its an opinion. Not a fact. "The sun is hot" is a fact. "I don't like the heat" is an opinion. See the difference? Similarly "an embryo has unique DNA" is a fact, "An embryo is a human being" is an opinion. See?
And I'm at a loss as to what "evidence" you've provided. Let me see.. umm.. oh there it is! "Dr Lejeune thinks this therefore it must be true". Wow! That's evidence if ever I saw it.
@amanda2324 A scientific fact is that the frontal lobes of the brain do not begin to develop until near the end of the term (R Joseph 1996). I think it is fair to say that our frontal lobe is what makes us "human".. otherwise we would be simply animals, reacting. The foetal stage is important to grow a body that a "human" can inhabit, but without that part of the brain, there is nothing to differentiate us from other primates. I invite you to have yours removed if you disagree.
@amanda2324 Stubborn? Arrogant? Because I won't agree that the opinion of someone who agrees with your point of view makes your point of view correct?? If I was a kettle, you would definitely be a pot.
@dmmchn No, you're arrogant because you think that your opinion is worth so much, when you have so little (actually, nothing) to back it up. Stubborn, because even after 12+ replies, you STILL haven't provided any REAL proof that your opinion has any facts to back it up, while I have, and you've only provided childish, uneducated replies as to why mine do not hold merit, when they hold a lot more than anything (or lack thereof) that you've thrown out.
@amanda2324 And the same goes for you. All you have done is provide the opinion of someone who agrees with you and pretended that its scientific. Where are your facts exactly? And how are the things I have stated not fact? Are you saying that sperm + egg does not equal embryo?
@dmmchn It is not JUST someone who agrees with me - it's a professional, a scholer, in that field. You obviously don't know much about how evidence is validated, or else you would know this simple fact. If I had quoted a redneck, that would have not been as good as who I DID quote; one who is actually studying this sort of thing. Therefore, your claim is a logical fallacy. Further, sperm + egg does equal an embryo, but embryo is basically just a human at an earlier stage of development.
@amanda2324 It doesn't matter; the logical fallacy is yours. You assume his opinion is a fact.
Evidence is not validated by "this guy researches in this field so his opinion must be right". It is validated by looking at data and drawing conclusions based on that data. Or you could compare the properties of humans to the properties of foetuses.. but if you were to do that the data would probably err in favour of "not human".
My argument is that an embryo and a baby have different properties, thus they are not equivalent. For example, a rock and a sponge have different properties, they are not the same even though they are both made of carbon. How is that "logically fallacious". I'd like you to point out exactly the fallacy.
Your argument is "This guy says this and therefore it is true". There is zero logic there.
[Lesley Stahl on U.S. sanctions against Iraq: "We have heard that a half million children have died. I mean, that's more children than died in Hiroshima. And, you know, is the price worth it?"; Secretary of State Madeleine Albright: "I think this is a very hard choice, but the price--we think the price is worth it." — "60 Minutes" (5/12/96)]
Abortion is the lynch pin upon which eugenics is hinged. Are Human Beings THE premiere life-form of this planet: Earth? That's the question. Those who believe not condemn their unborn children to forceps & vacuum tubes to make room for snail darters & eaglets.
The Illuminists & Fabians fervently believe that great wealth & power are theirs as the means to deliver chaos and oblivion to We the People: a.k.a. "human weeds" (as eugenist Margaret Sanger labeled us) & "worthless eaters" (as we're seen by the U.N.).
@ThePregnancySlaves common as they come baby but i don't force my wishes on onther people and try to force women who may die in pregnancy not to have an abortion or go and murder a doctor because they work at a med clinic, wasn't that doctor once one of your precious embroes?
@FetusDeathMatch lol you're an idiot. the only way a baby can develop or become a potential baby is with sperm and an egg TOGETHER. some people are stupid i swear.
Murder is always a choice, as is arson, counterfeiting, rape & shoplifting. The polar opposite of pro-life is pro-death. Abortion is about killing, not choosing. The choice to murder children in a clinic lies temporarily w/the mothers as the courts have, for the time-being, granted them impunity & immunity from prosecution
A guy pulling out, a guy wacking off, a girl giving a blow job, birth control, abortion it all has the same conclusion, loss of an oppertunity for human life, despite the way you christian fanatics try to dress it up to gain support
Let's think about this logicially, a women knows she can't care for a baby and to do so ruins her life, even if the baby is born the baby would live a poor life baring a miracle, logically it would be best to not have a kid, isn't it not givi9ng a baby a shot when a guy pulls out? If he would have not pulled out there would be a new baby? So is pulling out just as bad as abortion?
How is it that a group of people feel they have the right to force others into doing what they think is right? It's called religion...lets be realistic some kids will be brought into this world and due to living circumstance they won't have a fighting chance to make something of themselves and in the process they ruin the lives of the mother father and damage others in a domino like effect. Giving birth is extrmemly painful and forcing someone to do it isn't wrong?
I think the theme here is potential. It's intention that brings sanctity to an unborn child. Without it, it's jut a rudimentary cluster of cells, or perhaps an underdeveloped fetus depending on when it takes place. It was never planned or intended for, it's only a notch away from the sperm and egg that made it. Of course, this becomes less and less true over time, which is why late term abortion might be a bit shaky. Early term abortion is unquestionably morally neutral.
@LiveActionFilms You could apply that argument to a foetus also.
Is an ovum a homosapiens, no, it must be fertilised. I agree. Is a foetus a homosapiens? No, it must gestate. A born baby is a baby; that is a human life, it has successfully gestated and can live independently of its mother. Science is awesome. Check it out.
Uh, no. You're wrong. You need to look at science more clearly - Dr. Jerome Lejeune, the Father of Modern Genetics who discovered the cause of Down Syndromes, agrees that human life begins at conception.
Furthermore, infants can't live independently of their mother. Neither can toddlers. Your point?
@amanda2324 Uh no, you need to gain a better understanding of science. One doctor agrees? That's one.
Every scientist agrees that Uraniam is radioactive. See the difference?
Just because one person shares your beliefs does not make your beliefs correct. And, an infant does not need its mother to survive. Any human female can care for it.
If you remove a foetus from a womb it dies immediately.
@dmmchn It's not JUST one, I only cited one. But since he was a scientist who was more intelligent than the "average" scientist, he was worth listening too. Sorry, it doesn't matter HOW many people state something - the entire world thought the world was flat. Was that true? No, of course not. So don't be hiding behind numbers as if that actually means something.
And so what? There are ill people who not -every- or -any- doctor can care for, only a number can, if any at all. Your point?
@dmmchn Not necessarily, they can be transferred to new women as snowflake babies. What kills them is being ripped to shreds inside the womb and then sucked out.
@JessesanMan If you just took it out of the womb, surgically, it still wouldn't be able to grow into a functional human being. I doubt it would be particularly easy to "graft" it into a new womb at 3-4 months.
But if it is. maybe thats a solution you can propose? Your female pro-life compatriots can offer to provide a safe womb for unwanted foetuses.
@amanda2324 And furthermore - even if it can breathe independently, if it is not adequately gestated it is not a fully developed human. If you take a car body off the production line before the engine is put into it, can it drive? No. Therefore it is not a car yet.
@dmmchn Sorry, there is a HUGE difference between a LIVING THING, a -living being, and a car. A seed that is beginning to sprout is still a baby whatever-it's-supposed-to-be.
@dmmchn What exactly is the difference between a nine moth full-term one day before being born and an infant the day of birth in the mother's arms. Nothing, except location,
And there are no major day by day differences until you hit the difference between sperm and ova and a zygote/embryo. Two have become one, there is a new set of DNA, and now a new human is getting ready to begin its life in this world.
@JessesanMan Again, at no point have I said "terminating a 9 month old foetus is OK". Typically for people who use your argument, you deconstruct it only as far as necessary to support your point.
As I have said, the ability for a brain to have consciousness is my personal cut off point. Does a 3 month old zygote have this quality? No. Does a sperm or ovum? No.
Your argument is simply sexual politics "two become one", etc.
@DashingDominic An adolescent is still human, but an adolescent has fewer rights than an adult, is as appropriate, and a fertilized human egg has even fewer still. Do you think a fertilized human egg has the same rights as a human adult?
you gotta study the difference between killing and stopping an unwanted potential life brought into a world not wanting it...abortion is a choice, not a forced one...if you think that so much talk more about the option of adoption than using emotional blackmail with your stupid philosophies that make no fucking sense
Wow, Ana, you're not very bright, are you? So you think that women should be denied their human rights because of a non-existing being that may or may not be living in the future? Does this actually make any sense to you? You're striving for less rights for all, a lowered standard of living for all....you're really taking a huge step backwards, aren't ya? No one with a functioning brain in their head is gonna fall for your idiotic views, dream on.
loathedandabhorred 3 days ago
@loathedandabhorred
It's not non existing.
It exists for sure. Foetus' aren't a myth, they are an existing being. What a ridiculous statement.
And just calling her stupid and saying it takes a step backwards doesn't make you any more right.
heatbucspies55 1 day ago
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riverlife695 3 weeks ago
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No human being has the right to remain inside the body of another human being against that person's will. There is no right to be born.
Spermatozoa, zygotes, embroyos and fetuses do not have rights that supercede those of the woman carrying them.
animejerk05 3 weeks ago
@animejerk05 Would you say the same about parents throwing children out of their house because "they have no right to be dependents of me. The rights of toddlers, infants, and tweens does not supercede the rights of adults who had them. There is no right to be taken care of."
I think there's a law about that.
JessesanMan 3 weeks ago
@JessesanMan Throwing a newborn baby out of a window and forcing a women to be pregnant for 9 months and forcing her to bear a child are two very different things. Prolifers keep comparing irreverent things and comparing them with the same weight. No a women cannot throw a newborn out a window. But yes she can decide she doesnt want to be pregnant for 9 months she doesnt want go through child birth she doesnt want to wake up in the morning with pregnancy sickness.
animejerk05 3 weeks ago
@animejerk05 So then you're for convience against life?
JessesanMan 2 weeks ago
@JessesanMan A statement founded upon ignorance.
animejerk05 2 weeks ago
@animejerk05 What exactly are you talking about then? Morning sickness and few hours of a very natural pain is a small inconvenience when compared with the bigger picture.
JessesanMan 2 weeks ago
@JessesanMan So basically in your head its ok to take the rights away from another person in favor of the bigger picture. Oh I see thats how Pro lifers think
animejerk05 2 weeks ago
@animejerk05
Calling someone ignorant and giving no reason why doesn't make you any more right.
heatbucspies55 1 day ago
@heatbucspies55 your a idiot did you read the last post I was calling him ignorant because he profile pro choicers by saying that women get abortions for convience witch simply isnt true. Yes its ignorance and propaganda spreaded by prolifers and christians organizations
animejerk05 1 day ago
Never heard a woman regret giving birth (they complain about the pain, but had no regrets), but you can't count the number of women who regret their abortions.
JessesanMan 4 weeks ago
Great video!! I loved it! Keep up the good work! Save the babies and let them live! :D
<3
Thatsamystery0 1 month ago
taking away abortion takes away my choice!
packofwolves93 1 month ago
@packofwolves93 Did you not watch the vid. One choice versus a lifetime of choices. And if you don't want to be pregnant then use condoms. Or pills. Or both. 25 cents and no harm done VS. hundreds of dollars and a dead baby.
JessesanMan 4 weeks ago
@JessesanMan sometimes pills and condoms dont work.....also if someone is raped and gets pregnant then, because of your way of thinking, they cant get rid of that thing...makes total sense
packofwolves93 4 weeks ago
@packofwolves93 What percent of abortions even apply to that? More than half of abortions are from women who just don't want children and crudload more are from teens who are pressured into it. Most rape victims actually choose to have their rape-conceived children. Don't ask me why.
JessesanMan 3 weeks ago
@packofwolves93 (continued for him/her)
...to put the fear of God into the little buggers I already got
JessesanMan 2 weeks ago
@packofwolves93 Sorry, had to be a little childish there
JessesanMan 2 weeks ago
Ive been watching a couple of this women videos and Ive notice that she uses a lot of circular logic and just plain propaganda to try and prove a point.
animejerk05 1 month ago
yeah you're right...those babies that were going to die anyways totally had it's rights taken away.................
Mich3ll3low 1 month ago
can we have a baby?
woodchucko 1 month ago
No, pro-life is anti-choice. This is a sad excuse for propaganda, and thoroughly unconvincing of those on the opposing side.
deepstarsix 1 month ago
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I'm undecided about abortion.
On one hand I support it as it is killing children.
On the other hand, it gives women a choice.
ASDFsdg1000 1 month ago
Wow, seriously? Thinking the opportunity cost in choices of a fetus compares to the actual choice made by a grown woman is senseless for the same reason we don't consider the opportunity cost of the millions of sperm who die in the process of making a child: potentialities are not actualities. Not getting something you never had (and in particular because you never existed) is not the same as losing something you otherwise would have by virtue of the fact that you do exist, as an autonomous prsn
Superlativesweetie 3 months ago
@Superlativesweetie If you but sperm in a basin with something connected to them to keep them alive, they simply stay sperm. they do not change. If you were to put an embryo in some sort of tech that would keep them alive like an artificial womb, then they would grow and mature. Embryos and fetuses are two "stages" of early human life. Sperm and ova are excrement that could potentially start a life. That's a huge major difference.
JessesanMan 2 weeks ago
If you dislike abortions, don't get one. Most people don't like others telling them what to think or do with their own bodies. The rest watch FOX and Pat Robertson.
qixxxz 3 months ago
@llamas0086 A pregnant woman is a woman who is pregnant. I don't really understand what you're trying to ask.
dmmchn 3 months ago
I am grateful to my parents who cooperated with God to give me life.I as a human have not the right to decide who is to live and who is to die.A baby in the womb is alive;an adult should take all the necessary means to preserve their lives until their alloted time that God chooses.I am not indifferent to the sufferings some people go through; but killing a baby in the womb is not the solution.What has the baby done wrong except to be conceived in the mothers' womb ,which should be a safe haven
lazydazs 4 months ago
What choice has a dead baby been given?(a pro death verdict)
A pro-life mentality is the only choice a baby has;she or he wants to live!
lazydazs 4 months ago
@lazydazs What choice has a living baby been given? They don't choose to be conceived. They can't choose their parents or their early life. You might have had a decent childhood, but what if you were born into a family filled with rape and torture for yourself, would you still have the same perspective?
I guess because you are "pro-life", in that a living being should be given the choice as to whether or not it wishes to live, you are also "pro-suicide"?
dmmchn 4 months ago
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Bless you Ana <3
msacurrie44 4 months ago
Pro-life is the only choice--the alternative is pro-death.
lazydazs 4 months ago
@lazydazs Pro choice is the only choice - the alternative is pro-force.
dmmchn 4 months ago
aren't related to my baby and it's well being. For whom are these options more emotionally stressing and scarring? Ask yourself that next time you want to tell someone that abortion is wrong.
PokemonBandAid 4 months ago
I am currently pregnant and for the time being taking the steps needed to terminate my pregnancy. Abortion isn't just cut and dry. Today was my ultrasound to judge how far along I am; seeing something that could one day be a person I created is really difficult. Having to make any choice makes me feel like a monster. I'm sixteen. An abortion takes away the choices of someone who doesn't know the difference, but pro-life takes away the rest of my already conscious thoughts that...
PokemonBandAid 4 months ago
@PokemonBandAid If you want, then you can find a family for your child. There are organizations ready and willing to help girls like you find a good family for your baby, and for no cost. Meanwhile, how much are you going to have to pay the abortionists?
If you can make it through those nine months, then you can be proud and say that you were strong enough.
Many women regret their abortions, but I never heard of a woman regretting giving birth to a child.
JessesanMan 3 weeks ago
@JessesanMan women regret adoption much more than late term abortions. A women is 2x more likely to be sucidal from giving her newborn baby to adoption than she she from having an late term abortion. she also more likely to feel much more regret and mental pain from adoption That being said late term abortions only represent 4% of all abortions total And a women that has a 1st term abortion witch is 85% of abortion rarley feels regret and has no long term emotional effects
animejerk05 3 weeks ago
What if a woman is forced to get an abortion that she does not want? Where are the Pro-Choice people then?
formerevolutionist 4 months ago
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@formerevolutionist "What if a woman is forced to get an abortion that she does not want? Where are the Pro-Choice people then?"
I had a nightmare like that once!!! I was raped, and I told the doctors I wanted to keep the baby because I knew that abortion was murder, but they put me "under" and aborted the baby anyway, and when I came to, all the Pro-Choice people just said that I was a dumb teenager who deserved to have my baby slaughtered and all that. ;-;
amanda2324 4 months ago
@formerevolutionist I would imagine they are pretty pissed off. Pro choice implies "pro reproductive choice".
If prolifers weren't wasting their time I'm sure they would out saving the women from having abortions forced on them.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn
Why have I never seen pro-choicers campaigning for women who are trying to keep their baby? Pro-lifers are always eager to help such women, but the pro-choicers couldn't care less.
formerevolutionist 4 months ago
@formerevolutionist Because pro-lifers are taking all their time up, I think you would find that they do care.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn That is funny. Can you at least show me where they even mention helping or supporting women who want to keep their babies? To them, "choice" merely means choosing whether or not they are going to kill the baby.
formerevolutionist 4 months ago
@formerevolutionist Well, I guess in your opinion, so long as the "baby" isn't murdered, the rest of its life is unimportant. In your opinion, if a mother has an abortion, this is far worse than having the baby and then systematically abusing it.
Burning a baby with a cigarette, in your opinion, is not as bad as having an abortion, right?
See how I applied the same logic you applied to the pro-choice argument to your argument?
Don't be a moron on purpose, it doesn't help your argument.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn Another bad pro-choice argument.
1. Pro-lifers are willing to adopt unwanted babies. Pro-choicers do not express desire to adopt.
2. Neither abuse nor murder is acceptable. We Christians don't follow the "lesser of two evils" mentality.
3. Are you saying that killing a baby is better than abusing it? That is like saying being beaten to death is better than being beaten half to death.
Don't use bad arguments and then call other people morons.
formerevolutionist 4 months ago
@formerevolutionist
1. Um.. what? So pro-choice now means "anti baby"? No. Pro choice people have children, and adopt.
- And I don't see pro-lifers with multiple adopted babies either. Bring them to rallies to make your point.
2. Yes, but you would prefer a baby to be born to an abusive family than not born.
3. Abortion isn't killing a baby, it is stopping the "baby creation process".
I didn't call you a moron, I implied that you were smart and that you were purposely pretending not to be.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@formerevolutionist And in regards to point one -
if pro-lifers really cared about the unborn, why do they say "theres options", like "you can adopt", but then not immediately offer to adopt that child?
Theres enough pro-life people to adopt every potential abortion. So, why aren't you doing that, if you care so much?
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn Are bad arguments the only ones pro-choicers have?
Some pro-lifers can and have adopted children. Some stand outside and offer to do so.
Even if I am unwilling to adopt, does that mean I must accept the murder of innocent babies?
formerevolutionist 4 months ago
@formerevolutionist "Bad arguments" meaning ones you don't agree with? Tsk tsk.
And... I think that in most "revolutionary" differences of opinion, if you aren't part of the solution, you're part of the problem.
So you basically stand outside abortion clinics and say "DO NOT HAVE AN ABORTION", and when you're presented with the question, what else can I do?, you reply.. "I dunno".
Also, a foetus is not a baby. A baby is not a child, a child is not an adult.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn If you would study logic and rhetoric you would know what bad arguments are.
Of course a fetuses, babies, children, and adults are different. However, they are still human. Is it okay to kill an innocent adult? Is it okay to kill an innocent child or baby? If not, then why is it okay to kill a fetus? It is no less human than a baby, child, or an adult.
formerevolutionist 4 months ago
@formerevolutionist Clearly, you have done less study in the field of logic than I have.
By your argument, logically, all components and stages of human life are equivalent. Thus, by choosing to not be pregnant, a woman is denying human life.
The point of the pro-choice argument is to draw a clear definition between "murder" and "choosing not to be impregnated". I think you'll find that pro choice people are (in general) against late term abortions.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn If you claim that I don't understand logic as well as you do, then don't use fallacies, yourself. It just reflects poorly on you.
I'm glad that you understand that all stages of life are equally valid. No one is less of a human because of the current stage they are in. How does that support the claim that not getting pregnant is murder? If you think this is what pro-lifers believe, then you are mistaken.
I have a question: WHY are most pro-choice people against late-term abortions?
formerevolutionist 4 months ago
@formerevolutionist What fallacies exactly have I used? Do you know what a fallacy is? Pro-lifers use that word a lot, it must be in the pamphlet.
I never said that not getting pregnant was murder.
This video moves away from the idea that a foetus is equal to a human being, and instead claims that having an abortion denies a human the right to life. But, so does not being pregnant. If a pregnant woman considering abortion had just not had sex on that particular day, what's the difference?
dmmchn 4 months ago
@formerevolutionist Why are pro choice people against late term abortions.. because at 7-9 months the foetus body is developed enough for the brain to develop. The brain being the deciding factor of humanity, in this case.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@formerevolutionist I would just like to jump in to say that if you think that all of the stages of life are equal, then you should think a sperm cell, and an egg cell, are both equal to an adult human. Those are both living cells. So, if a man ejaculates, he should try and keep all the little sperm cells alive, because they are living, and technically human stages of life? In my opinion, that is a very stupid argument. A fetus is not equal to people who are born at all.
keilareadman 3 months ago
@keilareadman Because the human life begins at conception, not at meiosis, not at the third trimester. The moment the new human's DNA is its own individual genetic code. That is where it all begins.
JessesanMan 3 weeks ago
@formerevolutionist """why pro choice people against late terms""
Depends. Is it an abortion to save womans life? Even pro-loofas support those.
But if its a "gotcha" question about women who wants a baby till its in the birth canal & she suddenly changes her mind and wants to abort it (ie urban legend)
I can tellyou why I have problems w/ it. I support a womans right to get unpregnant. Someone who wants to get unpregnant, when
shes BEEN pregnant for 6, 7 months, kinda loses me.
Hexl702 2 months ago
@dmmchn A fetus is not a baby, a baby is not a child, and a child is not an adult.
They all have something in common though; They're human, and alive.
JessesanMan 3 weeks ago
@JessesanMan yes there techically alive and human but you cant force a women to carry another person against her will so that person can now have life. You cant take the rights away from 1 and give it to another. A women must decide to go through a pregnancy and give life to another person. You cannot force her against her will for what ever reason to give up her life for 9 months so another can breathe life its absurd.
animejerk05 3 weeks ago
I'm done arguing with you, dmmchn - just like every other Pro-Choicer I've ever come across, you're illogical and will do whatever you can to delude yourself further. Not intentionally, of course, but none of your arguments have been logical or reasonable, and I have no desire to continue "debating" with you when you bring up arguments that are based on biased opinion and full of flaws, and then when I demand you cite a source for something, you don't. So, have a good day, and farewell.
amanda2324 4 months ago
@amanda2324 Well, for a start, you're not actually arguing, you're just saying "But Dr Lejeune says this and therefore it must be a fact".
You haven't at any point in time pointed out a logical flaw with my arguments, unless you consider "it doesn't agree with my opinion" as a logical flaw.
Your ONLY argument is based on opinion, and the supposed validity of that opinion. So, I guess if I'm a kettle, you are a big, black pot.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@amanda2324 And incidentally, I don't have a biased opinion at all. My "biased opinion" is that if something has a functional human frontal lobe then it is a human. And, science has shown (if you did a 10 second google search) that the frontal lobe only begins to develop in the last few weeks of gestation. Lots of foetuses miscarry on their own - not every sperm, ova or foetus is destined to become human. Aborting a zygote is barely different from a woman choosing to have a period.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn That's your definition of a human: a functioning frontal lobe? How is that not a merely arbitrary definition?
formerevolutionist 4 months ago
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@formerevolutionist "That's your definition of a human: a functioning frontal lobe? How is that not a merely arbitrary definition?"
Good point... mind if I just watch you discuss/debate with dmmchn and occasionally pipe up in support of you?
amanda2324 4 months ago
@formerevolutionist What? How IS it an arbitrary definition?
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn There is no basis for this assertion. In fact, it is invalid because it is contradicted by known medical science. Many babies are born prematurely WITH all parts intact. By your logic it would be okay to kill anyone who has had a frontal lobotomy. After all, it is no longer human, right? Where do you get the idea that someone with human DNA is not a human until it has all its parts?
formerevolutionist 4 months ago
@formerevolutionist What are you talking about, there is no basis for this assertion? Have you done any research into it or are you just spouting verbatim what it says on pro life websites (hint : I know the answer is yes).
Dr Donald Stuss in particular has done enough research to pinpoint the frontal lobe as being "what makes us human". How has medical science proven that a foetus is human? PS - the answer is not "It is a medical fact".
dmmchn 4 months ago
@formerevolutionist Also, there has been research done that shows the frontal lobe only begins to develop in the last 7 weeks of pregnancy; the rest of gestation the body develops into something that can support the frontal lobe.
We are not talking about altered humans, or those who have already been born, we are trying to draw a satisfactory line for when a human life BEGINS. I believe that a frontal lobotomy is equivalent to execution anyway. More unethical than execution though.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn Think whatever you want - I couldn't care less. =3
amanda2324 4 months ago
@dmmchn " I think it is fair to say that our frontal lobe is what makes us "human".. otherwise we would be simply animals, reacting."
Incorrect - again, you're stating your own opinion. Is an infant, whose frontal lobes are less developed than mine, less human than I am? Am I less human than those whose frontal lobes are more developed than mine? Again, you're stating opinions that are based on logical fallacies and bias.
amanda2324 4 months ago
@amanda2324 What??? No, it is not my opinion that our frontal lobe makes us human, it is an actual scientific fact. Donald Stuss, a brain expert (who has actually done experiments to verify his opinion - do you see the difference?) has discovered the frontal lobe is the basis of what makes us human.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn I ask again - so an infant, whose frontal lobes are not yet fully developed, less human than me? Hm? I don't think so. Is someone whose frontal lobes are more developed than yours more human than you are? Hm? I don't think so. This guy may have proven that frontal lobes give us human consciousness or whatever, but is that truly what makes us human? No. It's one of the advantages we have over animals, but we humans still have different DNA, etc, from animals. Not just the "frontal lobes."
amanda2324 4 months ago
@amanda2324 Yes, an infant is less human than you. Yes, the more developed a persons frontal lobes are, the more human behaviours they are capable of. I think you're actually getting it.
It is the "only" advantage we have only other animals; our perception of time and complex social structure.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@amanda2324 And as far as DNA? Undersea worms which breathe sulfur share around 75% of our DNA. I don't think you understand genetics, DNA is simply a code which tells our cells to grow in a specific way. It's our DNA that allows us to have huge frontal lobes. So.. I don't really understand what you're trying to argue here.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn Well what about the man who doesn't even half the front half of his brain? If you google half headed man, you will see what I'm talking about. Is he just not human?
JessesanMan 3 weeks ago
@amanda2324 Your argument seems to be "if it has human DNA it has human rights". A dead body has human DNA, does it still have human rights? No. Because it lacks something humans do, the capability for consciousness.
The only way your argument can make any logical sense is from the "possible human life" point of view; in which case, you must include at least ova as a potential human life. An embryo is a human without 9 months of gestation, an ova is an embryo without a sperm, and thus a human.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn Actually, it also lacks life. So your analogy is flawed.
That is incorrect. The conceived embryo is not possible human life, it is already scientifically proven to BE human life. It is alive, but at an early stage of development. Therefore, again, you're using flawed arguments. Not only that, you're assuming you know what I am arguing, and you obviously don't. I never argue on the basis for "potential human life."
amanda2324 4 months ago
@amanda2324 No, it is not scientifically proven to be human life. How is it proven to be human life? Your only response is "because Dr Lejeune agrees". That is not a scientific proof.
You show me how it's proven.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn Furthermore, NO, an embryo is a human. That is a fact. What, does it just MAGICALLY become human later on? That's pretty stupid. An apple seed that has just begun growth is a tiny apple tree. See? You're not making any sense whatsoever. Furthermore, Dr. Lejeune doesn't just think it. You're running on assumptions. Please provide better, logical arguments.
amanda2324 4 months ago
@amanda2324 No, it is not a fact, it is your opinion. And, no, there is no magic, its' called "gestation".
An apple seed that has begun growth is not an apple tree; an apple tree has leaves and grows apples. You are the one making no sense at all. If you're going to take a reductionist view, you must continue and also consider an apple seed to be an apple tree.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn No, it is not my opinion. It is a fact supported by scientists. You have yet to provide ANY sort of scientific proof, only statements that you could have just as easily pulled out of thin air.
And incorrect again! If the apple tree does not have trees, or have apples (like an infertile apple tree) it is STILL an apple tree! You are basing your arguments on what something can or cannot do, which is fallacious.
amanda2324 4 months ago
@amanda2324 Which scientists! Theres only "one" scientist, and its his opinion. Show me the evidence, show me the experiments. There are none, because it is simply opinion.
Again, you are trying to provide a reductionist view, in which case you must believe that an ova is also a human being. I dont think you know what fallacious means. It is perfectly logical that if something does not have the properties of something, it is not that something. Wheres the fallacy?
dmmchn 4 months ago
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@amanda2324 Which scientists! Theres only "one" scientist, and its his opinion. Show me the evidence, show me the experiments. There are none, because it is simply opinion.
Again, you are trying to provide a reductionist view, in which case you must believe that an ova is also a human being. I dont think you know what fallacious means. It is perfectly logical that if something does not have the properties of something, it is not that something. Wheres the fallacy?
dmmchn 4 months ago
@amanda2324 YOUR argument is actually far less logically consistent. You want to reduce things to their basic components, but only as far as you are willing to go to support your views. An apple tree that cannot bear fruit is not an apple tree, it is an "apple tree that can't bear fruit". Boiling a germinated seed is not the same as cutting down a tree.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@LiveActionFilms Here's an idea Ana: You can keep and have all of the babies you want, but you honor the constitution and give others the responsibility to make their own decisions.
iamUSAn50 5 months ago
fetuses arent people. they are just sacks of shit
alakbakbak 5 months ago
@alakbakbak
Do you ever think before you spout offensive nonsense? Is it okay to kill someone because you have arbitrarily decided that they aren't real people?
formerevolutionist 4 months ago
@alakbakbak well they will be people its not like a human is going to have a fucking dolfin baby you are preventing human life
crazywilltheoriganal 4 months ago
@alakbakbak No. A sack of shit is a sack of shit. Human fetuses are humans in the early stage of life. I don't know why you said this stupid stuff, or why two people liked your comment, but if you have nothing constructive to say, don't say it.
JessesanMan 3 weeks ago
This has been flagged as spam show
Thumbs down you damn Nazi.
irenaprude2010 5 months ago
a fetus is nasty better off dead then in this world unwanted
bitcheznhos 5 months ago
@bitcheznhos So shall we kill all the poor African children? No one wants them, they'd be better off dead, too.
Your logic is faulty.
amanda2324 4 months ago
@amanda2324 Your assumptions are faulty. How do you know all the "poor African children" are unwanted? But if they were all unwanted as you say, it would be better for them not to be born at all so they would not suffer
bitcheznhos 4 months ago
@bitcheznhos And exactly who are you to decide what is better? I've talked with people who've helped orphans, homeless families, orphaned homeless children, and people who grew up in those conditions but were now adults, and all of them say that they would not have wanted to be aborted. So your assumption may only correct for you - however, you have no right to say that that's how it is for everyone else.
amanda2324 4 months ago
@amanda2324 AND FURTHERMORE!! If you're so into possible human lives, I should hope you are continually pregnant. You best not be wasting any precious human ova, that are potential human lives! Just think, by deciding to not be pregnant right now, you're robbing a potential human of a great possible life!!!
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn I never said anything about POSSIBLE human lives. Please stop with the assumptions, they make you look stupid.
amanda2324 4 months ago
@amanda2324 A foetus is a possible human life, not an actual human life. I don't think its a great leap of logic from "foetus" to "ova", since neither are human beings.. and since you care about one...
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn Um, you're wrong. The fetus has 46 Chromosomes, the number that is required for a human, while the "ova" does not. 23 chromosomes will not do much of anything by itself.
amanda2324 4 months ago
@amanda2324 46 chromosomes or not, a foetus can't do anything even vaguely human like, it cannot even breathe without being attached to another human. A foetus won't do much of anything by itself.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn So? Neither does an infant. Why are you judging something based on what it can or cannot do? A person who is in a coma can't do much. Are they not human? A person who is brain dead can't do much. Are they not human? Humanity is not based on a persons capabilities. If it were, there would be a lot of humans who would be referred to as "not human."
amanda2324 4 months ago
@amanda2324 No, but a foetus is not yet a human. A person in a coma "was" a human. A person who is braindead "was" a human.
I would probably go as far as to say that they're not really living a human life anymore anyway, but that's not what we're arguing here.
A baby is a potential human life, a foetus is a potential baby, and an ova is a potential foetus. If you want to blur the lines, you have to go all the way, that's all I'm saying.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn Now I KNOW something is wrong with your logic. A baby IS a human, period! The braindead and those in a coma still ARE human!
That's some of the most immoral, unscientific bull you've said yet! You really don't know what you're talking about. A fetus IS a baby, an ova is just an egg which will remain an egg. Egg + sperm = baby. Doesn't take rocket science to figure that one out. And science supports this. You've yet to say anything even remotely based on facts, only your opinion.
amanda2324 4 months ago
@amanda2324 No. What I said is fact - there is a distinction between ova, foetus and baby. The only opinion that is involved is yours, and that opinion is that there is no distinction between foetus and baby. Babies have their brain mostly developed, whereas a foetus does not; I would class a human as being a conscious entity, a foetus is not capable of consciousness.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn I think it is reasonable to say that a human being is mostly defined as something capable of conscious thought. The comatose.. well yes, still human. Braindead people WERE human. Now they are dead.
And, again, with regards to opinion, the idea that you can call something immoral because it disagrees with your opinion indicates that you have a strong bias away from being interested in fact. Finally? Egg + sperm = foetus. Foetus + 7-9 months gestation = baby. Not rocket science.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn Well, I don't care what YOU "classify" as a human being. I am STATING scientific FACTS. Dr. Jerome Lejeune, Father of Modern Genetics, and many other scientists agree that human life begins at conception. You have yet to state any source; all you've said is that you are stating fact, but it is not fact unless you can prove it, and you have not provided evidence, let alone proof, that it is fact. You're just preaching your opinion and then saying I'M the one doing that. Hypocrite.
amanda2324 4 months ago
@amanda2324 Mmm.. no, you're stating his opinion, not a scientific proof. Just because someone has some dealings in science does not make all of their opinions scientific facts.. as you said. "he agrees that life begins at conception". Not "He has done conclusive scientific tests and concluded that a foetus and a baby are equivalent".
Note the difference; you calling me a hypocrite is laughable, at least I haven't tried to name drop when presenting my opinion.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn Wait, would killing...I'm sorry, aborting a fetus at six months be okay?
JessesanMan 3 weeks ago
@amanda2324 And, I have stated facts - A sperm + egg = a foetus, a foetus requires 7-9 months to become a baby. Explain to me how any of that is "my opinion".....
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn It does not take 7-9 months to become a baby, it takes 7-9 months before the baby is normally ready for a natural birth to take place. After all, the youngest BABY to survive a premature birth was only 21 weeks, which is less than 7 months, only about 4 months. Therefore, your statement is false. Also, you have not cited where you got that self-claimed fact, so either you're lying, or you're just stating your opinion. Well, techniqually you'd be lying either way.
amanda2324 4 months ago
@dmmchn It does not take 7-9 months to become a baby, it takes 7-9 months before the baby is normally ready for a natural birth to take place. After all, the youngest BABY to survive a premature birth was only 21 weeks, which is less than 7 months, only about 4 months. Therefore, your statement is false. Also, you have not cited where you got that self-claimed fact, so either you're lying, or you're just stating your opinion. Well, techniqually you'd be lying either way.
amanda2324 4 months ago
@amanda2324 Your statement comes from the opinion of someone else, not a scientific fact.. so where exactly are you getting your "facts" from? If I find a bunch of pHd' holders who believe the world is flat, in your opinion does that mean the world is flat?
I get my facts from, you know, the book about human development. The egg is fertilised, it splits, it grows into an embryo, which then develops into a baby. Are they not the facts? If a baby is ready after 4 months, why does it take 9?
dmmchn 4 months ago
@amanda2324 And, with regards to the 4 month old, it's nice to understand the ethics behind your point of view. If it looks human in any way and breathes, it must BE a human. The problem with your moral standpoint is that it only takes into consideration how wonderful it is to "have" a child, like some kind of possession. Nevermind the quality of that childs life... I think its very wrong ethically for them to have "saved" it's life.. it will likely never develop mentally.. how cruel.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn I've seen mentally retarded people live full lives. They are happy, interesting human beings. They were given a chance at life and grabbed it by the horns. It is always better to give someone a chance than deny it to them entirely.
"I believe you will fail, so I won't even let you try."
JessesanMan 3 weeks ago
@JessesanMan So you think it's okay to bring a severely disabled child into the world? Are you a religious nut?
LickMyCamelToe 2 weeks ago
@JessesanMan They're almost always supported by other people for their entire lives. If they were completely independent, they wouldn't be considered retarded.
And, again, every single menstrual period is a denied human life.
dmmchn 2 weeks ago 2
@amanda2324 If you'd like some "real science" to go along with my opinion, why don't you take a look at this.
radiology.rsna.org/content/215/1/205.full
Until around 33 weeks, the brain is not in any way close to being a human brain. It's just a brain-shaped pile of cells. So.. again, foetus != human.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn btw, your link isn't working.
Furthermore, you still haven't proved that it isn't human.
amanda2324 4 months ago
@amanda2324 Add h_t_t_p etc in front of it. Youtube doesnt allow linking.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn The link still isn't working...
amanda2324 4 months ago
@amanda2324 And, finally... explain to me how exactly your "facts" are scientific, when they are the opinions of someone else?
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn Excuse me? Are you blind? "I am STATING scientific FACTS. Dr. Jerome Lejeune, Father of Modern Genetics, and many other scientists agree that human life begins at conception." Please explain to me how a "Father of Modern Genetics" would only have a mere -opinion- about this? You fail. If you cannot provide me with any note-worthy scientists to believe otherwise, I have no reason to listen to you. Furthermore, it's not because it LOOKS human, it IS human. Huge difference there, buddy.
amanda2324 4 months ago
@amanda2324 Nope, it's his opinion. Sorry, but you're confused as to what "science" is. A scientific opinion is one that is proven by empirical evidence. The earth rotates around the sun, this can be proven via experiment. What experiments has Dr Lejeune done regarding this subject? None. Just because he is "father of modern genetics", it does not make his opinion any less an opinion. YOU fail at understanding science.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn I understand science very well. Making assumptions makes you look very stupid. Furthermore, since he's the Father of Modern Genetics, he probably knows a lot more science than you do (after all, he's the one who found the cause of Down Syndrome, and he studied fetuses, so yeah...). This really shows how stubborn and arrogant you are. His opinion is worth a LOT more than yours, because he's a scientist and actually studies this sort of thing hands on, unlike you.
amanda2324 4 months ago
@amanda2324 It's reasonable to assume you have no idea about science, since you can't tell the difference between "opinion" and "scientific fact". So what if he studied foetuses. Yes, he has done a lot of research into genetics, but that doesn't make his "opinion" into a "fact". It's like arguing that since Stephen Hawking does not believe that god was necessary to create the universe, it is a fact, because he is a scientist who studies the universe.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn Actually, it looks like it is YOU who do not understand the difference between opinion and scientific fact. Furthermore, if you do your research (which you obviously haven't) no one has been able to disprove Dr. Jerome's stance. They've only been able to prove him more correct. So, until you can provide some evidence for your side, the evidence is on mine. You whining about whether or not his scientific fact is an opinion - that's only your opinion. You have no proof otherwise.
amanda2324 4 months ago
@amanda2324 Well.. obviously, you cant disprove an opinion.. because its an opinion. Not a fact. "The sun is hot" is a fact. "I don't like the heat" is an opinion. See the difference? Similarly "an embryo has unique DNA" is a fact, "An embryo is a human being" is an opinion. See?
And I'm at a loss as to what "evidence" you've provided. Let me see.. umm.. oh there it is! "Dr Lejeune thinks this therefore it must be true". Wow! That's evidence if ever I saw it.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@amanda2324 A scientific fact is that the frontal lobes of the brain do not begin to develop until near the end of the term (R Joseph 1996). I think it is fair to say that our frontal lobe is what makes us "human".. otherwise we would be simply animals, reacting. The foetal stage is important to grow a body that a "human" can inhabit, but without that part of the brain, there is nothing to differentiate us from other primates. I invite you to have yours removed if you disagree.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@amanda2324 Stubborn? Arrogant? Because I won't agree that the opinion of someone who agrees with your point of view makes your point of view correct?? If I was a kettle, you would definitely be a pot.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn No, you're arrogant because you think that your opinion is worth so much, when you have so little (actually, nothing) to back it up. Stubborn, because even after 12+ replies, you STILL haven't provided any REAL proof that your opinion has any facts to back it up, while I have, and you've only provided childish, uneducated replies as to why mine do not hold merit, when they hold a lot more than anything (or lack thereof) that you've thrown out.
amanda2324 4 months ago
@amanda2324 And the same goes for you. All you have done is provide the opinion of someone who agrees with you and pretended that its scientific. Where are your facts exactly? And how are the things I have stated not fact? Are you saying that sperm + egg does not equal embryo?
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn It is not JUST someone who agrees with me - it's a professional, a scholer, in that field. You obviously don't know much about how evidence is validated, or else you would know this simple fact. If I had quoted a redneck, that would have not been as good as who I DID quote; one who is actually studying this sort of thing. Therefore, your claim is a logical fallacy. Further, sperm + egg does equal an embryo, but embryo is basically just a human at an earlier stage of development.
amanda2324 4 months ago
@amanda2324 It doesn't matter; the logical fallacy is yours. You assume his opinion is a fact.
Evidence is not validated by "this guy researches in this field so his opinion must be right". It is validated by looking at data and drawing conclusions based on that data. Or you could compare the properties of humans to the properties of foetuses.. but if you were to do that the data would probably err in favour of "not human".
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn I do not assume at all. Your assumption is more logically fallacious than mine, but you're to proud and stubborn to admit it.
And he has done that. Or have you not researched into this at all? Obviously you haven't.
amanda2324 4 months ago
@amanda2324 No, it is not at all.
My argument is that an embryo and a baby have different properties, thus they are not equivalent. For example, a rock and a sponge have different properties, they are not the same even though they are both made of carbon. How is that "logically fallacious". I'd like you to point out exactly the fallacy.
Your argument is "This guy says this and therefore it is true". There is zero logic there.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@amanda2324 Like the guy arguing with you, who seems to be incapable of human's natural love for the future of their species.
JessesanMan 3 weeks ago
@JessesanMan ...uh... what?
amanda2324 3 weeks ago
@dmmchn They aren't talking about ovas and sperm, they're talking about embryos and fetuses. And about the unnatural killing of them.
JessesanMan 3 weeks ago
[Lesley Stahl on U.S. sanctions against Iraq: "We have heard that a half million children have died. I mean, that's more children than died in Hiroshima. And, you know, is the price worth it?"; Secretary of State Madeleine Albright: "I think this is a very hard choice, but the price--we think the price is worth it." — "60 Minutes" (5/12/96)]
IconsOfTeleplay 5 months ago
@reviewhouse : Discover your inner-woman.
IconsOfTeleplay 5 months ago
Abortion is the lynch pin upon which eugenics is hinged. Are Human Beings THE premiere life-form of this planet: Earth? That's the question. Those who believe not condemn their unborn children to forceps & vacuum tubes to make room for snail darters & eaglets.
IconsOfTeleplay 5 months ago
Abortion Saves lives!!!
69AlArmA 6 months ago
The Illuminists & Fabians fervently believe that great wealth & power are theirs as the means to deliver chaos and oblivion to We the People: a.k.a. "human weeds" (as eugenist Margaret Sanger labeled us) & "worthless eaters" (as we're seen by the U.N.).
ThePregnancySlaves 6 months ago
she is very pretty and pretty stupid ha ha
01Robinsky 6 months ago
@01Robinsky : Ana is beautiful. You are common.
ThePregnancySlaves 6 months ago
@ThePregnancySlaves common as they come baby but i don't force my wishes on onther people and try to force women who may die in pregnancy not to have an abortion or go and murder a doctor because they work at a med clinic, wasn't that doctor once one of your precious embroes?
01Robinsky 5 months ago
@01Robinsky : You're silly. There are millions of laws and all of them are mandatory.
ThePregnancySlaves 5 months ago
@FetusDeathMatch lol you're an idiot. the only way a baby can develop or become a potential baby is with sperm and an egg TOGETHER. some people are stupid i swear.
torisnorri12 6 months ago
Murder is always a choice, as is arson, counterfeiting, rape & shoplifting. The polar opposite of pro-life is pro-death. Abortion is about killing, not choosing. The choice to murder children in a clinic lies temporarily w/the mothers as the courts have, for the time-being, granted them impunity & immunity from prosecution
IconsOfTeleplay 6 months ago
A mother's blood-lust knows no satiety.
ThePregnancySlaves 6 months ago
A guy pulling out, a guy wacking off, a girl giving a blow job, birth control, abortion it all has the same conclusion, loss of an oppertunity for human life, despite the way you christian fanatics try to dress it up to gain support
MrJmartinez323 6 months ago
Let's think about this logicially, a women knows she can't care for a baby and to do so ruins her life, even if the baby is born the baby would live a poor life baring a miracle, logically it would be best to not have a kid, isn't it not givi9ng a baby a shot when a guy pulls out? If he would have not pulled out there would be a new baby? So is pulling out just as bad as abortion?
MrJmartinez323 6 months ago
How is it that a group of people feel they have the right to force others into doing what they think is right? It's called religion...lets be realistic some kids will be brought into this world and due to living circumstance they won't have a fighting chance to make something of themselves and in the process they ruin the lives of the mother father and damage others in a domino like effect. Giving birth is extrmemly painful and forcing someone to do it isn't wrong?
MrJmartinez323 6 months ago
I think the theme here is potential. It's intention that brings sanctity to an unborn child. Without it, it's jut a rudimentary cluster of cells, or perhaps an underdeveloped fetus depending on when it takes place. It was never planned or intended for, it's only a notch away from the sperm and egg that made it. Of course, this becomes less and less true over time, which is why late term abortion might be a bit shaky. Early term abortion is unquestionably morally neutral.
TheTubeTimeMaster1 6 months ago
@FetusDeathMatch Sperm is a haploid cell. Human diploid cells have 46 chromosomes and human haploid gametes (egg and sperm) have 23 chromosomes.
LiveActionFilms 6 months ago 4
@LiveActionFilms You could apply that argument to a foetus also.
Is an ovum a homosapiens, no, it must be fertilised. I agree. Is a foetus a homosapiens? No, it must gestate. A born baby is a baby; that is a human life, it has successfully gestated and can live independently of its mother. Science is awesome. Check it out.
dmmchn 5 months ago
Uh, no. You're wrong. You need to look at science more clearly - Dr. Jerome Lejeune, the Father of Modern Genetics who discovered the cause of Down Syndromes, agrees that human life begins at conception.
Furthermore, infants can't live independently of their mother. Neither can toddlers. Your point?
amanda2324 4 months ago
@amanda2324 Uh no, you need to gain a better understanding of science. One doctor agrees? That's one.
Every scientist agrees that Uraniam is radioactive. See the difference?
Just because one person shares your beliefs does not make your beliefs correct. And, an infant does not need its mother to survive. Any human female can care for it.
If you remove a foetus from a womb it dies immediately.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn It's not JUST one, I only cited one. But since he was a scientist who was more intelligent than the "average" scientist, he was worth listening too. Sorry, it doesn't matter HOW many people state something - the entire world thought the world was flat. Was that true? No, of course not. So don't be hiding behind numbers as if that actually means something.
And so what? There are ill people who not -every- or -any- doctor can care for, only a number can, if any at all. Your point?
amanda2324 4 months ago
@dmmchn Not necessarily, they can be transferred to new women as snowflake babies. What kills them is being ripped to shreds inside the womb and then sucked out.
JessesanMan 3 weeks ago
@JessesanMan If you just took it out of the womb, surgically, it still wouldn't be able to grow into a functional human being. I doubt it would be particularly easy to "graft" it into a new womb at 3-4 months.
But if it is. maybe thats a solution you can propose? Your female pro-life compatriots can offer to provide a safe womb for unwanted foetuses.
That keeps everyone happy.
dmmchn 2 weeks ago
@amanda2324 And furthermore - even if it can breathe independently, if it is not adequately gestated it is not a fully developed human. If you take a car body off the production line before the engine is put into it, can it drive? No. Therefore it is not a car yet.
dmmchn 4 months ago
@dmmchn Sorry, there is a HUGE difference between a LIVING THING, a -living being, and a car. A seed that is beginning to sprout is still a baby whatever-it's-supposed-to-be.
amanda2324 4 months ago
@dmmchn What exactly is the difference between a nine moth full-term one day before being born and an infant the day of birth in the mother's arms. Nothing, except location,
And there are no major day by day differences until you hit the difference between sperm and ova and a zygote/embryo. Two have become one, there is a new set of DNA, and now a new human is getting ready to begin its life in this world.
JessesanMan 3 weeks ago
@JessesanMan Again, at no point have I said "terminating a 9 month old foetus is OK". Typically for people who use your argument, you deconstruct it only as far as necessary to support your point.
As I have said, the ability for a brain to have consciousness is my personal cut off point. Does a 3 month old zygote have this quality? No. Does a sperm or ovum? No.
Your argument is simply sexual politics "two become one", etc.
dmmchn 2 weeks ago
@DashingDominic An adolescent is still human, but an adolescent has fewer rights than an adult, is as appropriate, and a fertilized human egg has even fewer still. Do you think a fertilized human egg has the same rights as a human adult?
pennieroyaltea 6 months ago
you gotta study the difference between killing and stopping an unwanted potential life brought into a world not wanting it...abortion is a choice, not a forced one...if you think that so much talk more about the option of adoption than using emotional blackmail with your stupid philosophies that make no fucking sense
charlienethercoat094 6 months ago