Jack Dempsey vs Gene Tunney - The Long Count (1927)

[ItsDatGirlJordz]

dempsey needed to be in the corner but when he was there the ref should of picked up the count from the time keeper

[b7r7u7c7e]

Its clear Dempsey was an icon. A great champ during his time. But the best of all time? I dont think so. I think a modern boxer like Ali, or Tyson would destroy Dempsey. I mean he couldnt put away Gene?? Amd Gene knocked him down! O just dont see him beating a Ali, Formen, or a monster like tyson who was around the same height yet 20 pounds heavier and twice as fast! lol

[banofee999]

@b7r7u7c7e dude jack was ring rusty he'd been innactive to long his legs were gone. ali would beat him foreman (ima george fan) but jack would hit foreman with 5 power shots to the chin before george knew he was in a fight. and tyson he was a little bit faster not twice as a fist a little bit faster. but jack was 3 inches taller and had a longer reach plus he hit harder yes he hit harder dont try and say he didnt its a well knon fact. btw dont take this personnaly ty :)

[b7r7u7c7e]

@banofee999 Im a huge Dempsey fan. Thats why Im here. But I think most people are bias for the love of there fighter. Im simply going by math. A prime Tyson the 85/88 version. Would kill Dempsey. Simply because he was very elusive, hard to hit, punched in combos, had the fastest hands in boxing...or tied with Ali for hand speed...with ko power in both hands. Just to big and fast. Dont get me wrong Dempsey was king in his time but Ali would beat him, Foremen would maul him, Tyson would ko him.

[banofee999]

@b7r7u7c7e im a dempsey fan but not a huge one. first ali would beat yes. foreman im sorry but dempsey would get in and out to fast and tyson mate tyson wasgood but he wasnt really special people use don king as an excuse for why he got owend in the 90's by holyfeild mate he trained hard in the 90's but got destroyed by good fighters. tyson was ok not great dempsey ko's mike earley

[renduke]

@b7r7u7c7e in addition to the guys you mentioned we also wouldn't have a very good night vs Louis OR Marciano

[b7r7u7c7e]

@renduke Agreed. Although I give Dempsey the edge in quickness and hand speed over them. But Louis had greater ko power and Marciano right hand was second to none for his weight. He was 180 pounds with knock out power of a modern heavy weight....yea I forgot about these two greats.

[wesboss1]

@renduke . I agree. That sax guy is blinded by the nostalgia of it all.

[Slickdapj]

Tunney was goofy. It is plain as day when he gets his wits back. He'd never have gotten up, and even if he had, could he have survived Dempsey without the extra recovery seconds.

In my book, Dempsey KOed Tunney. He KOed Sharkey a few months before that. An over-the-hill Dempsey KOed two Heavyweight Champions in the last phases of his career. I'd say he was a bit tougher than some of you want to believe.

[69ingpiranhas]

I think tunney would have gotten up even if the count wasn't long. He was just getting a breather

[BOXINGFANFAN]

the narrator tells everyone that Jack Dempsey forgot the new rule...Rules are made to stick by them and he didnt he has no one to blame but himself...and Gene did do the right thing and i think Gene won the fight

[HeroicBIOSHOCK]

@BOXINGFANFAN We all know rules are made to follow them. If you look he does go into a corner, maybe not a nuetral one but still a corner. I dont know if it was a new rule or not during that year/fight but still you shouldn't say that he didn't forget the rule when we both do not know if we did or did not know about it/forgot about it.

[BOXINGFANFAN]

@HeroicBIOSHOCK the rule was enforced in that fight...im not sure how much before that fight

[12321mizisawesome]

gean tunney is my great grandfater

[brightonblock]

@12321mizisawesome bullshit

[BOXINGFANFAN]

@12321mizisawesome Im sure ur proud he is ur grandfather?...i havent seen much of his fights but i still rate him 3rd best heavyweight ever next 2 Ali and Joe Louis...love watching what i can of him on youtube

[AHWSR72]

WAT BLACK FIGHTERS DID DEMPSEY FIGHT?

[renduke]

@AHWSR72 answer none....go to video best of jack dempsey recent thread there with me and some guy sax debating about Dempsey.....THERE IS NO WAY NO HOW I could ever bet Dempsey vs the following people (sax seems to disagree) Ali...Marciano...Louis...Holme­s....Foreman....Tyson....and maybe Frazier and Holifield

Dempsey couldn't handle Boxers Like Tunney...he also never fought a black fighter....he also had only 3 fights past age 30 and lost 2 of them

[BOXINGFANFAN]

@renduke was he not retired a few yrs b4 the first fight with Gene?...or he hadnt fought in 3 yrs...im not 2 sure...i do agree with u...he isnt in my top 10

[renduke]

@BOXINGFANFAN his last fight before tunney 1 was at age 28.....he had a 3 year layoff and returned to the ring at age 31 losing to tunney TWICE and beating Sharkey.....it should also be noted he has 11 draws (something that would never happen today).....i'de be very very very hard pressed to rank Dempsey any higher then 9th or 10th all time......this talk of best ever is a JOKE !

[BOXINGFANFAN]

@renduke But lets face it getting beat by Gene twice is nothing 2 b ashamed of..i may be wrong but were draws not the same as a no contest in those days?...if u didnt knock some1 out it was a no contest right up until the 30's i think..he isnt in my top ten, but Gene is...and i think the "best ever" thing is great..lol

[alchemistoxford]

Tunney won the fight fair and square. Tunney's style outclassed Dempsey. Dempsey had no one to blame but himself. Dempsey had insisted on the new rule of going to a 'neutral' corner, but he forgot it at the crucial moment. Tunney deserved the $1 million pay day. This video is an important document in boxing history. Tunney's style was eventually developed into Ali's even more strategic style of attack, and Dempsey influenced Bruce Lee. These two fighters are both to be admired.

[BOXINGFANFAN]

@alchemistoxford Dempsey influenced Bruce Lee?...i doubt that...Bruce Lee was influenced martial arts...not boxing

[alchemistoxford]

@BOXINGFANFAN Dempsey was influenced by fencing, and Bruce Lee was influenced by Dempsey. Just google 'dempsey influence bruce lee' and you will get a torrent of sources - including Wikipedia.

[expressivechild]

Dempsey wasn't screwed. True, the referee didn't count immediately but it was Dempsey who didn't go to a neutral corner. Tunney got 4 extra seconds to get up but he wasn't hurt that badly. Dempsey in his book stated that Tunney's eyes was clear and didn't look dazed at all. Tunney would have beaten the count anyway but he got a few seconds extra, so why not take it? Moreover, Dempsey got up at the count of one, so how is that unfair even if Tunney did not go to the neutral corner?

[crowley0312]

@expressivechild He was screwed. The ref stalled and made the slowest fucking count ever for Tunney. Even if he wasn't dazed, he still got a lot of recover time. And Jack's count is unfair because it proves that Tunney made a deal with the ref. The ref could clearly see them both in front of them but began counting immediately.

[RivJohnson101]

3 times even lol

[RivJohnson101]

woops too many times! Mind you its a point worh making 2 times lol

[RivJohnson101]

please don be offended by the fact that dempsey was only white world champion. Even though he never conquered the black world of boxing, he was definitely more than just a slugger, he had speed and a lot of bravado and recuperative power as well. SHame his skills werent up to the standard and he was taken apart by the first intelligent boxer he faced, I shudder to think what Jack Johnson would have done to him (and Jack Johnson wasnt even one of the truely great black champions).

[RivJohnson101]

please don be offended by the fact that dempsey was only white world champion. Even though he never conquered the black world of boxing, he was definitely more than just a slugger, he had speed and a lot of bravado and recuperative power as well. SHame his skills werent up to the standard and he was taken apart by the first intelligent boxer he faced, I shudder to think what Jack Johnson would have done to him (and Jack Johnson wasnt even one of the better black champions).

[RivJohnson101]

please don be offended by the fact that dempsey was only white world champion. Even though he never conquered the black world of boxing, he was definitely more than just a slugger, he had speed and a lot of bravado and recuperative power as well. SHame his skills werent up to the standard and he was taken apart by the first intelligent boxer he faced, I shudder to think what Jack Johnson would have done to him (and Jack isnt even one of the better black chamipns).

[RivJohnson101]

I have a lot of respect for dempsey but if he is only fighting half the world, then hes not a real world champion, very overrated but nevertheless a determined very strong slugger who was fun to watch.

[surathisuran]

Tunney was exceptionally talented no doubt but that alone did not made him his successful carrier.He was supported by the gangsters and the media.The much larger ring size,the neutral corner rule all were suited for Tunney.In fact, after this round Gene knocks out Dempsey & the referre starts counting within a blink of eye with Tunney standing right in front of Dempsey, it is not shown in this video.Dempsey always a street smart survivor forged a freindship with Tunney who helped him tilldeath.

[diptwares]

Tunney clearly got at least 4 seconds, but he looks like he could have gotten up without them, who knows, it's one of boxings great stories. It's like saying that Pudge Fisk was right when Armbrister was in front of him and should have gotten the interference call, but he didn't and the Reds won the series the next night( and Larry Barnet is still a POS). Coulda, woulda, shoulda, the stuff that makes boxing and baseball the two greatest sports to talk about.

[kaus2372]

Its a shame, Dempsey clearly knocked Tunney and he fell like a hip, this fight shall be awarded to Dempsey after all these years...referee seems to doesn't like Dempsey why? because he is a true honest fighter...who cares the guy might have won the fight but who lived on for ever

[hjaltirv]

must watch in HD!

[truebeliever786]

Jack Dempsey is truly the first ever 2-time Heavyweight champion of the world, because he won this fight. The referee was an ass...

[Easyandy100]

The rules are that the referee begins the count when he sees it is fit to do so.

[NoGoodBoyo1000]

Keep in mind that this was Dempsey far past his prime. Still, he deserved this win.

[TheFrontrowkid]

In 1927, penny arcade photos of Dempsey and Tunney getting ready for their fight were sold at amusement parks and arcades. I found some of these and sent a couple to Jack Dempsey at his NYC restaurant in the Eigties. He obligingly signed them and sent them back to me. What a treasurer to have.

[ragingbull191]

as far as I'm concerned Dempsey won, hell, he was halfway to flooring Tunney for 2 knockouts worth; and all you retards who say Dempsey dodged black fighters might want to do a little research before you spout shit from your uneducated mouths, he tried to fight Wills twice but the fight was vetoed by the NBA, Jack couldnt do a thing to get around the times he was living in, plus his shit manager refused to let him take fights with blacks

[Lews026]

Dempsey was a crude slugger who dodged African Americans. Gene Tunney fought everyone of any race and beat them all (bar one four rounder) with technical skill. Propoganda takes a long time to fade and Dempsey (the "great white hope") is still wrongly revered to this day. Tunney was a true champ, he just wasn't as exciting to watch.

[chrisM33]

@Lews026 Crude ? lol, look at the short sharp shots he put tunney down, mate he was not crude at all, he was not near his best here, he had gone soft and was more into making money, in short he was not hungry any more. Also he dodged ONE black fighter maybe, go on then name them all if you can. Jack johnson fought how many black fighters when he was champ again ?

[2pacinseattle]

@chrisM33

He was afraid of Sam Langford.

[1saxonwolf]

@Lews026 You r clueless ! Tunney never fought a black fighter his entire career. Not that it matters. Dempsey hired black fighters in every camp after he became champ, & nearly every camp when he became a contender. Your spouting propaganda from your "black" world view. Problem is yours is all UNTRUE!! Chief sparring partner Big Bill Tate, "black" HW champion, George Godfrey top 10 HW both guys >250lbs, JD KO both in camp. McVey, Johnson, etc... Get a clue before u post A-Hole !!

[RivJohnson101]

@1saxonwolf whislt its true that Dempsey wasnt inherently racist (no more than anyone those days) he never fought blacks after becoming champion, a purely pecuniary decision apparently.

The truth is that if you dont box with blacks then you are only champion of the WHITE crown, not the world champion. People like Dempsey and Sullivan were never world champions in the way that Marciano was. Hes the equivalent of 1/3rd title champions of today.

[1saxonwolf]

@RivJohnson101 "the truth", no just yours, & a poor one at that. Did u post the same on a Jack Johnson site ? No ? Why not? Did JJ duck the top black contenders during his reign ? Yes. Is he a 1/3rd of todays champions ? Clowns r all the same.

[RivJohnson101]

@1saxonwolf Yourreply is based on the fact that i think Johnson is one of the great heavyweight champions.

Unfortunately for your argument i dont think that, so your argument is utterly nullified, try another one, and this time without pretending to win your argument by saying 'clowns are all the same', my good man.

[RivJohnson101]

@1saxonwolf Yourreply is based on the fact that i think Johnson is one of the great heavyweight champions.

Unfortunately for your argument i dont think that, so your argument is utterly nullified, try another one, and this time without pretending to win your argument by saying 'clowns are all the same', my good man. Otherwise you will have to accept once and 4 all that Dempsey was white champion, not world champion

[RivJohnson101]

@1saxonwolf I see you deliberately missed the truth of why Johnson is revered, for his pioneering of a defensive style.

If any boxer including Johnson ducked half the worlds population (thats over half the contenders to the title, given that blacks are historically more successful in boxing) then they are only champion of half the world. Accept the facts if you wish.

[1saxonwolf]

@RivJohnson101 This is some of the dumbest crap yet.

Why not respond to what I wrote?

You continue to babble, have erroneous statements , no facts. "Half the population", LMAO. Yes, CLOWNS."Blacks r historically more successful in boxing" hahahaha. Like now u mean. Yes, CLOWNS.

"White Champion", yes CLOWNS.

Go ahead & share your brilliance, we r enjoying it !

[RivJohnson101]

@1saxonwolf you made no point, so I furthered my own, cheers

[RivJohnson101]

@1saxonwolf you've switched to using the word 'we' instead of referring to yourself. Why the need for outside support all of a  sudden, mate?

[1saxonwolf]

@RivJohnson101 Like I said "CLOWN" !!

[RivJohnson101]

@1saxonwolf its like talking to a broken record lool

[MrRoyalFatness]

@Lews026

That is complete bullshit. Dempsey fought many negros in his early days, and he also hired black fighters as sparring partners. Tunney never fought black fighters. Besides, Dempsey is was not crude at all. He was indeed a slugger, but a graceful one. Yes, Gene Tunney was indeed a great boxer, probably the best of his time, but definetely not as badass as the young Jack Dempsey, a man who knocked the fuck out of grown ups when he was still a teenager.

[LordTariq83]

it doesnt change anything IMO.tunney was clearly a better fighter than dempsey.in the 20 rounds they fought dempsey only won a single round.

[kewlnsimpguy]

@LordTariq83 they were all bad.... but Dempsey was older at the time

[LordTariq83]

@kewlnsimpguy even if dempsey was in his prime i still dont see him beating tunney.to me dempsey was one of the most overrated heavyweight champions in history

[Ricky42791]

Tunney said he could of gotten up but he didn't know if he could of survived dempseys killer instincts and ferocity without the extra time. He said when he got up "I thought dempsey was going to kill me!" and look at the way dempsey rushes in at him after he gets up hahaha

[Robstailey]

dempsey got screwed big time on this one.

[Chipinjack]

You should of shown Tunney's punch to Dempsey's solar plexis at the end of round 7. Dempsey called it the worst he's ever been hit.

[verbusen]

Wikipedia says the 10 count was a brand new rule that had not been used much before, so give the ref some slack! Look up "the long count".

The fight took place under new rules regarding knockdowns: the fallen fighter would have 10 seconds to rise to his feet under his own power, after his opponent moved to a neutral corner. The new rule, which was not yet universal, was asked to be put into use during the fight by the Dempsey camp, who had requested it during negotiations.

[muskratrowdy]

If the ref started counting on Tunney in the 7th as quickly as he did on Dempsey in the 8th, I wonder if Tunney would have beat the count? Not many people bring up or realize ref Dave Barry was not consistent in starting counts on the two fighters.

[BoxPred]

At the time of the knockdown (7th round) Tunney was winning on points. In the eighth he floored Dempsey himself for a 1 count and proceeded to easily take the final two rounds. Gene Tunney was a fantastic thinking boxer and deserves more credit than he gets when compared to the plaudits piled on Dempsey.

[kozmon0t]

Dempsey sounds like Curly from the 3 Stooges

[rrtodd95]

I don't think this was a fixed fight.

I'm blaming this more on Dempsey forgetting the new rules. If he would have been a little more disciplined he would have gone straight to his corner and would have won this fight.

When Dempsey started fighting when you dropped your opponent you could stand over him and wait to hit him until his knees left the mat even if the ref was still counting.

If you want to see a real fixed fight watch the Jake Lamotta Billy Fox fight.

[vivekpros]

im going with the notion that the ref was against dempsey i mean its clearly stated in the video 15 seconds man.. just cuz his willard fight... counting before a nutral corner man cheat..

[multiplemes101]

watch the dempsey vs willard fight. thats why they invented the get the hell away from your opponent rule

[Ricky42791]

@multiplemes101 lmao get the hell away from your opponent rule thats halirous

[NZA14]

its weird how history repeats its self, cause when Tyson fought Douglas, Douglas had 15 seconds to get up and Tyson lost the fight. and here we see Dempsey, Tyson's idol lose a fight cause of a long count, poor refereeing to me. plus they were 2 of the most brutal fighters in there eras everyone was terrified of them.

[TEMPmichaelhansen]

this film is on the not so great moments in sports vhs with different narriation

also there is a picture in B&W that makes it look like Jack Dempsey hair blends in so well with the B&W picture, it looks like his head is missing.

[expressivechild]

And besides, fighters like Ali and Holyfield has proven that good body conditioning and a hard chin enables a fighter to withstand savage beatings and aggressive attacks from opponents! But then, people love controversies... For me, there is nothing too controversial. Tunney obviously stayed down because he had more time due to the distraction... Dempsey should have just walked to his neutral corner but I guess he wasn't used to the idea of staying back and allow his opponent to stand up first..

[expressivechild]

Actually, there is nothing too controversial about the first Dempsey vs Tunney encounter. Though it was a long count indeed, but then again it was Dempsey who didn't go to his neutral corner immediately. And..... It is obvious Tunney deliberately stayed down till the count is almost over. And Tunney's great body conditioning and strong chin enables him to endure Dempsey's butchery. In their rematch, Tunney has proven himself again. I am no fan of Tunney, but then that's the truth...

[willfullyobscure]

Tunney got KTFO. he ran the rest of the fight, and that's why we remember Dempsey, for all his asshole showboating, and forget "Gene the Marine"

[chicodelaoculta]

1:00 - 1:20 Lol!!!

[groofoot]

I've read that when the referee, Dave Barry, was reading the instructions before the opening bell, he mentioned the new 'go to a neutral corner in case of a knockdown' rule, and then looked squarely at Dempsey, and said, 'Is that clear, Jack?!' ... kinda sounds like he just disliked Dempsey, for some reason....

[Garcia2603]

@groofoot Agree 100%

[expressivechild]

@groofoot - I don't think the referee dislike him or anything. Probably everyone know tha Dempsey would remorselessly pound on his opponents the very moment they are on their feet and would finish them as soon as he could. He probably finds it hard to get used to the neutral corner rule... The referee wouldn't want to disqualify Dempsey for failure to comply to this new rule then.

[RichieEastside]

Looks to me like the fix was in!

[jeste4187]

Dempsey should've won...thats bullshit...just like when that over blown spick julio caesar chavez got that gift when the ref stopped the fight 2 seconds left when meldrick taylor got up from a knockdown...taylor wouldve won, and history wouldve been altered....taylor kept fighting and never came back after a rematch, and now is broken physically and financially

[GalickGun5078]

@jeste4187 Gtfo.



[jeste4187]

@GalickGun5078 It is what it is

[dannyv2468va2]

If the fight was 15 rounds, Dempsey would have been knocked out!

[anselmochevelle]

this was the longest count ive ever seen

[unclesnoopy]

The book Tunney, by Jack Cavanaugh, is a great source of information about this fight and the rest of Gene Tunney's terrific boxing career.

Capone bought the referee? That must have been news to him, since he bet $50,000 on Dempsey in this fight.

[1899sharkey]

@unclesnoopy -Ijust finished the book it was a great read. As for Capone, Dempsey declined his help.

[lseateal]

capone bought the referee

[LUCIFERVAMPIRO]

Dude...Thanx for posting this...and the other Dempsey Fights, of course...For some reason alot of the Dempsey fights on my playlist are accompanied w/ foreign commentary...So the English version is much appreciated...I just wish the full fight is made available to all of us...Ah well...Anyway, Thanx...