The media said he had a prescription sedative patch on his body even though he didn't have a prescription for it. Then I hear he had Ketamine in his system.
Now you're telling me he had crack up his butt?
I smell a rat, same rat I smelled when the BART said their security cameras "MAGICALLY" quit working during the whole Oscar Grant shooting.
COME ON BRAH! HOW DO YOU KNOW THE POLICE DIDNT PUT THAT IN HIS ASS AFTER THE SHOOTING TO MAKE IT LOOK LIKE HE WAS A DRUG DEALER?!! THEY DO IT OFTEN THIS I KNOW FOR A FACT. ABOVE ALL OSCAR GRANT'S AGGRESSION DOESNT MEAN HE SHOULD BE SHOT AND KILLED, ESPECIALLY AFTER THE FACT THAT HE WAS HANDCUFFED!!!
@lasalleis19 nigga osca ma nigga that nigga a G i went to skoo wid that nigga n Mt. Eden that nigga a trip i smoked wid that nigga one time i was hella zooted n i askd ma nigga fuk iz thiz shit cuz it wz sum bom ass budda n he said he laced the kush with kriss.
@TyreeRealES510Hyphy oooohh nigga you swear?!!!! i mean whatever you feel me all that is irrelevant because the pigs is still the pigs! murder has too many factors just if he had possesion or not!
@zennie62 who really cares if your source is black, is that suppose to justify that the information was correct? Ok now the trial is over and when the pathologist was on the stand not once did he mention that they found Crack in Oscar's body. So looks as though YOU and your SOURCE are wrong, you might want to think about really investigating the things your source tells you, for it was not the truth.
As I expected, the autopsy report never showed anything that his UNNAMED source suggested, & as a journalist I would never report something so prejudicial against a deceased victim on the strength of 1 source, w/o any corroborating evidence. I hope this is a lesson learned, or perhaps u deliberately did it to generate traffic & hits. Today u owe the family an apology for your salacious reporting & spreading such repulsive information about a person who never deserved 2 b killed.
Who cares if he had crack that didn't mean he gets a death sentence, crack is actually the white-mans poison they don't want crack to go away they know its enslaving black America and keeping us down!
THE WHOLE CASE HINGES ON ..HE THOUGHT IT WAS HIS TASER....IF ANOUTHER COP HAS AHOLD OF HIM AT THE SAME TIME ...WOULDN'T HE GET ELECTRICUTED TOO??? IS THAT PROTICAL???
@toddholladay no he would not, they showed video demonstrations in court where people are deliberately being TASED while being held by two people on each side to prevent them from falling down, and they are not effected by the shock of 50,000 volts of electricity. Also electrocuted means to be killed by electricity, i think you meant shocked.
@zennie62 yo slave your source is not black, and nor are you black, but you ugly as hell, i dont know why you want to preach against your brother but i really hope, weather the county police, or cia, is paying you well with our tax money, and there is no point of trying to prove a case to an uncle tom, but if you think its fair for someone to get shot, with handcuffs on, then if your life is put on oscars shoes i would laugh my ass off, and my source would say you deserved it. lol
....umm, yeah maybe you stuff your crack up your ass for a night on the town....hey party on dude, whatever trips your nigger ass....but you smearin shit from your source's ass, what can i say....i say the better part of you ran down yo momma's ass....though looking at the shape of your head, congrats on surviving the coat hanger, ya nigga shill.
your source was so wrong about 1) cocaine was not ever mentioned in any pre-trial motion or by the coroner and the defense would have LOVED to exploit this point 2) KTVU was not hiding any videos 3) 6 videos eventually surfaced, the last being the Tommy Cross video on my site, 4) The evidence in trial points to Grant not being aggressive. 5) Mehserle will be found guilty of something, there is no way he walks.
@zennie62 I hate niggas like you yo! you initiated tapdancing/buckdancing for the cracker ass motherfucker. With all the power in The Universe that conscious brothers like I can muster, We will get rid of you Sorry Ass Sellout Satanic/Demonic Negroes dude, watch! you going to the same hell the cracker going or worse, and I damn your fucking soul to the deepest depth's of Hades you motherfucker!
@zennie62 Any Conscious Black person with 20/20 vision can see that you're a Boule Uncle Tom's Cabin ass nigga dude, and you have to be dealt with. You are a detriment to Black people and you mean us Black no good! If I had a sword and was near be Id behead your motherfucking ass nigga!
Your source is pissing conscious brothers like me the fuck off man, what you assholes trying to justify this murder? The Police job is to arrest and unarmed person whom they see as a criminal, not murder them, this guy on this video is a Boule asshole, my source my motherfucking ass, who the fuck are you talking about some source you fucking asshole! your source is your caucasian Templar counterparts
everything was ok until the billy bad azz walked up and pointed at oscar to say thats the nigga right there than oscar is sitting down on the floor looking up at the cop who are in a better advantege push him on his face billy bad azz puts his knee on his neck so the other cop had two free hands to pullout his gun and fire than they both stand up and you can see he was handcuffed if this cop gets away with this and blackman do nothing that is the damm shame fuck anybody that can't see the truth
@yoazzma Is that what you really think happened? Watch the other videos because the only shame here is your statement. 1) billy badass didn't put his knee in Oscar's neck until he resisted being searched by the first officer 2) the officer didn't pull his gun until Grant jerked his hand away and put it under his left side jacket 3) he wasn't handcuffed until after he was shot 4) the shame is you trying to make fiction into a fact. I respect people's opinions, until they ignore the obvious.
@x4JOZ215 Do you consider pulling away from the officer who was trying to search him as being non-aggressive? Or do you consider him trying to push the officer off of him when he was trying to pat him down as being non-aggressive? Maybe when he jerked his hand away from the officer that was trying to cuff him in order to be able to search him, you'd consider that non-aggressive? Run the violent crime stats there within a 6 block radius, it's staggering how much aggression there is.
C) Most judges are republicans, most was in the prosicuters officers procecuters are on the side of the police.
so... A) Money B) Fear & C) Racism & biast reasons is why cops dont get convicted.
and the one that are convicted are the one that didn't "PLAY BY THE RULES". I know, I am a former Officer who did not play by the rules and wanted to be an honest officer.
@JfarmerJr and thank you for stepping up and saying that. We all know there are good cops and Racist Cops. Mehserle, Pirone and Dominici ARE ALL RACIST COPS. Guess they played by the rules until they screwed up on live video camera and their chief of police Gee could not cover up the story, so he had no choice but to have them ALL fired from the force. Again thanks for being REAL...
A) if all cops in a city who harms a civilian is convicted for their wrong doings that city will be BANK RUPPED, so judges make sure that they have a job by playing part of the officers wrong doing by getting the cop off. some are going to say that a jury convicts not a judge. True but the judge controls the jury.
b) the cops are the largest gang in the U.S. there are more cops than judges. some judges fear for their lives.
Oscar Grant was fighting on a Bart Train. I was on a Bart Train the same day. If you fight on a train, think about how frightening it would be to be a passenger? On OUR car WE saw a fight. We were scared. Oscar Grant had a liability and assumed risk when he acted the fool on that train. Oscar Grant was also found with ketamine in his system. He didn't DESERVE to get shot, but he certainly had a part in his own demise. You reap what you sow.
@PaloAltoCalif According to testimony it was a white guy named David (aka Deisal) that had Oscar in a headlock so it was the other person who was the aggressor. That came out on Wednesday in court in Los Angeles.
@streetgangs Oscar and his friends were jumped by these guys they had every right to protect themselves from them. But that is neither here nor there, what everyone is not listening to is these kids were pulled from the train without even being identified by the person or person's who called into the dispatcher of the fight. The cops didn't even know if they had the right kids, they were not identified at all on that platform. It could of been any one of us!!
@PaloAltoCalif For real...FUCK YOU, he didnt deserve that shit, so what if he was fighting, i fought n school at the mall the park doesnt justify MURDER!!!!!!
@PaloAltoCalif so you tell me that when someone attacks you, that you would not defend yourself from the attacker? Oscar was jumped by this individual an he was defending himself as the other few that were fighting. If you did your research Oscar was in a headlock from this individual he was trying to get loose. So I guess he just should of let these creeps just beat him and his girlfriend up, oh so tell me this, how come the 'WHITE KID" never got arrested for fighting on the train?????????
Assumed risk? Possibly of being arrested but shot in the back never. Police were out of line and they have a responsibility to maintain public safety, not become a source of public endangerment. This is not to say that they do not have a tough job but with great authority and power comes a higher standard of responsibility.
your "sources" aside, the video shows Grant cooperative, sitting down, and then taken out of his sitting position, put down on the pavement, and capped...........
1. Grant sat against the wall under threat of being tasered according to witness accounts.
2. Officers tried to handcuff Grant. Grant would not submit to an arrest. You can see from multiple video angles that Grant did not give the officers his hands.
3. Grant was on parole. The drugs in his system and the crack up his ass would be a violation of his parole. This would show why Grant did not want to be arrested.
@kcofvjo Grant did not have crack up his azz as you put it, yes he did have pain meds in his systems, a doctors prescription, that is not against the law. He was not resisting arrest, he was resisting being Tazed and begged them not to Taze him all the while Mehserle fought to remove his weapon from his holster while he was looking down at it(look at the video) and removed it from his holster, pointed it and pulled the trigger, that cop knew what he was doing the whole time, as Pirone knew it.
is he f****ng serious??????? k so basically he's telling us oscar grant had crack in his ass to imply he sells drugs rite?? basically. so y would someone that seems like he's in support of the officers release tell us this??? becuz every1 cares about an innocent citizen and ppl frown upon drug dealers.. F*** his source, im waiting on proof!!! N if that officer walks hunney, opd better watch out thats real the community is not going to go for that!!
I agree with your source he will walk because the new assigned judge will nor bow to public pressure but rely on the evidence and truth. That's what it's all about looking at it with an open mind.
sfpd carry guns that require them to, first, unsnap the safety strap on the holster,then, tilt the gun backwards in the holster BEFORE it can be released from the holster(some safety mechanism designed to keep ppl like dead prez from pulling it)
y dont bart pd have guns like this.y they carry guns?this would hav maybe saved oscar grant,and showed intent.
also,were bart police ever tested 4 drugs?last i checked steroids r injected via ones ass.mehserle looked high on em!
yeah zennie.the problem is ur credibility dude.u know,ur shoddy journalism?
remember now,u were the dude that believed that kevin guy who claimed to be sarah palins black baby daddy...u got sources? well,like public enemy said,"CANT TRUSS IT!"
I too found the story of the child to be a foolish thing to be reporting on. But if I remember that story , Zennie was making videos about another guys video where this other Black guy claimed to be the baby-Daddy.
Zennie also did come out with a statement where he says it was all a lie the guy made up to raise interest in the guy's music.
My problem with the whole matter is that children should be off limits.
They were used by Obama supporters, and shouldn't have been
its ur obvious opportunism zennie1962.u know,ur careerist goals.u seem willing 2 follow any lead & inflate it sans cross reference.i think u wanna b seen/heard 4 som reason.maybe ignored as a dark black child? i dunno...maybe u think u have a good speaking voice& deserve 2 be an nbc anchor.or maybe its simpler than that.maybe u think u'd make a cute scatman(i didnt say tom so dont ban me)besides,democracy is a forum where the best ideas win.cant be avoiding discourse/debate if u want credibility
your source better be very careful of what he is saying, slander is a very bad charge to have put against you. Oscar Grant has never in his life used or sold crack. Also when the first autopsy came out it would have been stated right then and there they found crack on him. So your source is wrong, and better believe that he doesn't have a suit filed against him. RIP OSCAR, you will never be forgotten
I don't believe that the source quoted by Zennie said that the place where they found the Crack on the kid was the way he 'used" the drugs, only that this seems now to be where the drugs were found...
Back in my day we used pockets, but to each his own.
@redmsthang The autopsy took place the following day in a controlled environment with witnesses, video, and tons of media. You're holding onto a pipe dream if you think this was a cover up. Mr. Grant is the ONLY person responsible for his death. His friends didn't make him resist being searched, his daughter didn't make him go out that night to party and get in a fight on the train, his mother didn't tell him to jerk his hand away and put it inside his jacket. Grant did this so save the blame
@CaptAdams35 Guess my pipe dream was real, crack was never found on his or in his body. What Zennie did was slander because he allowed himself to listen to someone who just wanted to slander Oscar as well. Show me in the video where he resisted being searched. And for your information they were never searched whiled on that platform. Mehserle searched Oscar after he shot him, handcuffed him then searched him, Ummm shouldn't it been the other way around? Handcuff, search, then shoot if need be?
@frankiej510 Oscar is my nephew that is how I know he didn't use or sell crack. He was afraid of that drug for he has seen what it can do to a human and he also knew if ever caught selling what the outcome would mean. Yes he was found with a pain medication in his system, but that was due to and injury he had sustained prior to his MURDER which was given to him by his doctor.
the way KTVU has handeled this case is discrase.... i never watch them again... KTVU and Mr.Burris are only winners here makeing millions on guys death... for Bart their reputation has clearly damaged... for Bart officer hes life is damaged either going to jail or have to live with this fame rest of hes life, hes family reciving death treats along hes wife and baby... and finally O.Grant life is taken.
Whatever the charge ends up being, they had better make sure he is found guilty, because it doesn't take a genius to figure out how people will react. If he's allowed to walk, it sends the message that cops can and will get away with murdering American citizens in broad daylight, in full view of the public.
Do you really think America can afford that? Especially right now? People better wake up and start smelling the rotten stench of reality here or it'll only get worse.
('If he's allowed to walk") If he is Not Guilty then he should be found Not Guilty, case closed!
As far as I can see from the official cop statements of the events of that night, it looks to me to be an open and shut case of an accidental shooting.
Nothing more...
Time will tell what we will learn in the trial, but so far I don't see much chance of a Guilty of murder finding.
@AlanMolstad well he was found GUILTY, but what I am so happy about is the FEDS are now coming in to investigate. So guess they feel that Mehserle, Chief Gee, DA Tom Orloff, Pirone and Domenici have done something wrong, Ummm cover up maybe?? This killing has been a coverup since day one, the truth is all going to come out in the open. All I can say is all you cops who want to play dirty, be careful for more and more cases are being reopened and cops or being found guily of the charges.
I got this off a site quoting the shooter's lawyer in court at the bail hearing -
"The bulk of the discovery, including witness and officer statements, seem to indicate that this young officer, who carried a taser for only a few shifts prior to this event, may have mistakenly deployed his service pistol rather than his taser, thus negating any criminal intent,"
I dont know the future, so I cant say how the trial will go, but based on the offical statements so far I would say that we should expect the DA to lower the charges to Manslaughter as it becomes more and more clear that this is the correct charge to bring.
My guess is that the cop may well plead guilty to the lower charge and this may not need to go to the jury
Yeah, go figure that the DEFENSE ATTORNEY would say something like that. Except that attorney is WRONG; criminal intent is not negated by Mehserle thinking he had his taser.
DRAWING his taser OR his pistol was a CRIMINAL ACT given the circumstances. As I keep telling you, since a taser is a deadly weapon, it doesn't matter that it MIGHT have been an accident that Mehserle actually drew his pistol. Taser=deadly weapon. Pistol=deadly weapon. No. Difference. Whatsoever. Stop defending this pig.
Listen dumbass, I don't know what planet you come from, but here on earth, it's not ok for a cop to tase someone on the ground for no good reason. Even with a good reason, a cop should think twice and he should only use lethal force as a last resort.
As to your asinine hunting comment, you don't go squirrel hunting with a taser because 1. you wouldn't be able to hit a squirrel with one & 2. it'd be DEAD and halfway cooked for you if you did hit one.
If Mehserle walks, I suspect that Oakland would be reduced to a pile of ash within a matter of days due to the public outrage. If anything, I'd expect the local and state officials to know that & aim to convict Mehserle because they know what could happen if they don't. The people aren't stupid enough to fall for all this BS about drugs in his body, etc. The fact stands, there was absolutely no excuse for Oscar Grant to be shot, by a pistol OR by a taser. Mehserle needs to be held accountable.
I'm sorry, but the world is not as principled and logical as you'd like to make it out to be. Mehserle could be found guilty even if he's not guilty (he is, by the way) and he could be found not guilty even if he is (he is, by the way, now I'll prove if very easily).
1. Suspect is face-down on ground, clearly subdued.
2. Officer Mehserle, in violation of standard practice, draws a DEADLY weapon (tasers DO kill people), and aims at the subdued suspect.
again, this will all be answered in the trial I'm sure.
And yes, I do hope that the cop gets a good jury and a fair trial.
Anything less and he has a built-in appeal.
As for the outcome?...I cant predict the future but as it stands now based on the official statements of the other cop I don't see him guilty of murder. But he does seem guilty of a careless use of his firearm leading to the death of another person.
It's a 2nd degree murder charge. Here's an example. I think there's an intruder on my property so I grab a rifle. I know its loaded, but I think the safety is on. I confront the person, pointing the gun at him. The gun accidentally fires and kills the person I thought was a burglar. Turns out the person was just stopping by to ask for directions. It was an accident! Oh, but the law calls that murder. The law will ask, "Why did you aim a loaded gun at someone? You must have intended to kill him."
Again, you are wrong on this because a taser is a deadly weapon. I don't give a shit if he thought he had his taser. YOU DON'T TASE A SUBDUED MAN LAYING FACE DOWN ON THE GROUND. Frankly, this business we have nowadays where cops tase people for looking at them cross-eyed needs to STOP NOW, because THAT mentality is what caused Mehserle to think it would be OK to pull his weapon on a restrained suspect.
You talk so much about the rule of law. Mehserle did not uphold the law you hold so dear.
I don't give a damn about the other cop & as far as I'm concerned, that other cop (we're talking about that pig with his KNEE on Oscar's NECK, no?) is guilty of police brutality (duh, the newer video shows him punching Oscar in the face a minute before he gets shot by Mehserle). Geeeeee, have you ever heard of the BLUE WALL OF SILENCE??
I am sick of these pigs covering up for each other but there's your rule of law for you. When the law doesn't respect the law, will the People? My guess is no.
Not for nothing, propheticlivity, but I think this case calls for a manslaughter charge and not second degree murder.
Second degree murder entails intentionally shooting someone to kill, succeeding, and doing so unlawfully. It's first degree murder minus the premeditation. That's the difference.
Manslaughter is killing someone unlawfully but ACCIDENTALLY. Now, evidence could surface to indicate Mehserle intentionally fired the gun and did so to kill Grant. But for now . . .
Not for nothing, but I think you're wrong & here's why. You don't point a LETHAL weapon at a human being's back, fire, and then say "Ooops! I didn't mean to kill him, it was an accident!" Ok?
Was pulling the weapon out of his holster an accident? NO! Was aiming it at Oscar's back an accident? NO! Was pulling the trigger an accident? MAYBE!
It DOES NOT MATTER because officer Mehserle's weapon SHOULD NOT HAVE BEEN DRAWN & as an OFFICER OF THE LAW, Mehserle should be held to a higher standard.
You guys keep repeating the mantra of "it doesn't matter because the weapon should not have been drawn in the first place." In itself, that is beyond question. But it doesn't prove murder. It just makes Mehserle guilty of at least involuntary manslaughter. (If Grant had not died, then the charge would be most likely be aggravated assault.)
What you have to remember is that in order to prove murder, you have to demonstrate, beyond a reasonable doubt, that Mehserle INTENDED TO KILL Grant. Even if he intentionally pulled the trigger, which I highly doubt, that doesn't prove he wanted Grant dead.
Further, what almost everyone here is missing is that we don't really know from the video if Mehserle even aimed the gun intentionally. If your gun is drawn, but not aimed, it's going to be pointed downward.
@DetectiveCrockett77 so why did he sign a document stating he INTENTIONALLY pulled his weapon? If a weapon is pulled it is intended to be used. And you can clearly see him pull his gun from the holster, point and aim, then pull the trigger, he didn't even hesitate before he pulled the trigger.
See, you're making the same simpleminded argument the other it-was-murder people are making.
Just because you intentionally pull your weapon, doesn't mean you are going to fire it. And just because you fire it--even if deliberately--doesn't mean you are doing so out of malice, or with a specific intent to kill. I have my doubts as to the Taser story myself--HOWEVER, even IF that story is BS, you still can't prove murder here.
Further, let's apply some logic and common sense here. First, Mehserle fired one shot, and it entered Grant's back and exited out his front side. What killed him was the bullet riccocheting off the concrete platform, back into his body, and puncturing his lung. You can't plan that.
Secondly, if you're going to murder someone via firearm, you don't fire just one shot, and you don't fire that shot in the person's back--too much of a chance of survival.
The only thing clear here is that if there weren't videos of it, Mehserle would still have a job and would probably be on patrol as we speak. It would have been swept under the rug, and people would have let it go because it'd be the cop's word against everyone else. As it stands, BART lied about several things in the first few days before the vids came out.
All they want to do is save their own ass. We the People cannot allow this shit to go on. The law exists for us, not the other way around.
I have yet to see any real spots where the officals at BART have done anything wrong here.
They checked into the shooting, along with 3 different investigations, they turned over their findings to the DA, and the DA filed charges based on them right away.
It was very quickly after an arrest warrant was issued they the arrest out of State was made.
Seems like the BART people are doing what we all want.
2. They failed to question Mehserle the night of the shooting - what was it, a week later that he was supposed to go in for an interview, and then he resigns without making ANY statement?
3. It took TWO WEEKS for an arrest warrant. SINCE WHEN DO THE COPS ALLOW MURDER SUSPECTS CAUGHT ON VIDEO TO ROAM FREE?
All I've seen since this senseless act is a bunch of excuses and conjecture. All I know is:
#1, as far as I can see, about the only videos that can be used in the trial will come from any cellphones taken that night by the cops, so thank God they thought to do that!
#2 Mr Mehserle received the benefit of legal council within minutes after the shooting and sought protection under the 5th Amendment.
#3 there were 3 different investigations running at the same time, and the DA filed charges the moment the results were turned over to him.
You are a fool and I am done discussing this with you. Johannes Mehserle is guilty of murdering an innocent human being. We all saw it with our own eyes, so thank god for that. We will see how this turns out, but the People will be heard if the People are not satisfied with the verdict. End of story. Good day.
PS - those cellphone videos were illegally seized by the cops and probably won't be admissible in court -- if they even still exist at all, which I am doubtful of
Some of us have to learn some things, others different things. As there are some of us who don't have to learn how to have a normal conversation with people without being personally insulting.
But what can you say?
Good manners and and the art of civil speech seem more and more to be lost on the next generation.
Being shocking is the standard manners of the internet.
I know the same words others know, I could be dropping the F-Bomb, using the N-word, talking about others, but I dont
We got to understand that manners count for something in this world.
A lack of an ability to have a normal conversation on the internet is going to spill over into our life off-line too.
Being able to stand up and debate and give a good account of yourself used to be something taught in school.
But it seems today that more and more people took their ability to discuss issues of the day from the manners learned on the playground, not the classroom.
@DetectiveCrockett77 then tell me why Mehserle looked down his right side, fumbled with the strap on his holster to release his gun. Look at the video you see him looking at what he is doing he saw himself pull his gun from the holster, and he saw the gun in his hand when he pointed it at Oscar's back. He knew what he was doing!!
He THOUGHT he knew what he was doing. The fact that he was looking at his right side doesn't really prove anything either way. He was struggling to cuff Grant, and continued to struggle with him as he drew his weapon. He was constantly looking both down at Grant, then at his weapon, back and forth. It's likely that given those circumstances, and within that short a time frame, Mehserle simply overlooked the fact that he was undoing a safety--or it could have already been off.
@DetectiveCrockett77 What in the fuck does that matter. He should be tried for capital murder. If convicted he should be killed. We all know that's not what happened, but what if it had not been a pig who murdered Oscar? The murderer would be sent to death row, or at least never see freedom again. You're argument makes no sense. He THOUGHT he knew what he was doing, so does every drunk driver.
The trial already took place. Keep up with things, huh?
And it's not "capital murder" in the slightest. Whether a killing is done by a cop or an ordinary civilian, murder involves INTENT TO KILL, or "malice aforethought," neither of which could be proven beyond a reasonable doubt in this particular case. Otherwise, if still unlawful, said killing is manslaughter (or "negligent homicide," depending upon the jurisdiction in question).
@Detective Crockett 77 Look man, I know the trial already happened, he is not scheduled to be sentenced until Nov. He will probably get 1 or 2 years at the most. What I meant by what I said is that the way I saw the video, he obviously pulled out his gun and meant to shoot the man. That is intent. If it was some rookie cop that did this I might believe that it was an accident. But this veteran, who graduated in the top 5% of his college, is not that stupid. He got pissed off and killed the man.
You can't establish intent simply because he happened to shoot him. Even if the "Taser Confusion" story is untrue, common sense should tell you that even a "professional" or "veteran" is capable of accidentally pulling the trigger. Remember, this happened amidst a struggle, which makes it all the more likely that the shot was accidental to begin with.
Further, it's intent to KILL that proves murder, not merely intent to SHOOT.
@Detective Crockett 77 Whatever dude, he still killed the poor bastard for no good reason. BTW, that's a pretty big fucking mistake. The worst thing about this whole episode to me is, it adds fuel to the fire for all of them thug gangsters that live over in that shithole. These people thrive on this shit. It has already caused much turmoil, and I guarantee that more innocent people will be murdered by these same gangsters crying about his death. And I'm not talking about his family.
Not to mention, do you honestly think an otherwise reasonably intelligent person, like Mehserle--his lapse in judgment here aside--is going to risk his career, his pension, his reputation, death threats, et al, by killing someone in cold blood IN FRONT OF SCORES OF EYEWITNESSES? Not to mention that Grant, although habitual petty criminal, was not exactly on America's Most Wanted.
It just doesn't add up to murder. The crime is manslaughter, most likely voluntary.
"Reasonably intelligent" people do things to risk their careers, pensions, reputations, lives, family, etc all the time! Are you kidding?
The real issue at hand is that police in America are out of control nowadays. There is a culture of brutality in many places. Oh yeah, I know they know they can't go around firing their guns at people, but now they're convinced that they can go around tasing people & it's ok. Look it up, it's been happening for years. And yes, PEOPLE DIE FROM BEING TASED.
I didn't say most people, nor did I say most intelligent people... What I said was "'reasonably intelligent' people do things ... all the time", meaning, go to any court on Monday morning and you will find reasonably intelligent people who did something stupid. Granted... most of those people didn't murder somebody, but I stand by my statement that reasonably intelligent people do actually do things to jeopardize their standing in society, and it does happen "all the time".
Det. I get what your saying but, we depend on the officers to be alert, conscience and aware of the situations and surroundings at all times, after all we depend on them to "Serve and Protect" us. Oscar Grant is my 3yr old grandson. We teach him to fear God and respect everyone. We instilled in him morals, we teach him manners and etiquette, we teach him to say yes maam/yes sir, no maam/no sir, we teach him self worth, we allow him to be himself at this early age and when he makes a mistake
or a bad choice or mistake we let him know that, that was a bad choice or a mistake sometimes we get the butt, sometimes we dont :-) but he know what we mean. A few years from now, he becomes a young man with no petty criminal record, no police record at all, a respectable young man making a difference in his community. He is driving home from his girlfriends house and he is pulled over for speeding 10miles over the limit, the officer is nasty, rude, crude, yelling and calling him a liar (more
than once), he answers the officer with a calm cool and collected tone and the officer calls him a lying bastard and tells him to get out the car,,,,,,,WHAT IS 'OSCAR GRANT' MY GRANDSON TO DO NOW???????? Should he get out the car and risk being beat and/or shot b/c -according to the officer- he charged the officer WHO ORDERED HIM TO GET OUT THE CAR; or does he stay in the car and be charged with NOT FOLLOWING A DIRECT ORDER from the officer - being none complacent if you will !!!!!! Oscar Grant
my Grandson know two things about the "Laws of the Land" (the police own personal laws); The Officers are Going Home, The People (Oscar Grant) May not Make It HOME!!!!!!! So please Det. Crockett, Alan Molstad, and Propheticlivity (couldn't break your name up), what are we to teach our SONS our OSCAR GRANT? I have no desire to bury another child/Oscar Grant
I do not mean to sound angry with any of you but I AM LIVID, OUTRAGED and yes ANGRY over this whole NIGHTMARE
@DetectiveCrockett77 yes I do, he lost control of the situation, he got caught up in the aggresiveness of his fellow officer's, I wouldn't be surprised that Pirone told him to shoot him. Pirone needs to be charged in this death as much as Mehserle was. Mehserle confessed to his first attorney and signed a document he INTENTIONALLY drew his weapon. A document that was not allowed in court as evidence. THIS IS ALL A COVER UP!!
...Mehserle fires into suspect's back, resulting in fatal injuries to the suspect. This is known as MURDER. Accidental or intentional? IT DOES NOT MATTER. Why? Because Mehserle's action to draw and then fire a deadly weapon in a situation that in no way warranted it does legally constitute MURDER. When average citizens accidentally kill someone, they are held accountable. So too, should Mehserle.
I know there is a chance he won't be found guilty, and that would be a miscarriage of justice.
("When average citizens accidentally kill someone...")
If the result of the trial is the understanding that Grant died because of a cop's mistake, then this would put it in the area of other types of errors people can make that kill none the less.
Like you thinking a red light had turned green and hitting someone who had the real green light.
You would be guilty of a mistake that led to a death, but you are not guilty of "murder"
Here's the problem with your analogy. The person who accidentally kills someone with a car did not INTENTIONALLY aim to strike the other person's car or to kill them.
When ANYONE draws a WEAPON, AIMS it at a human, PULLS the TRIGGER, and KILLS the person, that is considered an INTENTIONAL ACT. So he meant to fire a taser? DOES NOT MATTER. It's a deadly weapon. If his taser accidentally went off while he was standing over Grant, THAT would be akin to your analogy, but that's not what happened.
The point I was originally trying to make is that if Mehserle is found not guilty by a judge or jury, the People will consider it a miscarriage of justice and, although their anger will most likely be misplaced, they will seek to create their own form of justice in the absense of the justice we in the "civilised society" were supposed to be able to count on.
The cops that beat Rodney King were guilty. (Rodney King was a bit guilty himself.) Oscar Grant was 100% innocent. Big difference.
People will go batshit insane if Mehserle walks. Do you think the reaction to the Rodney King verdict was bad? You haven't seen anything like what people will do if justice doesn't happen here.
Finally, I have to reiterate to you: the taser defense does not protect Mehserle from a murder charge. A taser is a lethal weapon - it kills people; tons of precedent to show that as fact. Murder is murder, whether intentional or accidental.
Johannes must be held accountable or there is no justice.
The People are fine with the rule of law... usually. But it fails them too often. Usually... the People let it go. But they will not let this one go, and you need to understand this.
Your rule of law will not stop the riots and destruction that will occur if JUSTICE is not done in this case.
Mehserle is guilty of 2nd degree murder; yes, it was most likely accidental. But that's still 2nd degree murder.
I know how the justice system works, and I know it FAILS all the time. The People know about the "rule of law", and they also know how often it fails. Regardless of what the facts are, regardless of what the verdict is, ALL I am saying is that if a not guilty verdict is returned the People WILL be outraged, and they will express that outrage. The establishment that would normally be working to acquit Mehserle (regardless of his actual guilt) needs to take this into consideration.
Did a little checking and I found a site that has the offical statement of the other cop who had his knee on Grant.
From reading his statement of what happend it seems clear that the cop who pulled his gun and shot actually was going for his Taser.
If this is true then the murder charge is not the correct charge in this case.
If the facts in the trial prove that the shooter-cop thought he had pulled his Taser then you could well see a "Not Guilty" result on the murder charge.
I've been saying all along that the charge should be manslaughter, because you can't prove murder here.
That said, I'm not sure I believe the Taser argument--although I do think it's possible. I think Mehserle did indeed knowingly draw his gun, but simply did not mean to pull the trigger when it went off.
Oh, there's no doubt in my mind Mehserle should not even have pulled his weapon, gun OR Taser.
And you hit the nail on the head as to not knowing from the "video alone." This is where many YouTubers are logically bankrupt. Video, no matter how open-and-shut it may seem, rarely tells the whole story. You still have to investigate what LED UP TO the situation, and whether there are any other mitigating factors. This is what a lot of people fail to grasp.
Chances are that if this story of where the drugs were found is true, then we will begin to hear from grant's friends about other times Grant was known to carry in this manner.
We really know little of Grant.
People tend to paint shooting victims to appear to be Saints and the shooter as a Hitler.
but the results of looking for answers may show us that Grant was no Saint, and the cop is no Hitler.
And neither woke that morning thinking this story would be all they were know for.
I went to school w/ Oskar back in the day and he was always fighting people. We used to joke that we would "get oskar on you" to people. I wouldn't doubt that he would have been kind of aggressive with BART cops cuz I know I have messed w/ BART cops before. But as far as the crack it doesn't make sense that he would put it up his ass because of some BART cops. Honestly I don't think that one holds water. But idk.
Now I understand they were fighting on the BART, and that the train had been held at the station so that the cops could get there. So I guess there was plenty of time to hide drugs.
But Grant could not find anyone else to just hold the drugs?
He didnt think of a pocket?
It's New Years Eve and Grant is going to or coming from a party with his drugs up his butt?
Unless Grant was one sick-SICK puppy, I have to have my doubts about this whole story.
i am at 179 pounds with clothing, warm me up, lay a handcuffed drunk agressive motorcicle-gang member on the floor or an aryan-brotherhood guy and see how he could perform, at all, with bare hands, let alone 4 officers fully armed on my side.
this dude is crazy
terrtrulo1 1 month ago
Lies I knew him and played on the same hoop team at MT Eden no even ass holes
84gcode 4 months ago
now thats stupid is it not? lets make fun of a young man geting shot yes that always makes some satans-coocksuckers day
1duspiores 8 months ago
U R SUCH AN ASS...DOES THAT JUSTIFY HIM BEING SHOT AFTER BEING CONFINED!
MrHuggybrobear 8 months ago
FUCKIN HEAR SAY NIGGA, U LOOK LIKE U SMOKE CRACK AND MAN BUTT U BUG EYED FAGGOT. SHUT CHA GOD DAMN MOUTH UP BITCH!
pwimberly1 8 months ago
dude this black dude looks like he smokes crack he should just stfu
sk8ordie8388 9 months ago
You are full of it. Zennie is a race-baiter and not at all a trusted source.
donsf2003 10 months ago
Wait a minute...
The media said he had a prescription sedative patch on his body even though he didn't have a prescription for it. Then I hear he had Ketamine in his system.
Now you're telling me he had crack up his butt?
I smell a rat, same rat I smelled when the BART said their security cameras "MAGICALLY" quit working during the whole Oscar Grant shooting.
nikeakle 1 year ago 2
COME ON BRAH! HOW DO YOU KNOW THE POLICE DIDNT PUT THAT IN HIS ASS AFTER THE SHOOTING TO MAKE IT LOOK LIKE HE WAS A DRUG DEALER?!! THEY DO IT OFTEN THIS I KNOW FOR A FACT. ABOVE ALL OSCAR GRANT'S AGGRESSION DOESNT MEAN HE SHOULD BE SHOT AND KILLED, ESPECIALLY AFTER THE FACT THAT HE WAS HANDCUFFED!!!
lasalleis19 1 year ago
@lasalleis19 nigga osca ma nigga that nigga a G i went to skoo wid that nigga n Mt. Eden that nigga a trip i smoked wid that nigga one time i was hella zooted n i askd ma nigga fuk iz thiz shit cuz it wz sum bom ass budda n he said he laced the kush with kriss.
TyreeRealES510Hyphy 1 year ago
@TyreeRealES510Hyphy oooohh nigga you swear?!!!! i mean whatever you feel me all that is irrelevant because the pigs is still the pigs! murder has too many factors just if he had possesion or not!
lasalleis19 1 year ago
@lasalleis19 I was talkn bout ma time wid osca i dun giv fuk bout no pigz. Im sayn osca was known for doin kriss
TyreeRealES510Hyphy 1 year ago
Comment removed
seattlehawkins 1 year ago
@seattlehawkins what does that even mean???
lasalleis19 1 year ago
I know this case is old,but it was murder plain and simple!! Why the dirty cop run off to Nevada? The farker should of got the dang chair..
Thugglifeinme 1 year ago
I DONT GIVE A HOOT HOW YOU CALL IT, IT PLAIN AS S**T STANK IT WAS MUDER.
Thechill12 1 year ago
@zennie62 who really cares if your source is black, is that suppose to justify that the information was correct? Ok now the trial is over and when the pathologist was on the stand not once did he mention that they found Crack in Oscar's body. So looks as though YOU and your SOURCE are wrong, you might want to think about really investigating the things your source tells you, for it was not the truth.
redmsthang 1 year ago
As I expected, the autopsy report never showed anything that his UNNAMED source suggested, & as a journalist I would never report something so prejudicial against a deceased victim on the strength of 1 source, w/o any corroborating evidence. I hope this is a lesson learned, or perhaps u deliberately did it to generate traffic & hits. Today u owe the family an apology for your salacious reporting & spreading such repulsive information about a person who never deserved 2 b killed.
streetgangs 1 year ago 10
You would make a good investigative reporter, but you have to stick to the facts only. Good job on the video.
TheJoeyD27 1 year ago
Who cares if he had crack that didn't mean he gets a death sentence, crack is actually the white-mans poison they don't want crack to go away they know its enslaving black America and keeping us down!
luckymike9 1 year ago
THE WHOLE CASE HINGES ON ..HE THOUGHT IT WAS HIS TASER....IF ANOUTHER COP HAS AHOLD OF HIM AT THE SAME TIME ...WOULDN'T HE GET ELECTRICUTED TOO??? IS THAT PROTICAL???
toddholladay 1 year ago
@toddholladay no he would not, they showed video demonstrations in court where people are deliberately being TASED while being held by two people on each side to prevent them from falling down, and they are not effected by the shock of 50,000 volts of electricity. Also electrocuted means to be killed by electricity, i think you meant shocked.
streetgangs 1 year ago
So then at the end of the day, The Retarded cop shot the crack head nigga.
IH8DANz 1 year ago
@zennie62 yo slave your source is not black, and nor are you black, but you ugly as hell, i dont know why you want to preach against your brother but i really hope, weather the county police, or cia, is paying you well with our tax money, and there is no point of trying to prove a case to an uncle tom, but if you think its fair for someone to get shot, with handcuffs on, then if your life is put on oscars shoes i would laugh my ass off, and my source would say you deserved it. lol
GURULUDE1 1 year ago
@zennie62
....umm, yeah maybe you stuff your crack up your ass for a night on the town....hey party on dude, whatever trips your nigger ass....but you smearin shit from your source's ass, what can i say....i say the better part of you ran down yo momma's ass....though looking at the shape of your head, congrats on surviving the coat hanger, ya nigga shill.
F250badgirl 1 year ago
man you smoking crack
MrUrbanMedia 1 year ago
That's cop was a retard!
MrUrbanMedia 1 year ago
Good riddance to that piece of trash. I hope his dumb ass is being raped in hell.
queueupladeez 1 year ago
shut the fuck up sucka ass nigga
cherylh88 1 year ago
your source was so wrong about 1) cocaine was not ever mentioned in any pre-trial motion or by the coroner and the defense would have LOVED to exploit this point 2) KTVU was not hiding any videos 3) 6 videos eventually surfaced, the last being the Tommy Cross video on my site, 4) The evidence in trial points to Grant not being aggressive. 5) Mehserle will be found guilty of something, there is no way he walks.
streetgangs 1 year ago
@zennie62 I hate niggas like you yo! you initiated tapdancing/buckdancing for the cracker ass motherfucker. With all the power in The Universe that conscious brothers like I can muster, We will get rid of you Sorry Ass Sellout Satanic/Demonic Negroes dude, watch! you going to the same hell the cracker going or worse, and I damn your fucking soul to the deepest depth's of Hades you motherfucker!
NegroXFile 1 year ago
@zennie62 Any Conscious Black person with 20/20 vision can see that you're a Boule Uncle Tom's Cabin ass nigga dude, and you have to be dealt with. You are a detriment to Black people and you mean us Black no good! If I had a sword and was near be Id behead your motherfucking ass nigga!
NegroXFile 1 year ago
Your source is pissing conscious brothers like me the fuck off man, what you assholes trying to justify this murder? The Police job is to arrest and unarmed person whom they see as a criminal, not murder them, this guy on this video is a Boule asshole, my source my motherfucking ass, who the fuck are you talking about some source you fucking asshole! your source is your caucasian Templar counterparts
NegroXFile 1 year ago
@NegroXFile Bernard....
TheHealthHopNetwork 6 months ago
everything was ok until the billy bad azz walked up and pointed at oscar to say thats the nigga right there than oscar is sitting down on the floor looking up at the cop who are in a better advantege push him on his face billy bad azz puts his knee on his neck so the other cop had two free hands to pullout his gun and fire than they both stand up and you can see he was handcuffed if this cop gets away with this and blackman do nothing that is the damm shame fuck anybody that can't see the truth
yoazzma 2 years ago
@yoazzma Is that what you really think happened? Watch the other videos because the only shame here is your statement. 1) billy badass didn't put his knee in Oscar's neck until he resisted being searched by the first officer 2) the officer didn't pull his gun until Grant jerked his hand away and put it under his left side jacket 3) he wasn't handcuffed until after he was shot 4) the shame is you trying to make fiction into a fact. I respect people's opinions, until they ignore the obvious.
CaptAdams35 1 year ago
"my source contends..."
fuk u
another dead troublemaking nig
ho-hum
iluvhotblondes 2 years ago
oscar grant -
yawn boring
iluvhotblondes 2 years ago
u dumbass how caan he be agressive when they shot him he was in handcuffs on my mamaz ya dumb there aint no excuse fukk the pigs R.I.P OSCAR!!!
510kream 2 years ago
HE WASNT AGGRESIVE
x4JOZ215 2 years ago 2
@x4JOZ215 Do you consider pulling away from the officer who was trying to search him as being non-aggressive? Or do you consider him trying to push the officer off of him when he was trying to pat him down as being non-aggressive? Maybe when he jerked his hand away from the officer that was trying to cuff him in order to be able to search him, you'd consider that non-aggressive? Run the violent crime stats there within a 6 block radius, it's staggering how much aggression there is.
CaptAdams35 1 year ago
It took a minute, but you got there.
It's hard to be objective when you watch the response of the crowd.
A crowd will turn on a trouble maker in a second, instead they turned on men with guns.
BSACAPITAL 2 years ago 2
Doesn't matter what was found in/on the man's body. THAT WAS A HOMOCIDE ! PERIOD !
911WasDoneByMenWhite 2 years ago
Part 2: Continued
C) Most judges are republicans, most was in the prosicuters officers procecuters are on the side of the police.
so... A) Money B) Fear & C) Racism & biast reasons is why cops dont get convicted.
and the one that are convicted are the one that didn't "PLAY BY THE RULES". I know, I am a former Officer who did not play by the rules and wanted to be an honest officer.
LETS BE REAL PEOPLE.
Lets be true.
JfarmerJr 2 years ago
@JfarmerJr and thank you for stepping up and saying that. We all know there are good cops and Racist Cops. Mehserle, Pirone and Dominici ARE ALL RACIST COPS. Guess they played by the rules until they screwed up on live video camera and their chief of police Gee could not cover up the story, so he had no choice but to have them ALL fired from the force. Again thanks for being REAL...
redmsthang 1 year ago
Here is waht my sources say.
A) if all cops in a city who harms a civilian is convicted for their wrong doings that city will be BANK RUPPED, so judges make sure that they have a job by playing part of the officers wrong doing by getting the cop off. some are going to say that a jury convicts not a judge. True but the judge controls the jury.
b) the cops are the largest gang in the U.S. there are more cops than judges. some judges fear for their lives.
to Continued.........
JfarmerJr 2 years ago
Son,
It's BANKRUPT, not "bank rupped."
DetectiveCrockett77 2 years ago
Oscar Grant was fighting on a Bart Train. I was on a Bart Train the same day. If you fight on a train, think about how frightening it would be to be a passenger? On OUR car WE saw a fight. We were scared. Oscar Grant had a liability and assumed risk when he acted the fool on that train. Oscar Grant was also found with ketamine in his system. He didn't DESERVE to get shot, but he certainly had a part in his own demise. You reap what you sow.
PaloAltoCalif 2 years ago 23
Exactly. Two sides to the coin, as they say.
DetectiveCrockett77 2 years ago
@PaloAltoCalif According to testimony it was a white guy named David (aka Deisal) that had Oscar in a headlock so it was the other person who was the aggressor. That came out on Wednesday in court in Los Angeles.
streetgangs 1 year ago
@streetgangs Oscar and his friends were jumped by these guys they had every right to protect themselves from them. But that is neither here nor there, what everyone is not listening to is these kids were pulled from the train without even being identified by the person or person's who called into the dispatcher of the fight. The cops didn't even know if they had the right kids, they were not identified at all on that platform. It could of been any one of us!!
redmsthang 1 year ago
@PaloAltoCalif For real...FUCK YOU, he didnt deserve that shit, so what if he was fighting, i fought n school at the mall the park doesnt justify MURDER!!!!!!
TheKrissibitch 1 year ago
@PaloAltoCalif so you tell me that when someone attacks you, that you would not defend yourself from the attacker? Oscar was jumped by this individual an he was defending himself as the other few that were fighting. If you did your research Oscar was in a headlock from this individual he was trying to get loose. So I guess he just should of let these creeps just beat him and his girlfriend up, oh so tell me this, how come the 'WHITE KID" never got arrested for fighting on the train?????????
redmsthang 1 year ago
@PaloAltoCalif
Assumed risk? Possibly of being arrested but shot in the back never. Police were out of line and they have a responsibility to maintain public safety, not become a source of public endangerment. This is not to say that they do not have a tough job but with great authority and power comes a higher standard of responsibility.
varhamur 11 months ago
wat the fuck is wrong w/your eyes?fukin black conehead!!!! is the voice real??
mikul515 2 years ago
your "sources" aside, the video shows Grant cooperative, sitting down, and then taken out of his sitting position, put down on the pavement, and capped...........
BeauJames59 2 years ago
1. Grant sat against the wall under threat of being tasered according to witness accounts.
2. Officers tried to handcuff Grant. Grant would not submit to an arrest. You can see from multiple video angles that Grant did not give the officers his hands.
3. Grant was on parole. The drugs in his system and the crack up his ass would be a violation of his parole. This would show why Grant did not want to be arrested.
kcofvjo 2 years ago
the video shows Grant cooperative, sitting down, and then taken out of his sitting position, put down on the pavement, and capped...........
BeauJames59 2 years ago
@kcofvjo Grant did not have crack up his azz as you put it, yes he did have pain meds in his systems, a doctors prescription, that is not against the law. He was not resisting arrest, he was resisting being Tazed and begged them not to Taze him all the while Mehserle fought to remove his weapon from his holster while he was looking down at it(look at the video) and removed it from his holster, pointed it and pulled the trigger, that cop knew what he was doing the whole time, as Pirone knew it.
redmsthang 1 year ago
is he f****ng serious??????? k so basically he's telling us oscar grant had crack in his ass to imply he sells drugs rite?? basically. so y would someone that seems like he's in support of the officers release tell us this??? becuz every1 cares about an innocent citizen and ppl frown upon drug dealers.. F*** his source, im waiting on proof!!! N if that officer walks hunney, opd better watch out thats real the community is not going to go for that!!
5104560711 3 years ago
KTVU is absolutely awful. They pray upon hysteria and stupidity.
james662662662 3 years ago
I agree with your source he will walk because the new assigned judge will nor bow to public pressure but rely on the evidence and truth. That's what it's all about looking at it with an open mind.
budwhite451 3 years ago
sfpd carry guns that require them to, first, unsnap the safety strap on the holster,then, tilt the gun backwards in the holster BEFORE it can be released from the holster(some safety mechanism designed to keep ppl like dead prez from pulling it)
y dont bart pd have guns like this.y they carry guns?this would hav maybe saved oscar grant,and showed intent.
also,were bart police ever tested 4 drugs?last i checked steroids r injected via ones ass.mehserle looked high on em!
ps burris is overated
SheWhoSavesThEarth 3 years ago
yeah zennie.the problem is ur credibility dude.u know,ur shoddy journalism?
remember now,u were the dude that believed that kevin guy who claimed to be sarah palins black baby daddy...u got sources? well,like public enemy said,"CANT TRUSS IT!"
SheWhoSavesThEarth 3 years ago
an interesting point.
I too found the story of the child to be a foolish thing to be reporting on. But if I remember that story , Zennie was making videos about another guys video where this other Black guy claimed to be the baby-Daddy.
Zennie also did come out with a statement where he says it was all a lie the guy made up to raise interest in the guy's music.
My problem with the whole matter is that children should be off limits.
They were used by Obama supporters, and shouldn't have been
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
its ur obvious opportunism zennie1962.u know,ur careerist goals.u seem willing 2 follow any lead & inflate it sans cross reference.i think u wanna b seen/heard 4 som reason.maybe ignored as a dark black child? i dunno...maybe u think u have a good speaking voice& deserve 2 be an nbc anchor.or maybe its simpler than that.maybe u think u'd make a cute scatman(i didnt say tom so dont ban me)besides,democracy is a forum where the best ideas win.cant be avoiding discourse/debate if u want credibility
SheWhoSavesThEarth 3 years ago
PLEASE SHOW ME WERE TO FIND THIS REPORT...
(bullshit)
billynutz567 3 years ago
I dont think it's out in a report yet...Im not sure.
I have not heard it was out anyway...
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
eh?
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
your source better be very careful of what he is saying, slander is a very bad charge to have put against you. Oscar Grant has never in his life used or sold crack. Also when the first autopsy came out it would have been stated right then and there they found crack on him. So your source is wrong, and better believe that he doesn't have a suit filed against him. RIP OSCAR, you will never be forgotten
redmsthang 3 years ago
an un-named source cant be guilty of slander...
Reporters always protect their sources.
I don't believe that the source quoted by Zennie said that the place where they found the Crack on the kid was the way he 'used" the drugs, only that this seems now to be where the drugs were found...
Back in my day we used pockets, but to each his own.
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
@redmsthang The autopsy took place the following day in a controlled environment with witnesses, video, and tons of media. You're holding onto a pipe dream if you think this was a cover up. Mr. Grant is the ONLY person responsible for his death. His friends didn't make him resist being searched, his daughter didn't make him go out that night to party and get in a fight on the train, his mother didn't tell him to jerk his hand away and put it inside his jacket. Grant did this so save the blame
CaptAdams35 1 year ago
@CaptAdams35 Guess my pipe dream was real, crack was never found on his or in his body. What Zennie did was slander because he allowed himself to listen to someone who just wanted to slander Oscar as well. Show me in the video where he resisted being searched. And for your information they were never searched whiled on that platform. Mehserle searched Oscar after he shot him, handcuffed him then searched him, Ummm shouldn't it been the other way around? Handcuff, search, then shoot if need be?
redmsthang 1 year ago
@redmsthang How do you know that Grant didn't sell crack and use it?
frankiej510 1 year ago
@frankiej510 Oscar is my nephew that is how I know he didn't use or sell crack. He was afraid of that drug for he has seen what it can do to a human and he also knew if ever caught selling what the outcome would mean. Yes he was found with a pain medication in his system, but that was due to and injury he had sustained prior to his MURDER which was given to him by his doctor.
redmsthang 1 year ago
the way KTVU has handeled this case is discrase.... i never watch them again... KTVU and Mr.Burris are only winners here makeing millions on guys death... for Bart their reputation has clearly damaged... for Bart officer hes life is damaged either going to jail or have to live with this fame rest of hes life, hes family reciving death treats along hes wife and baby... and finally O.Grant life is taken.
AND838 3 years ago
Whatever the charge ends up being, they had better make sure he is found guilty, because it doesn't take a genius to figure out how people will react. If he's allowed to walk, it sends the message that cops can and will get away with murdering American citizens in broad daylight, in full view of the public.
Do you really think America can afford that? Especially right now? People better wake up and start smelling the rotten stench of reality here or it'll only get worse.
propheticlivity 3 years ago
('If he's allowed to walk") If he is Not Guilty then he should be found Not Guilty, case closed!
As far as I can see from the official cop statements of the events of that night, it looks to me to be an open and shut case of an accidental shooting.
Nothing more...
Time will tell what we will learn in the trial, but so far I don't see much chance of a Guilty of murder finding.
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
@AlanMolstad well he was found GUILTY, but what I am so happy about is the FEDS are now coming in to investigate. So guess they feel that Mehserle, Chief Gee, DA Tom Orloff, Pirone and Domenici have done something wrong, Ummm cover up maybe?? This killing has been a coverup since day one, the truth is all going to come out in the open. All I can say is all you cops who want to play dirty, be careful for more and more cases are being reopened and cops or being found guily of the charges.
redmsthang 1 year ago
I got this off a site quoting the shooter's lawyer in court at the bail hearing -
"The bulk of the discovery, including witness and officer statements, seem to indicate that this young officer, who carried a taser for only a few shifts prior to this event, may have mistakenly deployed his service pistol rather than his taser, thus negating any criminal intent,"
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
Manslaughter (homicide without malice aforethought)
or
Murder, (unlawful premeditated killing of a human being by a human being)
If the truth is that this young cop just made a mistake when reaching for his TASER, then he clearly is NOT GUILTY of Murder,
while yet very much guilty of the lower charge of Manslaughter
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
I dont know the future, so I cant say how the trial will go, but based on the offical statements so far I would say that we should expect the DA to lower the charges to Manslaughter as it becomes more and more clear that this is the correct charge to bring.
My guess is that the cop may well plead guilty to the lower charge and this may not need to go to the jury
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
Yeah, go figure that the DEFENSE ATTORNEY would say something like that. Except that attorney is WRONG; criminal intent is not negated by Mehserle thinking he had his taser.
DRAWING his taser OR his pistol was a CRIMINAL ACT given the circumstances. As I keep telling you, since a taser is a deadly weapon, it doesn't matter that it MIGHT have been an accident that Mehserle actually drew his pistol. Taser=deadly weapon. Pistol=deadly weapon. No. Difference. Whatsoever. Stop defending this pig.
propheticlivity 3 years ago
("Taser=deadly weapon. Pistol=deadly weapon. No. Difference. Whatsoever")
Every once in a while I get to read something on the internet that is just the most funny thing I have ever seen in a long time...LOL
No difference?...right,LOL
Thats why I always go squirrel hunting with my dad's old Taser...LOL
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
Know how to google? Try "killed+by+taser"
Listen dumbass, I don't know what planet you come from, but here on earth, it's not ok for a cop to tase someone on the ground for no good reason. Even with a good reason, a cop should think twice and he should only use lethal force as a last resort.
As to your asinine hunting comment, you don't go squirrel hunting with a taser because 1. you wouldn't be able to hit a squirrel with one & 2. it'd be DEAD and halfway cooked for you if you did hit one.
propheticlivity 3 years ago
Oh what a joy it is to be able to have a nice conversation on a variety of topics with everyone always so respectful of others.
Brings a tear to my eye when I think about how much such posts mean to me.
Yes, I feel a real tear is about to fall from my eye...
Phuuuffffft,
Oh it was just gas, never mind.
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
If Mehserle walks, I suspect that Oakland would be reduced to a pile of ash within a matter of days due to the public outrage. If anything, I'd expect the local and state officials to know that & aim to convict Mehserle because they know what could happen if they don't. The people aren't stupid enough to fall for all this BS about drugs in his body, etc. The fact stands, there was absolutely no excuse for Oscar Grant to be shot, by a pistol OR by a taser. Mehserle needs to be held accountable.
propheticlivity 3 years ago
The only reason for Mehserle to be found Not Guilty is if he is Not Guilty...
This will be up to the trial to find out.
If it turns out that he did only make a mistake and reached for the wrong weapon and not his TASER, then he is not guilty of murder.
Guilty of something lesser, but not murder.
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
I'm sorry, but the world is not as principled and logical as you'd like to make it out to be. Mehserle could be found guilty even if he's not guilty (he is, by the way) and he could be found not guilty even if he is (he is, by the way, now I'll prove if very easily).
1. Suspect is face-down on ground, clearly subdued.
2. Officer Mehserle, in violation of standard practice, draws a DEADLY weapon (tasers DO kill people), and aims at the subdued suspect.
3. Mehserle fires into suspect's back...
propheticlivity 3 years ago
again, this will all be answered in the trial I'm sure.
And yes, I do hope that the cop gets a good jury and a fair trial.
Anything less and he has a built-in appeal.
As for the outcome?...I cant predict the future but as it stands now based on the official statements of the other cop I don't see him guilty of murder. But he does seem guilty of a careless use of his firearm leading to the death of another person.
Im not sure what charge that is?
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
It's a 2nd degree murder charge. Here's an example. I think there's an intruder on my property so I grab a rifle. I know its loaded, but I think the safety is on. I confront the person, pointing the gun at him. The gun accidentally fires and kills the person I thought was a burglar. Turns out the person was just stopping by to ask for directions. It was an accident! Oh, but the law calls that murder. The law will ask, "Why did you aim a loaded gun at someone? You must have intended to kill him."
propheticlivity 3 years ago
("so I grab a rifle")
You grabbed a gun...from then on you know you got a gun.
Thats a bit different than the BART accident.
In the BART shooting we may find that the cop was 100% sure he had pulled and fired his TASER not his real gun.
If this is true, then we have a totally accidental shooting where the cop was just as shocked as anyone who sees the video.
So that would make him clearly NOT GUILTY of murder.
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
So at most it seems from the offical statements that the BART cop is guilty of an accidental shooting.
An accidental shooting is a fact of life for big and small cities.
It happens,
Yes it's painfull for the family, and yes you can charge the shooter with a lower charge.
I would guess probation is clearly called for.
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
Again, you are wrong on this because a taser is a deadly weapon. I don't give a shit if he thought he had his taser. YOU DON'T TASE A SUBDUED MAN LAYING FACE DOWN ON THE GROUND. Frankly, this business we have nowadays where cops tase people for looking at them cross-eyed needs to STOP NOW, because THAT mentality is what caused Mehserle to think it would be OK to pull his weapon on a restrained suspect.
You talk so much about the rule of law. Mehserle did not uphold the law you hold so dear.
propheticlivity 3 years ago
From the website I have here I can read the offical statement of the other cop.
He says that both he and Mehserle were talking about the use of the TASER on Grant.
The other cop says that he and Mehserle felt at the time that they should use the TASER.
From this statement it seems clear to me that shooting Grant was just an accident of a younger cop.
I cant predict how the trial will go, but I guess I could well see a NOT GUILTY finding on the murder charge,
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
I don't give a damn about the other cop & as far as I'm concerned, that other cop (we're talking about that pig with his KNEE on Oscar's NECK, no?) is guilty of police brutality (duh, the newer video shows him punching Oscar in the face a minute before he gets shot by Mehserle). Geeeeee, have you ever heard of the BLUE WALL OF SILENCE??
I am sick of these pigs covering up for each other but there's your rule of law for you. When the law doesn't respect the law, will the People? My guess is no.
propheticlivity 3 years ago
Not for nothing, propheticlivity, but I think this case calls for a manslaughter charge and not second degree murder.
Second degree murder entails intentionally shooting someone to kill, succeeding, and doing so unlawfully. It's first degree murder minus the premeditation. That's the difference.
Manslaughter is killing someone unlawfully but ACCIDENTALLY. Now, evidence could surface to indicate Mehserle intentionally fired the gun and did so to kill Grant. But for now . . .
DetectiveCrockett77 3 years ago
Not for nothing, but I think you're wrong & here's why. You don't point a LETHAL weapon at a human being's back, fire, and then say "Ooops! I didn't mean to kill him, it was an accident!" Ok?
Was pulling the weapon out of his holster an accident? NO! Was aiming it at Oscar's back an accident? NO! Was pulling the trigger an accident? MAYBE!
It DOES NOT MATTER because officer Mehserle's weapon SHOULD NOT HAVE BEEN DRAWN & as an OFFICER OF THE LAW, Mehserle should be held to a higher standard.
propheticlivity 3 years ago
See this is where you people are wrong.
You guys keep repeating the mantra of "it doesn't matter because the weapon should not have been drawn in the first place." In itself, that is beyond question. But it doesn't prove murder. It just makes Mehserle guilty of at least involuntary manslaughter. (If Grant had not died, then the charge would be most likely be aggravated assault.)
(continued)
DetectiveCrockett77 3 years ago
("Mehserle guilty of at least involuntary manslaughter")
Yes, I tend to agree.
From the moment I heard the DA charged the cop with the murder of Grant I knew that this had to be an error on the DA's part.
Unless the charges are dropped down to manslaughter there is a very real chance that the case against Mehserle will cave in.
AlanMolstad 3 years ago 2
(part 2)
What you have to remember is that in order to prove murder, you have to demonstrate, beyond a reasonable doubt, that Mehserle INTENDED TO KILL Grant. Even if he intentionally pulled the trigger, which I highly doubt, that doesn't prove he wanted Grant dead.
Further, what almost everyone here is missing is that we don't really know from the video if Mehserle even aimed the gun intentionally. If your gun is drawn, but not aimed, it's going to be pointed downward.
(cont'd)
DetectiveCrockett77 3 years ago
("you have to demonstrate, beyond a reasonable doubt, that Mehserle INTENDED TO KILL...")
If this is true, (and I have no reason to doubt it) then there is a very real chance that Mehserle will walk on the murder charge.
Clearly this is not a case of murder.
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
@AlanMolstad guess what, he is going to do time, if not at the state level he will get it at the FEDERAL level.
redmsthang 1 year ago
@DetectiveCrockett77 so why did he sign a document stating he INTENTIONALLY pulled his weapon? If a weapon is pulled it is intended to be used. And you can clearly see him pull his gun from the holster, point and aim, then pull the trigger, he didn't even hesitate before he pulled the trigger.
redmsthang 1 year ago
@redmsthang
See, you're making the same simpleminded argument the other it-was-murder people are making.
Just because you intentionally pull your weapon, doesn't mean you are going to fire it. And just because you fire it--even if deliberately--doesn't mean you are doing so out of malice, or with a specific intent to kill. I have my doubts as to the Taser story myself--HOWEVER, even IF that story is BS, you still can't prove murder here.
DetectiveCrockett77 1 year ago
(part 3)
Further, let's apply some logic and common sense here. First, Mehserle fired one shot, and it entered Grant's back and exited out his front side. What killed him was the bullet riccocheting off the concrete platform, back into his body, and puncturing his lung. You can't plan that.
Secondly, if you're going to murder someone via firearm, you don't fire just one shot, and you don't fire that shot in the person's back--too much of a chance of survival.
(cont'd)
DetectiveCrockett77 3 years ago
good point, clearly this was an accident.
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
The only thing clear here is that if there weren't videos of it, Mehserle would still have a job and would probably be on patrol as we speak. It would have been swept under the rug, and people would have let it go because it'd be the cop's word against everyone else. As it stands, BART lied about several things in the first few days before the vids came out.
All they want to do is save their own ass. We the People cannot allow this shit to go on. The law exists for us, not the other way around.
propheticlivity 3 years ago
I have yet to see any real spots where the officals at BART have done anything wrong here.
They checked into the shooting, along with 3 different investigations, they turned over their findings to the DA, and the DA filed charges based on them right away.
It was very quickly after an arrest warrant was issued they the arrest out of State was made.
Seems like the BART people are doing what we all want.
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
Where should I start?
1. They lied about their cameras.
2. They failed to question Mehserle the night of the shooting - what was it, a week later that he was supposed to go in for an interview, and then he resigns without making ANY statement?
3. It took TWO WEEKS for an arrest warrant. SINCE WHEN DO THE COPS ALLOW MURDER SUSPECTS CAUGHT ON VIDEO TO ROAM FREE?
All I've seen since this senseless act is a bunch of excuses and conjecture. All I know is:
I SAW A MAN GET MURDERED, PLAIN AND SIMPLE
propheticlivity 3 years ago
#1, as far as I can see, about the only videos that can be used in the trial will come from any cellphones taken that night by the cops, so thank God they thought to do that!
#2 Mr Mehserle received the benefit of legal council within minutes after the shooting and sought protection under the 5th Amendment.
#3 there were 3 different investigations running at the same time, and the DA filed charges the moment the results were turned over to him.
So far they have been doing this case alright
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
You are a fool and I am done discussing this with you. Johannes Mehserle is guilty of murdering an innocent human being. We all saw it with our own eyes, so thank god for that. We will see how this turns out, but the People will be heard if the People are not satisfied with the verdict. End of story. Good day.
PS - those cellphone videos were illegally seized by the cops and probably won't be admissible in court -- if they even still exist at all, which I am doubtful of
propheticlivity 3 years ago
You have much to learn my young Padawan...
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
This is about life, death, and reality, not a science fiction story. We all have much to learn.
propheticlivity 3 years ago
Some of us have to learn some things, others different things. As there are some of us who don't have to learn how to have a normal conversation with people without being personally insulting.
But what can you say?
Good manners and and the art of civil speech seem more and more to be lost on the next generation.
Being shocking is the standard manners of the internet.
I know the same words others know, I could be dropping the F-Bomb, using the N-word, talking about others, but I dont
..
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
We got to become an adult sooner or later.
We got to understand that manners count for something in this world.
A lack of an ability to have a normal conversation on the internet is going to spill over into our life off-line too.
Being able to stand up and debate and give a good account of yourself used to be something taught in school.
But it seems today that more and more people took their ability to discuss issues of the day from the manners learned on the playground, not the classroom.
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
@DetectiveCrockett77 then tell me why Mehserle looked down his right side, fumbled with the strap on his holster to release his gun. Look at the video you see him looking at what he is doing he saw himself pull his gun from the holster, and he saw the gun in his hand when he pointed it at Oscar's back. He knew what he was doing!!
redmsthang 1 year ago
@redmsthang
He THOUGHT he knew what he was doing. The fact that he was looking at his right side doesn't really prove anything either way. He was struggling to cuff Grant, and continued to struggle with him as he drew his weapon. He was constantly looking both down at Grant, then at his weapon, back and forth. It's likely that given those circumstances, and within that short a time frame, Mehserle simply overlooked the fact that he was undoing a safety--or it could have already been off.
DetectiveCrockett77 1 year ago
@DetectiveCrockett77 What in the fuck does that matter. He should be tried for capital murder. If convicted he should be killed. We all know that's not what happened, but what if it had not been a pig who murdered Oscar? The murderer would be sent to death row, or at least never see freedom again. You're argument makes no sense. He THOUGHT he knew what he was doing, so does every drunk driver.
rebelnomo 1 year ago
@rebelnomo
The trial already took place. Keep up with things, huh?
And it's not "capital murder" in the slightest. Whether a killing is done by a cop or an ordinary civilian, murder involves INTENT TO KILL, or "malice aforethought," neither of which could be proven beyond a reasonable doubt in this particular case. Otherwise, if still unlawful, said killing is manslaughter (or "negligent homicide," depending upon the jurisdiction in question).
DetectiveCrockett77 1 year ago
@Detective Crockett 77 Look man, I know the trial already happened, he is not scheduled to be sentenced until Nov. He will probably get 1 or 2 years at the most. What I meant by what I said is that the way I saw the video, he obviously pulled out his gun and meant to shoot the man. That is intent. If it was some rookie cop that did this I might believe that it was an accident. But this veteran, who graduated in the top 5% of his college, is not that stupid. He got pissed off and killed the man.
rebelnomo 1 year ago
@rebelnomo
No, it is not.
You can't establish intent simply because he happened to shoot him. Even if the "Taser Confusion" story is untrue, common sense should tell you that even a "professional" or "veteran" is capable of accidentally pulling the trigger. Remember, this happened amidst a struggle, which makes it all the more likely that the shot was accidental to begin with.
Further, it's intent to KILL that proves murder, not merely intent to SHOOT.
DetectiveCrockett77 1 year ago
@Detective Crockett 77 Whatever dude, he still killed the poor bastard for no good reason. BTW, that's a pretty big fucking mistake. The worst thing about this whole episode to me is, it adds fuel to the fire for all of them thug gangsters that live over in that shithole. These people thrive on this shit. It has already caused much turmoil, and I guarantee that more innocent people will be murdered by these same gangsters crying about his death. And I'm not talking about his family.
rebelnomo 1 year ago
@rebelnomo
I tend to agree with you there.
DetectiveCrockett77 1 year ago
(part 4--conclusion)
Not to mention, do you honestly think an otherwise reasonably intelligent person, like Mehserle--his lapse in judgment here aside--is going to risk his career, his pension, his reputation, death threats, et al, by killing someone in cold blood IN FRONT OF SCORES OF EYEWITNESSES? Not to mention that Grant, although habitual petty criminal, was not exactly on America's Most Wanted.
It just doesn't add up to murder. The crime is manslaughter, most likely voluntary.
DetectiveCrockett77 3 years ago
"Reasonably intelligent" people do things to risk their careers, pensions, reputations, lives, family, etc all the time! Are you kidding?
The real issue at hand is that police in America are out of control nowadays. There is a culture of brutality in many places. Oh yeah, I know they know they can't go around firing their guns at people, but now they're convinced that they can go around tasing people & it's ok. Look it up, it's been happening for years. And yes, PEOPLE DIE FROM BEING TASED.
propheticlivity 3 years ago
I wouldn't say that. Most people don't risk their careers et al "all the time." I think you're overexaggerating.
Other than that, I don't really disagree with what you said here.
DetectiveCrockett77 3 years ago
I didn't say most people, nor did I say most intelligent people... What I said was "'reasonably intelligent' people do things ... all the time", meaning, go to any court on Monday morning and you will find reasonably intelligent people who did something stupid. Granted... most of those people didn't murder somebody, but I stand by my statement that reasonably intelligent people do actually do things to jeopardize their standing in society, and it does happen "all the time".
propheticlivity 3 years ago
Det. I get what your saying but, we depend on the officers to be alert, conscience and aware of the situations and surroundings at all times, after all we depend on them to "Serve and Protect" us. Oscar Grant is my 3yr old grandson. We teach him to fear God and respect everyone. We instilled in him morals, we teach him manners and etiquette, we teach him to say yes maam/yes sir, no maam/no sir, we teach him self worth, we allow him to be himself at this early age and when he makes a mistake
dimples40160 2 years ago
or a bad choice or mistake we let him know that, that was a bad choice or a mistake sometimes we get the butt, sometimes we dont :-) but he know what we mean. A few years from now, he becomes a young man with no petty criminal record, no police record at all, a respectable young man making a difference in his community. He is driving home from his girlfriends house and he is pulled over for speeding 10miles over the limit, the officer is nasty, rude, crude, yelling and calling him a liar (more
dimples40160 2 years ago
than once), he answers the officer with a calm cool and collected tone and the officer calls him a lying bastard and tells him to get out the car,,,,,,,WHAT IS 'OSCAR GRANT' MY GRANDSON TO DO NOW???????? Should he get out the car and risk being beat and/or shot b/c -according to the officer- he charged the officer WHO ORDERED HIM TO GET OUT THE CAR; or does he stay in the car and be charged with NOT FOLLOWING A DIRECT ORDER from the officer - being none complacent if you will !!!!!! Oscar Grant
dimples40160 2 years ago
my Grandson know two things about the "Laws of the Land" (the police own personal laws); The Officers are Going Home, The People (Oscar Grant) May not Make It HOME!!!!!!! So please Det. Crockett, Alan Molstad, and Propheticlivity (couldn't break your name up), what are we to teach our SONS our OSCAR GRANT? I have no desire to bury another child/Oscar Grant
I do not mean to sound angry with any of you but I AM LIVID, OUTRAGED and yes ANGRY over this whole NIGHTMARE
dimples40160 2 years ago
@DetectiveCrockett77 yes I do, he lost control of the situation, he got caught up in the aggresiveness of his fellow officer's, I wouldn't be surprised that Pirone told him to shoot him. Pirone needs to be charged in this death as much as Mehserle was. Mehserle confessed to his first attorney and signed a document he INTENTIONALLY drew his weapon. A document that was not allowed in court as evidence. THIS IS ALL A COVER UP!!
redmsthang 1 year ago
...Mehserle fires into suspect's back, resulting in fatal injuries to the suspect. This is known as MURDER. Accidental or intentional? IT DOES NOT MATTER. Why? Because Mehserle's action to draw and then fire a deadly weapon in a situation that in no way warranted it does legally constitute MURDER. When average citizens accidentally kill someone, they are held accountable. So too, should Mehserle.
I know there is a chance he won't be found guilty, and that would be a miscarriage of justice.
propheticlivity 3 years ago
("When average citizens accidentally kill someone...")
If the result of the trial is the understanding that Grant died because of a cop's mistake, then this would put it in the area of other types of errors people can make that kill none the less.
Like you thinking a red light had turned green and hitting someone who had the real green light.
You would be guilty of a mistake that led to a death, but you are not guilty of "murder"
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
Here's the problem with your analogy. The person who accidentally kills someone with a car did not INTENTIONALLY aim to strike the other person's car or to kill them.
When ANYONE draws a WEAPON, AIMS it at a human, PULLS the TRIGGER, and KILLS the person, that is considered an INTENTIONAL ACT. So he meant to fire a taser? DOES NOT MATTER. It's a deadly weapon. If his taser accidentally went off while he was standing over Grant, THAT would be akin to your analogy, but that's not what happened.
propheticlivity 3 years ago
The point I was originally trying to make is that if Mehserle is found not guilty by a judge or jury, the People will consider it a miscarriage of justice and, although their anger will most likely be misplaced, they will seek to create their own form of justice in the absense of the justice we in the "civilised society" were supposed to be able to count on.
The cops that beat Rodney King were guilty. (Rodney King was a bit guilty himself.) Oscar Grant was 100% innocent. Big difference.
propheticlivity 3 years ago
("the People will consider it...")
Under our system, if you are found Not Guilty then thats what you are...
Sure not everyone will like the verdict, but that happens no matter what the verdict is.
People didn't like it when OJ Simpson got away with it, but once you are found Not Guilty thats it
.
The rest of us just have to live with it...
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
People will go batshit insane if Mehserle walks. Do you think the reaction to the Rodney King verdict was bad? You haven't seen anything like what people will do if justice doesn't happen here.
Finally, I have to reiterate to you: the taser defense does not protect Mehserle from a murder charge. A taser is a lethal weapon - it kills people; tons of precedent to show that as fact. Murder is murder, whether intentional or accidental.
Johannes must be held accountable or there is no justice.
propheticlivity 3 years ago
("People will go batshit insane if Mehserle walks.")
That doesn't matter.
We have laws and a court system in this country to decide guilt or innocence.
We are not under mob rule, or the rule of thugs in the street.
If the cop is found guilty or not guilty is has to be because of the facts of the case presented in a court of law...
anything less than that gives the cop a built-in appeal.
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
("We are not under mob rule,")
Tell that to Los Angeles, circa April 29, 1992.
The People are fine with the rule of law... usually. But it fails them too often. Usually... the People let it go. But they will not let this one go, and you need to understand this.
Your rule of law will not stop the riots and destruction that will occur if JUSTICE is not done in this case.
Mehserle is guilty of 2nd degree murder; yes, it was most likely accidental. But that's still 2nd degree murder.
propheticlivity 3 years ago
("Tell that to Los Angeles, ")
Yes, Im telling that to them, and not only them but the whole world.
And what Im saying is this :
That unless we submit to the rule of law we are lost.
Unless we are ready to live with the results of the trial we are lost.
The rule of law is what we have to admit is more important than personal needs for revenge.
Guns made us free.
but laws made us Americans.
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
("aim to convict Mehserle because they know what could happen if they don't.")
Think about that sentence for a moment...
Don't you see how truly wrong this line of thinking is?
Does this way of thinking not scream out it's dangerous foolishness?
A person's guilt or innocence should not be left up to anything but the facts of the case and the rule of LAW!!!!
Anything less than that, even the hint of holding a person guilty because of "other reasons' is a crime and against the American way
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
I know how the justice system works, and I know it FAILS all the time. The People know about the "rule of law", and they also know how often it fails. Regardless of what the facts are, regardless of what the verdict is, ALL I am saying is that if a not guilty verdict is returned the People WILL be outraged, and they will express that outrage. The establishment that would normally be working to acquit Mehserle (regardless of his actual guilt) needs to take this into consideration.
propheticlivity 3 years ago
We cant allow even the thought of what others may think to be important to us when we put a man on trial for murder.
We have to keep the topic on the Law, Not the mob in the street.
The rule of law has to be the only voice we listen to.
If we look to what we think will be the reaction of the mob we have given up being Americans, and now are no better than the KKK or the Taliban
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
the nigger looks like bobby lashly
prozzak2006 3 years ago
So we have to allow the trial to start before we know for sure the defence that cop will raise.
But if it becomes clear that the "Taser Defence" is actually true, then this cop is Not Guilty of murder.
Some may not like that, but if the cop is not guilty then he is not guilty and shoule be found Not Guilty.
He is guilty of a lesser charge, Im not a lawyer so others can tell me what charge he would be guilty of.
If the shooting is an accident then I expect some jail time even so...
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
Did a little checking and I found a site that has the offical statement of the other cop who had his knee on Grant.
From reading his statement of what happend it seems clear that the cop who pulled his gun and shot actually was going for his Taser.
If this is true then the murder charge is not the correct charge in this case.
If the facts in the trial prove that the shooter-cop thought he had pulled his Taser then you could well see a "Not Guilty" result on the murder charge.
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
I've been saying all along that the charge should be manslaughter, because you can't prove murder here.
That said, I'm not sure I believe the Taser argument--although I do think it's possible. I think Mehserle did indeed knowingly draw his gun, but simply did not mean to pull the trigger when it went off.
DetectiveCrockett77 3 years ago
Detective Crocket77:
I think we all look at the video and struggle to understand the reason for even pulling the gun?
The sad fact is that none us can understand why it happend.
Perhaps from the video alone there is no reason?
So this means that as long as we are stuck just looking at the video alone we will never understand the reasons for this shooting.
However from the offical statements of the other cop it now seems clear to me that we are back to the idea of the "taser"...
AlanMolstad 3 years ago 4
Oh, there's no doubt in my mind Mehserle should not even have pulled his weapon, gun OR Taser.
And you hit the nail on the head as to not knowing from the "video alone." This is where many YouTubers are logically bankrupt. Video, no matter how open-and-shut it may seem, rarely tells the whole story. You still have to investigate what LED UP TO the situation, and whether there are any other mitigating factors. This is what a lot of people fail to grasp.
DetectiveCrockett77 3 years ago
("Video, no matter how open-and-shut it may seem, rarely tells the whole story")
I always try to keep in mind that we are only getting edited video.
Remember from the statement of the other cop he says that he hit Grant in the face after Grant had pushed ot hit the lady cop.
Has anyone seen that part of the video yet?.....
I have not.
If there is video of Grant pushing the lady cop then why have they not shown that part of the video as well?
AlanMolstad 3 years ago 3
As to that, I'm not sure.
DetectiveCrockett77 3 years ago
We shall see.
Zennie says that the TV station might be holding some videos to drive up TV rateings...God only knows whats on them videos.
Also if the cops did start grabbing cell phones that had recorded the shooting they would not come out until just before the trial right?
This means that some of the best and more clear video, (Perhaps with clear sound?) , might be yet to be seen by any of us.
Right now we just have to be carefull and remember there is much yet to learn.
AlanMolstad 3 years ago 2
Here is a question for everyone...
Has there been any other media that has come out with this "Butt Crack' story yet?
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
Chances are that if this story of where the drugs were found is true, then we will begin to hear from grant's friends about other times Grant was known to carry in this manner.
We really know little of Grant.
People tend to paint shooting victims to appear to be Saints and the shooter as a Hitler.
but the results of looking for answers may show us that Grant was no Saint, and the cop is no Hitler.
And neither woke that morning thinking this story would be all they were know for.
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
I went to school w/ Oskar back in the day and he was always fighting people. We used to joke that we would "get oskar on you" to people. I wouldn't doubt that he would have been kind of aggressive with BART cops cuz I know I have messed w/ BART cops before. But as far as the crack it doesn't make sense that he would put it up his ass because of some BART cops. Honestly I don't think that one holds water. But idk.
MusicManDan13 3 years ago
see thats the thing,,,,Crack up the butt?
Now I understand they were fighting on the BART, and that the train had been held at the station so that the cops could get there. So I guess there was plenty of time to hide drugs.
But Grant could not find anyone else to just hold the drugs?
He didnt think of a pocket?
It's New Years Eve and Grant is going to or coming from a party with his drugs up his butt?
Unless Grant was one sick-SICK puppy, I have to have my doubts about this whole story.
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
Sorry Realizalize, I didn't understand much of your last posting.
Something about bail?
I don't know what the bail was set at, but I'm sure it was enough to make sure the guy shows up for the trial.
I don't really know what police procedure you are talking about?
Do you have something in mind?
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
he was shot in the back, laying on the ground,
what is the dealy yah.?
i am at 179 pounds with clothing, warm me up, lay a handcuffed drunk agressive motorcicle-gang member on the floor or an aryan-brotherhood guy and see how he could perform, at all, with bare hands, let alone 4 officers fully armed on my side.
Realizalize 3 years ago
Whats your point then?
AlanMolstad 3 years ago
dude is on bail, and i don`t believe what i am saying: 3 mill. bail.
police procedure