Review-a-Day #79: Sin City - The Hard Goodbye

[zztoprules1]

I personally think that the misogyny aspect is common in noir fiction. And that the dialogue is ment to be cliche. I love the books. But I do respect your opinion.

[FuckWorkdays]

have you read the other books or seen the film?

[ComicBookClub]

@FuckWorkdays I have only seen the film... This didn't really sell me on reading more of the books, but I'm not opposed to it.

[IronManOfficialguy]

Frank miller is great but hes right. This is not Frank Millers best work the batman stuff is much better.

[fun012345]

you suck

[joker9494949494]

the sin city books are frank miller's greatest works. enough said. :)

[ultimatedesingers]

@joker9494949494 I know, the Sin City books are the best books ever made!

[Deviantman91]

i thought it was dark and amazing, we all have our own opinions great review my friend! 5/5

[hwilko]

Frank Miller is awesome!!!

[erodog]

I "feel" that you couldn't handle Frank Miller's balance between fun and seriousness.

[CosmoShidan]

I disagree that it's superhero-esque, I thought it was more of a pulp story.

[PFreakyPFister]

I personally really like Sin City: the Hard Goodbye, but I think people need to lighten up, just because you didn't like them doesn't meen that we fans all need to get mad

[wolfeman323232]

is this the same size as the one that comes with the extended cut of the movie?

[ComicBookClub]

Not sure... I'm guessing it's not? But could be wrong.

[slowmatt321]

good point uhh..(haha)...when i went to my book store i saw 7 sin city books not all where there but book 7 was there so i guess i didn't choose my words right sorry lol

[slowmatt321]

uhh aren't there like 7 sin city books out

[joker9494949494]

@slowmatt321 there is seven yes :D hhaha

[decos0]

dude what are you saying! this was the the godfather of all comics..you cant say it wasint good!

[ComicBookClub]

Well, I do like the art quite a bit.

[Attackofthecomics]

I couldn't take watching past 1:05 You are DUMB *Unsubscribe*

[ComicBookClub]

Ha! Really? You should probably have listened to what I said immediately before or after.

[AliasKenzo]

Dude... What kind of shit is this... ur shitting all over frank millers work.... stop bragging about daredevil or batman.... sin city is pure class..

[ComicBookClub]

We're all entitled to our opinions! I knew this wouldn't be a popular opinion, and I do think there are things to like about this volume (especially the art).

[lumpy814]

Yeah, but the art is only one aspect of the book. It requires the story for complete enjoyment.

[lumpy814]

But dude, the art and story need to be blended for true enjoyment. I mean it's like choco chip cookies. Yes I just compared a frank miller comic to cookies :P. Choco chips are fine alone, and plain cookies are good alone, but together they creat somthing beutiful just like the art of frank miller and his stories come together.

[cheeseleader09]

this book was supposed to have weird dialogue and a superhuman character. THIS ISN'T SUPPOSED TO BE A REALISTIC BOOK!!! and, it is noir story. It is a revenge story with the protagonist being dtermined by sexual relationships

[bloodyhell731]

Whether Frank Miller is misogynistic or not (probably so), I put that aside and don't really apply it to myself (female) when I read the story. Both the men and the women are such ridiculous extremes it can be laughable at times. I actually enjoyed the mix of superhero and film noir, simply because it's so different than reading superhero.

But yeah. If people started treating others like that in real life... ehh no.

[Yankeemetfan06]

Frank Miller is my favorite comic creator. Reading Sin City at age 7 had a big effect on me. I think that this is the weakest of the stories in the Sin City line, the art is amazing, but the writing is a little over the top sometimes. The Story itself is pretty good.

[Jeanmarcmis]

On the other hand, I love Miller's early work preciously because of many of these excesses and in your face attitude. It's like reading a really good 'bad movie'. You know the ones, so full of violence and sex, yet still sorta has a good eye for action and story.

Read his earlier stuff like Martha Washington, and revel in the kick ass B-Movie action! Back when he wasn't a bitter old man yelling at the world being wrong, and him right, all the freakin' time!

[Jeanmarcmis]

I totally agree with you in regards to the flowery language and misogynistic tone of the story. That this is also evident in many of other Frank Miller's works definitely makes me think whether he has issues with women quite a bit. Plus damn the main character really reminded me of his Dark Knight, old bitter man pushing through all the pain one last time, to go out in martyr like glory.

[moeezS]

The writing was fine in the comic, because I never took it seriously. But when it came out in the movie just like that, I felt like throwing up. Didn't realise how, like you said, overly "flowery" and too much "hard-boiled" it was. Even now, go play Max Payne 1 again, and I find it a little too much noir. Max Payne 2 handled it way better.

[lelandb123]

I've never been a huge fan of Sin City. I think actually seeing the movie made me like Frank Miller a little bit less. It's one thing to read a lot of his dialogue on the page but then to actually hear people read it aloud really made me dislike it. To me it feels gritty to the point of ridiculousness. It just isn't for me I guess.

[moeezS]

Either the dialogue is meant to be a parody of noir writing, or it just feels really, really stupid. I've never been a fan of his writing more than his unique art.

[wisebob134]

Sin City's not antiwomen. Everyone's rough in Sin City. All the men are murders , rapists or something else horrible. All the women are whores and such. Everyone's portrayed equally bad. So I'd think it gets a pass as far as misogynism goes.

[Melville10]

I tried reading Sin City and gave up. It was horrible and I like Miller's work. As for All Star Batman.....ugh

[spdrwrtr]

I think the writing of "All-Star Batman and Robin" is wayyyyy worse than Sin City: The hard goodbye

[bandito07]

damn, i read em all and thought it was the best one.

[hornychipmunk]

Sin City is one of the best comics I've ever read (all of them) & to say the writing is bad because of some hidden women hating agenda is pretty paranoid/ridiculous. You said it yourself, the character doesn't like women, but the whole story is a love story. The lengths a broken man will go to to get revenge on the MEN who killed a woman he loved (in his own crazy way), so if that's mysoginist then half the movies & comics I read are too.

[ComicBookClub]

Well, that last part is correct, isn't it?

[angeltread]

i wastn all that fond of you at first... but you are growing on me... here is a suggestion.. sometimes when you make like comments like "the dialog is flowery" maybe its just me but i have no idea of what that means... and if i did i would want an example of some... so yeah. maybe bookmark the parts so when you make a point you can quickly go to the inside and read from or show the camera what you mean. or get all fancy and do insert shots... take care and keep it up.

[RoyalTenenbaum]

I enjoyed it. Not my favorite comic, and I can see what you're saying, though I don't feel 100% the same way.

[BigBangBear]

Enjoyed the review Alex. I read it before the movies came out and I think it was the first thing I had read by Miller. As a result I wrote it off to the characters, but as you said his writing and trends are apparent the more material you read. As a result, I don't think I would enjoy it quite as much if I read Sin City now. I have to agree the art is very well done.

[PlowsharesTheatreCo]

Alex, great to see you back on Review-a-day. Congrats on the marriage, too.

Thank you for your review of SIN CITY. This piece of shit is part of the reason I fear THE SPIRIT is a going to suck. Miller has an inflated opinion of himself as an auteur that is completely undeserved.

I'm a huge fan of Miller's run on Daredevil. He did an amazing transformation of the character. His Batman is okay but All-Star is another piece of shit. He just likes to beat up on women. I'm afraid he likes that.

[nomadikk]

I concur with your review. Its not the characters that are misogynists, its Frank Miller. Just look at ALL of his writing, and you will notice the trend that all women are sluts, prostitutes, and conniving. Miller has some serious issues towards women, and you can see him struggling with this in each comic.

[comicbookfanboy]

When you first said it was not good, I was screaming WTF? But then you explained it in way that I can understand. Frank's writing has gone down, especially with All star Batman but I think he was still in his zone when doing Sin City. So when I think I want to read Frank Miller I go for Dark Knight Returns, Daredevil, Ronin, and yes Sin City because I did enjoy the writing in it because it can be silly and over the top but it's done purposely. So basicaly it is what it is.

[Yanirakarola]

Frank Miller isn't that good of a writer. And you aren't a very good reviewer......

[hellointernet]

I think Sin City is harsh, but in a fun way. I'm pretty sure Miller's tongue was pretty firmly in his cheek when he made these books, along with most of what he's done since. It's pulpy fun that looks incredible.

The misogyny doesn't really bother me because it's context is that of an unreal world. Saying that it's a problem is like saying Kill Bill is too violent. I know people say that, but to me it's an irrelevant argument against something that is so stylized and unreal.

[heerogundam]

I think as single books they are not all that good but as a whole its great! The fact u pick up on wants going on in some of the scene is good. So i would say pick up sin city if your willing to buy the lot.

[VicSidious]

I agree.

[Bestial1985]

Gotta say i LOVE Frank Millers work on Batman and Daredevil, some of the best comics i've ever read(and i wasnt even a Daredevil fan before i read his run) but i think that once he started writing Sin City, he never stopped and that is why his work recently has sucked. I love "Man Without Fear" but even that is just a Sin City with the Daredevil characters, and the same goes especially for All star Batman.

[tehquestion]

I found Sin City pretty lame for all the reasons Alex mentioned. But thats nothing to the horror that was the newest Spirit trailer.

[crivelliman]

If you saw Sin City, you basically had this volume read to you by actors.

[blowshimselfupdude]

I was a little under impressed with The Hard Goodbye. But The Dame to Kill For is one of my favorite graphic novles of all time. And I ejoyed the other Sin City books to varying degrees.

However I've always felt that The Hard Goodbye and Dame To Kill For should have had their names switched as I think their titles fit the other better.

[Serge0]

Yeah you'll probably get flamed, but remember there is not such a thing like good or bad, things good for some people an bad for others

[Serge0]

I just read The Hard Goodbye a couple of days ago and I see the similarities with All star Batman in the writing, as for the art I do think is great but not the best inside the Sin City series, to my eyes eh evolved in hes style from there. keep up the good shows.

[Violet9Spider]

Alex, I just wanted you to know I completely agree with your assessment. I don't really like Frank Miller's stuff and personally. Miller's stuff has almost no imagination, and is usually just offensive. You might get flamed, but I guess I will, too. Most of his stuff just isn't good.

[WrenchNinja]

All Miller can write is WHORESWHORESWHORES when it comes to female characters.

[geekmontreal]

It's bad people saying bad things. I certainly think the heroes of the Sin City novels say enough good things about women. They all hold women in a very high place of respect. So it kind of evens out. As for the writing it bad ass characters doing and saying bad ass things. So I enjoy it. It's definitely not a thinker. Just a good gritty action.

[fanboy2177721]

Not that I think your opinion is "totally wrong" or anything. You know what they say, opinions are like @#$holes everyones got one. Frank Miller understands people from the "other side of the tracks" like few other writers out there. He has a mastery of "gritty" storytelling which appeals to wolves much more than sheep or sheep dogs. IMHO Franks target audience isn't the average suburban comic reader and I'm happy that his books are being adapted to movies that can be understood by the everyman.

[LatinD]

For once I wholeheartedly disagree with you. But give That Yellow Bastard a try. That's probably the best one... but that's also done in the movie.

Thanks for the great review, Alex. When are you going to do some Star Wars comics? Or some honest-to-goodness classic manga? (Let me pick the manga...) Looking forward to those!

[scottkicksyou]

I would love to see Miller do art for Max Collins or someone.

[stiv6240]

I'm silent...

don't yell please.

[princeofpwnage22]

says the same thing in every review

dude we know ur not gonna be consistent

its ok

do it at ur own pace

[ComicBookClub]

Ha, thanks... We're still getting a lot of letters, so it stands repeating.

[lelanddupuy]

i drink urine.

[PretentiousHousefly]

I'd like to see give your opinion in front of Pete...just to see his reaction. :)

[elunicocalvo]

I think Sin City is much better on comics than on the movie. The reading makes some silly phrases feel more convincing, and the "rhythm" from panel to panel works better than the editing of the movie. Proof is, the weakest of the comic series is the best on the film ("The Big Fat Kill").

The first Sin City I read was "That Yellow Bastard", long before the movie was even mentioned...for me that's the definitive Sin City comic, The Hard Goodbye was just an experiment...

[STHayden]

haha.. I didn't read it either!

[guitarflame5]

Isn't there a sin city on judge dredd?

[CobraCommanderTFW]

Glad to see review-a-day back, been missing it.

havent read the book but ive felt for a while now that Frank (for me) can be a bit hit and miss now and then. But the art work looks really great