Blending Gasoline with vegetable oil to make Diesel Fuel

[DrMotorDude]

...gasoline dissolve revelry into do research below...

WTF???

[pearljamfan99]

DO NOT EVER PUT GASOLINE INTO YOUR DIESEL ENGINE!!! You are asking for major problems!!

[Jhananda]

@pearljamfan99 I have been blending gasoline into my diesel fuel for 5 years, so apparently it is a myth that one cannot run gasoline in a diesel engine

[pearljamfan99]

@Jhananda Do you understand the chemical differences in cetane versus octane? @ totally different methods of getting energy from fuels. I'm glad that you have found the "Myth" to not harm your diesel as of yet, but I don't think everyone who watches these youtube videos realize what actually happens internally in the two types of engines.

[Jhananda]

@pearljamfan99 Yes, I understand the chemical differences in cetane versus octane, because I used to work in petroleum research at Chevron Research.

Since I have successfully blended gasoline in the fuel of my diesel engine at 20% for more than 5 years without destroying the engine, and there are hundreds of people doing the same thing around the world on many different diesel engines, then we can conclude it is safe to do so on most diesel engines.

[pearljamfan99]

@Jhananda Your "scientific method" is flawed. So you can definitively conclude that gas mixed WVO does not do any internal harm to any diesel because of your 5 year experiment and the "hundreds" of people doing so? So where is the data about how much internal damage it does do? How are you ridding the WVO of FFA's? Let me guess those don't do any harm either right?

[Jhananda]

@pearljamfan99 well, I am a trained scientist, and I have been hired by Chevron Research, Steward Observatory, and Optical Science of the University of Arizona, and other research institutions to do research for them. So, take up the question of my scientific credibility with them.

On the question of FFAs in WVO, I settle my WVO before blending, further FFAs are not soluble in gasoline, so any that are left precipitate out of solution when gasoline is blended with WVO.

[Jhananda]

@pearljamfan99 Since I do not have hundreds of thousands of dollars to throw at research; whereas the petroleum industry has billions to throw at their research, then I use case histories to bolster my research, and case histories are acceptable in research when other methods, such as engine breakdown and micing the components is not an option.

[pearljamfan99]

@Jhananda There is no reason to continue this discussion because I am not going to be able to help you see the flaws in your thinking, nor are you going to convince me that WVO mixed with gasoline is safe for diesels

[Jhananda]

@pearljamfan99 that is fine, after all, I have a scientific training, and critical thinking to help me; whereas you obviously have just your flimsy beliefs to keep you comfy at night.

[lolailando]

my guess is that only the thinner oils are blending with the gas and now I have a blend with too much gas as only a few gallons of oil blended into the gas.

I pulled the thicker bottom with no smell of gas and left it on a close bucket and the I just mixed the thicker oil with some gas smell (5gallons) with 5gallons of wvo which looks pretty clean and 1gallon gas, and will see tomorrow.

I will try to post some videos so you can see

[Jhananda]

@lolailando Well, it is not true that only the "thinner oils" blend with gasoline. I have found if it is an oil, regardless of how "thick" it is, then it will dissolve into gasoline and become thinner. However, precipitates are commonly formed from making diesel blends. Those precipitates are various solids, and various liquids. The solids are mostly free-carbon. The liquids are mostly water and lacquer.

[lolailando]

@lolailando Hi again, and thank you. What I have is called MAGIC FRY-zz Clear Liquid Shortening, with anti-foam additive, it says all vegetable soybean oil. It is liquid not cloudy at all but amber. Around 50-52F it sems to develope certain cloudiness that will settle down very slowly in the mix that I made with RUG. That mix may have also had other oils, so I will try some new tests.

[Jhananda]

@lolailando your Clear Liquid Shortening, which is all vegetable soybean oil should work just fine for blending. So, just add gasoline to it at 20%, then let it settle for 24 hours, then drain off the bottom sludge, or pour off the top the good fuel blend, then filter down to 1-micron into your fuel tank. That is all there is to blending.

[lolailando]

Hi again, do you have any experience with shortening?

I mixed a batch of aprox. 3gallons gas and 9 gallons wvo. I know that at least more than half the wvo is liquid shortening. It seat for a few days, and I pumped from the top about 5-6 gallons of very thin mix (went through a 0.5micron sock filter right through like water), the rest is a much thicker oil with litle smell of gas, and the vey bottom doesn't smell of gas at all.

This is in an unheated garage at probably around 30F.

[Jhananda]

@lolailando OK, so, if you are blending with WVO, and using shortening, then shortening is about 1/2 hydrogenated oils and/or animal fat, neither of which will dissolve into any petroleum distillate. The other half of shortening is light oils. The light oils will dissolve into petroleum distillates. So, let your waste shortening settle in a warm place until the light oils rise to the top, pour them off, and blend with them. The shortening will have to be turned into biodiesel.

[Jhananda]

@lolailando Once the hydrogenated oils and animal fat are turned into biodiesel, then they can be blended with gasoline at about 5-10% to reduce the cloud point of biodiesel made from hydrogenated oils and animal fat.

[lolailando]

@Jhananda thanks. Well t is already blended with gas. It makes sense cause I roughly got 50% of the shortening plus the gas as a clear liquid.

Most restaurants won't tell me or don't know if it is shortening, or they may have mixed it. Is there a way to tell if there is shortening before blending without waiting a long time?

[Jhananda]

@lolailando Shortening is thick, cloudy, milky colored, whereas, waste vegetable oils tend to be thin and amber colored. So, look for the light amber colored oil that tends to float on top of shortening, pour the amber colored oil off the top, and leave the shortening, or concentrate the shortening together into a large enough batch to justify making biodiesel out of it.

[packrat541]

You can also run a mixture of gasoiline with a small amount of veg oil in a non catalitic convertor gasoiline engine if the outside air temperature is 80 degrees or hotter and gain feul economy.

[Jhananda]

@packrat541 good to know. Do you happen to know how percent vegetable oil will do this on a gasoline engine?

Also, apparently a gasoline engine can be run as a two-tank system with gasoline for the startup and shutdown, then the trip can be run on kerosene, or I suppose a blend of gasoline and vegetable oil to equal the viscosity of kerosene.

[lolailando]

If this sounds like too many questions I could contact you privately, but seeing all the negative comments you get when you are one of the few doing real and public research= no agenda, no funding from academia, sales, corporations or governments cutting your funding if you find the opposite of what they want. GOOD WORK!

[Jhananda]

@lolailando Thanks. I sure do get my share of offensive comments for posting free videos on a subject that does not have much information on it.

[lolailando]

The reason for doing a coold upflow would be to separated the fats and being able to use less RUG in the blend for the cold months.

[Jhananda]

@lolailando Well, yes, a cold upflow process works fine to eliminate the fats, which will not dissolve into gasoline anyway. But, I just leave my WVO sitting around for about a week to precipitate out the fats. Then I collect the fats together and turn them into biodiesel, which will dissolve into gasoline to lower its gel point.

[lolailando]

I am buying a 93 chevy 6.5 turbo to follow your footsteps. I appreciate your efforts to go mobile. I live in a colder climate, Albany NY. In order to use as litle RUG as needed I was thinking, cold upflow tank into a 2nd tank were I blend RUG and settle. I have enough space and time. The cold drum would be outside and feed a drum in the heated basement 8' below, filter after blending in warm bsmt drum. I am thinking the low head presure could push very slow though the filter.

[Jhananda]

@lolailando sound good.

[lolailando]

@Jhananda , got the truck! I am thinking to mix wvo/rug 70/30 and then fill the tank half regular diesel and half of that blend, to see how the truck runs and every week reduce the amount of diesel. We are still in the 40-50 during the day and 30' at night. What strategy would you recomend me to get started? thanks

[Jhananda]

@lolailando It sounds like you have worked out a pretty good strategy for yourself. So, now you have to build a blending and filtering system. Get a pressure tank with 1-2" fittings at both ends of a domed end tank, Turn it upright, plumb it so that you can get your blend in, and drain the sludge off, and pump it through a set of filters.

[lolailando]

@Jhananda thanks, could you comment on a couple topics?:

1-Gasoline mixed with wvo, how big of a batch I can do, or how long it would stay good. I mean does it go stale at some point? or can I batch 55 gallons that last me a month?

2-How dangerous/flamable is an 80/20mix? I know WVO won't ignite at room temp

3- Do you pour that white stuff at the bottom of the cubies, and/or what to do with it.

thanks a lot

[Jhananda]

@lolailando You can make as large a batch of waste oil blend diesel fuel you want. It will last months in a proper fuel storage container. It is far less dangerous/flamable than gasoline, but more dangerous/flamable than diesel fuel. The White stuff at the bottom of WVO will not blend, so extract it, turn it into biodiesel, then you can blend it with gasoline, and the rest of your batch of waste oil blend diesel fuel

[gnockergnutz]

@lolailando < You''ll want to use 5 gal. gasoline for 50 gal oil to make a 55 gal drum of fuel. The "white stuff", as you put it, is useable to an extent. Once heated, the chunks of white shortening and the creamy,hydrogenated oils become useable and will blend with the gas. You must install a heating system on your truck's fuel tank (i run mine from the radiator) in order to run hydrogenated blends.Start and heat the engine on normal diesel, then when tank oil is hot switch to wvo.

[Jhananda]

@gnockergnutz well, I think you mist a few things. First, gasoline at only 10% with waste vegetable oil is insufficient to burn properly, so, yes, you are adding heat to your fuel system; however, if you do, then you will end up with vapor-lock. At 10% gasoline in your blend vapor-lock will not be particularly noticeable; however, at higher levels it will become significant.

Also, hydrogentated oils and animal fats will form precipitates in a petroleum-based WVO blend, not good

[dezi035]

@Jhananda < The word is "missed" and I make and sell the stuff in 370 gal batches every day. I'm a licensed IKG transporter and renderer and make my saleable product at specified parameters. All diesel engines will run on unmodified veg oil straight out of the Wesson bottle from your grocers shelf, gasoline is only added to WVO to specifically to burn off glycerines as well as dissolve any particulate food matter that slipped past your filters and centrifuge.

[Jhananda]

@dezi035 It sounds like you have a few more things to learn about making diesel fuel out of waste oils, because hydrogenated oils and animal fat will not dissolve into petroleum distillates, this means that your fuel has precipitates in it, which are ruining your customer's engines, and fuel system.

[dezi035]

@Jhananda< My wife's account btw. I cannot believe someone who preaches what you do would block intelligence from commenting. Seriously, what would Siddhartha say to you performing such a childish act?

[Jhananda]

@dezi035 If you are going to be childish, and not post an intelligent response, on my YouTube channel, then you will have your messages blocked.

[BRILLOPADral]

@Jhananda I want to start making Bio deisel but not sure of the way I should do it. I live on a farm and have a small shed and have near to no money thus wanting to try save a little on travel its 15 miles to the nearest descent market. I saw those vids of the guys with machine separating/mixing /filtering machines but they must be loaded with wedge right.Anyway can you advise me if you have the answer? Cheers. Like the vid keep it up.

[Jhananda]

@BRILLOPADral Anyone can make diesel fuel out of any waste oil by adding gasoline to it at 20%, then let it settle for 24 hours for WVO and 3 days for WMO, then pour off the top the good clean oil for fuel, and leave behind the thick stuff.

[gxr420]

@Jhananda hey how are you doing man uhm out of all these video's which chemical that you've done is the cheapest to blend with waste vege oil and what are the ratio's to mix i am trying to do this on a large scale thanks.

[Jhananda]

@gxr420 I am doing well, thanks. The cheapest solvent that is available to me is gasoline, so I use it most often. But, other solvents might be cheaper for others in other regions, such as kerosene or pure gum turpentine. I prefer using pure gum turpentine because it smells so good, and it is biodegradable, etc. But it is very expensive for me to use.

[gxr420]

@Jhananda ahh i see what would the ratio's be to mix with the gasoline say gallon wise?

[Jhananda]

@gxr420 20% gasoline in a 20 gallon batch is 4 gallons to 80% waste oil, which would be 16 gallons. I hope that helps.

[lolailando]

In your experience if I want to try svo/rug for home heating in a boiler with gun type burner (beckett or so on), and would like to use as litle rug as possible to save $/recycle; should I keep a few gallons at let say 120F and then be able to use less RUG? could I make it work with 5% RUG? I mean increase temp = less RUG for same viscosity/specific gravity?

[Jhananda]

@lolailando You could just use the heat from your boiler to heat the WVO, like a two tank auto system, then you would not need any gasoline at all, except in your "startup" tank, to get your boiler going, if it goes out.

[lolailando]

Hi, great work! I have followed your work and read your posts in every forum I could find you, and first I would like to say GREAT research! you are trying something new for a good reason, with a clear objective, and an empirical method! so we all can learn and improve from where you have reach to. Keep on going! don't let don't let those narrow mind believers in the forums discourage you!

[Jhananda]

@lolailando Thanks.

[centexpw]

Rug and Diesel have different burning and ignition characteristics. Have you pulled the heads or injectors for inspection after 10k, 25K 0r 100k miles?

[Jhananda]

@centexpw I have removed my injectors numerous times. My injectors are great as long as I do not blend WMO with WVO, because doing so cokes the heck out of the injectors

[centexpw]

Ive run wvo and diesel blends also. 50/50 in the summer and 70/30 in the winter. I have a centrifugal filter system also to clean the wvo first. I have a problem with the wvo gelling in the filter and causing a slimy sludge. Cant seem to get rid of it. I tried the diesel secret 80%wvo/10%diesel/10%rug but eliminated the gas. Running RUG in a diesel engine is a bad idea because of coking. Have you removed the heads to inspect the combustion chamber? Your thoughts please. continued

[Jhananda]

@centexpw I have been running RUG in a 6.2L diesel engine for 5 years. It is great as an anti gel. In fact my fuel has never gelled. I never get the slimy sludge, as long as I blend, then settle, then drain off the slime sludge, then filter. So, try blending RUG first with your waste oil. You will find it helps to clean up your waste oil.

[davieboyhammer]

Will this mixture work in a furnace that runs off diesel as well??

[Jhananda]

@davieboyhammer yes

[125varma]

HI :) All I need is your word! So please tell me if I mix 20% gasoline and 80% of vegetable oil I can put the outcome into my diesel engine and it will run without causing problem for my engine.

[Jhananda]

@125varma I have been running an alternative diesel fuel blend of 20% gasoline and 80% of vegetable oil in my diesel engine for almost 5 years. I belong to several alternative diesel fuel forums, where people around the world report doing the same thing, and none of us are having problems with our engine, so it seems reasonable to say that an alternative diesel fuel blend of 20% gasoline and 80% should in any diesel engine without trouble. However, if there is increased emissions, then add gas

[125varma]

@Jhananda Thanks for your answer. I really appreciate it. I just got few liters of used vegetable oil and I'm going to filter it and add the gasoline. Only one more question: How to deal with the water which is mixed with oil? Do i need to some how remove it? If I don't remove the water, does it cause any problems? :)

[Jhananda]

@125varma it is better to blend gasoline with waste oil first, then let it settle for a few days, then pour off the light, thin blend off the top through a filter, then you have saved your filters and reduced the work needed to purify the fuel blend.

[125varma]

@Jhananda Thanks a lot. I really appreciate it :) 

[Jhananda]

@125varma you are welcome

[125varma]

@Jhananda I just wanted to report the outcome of my experiment. It worked perfectly. Exhaust smells funny, but Im loving it :D I just drove 250 kilometers last friday and I'm gonna drive 250 kilometers today. I must say that I add about one CC of acetone per liter of diesel. I have a 2.5 liters V6 engine and car drinks about 4.8 - 5.3 liters per 100 kilometers. Next I'm gonna add a bit of parrafin to diesel in order to increase the cetane of it. What do you think about that? :)

[Jhananda]

@125varma good to know you tried a 80/20 blend. Yes, the exhaust does smell funny, but I too find it pleasant to smell. I doubt if any kind of cetane booster is needed, because waste oils tend to pack lots of cetane.

[USFiltermaxx1]

2400 hours is about 170,000 miles. The typical driver goes about 12,000 miles a year. 170,000 miles / 12,000 miles per year = 14.16 years driving. SInce you consider 5 years to be an expert. I would think that 14 qualifies and I rest my case.

[Jhananda]

@USFiltermaxx1 I am glad you have put that many miles burning blended fuels on a vehicle, but it does not sound like you have put 4 or 14 years into your research

[USFiltermaxx1]

Diesel will gel in winter because it contains wax. Gasoline does not therefore it will not gel and act as a solvent (up to 30% gasoline) to extend the low temperature pour point of oils. Regarding the WMO fuel. We have conducted thousand of hours of testing on various blends. These are described in our book "Alternaive Energy Secrets." The actual blend depends upon the engine however we have 2400 hours runtime on straight motor oil that had been centrifuged to remove the particulates.

[Jhananda]

@USFiltermaxx1 This is why I advocate blending with gasoline instead of diesel fuel. Since you only have 2400 hours runtime on straight motor oil it explains why you advocate blending with diesel fuel. If you had been blending for 5 years, as I have, then you would have learned a great deal more about blending. Give it a few more years before you put yourself out as an "expert."

[zeigbo1]

I AGREE WITH THE VIDEO.

I run straight wvo .in the winter gasoline is mixed in. It will not knock because the veg oil blends well and retards the ignition point. Gets very close to diesel....

A LOT of guys run Black Diesel...waste motor oil (wmo) and gas up to 25%.

[Jhananda]

@zeigbo1 thank-you posting your comments on blending gasoline with WVO

[USFiltermaxx]

@zeigbo1 You can actually safely run 50% or more wmo mixed with diesel (a ratio of 1:1). I have performed thousands of hours of testing. I live off-grid with a generator that I built which runs on wmo. It is very important that you clean the oils very well with a good centrifuge, which will remove a large amount of contaminants that filters can never remove. I build and sell high quality centrifuges for this purpose. I have written several practical books. One is "Alternative Energy Secrets".

[Jhananda]

@USFiltermaxx while it is true that 50% waste oil blends with diesel fuel work, they tend to gel in the winter; whereas, gasoline need only be blended at 20% and will keep the fuel blend liquid and burning properly down below 0F (-18c)

[tada786]

1% off gas is enough to make it more flamable and works like a cleaner,anti geling,

i too have concerns at that percentage rate ,diesel compression is 24:1 gas 9:1

please post if you blow ur engine,and let us know

[Jhananda]

@tada786 I have been running my diesel engine on a blend of waste oil at 80% and gasoline at 20% for 4.5 years. My engine still runs fine. Therefore it is unreasonable to consider that this blend is harmful for it or any other diesel engine.

[nFlames2]

On the WVO is that like straight out of the fryer?

[Jhananda]

@nFlames2 yes, I just get the WVO that a restaurant removes from its fryer. I prefer using the waste oil from restaurant that use canola oil in their fryer, because it remain liquid down below freezing.

[Inspironator]

Sir, blending veg oil with gas to get the viscosity to equal that of diesel is only part of the solution. Gasoline will ignite before the diesel will and the resulting pre-ignition will cause the pistons to fight one another rather than support one another. You may get by with doing this in an emergency, but eventually, at the 80/20 mix you are suggesting will surely damage your pistons just as pre-ignition will damage a gas engine if allowed to continue "knocking" Beware all! bad idea.

[Jhananda]

@Inspironator I have been blending gasoline at 20% with WVO for more than four years and have not had the problem of pre-ignition or knocking that you predicted, so I find no evidence to support your fears. Instead I find gasoline in a WVO blend in a diesel engine acts as a kind of "spark plug" stimulant to my engine that gives it power and it tends to run clean

[USFiltermaxx]

@Inspironator Yes, I recommend mixing with diesel for more safety. Check out my channel and my book "Alternative Energy Secrets" to learn all about this and more.

Best regards,

Stephen Chastain

[Jhananda]

@USFiltermaxx while blending waste oils with diesel fuel works, it must be blended at a high percentage to avoid coking the inejctors; however, that blend will tend to gel in cold temperatures. Whereas, gasoline can be blended more effective at as little as 20%, and will prevent fuel gelling down below 0F (-18c)